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Thread: A Study of Torah from Gen. - Rev.

  1. #581
    Senior Member Rainrider's Avatar
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    Default Re: A Study of Torah from Gen. - Rev.

    Quote Originally Posted by Rainrider View Post
    Ex. 21:1- 11
    1 "Now these are the judgments which you shall set before them:
    2 If you buy a Hebrew servant, he shall serve six years; and in the seventh he shall go out free and pay nothing.
    3 If he comes in by himself, he shall go out by himself; if he comes in married, then his wife shall go out with him.
    4 If his master has given him a wife, and she has borne him sons or daughters, the wife and her children shall be her master's, and he shall go out by himself.
    5 But if the servant plainly says, 'I love my master, my wife, and my children; I will not go out free,'
    6 then his master shall bring him to the judges. He shall also bring him to the door, or to the doorpost, and his master shall pierce his ear with an awl; and he shall serve him forever.
    7 "And if a man sells his daughter to be a female slave, she shall not go out as the male slaves do.
    8 If she does not please her master, who has betrothed her to himself, then he shall let her be redeemed. He shall have no right to sell her to a foreign people, since he has dealt deceitfully with her.
    9 And if he has betrothed her to his son, he shall deal with her according to the custom of daughters.
    10 If he takes another wife, he shall not diminish her food, her clothing, and her marriage rights.
    11 And if he does not do these three for her, then she shall go out free, without paying money.

    Before anyone jumps up and tries to make slavery out as a bad thing, think about how it was back then. Trust me, I will stand and fight slavery to my last breath today. At lest the form that comes to mind for many of us today. Yet here we are looking at a form of slavery that doesn't come to mind when we hear the word. Let me explain.
    For the people of Israel, (and many other cultures) slavery was for the destitute. If a man or women was able to work, yet couldn't find work, they sold them self for a set sum. That sum was their worth for 6 years. True it was for less than you would pay someone that had a job, or worked their own land and was just looking for a little extra. Now if you sold your self with only 3 years to go until jubilee, (hope I spelled that right) you would only get the price for that 3 years. So even though we see the word slave, it may be a bit more clear if we see it as contract labor.
    Once you fulfilled your contract, you were free to leave. If a person left before it's fulfillment, they would then need to buy out the remainder of said contract.
    Many in the ancient word that had to sell them self into slavery, may have thought that HaShem abandoned them. Yet with a reading of this passage, it becomes clear that He hadn't. In fact if a person reads this passage, it should be clear to them that HaShem loved the slaves just much as He does the free man. How can that be said with such certainty? In the law that has been set down for the treatment of, and freedom of slaves. This idea is also backed by the following.
    Lev.25:39 ‘And if one of your brethren who dwells by you becomes poor, and sells himself to you, you shall not compel him to serve as a slave.
    Deut. 15:15 “You shall remember that you were a slave in the land of Egypt, and the LORD your God redeemed you; therefore I command you this thing today.

    There are many passages in the Tanakh dealing slavery. Yet did things change when it came to the NT? Did it some how remove this law, or do away with slavery?
    Gal. 3:28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free, there is neither male nor female; for you are all one in Christ Jesus.
    Eph. 6:8 knowing that whatever good anyone does, he will receive the same from the Lord, whether he is a slave or free.
    Col. 3:11 where there is neither Greek nor Jew, circumcised nor uncircumcised, barbarian, Scythian, slave nor free, but Christ is all and in all.
    Time ran out so I can't place in the above post.
    Some may well be thinking that this is only for the Jewish people. That for some reason HaShem gave one set of Laws on how to deal with fellow Jews, and left it open to treat gentiles just how ever. That sadly is something that I have seen said many times. In that claim, they try to show how the NT has changed the Torah. That teaching, though it may make some people feel better is not true at all. To show this, please read,
    Deut. 24:17 "You shall not pervert justice due the stranger or the fatherless, nor take a widow's garment as a pledge. 18 But you shall remember that you were a slave in Egypt, and the Lord your God redeemed you from there; therefore I command you to do this thing.

    As one can see, laws are to be applied equally to both Jew and Gentile. At lest that is, any that are not clearly for Israel, and Israel alone. They will be made clear not by any teacher, or person, rather by the Word. As we will soon see, there are many laws that are only for one class of people.
    Sorry i over this, it just came to mind when I was looking over my last post.
    beta likes this.
    we were asked to pray for 2 thing in the Word, do we pray them?
    Psa 122:6 Pray for the peace of Jerusalem: they shall prosper that love thee.
    Mat.9:38
    Pray ye therefore the Lord of the harvest, that he will send forth labourers into his harvest.

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    Default Re: A Study of Torah from Gen. - Rev.

    Ex. 21:12-36
    Although some will read the following and jump on the idea of HaShem being hateful back then, and He has some how changed into a better god. (It's a given that everyone will follow this line of thinking.) We must keep in mind that HaShem doesn't change, just to make Him Self more appealing to man kind. With that in mind, lets try to find the spiritual meaning for all the passages given here.
    12 "He who strikes a man so that he dies shall surely be put to death.

    If one wishes to look back at post #572 you will find the passages given on murder.

    13 However, if he did not lie in wait, but God delivered him into his hand, then I will appoint for you a place where he may flee.

    In case of an accidental death, a family member may still wish to take revenge. Yet in His ever wise way, HaShem has set in place a way to protect anyone that may kill another by accident.

