The two witnesses

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Aug 8, 2017
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#1
Could it be possible that the two witnesses could be 1 man? You know how a lot of times in the bible people have two names like say Paul for instance (this is just an example) could the 2 witnesses refer to Saul and Paul?
Saul when he was bad and Paul when he was good? One mans testimony as saul and again as paul?
 
Apr 15, 2017
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#2
Could it be possible that the two witnesses could be 1 man? You know how a lot of times in the bible people have two names like say Paul for instance (this is just an example) could the 2 witnesses refer to Saul and Paul?
Saul when he was bad and Paul when he was good? One mans testimony as saul and again as paul?
Rev 11:3 And I will give power unto my two witnesses, and they shall prophesy a thousand two hundred and threescore days, clothed in sackcloth.
Rev 11:4 These are the two olive trees, and the two candlesticks standing before the God of the earth.
Rev 11:5 And if any man will hurt them, fire proceedeth out of their mouth, and devoureth their enemies: and if any man will hurt them, he must in this manner be killed.

Zec 4:11 Then answered I, and said unto him, What are these two olive trees upon the right side of the candlestick and upon the left side thereof?
Zec 4:12 And I answered again, and said unto him, What be these two olive branches which through the two golden pipes empty the golden oil out of themselves?
Zec 4:13 And he answered me and said, Knowest thou not what these be? And I said, No, my lord.
Zec 4:14 Then said he, These are the two anointed ones, that stand by the Lord of the whole earth.

Mat 17:1 And after six days Jesus taketh Peter, James, and John his brother, and bringeth them up into an high mountain apart,
Mat 17:2 And was transfigured before them: and his face did shine as the sun, and his raiment was white as the light.
Mat 17:3 And, behold, there appeared unto them Moses and Elias talking with him.

The Bible refers to the two witnesses as two people,which I believe will be Moses,representing the law,and Elijah,representing the prophets.
 

OneFaith

Senior Member
Sep 5, 2016
2,270
369
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#3
Rev 11:3 And I will give power unto my two witnesses, and they shall prophesy a thousand two hundred and threescore days, clothed in sackcloth.
Rev 11:4 These are the two olive trees, and the two candlesticks standing before the God of the earth.
Rev 11:5 And if any man will hurt them, fire proceedeth out of their mouth, and devoureth their enemies: and if any man will hurt them, he must in this manner be killed.

Zec 4:11 Then answered I, and said unto him, What are these two olive trees upon the right side of the candlestick and upon the left side thereof?
Zec 4:12 And I answered again, and said unto him, What be these two olive branches which through the two golden pipes empty the golden oil out of themselves?
Zec 4:13 And he answered me and said, Knowest thou not what these be? And I said, No, my lord.
Zec 4:14 Then said he, These are the two anointed ones, that stand by the Lord of the whole earth.

Mat 17:1 And after six days Jesus taketh Peter, James, and John his brother, and bringeth them up into an high mountain apart,
Mat 17:2 And was transfigured before them: and his face did shine as the sun, and his raiment was white as the light.
Mat 17:3 And, behold, there appeared unto them Moses and Elias talking with him.

The Bible refers to the two witnesses as two people,which I believe will be Moses,representing the law,and Elijah,representing the prophets.
Yes, I was going to say that the two witnesses are Moses and Elijah, who represent the law and the prophets, but I seen that you already did. You were spot-on.
 
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Zmouth

Senior Member
Nov 21, 2012
3,391
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#4
Could be like the pulse and wave, which provide us with sight and sound.

The hearing ear, and the seeing eye, the LORD hath made even both of them. Proverbs 20:12
 

Jackson123

Senior Member
Feb 6, 2014
11,769
1,370
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#5
Rev 11:3 And I will give power unto my two witnesses, and they shall prophesy a thousand two hundred and threescore days, clothed in sackcloth.
Rev 11:4 These are the two olive trees, and the two candlesticks standing before the God of the earth.
Rev 11:5 And if any man will hurt them, fire proceedeth out of their mouth, and devoureth their enemies: and if any man will hurt them, he must in this manner be killed.

Zec 4:11 Then answered I, and said unto him, What are these two olive trees upon the right side of the candlestick and upon the left side thereof?
Zec 4:12 And I answered again, and said unto him, What be these two olive branches which through the two golden pipes empty the golden oil out of themselves?
Zec 4:13 And he answered me and said, Knowest thou not what these be? And I said, No, my lord.
Zec 4:14 Then said he, These are the two anointed ones, that stand by the Lord of the whole earth.

