pHart could you talk with me?

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Stunnedbygrace

Senior Member
Nov 12, 2015
9,112
822
113
#1
pHart, I read a post of yours somewhere and can't find it again now.

You said something like...the struggle to believe God will make a way of provision for you without you having to do something illegal or...I don't know, you said something like that.

I talk to brothers and sisters all the time about this, which is, from my observations of others and myself, a huge and first hurdle that we stumble on and don't ever get running swiftly because of. You could call the hurdle "The deceitfulness of riches" or..."The exodus wandering relived."

I know this isn't so much for those with financial security or a good job and a 401k. It's more for us who have never really had that but have lived more hand to mouth - either all of our lives or more recently, through circumstances where we lost a job with "bennies" or became fairly destitute from some other cause.

I know He can make a pair of shoes last 40 years and can sew up holes in pockets. And I read exodus and see all the failures of trust for temporal provision. I see our same failure to trust, despite knowing that Jesus said we are not to worry about these things as unbelievers do.

I see our "jars of worms" where we gather enough for the day AND for 30 years of retirement. And I see all of the worry about if we've saved enough to not starve in old age. And the worry when 401k's take a hit. Etc., etc. There is some inner lying of saying we trust when really we show ourselves to be leaning on a stockpile for our security.

I talk with others a lot about trust for provision no matter what it looks like currently. And mostly, I am strong in this myself. But I feel I am in danger of disqualification because after I teach trust to others, I have got into a funk over it early this morning.

Because I really would like some financial security, even though I KNOW He has done the very best thing for me and my growth of trust in Him and His promises.

So I KNOW all of these things and I STILL got into a funk and a struggle this morning.

There is some sort of...line, a dividing line? and I'm standing right on it instead of on one side or the other. Because I waver back and forth. I've gotten pretty good at recognizing when I'm kicking sand around with my foot and trying to cover up that line to go with the worlds wisdom instead of trust. And at the same time I'm desiring a stockpile and a small place of my own, I'm also deeply grateful that He hasn't given these things to me in order to grow my trust.

I guess what really hit me hard this morning is...a deep and profound...weariness over this struggle that never quite ceases. I think I have it licked and then it comes back and I just want to be done with it and be completely firm.

So, since you mentioned this somewhere in a post fairly recently, I just thought you might have some words or...wisdom...or encouragement for me. You're the only one I've ever heard address it (other than me) and so I know you understand this very real struggle. So even just what has helped to make you firmer would maybe help me. I'm weary of it. I feel I should be past this hurdle. He's given me the circumstances to bring me to the struggle in His mercy, and I don't want to muddle around in it any longer. I want to be firm and unshaken in it. I don't want this intermittent temptation to go back to the worlds wisdom and then worry about retirement. I guess I'm wondering how to get rid of the constant temptation...? Even to move on to a different temptation instead of the same one over and over would be a relief.
 
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
20,395
113
#2
David said....."In all his life he had not seen the righteous begging for bread."

Jesus said and promised "Food, clothing and shelter" <--Your Father in Heaven knows you need these things.

Faith is a gift and has been dealt in measure.......
 

Stunnedbygrace

Senior Member
Nov 12, 2015
9,112
822
113
#3
David said....."In all his life he had not seen the righteous begging for bread."

Jesus said and promised "Food, clothing and shelter" <--Your Father in Heaven knows you need these things.

Faith is a gift and has been dealt in measure.......
Thank you DC. Yes, I know these things. I know these promises. And yet the constant temptation to worry still assails me at times. Shouldn't I be past that 11 years later? It gets wearying to have the same battle over and over.

Maybe...my problem is lust...that desire to have more than enough for the day...?
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
#4
Thank you DC. Yes, I know these things. I know these promises. And yet the constant temptation to worry still assails me at times. Shouldn't I be past that 11 years later? It gets wearying to have the same battle over and over.

Maybe...my problem is lust...that desire to have more than enough for the day...?

Do you have someone close to you in your church you can disciple with, and explain these feelings to. and give you some help?

Satan wants you to think you are not worthy and if you have these issues you can;t be saved, If he gets you to believe this, he has you in his hands and has taken you out, or limited you in doing Gods will.

Grace is your greatest power. Don't let anyone tell you otherwise.
 

Stunnedbygrace

Senior Member
Nov 12, 2015
9,112
822
113
#5
Gm eg.:)

I don't have worry that if I have these issues I can't be saved.

I have great weariness over the same exact temptation and battle over and over again.

No I don't have anyone else to talk with. You guys ARE my brothers and sisters. Who else could help me better than those who have the same struggle...?
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
#6
Gm eg.:)

I don't have worry that if I have these issues I can't be saved.

I have great weariness over the same exact temptation and battle over and over again.

No I don't have anyone else to talk with. You guys ARE my brothers and sisters. Who else could help me better than those who have the same struggle...?

I would say most people have same issue, Maybe different sin, but same issue of strugglers with a besetting sin.

