The End is Near for Dispensationalism - it's cracking apart..

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Sep 14, 2017
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They do not symbolise of allegorise. They just note how large numbers were used in those days as indicating, for example, a long period of time (e.g. 'a thousand generations', which even you would not see as literal)




Satan was bound in the abyss in Revelation 9.



But the Scriptures do not state that it is literal. By all Old Testament examples it is NOT 'literal'



But the Scriptures do not demonstrate a 'literal fulfilment'. You have to PROVE it.
He's already proven it and you're still saying he has to, which means 1. nothing's gonna please you 2. You can't prove your own point with scripture
It seems to me if you were able to silence Ahwatukee with scripture, you'd have done it by now.
 
Sep 14, 2017
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They do not say 'through His church'. Christ IS ruling from Heaven (or is Acts 2 wrong?)



NOWHERE does it say He will literally rule on this physical earth from the physical Jerusalem. You imagine it.



Christ is ruling all things.



I would disagree, He IS shepherding the people with a rod of iron and He will smash them in pieces like a potter's vessel. HE is in control.
Again, no scripture.
 
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7seasrekeyed

Guest
I guess I should clarify. In the 4.5 yrs I've been on here I can only remember one issue where I was genuinely angry and disgusted. And it in a way had to do with this issue. The person was so adamantly opposed to Israel that she eventually went down the Holocaust denial route. I personally knew people who both suffered in the camps, and who liberated them.

I'm convinced at the root of Christian anti-semitism is replacement theology.

I absolutely love those that do not see Scripture in the literal way I do, but I must point out I NEVER start these threads dealing with this issue. But I feel compelled to respond to those that want to degrade those of us who believe in the literal interpretation.
I understand that our primary function as members of the body is to love one another and spread the Gospel unto Salvation to a dying world.

I think the rude awakening is that at some point the clarity of prophecy will be so evident that it cannot be denied.

We are on the cusp of a cashless society for instance. We have the technology, we have evil people wanting it, they simply know at this moment the political will isn't quite there yet.

Will you dear sister take some form of RFID chip, tattoo, or other device implanted in you for the purpose of buying and selling because you don't take that passage literally? I'd really like to know.

I don't know how much more specific Scripture can get than that.

So you know that I love you and Willie and everyone else that thinks differently than me on this issue. And if I started a thread with the intent of degrading your position I should expect a visceral response, shouldn't I?

this is my thought also

I've seen such vehement hatred of Jews in people calling themselves Christian, I would thought we were in the 1500's if it were not for the fact I was in a forum, on the internet, with a light on in the background

it makes perfect sense for the great deception, the great falling away and all eyes on Israel

it will happen
 
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7seasrekeyed

Guest
Replacement theology is a misnomer and is not the cause of "anti-semitism", "anti-semitism" is just another form of racism, no different that what plagued the US years with the African Americans.

This is just another red herring, we see racism/xenophobia all over the world, Muslims in Burma persecuted by Buddhists.
you are right

the devil is the cause for anti-semitism AND replacement theology is his doctrine

the sea is full of herrings and yet it is never full, even though all the rivers flow into it

nothing has changed. and one day every knee will bow and every tongue will confess that JESUS CHRIS IS LORD

even those who do not wish so to do
 

Ahwatukee

Senior Member
Mar 12, 2015
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NOWHERE does it say He will literally rule on this physical earth from the physical Jerusalem. You imagine it.
"Of the greatness of his government and peace there will be no end. He will reign on David's throne and over his kingdom, establishing and upholding it with justice and righteousness from that time on and forever. The zeal of the LORD Almighty will accomplish this." - Isaiah 9:7

"He will be great and will be called the Son of the Most High. The Lord God will give him the throne of his father David, and he will reign over Jacob’s descendants forever; his kingdom will never end.” - Luke 1:32

Therefore regarding the Lord's ruling from the throne of David, which it plainly states, you have to change the meaning of that to be ruling from heaven, which it does not imply.
 
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7seasrekeyed

Guest
7seasrekeyed....I agree with you except for one sentence. "that does not make him the owner or the ruler"

Rem. when He took Jesus to the Desert. Satan told Jesus then that he would give HIM (Jesus) all the nations of the earth. They had previously been given to him and Jesus knew that. Satan is the Prince of this world, thus the ruler of this world. While He is restrained at the moment, when the Rapture happens, all evil that exists in Satan, His mininions and Man will be at full throttle.

