View Poll Results: Has all already been fulfilled by Messiah?

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    5 27.78%
  • No everything has not yet been fulfilled

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Thread: Has all already been fulfilled by Messiah?

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    Senior Member Hizikyah's Avatar
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    Default Has all already been fulfilled by Messiah?

    Luke 24:44-46, “And He said to them, “These are the words which I spoke to you while I was still with you, that all have to be fulfilled that were written in the Law, the Prophets and the Psalms concerning Me. Then He opened their minds to understand the Scriptures, and said to them, “Thus it has been written, and so it was necessary for the Messiah to suffer and to rise again from the dead the third day.”


    There are 2 "it is done" statements...

    Fulfilled already
    John 19:30, “So when
    יהושע took the sour wine He said, “It is done!” And bowing His head, He gave up His spirit.”

    Fulfilled already- To be fulfilled in the future

    1. Passover/First-fruits – Yahshua's Sacrifice(Passover), burial and resurrection (First Fruits – presenting Himself to YHWH)
    2. Feast of Unleavened Bread – Removal of sin by Yahshua's perfect work as the Passover Sacrifice
    3. Feast of Weeks – The blessing Holy Spirit of YHWH, coming into our lives stronger than ever

    4. Feast of Trumpets – Yahshua's return and gathering of the Saints
    5. Day of Atonement – Yahshua leads the army of YHWH to destroy evil rulers of this world and satan is chained for 1,000 years
    6. Feast of Tabernacles – Yahshua dwells on earth for 1,000 years teaching truth and righteousness
    7. The Last Great Day – satan is loosed and swiftly destroyed, the Kingdom of YHWH reigns forever


    To be fulfilled in the future
    Revelation 21:4-8, “And Yah shall wipe away every tear from their eyes, and there shall be no more death, nor mourning, nor crying. And there shall be no more pain, for the former matters have passed away. And He who was sitting on the throne said, “See, I make all matters new.” And He said to me, “Write, for these words are true and trustworthy. And He said to me, “It is done! I am the ‘Aleph’ and the ‘Taw’, the Beginning and the End. To the one who thirsts I shall give of the fountain of the water of life without payment. The one who overcomes shall inherit all this, and I shall be his Strength and he shall be My son. But as for the cowardly, and untrustworthy, and abominable, and murderers, and those who whore, and drug sorcerers, and idolaters, and all the false, their part is in the lake which burns with fire and sulphur, which is the second death.”



    Psalms 2:1-12, "2:1, "Why do the nations rage, And the peoples meditate emptiness? The sovereigns of the earth take their stand, And the rulers take counsel together, Against יהוה and against His Messiah, and say, Let us tear apart Their bonds, And throw away Their ropes from us.”"2:4, " He who is sitting in the heavens laughs, יהוה mocks at them. Then He speaks to them in His wrath, And troubles them in His rage, saying,"2:6, "“ But I, I have set My Sovereign on Tsiyon, My set-apart mountain. I inscribe for a law: יהוה has said to Me, ‘You are My Son, Today I have brought You forth. Ask of Me, and I make the nations Your inheritance, And the ends of the earth Your possession. Break them with a rod of iron, Dash them to pieces like a potter’s vessel. And now, be wise, O sovereigns; Be instructed, you rulers of the earth. Serve יהוה with fear, And rejoice with trembling. Kiss the Son lest He be enraged, And you perish in the way, For soon His wrath is to be kindled. Blessed are all those taking refuge in Him.”


    Daniel 7:21-22, “I was looking, and this horn was fighting against the set-apart ones, and was prevailing against them, until the Ancient of Days came, and right-ruling was given to the set-apart ones of the Most High, and the time came and the set-apart ones took possession of the reign.”

    Mat 5:18, "I say to you; Unless heaven and earth passes away, one yodh; the smallest of the letters will in no way pass from the Law, until all things are perfected."

    Revelation 21:1, "I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away."



    Mat 22:37-40, "Yahshua said to him: You must love YHWH your Father with all your heart, and with all your soul, and with all your might. (Deut 6:5) This is the first and greatest commandment. And the second is like it: You shall love your neighbor as yourself. (Lev 19:18) On these two commandments hang all the Law and the Prophets."


    Mat 24:35, “Heaven and earth may pass away, but My teachings will not pass away.”


    Luke 16:16-17, "The Law and the Prophets were until John, since that time the Kingdom of YHWH is preached, and every man is pressed to enter it. But it is easier for heaven and earth to pass, than one yodh of the Law to fail."


    Daniyl 7:25, "And he will speak great words against YHWH, and will wear out; mentally attack to cause to fall away, the saints of YHWH, and think to change times and Laws…"


    Revelation 21:1-2, “And I saw a renewed heaven and a renewed earth, for the former heaven and the former earth had passed away, and the sea is no more. And I, Yoḥanan, saw the set-apart city, renewed Yerushalayim, coming down out of the heaven from Yah, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.”


    Ezekiel 48:35, “All around: eighteen thousand cubits. And the name of the city from that day is: יהוה is there!”


