The Grace Revolution and The Word of Faith

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Sep 3, 2016
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And we know that all things work together for good to those who love God, to those who are the called according to His purpose.
Romans 8:28[/TD]
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[TD="class: yiv4635002068mcnTextContent, align: left"] - DECEMBER 6 -
GOD MAKES ALL THINGS WORK TOGETHER FOR GOOD


[HR][/HR]
In this verse, “all things” is literally all things—the good, the bad and the ugly! Now, it does not mean that all things are from God. Some things, such as accidents, sicknesses, and broken relationships are not from Him. They are part of the fallen world that we live in. But what this verse does tell us is that “all things work together for good to those who love God, to those who are the called according to His purpose”. That is our inheritance as God’s beloved children.
Do the people of the world have this inheritance? No. When bad things happen to them, they are what they are—bad things. But when bad things happen to the children of God, it does not end there. God can make those bad things work together for good. In other words, the devil may throw lemons at you, but God can take those lemons and make refreshing lemonade for you!
For example, if you have been retrenched, believe that God, who makes all things work together for good, has a better job for you. Indeed, we have received testimonies from church members who have ended up with better jobs and higher salaries after they were retrenched.
It is important you remember that God is not behind anything bad or ugly. But when those things happen, know that He can make all things work together for good. And don’t let anyone tell you that all things will work together for good only if you love God and are called according to His purpose. These two things are not conditions but descriptions of believers. Believers are those who love God because they know that God first loved them. (1 John 4:19) And they are called according to His purpose for they have been born again and belong to Him.
My friend, because you have been born again, all things in your life will work together for good. This is your inheritance as a beloved child of God!

Your thoughts on this doctrine.


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Sep 3, 2016
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#2
Q: Did Jesus go to hell?


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A:

After the crucifixion, Jesus’ body was placed in a tomb, and His Spirit went to hell. There Jesus suffered all the torments of hell that we would have suffered. Jesus’ submission to death was complete. He experienced it to the ultimate degree so mankind would never have to be punished (2 Corinthians 5:21).
What a surprise the enemy received! The enemy thought he’d won the victory when Jesus came to hell. What he failed to understand was that hell could not hold the righteous Son of God! Jesus, who embodied the sinless nature of His Father God, had committed no sin. So He was not deserving of punishment. Satan, death and hell could not hold Him (Acts 2:24). The Spirit of God resurrected Jesus from hell and the grave by the power of God.
Satan, who thought he was the conqueror, became the conquered. Jesus became victorious over sin, hell and death (Revelation 1:18). Once Jesus completed the job He had to do, there was nothing hell could do to keep Him (Acts 2:31). Jesus stripped Satan of his power over death (Hebrews 2:14-15). Now we can accept Jesus as our Lord and Savior, and live with God for eternity, never to be separated from Him again!

Kenneth Copeland Ministries

The 'Jesus Died Spiritually' Doctrine of the Word Faith
.

Your thoughts please.




 
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7

7seasrekeyed

Guest
#3
Your thoughts please.
bold move

Prince AND Copeland at the same time

 

Dino246

Senior Member
Jun 30, 2015
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#4
The first post disregards the verses stating that God also causes calamity and sends wrath. Not terrible for an inspiring devotional, but thin on sound exegesis.

The second post is unbiblical speculation.

(drops mic)
 
Apr 23, 2017
1,064
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#5
Jesus didnt go to hell.......... sounds like a mistake u see.
 

