Who killed Jesus?

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Locutus

Senior Member
Feb 10, 2017
5,928
685
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#1
Mat 20:18 Behold, we go up to Jerusalem; and the Son of man shall be betrayed unto the chief priests and unto the scribes, and they shall condemn him to death,

Mat 20:19 And shall deliver him to the Gentiles to mock, and to scourge, and to crucify him: and the third day he shall rise again.

In another thread the above was quoted to claim that it was not the Jews who killed Jesus.

Yet Peter and Paul both assigned blame to the Jews:

Acts 3:13 “The God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob, the God of our fathers, has glorified His servant Jesus, the one whom you delivered and disowned in the presence of Pilate, when he had decided to release Him.

Acts 3:14 “But you disowned the Holy and Righteous One and asked for a murderer to be granted to you,

Acts 3:15 but put to death the Prince of life, the one whom God raised from the dead, a fact to which we are witnesses.



(1 Th 2:14 -15 For you, brethren, became imitators of the churches of God in Christ Jesus that are in Judea, for you also endured the same sufferings at the hands of your own countrymen, even as they did from the Jews, who both killed the Lord Jesus and the prophets, and drove us out. They are not pleasing to God, but hostile to all men,
 

Hizikyah

Senior Member
Aug 25, 2013
11,634
372
0
#2
the pharisee types and the roman judicial system, the pharisee types accused and the Romans actually carried it out.
 

Hizikyah

Senior Member
Aug 25, 2013
11,634
372
0
#3
Mark 10:33, "And said: Behold, we go up to Yerusalem, and the Son of Man will be handed over to the chief priests and the scribes; then they will condemn Him to death, and will hand Him over to the Gentiles, And they will mock Him, and will scourge Him, and will spit upon Him, and will kill Him; but the third day He will be raised up."

Luke 18:32, "For He will be handed over to the Gentiles, and will be mocked, insulted, and spat upon. Then they will scourge Him, and put Him to death: but on the third day He will be raised up."
 

FlSnookman7

Senior Member
Jun 27, 2015
1,125
135
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#4
Isaiah 53:10-11 10 [FONT=&quot]Yet it pleased the [/FONT][FONT=&quot]Lord[/FONT][FONT=&quot] to bruise him; he hath put him to grief: when thou shalt make his soul an offering for sin, he shall see his seed, he shall prolong his days, and the pleasure of the [/FONT][FONT=&quot]Lord[/FONT][FONT=&quot] shall prosper in his hand.[/FONT][FONT=&quot]11 He shall see of the travail of his soul, and shall be satisfied: by his knowledge shall my righteous servant justify many; for he shall bear their iniquities.[/FONT]
 

trofimus

Senior Member
Aug 17, 2015
10,684
794
113
#5
Jews would kill Jesus even without Romans (and tried it several times).

Romans would not kill Jesus without Jews pushing them, probably.

So even though both groups were involved, the authors of the New Testament are blaming primarily Jews. Their hate was the force behind it.
 
E

Ellsworth1943

Guest
#6
No one killed Jesus. He freely gave His life for our sins. No one could have kept Him off that cross that day because it was His appointed time.
 

phil36

Senior Member
Feb 12, 2009
8,260
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#7
It was both God and humans.

God decreed that it would happen, and humans freely did.

All under Gods control. Thats a God we can trust!
 

Locutus

Senior Member
Feb 10, 2017
5,928
685
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#8
So if a court orders the death penalty for a person is the guy that pulls the switch on the electric chair the party responsible or the judge/court?
 
J

jaybird88

Guest
#9
rome killed Jesus. the Jews loved Jesus. the pharisees who plotted his death had to do it in secret because Jesus had such a huge following which were Jewish.
 

Locutus

Senior Member
Feb 10, 2017
5,928
685
113
#10
It was both God and humans.

God decreed that it would happen, and humans freely did.

All under Gods control. Thats a God we can trust!
How can God be accused of killing his Son - that would mean God is taking the guilt upon himself - something wrong with this picture and would need to punished along side with those who killed him for shedding innocent blood.


Rev 19:2 For true and righteous are his judgments: for he hath judged the great whore.......... and hath avenged the blood of his servants at her hand.

So how does God avenge Himself.
 

tourist

Senior Member
Mar 13, 2014
41,243
16,252
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Tennessee
#11
So if a court orders the death penalty for a person is the guy that pulls the switch on the electric chair the party responsible or the judge/court?
The sovereign state is the authority that allows the court to issue a sentence of death. At that point it is up to the judicial system to carry out the sentence. The guy flipping the switch on Ol' Sparky is merely a tool that it utilized to facilitate electrocution.
 

notuptome

Senior Member
May 17, 2013
15,050
2,538
113
#12
The Levitical priesthood was responsible for killing the lamb for the sins of the people. The head of the household was responsible for killing the Passover lamb.

