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Thread: Why Some Saints Will Not Leave At The Rapture

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    Default Re: Why Some Saints Will Not Leave At The Rapture

    Quote Originally Posted by Enow View Post
    Luke 14:15 And when one of them that sat at meat with him heard these things, he said unto him, Blessed is he that shall eat bread in the kingdom of God. 16 Then said he unto him, A certain man made a great supper, and bade many: 17 And sent his servant at supper time to say to them that were bidden, Come; for all things are now ready. 18 And they all with one consent began to make excuse. The first said unto him, I have bought a piece of ground, and I must needs go and see it: I pray thee have me excused. 19 And another said, I have bought five yoke of oxen, and I go to prove them: I pray thee have me excused. 20 And another said, I have married a wife, and therefore I cannot come.21 So that servant came, and shewed his lord these things. Then the master of the house being angry said to his servant, Go out quickly into the streets and lanes of the city, and bring in hither the poor, and the maimed, and the halt, and the blind. 22 And the servant said, Lord, it is done as thou hast commanded, and yet there is room. 23 And the lord said unto the servant, Go out into the highways and hedges, and compel them to come in, that my house may be filled.24 For I say unto you, That none of those men which were bidden shall taste of my supper.

    If you don't think you would refuse the Bridegroom when He comes at the pre trib rapture for any of those reasons above, I would advise you to heed His warning because He said it will be a snare for those living at the time that He comes.

    Luke 21:33 Heaven and earth shall pass away: but my words shall not pass away. 34 And take heed to yourselves, lest at any time your hearts be overcharged with surfeiting, and drunkenness, and cares of this life, and so that day come upon you unawares. 35 For as a snare shall it come on all them that dwell on the face of the whole earth.36 Watch ye therefore, and pray always, that ye may be accounted worthy to escape all these things that shall come to pass, and to stand before the Son of man.

    Luke 17:28 Likewise also as it was in the days of Lot; they did eat, they drank, they bought, they sold, they planted, they builded; 29 But the same day that Lot went out of Sodom it rained fire and brimstone from heaven, and destroyed them all. 30 Even thus shall it be in the day when the Son of man is revealed. 31 In that day, he which shall be upon the housetop, and his stuff in the house, let him not come down to take it away: and he that is in the field, let him likewise not return back. 32 Remember Lot's wife.33 Whosoever shall seek to save his life shall lose it; and whosoever shall lose his life shall preserve it.

    So some saints will love their lives and their loved ones that they will not want to leave when the Bridegroom comes.

    So watch and pray always that the Lord will help you be far more willing to leave your life and your loved ones behind.

    No saint love their life.

    You question paralel with why some christian not love Jesus?

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    Default Re: Why Some Saints Will Not Leave At The Rapture

    Quote Originally Posted by Dai3234 View Post
    Most likely, none of you are going to listen or look, but I'll mention it once.

    The LAST TRUMP, is when the end of time is. They're was no Zero in greek, so 1000= 1000* +, = millennia * ?

    They're is no sense in a 1000 year reign after. Look up the 70 weeks of Daniel, revelation, and beast etc, on grace and truth ministries, YouTube.

    Learn from a wider pool. And get out of the puddle of one preacher knows all etc.

    I can't be bothered anymore, I'm tired of this rubbish. God will let you know if he wants you to know. Whatever.
    Yes no literal thousand year.(Amil) reign on this sin filled corrupted world . Thousand like one hundred and ten represent a unknown faith factor spiritul meaning.hid in parables throughout the scriptures.


    Isaiah 65:17 For, behold, I create new heavens and a new earth: and the former shall not be remembered, nor come into mind.

    Because God corrupted this present heaven and earth. Time will come to an end. the former will not be remembered, or come into mind.

    It would seem the use of the phrase the “last day” as it relates to the “last trump” is the end of time.

    The walls like at entering Jericho to symbolize the entering into the new heavens and earth the promised eternal land The heavenly Jerusalem prepared as His chaste virgin bride. .The old will crumble and go up in smoke. Its one of those historically y true parables used to point a head as the gospel to the promise or new incorruptible bodies.

    As I believe we are informed we do not know the Holy Spirit of God, Christ after the rudiments and philosophies as oral tradition of men of this world, we walk by faith.