Jimbone

Senior Member
Aug 22, 2014
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#6
I would like to see the scripture that says that Jesus Spirit went to hell. I don't know where it says that. "Hell" does not dish out our "ultimate justice" or punishment, God does. God crushed His blameless Son on the Cross, Jesus lay His life down, but it says in Isaiah 53:10&11
10But the LORD was pleased To crush Him, putting Him to grief; If He would render Himself as a guilt offering, He will see His offspring, He will prolong His days, And the good pleasure of the LORD will prosper in His hand. 11As a result of the anguish of His soul, He will see it and be satisfied; By His knowledge the Righteous One, My Servant, will justify the many, As He will bear their iniquities.

that it pleased the father to crush Him so we might be saved, it says as a RESULT of the anguish of His soul, the Fathers soul He will be satisfied, His justice, our deserved penelty for our sin was all satisfied. Just WOW really.:eek: That is the glory of our God, a God that knows we are fallen and incapable of coming to Him, He steps into His creation, fulfills the law, lays His life down to take the righteous wrath of Gods justice so that He could save and redeem a hopeless and fallen world. He is our hope, our ONLY hope in all it's glory, and I praise His name and stand in awe of His nature, but I do not see anywhere that His word tells me Jesus soul went to hell. I don't mean this in an arrogant way and I am more than willing to hear you out on how you came to this conclusion, but as far as scripture, can you show me where you understand it to say Jesus went to hell?Thanks and God bless.
 

notuptome

Senior Member
May 17, 2013
15,050
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#7
So Jesus took upon Himself our sin. What did Jesus do with our sin? Is our sin deposited in the depths of hell?

For the cause of Christ
Roger
 

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
24,167
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#8
I would like to see the scripture that says that Jesus Spirit went to hell.
It is unfortunate that the KJV used the word "hell" for Hades. Christ's soul and spirit did go to Hades for three days and three nights. But that was AFTER He finished His work of redemption on the Cross.

Because thou wilt not leave my soul in hell [Hades], neither wilt thou suffer thine Holy One to see corruption. (Acts 2:27).
 
Apr 23, 2017
1,064
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#9
It is unfortunate that the KJV used the word "hell" for Hades. Christ's soul and spirit did go to Hades for three days and three nights. But that was AFTER He finished His work of redemption on the Cross.

Because thou wilt not leave my soul in hell [Hades], neither wilt thou suffer thine Holy One to see corruption. (Acts 2:27).
?!?!?!??! WOW?!?!?!? i thought u were a kjvonly guy u see?????? someone mark this moment down in history u see
 

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
24,167
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#10
?!?!?!??! WOW?!?!?!? i thought u were a kjvonly guy u see?????? someone mark this moment down in history u see
I have always maintained that the KJV is the most trustworthy and faithful translation in English. I have never suggested that some changes could not be beneficial. And the King James 2000 has made the appropriate change.

King James 2000 Bible
Because you will not leave my soul in hades, neither will you allow your Holy One to see corruption.

What is unconscionable is for preachers and teachers to be lazy, and not search out the words to understand what the Bible is saying before they broadcast their false doctrines.
 
Nov 12, 2017
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#11
I would like to see the scripture that says that Jesus Spirit went to hell. I don't know where it says that.
Jesus Christ did descend into hades. But it was not for punishment. It was to declare his victory, to empty out paradise and bring all the OT saints to heaven. The Lord Jesus Christ's victory and being true humanity now opened up heaven to humanity.

Eph 4
8
Therefore it says,
“WHEN HE ASCENDED ON HIGH,
HE LED CAPTIVE A HOST OF CAPTIVES,
AND HE GAVE GIFTS TO MEN.”
9(Now this expression, “He ascended,” what does it mean except that He also had descended into the lower parts of the earth? 10He who descended is Himself also He who ascended far above all the heavens, so that He might fill all things.)
 
Nov 6, 2017
674
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#12
It is unfortunate that the KJV used the word "hell" for Hades. Christ's soul and spirit did go to Hades for three days and three nights. But that was AFTER He finished His work of redemption on the Cross.

Because thou wilt not leave my soul in hell [Hades], neither wilt thou suffer thine Holy One to see corruption. (Acts 2:27).



Psalm 16:10
For You will not abandon my soul to Sheol; Nor will You allow Your Holy One to undergo decay.

You are very correct.
 

Jimbone

Senior Member
Aug 22, 2014
2,694
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#13
Jesus Christ did descend into hades. But it was not for punishment. It was to declare his victory, to empty out paradise and bring all the OT saints to heaven. The Lord Jesus Christ's victory and being true humanity now opened up heaven to humanity.