No one can help you better than a person who is with you all the time, that sees you face to face. That really knows you.. I do not think you can get that same type of stuff online. We see you type. And can kind of see you. But not even close to a church friend who is out in the trenches with you.
 

Stunnedbygrace

Senior Member
Nov 12, 2015
9,112
822
113
#7
I think YOU guys are sufficiently in the trenches with me...maybe we will get some help here. I'll check back.

Have a good day. :)
 

Marcelo

Senior Member
Feb 4, 2016
2,359
859
113
72
#8
Gm eg.:) .........No I don't have anyone else to talk with. You guys ARE my brothers and sisters. Who else could help me better than those who have the same struggle...?
I appreciate you calling us your brothers and sisters. CC is called a "virtual" community, but its members are real and many among us are sincere Christians who can pray for you. Now as a retiree, and on a tight budget, I'm beginning to learn to really trust God and I see it's spiritually healthy. I'll be praying for you!
 

Blain

The Word Weaver
Aug 28, 2012
19,177
2,539
113
#9
I hear you. It's not easy to trust God will provide when you are struggling just to make it through the week, it's easy to teach and speak about trusting god for provisions when you are already provided but when you are struggling to just have food that is another story.
I live in house where there are times when all we have to eat is canned vegetables and maybe some bread, sometimes I have to actually go to my neighbor who is a friend of the family for food and once we were going to lose the house and and if my friends on cc had not shared some of their money we would not have had food and would have also lost the house. I cannot stand accepting money from others because I love to give but I am not so good at receiving.

It's a terrible internal struggle to have faith and believe that he will provide but I have found he that for me at least even though it takes a lot and sometimes an almost complete loss of everything including food and a home he came through. The trick is to look to him in these situations, the worry and fear and doubt is so easy to focus on and it will bring you down heavily so I submerged myself in his word and I spent as much time with him as humanly possible listening to Christian music talking on cc constantly and I found that since I was so focused on him I was blind to my worry and fear and doubt.

So believe me I know what it is like but I also like to look at as a learning experience,maybe God allowed such a situation so that we may learn to lean and trust in him all the more, but never go through these storms alone even if it is just your cc family we need support and encouragement to wage through these storms
 

stonesoffire

Poetic Member
Nov 24, 2013
10,665
1,829
113
#10
There is nothing wrong with having more than enough. Isn't that one of His characteristics? The God of more than enough. I've had this struggle when single. Even though I had a good paying job, I had kids going to school needing money and then car payments on top of that. One day all I had was a potatoe to eat at lunch.

Its coming into rest is what you need. Learning that one day is sufficient for the evil we face. It's a hurdle most of us have to face at some time.

But, He will bring you out whether your faith is perfect enough, just because you are His.

Remember? When we are faithless, He remains faithful, for He will not deny Himself. He won't go back on His Word.

This is the whole point of the not by works thread. It's by His work, we rest in.

His desire is to give you all your hearts desire. Just love on Him stunned. That's what He wants, not our strict obedience or our great faith. Just a seed is enough. He will water it and cause it's growth.
 

NayborBear

Banned Serpent Seed Heresy
#11
pHart, I read a post of yours somewhere and can't find it again now.

You said something like...the struggle to believe God will make a way of provision for you without you having to do something illegal or...I don't know, you said something like that.

I talk to brothers and sisters all the time about this, which is, from my observations of others and myself, a huge and first hurdle that we stumble on and don't ever get running swiftly because of. You could call the hurdle "The deceitfulness of riches" or..."The exodus wandering relived."

I know this isn't so much for those with financial security or a good job and a 401k. It's more for us who have never really had that but have lived more hand to mouth - either all of our lives or more recently, through circumstances where we lost a job with "bennies" or became fairly destitute from some other cause.

I know He can make a pair of shoes last 40 years and can sew up holes in pockets. And I read exodus and see all the failures of trust for temporal provision. I see our same failure to trust, despite knowing that Jesus said we are not to worry about these things as unbelievers do.

I see our "jars of worms" where we gather enough for the day AND for 30 years of retirement. And I see all of the worry about if we've saved enough to not starve in old age. And the worry when 401k's take a hit. Etc., etc. There is some inner lying of saying we trust when really we show ourselves to be leaning on a stockpile for our security.

I talk with others a lot about trust for provision no matter what it looks like currently. And mostly, I am strong in this myself. But I feel I am in danger of disqualification because after I teach trust to others, I have got into a funk over it early this morning.

Because I really would like some financial security, even though I KNOW He has done the very best thing for me and my growth of trust in Him and His promises.

So I KNOW all of these things and I STILL got into a funk and a struggle this morning.

There is some sort of...line, a dividing line? and I'm standing right on it instead of on one side or the other. Because I waver back and forth. I've gotten pretty good at recognizing when I'm kicking sand around with my foot and trying to cover up that line to go with the worlds wisdom instead of trust. And at the same time I'm desiring a stockpile and a small place of my own, I'm also deeply grateful that He hasn't given these things to me in order to grow my trust.

