Universal Reconcilation

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Galatea

Guest
#1
Does anyone believe in universal reconciliation on this site? I know it is heresy to most people. If anyone believes in it and knows a lot about it, I would appreciate if someone would pm me. If we talk in a thread, it may be deleted as heresy. I am increasingly coming to this belief as it is the only thing that really makes sense.

Thanks
 
Apr 23, 2017
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#2
ooh oh!!!!!!!!! ive been in this camp too...... when i first joiend this website u see..... i got tricked by someone saying aion or aionios sometimes means like 3 days in a whale like it was with noah and so on, i let em have it afterwards when i found out ive been tricked u see, goes to show u cant let a novice use a lexicon its dangerous........ i know it sounds really good but it makes all the warnings null and void and is just wishful thinking..... human domesticated version of God.

but these scriptures really refute universalism and u can check out the greek through sister angela on this forum who knows greek or any greek scholar:

Matthew 25:46
And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal.

2 Thessalonians 1:8-9
In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ:
Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power;

Daniel 12:2
And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.

John 5:28-29
Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice, And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.

Revelation 20:15
And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

Matthew 7:21
Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.

Matthew 10:28
And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.
 

trofimus

Senior Member
Aug 17, 2015
10,684
794
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#3
While I can understand why somebody wants to belive in universal salvation of all creatures, I am afraid its almost impossible to get that from Scriptures.

You can make quite a good case for destruction instead of eternal conscious misery, though.
 
G

Galatea

Guest
#4
ooh oh!!!!!!!!! ive been in this camp too...... when i first joiend this website u see..... i got tricked by someone saying aion or aionios sometimes means like 3 days in a whale like it was with noah and so on, i let em have it afterwards when i found out ive been tricked u see, goes to show u cant let a novice use a lexicon its dangerous........ i know it sounds really good but it makes all the warnings null and void and is just wishful thinking..... human domesticated version of God.

but these scriptures really refute universalism and u can check out the greek through sister angela on this forum who knows greek or any greek scholar:

Matthew 25:46
And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal.

2 Thessalonians 1:8-9
In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ:
Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power;

Daniel 12:2
And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.

John 5:28-29
Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice, And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.

Revelation 20:15
And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

Matthew 7:21
Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.

Matthew 10:28
And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.
Thank you for taking the time to post, but I am looking forward to speaking to people who espouse the belief to tell me more, not for people who are against the belief.

There are just as many verses supporting universal reconciliation as those against, so cherry picking verses without a context is not very convincing.
 
G

Galatea

Guest
#5
While I can understand why somebody wants to belive in universal salvation of all creatures, I am afraid its almost impossible to get that from Scriptures.

You can make quite a good case for destruction instead of eternal conscious misery, though.
Thank you for posting. I was wondering if there was anyone here who believes in it, rather than people who are against it. I want to talk to advocates to learn more.
 
Apr 23, 2017
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#6
Thank you for taking the time to post, but I am looking forward to speaking to people who espouse the belief to tell me more, not for people who are against the belief.

There are just as many verses supporting universal reconciliation as those against, so cherry picking verses without a context is not very convincing.
ok........ i didnt overstand that sorry.

but yes sio i wasnt picking out of the context u see........ all universalist proof texts tend to be out of context..... like 1 tim 4:10.

have a good time here........... peace

edit: there maybe some universalist forums where u can find more like minded people u see.
 
G

Galatea

Guest
#7
ok........ i didnt overstand that sorry.

but yes sio i wasnt picking out of the context u see........ all universalist proof texts tend to be out of context..... like 1 tim 4:10.

have a good time here........... peace

edit: there maybe some universalist forums where u can find more like minded people u see.
This is unrelated, but you may want to change your avatar. I learned online that sloths are in a great deal of pain and discomfort when they are forced to take pictures with tourists. It is not a humane practice.