    The Sun and the moon as temporal timer keepers have served their purpose .All in Hebrews 11 that died not receiving the promise now in the twinkling, together with those saints reigning with Christ on earth. Reveal the hidden glory of His bride the church. The second and final resurrection (rapture)


    And I saw no temple therein: for the Lord God Almighty and the Lamb are the temple of it.And the city had no need of the sun, neither of the moon, to shine in it: for the glory of God did lighten it, and the Lamb is the light thereof.And the nations of them which are saved shall walk in the light of it: and the kings of the earth do bring their glory and honour into it.And the gates of it shall not be shut at all by day: for there shall be no night there.And they shall bring the glory and honour of the nations into it. Rev 21:22

    And these all, having obtained a good report through faith, received not the promise:God having provided some better thing for us, that they without us should not be made perfect Heb 11:39

    1Co 15:51 Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,

    Two groups of people. One asleep in the bosom of Abraham the invisible presence with God as part of the first resurrection. And to those reigning here on earth as a kingdom of priests at the moment he comes both changed simultaneously. No literal thousand year reign on earth it will have vanished.

    In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality. So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory.1Co 15:52

    John 6:39 And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day.

    John 6:40 And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.

    John 6:44 No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day.

    John 6:54 Whoso eateth my flesh, and drinketh my blood, hath eternal life; and I will raise him up at the last day.
    John 7:37 In the last day, that great day of the feast, Jesus stood and cried, saying, If any man thirst, let him come unto me, and drink.

    John 11:24 Martha saith unto him, I know that he shall rise again in the resurrection at the last day.

    Judgment day the sixth day, as it was for the residents of Jericho a city of ill-repute used to represent this world a similar picture to the latter day the last trump ushering the new heavens and earth. .

    John 12:48 He that rejecteth me, and receiveth not my words, hath one that judgeth him: the word that I have spoken, the same shall judge him in the last day.
    Last edited by garee; 1 Week Ago at 01:47 PM.

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    Default Re: Why Some Saints Will Not Leave At The Rapture

    Quote Originally Posted by Jackson123 View Post
    No saint love their life.

    You question paralel with why some christian not love Jesus?
    Why would Jesus warn believers then? Why at a time when it is hardly the atmosphere a believer will find himself in at the end of the great tribulation where everyday cares of life may be a snare to them that they would not want to leave?

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    Default Re: Why Some Saints Will Not Leave At The Rapture

    Quote Originally Posted by celib View Post
    When the bride groom comes its all over, you have been deceived, there will be no rapture. God bless
    Quote Originally Posted by Ahwatukee View Post
    I just love the way that you supported your claim with scripture. The Lord's promise to gather the church, stands!

    If you are not believing in and looking forward to the Lord's promise to return and gather his church, then it is you who have been deceived. I hope that you will reconsider and believe in the Lord.
    Ah. You are the brother that is saying or implying that if they do not believe in the pre trib rapture, they will get left behind.

    Somebody confused me with your stance.

    Anyway, since we prophesy in part and know in part, I believe there are 2 things that would have a believer left behind; their unwillingness to leave this life or being found in iniquity, even former believers, as those saints are to be received later on as a vessel unto dishonor, but still in His House.... unless they turn to Him for help to repent & for being willing to go.

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    Default Re: Why Some Saints Will Not Leave At The Rapture

    Quote Originally Posted by Enow View Post
    Why would Jesus warn believers then? Why at a time when it is hardly the atmosphere a believer will find himself in at the end of the great tribulation where everyday cares of life may be a snare to them that they would not want to leave?
    I believe you talking about matt 10:39

    39 Whoever finds their life will lose it, and whoever loses their life for my sake will find it.

    Another version

    The person who tries to preserve his life will lose it, but the person who loses his life for me will preserve it.

    to me it is mean Christian not suppose preserve his life.

    So all that not preserve his life mean Christian, mean go to rapture after tribulation.

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    Default Re: Why Some Saints Will Not Leave At The Rapture

    Greetings Enow,

    Ah. You are the brother that is saying or implying that if they do not believe in the pre trib rapture, they will get left behind
    So, please show me where in that post where I said or even mention that if someone doesn't believe in the "pre trb rapture that they will get left behind?"

    What it does say is that, he is being deceived because he is not believing in the scripture that states that the Lord went to the Father's house to prepare places for us and that he will return and gather his church as he promised in John 14:1-3.