    14 "But if a man acts with premeditation against his neighbor, to kill him by treachery, you shall take him from My altar, that he may die.
    15 "And he who strikes his father or his mother shall surely be put to death.
    16 "He who kidnaps a man and sells him, or if he is found in his hand, shall surely be put to death.
    17 "And he who curses his father or his mother shall surely be put to death.
    18 "If men contend with each other, and one strikes the other with a stone or with his fist, and he does not die but is confined to his bed,
    19 if he rises again and walks about outside with his staff, then he who struck him shall be acquitted. He shall only pay for the loss of his time, and shall provide for him to be thoroughly healed.
    20 "And if a man beats his male or female servant with a rod, so that he dies under his hand, he shall surely be punished.
    21 Notwithstanding, if he remains alive a day or two, he shall not be punished; for he is his property.
    22 "If men fight, and hurt a woman with child, so that she gives birth prematurely, yet no harm follows, he shall surely be punished accordingly as the woman's husband imposes on him; and he shall pay as the judges determine.
    23 But if any harm follows, then you shall give life for life,
    24 eye for eye, tooth for tooth, hand for hand, foot for foot,
    25 burn for burn, wound for wound, stripe for stripe.

    Though one can read the plain text here, and find that it seems at odds with the NT teaching of Yeshua, in Mat. 5:
    38 "You have heard that it was said, 'An eye for an eye and a tooth for a tooth.'
    39 But I tell you not to resist an evil person. But whoever slaps you on your right cheek, turn the other to him also.
    Though it is a more passive way of life, one must think of the many things in life that are not so cut and dry. If a person wishes to kill your children, do you let them, or stop them? If you say stop them did you turn the other cheek? No you resisted evil. So by doing so did you brake this commandment? Oddly some would say that you had, though to take a life in order to save another is not wrong.


    26 If a man strikes the eye of his male or female servant, and destroys it, he shall let him go free for the sake of his eye.
    27 And if he knocks out the tooth of his male or female servant, he shall let him go free for the sake of his tooth.
    28 "If an ox gores a man or a woman to death, then the ox shall surely be stoned, and its flesh shall not be eaten; but the owner of the ox shall be acquitted.
    29 But if the ox tended to thrust with its horn in times past, and it has been made known to his owner, and he has not kept it confined, so that it has killed a man or a woman, the ox shall be stoned and its owner also shall be put to death.
    30 If there is imposed on him a sum of money, then he shall pay to redeem his life, whatever is imposed on him.
    31 Whether it has gored a son or gored a daughter, according to this judgment it shall be done to him.
    32 If the ox gores a male or female servant, he shall give to their master thirty shekels of silver, and the ox shall be stoned.
    33 "And if a man opens a pit, or if a man digs a pit and does not cover it, and an ox or a donkey falls in it,
    34 the owner of the pit shall make it good; he shall give money to their owner, but the dead animal shall be his.
    35 "If one man's ox hurts another's, so that it dies, then they shall sell the live ox and divide the money from it; and the dead ox they shall also divide.
    36 Or if it was known that the ox tended to thrust in time past, and its owner has not kept it confined, he shall surely pay ox for ox, and the dead animal shall be his own.

    In all, what you have read gives a clear idea that any punishment should fit the crime. So do we go around pooking out eyes, or cutting off hands? NO! Do we just let it go, and say something like, "It's ok I will grow another." Or maybe we should say, "Just be a bit more careful next time will you." Although I do know some that think this way, it is not right. If I did something stupid, and you lost your hand, then I need to everything I can to make that right. I can't put miracle grow on it and grow you a new hand, sorry. What I can do however is cover all med cost, then pay what is required by law for the loss of that hand. This is what is being told to us. Make any bad we do right.
    Does this in any way remove any of the spiritual aspects of Torah? Some may well think it does, however, I simply don't see it that way. 2 wrongs don't make a right, and that is something we will see a bit later. Just as if a person stood by and let their child be killed makes them just as wrong as the one doing the killing. That is another thing we will get into later.
    we were asked to pray for 2 thing in the Word, do we pray them?
    Psa 122:6 Pray for the peace of Jerusalem: they shall prosper that love thee.
    Mat.9:38
    Pray ye therefore the Lord of the harvest, that he will send forth labourers into his harvest.

  3. #583
    Senior Member Rainrider's Avatar
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    Default Re: A Study of Torah from Gen. - Rev.

    Ex. 22
    This is an expansion on the Laws we have looked at. In that here we find one is be fined for theft, as well as penalty's for other infractions of the Law.
    1 "If a man steals an ox or a sheep, and slaughters it or sells it, he shall restore five oxen for an ox and four sheep for a sheep.
    2 If the thief is found breaking in, and he is struck so that he dies, there shall be no guilt for his bloodshed.
    3 If the sun has risen on him, there shall be guilt for his bloodshed. He should make full restitution; if he has nothing, then he shall be sold for his theft.
    4 If the theft is certainly found alive in his hand, whether it is an ox or donkey or sheep, he shall restore double.

    First lets look at not being guilty of murder if it is at night. The idea here may be one of 2 things. First most theft takes place at night, and back then it would be dark in ones house. This would mean that it would hard to tell if the intruder has a weapon, and may kill you if you try to stop them. Killing a person to save your life is not the same as murder, even by today's thinking. (Well in most cases that is) Yet if the sun is up, you can see if a threat on your lift is there or not. If it is, and others see it as well, then you will not guilty of murder.

    5 "If a man causes a field or vineyard to be grazed, and lets loose his animal, and it feeds in another man's field, he shall make restitution from the best of his own field and the best of his own vineyard.

    Letting ones animal lose to feed in your field is one thing, if you let it in another persons field, without permission, that is the same as theft.

    6 "If fire breaks out and catches in thorns, so that stacked grain, standing grain, or the field is consumed, he who kindled the fire shall surely make restitution.

    This makes a clear case for culpability. Even today it is a crime to let a fire get away from you, and do damage to the property of others.

