Do you believe God is Good?

oyster67 · Sep 30, 2017

I used to think that perhaps just believing in Jesus and the sufficiency of His atonement might be good enough to please God. I would think of Hebrews 11:6 where it states that faith pleases God, but today it jumped out at me that Hebrews 11:6 says more than that:

11:6 But without faith [it is] impossible to please [him]: for he that cometh to God must believe that he is, and [that] he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him.

So must we also believe that He is kind and benevolent?

Desertsrose · Sep 30, 2017

oyster67 said:

Hi Oyster,

Great OP!

What kind of faith pleases God? James talked about a dead faith. I would conclude Paul is speaking here in Hebrews of the true faith, the faith that's not dead, but is alive and this faith believes there Is God and that He rewards those who diligently seek Him.

I believe that Paul is describing what true faith looks like and He gives examples of those who have gone before us, the great cloud of witnesses whose faith was genuine and they proved it through the life they lived in obedience to God.

How I would answer your question is instead of the MUST WE in your question, I would change it around and look at where this comment is couched. It describes those with genuine faith.

This verse you posted says that without faith it's impossible to please Him. So conversely, with faith, it is possible to please Him.

So faith is described as:
~ believing that He is
~ believing that He is a rewarder of those who diligently seek Him

So I don't see it as we Must, but if we have genuine faith we Will.

oldhermit · Sep 30, 2017

oyster67 said:

I used to think that perhaps just believing in Jesus and the sufficiency of His atonement might be good enough to please God. I would think of Hebrews 11:6 where it states that faith pleases God, but today it jumped out at me that Hebrews 11:6 says more than that:

11:6 But without faith [it is] impossible to please [him]: for he that cometh to God must believe that he is, and [that] he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him.

So must we also believe that He is kind and benevolent?

We need to believe in all of the extended attributes of God. Why would we not?

Magenta · Sep 30, 2017

Jesus answered. "No one is good--except God alone."

Jesus said that only God is good. Yes, I believe it

followjesus · Sep 30, 2017

oyster67 said:

11:6 But without faith [it is] impossible to please [him]: for he that cometh to God must believe that he is, and [that] he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him.

it kind of tells you what to believe there what faith believes, that God exists, and that He is a rewarder of those who diligently seek Him. <<<<< the second part there is what many refuse to acknowledge.

if you believe God rewards the One who diligently seeks Him, then you will diligently seek Him, if the Belief is real. we have to believe what God said not only what we think is a good thing to believe, but what God has said. were called to seek Him, to Love and Obey Him, to believe that if we serve God He will reward us as he repeats again and again.

somehow people have come to believe that we dont need to seek God diligently because well.....were already saved and can never refuse or "Lose" that regardless of whether we seek Him or not. false doctrine has omitted so much of the truth , all for the sake of men getting rich off selling thier latest revolutionary gospel........it doesnt need a revolution it has been perfect since God spoke it.

trofimus · Sep 30, 2017

oyster67 said:

When I read the rest of the chapter and examples given there, I think it means that we must belive He is, but this is (similarly to what James says) not enough.

We must also live according to His will, awaiting that our deeds will be judged, awarded or punished.

Dino246 · Sep 30, 2017

oyster67 said:

Do I believe that God is good? Yes, very much so! He has proven His goodness to me many times.

Must I believe that God is good? No, that is not stated as such as a requirement for salvation, but I suspect very few people who do believe in Jesus for salvation believe otherwise. It is certainly plausible that one who comes to saving faith does not immediately believe that God is good, but he or she will likely grow into that understanding fairly soon, provided that person is seeking to grow in Christ.

tourist · Sep 30, 2017

in the book of John it states that God is love.

DustyRhodes · Sep 30, 2017

1 John 4:16: God is love and he who lives in love lives in God and God lives in Him.
The God that is in us makes us good since that is why Jesus came.

Angela53510 · Sep 30, 2017

Desertsrose said:

I agree with what you have posted here, except Paul did not write Hebrews. For one thing, Paul identified himself very clearly in all of his epistles. Hebrews does not!

Second, the Greek is significantly different, and more complex than what Paul wrote. Different words, syntax and grammar. And hard! Hebrews was the third last passage we read in second year Greek. It was so difficult, the professor is removing it from the next edition. We did Hebrews 6, a very interesting chapter, but so hard to translate. Even Luke and Acts aren't that hard.

Suggestions as to who wrote it include Apollos, or other native Greek scholars. Ironical, when it was written to the Hebrews! Yet, there were Hellenistic Jews for 400 years, from the time of Alexander the Great, whose goal was to Hellenize the known world, which happened!