I have not studied universal reconciliation in depth, so I would like to know if anyone here knows much about it.
 

tourist

Senior Member
Mar 13, 2014
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#8
I don't know anything about this but have prayed for the salvation of everyone. It is my understanding that God hears and answers all prayer. Don't want anyone to go to hell, the thought of someone going there makes me sad. God also said that there will be no more tears in heaven. I really don't believe that He will simply wipe all of our memory away so that we won't know who is not in heaven with us. That's seems to be dishonest to me. I believe that our entire memory will be completely intact.
 

notuptome

Senior Member
May 17, 2013
15,050
2,538
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#9
There are just as many verses supporting universal reconciliation as those against, so cherry picking verses without a context is not very convincing.
This is where the wheels come off the train. In context there is no scriptural support for universal reconciliation.

For the cause of Christ
Roger
 
7

7seasrekeyed

Guest
#10
This is unrelated, but you may want to change your avatar. I learned online that sloths are in a great deal of pain and discomfort when they are forced to take pictures with tourists. It is not a humane practice.

I have not studied universal reconciliation in depth, so I would like to know if anyone here knows much about it.
as you state you do not know about universalism, how is it you can state there are just as many verses supporting it as there are for not supporting it?

you should have no problem finding information on this subject as the net is a fantastic resource and many there will be glad to help you sort out your views

I made it my business to study it when the book by Rob Bell came out years ago.
 
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G

Galatea

Guest
#11
as you state you do not know about universalism, how is it you can state there are just as many verses supporting it as there are for not supporting it?

you should have no problem finding information on this subject as the net is a fantastic resource and many there will be glad to help you sort out your views

I made it my business to study it when the book by Rob Bell came out years ago.
Sure, but I would like to talk to someone here if they also espouse the belief.

I don’t know who Rob Bell is.
 
Feb 7, 2015
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#12
It is interesting that Calvinists (Reformed) claim they don't believe in it. When, in effect, every one of their "elected ones" has supposedly been given Universal Salvation, right out of the gate, even before they ever knew there was a man named Jesus. Before they were born, even. They didn't have to believe, they were universally predestined for that status.

The Bible clearly states that Salvation is universally OFFERED to all men. As the Bible puts it, to "the world." However, the "Whosoever" attaches a very definite and identified caveat to that offer. And that is where the mistaken idea of "Total Universalism" is qualified........and, consequently, sort of falls apart.
 
Feb 7, 2015
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#13
Sure, but I would like to talk to someone here if they also espouse the belief.

I don’t know who Rob Bell is.
It's smarter not to even try to find out.
 

tourist

Senior Member
Mar 13, 2014
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#14
This is where the wheels come off the train. In context there is no scriptural support for universal reconciliation.

For the cause of Christ
Roger
The wheels are back on the train. The following scriptural support is as follows:

John 3:16God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life.

2 Peter 3:9
The Lord is not slack concerning His promise, as some men count slackness, but is longsuffering toward us, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.

1 Timothy 2:3-4
For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Savior, [SUP] [/SUP]who desires all men to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth.

Seems to me that God's will and desire to accomplish a purpose means that it will certainly happen.
 
7

7seasrekeyed

Guest
#15
Sure, but I would like to talk to someone here if they also espouse the belief.

I don’t know who Rob Bell is.

did you miss the part where I found it lacking in credibility for you to state there are just as many verses supporting it as not supporting it?

you may have missed it, so here it is again. no answer needed. just wondered why you would make such an obviously false statement

it doesn't matter if you don't know who Rob Bell is. look him up. you may want to read his book as he is a universalist
 
Feb 7, 2015
22,418
413
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#16
The wheels are back on the train. The following scriptural support is as follows:

John 3:16God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life.

2 Peter 3:9
The Lord is not slack concerning His promise, as some men count slackness, but is longsuffering toward us, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.

1 Timothy 2:3-4
For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Savior, [SUP] [/SUP]who desires all men to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth.

Seems to me that God's will and desire to accomplish a purpose means that it will certainly happen.
Jerry,
This got a big, "Yikes!" from Sue.
 