    7 "If a man delivers to his neighbor money or articles to keep, and it is stolen out of the man's house, if the thief is found, he shall pay double.
    8 If the thief is not found, then the master of the house shall be brought to the judges to see whether he has put his hand into his neighbor's goods.
    9 "For any kind of trespass, whether it concerns an ox, a donkey, a sheep, or clothing, or for any kind of lost thing which another claims to be his, the cause of both parties shall come before the judges; and whomever the judges condemn shall pay double to his neighbor.

    As stated in the commandment on theft, if we find any thing, it is not ours, it belongs to the person that lost it. Even if it is 25 years down the road. Now if I left something in your care, and it gets stolen, do you feel you should make that right? I know for sure I would make it right. Now if I let it in your care, and made it clear that it wasn't worth anything to me, I just wanted a place to put it and get it out of my way for now, then there would be real loss for me.

    10 If a man delivers to his neighbor a donkey, an ox, a sheep, or any animal to keep, and it dies, is hurt, or driven away, no one seeing it,
    11 then an oath of the Lord shall be between them both, that he has not put his hand into his neighbor's goods; and the owner of it shall accept that, and he shall not make it good.
    12 But if, in fact, it is stolen from him, he shall make restitution to the owner of it.
    13 If it is torn to pieces by a beast, then he shall bring it as evidence, and he shall not make good what was torn.
    14 "And if a man borrows anything from his neighbor, and it becomes injured or dies, the owner of it not being with it, he shall surely make it good.
    15 If its owner was with it, he shall not make it good; if it was hired, it came for its hire.

    Though it seems clear in my mind, I will say this. If you barrow my rifle to go hunting, and I am with you, I am going to look out for my rifle. The same holds true here. The owner of anything is going to look out it. Now my hound, you won't take out for any kind of hunt without me being there. Yet if you did take it out, they best return in one peace, or you best be ready to pay for a new hound, along with it's training. Think about it, if you had say $5000 in a good hound, would you not it replaced, as well as the expense of it's training?

    16 "If a man entices a virgin who is not betrothed, and lies with her, he shall surely pay the bride-price for her to be his wife.
    17 If her father utterly refuses to give her to him, he shall pay money according to the bride-price of virgins.

    If only we did follow this today. By setting aside this one little law, we have seen an increase in STD's, babies not for sure who there faith is, and even if they do know for sure, they may not ever get to know their dad. I could go on a week long rant of the many ways this one little law being removed has opened the human mind to sinful ways.

    18 "You shall not permit a sorceress to live.
    19 "Whoever lies with an animal shall surely be put to death.
    20 "He who sacrifices to any god, except to the Lord only, he shall be utterly destroyed.
    21 "You shall neither mistreat a stranger nor oppress him, for you were strangers in the land of Egypt.
    22 "You shall not afflict any widow or fatherless child.
    23 If you afflict them in any way, and they cry at all to Me, I will surely hear their cry;
    24 and My wrath will become hot, and I will kill you with the sword; your wives shall be widows, and your children fatherless.

    When one looks at how we think of kids that have no dad in their life now, (that is to say after turning our life to HaShem) it becomes clear that we that truly folllow after the spirit of HaShem, follow this. Yet if we look back in time, that has not always been the case.

    25 "If you lend money to any of My people who are poor among you, you shall not be like a moneylender to him; you shall not charge him interest.

    Now here's a topic most never think of. I say most as I understand many simply don't lend money to any one. A good idea not to really, unless you know you can live with out. Yet if you went to a bank for a loan, and they asked, "Are you a true believer?' you may find your self thinking, what has that to do with any of this? Yet you answer it with a Yes, and find that it let you get what money you need with no interest. Well we know that bank wouldn't last long in this world, or would it? The intent of this law isn't to let any bank go under, or not stop it from growing. The intent here is to not place any undue burdened on others.

    26 If you ever take your neighbor's garment as a pledge, you shall return it to him before the sun goes down.
    27 For that is his only covering, it is his garment for his skin. What will he sleep in? And it will be that when he cries to Me, I will hear, for I am gracious.
    28 "You shall not revile God, nor curse a ruler of your people.
    29 "You shall not delay to offer the first of your ripe produce and your juices. The firstborn of your sons you shall give to Me.
    30 Likewise you shall do with your oxen and your sheep. It shall be with its mother seven days; on the eighth day you shall give it to Me.
    31 "And you shall be holy men to Me: you shall not eat meat torn by beasts in the field; you shall throw it to the dogs.

    Though many in the world today love to take badly of our leaders, it is not a good idea. After all, they were put there by HaShem. If we speak ill of them, do we also not speak ill of HaShem, and His ways?
    Before any one thinks that we no longer need to give of the fruits of our labor, the first born of our livestock if you will. Do you not teach of giving tithe? Do you not find that to give a 10th of your wages to HaShem is something we should do? If you answered yes, then you do follow this law. Just as most would never dream of eating anything they found dead, be it road kill or something that was killed by a mountain lion. Funny how by our own actions, teachings, and thoughts we show that we do in-dead, even if not in thought, follow many aspects of Torah.
    we were asked to pray for 2 thing in the Word, do we pray them?
    Psa 122:6 Pray for the peace of Jerusalem: they shall prosper that love thee.
    Mat.9:38
    Pray ye therefore the Lord of the harvest, that he will send forth labourers into his harvest.

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    Senior Member tanakh's Avatar
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    Default Re: A Study of Torah from Gen. - Rev.

    One of the main stumbling blocks among Christians is the confusion regarding the words Testament and Covenant.

    A Testament is a written contract like a last will and testament listing property to be left to people when a person dies.
    A Testament can be replaced with an entirely new one. In that case the older version no longer has any legal value

    A covenant is something entirely different. It is an agreement between two parties. It can be added to and expanded but the original content cannot be destroyed or done away with its permanent. The Bible at its root is a covenant between God and Humanity. In that sense there is no Old and New Testament. What is called the New Testament or Covenant is an extension of the one originally given by God. The muddle has led to many Christians thinking that the OT is less important than the new. When in fact the NT is a continuation of the old. We should remember that the early Church had no fixed NT cannon for a couple of hundred years. Their Bible was what we call the OT
    Rainrider likes this.

