BAPTISM --- TWICE ??

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.

Gabriel2020

Senior Member
May 6, 2017
1,099
41
48
you are missing it. "the baptism that i am baptized with" present tense, not forthcoming.
 
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
20,395
113
Jesus was baptized to fulfill all righteousness... :)
and was already the son of God by birth before he was immersed....

The angel answered and said to her, "The Holy Spirit will come upon you, and the power of the Most High will overshadow you; and for that reason the holy Child shall be called the Son of God.
 

Magenta

Senior Member
Jul 3, 2015
55,247
25,716
113
[video=youtube;CYV7hpD9JTI]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CYV7hpD9JTI[/video]
 

Gabriel2020

Senior Member
May 6, 2017
1,099
41
48
Amen. He was already baptized by the holy spirit while yet in the womb
 

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
24,167
12,763
113
What is the "one baptism" of Ephesians 4:5? One Lord, one faith, one baptism . . . .

Just as animal sacrifice pointed to the greater reality of the sacrifice of Jesus Christ, water baptism is symbolic and points to a greater reality of baptism with holy Spirit.

I indeed have baptized you with water: but he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost. Mark 1:8
For John truly baptized with water; but ye shall be baptized with the Holy Ghost not many days hence. Acts 1:5
Another way to look at this is that water baptism represents the death, burial, and resurrection of the sinner with Christ (indicating that the old life is dead and gone), whereas the baptism WITH the Holy Ghost or Holy Spirit indicates that the saint is now empowered to "walk in newness of life" by the power of the Holy Spirit. As Paul said (and I paraphrase) "Walk in the Spirit and you will not fulfil the lusts of the flesh". Both baptisms are necessary for every Christian, and because many believers were not baptized immediately after conversion, they have not really moved forward in their Christian walk. Why? Because water baptism is the first step of obedience to Christ and becoming disciples (see Matthew 28:18-20).
 

graceNpeace

Senior Member
Aug 12, 2016
2,180
107
63
That's a pretty long explanation of what I think I just stated....

until Jesus came along and gave us a NEW use of "baptizo", the word meant to immerse into some kind of liquid.

THAT is what the people of that time immediately thought of when they were told to "be baptized".

Jesus brought the added (expanded) use of the word as being "immersed in the Spirit". The people of that time had no concept of that. So, when Peter told the crowd to "repent and be baptized", they knew exactly what he meant for them to do.... be immersed in water.

Jesus just taught us that while we are being immersed in water, we are ALSO being immersed in the Spirit... it's both a physical and spiritual immersion.
hornetguy, I really enjoyed your exposition!
Couple of points though to think about:

Total immersion also implies wholehearted commitment. In English we even use this as a figure of speech, like, "I was so immersed in my book I was not aware of anything else."
As such there is no place for spiritual idolatory - the Holy Spirit baptises us into the blood of Christ and immediately after Jesus Christ baptises us into the Holy Spirit. Both immersions are full and complete - never partial. We call this being "born again!"

At some point in time following this one would then be water baptised. Water baptism is not the process outlined above but a visible external pronouncement and public commitment to an already realised inner spiritual reality.

Water baptism and being "born again" are not synonymous concepts, although some believe that they are and this is what is called "baptismal regeneration." Full account of all the Biblical evidence regarding baptism shows that baptismal regeneration is is a misapplication of the texts denoting the spiritual baptism in and by the Holy Spirit to water baptism. In fact, a conflation of the two occurs that results in the erroneous belief that water baptism becomes the moment of salvation (or being born again).
 

Gabriel2020

Senior Member
May 6, 2017
1,099
41
48
I dont know why people are fighting against recieving the holy ghost in this generation. When paul went to that city where other apostles were preaching. They had never heard of the holy ghost and was eager to recieve what they knew nothing about. And recieved it right there on the spot. If this is what hard hearted is then i am shocked.
 
Nov 12, 2015
9,112
822
113
Yes, you are correct... the physical aspect of circumcision was the old law, so Paul saw the futility of trying to impose circumcision on new Christians.... although, I believe he DID insist that Timothy be circumcised, to help with his witness to the Jewish nation...
Then I do not understand what concept you said you disagreed with in my post!! HAHA!
 
