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Thread: Paul exposes false application of the law

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    Senior Member eternally-gratefull's Avatar
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    Default Paul exposes false application of the law

    In Paul’s letter to timothy he exposes those who are taking the law out of context, and trying to add it to The Christian way of life.


    1 Tim 1: 3 As I urged you when I went into Macedonia—remain in Ephesus that you may charge some that they teach no other doctrine, 4 nor give heed to fables and endless genealogies, which cause disputes rather than godly edification which is in faith. 5 Now the purpose of the commandment is love from a pure heart, from a good conscience, and from sincere faith, 6 from which some, having strayed, have turned aside to idle talk, 7 desiring to be teachers of the law, understanding neither what they say nor the things which they affirm.



    Notice, Paul wants timothy to remain in Ephesus to expose and teach men who are teaching strange doctrines, instead of furthering the Administration of God, focusing instead on Faith and love. Instead o focusing on myth on myths and genealogies, which lead to speculations, instead of truth. And who were these men?


    6 For some men, straying from these things, have turned aside to fruitless discussion, 7 wanting to be teachers of the Law, even though they do not understand either what they are saying or the matters about which they make confident assertions.


    These are men who are attempting to teach the law, however, they are only making assertions, which are not true, for they do not understand the law, even though they make confident assertions what they teach is true.

    Then paul tells Timothy (and us) what the law is really about.


    8 But we know that the Law is good, if one uses it lawfully,


    It is only Good if it is used according to the rules and guidelines for which it was originally intended. In other words. Taking the law out of context. Using it outside of its original intended purpose, Makes the law not a good thing, But a Bad thing. According to paul, it causes division and destroys godly edification. And does not lead to truth. Which is never a good thing.


    9 knowing this: that the law is not made for a righteous person, but for the lawless and insubordinate,


    first. Paul goes on to who was the law written for?


    1. The righteous, Who are the righteous, according to Paul?


    Phil 3: 9 and be found in Him, not having my own righteousness, which is from the law, but that which is through faith in Christ, the righteousness which is from God by faith;

    1. It is of faith only, Not by following some law, so just because someone may be obeying the law and doing what the law says, does not mean they are righteous.


    2. It is something given, not something done, or earned


    3. It is made for sinners,


    2 Cor 5: 21 For He made Him who knew no sin to be sin for us, that we might become the righteousness of God in Him.


    It is something given, based on what Christ did on the cross.


    Rom 3: 21 But now the righteousness of God apart from the law is revealed, being witnessed by the Law and the Prophets, 22 even the righteousness of God, through faith in Jesus Christ, to all and on all who believe. For there is no difference; 23 for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, 24 being justified freely by His grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus,


    1. again, not of the law


    2. it is given to all who believe


    3. no one is righteous by being obedient all have sinned and fall short.


    4. it is freely paid for by the redeeming act of Christ.


    Conclusion, the law is not for true Christians, who were given righteousness by being redeemed, it is given only for sinners


    Eternally Grateful for the grace God has shown a wretched soul such as myself.

    Rom 8:1 There is therefore now no condemnation to those who are in Christ Jesus,

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    Senior Member eternally-gratefull's Avatar
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    Default Re: Paul exposes false application of the law

    who are sinners?


    for the ungodly and for sinners, for the unholy and profane, for murderers of fathers and murderers of mothers, for manslayers, 10 for fornicators, for sodomites, for kidnappers, for liars, for perjurers, and if there is any other thing that is contrary to sound doctrine, 11 according to the glorious gospel of the blessed God which was committed to my trust
    notice how Paul gives a list which basically follows the ten commands, something which paul even said in romans, we are all guilty of.

    Notice how paul gives a list which resembles the ten commands, according to what we just read, this means that a sinner is anyone who has not kept all gods commands perfectly (see gal 3, it requires perfection, or perfect obedience, as james said, if we break even the least of all commands, we are guilty of the whole law)



    The law is given to sinners, why?

    Rom 3: 19 Now we know that whatever the law says, it says to those who are under the law, that every mouth may be stopped, and all the world may become guilty before God.


    since the whole world is guilty, the law exposes the whole world as sinners, it makes us all guilty before God, and gives us no excuse.


    why do we need exposed as sinners?



    Gal 3: 24 Therefore the law was our tutor to bring us to Christ, that we might be justified by faith.


    The word tutor comes from a greek word which means schoolmaster, who was someone tasked to lead a child by the hand to get to the intended destination. in other words, the purpose of the law is to take a sinner, expose their sin (because they can not keep the law) and lead them to the destination they need to be led to which is Christ. any other use of the law is taking the law outside its purpose, and according to paul is not truth, leads to division, and destroys godly edification.

    Eternally Grateful for the grace God has shown a wretched soul such as myself.

