Is the great biblical flood real or not?

[trofimus]

True science results in TECHNOLOGY, not stories about lands before time as depicted in propaganda cartoons obviously for children.

Truth is, there isn't any such thing as creation science, nor any science of the past.

So, criminology or a reconstruction of crime scene is not scientific, just because it is about past?

 

[Dino246]

I thought Psalms were meant to be positive and uplifting, like creating something, instead of destroying it.

I don't know where that idea came from, but likely not from actually reading the Psalms. Here are a few excerpts (with key words bolded):

Psalm 68:
21 Surely God will shatter the head of His enemies,
The hairy crown of him who goes on in his guilty deeds.
22 The Lord said, “I will bring them back from Bashan.
I will bring them back from the depths of the sea; 23 That your foot may shatter them in blood,
The tongue of your dogs may have its portion from your enemies.”

Psalm 69:
22 May their table before them become a snare;
And when they are in peace, may it become a trap.
23 May their eyes grow dim so that they cannot see,
And make their loins shake continually.
24 Pour out Your indignation on them,
And may Your burning anger overtake them.
25 May their camp be desolate;
May none dwell in their tents.
26 For they have persecuted him whom You Yourself have smitten,
And they tell of the pain of those whom You have wounded.
27 Add iniquity to their iniquity,
And may they not come into Your righteousness. 28 May they be blotted out of the book of life
And may they not be recorded with the righteous.

Psalm 73:
16 When I pondered to understand this,
It was troublesome in my sight

17 Until I came into the sanctuary of God;
Then I perceived their end.
18 Surely You set them in slippery places;
You cast them down to destruction.
19 How they are destroyed in a moment!
They are utterly swept away by sudden terrors! 20 Like a dream when one awakes,
O Lord, when aroused, You will despise their form.

So there were 3 sons of the same parents...

2 parents...

And then 3 other women married to the 3 sons...

I guess Noah was European, his wife African, and their sons must have married an Asian, an Indian, and an Inuit.

And then after the flood the peoples born of these 8 star seeds all decided to divide themselves ethnically by continents separated by thousands of miles of sea.

And then they must have forgot how they traveled so far from their native lands.

Until one day, Christopher Columbus had a vision of a past life, and sought out to unify all the ethnicities once again.

Hmmm...

You're making things up based on an apparently limited understanding of genetics. Instead of mocking, why don't you do some investigation? The information is readily available for those who want to learn.

 

[Sagart]

True science results in TECHNOLOGY, not stories about lands before time as depicted in propaganda cartoons obviously for children.

Truth is, there isn't any such thing as creation science, nor any science of the past.

Have you not noticed how completely lacking in science the myths of modern science are?

Let me give you a simple truth that you probably never heard of.

Are you ready?

There exists no mechanism by which to lay down well sorted layers of materials on a global scale except a deep global flood.

Now what do the phony myth making scientists say about those banded layers? They claim that the well sorted layers everyone can plainly see from mountain top to beneath valley floors were laid down over eons of time. But, they don't tell you that long spans of time can't produce well sorted materials.

There is not one word of truth in this delusional nonsense!

 

[Sagart]

And where do you think mountains came from?
Let me guess....you think they magically rose up out of the ground over eons of time?
Magic underground mountain making forces.

It never occurs to you science minded readers that there exists no mountain making underground force.

The Holy Bible tells you scoffers would show up at the time of the end. And so hete they are. But surely you readers know that scoffers are not scientific thinkers.

This post is a commingling of inexcusable ignorance of the earth, and more delusional nonsense!

Why do some people who profess to be Christians believe that their mission from God is to make Christians appear to be intellectually challenged baboons suffering from the late stages of dementia?

 

[Joseppi]

There are today about 2,000,000 genetically distinct populations of animals living on the earth.

A strawman argument unrelated to the kinds of beasts that entered the ark.

The few hundred thousand “kinds” of animals, including the dinosaurs, mammoths, giant ground sloths, etc., which have become extinct must also be considered.

Mammoths are elephant kind, dinosaurs are cartoon creatures that appear to be man made genetic monsters, giant sloths are sloths.

Did they all become extinct before the flood?

The flood of Noah is the catastrophy that wipe out all flesh that wasn't allowed on the ark.