Magenta

Senior Member
Jul 3, 2015
55,248
25,719
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#17
Salvation is contingent upon repentance and belief, for without faith, it is impossible to please God. One must be born again of the Spirit of God, which the unbeliever does not experience, instead having their name blotted out of the Lamb's book of life, and thereafter passing into the second death, for the flesh counts for nothing. Jesus has overcome sin and death on our behalf, and holds to keys to life; in Him we live and move and have our being. Those who reject Him, relinquish any right to life through their renunciation of God.
 

DJ2

Senior Member
Apr 15, 2017
1,660
57
48
#18
Salvation is contingent upon repentance and belief, for without faith, it is impossible to please God. One must be born again of the Spirit of God, which the unbeliever does not experience, instead having their name blotted out of the Lamb's book of life, and thereafter passing into the second death, for the flesh counts for nothing. Jesus has overcome sin and death on our behalf, and holds to keys to life; in Him we live and move and have our being. Those who reject Him, relinquish any right to life through their renunciation of God.
This is the part that people do not understand about universal reconciliation. They believe that God will ultimately provide the faith/repentance needed to be reunited with Him regardless of who or what the circumstances.

Think of it as calvinism for all as opposed to the few.
 

notuptome

Senior Member
May 17, 2013
15,050
2,538
113
#19
The wheels are back on the train. The following scriptural support is as follows:

John 3:16God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life.

2 Peter 3:9
The Lord is not slack concerning His promise, as some men count slackness, but is longsuffering toward us, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.

1 Timothy 2:3-4
For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Savior, who desires all men to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth.

Seems to me that God's will and desire to accomplish a purpose means that it will certainly happen.
If you ignore the context you can make an impassioned but futile argument for universal reconciliation. Rome as promoted such through their purgatory doctrine but it is a false hope.

John 3:16 is followed by John 3:19-20. Men refuse to receive Christ and be saved.

2 Peter 3:9 is speaking about the coming of the Lord to bring the end of the age. Christ is coming to bring judgment not reconciliation when He returns.

1 Tim 2:3-4 Certainly proclaims that Christ has died for all and excluded none. Yet we see that men refuse to be saved. Men refuse not God.

Mt 23:37 O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, thou that killest the prophets, and stonest them which are sent unto thee, how often would I have gathered thy children together, even as a hen gathereth her chickens under her wings, and ye would not!

For the cause of Christ
Roger
 

tourist

Senior Member
Mar 13, 2014
41,243
16,252
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Tennessee
#20
If you ignore the context you can make an impassioned but futile argument for universal reconciliation. Rome as promoted such through their purgatory doctrine but it is a false hope.

John 3:16 is followed by John 3:19-20. Men refuse to receive Christ and be saved.

2 Peter 3:9 is speaking about the coming of the Lord to bring the end of the age. Christ is coming to bring judgment not reconciliation when He returns.

1 Tim 2:3-4 Certainly proclaims that Christ has died for all and excluded none. Yet we see that men refuse to be saved. Men refuse not God.

Mt 23:37 O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, thou that killest the prophets, and stonest them which are sent unto thee, how often would I have gathered thy children together, even as a hen gathereth her chickens under her wings, and ye would not!

For the cause of Christ
Roger
I would not instruct anyone that God is going to save everybody regardless of how evil they are.

You can only go to the Father through Jesus, and only those that know and love Him will be with Him for eternity.The bible does say however that God's will and desire is for no one to perish. It also says that there is a certain eternal punishment for those that remain unrepentant of their sins unto death.

I would say that there is more scriptural support for eternal punishment for those not saved by the shed blood of Jesus on the cross for their sins than a few verses that offer a glimmer of hope to those that are still alive and sick in their heart that they will never see an unsaved love one ever again, in this world and the next.

This hope may not be a blessed assured hope but certainly there may be a chance for redemption yet for those that have gone on to their eternal reward or punishment.