    Rom 8:1 There is therefore now no condemnation to those who are in Christ Jesus,

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    Senior Member eternally-gratefull's Avatar
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    Default Re: Paul exposes false application of the law

    so what is improper us of the law!


    1. we keep the law to earn Gods acceptance (justification)


    Gal 2: 16 knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law but by faith in Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Christ Jesus, that we might be justified by faith in Christ and not by the works of the law; for by the works of the law no flesh shall be justified.

    2. We keep the law in order to help us mature in Christ (Sanctification)



    Rom 6: 14 For sin shall not have dominion over you, for you are not under law but under grace.
    Rom 7: 6 But now we have been delivered from the law, having died to what we were held by, so that we should serve in the newness of the Spirit and not in the oldness of the letter.


    These 2 false applications of the law which as paul says is confidently taught by false teachers, (they actually believe and are confident they are right). is devastating to church growth, individual growth and as a church we need to stand against them.


    1 Paul makes it clearl it is under grace we have power over sin, not law. The law will not make us good people, grace will


    2. We serve god in a new way, by the spirit, not the letter (law)


    Today, many call this false teaching legalism.
    legalism states


    1. we are righteous because we are good, thus we do not need certain things


    2. we are bad, thus we do not reserve certain things. so why bother
    what does Paul tell us we SHOULD focus on instead?!

    12 And I thank Christ Jesus our Lord who has enabled me, because He counted me faithful,
    Notice, God enabled Paul not because he obeyed the law and was righteous, but because of his faith!
    putting me into the ministry, 13 although I was formerly a blasphemer, a persecutor, and an insolent man; but I obtained mercy because I did it ignorantly in unbelief. 14 And the grace of our Lord was exceedingly abundant, with faith and love which are in Christ Jesus. 15 This is a faithful saying and worthy of all acceptance, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners, of whom I am chief. 16 However, for this reason I obtained mercy, that in me first Jesus Christ might show all longsuffering, as a pattern to those who are going to believe on Him for everlasting life. 17 Now to the King eternal, immortal, invisible, to God who alone is wise, be honor and glory forever and ever. Amen.


    Paul is saying instead of focusing on laws, genealogies and fables, focus on Gods grace


    1. God came to save sinners


    2. He is chief of all sinners


    3. because of grace, Paul is enables to do what God wanted him to do. which was to be an apostle, God empowers us in all things, by grace, and mercy, not by works, he enables us and strengthens us.

    Rom 11: 6 And if by grace, then it is no longer of works; otherwise grace is no longer grace. But if it is of works, it is no longer grace; otherwise work is no longer work.


    Grace and works are opposed to each other, one cancels the other out, it can not be both it has to be one or the other.
    2 Tim 4: 18 And the Lord will deliver me from every evil work and preserve me for His heavenly kingdom. To Him be glory forever and ever. Amen!

    Eph 3 20 Now to Him who is able to do exceedingly abundantly above all that we ask or think, according to the power that works in us, 21 to Him be glory in the church by Christ Jesus to all generations, forever and ever. Amen.


    Paul is telling us to appreciate Gods grace, and thanksgiving. These, unlike law will have positive effects on the church and individuals


    1. it is contagious


    2. it produces humility (as opposed to self-righteousness, which come from following the law)


    3. it rekindles our passion to serve others, as we remember remember how God serves and is serving us, who are undeserving based on our personal righteousness


    4. It gives us strength and empowers us to forgive and love others.
    in review, grace build us up,


    Act 20:32 “So now, brethren, I commend you to God and to the word of His grace, which is able to build you up and give you an inheritance among all those who are sanctified.



    where the law gives us a false sense of entitlement, or a can lead to and a false sense of unworthiness.


    this is a serious subject, i hope we can discuss this freely and openly, while at the same time learn how a false interpretation of the law can only destroy and divide us, it will never edify us.
    Eternally Grateful for the grace God has shown a wretched soul such as myself.

    Rom 8:1 There is therefore now no condemnation to those who are in Christ Jesus,

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    Senior Member Bogadile's Avatar
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    Default Re: Paul exposes false application of the law

    Great post brother.

    The law is there to show us our sins, and lead us to Christ!

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    Default Re: Paul exposes false application of the law

    What are you wanting to discuss? You covered a lot more than just Paul exposing the false application of the law.

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    Senior Member eternally-gratefull's Avatar
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    Default Re: Paul exposes false application of the law

    I covered the passage in which paul exposed false teachers. And what we should focus on anyhow. Ie, 1 Timothy 1 and the verses I covered.

    There are so many lawyers, in here lately, and what I would call Hebrew roots people who think we need to still obey the law. And this is how we are sanctified or grow in christ. My thread is concerning those things.

    are we sanctified by the law.. or are we sanctified by grace?