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    Default Re: A Study of Torah from Gen. - Rev.

    Retitle time. Torah is the Books of Moses or the Pentateuch.

    If you would be more to the point your title should refer to the Tanakh, from Genesis through Revelation inclusive. pardon any misspelling.
    From the Mouth of our Lord, Jesus Christ, or do you call Him Yeshua?
    Mat 7:1 Judge not, that ye be not judged.


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    Senior Member Rainrider's Avatar
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    Default Re: A Study of Torah from Gen. - Rev.

    Quote Originally Posted by JaumeJ View Post
    Retitle time. Torah is the Books of Moses or the Pentateuch.

    If you would be more to the point your title should refer to the Tanakh, from Genesis through Revelation inclusive. pardon any misspelling.

    Once more I will explain. This is a study of Torah>> And how it fits in to the Whole of the Word, after all the Torah is the word of HaShem, given to Moses. It is the foundation upon witch the rest is biult.
    we were asked to pray for 2 thing in the Word, do we pray them?
    Psa 122:6 Pray for the peace of Jerusalem: they shall prosper that love thee.
    Mat.9:38
    Pray ye therefore the Lord of the harvest, that he will send forth labourers into his harvest.

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    Default Re: A Study of Torah from Gen. - Rev.

    Would you leave out the Writings and the Prophets by teaching or sharing just from theTorah? It is the Law AND the Prophets fulfilled by Jesus Christ, Yeshua.

    Quote Originally Posted by Rainrider View Post
    Once more I will explain. This is a study of Torah>> And how it fits in to the Whole of the Word, after all the Torah is the word of HaShem, given to Moses. It is the foundation upon witch the rest is biult.
    From the Mouth of our Lord, Jesus Christ, or do you call Him Yeshua?
    Mat 7:1 Judge not, that ye be not judged.


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    Senior Member Rainrider's Avatar
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    Default Re: A Study of Torah from Gen. - Rev.

    Quote Originally Posted by JaumeJ View Post
    Would you leave out the Writings and the Prophets by teaching or sharing just from theTorah? It is the Law AND the Prophets fulfilled by Jesus Christ, Yeshua.
    Is the Tanakh found in the Word between the Books of Gen. and Rev.? I kind of though it was.

    Yeshua has fulfilled most of what is written yes. Not all however. As we will see when to it, Yeshua has fulfilled some of the feast, not all.
    we were asked to pray for 2 thing in the Word, do we pray them?
    Psa 122:6 Pray for the peace of Jerusalem: they shall prosper that love thee.
    Mat.9:38
    Pray ye therefore the Lord of the harvest, that he will send forth labourers into his harvest.

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    Senior Member JaumeJ's Avatar
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    Default Re: A Study of Torah from Gen. - Rev.

    If you believe the writings of the New Testament are of God then, a big yes it is because the Tanakh is composed of the Torah, the Prohets and the Writings. This would include the kApostles' writings....


    Quote Originally Posted by Rainrider View Post
    Is the Tanakh found in the Word between the Books of Gen. and Rev.? I kind of though it was.

    Yeshua has fulfilled most of what is written yes. Not all however. As we will see when to it, Yeshua has fulfilled some of the feast, not all.
    From the Mouth of our Lord, Jesus Christ, or do you call Him Yeshua?
    Mat 7:1 Judge not, that ye be not judged.


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    Default Re: A Study of Torah from Gen. - Rev.

    Quote Originally Posted by JaumeJ View Post
    If you believe the writings of the New Testament are of God then, a big yes it is because the Tanakh is composed of the Torah, the Prohets and the Writings. This would include the kApostles' writings....
    Thank you for making my point.
    we were asked to pray for 2 thing in the Word, do we pray them?
    Psa 122:6 Pray for the peace of Jerusalem: they shall prosper that love thee.
    Mat.9:38
    Pray ye therefore the Lord of the harvest, that he will send forth labourers into his harvest.

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    Senior Member Rainrider's Avatar
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    Default Re: A Study of Torah from Gen. - Rev.

    Ex 23
    1 "You shall not circulate a false report. Do not put your hand with the wicked to be an unrighteous witness.
    2 You shall not follow a crowd to do evil; nor shall you testify in a dispute so as to turn aside after many to pervert justice.
    3 You shall not show partiality to a poor man in his dispute.

    Gossip is one way to look at this passage. Though we are seeing the demand's given to up hold the integrity of the Judicial system. In that light, if you are a witness in a trial of any kind, and your testimony backs mine, yet for some reason I have been disqualified, you shouldn't tie yours to mine. Even if you know what I say is true. One teaching on that is as follows. If we tie any part of our testimony to that of a disqualified witness, even if they are telling the truth, it can diminish your own. In such a way as to lead away from the truth.

    4 "If you meet your enemy's ox or his donkey going astray, you shall surely bring it back to him again
    5 If you see the donkey of one who hates you lying under its burden, and you would refrain from helping it, you shall surely help him with it.

    When Yeshua talks of loving your enemy, it is this passage that is alluded to.
    Mat5:43-44 “You have heard that it was said, ‘You shall love your neighbor and hate your enemy. But I say to you, love your enemies, bless those who curse you, do good to those who hate you, and pray for those who spitefully use you and persecute you,
    What we must make note of is that Yeshua said you have heard that it was said. There isn't any passage I have found, or can think of that tells us to hate anyone. Some other passages you may find in lighting. 1 Sam 24:19, Pro. 25:21, and Rom. 12:19-20

    6 "You shall not pervert the judgment of your poor in his dispute.
    7 Keep yourself far from a false matter; do not kill the innocent and righteous. For I will not justify the wicked.
    8 And you shall take no bribe, for a bribe blinds the discerning and perverts the words of the righteous.
    9 Also you shall not oppress a stranger, for you know the heart of a stranger, because you were strangers in the land of Egypt.