Mat 17:1 And after six days Jesus taketh Peter, James, and John his brother, and bringeth them up into an high mountain apart,
Mat 17:2 And was transfigured before them: and his face did shine as the sun, and his raiment was white as the light.
Mat 17:3 And, behold, there appeared unto them Moses and Elias talking with him.

The Bible refers to the two witnesses as two people,which I believe will be Moses,representing the law,and Elijah,representing the prophets.
I heard they work in the first 3 1/2 years tribulation, before Antichrist reveal. Because antichrist will not survive against two witnesses
 

Adstar

Senior Member
Jul 24, 2016
7,417
3,468
113
#6
Could it be possible that the two witnesses could be 1 man? You know how a lot of times in the bible people have two names like say Paul for instance (this is just an example) could the 2 witnesses refer to Saul and Paul?
Saul when he was bad and Paul when he was good? One mans testimony as saul and again as paul?
No i do not think so.. The book of Revelation seems to be clear that it is two men..

Revelation 11: KJV
6 "These have power to shut heaven, that it rain not in the days of their prophecy: and have power over waters to turn them to blood, and to smite the earth with all plagues, as often as they will. {7} And when they shall have finished their testimony, the beast that ascendeth out of the bottomless pit shall make war against them, and shall overcome them, and kill them. {8} And their dead bodies shall lie in the street of the great city, which spiritually is called Sodom and Egypt, where also our Lord was crucified."
 
Aug 8, 2017
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#7
Ok so its not one man, does it have to even be a man?
What about the testament's, could the two witnesses be the 1st & 2nd testement?
 
Jun 1, 2016
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#8
Rev 11:3 And I will give power unto my two witnesses, and they shall prophesy a thousand two hundred and threescore days, clothed in sackcloth.
Rev 11:4 These are the two olive trees, and the two candlesticks standing before the God of the earth.
Rev 11:5 And if any man will hurt them, fire proceedeth out of their mouth, and devoureth their enemies: and if any man will hurt them, he must in this manner be killed.

Zec 4:11 Then answered I, and said unto him, What are these two olive trees upon the right side of the candlestick and upon the left side thereof?
Zec 4:12 And I answered again, and said unto him, What be these two olive branches which through the two golden pipes empty the golden oil out of themselves?
Zec 4:13 And he answered me and said, Knowest thou not what these be? And I said, No, my lord.
Zec 4:14 Then said he, These are the two anointed ones, that stand by the Lord of the whole earth.

Mat 17:1 And after six days Jesus taketh Peter, James, and John his brother, and bringeth them up into an high mountain apart,
Mat 17:2 And was transfigured before them: and his face did shine as the sun, and his raiment was white as the light.
Mat 17:3 And, behold, there appeared unto them Moses and Elias talking with him.

The Bible refers to the two witnesses as two people,which I believe will be Moses,representing the law,and Elijah,representing the prophets.

acts 28:23 "And when they had appointed him a day, there came many to him into his lodging; to whom he expounded and testified the kingdom of God, persuading them concerning Jesus, both out of the law of Moses, and out of the prophets, from morning till evening. "

acts 3:But those things, which God before had shewed by the mouth of all his prophets, that Christ should suffer, he hath so fulfilled. 19Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, when the times of refreshing shall come from the presence of the Lord; 20And he shall send Jesus Christ, which before was preached unto you: 21Whom the heaven must receive until the times of restitution of all things, which God hath spoken by the mouth of all his holy prophets since the world began.

22For Moses truly said unto the fathers, A prophet shall the Lord your God raise up unto you of your brethren, like unto me; him shall ye hear in all things whatsoever he shall say unto you. 23And it shall come to pass, that every soul, which will not hear that prophet, shall be destroyed from among the people.

24Yea, and all the prophets from Samuel and those that follow after, as many as have spoken, have likewise foretold of these days."


I agree both the Law and Prophets are Gods Word and both foretell and witness of Jesus before He ever even was born. they also build faith for a believer as we learn the law and prophets and see Jesus being testified to by them Both.
 

