This thread is dedicated to the results of the Rapture*****I respect Pre-Trib----Mid-Trib---Post Trib****I have studied the End Times for 40 years and heard all the views***I personally believe in Pre-Trib because I see it clearly in the Scriptures***I follow ministries which believe in the other views and have no problem with this aspect of theology----it doesn't determine our Salvation***I have studied theology courses in College which were conducted by educated people who teach the Rapture (they studied at such Colleges as Princeton, ect.)***I tried to find the very best teaching on opposing views to the Rapture because I wanted to be sure I could commit to this teaching when being licensed to preach***Every opposing teaching I have found to the Rapture by all sort of ministries could not move me from what I had found in the Scriptures****I will follow up in this thread on some things I believe will happen in the future and what are responsibilities are now to prepare for them...
Our Responsibility Before and After the Rapture
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The Rapture/Deception ***I believe following the Rapture will follow grand deception which is now being prepared by the devil***forty years ago I was serving as a Chaplain's Assistance in the Army and was on a retreat with soldiers in New Mexico***the purpose was to instill in the soldiers a connection to God and a break from their duties***one of my friends who later served as a minister in the Episcopal Church was talking with me and I shared what I felt God was impressing me with---that after the Rapture their would be an attempt to explain it away as Aliens***he told me I should write a book about it---well, some have written about it and even in the last 30 years those in the New Age movement talk of Christians being removed from the Earth because they are "bad karma"----What are our responsibilities knowing such possible things could be coming?----more to come***
***The Rapture/Two Groups Left ***after the Rapture their will be two distinct groups left on Earth----those who will be deceived because they have rejected the truth (unsaved/indifferent)----and those who know the teachings of the Rapture and realize they missed God and it was true (unsaved/convicted)***it is most urgent now to get the Gospel out to bring in the Harvest so those who can go will go---and those who do not go will have a chance (unsaved/convicted)***as I entered the Army 40 years ago my suitcase had a sticker on it that I'm sure some were curious about that said***Rapture---Are You Ready?---with a picture of Christians being caught up to the Lord...
***The Rapture/Some Say it is Dangerous ***I hear some voice the opinion that the teaching of the Rapture is dangerous because it makes people lazy and unprepared for The Great Tribulation***although it may have this affect on some, does not disqualify it as a great teaching***many said the same thing about the teachings of Grace by the Apostle Paul---that having Grace will make some more likely to sin and take God and their Salvation for granted***I believe some even said that Paul was teaching Grace was so good that you should sin and make Grace abound----God forbid (Romans 6:1)...
What if they announce a rapture occurred... what if you expected to be taken but was left behind? Would you be Faithful? Or upset believing you are not saved?
Prepare to endure until the end not loving your life that fear comes and you will do anything to save it.
That is where we need to be.. ready to die For Our Faith.
Prepare to endure until the end not loving your life that fear comes and you will do anything to save it.
That is where we need to be.. ready to die For Our Faith.
that what happen in thesalonians. Paul warn believer in thesaloniian not to believe the teaching or prophecy or word of mouth or letter, that rapture and second coming is already come
why Paul address this, I believe there is a false prophecy or teaching or letter to thesalonians that rapture already happen.
than paul explain : rapture and second coming Will happen after tribulation, not before
2 Concerning the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our being gathered to him, we ask you, brothers and sisters, 2 not to become easily unsettled or alarmed by the teaching allegedly from us—whether by a prophecy or by word of mouth or by letter—asserting that the day of the Lord has already come.
3 Don’t let anyone deceive you in any way,
for that day Will not come until
the rebellion occurs and the man of lawlessness[a] is revealed, the man doomed to destruction. 4 He will oppose and will exalt himself over everything that is called God or is worshiped, so that he sets himself up in God’s temple, proclaiming himself to be God.
why Paul address this, I believe there is a false prophecy or teaching or letter to thesalonians that rapture already happen.
than paul explain : rapture and second coming Will happen after tribulation, not before
2 Concerning the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our being gathered to him, we ask you, brothers and sisters, 2 not to become easily unsettled or alarmed by the teaching allegedly from us—whether by a prophecy or by word of mouth or by letter—asserting that the day of the Lord has already come.