The ark, as literally described in Genesis, was much too small because the amount of water that it would be capable of displacing would weigh less than the animals, cages, and food on board, thus making it impossible for the ark to float.

You have no clue how many creature kind were on the ark nor the weight of food, cages, and creatures on the

The floor space on the ark was too small to hold any more than a tiny fraction of the cages that would be necessary to keep the animals in place (and from eating each other).

So far all you are doing is presenting strawman arguments dependent on other strawman arguments. Your initial premise was false.

[QuotepThe amount of food required for the animals would weigh at least nearly as much as the animals, and would require a vast amount of storage space.

Why would hibernating creatures need vast amounts of food?

Many of the animals aboard the ark would have required specific FRESH fruits, vegetables, leaves, grass, bark, roots, etc., including fresh fruits that are produced only on MATURE plants.

Hibernation solves such problems.

Most of the genetically discrete populations of fish (including many VERY LARGE fish) would have to be taken aboard the ark and kept in tanks of water that met their very specific water chemistry needs in order to survive.

No fish needed to be on the ark.

The weight of the water on the earth would have crushed to death any of the land plants that did not drown in the water

Except for the fact that plants float.

After 150 days when the water abated, there would be no vegetation on the earth for the herbivores to eat, and no meat for the carnivores to eat, therefore a vast amount of food would necessarily have been kept aboard the ark to sustain the animals AFTER the flood.

The flood of Noah is what laid down the top soil needed for future growth.
Plant life grew rapidly in the rich soil after the flood.
And this began while Noah remained on the ark as the earth dried.
And the creatures initially occupied the high ground that was drier.

The Animals could not all be released all at once or in the same place because many of them would eat each other.

So they were released wisely by Noah.
And they were young small creatures not large bulky adults.

The coming of the animals to Noah from all over the earth would have been a physical impossibility no less impossible...

Creatures still migrate irregardless of your made up notions of what you think impossible.

The polar bears and penguins, not to mention all of the unique kinds of animals in Australia, would have posed more than a few special difficulties.

Not at all. The polar bear is of the bear kind. And the existence of land bridges to australia is well known.
And the ocean waters rose over centuries after the flood and isolated them there.

After the flood, the animals could not be returned to their original habitat because all habitats would have been destroyed by the flood.

The migration of creatures is instinctive and adaptation within kind in new environments is not limited by former habitats.

Many of the necessary habitats would take 50 years or more to be reestablished and their reestablishment would have required the effort of many thousands of persons.

The creatures adapted rapidly after the flood.

Until all the necessary habitats could be reestablished, the animals requiring these habitats would have to be kept and cared for by Noah and his family.

Again you use strawman arguments to support specious conclusions conclusions on them.

There was not enough water to cover the entire earth, and even if there was, where did it go after the flood?

There is enough water to reach a height of 8ooo feet.
The Pacific Ocean basin sank to facillitate the drainage of water of the continents.
And sediment layers on the highest mountains of the earth prove they were under water and raised upwards after floid waters abated.

If the reported sightings of the Ark are factual, the Ark came to rest on a VERY high mountain on VERY rugged terrain from which the large majority of the animals would not have been able to descend.

Where the ark rested is not known except as a region.

The narrative of Noah’s Ark cannot be a literal account of an historic event. Indescribably huge and very numerous miracles would have been necessary, and a literal interpretation of Genesis does not allow for these miracles because the whole point of the narrative is that through the natural, physical means of an ark built by Noah and his family, mankind and all the kinds of animals were saved from the floodwaters.

Your incredulousness is not evidence of anything.

 

[Joseppi]

So, criminology or a reconstruction of crime scene is not scientific, just because it is about past?

Correct. The prosecutor tells a story and a jury on non scientists vote on it.

 

[Joseppi]

Not "magically", but naturally by the processes during the formation of our planet.

What natural mountain making force are you referring to?

 

[Joseppi]

So, can anyone google a scientific answer as to how a sediment layer of well sorted materials can be laid down slowly over long spans of time?

 

[CainHarmbank]

I don't know where that idea came from, but likely not from actually reading the Psalms. Here are a few excerpts (with key words bolded):

Psalm 68:
21 Surely God will shatter the head of His enemies,
The hairy crown of him who goes on in his guilty deeds.
22 The Lord said, “I will bring them back from Bashan.
I will bring them back from the depths of the sea; 23 That your foot may shatter them in blood,
The tongue of your dogs may have its portion from your enemies.”