Ahwatukee

Senior Member
Mar 12, 2015
11,162
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#9
I heard they work in the first 3 1/2 years tribulation, before Antichrist reveal. Because antichrist will not survive against two witnesses
Hello Jackson123, I am in agreement with you regarding the two witnesses' time of prophecy taking place during the first 3 1/2 years. And the reason for that is because, in the middle of the seven years the abomination is set up, which is when the woman of Rev.12 which Represents Israel, flees out into the desert where she is cared for by God 1260 days, which is during that last 3 1/2 years. That said, if the two witnesses were to prophesying in the streets of Jerusalem during the last 3 1/2 years, the people of Israel would not be in Jerusalem to here them because the will have fled because of the abomination. - Rev.12:6, 14

Another reason is that, the two witnesses prophesy for 1260 days i.e. 3 1/2 years. Therefore since the seven year period is divided up into two 3 1/2 year periods, then the two witnesses must either begin their time of prophecy at the beginning of the seven years to the middle or from the middle to the end when Jesus returns to the earth. In considering their time of prophesy as being during the last 3 1/2 years, Since the beast comes up out of the Abyss at the sounding of the 5th trumpet, which takes place just prior to the middle of the seven years, it would mean that the beast would have to wait a little over 3 1/2 years before he could kill them. But, if you have their time of prophesy as taking place from the beginning of the seven years to the middle, then it would be a much better fit, because the beast would be coming up out of the Abyss just prior to the two witnesses finishing their time of prophecy and just before the abomination is set up. - Rev.9:1-11, 11:3-12
 
Apr 15, 2017
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#10
The Jews that flee the abomination of desolation will be the saints,not the people that do not believe in Jesus,for they will not flee,but the 2 witnesses will be there during the last three and one half years to witness to them,and at the end of that time they will be resurrected up.

The majority of Jews will not flee,but the 2 witnesses will turn them to the truth.

Israel is blinded in part,until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in,and so all Israel shall be saved.

The world has salvation for the first three and one half years,and after the 6th trumpet and they do not turn to God,He gives them the man of sin to rule over them.

When the world follows the beast,and takes the mark,then salvation is no longer available to them,and the fulness of the Gentiles will be come in,and then God will send Israel 2 witnesses to turn them to the truth,for Israel is blinded in part,until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in,so Israel is still blinded in part during the first three and one half years,so the witnesses do not witness during that time.

If the witnesses are sent to Israel during the first three and one half years,and they turn to the truth,then the beast will physically attack Israel in the middle of the 7 years period,for he persecutes all who hold the testimony of Jesus,but Israel is protected for the whole 7 years period from physical attack,so at the end of the last three and one half years Israel turned to the truth,and then the beast attacks them for their testimony of Jesus.

The majority of Jews will not run because they do not believe in Jesus,but only those that believe in Jesus will run for they know he is not God,and their Messiah.

The 2 witnesses are sent to Israel during the last three and one half years of the tribulation,for Israel is blinded in part,until the Gentiles that do not love God take the mark of the beast,and then salvation is no longer available to them,which is the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.

Rev 11:15 And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever.
Rev 11:16 And the four and twenty elders, which sat before God on their seats, fell upon their faces, and worshipped God,
Rev 11:17 Saying, We give thee thanks, O Lord God Almighty, which art, and wast, and art to come; because thou hast taken to thee thy great power, and hast reigned.
Rev 11:18 And the nations were angry, and thy wrath is come, and the time of the dead, that they should be judged, and that thou shouldest give reward unto thy servants the prophets, and to the saints, and them that fear thy name, small and great; and shouldest destroy them which destroy the earth.
Rev 11:19 And the temple of God was opened in heaven, and there was seen in his temple the ark of his testament: and there were lightnings, and voices, and thunderings, and an earthquake, and great hail.

When the 2 witnesses are resurrected up,and Israel is in the truth,then the 7th angel sounds,the 7th trumpet,and the wrath of God is poured upon the world,and the kingdoms of the world become the kingdoms of the Lord,and His Christ,which would not happen at the middle of the 7 years period.
 

Ahwatukee

Senior Member
Mar 12, 2015
11,162
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#11
The Jews that flee the abomination of desolation will be the saints,not the people that do not believe in Jesus,for they will not flee,but the 2 witnesses will be there during the last three and one half years to witness to them,and at the end of that time they will be resurrected up.


If Jews were saints, they would have been caught up with the rest of the church prior to the seven year period. Remember, this last seven years is the fulfillment of the decree that was given to Israel and Jerusalem as found in Dan.9:24, so those who flee are true Israel. The other people that will be on the earth during that time will be the great tribulation saints who are said to be from every tribe, nation, people and tongues, which would make them Gentiles.