    The close of this passage is clear. We all would love to see a poor man gain a judgment that would help them to better them selves. Yet as we can see in the closing here, we are to judge only on facts, not on ones heart, or their own way of thinking.
    I did stop with this, when we pick up again, there will a lot to cover. I know that with my disability, the shorter the better. I am also aware that there are more out there like myself, so out of respect for them, this seems like a good stop spot.
    we were asked to pray for 2 thing in the Word, do we pray them?
    Psa 122:6 Pray for the peace of Jerusalem: they shall prosper that love thee.
    Mat.9:38
    Pray ye therefore the Lord of the harvest, that he will send forth labourers into his harvest.

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    Default Re: A Study of Torah from Gen. - Rev.

    Ex 23 10-19 10 "Six years you shall sow your land and gather in its produce,
    11 but the seventh year you shall let it rest and lie fallow, that the poor of your people may eat; and what they leave, the beasts of the field may eat. In like manner you shall do with your vineyard and your olive grove.

    Although may see this as an inconvenient way of farming today, with having to make all them bills that don't take a rest. When looked at from a little different angle, we find that it is god for the land. In that any part of the crop that falls to the ground puts back into it what it may have removed. Also by letting your cows, sheep, or what have you go in and eat, they also help to replenish the land. We will come back to this in time, so for now, think of the good it does for your land, as well as the people around you.

    12 Six days you shall do your work, and on the seventh day you shall rest, that your ox and your donkey may rest, and the son of your female servant and the stranger may be refreshed.

    Ever had a job were you worked 7 days a week? Or just worked 7 days a week with no rest, be at work, then doing work around the house and so on? Then you got a day to just rest, no work to do, or any one pushing you to do more. Think on that for a second then read on.
    That day of rest you got, how much better did you feel the next day? Less stressed, lest worm down, more like facing the day. This is the reason that we will find the Bible tells us we were not made for the Sabbath, rather it was made for us. Also one may note that once more, the Sabbath is named as being the 7th day.

    13 And in all that I have said to you, be circumspect and make no mention of the name of other gods, nor let it be heard from your mouth.

    This as it turns out, has been a thing I find hard to follow. I try, yet there is always a question of one kind or another that leads to the naming of at lest one other god. One sadly has been the topic for some time, and that one will not be dropped for many years to come. Though it is also something I have been seeking a way around. Not a way round keep this commandment, just a way around speaking the name.

    14 "Three times you shall keep a feast to Me in the year
    15 You shall keep the Feast of Unleavened Bread (you shall eat unleavened bread seven days, as I commanded you, at the time appointed in the month of Abib, for in it you came out of Egypt; none shall appear before Me empty);
    16 and the Feast of Harvest, the firstfruits of your labors which you have sown in the field; and the Feast of Ingathering at the end of the year, when you have gathered in the fruit of your labors from the field.
    17 Three times in the year all your males shall appear before the Lord God.
    18 You shall not offer the blood of My sacrifice with leavened bread; nor shall the fat of My sacrifice remain until morning.
    19 The first of the firstfruits of your land you shall bring into the house of the Lord your God. You shall not boil a young goat in its mother's milk

    As for the feast named here, we will cover them in later post. The thing I wish to make note of on this is boiling a goat in it's mothers milk. Why make a big deal of this one thing? Well as it turns out, may have done so and not once has anyone addressed the reason for this commandment. (Well out side of Jewish teaching that is.)
    R'Hirssch suggest a reason. The meat represents the life of the animal, the milk it's reproduction. Yet when debating this topic with a well known Rabbi, an alternate reason was given. He was asked if it may be that the milk of it's mom both gave, and sustained it's life, so this was put into place to stop a practice by the pagans followed. After all we all know that milk can add flavor, and help to make the meat tender. Yet at the same time, it can be seen as an insult to both the creator and the beast, in that one is using the life giving milk in the death of the beast.
    Though we find in Rabbinic Law that this has been expanded to cover all forms of meat, I see nothing wrong in that teaching. After all, there is little in the Laws that is confined to just one people, beast, or thing. Yet when it out that to follow this I would have to give up my ever so tasty chess burger, I found I had to know for sure. That was were logic kicked in. (sadly I am a logical thinker, and have trouble staying in any box.) So started looking over the top of that box as always, and I found that though we are not cooking meat in moms milk, we are doing something that may seem unimportant. We make it harder for our body to digest that meal. Something you see a lot of when we get to the diet, and so on is logic. So why logic? Well mostly it deals with science. That is after all a form of logic that is hard to dispute.
    we were asked to pray for 2 thing in the Word, do we pray them?
    Psa 122:6 Pray for the peace of Jerusalem: they shall prosper that love thee.
    Mat.9:38
    Pray ye therefore the Lord of the harvest, that he will send forth labourers into his harvest.

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    Default Re: A Study of Torah from Gen. - Rev.

    Coming to think of it, in reference to our dialog on Torah, Tanakh, etc, Just as Tahakh, Torah should cover it all. Please forgive my unintentional nit-picking. Unintentional or not, it is still nit-picking. kkGod bless you always.
    From the Mouth of our Lord, Jesus Christ, or do you call Him Yeshua?
    Mat 7:1 Judge not, that ye be not judged.


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    Default Re: A Study of Torah from Gen. - Rev.