3 Don’t let anyone deceive you in any way,
for that day Will not come until
the rebellion occurs and the man of lawlessness[a] is revealed, the man doomed to destruction. 4 He will oppose and will exalt himself over everything that is called God or is worshiped, so that he sets himself up in God’s temple, proclaiming himself to be God.
I just listen in youtube, an Indonesian lady have a vission about rapture. Her testimonies is inconsistance
she Said, God brought her to heaven and hell. One thing God show her is a square Building. God say that is third temple.
when the third temple builted Will be chaos
she Said, some Christian will be kill, and there will rapture.
this what the inconsistentce She Said some Christian Will be kill, than there is rapture
if there is rapture, how to kill them.
seem to me temple first than intencified persecution than rapture.
no matter what 2 thesalonians 2 is reliable, Not only in thesalonian. This teaching rapture before trib is happen now
she Said, God brought her to heaven and hell. One thing God show her is a square Building. God say that is third temple.
when the third temple builted Will be chaos
she Said, some Christian will be kill, and there will rapture.
this what the inconsistentce She Said some Christian Will be kill, than there is rapture
if there is rapture, how to kill them.
seem to me temple first than intencified persecution than rapture.
no matter what 2 thesalonians 2 is reliable, Not only in thesalonian. This teaching rapture before trib is happen now
The Pre Tribulation Rapture is part of a satanic belief system created in the 19th Century after a Scottish girl named Margaret McDonald had a vision whilst suffering sickness and a high fever. It was then adopted and developed by Edward Irvin who is considered the Founding Father of the Charismatic Movement. He believed that Christ had a sin nature which resulted in him being kicked out of his own church. The Assemblies of God denomination owe a lot to him. Another key individual Was John Darby who created the whole Dispensationalist system and was head of the Exclusive Brethren cult. A third person mainly responsible for spreading this heresy in the US was Cyrus Scofield Who produced a corrupted verson of the KJV Bible by adding notes to it. This fine man served six months in Prison after defrauding his Mother in Law out of $1,300 all the money She had and a fortune in the 1880s He also left his wife and Children for months dependent on her Mother for support. She Divorced him and he remarried about three months later. These are the people which the whole dispensationalist teaching
rests on.
rests on.
So, pre-tribbers, when is "the day of the Lord"?
Is it the day all you "real Christians" get "raptured
outta here" and all us heathens get "left behind",
or is it the day the Earth and everything on it burns up?
Bible says the latter, and you can't have it both ways.
II Peter 3:
9 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.
10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.
11 Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness,
12 Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?
Is it the day all you "real Christians" get "raptured
outta here" and all us heathens get "left behind",
or is it the day the Earth and everything on it burns up?
Bible says the latter, and you can't have it both ways.
II Peter 3:
9 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.
10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.
11 Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness,
12 Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?
before John Darby, according to this article in this link, Pre trib teaching come from Jesuit priest Fransisco Ribera
vatican asign him to counter reformation to teach that antichrist is not catholic. The fathers of reformation like Luther, Calvin etc believe that antichrist is catholic. I am not agree with all in this link, but at least It give history of Pre trib teaching.
Jesuit End Times Antichrist, 7 year Tribulation, Rapture Deception
vatican asign him to counter reformation to teach that antichrist is not catholic. The fathers of reformation like Luther, Calvin etc believe that antichrist is catholic. I am not agree with all in this link, but at least It give history of Pre trib teaching.
Jesuit End Times Antichrist, 7 year Tribulation, Rapture Deception
The so called rapture is a false doctrine, which can only be documented by twisting scripture. This is one of Satan's MOs.