    Matthew 5:17-19, “Do not think that I came to destroy the Torah or the Prophets. I did not come to destroy but to fulfill. For truly, I say to you, till the heaven and the earth pass away, one yod or one tittle shall by no means pass from the Torah till all be done. Whoever, then, breaks one of the least of these commands, and teaches men so, shall be called least in the reign of the heavens; but whoever does and teaches them, he shall be called great in the reign of the heavens.”


    Revelation 21:1, "I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away."


    Mat 24:35, “Heaven and earth may pass away, but My teachings will not pass away.”
    Studyman likes this.
    Mt5:18, "I say to you; Unless heaven and earth passes away, one yodh; the smallest of the letters will in no way pass from the Law, until all things are perfected."

    Rev21:1-2, "I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away."

    Rom3:28, "For we maintain that a person is justified by faith apart from the works of the Law."

    Rom3:31, "Are we then doing away with the Law through the faith? By no means! Rather, we establish the Law!"


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    Default Re: Has all already been fulfilled by Messiah?

    Rom3:31, "Are we then doing away with the Law through the faith? By no means! Rather, we establish the Law!"

    This is my understanding on this.

    Jesus fulfilled the Law perfectly on behalf of us. And we establish the Law by letting Him be expressed through our actions and speech. It is ALL ABOUT HIM. We are only the vessels.

    If we fail to do this in different ways, we are still saved and enjoy intimacy with Him. But we lose out on the blessings of seeing how He can be manifested through us.

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    Senior Member Hizikyah's Avatar
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    Default Re: Has all already been fulfilled by Messiah?

    Quote Originally Posted by Joidevivre View Post
    Rom3:31, "Are we then doing away with the Law through the faith? By no means! Rather, we establish the Law!"

    This is my understanding on this.

    Jesus fulfilled the Law perfectly on behalf of us. And we establish the Law by letting Him be expressed through our actions and speech. It is ALL ABOUT HIM. We are only the vessels.

    If we fail to do this in different ways, we are still saved and enjoy intimacy with Him. But we lose out on the blessings of seeing how He can be manifested through us.
    I would agree in that if His Spirit is not upon us we will not walk in His ways:

    1 John 3:24, “And the one guarding His commands stays in Him, and He in him. And by this we know that He stays in us, by the Spirit which He gave us.”


    John/Yahanan 15:5-16, "I am the vine, you are the branches. He who abides in Me, and I in him, produces much fruit; but without Me, you can do nothing. If anyone does not abide in Me, he is thrown away like a branch, and is withered; and they gather them and throw them into the fire, and they are burned. If you abide in Me, and letting My words; abide in you, you will ask what you will, and it will be done for you. In this is My Father glorified: when you produce much fruit; and in this way you become My disciples. Just as the Father has loved Me, so have I loved you; continue in My love. If you keep My Commands, you will abide in My love; just as I have kept My Father's Commands, and abide in His love. These things I have spoken to you, that My joy might remain in you, and that your joy might be complete. This is My Command: Love one another as I have loved you. Greater love has no one than this: that one would lay down his life on behalf of his brothers. You are My brothers, if you do whatever I command you."

    Yet we are still responsible for our actions:


    John 5:28-30, “Do not marvel at this, because the hour is coming in which all those in the tombs shall hear His voice, and shall come forth – those who have done righteousness, to the resurrection of life, and those who have practiced evil matters, to a resurrection of judgment. Of Myself I am unable to do any matter. As I hear, I judge, and My judgment is righteous, because I do not seek My own desire, but the desire of the Father who sent Me.”

    Matthew 12:50, “For whoever does the desire of My Father who is in the heavens is My brother and sister and mother.”


    Hebrews 4:12-13, “For the Word of Yah is living, and working, and sharper than any two-edged sword, cutting through even to the dividing of being and spirit, and of joints and marrow, and able to judge the thoughts and intentions of the heart. And there is no creature hidden from His sight, but all are naked and laid bare before the eyes of Him with whom is our account."

    The power and ability to abide in Him and Him in us is offered, we must hold fast IMO.
    Mt5:18, "I say to you; Unless heaven and earth passes away, one yodh; the smallest of the letters will in no way pass from the Law, until all things are perfected."

    Rev21:1-2, "I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away."

    Rom3:28, "For we maintain that a person is justified by faith apart from the works of the Law."

    Rom3:31, "Are we then doing away with the Law through the faith? By no means! Rather, we establish the Law!"


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    Default Re: Has all already been fulfilled by Messiah?

    yes everything has been fulfilled.
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    Default Re: Has all already been fulfilled by Messiah?

    Quote Originally Posted by Hizikyah View Post
    Luke 24:44-46, “And He said to them, “These are the words which I spoke to you while I was still with you, that all have to be fulfilled that were written in the Law, the Prophets and the Psalms concerning Me. Then He opened their minds to understand the Scriptures, and said to them, “Thus it has been written, and so it was necessary for the Messiah to suffer and to rise again from the dead the third day.”


    Fulfilled on the third day.



    There are 2 "it is done" statements...

