The Concept of a Trinity

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newton3003

Senior Member
Feb 4, 2017
437
42
28
#1
[FONT=Calibri, sans-serif]Somehere have asked the question of whether the Father, the son and theholy ghost form one God. Some have asserted that it is the doctrineof one God. So, since our understanding of God is based on thescriptures as well as should be, despite the fact that since we arenot God, our understanding of Him is not perfect, nonetheless 2Timothy 3:16 says, “All Scripture is breathed out by God andprofitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, and fortraining in righteousness...” And it is with that understandingthat we approach the question of a trinity operating as one.[/FONT]


[FONT=Calibri, sans-serif]TheGod we are talking about is the God who created the heavens and theearth and who led Moses and his people to the Promised Land. It isthe God whom Jesus as a rabbi extolled the virtues of faith andunderstanding in Him. Jesus came to earth long after the Creation,but that is not to say he didn't exist along with God long before.Jesus himself says in John 8:58, “...before Abraham was, I am.”[/FONT]


[FONT=Calibri, sans-serif]ButGod, Jesus and the holy spirit are separate and distinct, inasmuch aspassages in the Scriptures delineate them. Jesus makes thedistinction in Matthew 28:19 when he tells his disciples to “ Gotherefore and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in thename of the FATHER AND OF THE SON AND OF THE HOLY SPIRIT. “ Thethree may exist as a trinity, but the fact that Jesus names the threeseparate components would lead us to believe that each componentcould exist without depending on the others, inasmuch as a husbandand wife could exist without the other. [/FONT]


[FONT=Calibri, sans-serif]AlthoughJesus has said that he and the Father are one, if you consider whathe said in John 8:58 as well as the rest of the Scriptures, he meantthat he and God are one in terms of what God wants. To be sure, 1Corinthians 8:6 says “...yet for us there is one God, the Father,from whom are all things and for whom we exist, and one Lord, JesusChrist, THROUGH whom are all things and THROUGH whom we exist. Jesusis the conduit of what God wants.[/FONT]


[FONT=Calibri, sans-serif]Andwhat is the Holy Spirit? Does it emanate from the Bible, or are weinfluenced by it through God's Grace? If it emanates from the Bible,that would imply that our works may contribute to our salvation whenwe have faith, but if it influences us through God's Grace alone,then it contributes to the assertion that it is by faith alone,without works, that we may attain salvation. [/FONT]


[FONT=Calibri, sans-serif]Passagesin the Old Testament refer to the Spirit, and in that context it isthe Spirit of God. Psalm 139:7 says, “Where shall I go from yourSpirit? Or where shall I flee from your presence?” Psalm 104:30says, “When you send forth your Spirit, they are created,[/FONT]
[FONT=Calibri, sans-serif]andyou renew the face of the ground.” [/FONT]


[FONT=Calibri, sans-serif]Itell you that the Trinity are physically different from eachother,but in terms of what God wants they are one and the same.[/FONT]
 

PennEd

Senior Member
Apr 22, 2013
12,818
8,594
113
#2
Umm.. If this is a convoluted way to say Jesus is NOT God. You are gravely wrong. And it is heresy


So can you just say whether that is what you are posting?
IS JESUS GOD?
 

Magenta

Senior Member
Jul 3, 2015
55,247
25,715
113
#3
Scripture PLAINLY, EXPLICITLY, and IRREVOCABLY states that Jesus is God.

Read John Chapter one. Here are a couple of the very relevant parts:

In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

We probably most of us know that by heart. How can it be overlooked? Then verse 14,

The Word became flesh and dwelt among us.
 

tourist

Senior Member
Mar 13, 2014
41,243
16,252
113
69
Tennessee
#4
The trinity is God. There is the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. Take either one away and there would be no God. You can either believe this or disbelieve at your own peril.
 

Magenta

Senior Member
Jul 3, 2015
55,247
25,715
113
#5
Matthew 1:23 - “Behold, the virgin shall be with child, and bear a Son, and they shall call His name Immanuel,” which is translated, “God with us.”

Isaiah 9:6 - For unto us a Child is born, Unto us a Son is given; And the government will be upon His shoulder. And His name will be called Wonderful, Counselor, Mighty God, Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace.