My favourite possibility as to authorship was that Prisca, or Priscilla wrote it. She might have had to protect herself from Greeks and Romans, who would not accept the scholarship of women. Really, she had the most to gain by anonymity! Of course, in actual fact, the author of Hebrews will remain unknown until we see Jesus face to face. Who wrote Hebrews, a wonderful book, is near the top of my "Questions to Ask Jesus When He Returns" list!

Angela53510 · Sep 30, 2017

As to the OP, yes, God is good, all the time, every day, in every way!

Why would you even ask, or consider anything else!

Hizikyah · Sep 30, 2017

oyster67 said:

John/Yahanan 14:23, "Yahshua answered, and said to him: If a man loves Me, he will keep My teachings and My Father will love him, and We will come to him and make Our home with him."

and I say these as if from my own mouth

Matthew 9:13, “But go and learn what this means, ‘I desire compassion and not offering. For I did not come to call the righteous to repentance, but sinners.”

Hosea 6:6, “For I delight in loving-commitment and not sacrifice, and in the knowledge of Yah more than ascending offerings.”

Micah 6:8, “He has declared to you, O man, what is good. And what does יהוה require of you but to do right, and to love loving-commitment, and to walk humbly with your Father?"

Matthew 12:7, “And if you had known what this means, ‘I desire compassion and not offering,’ you would not have condemned the blameless."

Psalm 32:1, “Blessed is he whose transgression is forgiven, Whose sin is covered.”

Isayah 44:22, "“I shall wipe out your transgressions like a cloud, and your sins like a mist. Return to Me, for I shall redeem you.”

Psalms 25:14-18, “The secret of יהוה is with those who fear Him, And He makes His covenant known to them. My eyes are ever toward יהוה, For He brings my feet out of the net. Turn Your face to me, and show me favor, For I am lonely and afflicted. The distresses of my heart have enlarged; Oh, bring me out of my distresses! Look on my affliction and my toil, And forgive all my sins.”

Lamentations 3:22-24, “The kindnesses of יהוה ! For we have not been consumed, For His compassions have not ended. They are new every morning, Great is Your trustworthiness. “יהוה is my Portion,” says my being, “Therefore I wait for Him!”

MattforJesus · Sep 30, 2017

oyster67 said:

Yes,we must.

People must have faith,and believe that God exists,and also that He will do good to all those who follow Him.

Creation testifies there is a God,and of His attributes,so the world is without excuse.

Which one of these attributes is love,for He provided food,and the means to make clothing,and shelter,and also that He is powerful,and above us,and wise,and highly intelligent.

Creation alone can testify against a person why did they not acknowledge a higher power who is love,and love people,for He loves people.

Therefore all people whether they heard the word of God,or not,have the testimony by creation that God is love,and good,and loves people,and provided them with food,and the means to make clothing,and shelter.

So obviously through creation alone,everybody has the witness that God is love,and good,and does good things for us.

So a person has to believe that God exists,and come to Him knowing that He is love,and good,for they already have the testimony of that by creation.

To come to God believing that He exists,but does not care about our welfare,for He will do no good for us,but we better follow Him or we will be in trouble,is to go against the witness of creation to all mankind,which nobody has an excuse.

Or to believe that He exists,but has no dealing at all with mankind,is to go against creation.

StevieXKR · Sep 30, 2017

I believe that our Lord has put us on this earth to make our own choices. We can choose good or we can choose evil

joaniemarie · Sep 30, 2017

When we know we are loved by God unconditionally we are motivated by that love. It's the love of God that constrains us. Meaning it compels us to move forward. I like your question very much oyster because it's so important to God that we love Him back. He wants us to know and trust in and rely and DEPEND on His love and concern and watch care of us.

Sure., obedience is a great and wonderful thing. But why we obey is the question. To obey out of fear is not what we are called to do. We love God because we have an understanding of how He loves us. Our desire is to do all and be all that He wants because we know He loves us and is for us. We know He cares about our welfare and so much so He sent Jesus His only Son to show us just how much.

There is so much more to the love and grace of God that we will be and need to be learning each day. Once we start learning we want to learn more and more about Him. And then we want to learn how to be more like Him by allowing Him to live in and through us. Gal.2:20 And the Holy Spirit makes sure we will succeed. Amen!!

notmyown · Sep 30, 2017

oyster67 said:

hello, oyster,

i think it's pretty clear God is indeed kind and benevolent if only in that 'the rain falls on the just and the unjust'.

that He also saves people is big evidence of it. but you know what strikes me about that whole chapter?
the writer, under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit, recounts a long list of people who 'by faith' did such and such, all good stuff.
but we know from the Scriptures that most of them also committed awful sin (like me) and not one time does God bring it up in this chapter.