    Fulfilled already
    John 19:30, “So when
    יהושע took the sour wine He said, “It is done!” And bowing His head, He gave up His spirit.”

    Fulfilled already.

    1. Passover/First-fruits – Yahshua's Sacrifice(Passover), burial and resurrection (First Fruits – presenting Himself to YHWH)
    2. Feast of Unleavened Bread – Removal of sin by Yahshua's perfect work as the Passover Sacrifice
    3. Feast of Weeks – The blessing Holy Spirit of YHWH, coming into our lives stronger than ever.


    Agreed. But also fulfilled already.

    4. Feast of Trumpets – He shall come as you have seen Him go

    5. Day of Atonement – God has made atonement for His people.

    6. Feast of Tabernacles – living water from HIM (John7.38-39).

    7. The Last Great Day of the Feast – out of His innermost being shall flow rivers of living water - the Holy Spirit



    willfollowsGod and Grandpa like this.

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    Default Re: Has all already been fulfilled by Messiah?

    Quote Originally Posted by Snoozy View Post
    yes everything has been fulfilled.
    Including all this:

    4. Feast of Trumpets – Yahshua's return and gathering of the Saints
    5. Day of Atonement – Yahshua leads the army of YHWH to destroy evil rulers of this world and satan is chained for 1,000 years
    6. Feast of Tabernacles – Yahshua dwells on earth for 1,000 years teaching truth and righteousness
    7. The Last Great Day – satan is loosed and swiftly destroyed, the Kingdom of YHWH reigns forever


    Revelation 21:4-8, “And Yah shall wipe away every tear from their eyes, and there shall be no more death, nor mourning, nor crying. And there shall be no more pain, for the former matters have passed away. And He who was sitting on the throne said, “See, I make all matters new.” And He said to me, “Write, for these words are true and trustworthy. And He said to me, “It is done! I am the ‘Aleph’ and the ‘Taw’, the Beginning and the End. To the one who thirsts I shall give of the fountain of the water of life without payment. The one who overcomes shall inherit all this, and I shall be his Strength and he shall be My son. But as for the cowardly, and untrustworthy, and abominable, and murderers, and those who whore, and drug sorcerers, and idolaters, and all the false, their part is in the lake which burns with fire and sulphur, which is the second death.”


    Isaiah 13:9, "See, the day of יהוה is coming, fierce, with wrath and heat of displeasure, to lay the earth waste, and destroy its sinners from it. For the stars of the heavens and their constellations do not give off their light. The sun shall be dark at its rising, and the moon not send out its light. And I shall punish the world for its evil, and the wrong for their crookedness, and shall put an end to the arrogance of the proud, and lay low the pride of the ruthless."


    Revelation 19:11-16, “And I saw the heaven opened, and there was a white horse. And He who sat on him was called Trustworthy and True, and in righteousness He judges and fights. And His eyes were as a flame of fire, and on His head were many crowns, having a Name that had been written, which no one had perceived except Himself – and having been dressed in a robe dipped in blood (Isaiah 63:2) and His Name is called: The Word of יהוה. And the armies in the heaven, dressed in fine linen, white and clean, followed Him on white horses. And out of His mouth goes a sharp sword, that with it He should smite the nations. And He shall shepherd them with a rod of iron. And He treads the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of the Almighty Strength. And on His robe and on His thigh He has a name written: SOVEREIGN OF SOVEREIGNS AND MASTER OF MASTERS.”

    Mattithyah 5:18, "For truly I say to you; Unless heaven and earth passes away, one yodh--the smallest of the letters will in no way pass from the Law, until all things are perfected."


    Revelation 21:1-2, "And I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away, and there was no more sea. And I, Yahanan, saw the holy city, New Yerusalem (YHWH Shammah), coming down from YHWH out of heaven, prepared as brides adorned for their husbands. And I heard a great voice out of heaven, saying: Behold, the tabernacle of YHWH is with men, and He will dwell with them, and they will be His people, and YHWH Himself will be with them, and be their Father.”
    Mt5:18, "I say to you; Unless heaven and earth passes away, one yodh; the smallest of the letters will in no way pass from the Law, until all things are perfected."

    Rev21:1-2, "I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away."

    Rom3:28, "For we maintain that a person is justified by faith apart from the works of the Law."

    Rom3:31, "Are we then doing away with the Law through the faith? By no means! Rather, we establish the Law!"


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    Default Re: Has all already been fulfilled by Messiah?

    Hiz - what you have always called 'law' which borders on works and is legalistic is what I call manifestations of Jesus through His body the church.

    To approach our being vessels for HIM is so much easier to understand. It invites - instead of demands.

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    Default Re: Has all already been fulfilled by Messiah?

    Quote Originally Posted by Joidevivre View Post
    Hiz - what you have always called 'law' which borders on works and is legalistic is what I call manifestations of Jesus through His body the church.

    To approach our being vessels for HIM is so much easier to understand. It invites - instead of demands.
    Agree, Also the law demands perfection. Where as the invitation forgives the fact we do not live up to the requirment.

    One is based on a demand no one can fulfill. The other is based on grace. And leads to obedience.
    Eternally Grateful for the grace God has shown a wretched soul such as myself.