Isaiah 43:10,11 - “You are My witnesses,” says the Lord, “And My servant whom I have chosen, That you may know and believe Me, and understand that I am He. Before Me there was no God formed, Nor shall there be after Me. I, even I, am the Lord, and besides Me there is no Savior.”
Revelation 1:17-18; Revelation 2:8 - (Jesus is the First and the Last)

Isaiah 44:6 - (God is the Redeemer)
2 Peter 1:1 (Jesus is the Redeemer) - “To those who have obtained like precious faith with us by the righteousness of our God and Savior Jesus Christ

Isaiah 44:24 - (God created the world by Himself alone)
John 1:3; Colossians 1:16 - (Jesus made all things)

John 1:1-3 - In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. He was in the beginning with God. All things were made through Him, and without Him nothing was made that was made... 1:14 - And the Word became flesh and dwelt among us,

John 5:17,18 - “My Father has been working until now, and I have been working.” Therefore the Jews sought to kill Him, because He not only broke the Sabbath, but also said that God was His Father, making Himself equal with God.

John 5:23 - that all should honor the Son just as they honor the Father. He who does not honor the Son does not honor the Father who sent Him.

John 8:24 - “Therefore I said to you that you will die in your sins; for if you do not believe that I AM [He], you will die in your sins.”

John 8:58 - Then Jesus said to them, “Most assuredly, I say to you, before Abraham was, I AM.”

John 10:30-33 - Jesus answered them, “I and My Father are one.” Then the Jews took up stones again to stone Him. Jesus answered them, “Many good works I have shown you from My Father. For which of those works do you stone Me?” The Jews answered Him, saying, “For a good work we do not stone You, but for blasphemy, and because You, being a Man, make Yourself God.”

John 14:6-7 - Jesus said to him, “I AM the way, the truth, and the Life. No one comes to the Father except through Me.”

John 14:9-11 - Jesus said to him, “Have I been with you so long and yet you have not known Me, Philip? He who has seen Me has seen the Father; so how can you say, 'Show us the Father'?”

John 20:28 - And Thomas answered and said to Him, “My Lord and my God!

Acts 4:12 - “Nor is there salvation in any other, for there is no other name under heaven given among men by which we must be saved.”

Acts 20:28 - (God purchased us with His own blood)
Revelation 1:5-6; Revelation 5:8-9 - (Jesus' blood purchased us)

Philippians 2:5-7 - Let this mind be in you which was also in Christ Jesus, who, being in the form of God, did not consider it robbery to be equal with God, but made Himself of no reputation, taking the form of a bond-servant, and coming in the likeness of men.

Colossians 2:9 - For in Him dwells all the fullness of the Godhead bodily

1 Timothy 3:16 - And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifested in the flesh, Justified in the Spirit, Seen by angels, Preached among the Gentiles, Believed on in the world, Received up in glory.

Titus 2:13 - looking for the blessed hope and glorious appearing of our great God and Savior Jesus Christ

Hebrews 1:8-9 - But to the Son He says: “Your throne, O God, is forever and ever; A scepter of righteousness is the scepter of Your kingdom. You have loved righteousness and hated lawlessness; Therefore God, Your God, has anointed You with the oil of gladness more than Your companions.”

2 John 1:7 - For many deceivers have gone out into the world who do not confess Jesus Christ as coming in the flesh. This is a deceiver and an antichrist.

Revelation 1:8 - “I am the Alpha and the Omega, the Beginning and the End,” says the Lord, “who is and who was and who is to come, the Almighty.”

Revelation 22:13 - “I AM the Alpha and the Omega, the Beginning and the End, the First and the Last.”... 22:16 - “I, Jesus, have sent My angel to testify to you these things in the churches.”

1 Timothy 6:14-16 - “our Lord Jesus Christ's appearing, which He will manifest in His own time, He who is the blessed and only Potentate, the King of kings and Lord of lords, who alone has immortality, dwelling in unapproachable light, whom no man has seen or can see, to whom be honor and everlasting power. Amen.”
 