Those left behind are in for a ride, that is for sure.


and yet the OT tells us that the earth is the footstool of God

if we understand the Bible, we understand the world systems that are in place

consider Ephesians ... there is more in the atmosphere than ozone

the devil does not own this world. God made it, for some reason He cast the devil down onto it.

it's a personal battle that the devil will not win. he will rage well enough when he knows his time is short

I personally do not believe in a pre-trib rapture

the church is lazy, fat and has forgotten the battle...not every person, but people will show who they are when they must make a choice that goes beyond words

there is nothing worse than a false peace which many now live under

I'll add, the devil is a false god and well represented by every idol on the planet. there are many gods, one devil who is behind them all
 
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7seasrekeyed

Guest
Satan was bound in the abyss in Revelation 9.
right

he must chuckle whenever he reads such things
 
Dec 12, 2013
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I believe what the Bible says, Why don't you? While satan is the ruler (even christ called him the ruler of the world) he can only do what God allows him to do. Otherwise mankind would have been gone along time agan. You think satan wants mankind to live?

The Bible says things will get worse. As Thge love of God grows cold. It is not satan that is causing it, it is people hate toward God which causes it, Satan is limited in what he can do. Yet look at WW2. I hope you do not think CHrist was helping Hitler muyrder all those millions in cold blood, Or Stalin, or any of the other dictators who murder millions.

God created Israel. Did God fail because Israel continued to rebell against God? Of course not. God will never force anyone to do anything (in spite of what calvanism teaches). But God will finish his plan he had for israel. You can count on it.
He is called the KosmoKratos<----world ruler......and He will....

Wear out the saints of the most high
Make war against the saints of the most high
Prevail against the saints and overcome the saints of the most high

For 3.5 years or 42 months or 1260 days........
 
Apr 23, 2017
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"Of the greatness of his government and peace there will be no end. He will reign on David's throne and over his kingdom, establishing and upholding it with justice and righteousness from that time on and forever. The zeal of the LORD Almighty will accomplish this." - Isaiah 9:7

"He will be great and will be called the Son of the Most High. The Lord God will give him the throne of his father David, and he will reign over Jacob’s descendants forever; his kingdom will never end.” - Luke 1:32

Therefore regarding the Lord's ruling from the throne of David, which it plainly states, you have to change the meaning of that to be ruling from heaven, which it does not imply.
isaiah 55:3
Incline your ear, and come to me; hear, that your soul may live; and I will make with you an everlasting covenant, my steadfast, sure love for David.

acts 13:34
And as for the fact that he raised him from the dead, no more to return to corruption, he has spoken in this way, “‘I will give you the holy and sure blessings of David.’

acts 15:14-18
Simeon has related how God first visited the Gentiles, to take from them a people for his name. And with this the words of the prophets agree, just as it is written, “‘After this I will return, and I will rebuild the tent of David that has fallen; I will rebuild its ruins, and I will restore it, that the remnant of mankind may seek the Lord, and all the Gentiles who are called by my name, says the Lord, who makes these things known from of old.’

would u accuse him of "spiritualizing" amos 9:11? if it wasnt in teh NT maybe yes:

Amos 9:11
“In that day I will raise up the booth of David that is fallen and repair its breaches, and raise up its ruins and rebuild it as in the days of old,


see it says repair breaches and rebuild as the days of old u see...... in the old days it wasnt a group of people it was a real booth..... so as u see that prophecy was fulfilled not literally but spiritually.......
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
right

he must chuckle whenever he reads such things
He has to laugh at how gullible people are.. And he uses it against them, and they can not even see it.
 

Locutus

Senior Member
Feb 10, 2017
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isaiah 55:3
Incline your ear, and come to me; hear, that your soul may live; and I will make with you an everlasting covenant, my steadfast, sure love for David.

acts 13:34
And as for the fact that he raised him from the dead, no more to return to corruption, he has spoken in this way, “‘I will give you the holy and sure blessings of David.’

acts 15:14-18
Simeon has related how God first visited the Gentiles, to take from them a people for his name. And with this the words of the prophets agree, just as it is written, “‘After this I will return, and I will rebuild the tent of David that has fallen; I will rebuild its ruins, and I will restore it, that the remnant of mankind may seek the Lord, and all the Gentiles who are called by my name, says the Lord, who makes these things known from of old.’

would u accuse him of "spiritualizing" amos 9:11? if it wasnt in teh NT maybe yes:

Amos 9:11
“In that day I will raise up the booth of David that is fallen and repair its breaches, and raise up its ruins and rebuild it as in the days of old,


see it says repair breaches and rebuild as the days of old u see...... in the old days it wasnt a group of people it was a real booth..... so as u see that prophecy was fulfilled not literally but spiritually.......
Very good points here mon - especially Acts 15:14-18.