Psalm 69:
22 May their table before them become a snare;
And when they are in peace, may it become a trap.
23 May their eyes grow dim so that they cannot see,
And make their loins shake continually.
24 Pour out Your indignation on them,
And may Your burning anger overtake them.
25 May their camp be desolate;
May none dwell in their tents.
26 For they have persecuted him whom You Yourself have smitten,
And they tell of the pain of those whom You have wounded.
27 Add iniquity to their iniquity,
And may they not come into Your righteousness. 28 May they be blotted out of the book of life
And may they not be recorded with the righteous.

Psalm 73:
16 When I pondered to understand this,
It was troublesome in my sight

17 Until I came into the sanctuary of God;
Then I perceived their end.
18 Surely You set them in slippery places;
You cast them down to destruction.
19 How they are destroyed in a moment!
They are utterly swept away by sudden terrors! 20 Like a dream when one awakes,
O Lord, when aroused, You will despise their form.



You're making things up based on an apparently limited understanding of genetics. Instead of mocking, why don't you do some investigation? The information is readily available for those who want to learn.

Way to project dude or dudette. You are the one making things up here, exxagerating the weather control powers of God, and then doubling down on inconceivable ethnic distribution theories. I'm only trying to satirically show how each big lie of yours after the next is ridiculous.

Maybe if you want people to take the bible more seriously you can try reading into it with some more grains of salt.

 

[Dino246]

Way to project dude or dudette.

Likewise. If you want to suggest that I am not the gender that my profile lists, I will grant you the same, Ma'am.

You are the one making things up here, exxagerating the weather control powers of God, and then doubling down on inconceivable ethnic distribution theories. I'm only trying to satirically show how each big lie of yours after the next is ridiculous.

Maybe if you want people to take the bible more seriously you can try reading into it with some more grains of salt.

I'm merely telling you what the Bible says. If you choose not to believe it, that's between you and God. Your assertion that I'm telling lies awaits evidence.

As for genetics, you are welcome to your opinion. Until you want to learn, you are unteachable anyway.

 

[CainHarmbank]

So, can anyone google a scientific answer as to how a sediment layer of well sorted materials can be laid down slowly over long spans of time?

I think early on in building the world, before any life was seeded here, it was entirely covered with water.

I'm guessing the lands and mountains were erected more quickly than the scientific consensus, but I guess the subduction / earthquake process might have been the way it was done.

I think this process would have been so shaky that no life could have been seeded here during it and survived.

That is why I don't think any mountains were formed during the gflood, but well in advance.

Perhaps you can reply to enlighten me if any of my assumptions are erroneous...

 

[CainHarmbank]

Likewise. If you want to suggest that I am not the gender that my profile lists, I will grant you the same, Ma'am.



I'm merely telling you what the Bible says. If you choose not to believe it, that's between you and God. Your assertion that I'm telling lies awaits evidence.

As for genetics, you are welcome to your opinion. Until you want to learn, you are unteachable anyway.

Oh sorry I didn't check your profile for your gender dude.

There is no evidence to support a worldwide flood wiping out all life during man's time on earth is there? Your only evidence is what, a tall tale called the book of Genesis?

I am not the one claiming all of the ethnicities in the world came from Noah and family. Since you have asserted it, perhaps you can support your assertion using your own words from the evidence you have gathered.

 

[Dino246]

Oh sorry I didn't check your profile for your gender dude.

No worries. You can check the gender of a contributor by noting the colour of their nickname in the upper-left corner. Males are blue, females are pink. A few newcomers get it wrong, but I have yet to meet anyone on here who intentionally misrepresents themselves.

There is no evidence to support a worldwide flood wiping out all life during man's time on earth is there? Your only evidence is what, a tall tale called the book of Genesis?

I am not the one claiming all of the ethnicities in the world came from Noah and family. Since you have asserted it, perhaps you can support your assertion using your own words from the evidence you have gathered.

Actually, there is plenty of evidence to support a worldwide flood in human memory, but you probably won't find it by following Nova, BBC, or National Geographic. I would recommend answersingenesis.org, icr.org and creation.com as a start.