    I gave what I think paul said, we are sanctified by grace, not by following rules and regulations found in the law.
    Eternally Grateful for the grace God has shown a wretched soul such as myself.

    Rom 8:1 There is therefore now no condemnation to those who are in Christ Jesus,

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    Senior Member Johnny_B's Avatar
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    Default Re: Paul exposes false application of the law


    Since there are a number of Sabbaters here, how does the Sabbath apply to what Paul is teaching here?
    John 6:63, 65 "It is the Spirit who gives life; the flesh is no help at all. The words that I have spoken to you are spirit and life....65 And he said, “This is why I told you that no one can come to me unless it is granted him by the Father.”

    I Corinthians 4:7 "For who sees anything different in you? What do you have that you did not receive? If then you received it, why do you boast as if you did not receive it?"

    Born in the Spirit & word, granted by the Father. EE-TEOW




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    Default Re: Paul exposes false application of the law

    Quote Originally Posted by eternally-gratefull View Post
    I covered the passage in which paul exposed false teachers. And what we should focus on anyhow. Ie, 1 Timothy 1 and the verses I covered.

    There are so many lawyers, in here lately, and what I would call Hebrew roots people who think we need to still obey the law. And this is how we are sanctified or grow in christ. My thread is concerning those things.

    are we sanctified by the law.. or are we sanctified by grace?

    I gave what I think paul said, we are sanctified by grace, not by following rules and regulations found in the law.
    Thank you for the clarification.

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    Senior Member eternally-gratefull's Avatar
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    Default Re: Paul exposes false application of the law

    Quote Originally Posted by Johnny_B View Post

    Since there are a number of Sabbaters here, how does the Sabbath apply to what Paul is teaching here?
    it is quite simple. If we are obeying the letter thinking it will make us righteous. We are taking the law out of context. We need to focus on love and faith. WHat are we resting (sabbath) for? Because God said to rest. (Remember the sabbath and keep it) Or because we are serving others and loving others out of faith?


    Eternally Grateful for the grace God has shown a wretched soul such as myself.

    Rom 8:1 There is therefore now no condemnation to those who are in Christ Jesus,

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    Senior Member Johnny_B's Avatar
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    Default Re: Paul exposes false application of the law

    Quote Originally Posted by eternally-gratefull View Post
    it is quite simple. If we are obeying the letter thinking it will make us righteous. We are taking the law out of context. We need to focus on love and faith. WHat are we resting (sabbath) for? Because God said to rest. (Remember the sabbath and keep it) Or because we are serving others and loving others out of faith?


    I believe we keep the Sabbath in loving the Lord God with all out heart, all our mind, all our soul, and all our strength and if you love your neighbor as yourself. If you do those two you can not brake any Law or commandment.

    I was only asking because I thought for sure you would get one of these Sabbathers asking you.
    John 6:63, 65 "It is the Spirit who gives life; the flesh is no help at all. The words that I have spoken to you are spirit and life....65 And he said, “This is why I told you that no one can come to me unless it is granted him by the Father.”

    I Corinthians 4:7 "For who sees anything different in you? What do you have that you did not receive? If then you received it, why do you boast as if you did not receive it?"

    Born in the Spirit & word, granted by the Father. EE-TEOW




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    Default Re: Paul exposes false application of the law

    Quote Originally Posted by Johnny_B View Post

    Since there are a number of Sabbaters here, how does the Sabbath apply to what Paul is teaching here?
    Sabbaters are trying to understand the sabbath physically resting but under grace we understand the sabbath as a spiritual rest.
    The words JESUS spake are Spirit and Life.
    Grandpa, MarcR and Stunnedbygrace like this.
    IF you do not realize that the rebirth took place in your spirit then it can be confusing to your mind worshiping GOD standing in front of a physical mirror.

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    Default Re: Paul exposes false application of the law

    i always wondered what he was talking about with the endless genealogies.
    posthuman and oldethennew like this.

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    Default Re: Paul exposes false application of the law

    Quote Originally Posted by Bogadile View Post
    Great post brother.

    The law is there to show us our sins, and lead us to Christ!
    Amen a good summation.......

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    Default Re: Paul exposes false application of the law

    AMEN on the thread bro......at the end of the day that which is designed to prove guilt will never justify before God.....it points us to Christ as the cure and then the righteousness of Christ who fulfilled the law is imputed unto the believer by faith without the works of the law which cannot be done by man without failure on some level because it proves guilt.....
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    Default Re: Paul exposes false application of the law

    Quote Originally Posted by eternally-gratefull View Post
    are we sanctified by the law.. or are we sanctified by grace?
    Sanctification is coming to the knowledge of the truth. [1 Tim 2:4]

    • Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth. John 17:17

    Faith is believing all things.