    Rom 8:1 There is therefore now no condemnation to those who are in Christ Jesus,

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    Senior Member Hizikyah's Avatar
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    Default Re: Has all already been fulfilled by Messiah?

    Quote Originally Posted by Joidevivre View Post
    Hiz - what you have always called 'law' which borders on works and is legalistic is what I call manifestations of Jesus through His body the church.

    To approach our being vessels for HIM is so much easier to understand. It invites - instead of demands.
    First I want to say I love and respect you in Messiah I truly do, I have enjoyed many of your posts here and have a sincere care for those that truly seek Messiah.

    Ok so this is a rather long post, but I actually want to add more but Ill try to keep it short.The word demand does sound harsh, but is it not true that Yahshua Messiah/Jesus Christ demands things of us?

    Matthew 16:24-27, “Then יהושע said to His disciples, “If anyone wishes to come after Me, let him deny himself, and take up his stake, and follow Me. For whoever wishes to save his life shall lose it, and whoever loses his life for My sake shall find it. For what is a man profited if he gains all the world, and loses his own life? Or what shall a man give in exchange for his life? For the Son of Aḏam is going to come in the esteem of His Father with His messengers, and then He shall reward each according to his works.”



    John/Yahanan 10:27-30, "My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me. And I give them eternal life, and they will never perish; neither will any man snatch them out of My hand. My Father, Who gave them to Me, is greater than all; and no man is able to snatch them out of My Father's hand: I and My Father are in accord."


    John/Yahanan 12:48, "He who rejects Me, and does not follow My words has One Who judges him. The word that I have spoken, the same will be used to judge him in the last day."


    John 14:23-24, "יהושע answered him, “If anyone loves Me, he shall guard My Word. And My Father shall love him, and We shall come to him and make Our home with him. He who does not love Me does not guard My Words. And the Word which you hear is not Mine but of the Father Who sent Me.”



    Well I believe the view point is just that, a personal view. YHWH's Torah is actually His Instructions, it is supposed to be in the heart of the follower of Yahshua, those in the covenant ratified in His blood. Law is the common term used to translate but not true to it's real meaning. Law sounds all scary, Instructions sound more loving. WHen Yahshua sent His disciples out He gave them Instructions/Commands/Laws, however we word it, the content is the same but possibly our perception changs due to predisposition and common modern usage "the long arm of the law" type thing.

    Romans 7:12-14, “So that the Law truly is holy, and the command holy, and righteous, and good. Therefore, has that which is good become death to me? Let it not be! But the sin, that sin might be manifest, was working death in me through what is good, so that sin through the command might become an exceedingly great sinner. For we know that the Law is Spiritual, but I am fleshly, sold under sin."

    2 Corinthians 3:7-8, “But if the administering of death in letters, engraved on stones, was esteemed, so that the children of Yisra’yl were unable to look steadily at the face of Mosheh because of the esteem of his face, which was passing away, how much more esteemed shall the administering of the Spirit not be?”

    Is there ever a single time Yahshua/Jesus or any other writer of Scripture says the Law is bad an not to be followed?

    2 Peter/Kepha 3:15-17, "and reckon the patience of our Master as deliverance, as also our beloved brother Paul/Sha’ul wrote to you, according to the wisdom given to him, as also in all his letters, speaking in them concerning these matters, in which some are hard to understand, which those who are untaught and unstable twist to their own destruction, as they do also the other Scriptures. You, then, beloved ones, being forewarned, watch, lest you also fall from your own steadfastness, being led away with the delusion of the lawless, but grow in the favor and knowledge of our Master and Savior יהושע Messiah. To Him be the esteem both now and to a day that abides. Awmĕin.”

    If it is in the heart

    Hebrews 10:16, "This is the covenant that I will make with them after those days, says YHWH: I will put My Law into their hearts, and in their minds I will write them.”



    Isaiah 51:7, “Listen to Me, you who know righteousness, a people in whose heart is My Torah (Instructions/Law): do not fear the reproach of men, nor be afraid of their reviling.”

    I don't think it is demanding but rather a joy, liberty from the ways of the world if you will.

    Psalm 119:44-45, "That I might guard Your Law continually, Forever and ever; That I might walk in liberty, For I have sought Your orders;"


    James 1:22-25, “And become doers of the Word, and not hearers only, deceiving yourselves. Because if anyone is a hearer of the Word and not a doer, he is like a man who looks at his natural face in a mirror, for he looks at himself, and goes away, and immediately forgets what he was like. But he that looked into the perfect Law of liberty, and continues in it, not becoming a hearer that forgets, but a doer of work, this one shall be blessed in his doing.”


    James 2:8-12, “If you truly accomplish the sovereign Law according to the Scripture, “You shall love your neighbor as yourself, (Lev 19:18) you do well, but if you show partiality, you commit sin, being found guilty by the Law as transgressors. For whoever shall guard all the Law, and yet stumble in one point, he is guilty of all. For He who said, “Do not commit adultery,” (Exo 20:14) also said, “Do not murder.” (Exo 20:13) Now if you do not commit adultery, but you do murder, you have become a transgressor of Law. So speak and so do as those who are to be judged by the Law of liberty.”