Eph 4
8
Therefore it says,
“WHEN HE ASCENDED ON HIGH,
HE LED CAPTIVE A HOST OF CAPTIVES,
AND HE GAVE GIFTS TO MEN.”
9(Now this expression, “He ascended,” what does it mean except that He also had descended into the lower parts of the earth? 10He who descended is Himself also He who ascended far above all the heavens, so that He might fill all things.)
I honestly take this to mean that God "descended" onto earth, I see it says the "lower parts of the earth", but I couldn't find anyone that names this "Hell", I think it just means earth, I don't see at all where is says anything about Jesus suffering in Hell for our sins. I still don't see it.
 

joaniemarie

Senior Member
Jan 4, 2017
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303
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#14
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And we know that all things work together for good to those who love God, to those who are the called according to His purpose.
Romans 8:28[/TD]
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[TD="class: yiv4635002068mcnTextContent, align: left"] - DECEMBER 6 -
GOD MAKES ALL THINGS WORK TOGETHER FOR GOOD


[HR][/HR]
In this verse, “all things” is literally all things—the good, the bad and the ugly! Now, it does not mean that all things are from God. Some things, such as accidents, sicknesses, and broken relationships are not from Him. They are part of the fallen world that we live in. But what this verse does tell us is that “all things work together for good to those who love God, to those who are the called according to His purpose”. That is our inheritance as God’s beloved children.
Do the people of the world have this inheritance? No. When bad things happen to them, they are what they are—bad things. But when bad things happen to the children of God, it does not end there. God can make those bad things work together for good. In other words, the devil may throw lemons at you, but God can take those lemons and make refreshing lemonade for you!
For example, if you have been retrenched, believe that God, who makes all things work together for good, has a better job for you. Indeed, we have received testimonies from church members who have ended up with better jobs and higher salaries after they were retrenched.
It is important you remember that God is not behind anything bad or ugly. But when those things happen, know that He can make all things work together for good. And don’t let anyone tell you that all things will work together for good only if you love God and are called according to His purpose. These two things are not conditions but descriptions of believers. Believers are those who love God because they know that God first loved them. (1 John 4:19) And they are called according to His purpose for they have been born again and belong to Him.
My friend, because you have been born again, all things in your life will work together for good. This is your inheritance as a beloved child of God!

Your thoughts on this doctrine.


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Thank you MOTC., Nice to see someone else post one of JP devotionals because I really like his preaching and teaching. I totally agree with this post. We can't make ourselves more righteous than we already have been made IN Christ when we first got saved. Righteousness is a free gift only Christ Jesus can give. Amen!
 

BenFTW

Senior Member
Oct 7, 2012
4,834
981
113
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#15
The first post disregards the verses stating that God also causes calamity and sends wrath. Not terrible for an inspiring devotional, but thin on sound exegesis.

The second post is unbiblical speculation.

(drops mic)
That would be judgement though, and that doesn't negate that God does make all things work together for our good, those called according to His purposes. I also would be very careful of declaring certain calamities "acts of God" as that is defamatory and near blasphemy, attributing evil to God when a nation, for example, is hit by a tsunami (causing many deaths and suffering). It is better to be silent on this matter than risk defaming God. More often than not I bet the Lord is like, "Why are you blaming me?"
 

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
24,167
12,764
113
#16
I honestly take this to mean that God "descended" onto earth, I see it says the "lower parts of the earth", but I couldn't find anyone that names this "Hell"
Jesus Himself said that He would descend into "the heart of the earth" (the lower parts of the earth). Sheol/Hades is within the core of the earth.

For as Jonas was three days and three nights in the whale's belly; so shall the Son of man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth. (Mt 12:40).
I think it just means earth, I don't see at all where is says anything about Jesus suffering in Hell for our sins. I still don't see it.
No it does not just mean earth. And yes, Christ was in Sheol/Hades proclaiming ("preaching") His victory on the Cross to the spirits in prison. It was also necessary for Him to be there to take all the OT saints with Him To Heaven, "when He ascended up on high".
 

joaniemarie

Senior Member
Jan 4, 2017
3,198
303
83
#17
Q: Did Jesus go to hell?