As for genetic diversity from Noah's family, that is primarily from Scripture, but supported by other sources. I can do some digging if you're serious about learning. I don't have them on hand to list; much of my knowledge comes from a wide variety of books, lectures, YouTube videos, and articles, so I doubt I could cite them all. Some names that come to mind are Jonathan Sarfati, Ken Ham, Jason Lisle, Don Patton, and Thomas Kindell. There are also extensive video series from the Northwest Creation Conferences over the last decade or so.

 

[Joseppi]

I think early on in building the world, before any life was seeded here, it was entirely covered with water.

I'm guessing the lands and mountains were erected more quickly than the scientific consensus, but I guess the subduction / earthquake process might have been the way it was done.

I think this process would have been so shaky that no life could have been seeded here during it and survived.

That is why I don't think any mountains were formed during the gflood, but well in advance.

Perhaps you can reply to enlighten me if any of my assumptions are erroneous...

I note that you provided no scientific evidence because the isn't any.
And I saw no indication that you understood my point about there being no mechanism that sorts out materials into banded layers.
The banded layerd seen world wide are banded because all materials within a band have been sorted in deep water and laid down as a layer in a short time.
Whereas, long periods of time materials can't be sorted out into discrete bands either in or out of water.
Which means that the banding you see worldwide is the global evidence of a global flood of deep water.

 

[Lucy-Pevensie]

exxagerating the weather control powers of God

I think you should make your peace with The Lord. You have an attitude problem. If his omnipotence is a problem for you, you are stumbling through information (having started off on the wrong foot) rather than studying it. And you are open to all sorts of deception.


Job 38:4

[FONT=&quot]“Where were you when I laid the earth’s foundation?[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] Tell me, if you understand.



[/FONT]

 

[trofimus]

Correct. The prosecutor tells a story and a jury on non scientists vote on it.

And jury of both non scientists and scientists voted that the Universe is very old and that animals and plants developed over time.

Its the most probable scenario with tuns of evidence and, most importantly, making working and verifiable models.

 

[Joseppi]

All the water laid sediments 2 miles deep and laying on the continents and crossing over oceans is the evidence of the extinction results of Noah's flood.
There exists no other explanation. Only deep waters can produce the result seen GLOBALLY.
And the millenias old Genesis text reveals that the ancients knew what happened. While modern scientists claim to not see the evidence.

There is no evidence to support a worldwide flood wiping out all life during man's time on earth is there? Your only evidence is what, a tall tale called the book of Genesis?

See text preceeding the above quote.

[/quote]I am not the one claiming all of the ethnicities in the world came from Noah and family. Since you have asserted it, perhaps you can support your assertion using your own words from the evidence you have gathered.[/QUOTE]If there was genetic evidence contrary to the flood of Noah narrative as found in the Holy Bible you'd here about it.
But all genetics agrees with the biblical narrative.
Now the biased scientists invent out of africa stories to try and spin the genetic evidences as if mankind originated in africa when all evidence points to the fertile cresent area.

 

[Joseppi]

And jury of both non scientists and scientists voted that the Universe is very old and that animals and plants developed over time.

Its the most probable scenario with tuns of evidence and, most importantly, making working and verifiable models.

Science isn't based on juries, concensus, and vague probability claims.
Such nonsense is invented by biased people who have no integrity and only desire to create "just so stories" that agree with their anti Holy Bible philosophies, and packaged ad cartoon friendly propoganda for children.

 

[Joseppi]

Any scientist cult can tell just so stories and publish cartoons.
But that isn't science.

The Holy Bible is history recorded by eye witnesses, provided with geneaologies, locations, time frames, predictions of God, and extending down to the prrsent day as the ONLY KNOWN HISTORY OF MANKIND, and has a continuity throught of the purpose of God from beginning to predicted end of mankind.
In case you haven't ever noticed the obvious....
The world of heathen intellectuals can offer no history whatsoever.
They can't explain where and/or how anything originated.
But you can just believe that the cosmos created and invented itself without reason purpose.
"The nobody created, designed or did anything" theory.

True science leads to and establishes technolgies that obey the laws governing nature.
False science leads to cartoons of just so stories about the supposed time before history.

 

[Endoscopy]

Not "magically", but naturally by the processes during the formation of our planet.

Secular not Biblical view. "In the begining God created the heavens and earth. Science has shown that the universe is expanding therefore it had a beginning. Oops both agree. Big bang evolution fails 5 scientific laws. Poor atheists have a major problem here.