    Anyway, since we prophesy in part and know in part, I believe there are 2 things that would have a believer left behind; their unwillingness to leave this life or being found in iniquity, even former believers, as those saints are to be received later on as a vessel unto dishonor, but still in His House.... unless they turn to Him for help to repent & for being willing to go.
    Regarding what you said above, what do you think about the following:

    "But suppose that servant is wicked and says to himself, ‘My master is staying away a long time,’ and he then begins to beat his fellow servants and to eat and drink with drunkards. The master of that servant will come on a day when he does not expect him and at an hour he is not aware of. He will cut him to pieces and assign him a place with the hypocrites, where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth."

    Salvation and eternal security is dependent upon having faith from beginning to the end. If a person goes back into willfully living according to the sinful nature, then they are accumulating a multitude of sins and are on their way to death, unless they return to having faith, as the scripture in James makes clear:

    "My brothers, if anyone among you wanders from the truth and someone brings him back, let him know that whoever brings back a sinner from his wandering will save his soul from death and will cover a multitude of sins."

    In the scripture above, when that brother wanders away he is accumulating a multitude of sin and is on his way to death.

    "Once you were alienated from God and were enemies in your minds because of your evil behavior. But now he has reconciled you by Christ’s physical body through death to present you holy in his sight, without blemish and free from accusation— if you continue in your faith, established and firm, and do not move from the hope held out in the gospel.
    But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, forbearance, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness and self-control ...

    I am the vine; you are the branches. If you remain in me and I in you, you will bear much fruit ...

    This is to my Father’s glory, that you bear much fruit ....

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    Default Re: Why Some Saints Will Not Leave At The Rapture

    Quote Originally Posted by Jackson123 View Post
    I believe you talking about matt 10:39

    39 Whoever finds their life will lose it, and whoever loses their life for my sake will find it.

    Another version

    The person who tries to preserve his life will lose it, but the person who loses his life for me will preserve it.

    to me it is mean Christian not suppose preserve his life.

    So all that not preserve his life mean Christian, mean go to rapture after tribulation.
    If you read the scripture in the OP, you might find the passage in Luke 17th chapter that may show you that believers are not to love this life to such a point that they would not want to leave it when the Bridegroom comes.
    heartofdavid likes this.

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    Default Re: Why Some Saints Will Not Leave At The Rapture

    Quote Originally Posted by Enow View Post
    If you read the scripture in the OP, you might find the passage in Luke 17th chapter that may show you that believers are not to love this life to such a point that they would not want to leave it when the Bridegroom comes.
    It does not matter whether a person wants to leave this life or not. If he is a Christian, born again of the Holy Spirit, when Jesus Christ returns to gather his church, that person will go. That person made his choice when he decided to believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and became saved.

    Your belief that some Christians will be left behind at the rapture is not true.

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    Default Re: Why Some Saints Will Not Leave At The Rapture

    Quote Originally Posted by Enow View Post
    Why would Jesus warn believers then? Why at a time when it is hardly the atmosphere a believer will find himself in at the end of the great tribulation where everyday cares of life may be a snare to them that they would not want to leave?
    I want to leave BECAUSE of the snares hahaha but God has a different plan I know.
    Earth awaken, all creation, open up your eyes again, alive again, for Christ has torn the veil of darkness away!
    Easter - Theocracy

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    Default Re: Why Some Saints Will Not Leave At The Rapture

    Quote Originally Posted by Ahwatukee View Post
    Greetings Enow,
    Greetings, Brother Ahwatukee,

    So, please show me where in that post where I said or even mention that if someone doesn't believe in the "pre trb rapture that they will get left behind?"

    What it does say is that, he is being deceived because he is not believing in the scripture that states that the Lord went to the Father's house to prepare places for us and that he will return and gather his church as he promised in John 14:1-3.
    Just wondering why you cited he is being deceived as if there was a consequence to that deception. It is true you did not state it, but I did seem to read that as implied. My apology. Sorry about that.

    Regarding what you said above, what do you think about the following:

    "But suppose that servant is wicked and says to himself, ‘My master is staying away a long time,’ and he then begins to beat his fellow servants and to eat and drink with drunkards. The master of that servant will come on a day when he does not expect him and at an hour he is not aware of. He will cut him to pieces and assign him a place with the hypocrites, where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth."

    Salvation and eternal security is dependent upon having faith from beginning to the end. If a person goes back into willfully living according to the sinful nature, then they are accumulating a multitude of sins and are on their way to death, unless they return to having faith, as the scripture in James makes clear:

    "My brothers, if anyone among you wanders from the truth and someone brings him back, let him know that whoever brings back a sinner from his wandering will save his soul from death and will cover a multitude of sins."