When the world follows the beast,and takes the mark,then salvation is no longer available to them


The above is not correct and that for the following reasons:

"
The rest of mankind who were not killed by these plagues still did not repent of the work of their hands; they did not stop worshiping demons, and idols of gold, silver, bronze, stone and wood—idols that cannot see or hear or walk. Nor did they repent of their murders, their magic arts, their sexual immorality or their thefts."

That it says that those above "did not repent" infers that they have the opportunity to do so. In fact, salvation is available all the way to the 7th bowl judgment, which completes God's wrath as revealed below:

"
The fourth angel poured out his bowl on the sun, and the sun was allowed to scorch people with fire.They were seared by the intense heat and they cursed the name of God, who had control over these plagues, but they refused to repent and glorify him."

"The fifth angel poured out his bowl on the throne of the beast, and its kingdom was plunged into darkness. People gnawed their tongues in agony and cursed the God of heaven because of their pains and their sores,
but they refused to repent of what they had done.

Again, the words "but they refused to repent" infers that they have the opportunity to repent, otherwise why would anyone repent if they had no hope of forgiveness?

Only those who worship the beast, his image and receive his mark are not longer eligible for salvation.
 
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Jackson123

Senior Member
Feb 6, 2014
11,769
1,370
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#12
The Jews that flee the abomination of desolation will be the saints,not the people that do not believe in Jesus,for they will not flee,but the 2 witnesses will be there during the last three and one half years to witness to them,and at the end of that time they will be resurrected up.

The majority of Jews will not flee,but the 2 witnesses will turn them to the truth.

Israel is blinded in part,until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in,and so all Israel shall be saved.

The world has salvation for the first three and one half years,and after the 6th trumpet and they do not turn to God,He gives them the man of sin to rule over them.

When the world follows the beast,and takes the mark,then salvation is no longer available to them,and the fulness of the Gentiles will be come in,and then God will send Israel 2 witnesses to turn them to the truth,for Israel is blinded in part,until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in,so Israel is still blinded in part during the first three and one half years,so the witnesses do not witness during that time.

If the witnesses are sent to Israel during the first three and one half years,and they turn to the truth,then the beast will physically attack Israel in the middle of the 7 years period,for he persecutes all who hold the testimony of Jesus,but Israel is protected for the whole 7 years period from physical attack,so at the end of the last three and one half years Israel turned to the truth,and then the beast attacks them for their testimony of Jesus.

The majority of Jews will not run because they do not believe in Jesus,but only those that believe in Jesus will run for they know he is not God,and their Messiah.

The 2 witnesses are sent to Israel during the last three and one half years of the tribulation,for Israel is blinded in part,until the Gentiles that do not love God take the mark of the beast,and then salvation is no longer available to them,which is the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.

Rev 11:15 And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever.
Rev 11:16 And the four and twenty elders, which sat before God on their seats, fell upon their faces, and worshipped God,
Rev 11:17 Saying, We give thee thanks, O Lord God Almighty, which art, and wast, and art to come; because thou hast taken to thee thy great power, and hast reigned.
Rev 11:18 And the nations were angry, and thy wrath is come, and the time of the dead, that they should be judged, and that thou shouldest give reward unto thy servants the prophets, and to the saints, and them that fear thy name, small and great; and shouldest destroy them which destroy the earth.
Rev 11:19 And the temple of God was opened in heaven, and there was seen in his temple the ark of his testament: and there were lightnings, and voices, and thunderings, and an earthquake, and great hail.

When the 2 witnesses are resurrected up,and Israel is in the truth,then the 7th angel sounds,the 7th trumpet,and the wrath of God is poured upon the world,and the kingdoms of the world become the kingdoms of the Lord,and His Christ,which would not happen at the middle of the 7 years period.
if I understand correctly, you believe: only Christian Jews flee to the mountain, than two witnesses come
in the last 3 1/2 years, so does the antichrist

Than the remnant that already take the mark may repent, as a result of the work of 2 witnesses.

so you believe people may repent after taken tha mark of the beast, am I correct?
 

jb

Senior Member
Feb 27, 2010
4,940
586
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#13
No i do not think so.. The book of Revelation seems to be clear that it is two men..