I guess what really hit me hard this morning is...a deep and profound...weariness over this struggle that never quite ceases. I think I have it licked and then it comes back and I just want to be done with it and be completely firm.

So, since you mentioned this somewhere in a post fairly recently, I just thought you might have some words or...wisdom...or encouragement for me. You're the only one I've ever heard address it (other than me) and so I know you understand this very real struggle. So even just what has helped to make you firmer would maybe help me. I'm weary of it. I feel I should be past this hurdle. He's given me the circumstances to bring me to the struggle in His mercy, and I don't want to muddle around in it any longer. I want to be firm and unshaken in it. I don't want this intermittent temptation to go back to the worlds wisdom and then worry about retirement. I guess I'm wondering how to get rid of the constant temptation...? Even to move on to a different temptation instead of the same one over and over would be a relief.
It "sounds like", to me, anyways, that Jesus has confessed "you forward", to the "Government", on His shoulders! Yet, for 1 reason, or another, you are, or seem, not so willing, to head unto the "threshing floor" (again). This ain't "burger king", yanno? You were bought, for a price! Your life, is not, your own! Contrary, to what "the world" wants you to think!

 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
#12
It "sounds like", to me, anyways, that Jesus has confessed "you forward", to the "Government", on His shoulders! Yet, for 1 reason, or another, you are, or seem, not so willing, to head unto the "threshing floor" (again). This ain't "burger king", yanno? You were bought, for a price! Your life, is not, your own! Contrary, to what "the world" wants you to think!

Do what? Are you judging her?
 

Stunnedbygrace

Senior Member
Nov 12, 2015
9,112
822
113
#14
There is nothing wrong with having more than enough. Isn't that one of His characteristics? The God of more than enough. I've had this struggle when single. Even though I had a good paying job, I had kids going to school needing money and then car payments on top of that. One day all I had was a potatoe to eat at lunch.

Its coming into rest is what you need. Learning that one day is sufficient for the evil we face. It's a hurdle most of us have to face at some time.

But, He will bring you out whether your faith is perfect enough, just because you are His.

Remember? When we are faithless, He remains faithful, for He will not deny Himself. He won't go back on His Word.

This is the whole point of the not by works thread. It's by His work, we rest in.

His desire is to give you all your hearts desire. Just love on Him stunned. That's what He wants, not our strict obedience or our great faith. Just a seed is enough. He will water it and cause it's growth.
I wasn't saying there was anything wrong with having more than enough...But some of us don't have more than enough. We eke by. Live hand to mouth mostly. And an apostle said if you have ENOUGH to eat and drink, be content. And he said he had learned to be content with a little or a lot. So I could counter what you said with: There is nothing wrong with NOT having more than enough. I don't quite understand where you were going with the comment, sorry. :)

And P.S. - I think I'd be in trouble if He gave me everything my heart wanted....
 
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Stunnedbygrace

Senior Member
Nov 12, 2015
9,112
822
113
#15
Oh thank you Lord, I see pHart at the bottom of the page! :)
 
P

PHart

Guest
#16
pHart, I read a post of yours somewhere and can't find it again now.

You said something like...the struggle to believe God will make a way of provision for you without you having to do something illegal or...I don't know, you said something like that.
Hi, Stunned.

I do recall talking to you about this passage:

"1What causes fights and quarrels among you? Don’t they come from your desires that battle within you? 2You desire but do not have, so you kill. You covet but you cannot get what you want, so you quarrel and fight. You do not have because you do not ask God. 3When you ask, you do not receive, because you ask with wrong motives, that you may spend what you get on your pleasures." (James 4:1-3 NIV)

This passage was a life changer for me. By nature we react to threats to our security and well being in sinful ways (fear, anger, rage, jealousy, greed, etc). I realized that the problem was not the things threatening my well being, it was my sinful response to those things. Once I realized that, I was able to focus God's grace for the problem in the right place....in me.

Let me know if this was the passage you were thinking of. I've been short of time to post, but I'll be back. And thank you for your inquiry. Even if this wasn't the passage, we'll all talk anyway, and, prayerfully, we'll all be edified and strengthened and encouraged as we learn from each other and inspire one another to growth in Christ. Thanks for sharing.
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
#18

Speaking from similar experience/s? Yes!

Advice from goodly-Godly council? Yes!

Is that "judging?" To some eyes? It would appear so. :rolleyes:
you sounded like you tried to tell her if she was still struggling she could not be saved. If this is true, You are wrong, dead wrong. And you need to judge yourself (remove the plank) before you judge others.
 

NayborBear

Banned Serpent Seed Heresy
#19
you sounded like you tried to tell her if she was still struggling she could not be saved. If this is true, You are wrong, dead wrong. And you need to judge yourself (remove the plank) before you judge others.

Good Grief EG! Since when is one's not wishing to be "refined", turn into one not being saved?
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
#20
Good Grief EG! Since when is one's not wishing to be "refined", turn into one not being saved?
Does it matter? You think she has no desire to be refined?