    In the scripture above, when that brother wanders away he is accumulating a multitude of sin and is on his way to death.

    "Once you were alienated from God and were enemies in your minds because of your evil behavior. But now he has reconciled you by Christ’s physical body through death to present you holy in his sight, without blemish and free from accusation— if you continue in your faith, established and firm, and do not move from the hope held out in the gospel.
    Well, that reference from Luke 12 is a warning I hope in Christ Jesus that He will help me to avoid, because it reads to me that I should not have fellowship with tongue speakers and others that preach even more infilling of the Spirit for other signs; that I should stop beating them over the head in trying to reason with them so to speak, to reconsider & discern with Him at that throne of grace to repent of that kind of tongue that they have for private use and stop chasing after seducing spirits to receive after a sign. Otherwise, I run the same risk.

    In which case, I do wonder if the command to withdraw over rides giving one of these little ones something to drink; since after the second admonition, I am to reject. I hope in Him to help me withdraw when it is time because all of this is beyond me. One one hand, I am obligated to share the meat and on the other hand, not sure how many times I should repeat it just for newbies sakes that may be reading the threads that may go astray if I had not shared anything to give them pause.

    Anyway,... that is what that reference from Luke 12 leads me to ponder upon as I could very well be left behind but I am trusting the Lord to deliver me from all my troubles and so ... truly surrendering that conern to Him to help me follow Him.

    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

    Since I should avoid assumptions, I wish to address this statement out of the quote above.

    Salvation and eternal security is dependent upon having faith from beginning to the end.
    Although I believe the firstfruits of the resurrection are the vessels unto honor in His House which is the eternal glory that comes with our salvation in Christ Jesus that those worthy of that resurrection will be like the angels that will never die nor marry, that shows a difference for those who are castaways as vessels unto dishonor in His House, because only the second death has no power over those saints coming out of the great tribulation. That means those saints left behind as castaways and new believers after the pre trib rapture will be inheritting the glory of the terrestrial inheritance.

    That being said, the castaways can be saved believers that did not look to Jesus Christ as their Good Shepherd for help to discern iniquity by the KJV and to depart from iniquity. This also includes former believers as well. Any iniquity that denies Him, they will be denied by Him, unless they repent before the Bridegroom comes. Those left behind as denied, He still abides, even in former believers that err from the truth that has their faith overthrown.

    2 Timothy 2:18 Who concerning the truth have erred, saying that the resurrection is past already; and overthrow the faith of some.19 Nevertheless the foundation of God standeth sure, having this seal, The Lord knoweth them that are his. And, let every one that nameth the name of Christ depart from iniquity. 20 But in a great house there are not only vessels of gold and of silver, but also of wood and of earth; and some to honour, and some to dishonour.21 If a man therefore purge himself from these, he shall be a vessel unto honour, sanctified, and meet for the master's use, and prepared unto every good work.

    So I was wondering if you knew that those saints left behind, He still abides in them. This is why His disciples are to call believers to look to Jesus Christ for help to discern and to depart from iniquity in getting ready for the Bridegroom as well as help in not being snared by the cares of this life so as to be willing to go when the time comes. Our desire is that they too will be found abiding in Him & be willing to go by Him to be received as a vessel unto honor in His House by the Bridegroom which is the eternal glory that awaits all believers that comes with our salvation in Christ Jesus.

    2 Timothy 2:10 Therefore I endure all things for the elect's sakes, that they may also obtain the salvation which is in Christ Jesus with eternal glory.11 It is a faithful saying: For if we be dead with him, we shall also live with him: 12 If we suffer, we shall also reign with him: if we deny him, he also will deny us: 13 If we believe not, yet he abideth faithful: he cannot deny himself.

    Thank you for sharing, brother. Only the Lord knows if He will have me will return or not.

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    Default Re: Why Some Saints Will Not Leave At The Rapture

    Quote Originally Posted by Enow View Post
    Well, that reference from Luke 12 is a warning I hope in Christ Jesus that He will help me to avoid, because it reads to me that I should not have fellowship with tongue speakers...
    Would you have disassociated yourself from the apostles?

    Acts 2:
    4) And they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance.

    Would you have disassociated yourself from Paul?

    1 Cor 14:
    18) I thank my God, I speak with tongues more than ye all:

    Enow, my friend, you are ignorant about speaking in tongues.