Prov910

Senior Member
Jan 10, 2017
880
47
0
#7
Somehere have asked the question of whether the Father, the son and theholy ghost form one God. Some have asserted that it is the doctrineof one God. So, since our understanding of God is based on thescriptures as well as should be, despite the fact that since we arenot God, our understanding of Him is not perfect, nonetheless 2Timothy 3:16 says, “All Scripture is breathed out by God andprofitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, and fortraining in righteousness...” And it is with that understandingthat we approach the question of a trinity operating as one.


TheGod we are talking about is the God who created the heavens and theearth and who led Moses and his people to the Promised Land. It isthe God whom Jesus as a rabbi extolled the virtues of faith andunderstanding in Him. Jesus came to earth long after the Creation,but that is not to say he didn't exist along with God long before.Jesus himself says in John 8:58, “...before Abraham was, I am.”


ButGod, Jesus and the holy spirit are separate and distinct, inasmuch aspassages in the Scriptures delineate them. Jesus makes thedistinction in Matthew 28:19 when he tells his disciples to “ Gotherefore and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in thename of the FATHER AND OF THE SON AND OF THE HOLY SPIRIT. “ Thethree may exist as a trinity, but the fact that Jesus names the threeseparate components would lead us to believe that each componentcould exist without depending on the others, inasmuch as a husbandand wife could exist without the other.


AlthoughJesus has said that he and the Father are one, if you consider whathe said in John 8:58 as well as the rest of the Scriptures, he meantthat he and God are one in terms of what God wants. To be sure, 1Corinthians 8:6 says “...yet for us there is one God, the Father,from whom are all things and for whom we exist, and one Lord, JesusChrist, THROUGH whom are all things and THROUGH whom we exist. Jesusis the conduit of what God wants.


Andwhat is the Holy Spirit? Does it emanate from the Bible, or are weinfluenced by it through God's Grace? If it emanates from the Bible,that would imply that our works may contribute to our salvation whenwe have faith, but if it influences us through God's Grace alone,then it contributes to the assertion that it is by faith alone,without works, that we may attain salvation.


Passagesin the Old Testament refer to the Spirit, and in that context it isthe Spirit of God. Psalm 139:7 says, “Where shall I go from yourSpirit? Or where shall I flee from your presence?” Psalm 104:30says, “When you send forth your Spirit, they are created,
andyou renew the face of the ground.”


Itell you that the Trinity are physically different from eachother,but in terms of what God wants they are one and the same.
This is a great topic to discuss. But one problem you'll face in this conversation is that there are lots of folks here on CC who are convinced they know the specifics of God, Jesus and the Holy Spirit (and lots of other things). They trot out doctrines handed down by their particular church, and if you try to discuss something that questions those doctrines they'll accuse you of speaking heresy.

The fact of the matter is, God is omniscient, omnipresent and omnipotent. He is beyond our comprehension. As such, God is not subject to the limits of our understanding of Him or our doctrines regarding Him. It's wonderful to study and learn about God, Jesus and the Holy Spirit. But I don't think we are capable of defining God to fit a a neat little well packaged doctrine, as some would have us believe. /jmho
 

Magenta

Senior Member
Jul 3, 2015
55,247
25,715
113
#8
This is a great topic to discuss. But one problem you'll face in this conversation is that there are lots of folks here on CC who are convinced they know the specifics of God, Jesus and the Holy Spirit (and lots of other things). They trot out doctrines handed down by their particular church, and if you try to discuss something that questions those doctrines they'll accuse you of speaking heresy.
Haha yeah the OP trotted out his opinion convinced he is right... right?

The fact of the matter is, God is omniscient, omnipresent and omnipotent. He is beyond our comprehension. As such, God is not subject to the limits of our understanding of Him or our doctrines regarding Him. It's wonderful to study and learn about God, Jesus and the Holy Spirit. But I don't think we are capable of defining God to fit a a neat little well packaged doctrine, as some would have us believe. /jmhoIt
It is against the site rules to continually present and argue for the acceptance of heretical views. Denying the Trinity/that Jesus is God is a bannable offense, because it is heretical. The Deity of Jesus Christ is a core Christian belief. As the apostle Paul stated, For in Christ all the fullness of the Deity lives in bodily form (Col. 2:9).
 