Nov 12, 2015
9,112
822
113
Thats ok, There is no indication it is water, The word baptizo itself in the greek does not have water attached to it. It must be taken into context.

Being baptized INTO CHRIST is not the same as being baptized INTO WATER. And john clearly seperated baptism in water with the baptism of the HOLY SPIRIT and Baptism of FIRE

think of baptism as being an action verb, where as the thing one is baptized into is what follows.
The word is spirit and truth. :)
There is always the letter.
But it's the spirit of the word that avails us.
Very hard to read and not go back to the letter - the literal meaning.
It's always a struggle for me!
 
Feb 21, 2012
3,794
199
63
Another way to look at this is that water baptism represents the death, burial, and resurrection of the sinner with Christ (indicating that the old life is dead and gone), whereas the baptism WITH the Holy Ghost or Holy Spirit indicates that the saint is now empowered to "walk in newness of life" by the power of the Holy Spirit. As Paul said (and I paraphrase) "Walk in the Spirit and you will not fulfil the lusts of the flesh". Both baptisms are necessary for every Christian, and because many believers were not baptized immediately after conversion, they have not really moved forward in their Christian walk. Why? Because water baptism is the first step of obedience to Christ and becoming disciples (see Matthew 28:18-20).
Both baptisms are necessary for every Christian, . . . which makes two baptisms. Scripture clearly states there is one baptism.
 

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
24,167
12,763
113
Both baptisms are necessary for every Christian, . . . which makes two baptisms. Scripture clearly states there is one baptism.
Context is critical, and taking things out of context leads to error. Where the Bible says "one baptism" it is clearly a reference to the baptism with the Holy Spirit. But where the Bible says "of the doctrine of baptisms" (plural) that is a reference to several baptisms mentioned in Scripture such as (a) the baptism of John the Baptizer, (b) the baptism with the Holy Ghost, (c) the baptism of the believer by immersion, (d) the baptism with "fire" or suffering, and (e) the baptism with unquenchable fire for those outside of Christ (Matthew 3:12).

Of the doctrine of baptisms, and of laying on of hands, and of resurrection of the dead, and of eternal judgment. (Hebrews 6:2 KJV).
 
Last edited:
Feb 21, 2012
3,794
199
63
Context is critical, and taking things out of context leads to error. Where the Bible says "one baptism" it is clearly a reference to the baptism with the Holy Spirit. But where the Bible says "of the doctrine of baptisms" (plural) that is a reference to several baptisms mentioned in Scripture such as (a) the baptism of John the Baptizer, (b) the baptism with the Holy Ghost, (c) the baptism of the believer by immersion, (d) the baptism with "fire" or suffering, and (e) the baptism with unquenchable fire for those outside of Christ (Matthew 3:12).

Of the doctrine of baptisms, and of laying on of hands, and of resurrection of the dead, and of eternal judgment. (Hebrews 6:2 KJV).
Yes, context is critical . . . I therefore, the prisoner of the Lord, beseech you that you walk worthy of the vocation wherewith you are called, with all lowliness and meekness with longsuffering, forbearing one another in love; endeavoring to keep the unity of the Spirit in the bond of peace. There is one body, and one Spirit, even as you are called in one hope of your calling; one Lord, one faith, one baptism, one God and Father of all, who is above all, and through all, and in you all. Ephesians 4:1-6 .. . . . and in context - there is one baptism and yes it is the baptism of the holy spirit. The baptism of John with water was the forerunner of baptism with holy Spirit . . . both are immersions. Baptism with "fire" or suffering? :confused: Baptism with unquenchable fire? :confused:

As for Hebrews 6 . . . For every one that uses milk is unskilful in the word of righteousness: for he is a babe. But strong meat belongs to them that are of full age, even those who by reason of use have their senses exercised to discern both good and evil. Therefore leaving the principles of the doctrine of Christ, let us go on unto perfection; 1) not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works, and faith toward God, 2) of the doctrine of baptisms, and 3) of laying on of hands, and 4) of resurrection of the dead, and 5) of eternal judgment. . . . . We should be past the "milk" of the word (1-5 listed in v1,2) and moving on to the "meat" of the word . . . IOW, we need to grow up!!