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    Default Re: Why Some Saints Will Not Leave At The Rapture

    Quote Originally Posted by Enow View Post
    Only the Lord knows if He will have me will return or not.
    Your statement is not very clear, but are you saying you don't know whether you'r saved or not?

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    Default Re: Why Some Saints Will Not Leave At The Rapture

    Quote Originally Posted by Enow View Post
    If you read the scripture in the OP, you might find the passage in Luke 17th chapter that may show you that believers are not to love this life to such a point that they would not want to leave it when the Bridegroom comes.

    Luke 17

    33 Whosoever shall seek to save his life shall lose it; and whosoever shall lose his life shall preserve it.

    Jesus say whosoever shall seek to save his life shall lose it.

    i believe it mean that only who willing to die for Him consider Christian. It is not easy to be real Christian.

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    Default Re: Why Some Saints Will Not Leave At The Rapture

    Quote Originally Posted by Ahwatukee View Post
    I just love the way that you supported your claim with scripture. The Lord's promise to gather the church, stands!

    Below is the promise:

    "My Father’s house has many rooms; if that were not so, would I have told you that I am going there to prepare a place for you?And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come back and take you to be with me that you also may be where I am."

    And below is the detailed way in which the church will be gathered:

    "For the Lord himself will come down from heaven, with a loud command, with the voice of the archangel and with the trumpet call of God, and the dead in Christ will rise first. After that, we who are still alive and are left will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And so we will be with the Lord forever."

    And below are the major reasons why the church cannot go through God's coming wrath which follows the gathering of the church:

    "
    They tell how you turned to God from idols to serve the living and true God, and to wait for his Son from heaven, whom he raised from the dead—Jesus, who rescues us from the coming wrath."

    "
    But since we belong to the day, let us be sober, putting on faith and love as a breastplate, and the hope of salvation as a helmet. For God did not appoint us to suffer wrath but to receive salvation through our Lord Jesus Christ. "

    "
    Because you have kept the word of My patient endurance, I also will keep you out of the hour of the trial being about to come upon the whole inhabited world, to try those dwelling upon the earth."

    In John 14:1-3, Jesus that he was going to the Father's house (heaven) to prepare places for us and that he was going to come again and receive us to himself and take us back to the Father's house to those places that he prepared for us. Therefore, this promise must take place because the Lord said it.

    In addition, our being gathered must take place prior when God's wrath begins, which is initiated at the opening of the 1st seal, therefore, the church must be caught up prior to the 1st seal being opened.

    Also, Rev.19:6-8 shows the bride/church receiving her fine linen, white and clean at the wedding of the Lamb during the time of God's wrath upon the earth. Then in Rev.19:14, the bride/church is shown to be following the Lord out of heaven riding on white horses and wearing her fine linen.

    If you are not believing in and looking forward to the Lord's promise to return and gather his church, then it is you who have been deceived. I hope that you will reconsider and believe in the Lord.
    The subject in 1Thess.4 is where are the dead, Paul explains those that have died are already in Heaven and there coming back with Christ when he returns in a big crowd [cloud] and we will meet him in our spiritual body [air], Christ will gather his elects and take them to Jerusalem to start judgment day, In Gods house are many abodes, thats us, he said he would return and abode with us and he does abode with those that believe. God bless

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    Default Re: Why Some Saints Will Not Leave At The Rapture

    Quote Originally Posted by Jackson123 View Post
    Luke 17

    33 Whosoever shall seek to save his life shall lose it; and whosoever shall lose his life shall preserve it.

    Jesus say whosoever shall seek to save his life shall lose it.

    i believe it mean that only who willing to die for Him consider Christian. It is not easy to be real Christian.
    If you read that verse by itself instead of in context, I can understand why you are reading it to mean it in that way.

    Try reading it in context.

    Luke 17:26 And as it was in the days of Noe, so shall it be also in the days of the Son of man. 27 They did eat, they drank, they married wives, they were given in marriage, until the day that Noah entered into the ark, and the flood came, and destroyed them all. 28 Likewise also as it was in the days of Lot; they did eat, they drank, they bought, they sold, they planted, they builded; 29 But the same day that Lot went out of Sodom it rained fire and brimstone from heaven, and destroyed them all. 30 Even thus shall it be in the day when the Son of man is revealed. 31 In that day, he which shall be upon the housetop, and his stuff in the house, let him not come down to take it away: and he that is in the field, let him likewise not return back. 32 Remember Lot's wife. 33 Whosoever shall seek to save his life shall lose it; and whosoever shall lose his life shall preserve it. 34 I tell you, in that night there shall be two men in one bed; the one shall be taken, and the other shall be left. 35 Two women shall be grinding together; the one shall be taken, and the other left. 36 Two men shall be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left.37 And they answered and said unto him, Where, Lord? And he said unto them, Wheresoever the body is, thither will the eagles be gathered together.