Nov 26, 2012
3,095
1,050
113
#9
In order for one to argue that Jesus is the Father you need to ignore multiple passages and misinterpret one. If someone gets banned for believing that then ban me. They called Christ a heretic too.
 

trofimus

Senior Member
Aug 17, 2015
10,684
794
113
#10
In order for one to argue that Jesus is the Father you need to ignore multiple passages and misinterpret one. If someone gets banned for believing that then ban me. They called Christ a heretic too.
Jesus is not Father.
 

Magenta

Senior Member
Jul 3, 2015
55,247
25,715
113
#11
In order for one to argue that Jesus is the Father you need to ignore multiple passages and misinterpret one. If someone gets banned for believing that then ban me. They called Christ a heretic too.
Jesus is called the Son of God. I have never seen anyone argue that Jesus is the Father, so your red herring does not fly. Christ and the Father are one. Jesus said so :)
 

bluto

Senior Member
Aug 4, 2016
2,023
505
113
#12
In order for one to argue that Jesus is the Father you need to ignore multiple passages and misinterpret one. If someone gets banned for believing that then ban me. They called Christ a heretic too.
I'm "hungry" to know hungry, where in the entire Bible is Jesus identified as God the Father? :eek:

IN GOD THE SON,
bluto
 
Apr 15, 2017
2,867
653
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#13
Isa 44:8 Fear ye not, neither be afraid: have not I told thee from that time, and have declared it? ye are even my witnesses. Is there a God beside me? yea, there is no God; I know not any.

The heaven,and the heavens of heavens,cannot contain God,for He is an omnipresent Spirit,so there is not a place,and not anything,that He does not know about,and He said He cannot find another God.

Isa 43:10 Ye are my witnesses, saith the LORD, and my servant whom I have chosen: that ye may know and believe me, and understand that I am he: before me there was no God formed, neither shall there be after me.
Isa 43:11 I, even I, am the LORD; and beside me there is no saviour.

God said there was no God formed before Him,and there will be no God formed after Him,but how can there be when God is an omnipresent Spirit,and God means supreme being.

Only God can be the supreme being,for He occupies all space,and He is in all,and through all,and above all,for He flows all through all creation,and has all the power that can be possessed,and has all the knowledge that can be known.

God could not create another God,for everything He created comes from the physical matter,and what kind of God would that be for God can assemble,and disassemble physical matter,at any time.

There is no such thing as God apart from God,for it is impossible.

No God beside God,no God before God,and no God after God.God is so awesome it is crazy,and His Spirit cannot blow up,cannot disintegrate,cannot melt,cannot shred,cannot break in pieces.He is so great that many cannot believe He exists for the greatness the Bible describes Him,for they say that a being like that could not exist.

Isa 9:6 For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace.
Isa 9:7 Of the increase of his government and peace there shall be no end, upon the throne of David, and upon his kingdom, to order it, and to establish it with judgment and with justice from henceforth even for ever. The zeal of the LORD of hosts will perform this.

Isa 59:1 Behold, the LORD'S hand is not shortened, that it cannot save; neither his ear heavy, that it cannot hear:
Isa 59:2 But your iniquities have separated between you and your God, and your sins have hid his face from you, that he will not hear.
Isa 59:12 For our transgressions are multiplied before thee, and our sins testify against us: for our transgressions are with us; and as for our iniquities, we know them;
Isa 59:13 In transgressing and lying against the LORD, and departing away from our God, speaking oppression and revolt, conceiving and uttering from the heart words of falsehood.
Isa 59:14 And judgment is turned away backward, and justice standeth afar off: for truth is fallen in the street, and equity cannot enter.
Isa 59:15 Yea, truth faileth; and he that departeth from evil maketh himself a prey: and the LORD saw it, and it displeased him that there was no judgment.
Isa 59:16 And he saw that there was no man, and wondered that there was no intercessor: therefore his arm brought salvation unto him; and his righteousness, it sustained him.
Isa 59:17 For he put on righteousness as a breastplate, and an helmet of salvation upon his head; and he put on the garments of vengeance for clothing, and was clad with zeal as a cloke.
Isa 59:18 According to their deeds, accordingly he will repay, fury to his adversaries, recompence to his enemies; to the islands he will repay recompence.
Isa 59:19 So shall they fear the name of the LORD from the west, and his glory from the rising of the sun. When the enemy shall come in like a flood, the Spirit of the LORD shall lift up a standard against him.