The cross upon which Jesus was crucified was made by Roman hands but it was the Jewish priesthood that really shed Christ's blood.

For the cause of Christ
Roger
 

Locutus

Senior Member
Feb 10, 2017
5,928
685
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#13
The sovereign state is the authority that allows the court to issue a sentence of death. At that point it is up to the judicial system to carry out the sentence. The guy flipping the switch on Ol' Sparky is merely a tool that it utilized to facilitate electrocution.
The Roman's were the tool in Jesus' case.
 

Hizikyah

Senior Member
Aug 25, 2013
11,634
372
0
#14
rome killed Jesus. the Jews loved Jesus. the pharisees who plotted his death had to do it in secret because Jesus had such a huge following which were Jewish.
You ever think about Roman imperialisim and how they had to control provinces? Think the Romans put pressure on the local pharisee types that they allowed to "be in charged" of that province to qwell the following that this Yahshua of Netzaert was causing? Then in turn, would not the corrupt pharisee types not have even more hatred and desire to kill Him?
 

phil36

Senior Member
Feb 12, 2009
8,260
2,111
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#15
How can God be accused of killing his Son - that would mean God is taking the guilt upon himself - something wrong with this picture and would need to punished along side with those who killed him for shedding innocent blood.


Rev 19:2 For true and righteous are his judgments: for he hath judged the great whore.......... and hath avenged the blood of his servants at her hand.

So how does God avenge Himself.

Did God decree it would happen.. Did Jesus predict it before it happened (He is God), and also did he not say that they could not do it if God did not allow it.

God is Just in demanding death for sin, and he shows His justice and His mercy and His Love on the cross. He sent His Son to die the death that we should have had. (God sent His Son to die).

Unless you think it was an accident and Jesus did not come (remember Jesus is God) to die for the sinner??

So Yes God decreed it, and man 'Freely' plotted and killed Jesus.
 

Hizikyah

Senior Member
Aug 25, 2013
11,634
372
0
#16
Isaiah 53:10-11 10 Yet it pleased the Lord to bruise him; he hath put him to grief: when thou shalt make his soul an offering for sin, he shall see his seed, he shall prolong his days, and the pleasure of the Lord shall prosper in his hand.11 He shall see of the travail of his soul, and shall be satisfied: by his knowledge shall my righteous servant justify many; for he shall bear their iniquities.
No one killed Jesus. He freely gave His life for our sins. No one could have kept Him off that cross that day because it was His appointed time.
He definilty offered up Himself, however the act still had to be carried out by an outside party that wanted to and was willing to ACTUALLY and literally kill Him.
 

phil36

Senior Member
Feb 12, 2009
8,260
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#17
Locutus,

This may help you:


New International Version
This man was handed over to you by God's deliberate plan and foreknowledge; and you, with the help of wicked men, put him to death by nailing him to the cross. Acts 2:23
 

Locutus

Senior Member
Feb 10, 2017
5,928
685
113
#18
Locutus,
This may help you:

New International Version
This man was handed over to you by God's deliberate plan and foreknowledge; and you, with the help of wicked men, put him to death by nailing him to the cross. Acts 2:23
I've already considered that - but that does not mean that God killed him.
 

Prov910

Senior Member
Jan 10, 2017
880
47
0
#19
Jews would kill Jesus even without Romans (and tried it several times).

Romans would not kill Jesus without Jews pushing them, probably.

So even though both groups were involved, the authors of the New Testament are blaming primarily Jews. Their hate was the force behind it.
^^This. To be more specific, it was the Chief Priests, Scribes and Elders--and not just the Jews. At this point, most of Jesus' followers were Jewish. The anticipated loss of authority of the Chief Priests, etc. is one reason that probably led them to have the Romans crucify Jesus.

============================

I wonder if Satan entered into the Chief Priests or Jewish leaders like he entered Judas? Luke 22:3 The bible doesn't say anything about it (as far as I know), but it would sure make sense. :shrug:
 
J

jaybird88

Guest
#20
You ever think about Roman imperialisim and how they had to control provinces? Think the Romans put pressure on the local pharisee types that they allowed to "be in charged" of that province to qwell the following that this Yahshua of Netzaert was causing? Then in turn, would not the corrupt pharisee types not have even more hatred and desire to kill Him?
exactly HZ!
the Jewish people had no choice who their priest leadership was, they were appointed by the roman administration. this is why you had zealots and pharisees, these two groups had the same spiritual beliefs, the only difference was the zealots were not pro roman. how many times do we hear of zealots as part of the leadership, never! unless your in bed with the romans you have no chance. king herod is a good example, he stood in front of the crowds and claimed to be Jewish but on the inside he was all roman. he plotted many murders of good Jewish leaders that were loved by the Jewish people.