...their sins and lawless deeds I will remember no more.

i find that beyond kind, and comforting, too. what i really wonder is, are you okay, bro? anything troubling you?
my PM is open, if you need a friend, just so you know.

graceNpeace · Sep 30, 2017

Angela53510 said:

Nice post!

I confess to never considering Priscilla as the author of Hebrews.
Your theory is an interesting one!

I too am intensely curious to know actually wrote Hebrews.
Whoever it was had a simply brilliant grasp of the implications of the New covenant with respect to all the other covenants that preceded it, not to mention being a supremely gifted writer!

Bladerunner · Sep 30, 2017

Angela53510 said:

Hello Angela53510....I happen to be one of those that believe that Paul wrote Hebrews.
Here is one of the articles about Hebrews that helped makeup my mind as who the author was.

The Epistle to the Hebrews is one of the two greatest theological treatises of the New Testament.1 This letter is, in a real sense, the "Leviticus" of the New Testament, detailing how the Lord Jesus Christ is both the fulfillment and the successor to all that had gone on before.

The extreme dilemma of the Jewish Christians -- especially while the Temple was still standing -- was their extreme predicament.

They had been drawn from a divinely appointed religion, with divinely appointed priests officiating in a divinely appointed Temple, accomplishing a divinely ordered service, all of which had been ennobled throughout their entire history.

How could believing priests and Pharisees remain "zealous of the Law"? It was, after all, the Jewish world that had crucified Christ and was repudiating Him.

This letter was clearly aimed at the people who were now Christians but had come out of Judaism. It focuses on the background that they came from, and tries to demonstrate how Jesus was a fulfillment of those things; in fact, he superseded those things. Jesus is the very fulfillment of the Old Testament.

Authorship

Who wrote the book of Hebrews? Hebrews is an unsigned book and there are many theories, but the available evidence, we feel, seems to justify a Pauline ascription.

Apollos? Some suggest that Apollos wrote this epistle, although there is not much evidence to support the theory. Furthermore, Apollos was from Alexandria, and yet even in Alexandria in the earliest times the book was associated with Paul. So, if Apollos was the author, somehow he didnt even convince his own hometown.

Barnabas? Others ascribe the book to Barnabas, but here again there is no evidence to support this theory. There are some spurious writings (that are not regarded as authentic) that were attributed to Barnabas, but their style is so different from the epistle to the Hebrews that if one can conclude that the writings attributed to Barnabas were at all indicative of Barnabas style, he clearly didnt write the Epistle to the Hebrews.

Paul? There are many stylistic reasons that point to its Pauline authorship.

Pauls Special Mark

If one recognizes that there were apparently forgeries of Thessalonian letters being circulated, then several passages become clearer.2 Thus at the end of that letter, Paul includes a sort of special mark, a token:

The salutation of Paul with mine own hand, which is the token in every epistle: so I write.
2 Thessalonians 3:17

Note how Paul is emphasizing that he has signed the letter with his own hand (most were probably drafted by an amanuensis or secretary). He would include a sign at the end so they would know that the letter was really from him.

So what is this signature or style item that is included in every letter?3

The grace of our Lord Jesus Christ be with you all. Amen.
2 Thessalonians 3:18

And how does Hebrews end?

Grace be with you all. Amen.
Hebrews 13:25

Why is this so impressive of Pauls style? Because the word "Grace" does not even appear in the other epistles!4

The Trilogy on Habakkuk 2:4

The key verse in Habakkuk is:

The Just shall live by faith.
Habakkuk 2:4

This verse became the primary banner that inflamed the Reformation. It would seem that Paul penned a deliberate trilogy on this very verse.

Who are "the Just"? The Book of Romans answers the question (Cf. Rom 1:17).

How then "Shall [they] Live"? Gal-atians shows how we are to live -- called out of religious externalism (Cf. Gal 3:11).

"By faith..." What is the epistle on "faith"? This Epistle to the Hebrews (Cf. Heb 10:38)!

As a former systems engineer and technologist in the information sciences, I tend to favor evidences that reveal an architecture and integrity of design, and it is this unique characteristic of the entire Bible that has been the foundation of our ministry.

Thus, it is the apparent trilogy of Romans, Galatians and Hebrews, dealing specifically on Habakkuk 2:4, that causes us to lean strongly on the inference that Hebrews was authored by Paul.