Mic 5:2 But thou, Bethlehem Ephratah, though thou be little among the thousands of Judah, yet out of thee shall he come forth unto me that is to be ruler in Israel; whose goings forth have been from of old, from everlasting(Son,no beginning).

Jesus is made after the order of Melchizedek who was a visible manifestation of God,who had no mother or father,and had neither beginning of days,or end of life.

1Ti 3:16 And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory.

1Ti 6:14 That thou keep this commandment without spot, unrebukeable, until the appearing of our Lord Jesus Christ:
1Ti 6:15 Which in his times he shall shew, who is the blessed and only Potentate, the King of kings, and Lord of lords;
1Ti 6:16 Who only hath immortality, dwelling in the light which no man can approach unto; whom no man hath seen, nor can see: to whom be honour and power everlasting. Amen.

Jesus is God,and He cannot be a created God,for there was no God formed after God,and there is no such thing as a created God,for it is impossible.

Jesus dwells in the light that no person can approach unto,and no person has ever seen Jesus,and no person will ever see Jesus,for He is God an invisible Spirit,that manifest Himself in flesh.

Which that throws some people off because how can Jesus be God,when He is in a human body,and now a glorified body,for God is greater than that.

God manifest in the flesh means that God manifest all His attributes to the man Christ Jesus,and the Spirit in Christ is still connected to the omnipresent Spirit of God,for God cannot be separated,meaning Jesus is an omnipresent Spirit,flesh robed around Spirit,and the Spirit flows through that flesh,and the man Christ Jesus is the personal human body of God.

Jesus is an omnipresent Spirit,and Jesus does not have His own personal piece of the Spirit that moves around with Him in His visible manifestation,for there cannot be an empty space the Spirit is not at,and there cannot be a space that has a double portion of the Spirit in that area.

The Spirit does not have to move,for the Spirit is already there,but the man Christ Jesus moves through the Spirit,and where ever He is at the Spirit is there.

If the man Christ Jesus is standing in a certain spot He has the Spirit that occupies that space,but if He moves 50 feet away He has the Spirit that occupies that spot,for He moves through the Spirit,for the Spirit does not have to move,for the Spirit is already there.

The same as the saints,but Jesus has the fulness of God's attributes,but the saints partial attributes.

If it were possible that Jesus had a portion of the Spirit that broke off from the rest of the Spirit,and moved around with Him,then we could say Jesus is not God,for He would not be the fulness of God,but since God cannot be separated,and God is in all,and through all,and occupies all space,then we can say Jesus is God,for He is an omnipresent Spirit because He moves through the Spirit,and has the fulness of God's attributes.

Jesus moves through the Spirit,so He is the omnipresent Spirit.Jesus is not a created God with partial attributes,but He is the fulness of the Godhead bodily.
 
Apr 23, 2017
1,064
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#14
sekkluud mon. these threads coming out the woodworks lately...... i wonder why non-trinitarians are so adament about speaking their mind u see....... because everytime i ask unitarians "are trinitarians saved?" they say something like well salvation isnt about right theology, they dodge the question...... well ok then why should i be unitarian???? while they are risking everything for if Jesus is God, and they dont believe that "I AM" about Jesus...... problems u see.

only unitarian i like is teh one that says honestly yeah i believe trinitarians are idolaters and lost.......... they are the honest ones u see.
 

Magenta

Senior Member
Jul 3, 2015
55,247
25,715
113
#15
I suggest the OP read John chapter eight, wherein Jesus is discussing Who He is with the scribes and Pharisees, after they tried to trick Him. Jesus told them they would die in their sins if they did not believe Who He said He was. In John 9:39, Jesus says the Scriptures testify of Him.

Jesus is the Rock of our salvation. God is the only Rock of our salvation.

Psalm 78:35

And they remembered that God was their rock, And the Most High God their Redeemer.

Genesis 49:24
But his bow remained firm, And his arms were agile, From the hands of the Mighty One of Jacob (From there is the Shepherd, the Stone of Israel),


Deuteronomy 32:15
"But Jeshurun grew fat and kicked-- You are grown fat, thick, and sleek-- Then he forsook God who made him, And scorned the Rock of his salvation.