    Quote Originally Posted by JaumeJ View Post
    Coming to think of it, in reference to our dialog on Torah, Tanakh, etc, Just as Tahakh, Torah should cover it all. Please forgive my unintentional nit-picking. Unintentional or not, it is still nit-picking. kkGod bless you always.
    All though the Torah is a part of the Tanakh, and some do use the word to denote the whole of the Tanakh, it isn't. Torah is only the first 5 books. The word Tanakh is an anagram for the 3 divisions of what we call the OT.
    T= Totah, teachings or laws
    N= Nevi-im, Prohets
    K= K'tuvim, writings
    we were asked to pray for 2 thing in the Word, do we pray them?
    Psa 122:6 Pray for the peace of Jerusalem: they shall prosper that love thee.
    Mat.9:38
    Pray ye therefore the Lord of the harvest, that he will send forth labourers into his harvest.

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    Default Re: A Study of Torah from Gen. - Rev.

    Ex 23:20-33
    20 "Behold, I send an Angel before you to keep you in the way and to bring you into the place which I have prepared.
    21 Beware of Him and obey His voice; do not provoke Him, for He will not pardon your transgressions; for My name is in Him
    22 But if you indeed obey His voice and do all that I speak, then I will be an enemy to your enemies and an adversary to your adversaries.

    There 2 interesting teaching on this. The first though it seems good to some,I find interesting in that it removes any thought of Yeshua. Please keep in mind that the same people that hold to this teaching, also reject anything that places Yeshua in the OT in anyway. They teach that this Angel was the Holy Spirit, and that Michael and the Holy Spirit are one in the same.
    It is clear that this Angle has the name of HaShem in Him. This should lead one to think of Yeshua, even the Sages teach that this angel identified Him-self to Moses as the head of HaShem's legion.
    Being told that we are to obey His voice here, should be no surprise to any of us. After all, john chapter 1 tells us that Yeshua is HaShem.

    23 For My Angel will go before you and bring you in to the Amorites and the Hittites and the Perizzites and the Canaanites and the Hivites and the Jebusites; and I will cut them off.
    24 You shall not bow down to their gods, nor serve them, nor do according to their works; but you shall utterly overthrow them and completely break down their sacred pillars.

    Though we could take this and spend a year or so just on 24 , it may be best however to give just one teaching and move on. This is a highly debated teaching, that some know nothing about. It came to mind as it shows just bad our best acts can be. I am only go give the the main points, to give the full teaching would take 10 or so pages. Just as we find it hard to think that Israel would turn to idolatry after seeing all that had been on their behalf, yet the Word shows us they had. Many in the world today follow after the same gods and goddesses in their life. They take upon them selves pagan rituals, filled with lies, pass them down as if they are Biblical based truths.

    25 So you shall serve the Lord your God, and He will bless your bread and your water. And I will take sickness away from the midst of you.
    26 No one shall suffer miscarriage or be barren in your land; I will fulfill the number of your days.
    27 "I will send My fear before you, I will cause confusion among all the people to whom you come, and will make all your enemies turn their backs to you.
    28 And I will send hornets before you, which shall drive out the Hivite, the Canaanite, and the Hittite from before you.
    29 I will not drive them out from before you in one year, lest the land become desolate and the beast of the field become too numerous for you.
    30 Little by little I will drive them out from before you, until you have increased, and you inherit the land.

    Why little by little? This has been asked in more than one class, and it is a valid question. If the people had low numbers, they would to spread out to help anyone under attack. By giving them the land a little at a time, it gives them time to grow stronger. Also it helps to make sure that they can live in peace. An old saying comes to mind, "If you want peace, prepare for war." This is attributed to Roman general Vegetius.
    31 And I will set your bounds from the Red Sea to the sea, Philistia, and from the desert to the River. For I will deliver the inhabitants of the land into your hand, and you shall drive them out before you.
    32 You shall make no covenant with them, nor with their gods.
    33 They shall not dwell in your land, lest they make you sin against Me. For if you serve their gods, it will surely be a snare to you."

    Though Israel never held all the land that was given to them, it is clear that one day they will. Some say this was due to Joshua making a covenant with the Gibeonites, (see Jos.9) Other say it was due to idolatry, and some say Israel just stopped, never wanting to hold all the land of their promise. Though we can debate this all our lives, we will never really know the whole story.
    we were asked to pray for 2 thing in the Word, do we pray them?
    Psa 122:6 Pray for the peace of Jerusalem: they shall prosper that love thee.
    Mat.9:38
    Pray ye therefore the Lord of the harvest, that he will send forth labourers into his harvest.

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    Default Re: A Study of Torah from Gen. - Rev.

    Ex chapter 24
    1 Now He said to Moses, "Come up to the Lord, you and Aaron, Nadab and Abihu, and seventy of the elders of Israel, and worship from afar.
    2 And Moses alone shall come near the Lord, but they shall not come near; nor shall the people go up with him."
    3 So Moses came and told the people all the words of the Lord and all the judgments. And all the people answered with one voice and said, "All the words which the Lord has said we will do."

    Two teachings on this, as they are both followed by at lest in some part by almost every church.
    In the first we find that some think it is a bad idea to say that one will follow what HaShem said back when He was mean, angry, and vengeful. Yet also in that same teaching, we are told to walk as Yeshua walked. The real sad thing is, they will also use this to show that HaShem has some how changed. They say the following 2 things have changed, so I ask, if you follow this line of thinking please explain it.
    First HaShem was angry that only Moses was able to talk with Him, every one had to go through some other person to speak to Him, if not He would just kill them. That really has not changed folks. Today we go through Yeshua to speak to HaShem. Moses as this same church is all to happy to agree with, was a shadow of Yeshua in many regrades. As I do pray everyone already knows this, I won't list the many ways.
    The other teaches that just as the people agree to follow what HaShem has said, we do the same. Or at lest we should. When we turn our life over to Yeshua, we are in fact turning it over to HaShem. We place our faith in Him, and call on Him for salvation. Yes I know some think that it is Yeshua that will be our judge. Though this may be right to some extent, Yeshua will carry out the will of His father in all matters, even judgment.