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    Default Re: Why Some Saints Will Not Leave At The Rapture

    Quote Originally Posted by Ahwatukee View Post
    I just love the way that you supported your claim with scripture. The Lord's promise to gather the church, stands!

    Below is the promise:

    "My Father’s house has many rooms; if that were not so, would I have told you that I am going there to prepare a place for you?And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come back and take you to be with me that you also may be where I am."

    And below is the detailed way in which the church will be gathered:

    "For the Lord himself will come down from heaven, with a loud command, with the voice of the archangel and with the trumpet call of God, and the dead in Christ will rise first. After that, we who are still alive and are left will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And so we will be with the Lord forever."

    And below are the major reasons why the church cannot go through God's coming wrath which follows the gathering of the church:

    "
    They tell how you turned to God from idols to serve the living and true God, and to wait for his Son from heaven, whom he raised from the dead—Jesus, who rescues us from the coming wrath."

    "
    But since we belong to the day, let us be sober, putting on faith and love as a breastplate, and the hope of salvation as a helmet. For God did not appoint us to suffer wrath but to receive salvation through our Lord Jesus Christ. "

    "
    Because you have kept the word of My patient endurance, I also will keep you out of the hour of the trial being about to come upon the whole inhabited world, to try those dwelling upon the earth."

    In John 14:1-3, Jesus that he was going to the Father's house (heaven) to prepare places for us and that he was going to come again and receive us to himself and take us back to the Father's house to those places that he prepared for us. Therefore, this promise must take place because the Lord said it.

    In addition, our being gathered must take place prior when God's wrath begins, which is initiated at the opening of the 1st seal, therefore, the church must be caught up prior to the 1st seal being opened.

    Also, Rev.19:6-8 shows the bride/church receiving her fine linen, white and clean at the wedding of the Lamb during the time of God's wrath upon the earth. Then in Rev.19:14, the bride/church is shown to be following the Lord out of heaven riding on white horses and wearing her fine linen.

    If you are not believing in and looking forward to the Lord's promise to return and gather his church, then it is you who have been deceived. I hope that you will reconsider and believe in the Lord.
    But there are conditions for why the saints would suffer His wrath. Below is about those who had received the knowledge that there is no more sacrifice for sins and yet sin willfully in practice as if there is as they do in the Mass and how some perform communion, believing Christ's Presence is in the sacraments for Catholics to receive the one time sacrifice for sins made present again or for Protestants to receive Him again, instead of doing communion in remembrance of Him.

    Hebrews 10:26 For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins, 27 But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries.28 He that despised Moses' law died without mercy under two or three witnesses: 29 Of how much sorer punishment, suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace? 30 For we know him that hath said, Vengeance belongeth unto me, I will recompense, saith the Lord. And again, The Lord shall judge his people.31 It is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God.

    So if saved believers do not repent from that practice, comeuppance will come from the Father. The living do rick being left behind when God comes to judge His House first.

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    Default Re: Why Some Saints Will Not Leave At The Rapture

    Quote Originally Posted by celib View Post
    The subject in 1Thess.4 is where are the dead, Paul explains those that have died are already in Heaven and there coming back with Christ when he returns in a big crowd [cloud] and we will meet him in our spiritual body [air], Christ will gather his elects and take them to Jerusalem to start judgment day, In Gods house are many abodes, thats us, he said he would return and abode with us and he does abode with those that believe. God bless
    The spirits of the saints that are deceased are in Heaven presently, but regarding the firstfruits of the resurrection, those that have died abiding in Him, will be resurrected a glorified celestial body liken unto the angels that can never die while the living abiding in Him will be changed & caught up with them that rise first to meet the Lord in the air.

    Those whom had died in unrepentant iniquity will be resurrected later on in being received as vessels unto dishonor in His House, but they are still presently with the Lord in Heaven. Those saints left behind that did not look to Jesus Christ in trusting Him as their Good Shepherd to help discern & depart from iniquity before the Bridegroom had come, will die and their spirits will be with the Lord in Heaven until they too are resurrected after the great tribulation in a glorified terrestrial body where only the second death has no power over them.