    Psalm 19:7-11, “The Torah of יהוה is perfect, bringing back the being; The witness of יהוה is trustworthy, making wise the simple; The orders of יהוה are straight, rejoicing the heart; The command of יהוה is clear, enlightening the eyes; The fear of יהוה is clean, standing forever; The right-rulings of יהוה are true, They are righteous altogether, More desirable than gold, Than much fine gold; And sweeter than honey and the honeycomb. Also, Your servant is warned by them, In guarding them there is great reward.”

    Isaiah 5:20, “Woe to those who call evil good, and good evil; who put darkness for light, and light for darkness; who put bitter for sweet, and sweet for bitter!”

    Psalm 119:103-105, “How sweet to my taste has Your word been, More than honey to my mouth! From Your orders I get understanding; Therefore I have hated every false way. Your word is a lamp to my feet And a light to my path.”

    Psalm 119:142-145, “Your righteousness is righteousness forever, And Your Torah is truth. Distress and anguish have found me; Your commands are my delight. The righteousness of Your witnesses is forever; Make me understand, that I might live. I have called with all my heart; Answer me, O יהוה! I observe Your Laws.”

    Psalm 119:151-152, “You are near, O יהוה, And all Your commands are truth. Of old I have known Your witnesses, That You have founded them forever.”

    Psalm 119:164-167, “I have praised You seven times a day, Because of Your righteous right-rulings. Great peace have those loving Your Torah, And for them there is no stumbling-block. יהוה, I have waited for Your deliverance, And I have done Your commands. My being has guarded Your witnesses, And I love them exceedingly.”

    Psalm 119:169-174, “My cry comes before You, O יהוה ; Make me understand according to Your word. Let my prayer come before You; Deliver me according to Your word. My lips pour forth praise, For You teach me Your Laws. My tongue sings of Your word, For all Your commands are righteousness. Your hand is a help to me, For I have chosen Your orders. I have longed for Your deliverance, O יהוה, And Your Torah is my delight.”
    Mt5:18, "I say to you; Unless heaven and earth passes away, one yodh; the smallest of the letters will in no way pass from the Law, until all things are perfected."

    Rev21:1-2, "I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away."

    Rom3:28, "For we maintain that a person is justified by faith apart from the works of the Law."

    Rom3:31, "Are we then doing away with the Law through the faith? By no means! Rather, we establish the Law!"


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    Default Re: Has all already been fulfilled by Messiah?

    Quote Originally Posted by eternally-gratefull View Post
    Agree, Also the law demands perfection. Where as the invitation forgives the fact we do not live up to the requirment.

    One is based on a demand no one can fulfill. The other is based on grace. And leads to obedience.
    1 John 3:4, "Whoever commits sin, transgresses also the Law; for sin is the transgression of the Law."

    Romans 5:13, "For until the law sin was in the world: but sin is not imputed when there is no law."

    Romans, “6:1-2, "What shall we say then? Are we to continue in sin that grace may abound? By no means! How can we who died to sin still live in it?"

    1 John 1:8-10, "If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. If we confess our sins, He is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. If we say that we have not sinned, we make Him a liar, and His Word is not in us."

    1 John 2:1-2, "My little children, I write these things to you, so that you may not sin. And if anyone sins, we have an Advocate with the Father: Yahshua Messiah, the Righteous; and He is the sacrifice of atonement for our sins, and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world."
    Studyman likes this.
    Mt5:18, "I say to you; Unless heaven and earth passes away, one yodh; the smallest of the letters will in no way pass from the Law, until all things are perfected."

    Rev21:1-2, "I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away."

    Rom3:28, "For we maintain that a person is justified by faith apart from the works of the Law."

    Rom3:31, "Are we then doing away with the Law through the faith? By no means! Rather, we establish the Law!"


  11. #11
    Senior Member Hizikyah's Avatar
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    Default Re: Has all already been fulfilled by Messiah?

    Quote Originally Posted by valiant View Post
    Fulfilled on the third day.[/SIZE][/FONT]


    There are 2 "it is done" statements...

    Fulfilled already
    John 19:30, “So when
    יהושע took the sour wine He said, “It is done!” And bowing His head, He gave up His spirit.”



    Agreed. But also fulfilled already.[/COLOR]
    4. Feast of Trumpets – He shall come as you have seen Him go

    5. Day of Atonement – God has made atonement for His people.

    6. Feast of Tabernacles – living water from HIM (John7.38-39).

    7. The Last Great Day of the Feast – out of His innermost being shall flow rivers of living water - the Holy Spirit



    So you beleive

    Feast of Trumpets – He shall come as you have seen Him go

    Day of Atonement – God has made atonement for His people.

    Feast of Tabernacles – living water from HIM (John7.38-39).