    • Beareth all things, believeth all things, hopeth all things, endureth all things. 1 Cor 13:7
    • Jesus said unto him, If thou canst believe, all things are possible to him that believeth. Mark 9:23

    Faith is making search and inquiry.

    • Then shalt thou inquire, and make search, and ask diligently; Deut 13:14
    • Of which salvation the prophets have inquired and searched diligently, who prophesied of the grace that should come unto you: 1 Peter 1:10

    Faith is trying the word.

    • Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: 1 John 4:10
    • Prove all things; hold fast that which is good.1 Thess 5:21

    We are sanctified by the Word of God [See John 17:19]

    • The law of truth was in his mouth, and iniquity was not found in his lips: [Malachi 2:6]


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    Default Re: Paul exposes false application of the law

    why do we need exposed as sinners?
    The law was added because of Adams disobedience because after the fall Adam would have to fulfill GOD’s perfect standard of righteousness of his own strength and needed to know when he was offending GOD’s perfect standard of righteousness.

    Since we all know that no man can be perfectly righteous of his own strength,Every man would fall short of the glory of GOD and eventually realize that he couldn’t fulfill the law given by Moses perfectly of his own strength and that he seeded a savior.

    We needed mercy and grace.

    Grace was provided,JESUS,the Issue now Is faith,will you be obedient to faith?

    For GOD SO loved the world that HE gave HIS only begotten SON that whosoever believes In HIS WORD would not perish but have EVERLASTING LIFE.
    Grandpa and Stunnedbygrace like this.
    IF you do not realize that the rebirth took place in your spirit then it can be confusing to your mind worshiping GOD standing in front of a physical mirror.

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    Default Re: Paul exposes false application of the law

    Quote Originally Posted by eternally-gratefull View Post
    ...are we sanctified by the law.. or are we sanctified by grace?
    How about both (provided we understand what the term "Law" means in this context). A Christian is sanctified as he seeks to walk in the Spirit, and in practical terms that means as he seeks to apply the Law of Christ -- the Law of Love -- in his daily interactions with God and with men. But what is the Law of Christ, other than the Ten Commandments, which are called "the Law" in the epistle to the Romans? So it is grace that directs the Christian to apply the Law and thus be sanctified. There is no conflict whatsoever. The Bible says that the Law is spiritual, so who are we to dispute that?

    The Antinomians falsely believe that the Law has no bearing on Christian behavior. That is utter nonsense, since God Himself has said that when He makes the New Covenant, He will write His laws in the hearts and minds of His people.
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    Default Re: Paul exposes false application of the law

    Romans 8:1-2 There is therefore now no condemnation to them that are in Christ Jesus. 2. For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus made me free from the law of sin and death.

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    Default Re: Paul exposes false application of the law

    James wrote of “the perfect law that gives freedom” (Jas 1:25), which can be contrasted with the law of Moses that binds (Rom 7:6). What is the perfect law that gives freedom? Well, what is the implanted word that can save you (Jas 1:21)? It’s not the Ten Commandments or the Bible. It’s Jesus, the living Word who sets us free.

    The perfect law of liberty describes what Jesus has done (perfectly fulfilled or completed the law) and the fruit he will bear in our lives (liberty) if we trust him.


    But whoever looks intently into the perfect law that gives freedom, and continues in it – not forgetting what they have heard, but doing it – they will be blessed in what they do. (Jas 1:25)


    Look into the mirror of Moses’ law and you will be miserable, for it exposes all your faults. But look into the perfect law which is Jesus and you will be blessed, for it reveals his righteousness.


    “Don’t just listen but do what it (the perfect law of liberty) says” (Jas 1:22). In other words, allow the Spirit of Christ to convince you that in him you are righteous and holy. Don’t walk away from the perfect law and forget who you are in Christ. Fix your eyes on Jesus. Look intently with an unveiled face and be transformed into his likeness.



    Taken from Bible commentary




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    Default Re: Paul exposes false application of the law

    The difference between the old law (a written code you can’t keep) and the new Law (Christ himself, living in you). Try and live by the old laws, as Paul did, and it make you miserable:

    What a wretched man I am! Who will rescue me from this body that is subject to death? (Rom 7:24)


    Paul couldn’t keep the old law no matter how hard he tried. He needed a new law and that new law is a Who:

    Who will rescue me…? Thanks be to God, who delivers me through Jesus Christ our Lord. (Rom 7:24-25a)

    The old law is a what; the new law is a Who. The old law ministers condemnation and death (2 Cor 3:7-9), but the new “law of the Spirit gives life” (Rom 8:2).


    For the letter kills, but the Spirit gives life. (2 Cor 3:6)


    Who gives life? Not a set of rules, but the Spirit of Christ within you. One more time for emphasis: the new law is a Who.

    Taken from Bible commentary



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