The same woody literal mis-thinking is applied to John the Baptist by the dispensationalists in regards to his role as Elijah that the physical Elijah must come.

Christ gave the spiritual meaning/application when he said:

Mat 17:11 And Jesus answered and said unto them, Elias truly shall first come, and restore all things.

Mat 17:12 But I say unto you, That Elias is come already, and they knew him not, but have done unto him whatsoever they listed. Likewise shall also the Son of man suffer of them.
 
Sep 14, 2017
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It would seem to me that an unsaved investigator could look at the many "last days" scriptures, then look at what religious groups are really being persecuted without evidence, and make an educated guess of which groups are godly based on the facts.
I wouldn't say he would get 100% accuracy, but at least in the 60% range.
Yet with all the facts, many religious people get it all wrong. Why is that? I would say that the verses on end times delusion are covering a lot more people than we realize, and that we're way closer to the end than we realize.
What else could it be?
 
Sep 14, 2017
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It would seem to me that an unsaved investigator could look at the many "last days" scriptures, then look at what religious groups are really being persecuted without evidence, and make an educated guess of which groups are godly based on the facts.
I wouldn't say he would get 100% accuracy, but at least in the 60% range.
Yet with all the facts, many religious people get it all wrong. Why is that? I would say that the verses on end times delusion are covering a lot more people than we realize, and that we're way closer to the end than we realize.
What else could it be?
Dispensationalists have really been taking it on the chin lately, haven't they?
 
Jul 23, 2017
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Those in the BDF, of course.
its only that guy with the chihuahua avatar who keeps making articles about it. he believes resurrection already happened, therefore he is disqualified as a bible teacher.

2 Tim 2:18 Who concerning the truth have erred, saying that the resurrection is past already; and overthrow the faith of some.
 
H

heartofdavid

Guest
and yet the OT tells us that the earth is the footstool of God

if we understand the Bible, we understand the world systems that are in place

consider Ephesians ... there is more in the atmosphere than ozone

the devil does not own this world. God made it, for some reason He cast the devil down onto it.

it's a personal battle that the devil will not win. he will rage well enough when he knows his time is short

I personally do not believe in a pre-trib rapture

the church is lazy, fat and has forgotten the battle...not every person, but people will show who they are when they must make a choice that goes beyond words

there is nothing worse than a false peace which many now live under

I'll add, the devil is a false god and well represented by every idol on the planet. there are many gods, one devil who is behind them all
True,but it is multifaceted.
In Ruth,the principle of the title deed is illustrated.

God is sovereign over the entire universe.Earth included. Adam gave up dominion. That is where satan became the "god" of this world.

On the cross,Man was redeemed,satan was defeated,and healing,life and personal dominion were secured.
The reason satan is still the god of this world is because of "worship,and loyalty" of man to satan.

Satan rules,enslaves,and controls this world and it's population.(except those that are redeemed).

In rev 5 ,note that it is a man that must open the scroll. A MAN. A man can only open the scroll. (THE GOD MAN JESUS).

Why? Because he is the kinsman redeemer. Boaz,in the book of Ruth.
 

Bladerunner

Senior Member
Aug 22, 2016
3,076
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and yet the OT tells us that the earth is the footstool of God

if we understand the Bible, we understand the world systems that are in place

consider Ephesians ... there is more in the atmosphere than ozone

the devil does not own this world. God made it, for some reason He cast the devil down onto it.

it's a personal battle that the devil will not win. he will rage well enough when he knows his time is short

I personally do not believe in a pre-trib rapture

the church is lazy, fat and has forgotten the battle...not every person, but people will show who they are when they must make a choice that goes beyond words

there is nothing worse than a false peace which many now live under

I'll add, the devil is a false god and well represented by every idol on the planet. there are many gods, one devil who is behind them all
Since you do not believe in the PRE-TRIB Rapture,, what do you believe. Amellinenialism.

 

Ahwatukee

Senior Member
Mar 12, 2015
11,159
2,373
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there is more in the atmosphere than ozone

the devil does not own this world.
Hello 7seasrekeyed!

After Adam and Eve disobeyed God, the world and its nations where given to Satan, as you can you can see from the following:

"The devil led him up to a high place and showed him in an instant all the kingdoms of the world. And he said to him, “I will give you all their authority and splendor; it has been given to me, and I can give it to anyone I want to. If you worship me, it will all be yours.”

Jesus bought back everything that was lost as a result of mankind's fall, the earth and everything in it. The war in Rev.12 where Satan and his angels are being cast out of heaven and his imprisonment in the Abyss, is part of the on-going process of the earth's ownership reverting from Satan back to God and mankind.