(If it should turn out that it was by another, then this very design becomes an even more impressive "fingerprint" of the Holy Spirit!)

Other Stylistic Evidences

In Romans 8:35-39, Paul lists a number of things that can separate you from the love of Christ. He lists seven things, and then 10 more, for a total of 17.

In Hebrews 12:18-24 we find a similar list: Again there are seven things, and then 10 more, for a total of 17. And in Galatians 5:19-21 there is also a list of 17 things.

(Again, it is Romans, Galatians, and Hebrews that evidence a similarity of style.)

Paul also favored the Greek word, huios, "sons," rather than a similar Greek word, teknon, which other writers use, which means "children."

The "witness of the Holy Spirit," discussed in Romans 8:16 and Hebrews 10:15 also hints at a common authorship.

In Hebrews 13:18, the writer says, "Pray for us." There is only one epistle writer that makes that specific request: none other than Paul.

The Role of Timothy

In Chapter 13 of Hebrews, there is a reference that notes that the writer of the Epistle to the Hebrews was accompanied by Timothy.5 We know from a number of epistles that Timothy accompanied Paul.6 We do not have any record of him accompanying anyone else. While that does not mean that Timothy exclusively accompanied Paul, we do not have any evidence of him accompanying any other writer.

Why Anonymous?

So if Paul did write the book, why would he keep it anonymous? From Acts 9:15 we know that Paul was the apostle to the Gentiles. While the Gentiles were his primary mission field, he also had an intense burden for his own brethren. Looking at Pauls life, it is clear that Paul would sooner or later write an epistle to the Hebrews.

So why would he write one and keep it anonymous? Because every time he tried to address them there were riots. They were prejudiced against his ministry; he was distrusted by the Jews because he had converted to Christianity.

He never recovered the confidence of the Jewish side; they reputed his apostleship and also feared his attack against their ancient rituals and ceremonies.7

Nowhere in the book of Hebrews does Paul assert his apostleship, unlike his other epistles, but instead he builds his entire thesis uniquely from basic Jewish arguments from Old Testament passages. He exalts Christ, not his own apostleship.

There are reasons in the text that we could infer that the book was probably written after Pauls first imprisonment, but before his second arrest.8 It was clearly written prior to the destruction of the Temple in 70 a.d. The impending destruction of the Temple may have been one of the reasons that God had Paul show them how they needed, as Christian believers, not only to accept Christ, but to come out of Judaism.9

Peters Testimony

Peter also seems to allude to this letter in 2 Peter 3:15-16:

And account that the longsuffering of our Lord is salvation; even as our beloved brother Paul also according to the wisdom given unto him hath written unto you...
2 Peter 3:15

Peter here ascribes a letter written by Paul to the Hebrews. But the other 13 Pauline epistles all went to Gentile churches. So if Hebrews was not written by Paul, then there is a missing letter written by Paul to the Hebrews.

As also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which they that are unlearned and unstable wrest, as they do also the other scriptures, unto their own destruction.
2 Peter 3:16

Here Peter is commenting on Pauls letter, saying that Paul had written some things that were hard to understand (indeed, the difficulties in Hebrews 6 and 10).(1)

Koinonia House, "The Pivotal Epistle, Hebrews"

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Cee · Oct 1, 2017

The glory of God is connected to the goodness of God. (Declared when He walked by Moses)

And the glory of God is covering the Earth.

If we take "gospel" we find it means "good news"...

What is the good news? God is good. So good that He gave His Son so that we might have eternal life.

Which is to know Him.

It is the Father's "good pleasure" to give you the Kingdom...

Every good and perfect gift comes from the Father of lights...

Doubting the revelation of God's goodness was the first lie...

"God doesn't want you to be like Him..."

Doubting the goodness of God, but gospel dismantles that lie and teaches us that God has always wanted us to be like Him.

It is the purpose of God to conform us into the Image of His Son...

Now after reading what I wrote, consider Scripture that says, faith is only what gives Him pleasure...

It only gives Him pleasure when we believe He IS (Which means with us now) and He wants to gives us gifts as our Rewarder...

Said another way, His Presence presently gives us presents of Himself.

C.

Namiette · Oct 1, 2017

Of course I do believe that God is good. And I do believe it not because I was told so, but because I have experienced His goodness in my life. He is good. Without any doubt. After all, giving the only beloved Son to be punished for the sins of the whole world, what is it, if it's not a love and goodness?

I do not fully understand your "must we believe". How can anyone believe in God, see what He has done for us and what He is doing for us, and not believe that God is good?

Do you believe God is Good?

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