  • Facebook Twitter More



A:

After the crucifixion, Jesus’ body was placed in a tomb, and His Spirit went to hell. There Jesus suffered all the torments of hell that we would have suffered. Jesus’ submission to death was complete. He experienced it to the ultimate degree so mankind would never have to be punished (2 Corinthians 5:21).
What a surprise the enemy received! The enemy thought he’d won the victory when Jesus came to hell. What he failed to understand was that hell could not hold the righteous Son of God! Jesus, who embodied the sinless nature of His Father God, had committed no sin. So He was not deserving of punishment. Satan, death and hell could not hold Him (Acts 2:24). The Spirit of God resurrected Jesus from hell and the grave by the power of God.
Satan, who thought he was the conqueror, became the conquered. Jesus became victorious over sin, hell and death (Revelation 1:18). Once Jesus completed the job He had to do, there was nothing hell could do to keep Him (Acts 2:31). Jesus stripped Satan of his power over death (Hebrews 2:14-15). Now we can accept Jesus as our Lord and Savior, and live with God for eternity, never to be separated from Him again!

Kenneth Copeland Ministries

The 'Jesus Died Spiritually' Doctrine of the Word Faith
.

Your thoughts please.






I do not agree with this post from KCM that Jesus went to hell to suffer., that is not in the Bible. He died on the cross and did all the suffering He would ever have to do when He was here on earth when He was beat by the soldiers and then was crucified the cross and then He said "It is finished" and He died ONCE. Never to suffer and die again.
 
Sep 3, 2016
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#18
Thank you MOTC., Nice to see someone else post one of JP devotionals because I really like his preaching and teaching. I totally agree with this post. We can't make ourselves more righteous than we already have been made IN Christ when we first got saved. Righteousness is a free gift only Christ Jesus can give. Amen!
And we know that all things work together for good (but only if certain conditions are met) to them who love God ( the first condition), to them who are the called according to His purpose (this means it's "His purpose, and not ours," which is the second condition; otherwise, all things will not work together for our good). Romans 8:28

JSM
 
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Grandpa

Senior Member
Jun 24, 2011
11,551
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#19
And we know that all things work together for good (but only if certain conditions are met) to them who love God ( the first condition), to them who are the called according to His purpose (this means it's "His purpose, and not ours," which is the second condition; otherwise, all things will not work together for our good). Romans 8:28

JSM
Those conditions aren't met by us.

They are given as gifts. Grown as fruit...

joaniemarie was absolutely correct in her post...

Thank you MOTC., Nice to see someone else post one of JP devotionals because I really like his preaching and teaching. I totally agree with this post. We can't make ourselves more righteous than we already have been made IN Christ when we first got saved. Righteousness is a free gift only Christ Jesus can give. Amen!
 
Sep 3, 2016
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#20
Those conditions aren't met by us.

They are given as gifts. Grown as fruit...

joaniemarie was absolutely correct in her post...
We must remember that whenever the Pharisees and the Sadducees would question Jesus about the scriptures (the letter of the Law) Jesus would answer them with the spirit of the Law.

Pastor Prince uses the scripture 1 John 4:19, "We love Him [SUP]a][/SUP]because He first loved us. " This is the letter of the Law. We learn in Rev. 2:4-5, something is wrong, despite their zeal. "Because you have left your first love (not "lost" your first love; it refers to a departure from the Cross. This means they fell from Grace, which means they had stopped depending on Christ and the Cross - Gal. 5:4). John 14:15, Jesus says, "If (condition) you love me, keep my commandments." So how do we as Christians keep His commandments? By placing and maintaining our Faith exclusively in Gods beloved Son Jesus and the Finished Work at Calvary Cross. Any other way they have left their First Love Jesus and is committing "Spiritual Adultery" and open for judgement.
 
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