    The Last Great Day of the Feast

    are all aready fulfilled and finished?

    when did this happen?:

    4. Feast of Trumpets (Yom Teruah) – Yahshua's return, the resurrection/transformation of the elect.


    1 Corinthians 15:51-55, “See, I speak a secret to you: We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed, in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed. For this corruptible has to put on incorruption, and this mortal to put on immortality. And when this corruptible has put on incorruption, and this mortal has put on immortality, then shall come to be the word that has been written, “Death is swallowed up in overcoming. O Death, where is your sting? O grave, where is your overcoming?”


    Mat 24:29-31, “And immediately after the tribulation of those days the sun shall be darkened, and the moon shall not give its light, and the stars shall fall from the heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken. And then the sign of the Son of Aḏam shall appear in the heaven, and then all the tribes of the earth shall mourn, and they shall see the Son of Aḏam coming on the clouds of the heaven with power and much esteem. And He shall send His messengers with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together His chosen ones from the four winds, from one end of the heavens to the other.”
    Mt5:18, "I say to you; Unless heaven and earth passes away, one yodh; the smallest of the letters will in no way pass from the Law, until all things are perfected."

    Rev21:1-2, "I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away."

    Rom3:28, "For we maintain that a person is justified by faith apart from the works of the Law."

    Rom3:31, "Are we then doing away with the Law through the faith? By no means! Rather, we establish the Law!"


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    Senior Member eternally-gratefull's Avatar
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    Default Re: Has all already been fulfilled by Messiah?

    Quote Originally Posted by Hizikyah View Post
    1 John 3:4, "Whoever commits sin, transgresses also the Law; for sin is the transgression of the Law."

    Romans 5:13, "For until the law sin was in the world: but sin is not imputed when there is no law."

    Romans, “6:1-2, "What shall we say then? Are we to continue in sin that grace may abound? By no means! How can we who died to sin still live in it?"

    1 John 1:8-10, "If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. If we confess our sins, He is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. If we say that we have not sinned, we make Him a liar, and His Word is not in us."

    1 John 2:1-2, "My little children, I write these things to you, so that you may not sin. And if anyone sins, we have an Advocate with the Father: Yahshua Messiah, the Righteous; and He is the sacrifice of atonement for our sins, and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world."
    So you do not know what sin is?

    And by the way, Yioyu can keep the law 100% and still sin. DO you know how?

    Eternally Grateful for the grace God has shown a wretched soul such as myself.

    Rom 8:1 There is therefore now no condemnation to those who are in Christ Jesus,

  13. #13
    Senior Member Hizikyah's Avatar
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    Default Re: Has all already been fulfilled by Messiah?

    Quote Originally Posted by eternally-gratefull View Post
    So you do not know what sin is?

    And by the way, Yioyu can keep the law 100% and still sin. DO you know how?

    Sin is tr5ansgression of YHWH's Law, none are sinless. This does not mean we ignore His instructions. also this is not the point of this thread, I don;t really want to get into this deabte here especially when I post a verse that says what sin is and you reply asking/implying that I don't know what sin is. If you read my reply you would see that answer is in that post.
    Mt5:18, "I say to you; Unless heaven and earth passes away, one yodh; the smallest of the letters will in no way pass from the Law, until all things are perfected."

    Rev21:1-2, "I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away."

    Rom3:28, "For we maintain that a person is justified by faith apart from the works of the Law."

    Rom3:31, "Are we then doing away with the Law through the faith? By no means! Rather, we establish the Law!"


  14. #14
    Senior Member eternally-gratefull's Avatar
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    Default Re: Has all already been fulfilled by Messiah?

    Quote Originally Posted by Hizikyah View Post
    Sin is tr5ansgression of YHWH's Law, none are sinless. This does not mean we ignore His instructions. also this is not the point of this thread, I don;t really want to get into this deabte here especially when I post a verse that says what sin is and you reply asking/implying that I don't know what sin is. If you read my reply you would see that answer is in that post.

    Again i ask. Do you know what sin is?

    yes, sin is transgression of the law. I am not debating that. Sin is also we are told knowing to do right and not doing it.
    Sin is more than just transgressing the law. Built that was not my question.

    Do you not know what sin is?
    Eternally Grateful for the grace God has shown a wretched soul such as myself.

    Rom 8:1 There is therefore now no condemnation to those who are in Christ Jesus,

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    Senior Member Hizikyah's Avatar
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    Default Re: Has all already been fulfilled by Messiah?

    Quote Originally Posted by eternally-gratefull View Post
    Again i ask. Do you know what sin is?

    yes, sin is transgression of the law. I am not debating that. Sin is also we are told knowing to do right and not doing it.
    Sin is more than just transgressing the law. Built that was not my question.