 
M

Miri

Guest
When I was baptised, something happened spiritually it wasn't just a physical act.

Did baptism save me - NO I was saved before I got baptised but spiritually
something happened. I felt such peace and joy, I was walking on air in the
coming weeks. I felt such contentment and it was like something had changed in me.
I knew without a shadow of a doubt the God was with me and pleased with me.


Matthew 3:16-17 NKJV
[16] When He had been baptized, Jesus came up immediately from the water; and behold,
the heavens were opened to Him, and He saw the Spirit of God descending like a dove
and alighting upon Him. [17] And suddenly a voice came from heaven, saying,
"This is My beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased."


It pleases God when we are baptised. :)

It would be interesting to know how others felt when they were baptised, maybe it
will encourage those who haven't been baptised, to think about going for it.
 
J

joefizz

Guest
Please Holy spirit be with me as you have been frequently of late...
The question posed by Fran was,is it necessary for a member of her family to be baptized again seeing as that they were baptized as a baby,well first off Fran I shall speak on the wise paul did,I apologize if what I say offends you but I shall not apologize for telling the "Truth".(also if you can't read my post feel free to edit it into paragraphs and etc,I shall try to be mindful of not doing a wall text!)
Here is your answer...a baby has no reason to be baptized for it is written,"if a child hath no parent then God accepts the child with open arms"meaning whether a baby is baptized or not if the child dies God accepts the child into heaven into his "arms",
A "true"water baptism is when the individual is aware of that they are being baptized not for mere membership to a church(the wrong reason to be baptized)but rather you accept Jesus's death for your sins and believe faithfully that from the baptism you shall be cleansed of sin through Jesus,(thereby being rid of your own sin as well as being free from adam's old sin)
so your family member,only if the desire a clean slate for themselves and truly believe that Jesus died for their sins shall they choose water baptism now being "able" to accept cleansing through water baptism,which is really in general terms starting over with no sin(yet still capable of sin)
but remember water baptism is only "water" if there is no willingness to begin life a new,just as to be saved is not to be forced upon anyone,neither is water baptism to be forced each "individual" must decide for themselves whether or not they will ask God to save their soul sincerely,accept Jesus as their saviour,and be baptized in water thereby being baptized into Jesus's death,and both are best to do for once going through both "Willingly" "anyone" can receive the holy spirit,who not only comforts but will teach one while one reads the bible,and bring to mind scriptures(as the holy spirit does for me ever so frequently now!)that you have read and know some about,
So to summarize no your family member does not have to be baptized but their first supposed baptism was not a "True" water baptism so this has currently done nothing for your family member where as if they are willingly water baptized now they will receive the blessing of what the bible tells of,a new start without sin.
Though as I said both are best to go through because anyone who does so willingly will not only receive the holy spirit but also be forever God's servant and thereby being in his hand therefore nothing nor noone can pluck the individual from God's hand,as in the devil has no more power over the individual and they are protected eternally by God,and "if God is for you,who dare be against you" so basically to further summarize an individual can have wisdom from the holy spirit,God's protection,and a sin free new start,"for whosoever believeth in the son is a new creature,the old is gone the new is come(not the exact scripture probably because I'm about to nod off)
so I have given what the holy spirit has allowed me to share with you,now you may decide what you believe and if you tell your relative they can decide what they believe,I have given you truth but no command for I am not God and as his servant can only speak in such a way that one understands baptism and salvation but shall never be forced by me in anyway for I be not a fool for I fear God who can destroy body and soul,so I dare not speak in a forcive manner,authorative and truthful yes but forcibly no,well I am fading into sleep fast,so I would last like to say I have given what I can to answer your question,Fran and I leave this all for you to ponder upon.(also as I said before feel free to put my post in a way that you can read it,because I'm too groggy it's 7 am I got off work at 3:30 and have tried my utmost to answer your question,so I'm going to sleep now...)