    Eventually, after Satan has been let loose from the pit and defeated one last time, death & hell will be cast into the lake of fire where death can no longer sting any one in the land of the living and live forever with the Lord.

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    Default Re: Why Some Saints Will Not Leave At The Rapture

    Quote Originally Posted by Enow View Post
    The spirits of the saints that are deceased are in Heaven presently, but regarding the firstfruits of the resurrection, those that have died abiding in Him, will be resurrected a glorified celestial body liken unto the angels that can never die while the living abiding in Him will be changed & caught up with them that rise first to meet the Lord in the air.

    Those whom had died in unrepentant iniquity will be resurrected later on in being received as vessels unto dishonor in His House, but they are still presently with the Lord in Heaven. Those saints left behind that did not look to Jesus Christ in trusting Him as their Good Shepherd to help discern & depart from iniquity before the Bridegroom had come, will die and their spirits will be with the Lord in Heaven until they too are resurrected after the great tribulation in a glorified terrestrial body where only the second death has no power over them.

    Eventually, after Satan has been let loose from the pit and defeated one last time, death & hell will be cast into the lake of fire where death can no longer sting any one in the land of the living and live forever with the Lord.
    Everyone that dies today goes to heaven on one side of the great gulf or the other, to be absent from your body is to be present with the Lord 2Co.5:6, the resurrection is not of the flesh, its from spiritually dead to spiritually alive, the first resurrection will be those who do not worship satan who will claim to be Christ when Christ returns, the second resurrection will be after the millinum at the great white throne judgment. When Christ returns we will ALL be changed into our celestial body in the twinkle of an eye 1Co.15:52. God bless

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    Default Re: Why Some Saints Will Not Leave At The Rapture

    Quote Originally Posted by celib View Post
    Everyone that dies today goes to heaven on one side of the great gulf or the other, to be absent from your body is to be present with the Lord 2Co.5:6, the resurrection is not of the flesh, its from spiritually dead to spiritually alive, the first resurrection will be those who do not worship satan who will claim to be Christ when Christ returns, the second resurrection will be after the millinum at the great white throne judgment. When Christ returns we will ALL be changed into our celestial body in the twinkle of an eye 1Co.15:52. God bless
    Christ's physical body was changed and He had risen from the grave.

    You do not get the dead rise in Christ first unless there is a physical resurrection for the dead as well.

    The celestial body will be able to eat & drink with Jesus in the Kingdom of God.

    Matthew 26:29 But I say unto you, I will not drink henceforth of this fruit of the vine, until that day when I drink it new with you in my Father's kingdom.

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    Default Re: Why Some Saints Will Not Leave At The Rapture

    Quote Originally Posted by shrume View Post
    Every Christian will participate in the rapture. Every Christian is born again of the gift of the Holy Spirit, a child of God, and a member of the church of the body of Christ. When Christ comes to gather his church, every single Christian on the planet, whether alive or dead, will participate. Christianity (when it became available to be born of the Holy Spirit) began on the day of Pentecost, and will end with the rapture. Jesus Christ never spoke to a Christian during his earthly ministry. Christians did not exist yet. It first became possible to become a Christian on the day of Pentecost, when the gift of the Holy Spirit was first poured out. There were obviously followers of Jesus before Pentecost, but there were no Christians (people born of the Holy Spirit). Having the gift of the Holy Spirit living in a person guarantees his salvation, and that will involve participating in the rapture of the Christian church, the marriage supper of the Lamb, and the millennial kingdom.

    It will not matter whether a Christian "wants" to leave or not. When Christ returns to gather his church, every Christian will go.

    Not sure if you saw this, Enow: 1:9 Whosoever revolteth, and continueth not in the doctrine of Christ, hath not God.
    No sir
    Not every believer is taken in the rapture.
    " ...pray that you be counted worthy..."
    The rapture is not a salvation issue. Those departing are saved but that is a gimme.

    The parable of the 10 virgins is a vivid picture of those unworthy.
    All were virgins. IOW CLEAN and undefiled (saved),but only half were worthy.

    Their unworthyness had to do with oil,not virginity
    Last edited by heartofdavid; 1 Week Ago at 11:49 AM.
    Enow likes this.

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