    Do you not know what sin is?
    Sin is transgression of YHWH's Law. It seems you keep angling to find a standard of right and wrong out side of what the Creator says. You will see the word "kalos" used in Jeams 4:17 and in describing the Law of YHWH:

    James 4:17, "To him, then, who knows to do right and does not do it, to him it is sin."

    right” is word #G2570 καλός kalos (ka-los') adj., 1. (properly) beautiful., 2. (chiefly, figuratively) good., 3. (literally) valuable., 4. (morally) virtuous.. {for appearance or use, and thus distinguished from G18, which is properly intrinsic}, [of uncertain affinity], KJV: X better, fair, good(-ly), honest, meet, well, worthy, Compare: G18




    Romans 7:16, "But if I do what I do not wish, I agree with the Torah that it is right."

    right” is word #G2570 καλός kalos (ka-los') adj., 1. (properly) beautiful., 2. (chiefly, figuratively) good., 3. (literally) valuable., 4. (morally) virtuous.. {for appearance or use, and thus distinguished from G18, which is properly intrinsic}, [of uncertain affinity], KJV: X better, fair, good(-ly), honest, meet, well, worthy, Compare: G18




    1 Timothy 1:8, "And we know that the Torah is right if one uses it legitimately."


    right” is word #G2570 καλός kalos (ka-los') adj., 1. (properly) beautiful., 2. (chiefly, figuratively) good., 3. (literally) valuable., 4. (morally) virtuous.. {for appearance or use, and thus distinguished from G18, which is properly intrinsic}, [of uncertain affinity], KJV: X better, fair, good(-ly), honest, meet, well, worthy, Compare: G18

    So I ask you what is kalos or good/right? Is the Law not
    kalos or good/right?


    Romans 7:12-14, “So that the Law truly is holy, and the command holy, and righteous, and good. Therefore, has that which is good become death to me? Let it not be! But the sin, that sin might be manifest, was working death in me through what is good, so that sin through the command might become an exceedingly great sinner. For we know that the Law is Spiritual, but I am fleshly, sold under sin."


    2 Corinthians 3:7-8, “But if the administering of death in letters, engraved on stones, was esteemed, so that the children of Yisra’yl were unable to look steadily at the face of Mosheh because of the esteem of his face, which was passing away, how much more esteemed shall the administering of the Spirit not be?”


    2 Peter/Kepha 3:15-17, "and reckon the patience of our Master as deliverance, as also our beloved brother Paul/Sha’ul wrote to you, according to the wisdom given to him, as also in all his letters, speaking in them concerning these matters, in which some are hard to understand, which those who are untaught and unstable twist to their own destruction, as they do also the other Scriptures. You, then, beloved ones, being forewarned, watch, lest you also fall from your own steadfastness, being led away with the delusion of the lawless, but grow in the favor and knowledge of our Master and Savior יהושע Messiah. To Him be the esteem both now and to a day that abides. Awmĕin.”
    Mt5:18, "I say to you; Unless heaven and earth passes away, one yodh; the smallest of the letters will in no way pass from the Law, until all things are perfected."

    Rev21:1-2, "I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away."

    Rom3:28, "For we maintain that a person is justified by faith apart from the works of the Law."

    Rom3:31, "Are we then doing away with the Law through the faith? By no means! Rather, we establish the Law!"


  16. #16
    Senior Member eternally-gratefull's Avatar
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    Default Re: Has all already been fulfilled by Messiah?

    Quote Originally Posted by Hizikyah View Post
    Sin is transgression of YHWH's Law. It seems you keep angling to find a standard of right and wrong out side of what the Creator says. You will see the word "kalos" used in Jeams 4:17 and in describing the Law of YHWH:

    James 4:17, "To him, then, who knows to do right and does not do it, to him it is sin."

    right” is word #G2570 καλός kalos (ka-los') adj., 1. (properly) beautiful., 2. (chiefly, figuratively) good., 3. (literally) valuable., 4. (morally) virtuous.. {for appearance or use, and thus distinguished from G18, which is properly intrinsic}, [of uncertain affinity], KJV: X better, fair, good(-ly), honest, meet, well, worthy, Compare: G18




    Romans 7:16, "But if I do what I do not wish, I agree with the Torah that it is right."

    right” is word #G2570 καλός kalos (ka-los') adj., 1. (properly) beautiful., 2. (chiefly, figuratively) good., 3. (literally) valuable., 4. (morally) virtuous.. {for appearance or use, and thus distinguished from G18, which is properly intrinsic}, [of uncertain affinity], KJV: X better, fair, good(-ly), honest, meet, well, worthy, Compare: G18




    1 Timothy 1:8, "And we know that the Torah is right if one uses it legitimately."


    right” is word #G2570 καλός kalos (ka-los') adj., 1. (properly) beautiful., 2. (chiefly, figuratively) good., 3. (literally) valuable., 4. (morally) virtuous.. {for appearance or use, and thus distinguished from G18, which is properly intrinsic}, [of uncertain affinity], KJV: X better, fair, good(-ly), honest, meet, well, worthy, Compare: G18

    So I ask you what is kalos or good/right? Is the Law not
    kalos or good/right?


    Romans 7:12-14, “So that the Law truly is holy, and the command holy, and righteous, and good. Therefore, has that which is good become death to me? Let it not be! But the sin, that sin might be manifest, was working death in me through what is good, so that sin through the command might become an exceedingly great sinner. For we know that the Law is Spiritual, but I am fleshly, sold under sin."