Remember that religion is one of Satan’s hidden dynasties. He loves to plant false doctrines, which twist Scripture, in Christian churches.
If you believe the rapture, you may find yourself among the following group of deceived Christians when Christ returns.
And said to the mountains and rocks, Fall on us, and hide us from the face of him that sitteth on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb. Revelation 6:16
The above folks are so ashamed because they’ve been worshiping the wrong Christ.
It seems that the rapture people have forgotten how to count. The think the 7th trump comes before 6th ... that the real Christ comes before the false one comes. Christ returns at the 7th trump, not the 6th trump;
At the 6th seal, 6th trump, 6th vial (666), Michael will boot Satan, playing his role as the antichrist (instead of Christ in the Greek), from heaven to earth (Revelation Chapter 12:6-9). Keep in mind that Revelation is a Prophetic book making the word SAW into the futuristic word "will" fall etc.
Christ also gave you all 7 seals & trumps in Mark 13, Luke 21, and Matthew 24. Have you read them with understanding?
So, from where then did the false rapture doctrine come?
Before 1830, you can find no mention of the Rapture Doctrine. That alone ought to send up a red flag. In fact, the word "rapture" is not in the Bible. So, where did this false doctrine come from? In 1830, Margaret MacDonald had an evil revelation on her sick bed, supposedly from God, in which she was shown what would become "The Rapture Of The Church", among other names.
And, from The Incredible Cover-up by Dave Macpherson, Appendix A, you'll read:
"I felt this needed to be revealed, and that there was great darkness and error about it, but suddenly what it was burst upon me with a glorious light." - Margaret MacDonald (Spring of 1830)
MacDonald's revelation would have probably died with her; however, two preachers grabbed it, cleaned it up, and presented it to Christendom. Today, you'll hear many pastors promoting that false doctrine from pulpits. Satan does some of his "best" work from Christian pulpits.
That's why the whole world will whore after him.
Remember that religion is one of Satan’s hidden dynasties. He loves to plant false doctrines, which twist Scripture, in Christian churches.
If you believe the rapture, you may find yourself among the following group of deceived Christians when Christ returns.
And said to the mountains and rocks, Fall on us, and hide us from the face of him that sitteth on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb. Revelation 6:16
The above folks are so ashamed because they’ve been worshiping the wrong Christ.
It seems that the rapture people have forgotten how to count. The think the 7th trump comes before 6th ... that the real Christ comes before the false one comes. Christ returns at the 7th trump, not the 6th trump;
At the 6th seal, 6th trump, 6th vial (666), Michael will boot Satan, playing his role as the antichrist (instead of Christ in the Greek), from heaven to earth (Revelation Chapter 12:6-9). Keep in mind that Revelation is a Prophetic book making the word SAW into the futuristic word "will" fall etc.
Christ also gave you all 7 seals & trumps in Mark 13, Luke 21, and Matthew 24. Have you read them with understanding?
So, from where then did the false rapture doctrine come?
Before 1830, you can find no mention of the Rapture Doctrine. That alone ought to send up a red flag. In fact, the word "rapture" is not in the Bible. So, where did this false doctrine come from? In 1830, Margaret MacDonald had an evil revelation on her sick bed, supposedly from God, in which she was shown what would become "The Rapture Of The Church", among other names.
And, from The Incredible Cover-up by Dave Macpherson, Appendix A, you'll read:
"I felt this needed to be revealed, and that there was great darkness and error about it, but suddenly what it was burst upon me with a glorious light." - Margaret MacDonald (Spring of 1830)
MacDonald's revelation would have probably died with her; however, two preachers grabbed it, cleaned it up, and presented it to Christendom. Today, you'll hear many pastors promoting that false doctrine from pulpits. Satan does some of his "best" work from Christian pulpits.
That's why the whole world will whore after him.