    4 And Moses wrote all the words of the Lord. And he rose early in the morning, and built an altar at the foot of the mountain, and twelve pillars according to the twelve tribes of Israel.
    5 Then he sent young men of the children of Israel, who offered burnt offerings and sacrificed peace offerings of oxen to the Lord.
    6 And Moses took half the blood and put it in basins, and half the blood he sprinkled on the altar.
    7 Then he took the Book of the Covenant and read in the hearing of the people. And they said, "All that the Lord has said we will do, and be obedient."
    8 And Moses took the blood, sprinkled it on the people, and said, "This is the blood of the covenant which the Lord has made with you according to all these words."

    It is clear to me that may see the NT as a whole way of HaShem bring us back to Him. That some how the blood that was spoken of here wasn't a shadow of the blood of Yeshua, or that even if it was, HaShem changed His mind. Giving us a whole way of life, and we are now saved by grace through ONLY faith. Yet as has been shown in this study, Abraham was also saved by grace, through his faith and obedience. Before you go off the rail, and blow up, keep in mind what was asked before. Stay only on topic with what you wish to question.
    Before we move on, I am sure we can all agree, the Bible should the only thing one needs to understand the Bible. So it was brought up, lets take a second to look at just the Bible tells us about what this New Covenant is.
    Jer. 31:31-34
    “Behold, the days are coming, says the LORD, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah—“not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to lead them out of the land of Egypt, My covenant which they broke, though I was a husband to them, says the LORD. “But this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, says the LORD: I will put My law in their minds, and write it on their hearts; and I will be their God, and they shall be My people.“No more shall every man teach his neighbor, and every man his brother, saying, ‘Know the LORD,’ for they all shall know Me, from the least of them to the greatest of them, says the LORD. For I will forgive their iniquity, and their sin I will remember no more.”
    9 Then Moses went up, also Aaron, Nadab, and Abihu, and seventy of the elders of Israel,
    10 and they saw the God of Israel. And there was under His feet as it were a paved work of sapphire stone, and it was like the very heavens in its clarity.
    11 But on the nobles of the children of Israel He did not lay His hand. So they saw God, and they ate and drank.
    12 Then the Lord said to Moses, "Come up to Me on the mountain and be there; and I will give you tablets of stone, and the law and commandments which I have written, that you may teach them."

    Though there are some that teach, (by way of only this passage) that we only need to follow the 10 writing on the stones, they back away from that teaching when asked about other laws that every true follower follow. Like sexual immorality, tithe, idolatry, and so on. Though there are some that will simply by pass anthing like that, as it can't be answered and stay true to their faith.

    13 So Moses arose with his assistant Joshua, and Moses went up to the mountain of God.
    14 And he said to the elders, "Wait here for us until we come back to you. Indeed Aaron and Hur are with you. If any man has a difficulty, let him go to them."
    15 Then Moses went up into the mountain, and a cloud covered the mountain.

    Some make note that Moses went up a lone, yet just before this it said we will return. So why say we if only Moses was going before HaShem? The sages teach the Joshua went up to the foot of the mountain and there he waited for Moses. They say he didn't leave for a cup of coffee, or to see what was going on it the camp. It was this loyalty that lead to him becoming the leader of Israel after Moses death.

    16 Now the glory of the Lord rested on Mount Sinai, and the cloud covered it six days. And on the seventh day He called to Moses out of the midst of the cloud.
    17 The sight of the glory of the Lord was like a consuming fire on the top of the mountain in the eyes of the children of Israel.
    18 So Moses went into the midst of the cloud and went up into the mountain. And Moses was on the mountain forty days and forty nights.

    The Torah makes a point to let us know that Moses was on the mountain for 40 days and nights. I know for sure that one teacher, (who no longer has a job due to this) said that the 40 days and nights, was 40 years. You see, that teacher made the simple mistake of applying the idea that a day is a year. Though that does hold true in many instantiates. This is not one of them. In all truth, that teacher didn't loss his job over the mistake, he lost over his insistents that he was right.
    He also had something right however. In that this once more was a shadow of Yeshua going into the wilderness for 40 days and nights.
    I do ask that you keep this time frame in mind, as it will come up later. You see thought we have a written account of most things, if one was to look at what is said, and not think about what was not said, they may they are on the wrong rabbit trail.
    we were asked to pray for 2 thing in the Word, do we pray them?
    Psa 122:6 Pray for the peace of Jerusalem: they shall prosper that love thee.
    Mat.9:38
    Pray ye therefore the Lord of the harvest, that he will send forth labourers into his harvest.

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    Default Re: A Study of Torah from Gen. - Rev.

    Ex 25:1-22
    1 Then the Lord spoke to Moses, saying:
    2 "Speak to the children of Israel, that they bring Me an offering. From everyone who gives it willingly with his heart you shall take My offering.
    3 And this is the offering which you shall take from them: gold, silver, and bronze;
    4 blue, purple, and scarlet thread, fine linen, and goats' hair;
    5 ram skins dyed red, badger skins, and acacia wood;
    6 oil for the light, and spices for the anointing oil and for the sweet incense;
    7 onyx stones, and stones to be set in the ephod and in the breastplate.
    8 And let them make Me a sanctuary, that I may dwell among them.
    9 According to all that I show you, that is, the pattern of the tabernacle and the pattern of all its furnishings, just so you shall make it.