2 Samuel 23:3
"The God of Israel said, The Rock of Israel spoke to me, 'He who rules over men righteously, Who rules in the fear of God,


Psalm 42:9
I will say to God my rock, "Why have You forgotten me? Why do I go mourning because of the oppression of the enemy?"


Isaiah 30:29
You will have songs as in the night when you keep the festival, And gladness of heart as when one marches to the sound of the flute, To go to the mountain of the LORD, to the Rock of Israel.


Habakkuk 1:12
Are You not from everlasting, O LORD, my God, my Holy One? We will not die You, O LORD, have appointed them to judge; And You, O Rock, have established them to correct.


2 Samuel 22:32
"For who is God, besides the LORD?
And who is a rock, besides our God?


Psalm 18:31
For who is God, but the LORD? And who is a rock, except our God,


1 Samuel 2:2
"There is no one holy like the LORD, Indeed, there is no one besides You, Nor is there any rock like our God.


Isaiah 44:8
'Do not tremble and do not be afraid; Have I not long since announced it to you and declared it? And you are My witnesses Is there any God besides Me, Or is there any other Rock? I know of none.'"


Deuteronomy 32:31
"Indeed their rock is not like our Rock, Even our enemies themselves judge this.


Deuteronomy 32:37
"And He will say, 'Where are their gods, The rock in which they sought refuge?


Psalm 144:1
Blessed be the LORD, my rock, Who trains my hands for war, And my fingers for battle;


Deuteronomy 32:4
"The Rock! His work is perfect, For all His ways are just; A God of faithfulness and without injustice, Righteous and upright is He.


Psalm 92:15
To declare that the LORD is upright; He is my rock, and there is no unrighteousness in Him.


Psalm 62:7
On God my salvation and my glory rest; The rock of my strength, my refuge is in God.


Psalm 28:1
To You, O LORD, I call; My rock, do not be deaf to me, For if You are silent to me, I will become like those who go down to the pit.


Psalm 31:1-3
In You, O LORD, I have taken refuge; Let me never be ashamed; In Your righteousness deliver me. Incline Your ear to me, rescue me quickly; Be to me a rock of strength, A stronghold to save me. For You are my rock and my fortress; For Your name's sake You will lead me and guide me.


Psalm 61:2
From the end of the earth I call to You when my heart is faint; Lead me to the rock that is higher than I.


Psalm 71:3
Be to me a rock of habitation to which I may continually come; You have given commandment to save me, For You are my rock and my fortress.


Isaiah 26:4
"Trust in the LORD forever, For in GOD the LORD, we have an everlasting Rock.


Psalm 94:22
But the LORD has been my stronghold, And my God the rock of my refuge.


2 Samuel 22:3
My God, my rock, in whom I take refuge, My shield and the horn of my salvation, my stronghold and my refuge; My savior, You save me from violence.


Psalm 18:2
The LORD is my rock and my fortress and my deliverer, My God, my rock, in whom I take refuge; My shield and the horn of my salvation, my stronghold.


Psalm 95:1
O come, let us sing for joy to the LORD, Let us shout joyfully to the rock of our salvation.


2 Samuel 22:47
"The LORD lives, and blessed be my rock; And exalted be God, the rock of my salvation,


Psalm 18:46
The LORD lives, and blessed be my rock; And exalted be the God of my salvation,
 

Magenta

Senior Member
Jul 3, 2015
55,247
25,715
113
#16
Psalm 19:14
Let the words of my mouth and the meditation of my heart Be acceptable in Your sight, O LORD, my rock and my Redeemer.


Psalm 62:2
He only is my rock and my salvation, My stronghold; I shall not be greatly shaken.


Psalm 89:26
"He will cry to Me, 'You are my Father, My God, and the rock of my salvation.'


Isaiah 17:10
For you have forgotten the God of your salvation And have not remembered the rock of your refuge. Therefore you plant delightful plants And set them with vine slips of a strange god.


Isaiah 8:14
"Then He shall become a sanctuary; But to both the houses of Israel, a stone to strike and a rock to stumble over, And a snare and a trap for the inhabitants of Jerusalem.