    2 Corinthians 3:7-8, “But if the administering of death in letters, engraved on stones, was esteemed, so that the children of Yisra’yl were unable to look steadily at the face of Mosheh because of the esteem of his face, which was passing away, how much more esteemed shall the administering of the Spirit not be?”


    2 Peter/Kepha 3:15-17, "and reckon the patience of our Master as deliverance, as also our beloved brother Paul/Sha’ul wrote to you, according to the wisdom given to him, as also in all his letters, speaking in them concerning these matters, in which some are hard to understand, which those who are untaught and unstable twist to their own destruction, as they do also the other Scriptures. You, then, beloved ones, being forewarned, watch, lest you also fall from your own steadfastness, being led away with the delusion of the lawless, but grow in the favor and knowledge of our Master and Savior יהושע Messiah. To Him be the esteem both now and to a day that abides. Awmĕin.”
    This is why people get frustrated with youy my friend. I asked you a question, looking for a yes or no answer, and you keep posting the same answer,. Even after I said that was not what I was asking.

    I asked you, Do you know what sin is. The correct answer would be yes or no.

    Again, Do you know what sin is, Do you know that adultry is a sin? Do you know that bearing false witness is a sin, DO you know that coveting is a sin? DO you know that not loving God is a sin?

    I do not need bible verses, I know the word of God. I am asking you, Hizekya, do you know what sin is..


    Eternally Grateful for the grace God has shown a wretched soul such as myself.

    Rom 8:1 There is therefore now no condemnation to those who are in Christ Jesus,

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    Default Re: Has all already been fulfilled by Messiah?

    Quote Originally Posted by eternally-gratefull View Post
    So you do not know what sin is?

    And by the way, Yioyu can keep the law 100% and still sin. DO you know how?

    You seem to be talking in Circles here EG,

    You say it is impossible to obey God without the Holy Spirit, and I agree. You say God's Commandments are not made for the Christian, which I disagree of course.

    But now you say you can keep the Commandments of God 100% and be guilty of Transgression of God's Commandments.

    How can His Spirit provide the Spiritual help necessary to meet the righteous requirements of the Law, and yet condemn us for following this same Spirit?

    Whose judgment are you using?
    Hizikyah and LoveGodForever like this.

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    Default Re: Has all already been fulfilled by Messiah?

    Quote Originally Posted by eternally-gratefull View Post
    This is why people get frustrated with youy my friend. I asked you a question, looking for a yes or no answer, and you keep posting the same answer,. Even after I said that was not what I was asking.

    I asked you, Do you know what sin is. The correct answer would be yes or no.

    Again, Do you know what sin is, Do you know that adultry is a sin? Do you know that bearing false witness is a sin, DO you know that coveting is a sin? DO you know that not loving God is a sin?

    I do not need bible verses, I know the word of God. I am asking you, Hizekya, do you know what sin is..


    He posted God's Definition of sin. What more is there?

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    Senior Member Hizikyah's Avatar
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    Default Re: Has all already been fulfilled by Messiah?

    Quote Originally Posted by eternally-gratefull View Post
    This is why people get frustrated with youy my friend. I asked you a question, looking for a yes or no answer, and you keep posting the same answer,. Even after I said that was not what I was asking.

    I asked you, Do you know what sin is. The correct answer would be yes or no.

    Again, Do you know what sin is, Do you know that adultry is a sin? Do you know that bearing false witness is a sin, DO you know that coveting is a sin? DO you know that not loving God is a sin?

    I do not need bible verses, I know the word of God. I am asking you, Hizekya, do you know what sin is..


    I answered this like 3 or 4 times. Yes. and transgression of the Law is sin, adultery is transgression of the Law, murer is transgression of the Law, coveting is transgression of the Law, not honoring father and mother is transgression of the Law. This is in line with everythign I have been saying. You just claim it is not answered, or possible desire a simple answer so you may then add you own view to my words, I would rather give a bit of a fuller explanation to make my view sure.
    LoveGodForever likes this.
    Mt5:18, "I say to you; Unless heaven and earth passes away, one yodh; the smallest of the letters will in no way pass from the Law, until all things are perfected."

    Rev21:1-2, "I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away."

    Rom3:28, "For we maintain that a person is justified by faith apart from the works of the Law."

    Rom3:31, "Are we then doing away with the Law through the faith? By no means! Rather, we establish the Law!"


  20. #20
    Senior Member eternally-gratefull's Avatar
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    Default Re: Has all already been fulfilled by Messiah?

    Quote Originally Posted by Hizikyah View Post
    I answered this like 3 or 4 times. Yes. and transgression of the Law is sin, adultery is transgression of the Law, murer is transgression of the Law, coveting is transgression of the Law, not honoring father and mother is transgression of the Law. This is in line with everythign I have been saying. You just claim it is not answered, or possible desire a simple answer so you may then add you own view to my words, I would rather give a bit of a fuller explanation to make my view sure.

    Sorry that was for another thread. My bad, We can move it to there and not derail this thread, which is about covenants.
    Eternally Grateful for the grace God has shown a wretched soul such as myself.

    Rom 8:1 There is therefore now no condemnation to those who are in Christ Jesus,

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