Yes Franscisco Ribera ' (1537-1591) was a Jesuit Priest who the then Pope Leo gave the task of counteracting the reformers belief that the Catholic Church was the Whore of Babylon and the Pope was the Beast. He wrote a commentary on Revelation and created the Futurist position by placing all the details of revelation far into the future so the present Pope couldn't be accused of being him.
Another Jesuit Priest by the name of Emmanual Lacunza (1731-1801), was aware of Riberas teachings. He wrote a book under the fictional name of Rabbi Ben Ezra' (supposedly a Jewish convert), called The Coming of the Messiah in Glory and Majesty. He used a false name so that Protestants wouldn't be alienated from it. He taught that the Church would not be on earth during the tribulation but would be raptured away.
Edward Irvin obtained a copy of this book and translated it from the Spanish into English. It can still be obtained through Amazon. Its in two volumes and the kindle version is very cheap. It also includes a lengthy preface by Irvin.. This brings up to the 19th Century. The whole history of this teaching is full of lies and deception. Unfortunately most Christians are unaware of any of this and rely on others to teach them. Thats how it spreads.
Another Jesuit Priest by the name of Emmanual Lacunza (1731-1801), was aware of Riberas teachings. He wrote a book under the fictional name of Rabbi Ben Ezra' (supposedly a Jewish convert), called The Coming of the Messiah in Glory and Majesty. He used a false name so that Protestants wouldn't be alienated from it. He taught that the Church would not be on earth during the tribulation but would be raptured away.
Edward Irvin obtained a copy of this book and translated it from the Spanish into English. It can still be obtained through Amazon. Its in two volumes and the kindle version is very cheap. It also includes a lengthy preface by Irvin.. This brings up to the 19th Century. The whole history of this teaching is full of lies and deception. Unfortunately most Christians are unaware of any of this and rely on others to teach them. Thats how it spreads.
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I do not believe in the rapture at all, but I have a few small issues with your post....how can Satan/Devil be the antichrist? did you mean the beast? antichrist is not found anywhere in the book of Revelation, right?
Second how can Satan/devil be the beast and satan/devil?....It says that all 3 are thrown in the lake of fire....
Rev 20.10
[SUP]10 [/SUP]And the devil who deceived them was thrown into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are also; and they will be tormented day and night forever and ever.
Jesus said Satan cannot be divided agaisnt himself, so how is it possible that Satan plays the role of the beast and himself?
Luke11.18
[SUP]18 [/SUP]If Satan also is divided against himself, how will his kingdom stand? For you say that I cast out demons by Beelzebul.
I agree with your eschatology, but you are way off point on Satan's role....
Second how can Satan/devil be the beast and satan/devil?....It says that all 3 are thrown in the lake of fire....
Rev 20.10
[SUP]10 [/SUP]And the devil who deceived them was thrown into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are also; and they will be tormented day and night forever and ever.
Jesus said Satan cannot be divided agaisnt himself, so how is it possible that Satan plays the role of the beast and himself?
Luke11.18
[SUP]18 [/SUP]If Satan also is divided against himself, how will his kingdom stand? For you say that I cast out demons by Beelzebul.
I agree with your eschatology, but you are way off point on Satan's role....
***The Rapture/Think About It ***just a little info about the Rapture***not trying to push my ideas on people, but rather to encourage***to be honest with you, some of the people that are against the Rapture are probably going to be mad when it happens----just my impression---sorry***One of the Bible teachers I love is Chuck Smith***he said one time if I recall correctly he doesn't teach on the Rapture as a separate topic at that time because it is all through the Bible and he would teach on it as he came across Rapture passages***I will try to share some things I have discovered about the Rapture***if you are hungry for good teaching on the Rapture I recommend Perry Stone***just to wet your appetite I would like you to find the Rapture in the Letters to the 7 Churches in Revelation----I'll give you a clue---one Church might get tossed into Great Tribulation, while another Church is promised escape from the hour of temptation coming upon the Earth... ***sorry if I ruined your day if your Post-Trib ect.----not my intent to cause strife, rather encouragement and blessing...