Isaiah 28:16
Therefore thus says the Lord GOD, "Behold, I am laying in Zion a stone, a tested stone, A costly cornerstone for the foundation, firmly placed. He who believes in it will not be disturbed.


Psalm 118:22
The stone which the builders rejected Has become the chief corner stone.


Matthew 21:42
Jesus said to them, "Did you never read in the Scriptures, 'THE STONE WHICH THE BUILDERS REJECTED, THIS BECAME THE CHIEF CORNER stone; THIS CAME ABOUT FROM THE LORD, AND IT IS MARVELOUS IN OUR EYES'?


Mark 12:10

"Have you not even read this Scripture: 'THE STONE WHICH THE BUILDERS REJECTED, THIS BECAME THE CHIEF CORNER stone;


Luke 20:17
But Jesus looked at them and said, "What then is this that is written: 'THE STONE WHICH THE BUILDERS REJECTED, THIS BECAME THE CHIEF CORNER stone'?


Acts 4:11
"He is the STONE WHICH WAS REJECTED by you, THE BUILDERS, but WHICH BECAME THE CHIEF CORNER stone.


1 Peter 2:6-7
For this is contained in Scripture: "BEHOLD, I LAY IN ZION A CHOICE STONE, A PRECIOUS CORNER stone, AND HE WHO BELIEVES IN HIM WILL NOT BE DISAPPOINTED." This precious value, then, is for you who believe; but for those who disbelieve, "THE STONE WHICH THE BUILDERS REJECTED, THIS BECAME THE VERY CORNER stone,"


Matthew 21:44
"And he who falls on this stone will be broken to pieces; but on whomever it falls, it will scatter him like dust."


Luke 20:18
"Everyone who falls on that stone will be broken to pieces; but on whomever it falls, it will scatter him like dust."


Romans 9:32-33
Why? Because they did not pursue it by faith, but as though it were by works. They stumbled over the stumbling stone, just as it is written, "BEHOLD, I LAY IN ZION A STONE OF STUMBLING AND A ROCK OF OFFENSE, AND HE WHO BELIEVES IN HIM WILL NOT BE DISAPPOINTED."


1 Peter 2:4-8
And coming to Him as to a living stone which has been rejected by men, but is choice and precious in the sight of God, you also, as living stones, are being built up as a spiritual house for a holy priesthood, to offer up spiritual sacrifices acceptable to God through Jesus Christ. For this is contained in Scripture: "BEHOLD, I LAY IN ZION A CHOICE STONE, A PRECIOUS CORNER stone, AND HE WHO BELIEVES IN HIM WILL NOT BE DISAPPOINTED."
 
J

jaybird88

Guest
#17
In order for one to argue that Jesus is the Father you need to ignore multiple passages and misinterpret one. If someone gets banned for believing that then ban me. They called Christ a heretic too.
the roman church would also label the Nazerenes as heretics.

Mark 14:67
and seeing Peter warming himself, she looked at him and said, “You also were with the Nazarene, Jesus.”

sometimes i wonder if rome and the pharisees even read the scriptures, they seemed to focus all of their time writing heresies and killing everyone based on the heresies.
 

trofimus

Senior Member
Aug 17, 2015
10,684
794
113
#18
the roman church would also label the Nazerenes as heretics.

Mark 14:67
and seeing Peter warming himself, she looked at him and said, “You also were with the Nazarene, Jesus.”

sometimes i wonder if rome and the pharisees even read the scriptures, they seemed to focus all of their time writing heresies and killing everyone based on the heresies.
Jesus was from Nazareth, which is also a meaning of the word "Nazarene".
 
J

jaybird88

Guest
#19
Jesus was from Nazareth, which is also a meaning of the word "Nazarene".
could be the root of the term Nazarene, but the point was they (Jesus, the 12, the first set of believers) were called Nazarenes, not nazarethites. and the roman church called this group heretics.
 

oldhermit

Senior Member
Jul 28, 2012
9,142
612
113
69
Alabama
#20
These people are never going to believe Jesus is God no matter what scripture tells them. They ignore the testimony of John. They ignore the testimony of Paul and the other apostles and they even ignore the testimony of the Father and I weary of dealing with these people.