Revelation 11: KJV
6 "These have power to shut heaven, that it rain not in the days of their prophecy: and have power over waters to turn them to blood, and to smite the earth with all plagues, as often as they will. {7} And when they shall have finished their testimony, the beast that ascendeth out of the bottomless pit shall make war against them, and shall overcome them, and kill them. {8} And their dead bodies shall lie in the street of the great city, which spiritually is called Sodom and Egypt, where also our Lord was crucified."
Jerusalem!
 

kaijo

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2017
355
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#14
At this stage i think it will be Elijah and Enoch.

Those are the only two men that have not experienced Death.


Hebrews 9:27
27 And as it is appointed for men to die once...

And its probably why they will be so bold. Coz they know EXACTLY whats "up there". They will have no fear in them.
 
Mar 28, 2016
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#15
Ok so its not one man, does it have to even be a man?
What about the testament's, could the two witnesses be the 1st & 2nd testement?
It will not be men but the principle some call sola scriptural. The two witnesses are typified by Moses and Elijah, who represent the law and the prophets. Moses represents God's perfect law as to the letter that kill ,and Elijah to represent the spirit of the law, the spirit of faith not seen as that makes whole or perfect as new creatures.

Together they represent the one faith of God, as the work of God that alone comes from hearing God .

It would make me wonder that when he does come on the last day will he find the two witnesses working to both will and do His good pleasure. Or will like it be as in the time of Noah
the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every imagination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually?


Luk 18:8 I tell you that he will avenge them speedily. Nevertheless when the Son of man cometh, shall he find faith on the earth?




 
Mar 28, 2016
15,954
1,528
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#16
At this stage i think it will be Elijah and Enoch.

Those are the only two men that have not experienced Death.


Hebrews 9:27
27 And as it is appointed for men to die once...

And its probably why they will be so bold. Coz they know EXACTLY whats "up there". They will have no fear in them.
Corrupted flesh and blood cannot enter the kingdom of God .They are literally dead the memories of this world are forgotten and will never to come to mind . All saints die not receiving the promise of their new incorruptible bodies. All saints who are saved by the work of Christ's faith according to His three day labor of love will receive the new in the twinkling of the eye.

Heb 11:39 And these all, having obtained a good report through faith, received not the promise:
Heb 11:40 God having provided some better thing for us, that they without us should not be made perfect.
 

kaijo

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2017
355
54
28
#17
Corrupted flesh and blood cannot enter the kingdom of God .They are literally dead the memories of this world are forgotten and will never to come to mind . All saints die not receiving the promise of their new incorruptible bodies. All saints who are saved by the work of Christ's faith according to His three day labor of love will receive the new in the twinkling of the eye.

Heb 11:39 And these all, having obtained a good report through faith, received not the promise:
Heb 11:40 God having provided some better thing for us, that they without us should not be made perfect.

What are you on about Garee?

Are you saying those 2 Died?
 

Ahwatukee

Senior Member
Mar 12, 2015
11,162
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#18
What are you on about Garee?

Are you saying those 2 Died?
Hello Kaijo,

The two witnesses couldn't have previously died and that because they are killed by the beast after they finish their 3 1/2 years of prophecy. In order for garee's claim to be true, it would mean that the two witnesses would have to die twice.
 
Dec 12, 2013
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#19
At this stage i think it will be Elijah and Enoch.

Those are the only two men that have not experienced Death.


Hebrews 9:27
27 And as it is appointed for men to die once...

And its probably why they will be so bold. Coz they know EXACTLY whats "up there". They will have no fear in them.
I agree with this......it is appointed unto men to die once.....that leaves MOSES OUT........God does not lie and if Moses were one...he would experience death TWICE......he is alleviated by the very word of GOD
 

Jackson123

Senior Member
Feb 6, 2014
11,769
1,370
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#20
It will not be men but the principle some call sola scriptural. The two witnesses are typified by Moses and Elijah, who represent the law and the prophets. Moses represents God's perfect law as to the letter that kill ,and Elijah to represent the spirit of the law, the spirit of faith not seen as that makes whole or perfect as new creatures.

Together they represent the one faith of God, as the work of God that alone comes from hearing God .

It would make me wonder that when he does come on the last day will he find the two witnesses working to both will and do His good pleasure. Or will like it be as in the time of Noah
the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every imagination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually?


Luk 18:8 I tell you that he will avenge them speedily. Nevertheless when the Son of man cometh, shall he find faith on the earth?




so you believe the law and spirit of law will come for 3 1/2 years and kill and their dead body will rise after 3 1/2 days?