    As much of this will covered in depth later, I feel it would be best to look at the simple understanding for now. Though we call our gifts tithes today, they are in fact an offering. One that should only be given when our hearts are moved to give. Does this mean we should only give to the church? Though it is true as we will see at a later date, there are other places ones heart may be moved to give, like to help feed the children in the world, or to the IDF. We as fallible humans, have moved to change the things we are told from the word. At times we move toward a better way of living, at others we move toward things we may be better off to let a lone.
    Though we should have a simple take away from this short part of the chapter of, "HaShem never ask of us any more than He may need. He also never ask more than we can afford to give. Be it our time, money, or both, we should give freely, and only out of love.
    10 "And they shall make an ark of acacia wood; two and a half cubits shall be its length, a cubit and a half its width, and a cubit and a half its height.
    11 And you shall overlay it with pure gold, inside and out you shall overlay it, and shall make on it a molding of gold all around.

    Why gold? A question I have looked at many times in my life, and found no solid answer. Well at lest one that fits in a way that seems right. However the best answer came from a geologist. Gold is the only thing on this earth that is incorruptible. No matter what we do to it, it remains the same. So it would seem that HaShem is telling us something here.
    It may well be that we are being told to be the same way. Incorruptible both in the image we project to others, as well as the one hold when we think no one will see us.

    12 You shall cast four rings of gold for it, and put them in its four corners; two rings shall be on one side, and two rings on the other side.
    13 And you shall make poles of acacia wood, and overlay them with gold.
    14 You shall put the poles into the rings on the sides of the ark, that the ark may be carried by them.
    15 The poles shall be in the rings of the ark; they shall not be taken from it.
    16 And you shall put into the ark the Testimony which I will give you.

    If indeed HaShem is telling us to be incorruptible, then can this point to the placement of His Law in our hearts and minds? As told to us in Jer. 31:31-33, and confirmed Yeshua?

    17 You shall make a mercy seat of pure gold; two and a half cubits shall be its length and a cubit and a half its width.
    18 And you shall make two cherubim of gold; of hammered work you shall make them at the two ends of the mercy seat.
    19 Make one cherub at one end, and the other cherub at the other end; you shall make the cherubim at the two ends of it of one piece with the mercy seat.
    20 And the cherubim shall stretch out their wings above, covering the mercy seat with their wings, and they shall face one another; the faces of the cherubim shall be toward the mercy seat.
    21 You shall put the mercy seat on top of the ark, and in the ark you shall put the Testimony that I will give you.
    22 And there I will meet with you, and I will speak with you from above the mercy seat, from between the two cherubim which are on the ark of the Testimony, about everything which I will give you in commandment to the children of Israel.
    we were asked to pray for 2 thing in the Word, do we pray them?
    Psa 122:6 Pray for the peace of Jerusalem: they shall prosper that love thee.
    Mat.9:38
    Pray ye therefore the Lord of the harvest, that he will send forth labourers into his harvest.

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    Default Re: A Study of Torah from Gen. - Rev.

    Ex 25:23-
    23 "You shall also make a table of acacia wood; two cubits shall be its length, a cubit its width, and a cubit and a half its height.
    24 And you shall overlay it with pure gold, and make a molding of gold all around.
    25 You shall make for it a frame of a handbreadth all around, and you shall make a gold molding for the frame all around.
    26 And you shall make for it four rings of gold, and put the rings on the four corners that are at its four legs.
    27 The rings shall be close to the frame, as holders for the poles to bear the table.
    28 And you shall make the poles of acacia wood, and overlay them with gold, that the table may be carried with them.
    29 You shall make its dishes, its pans, its pitchers, and its bowls for pouring. You shall make them of pure gold.
    30 And you shall set the showbread on the table before Me always.

    though we can a number of teachings on this table, and it's bread. The best one I know of is also the simplest. The crown if you will, that is placed on it is a reminder that HaShem is King of Israel. The bread is to show that under His rule Israel will remain a prosperous nation. If they will only walk in both faithfulness, and obedience.

    31 "You shall also make a lampstand of pure gold; the lampstand shall be of hammered work. Its shaft, its branches, its bowls, its ornamental knobs, and flowers shall be of one piece.
    32 And six branches shall come out of its sides: three branches of the lampstand out of one side, and three branches of the lampstand out of the other side.
    33 Three bowls shall be made like almond blossoms on one branch, with an ornamental knob and a flower, and three bowls made like almond blossoms on the other branch, with an ornamental knob and a flower--and so for the six branches that come out of the lampstand.
    34 On the lampstand itself four bowls shall be made like almond blossoms, each with its ornamental knob and flower.
    35 And there shall be a knob under the first two branches of the same, a knob under the second two branches of the same, and a knob under the third two branches of the same, according to the six branches that extend from the lampstand.
    36 Their knobs and their branches shall be of one piece; all of it shall be one hammered piece of pure gold.
    37 You shall make seven lamps for it, and they shall arrange its lamps so that they give light in front of it.
    38 And its wick-trimmers and their trays shall be of pure gold.
    39 It shall be made of a talent of pure gold, with all these utensils.
    40 And see to it that you make them according to the pattern which was shown you on the mountain.

    The menorah has became a symbol of many things. Some of them are not at all what they should be. Though the one that stands as true, and has never changed is that it gives us a view of Yeshua. He is the light of the world, just as Israel was to be a light in the world. They were to teach the Torah of what it truly means, and has to tell us. As we move on in this study, slow as it may be right now, we will get a chance to cover this and more in close detail. for now howevr, I must get back to bed. I pray that my next pain meds won't be so strgong, and that I can function in everyday life. At lest as it is for me anymore.
    we were asked to pray for 2 thing in the Word, do we pray them?
    Psa 122:6 Pray for the peace of Jerusalem: they shall prosper that love thee.
    Mat.9:38
    Pray ye therefore the Lord of the harvest, that he will send forth labourers into his harvest.

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