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Thread: Did God tell a lie? (Genesis 2-3)

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    Member Devin02's Avatar
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    Default Did God tell a lie? (Genesis 2-3)

    In Genesis 2 when God is instructing Adam that he can't eat from the tree of knowledge of good and evil he says if you eat from the tree "you shall surely die" (Verse 17). So how come they didn't die when they ate from the tree of knowledge of good and evil as God said they would?
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    Default Re: Did God tell a lie? (Genesis 2-3)

    They did die. It did not happen immediately, but they died.


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    Default Re: Did God tell a lie? (Genesis 2-3)

    Quote Originally Posted by Devin02 View Post
    In Genesis 2 when God is instructing Adam that he can't eat from the tree of knowledge of good and evil he says if you eat from the tree "you shall surely die" (Verse 17). So how come they didn't die when they ate from the tree of knowledge of good and evil as God said they would?
    Are you assuming the word, "surely", means 'immediately' or 'instantly'?[

    5 Then the Lord God took the man and put him in the Garden of Eden to farm the land and to take care of it. 16 The Lord God commanded the man. He said, “You are free to eat from any tree in the garden. 17 But you must never eat from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil because when you eat from it, you will certainly die.”

    Tell me how you put those two thoughts together.
    Last edited by Willie-T; 2 Weeks Ago at 02:01 PM.
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    Default Re: Did God tell a lie? (Genesis 2-3)

    He didn't say they would die immediately. He simply stated that they would die. Up to that point in their existence there was no death.
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    Default Re: Did God tell a lie? (Genesis 2-3)

    Once Adam and Eve ate the fruit of the forbidden tree, God made certain they could not then eat from the Tree of Life and live forever in their sinful state, by ousting them from the Garden of Eden and setting cherubim with a flaming sword to guard the Tree of Life. Some people believe that Adam and Eve had already eaten of the Tree of Life, just because they were alive, but since eating of the Tree of Life gives one life ever after, it is not possible that they had eaten of it. Everyone alive in the world today has not eaten of the Tree of Life, either

    The Tree of Life is a type of Christ. The fruit they ate can be seen as their rebellion against God, which alienated them from God and made them aware of their disobedience and lack of covering, which we now obtain through the shed righteous blood of Christ. Some say the death they experienced immediately is encapsulated in that spiritual severance, or alienation. It is only through faith in Christ's sacrifice on our behalf that we can be reconciled to God.
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    Default Re: Did God tell a lie? (Genesis 2-3)

    God said; "...but of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil you shall not eat, for in the day that you eat of it you shall surely die." Genesis 2:17.

    And they did just as God had said:

    for in the day thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die; or "in dying, die" (z); which denotes the certainty of it, as our version expresses it; and may have regard to more deaths than one; not only a corporeal one, which in some sense immediately took place, man became at once a mortal creature, who otherwise continuing in a state of innocence, and by eating of the tree of life, he was allowed to do, would have lived an immortal life; of the eating of which tree, by sinning he was debarred, his natural life not now to be continued long, at least not for ever; he was immediately arraigned, tried, and condemned to death, was found guilty of it, and became obnoxious to it, and death at once began to work in him; sin sowed the seeds of it in his body, and a train of miseries, afflictions, and diseases, began to appear, which at length issued in death.

    Moreover, a spiritual or moral death immediately ensued;
    he lost his original righteousness, in which he was created; the image of God in him was deformed; the powers and faculties of his soul were corrupted, and he became dead in sins and trespasses; the consequence of which, had it not been for the interposition of a surety and Saviour, who engaged to make satisfaction to law and justice, must have been eternal death, or an everlasting separation from God, to him and all his posterity; for the wages of sin is death, even death eternal, Romans 6:23. So the Jews (a) interpret this of death, both in this world and in the world to come. - John Gill

    No. God did not tell a lie and cannot lie.
    People are offended that God is God.

    Oh, my brethren! bold-hearted men are always called mean-spirited by cowards. - Charles Spurgeon

    Open Theism and Molinism, two inept theological camps, do err in this sense; God doesn't have an R&D department, He does all things perfectly.

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    Default Re: Did God tell a lie? (Genesis 2-3)

    Quote Originally Posted by Devin02 View Post
    In Genesis 2 when God is instructing Adam that he can't eat from the tree of knowledge of good and evil he says if you eat from the tree "you shall surely die" (Verse 17). So how come they didn't die when they ate from the tree of knowledge of good and evil as God said they would?
    Is like saying: "Best wear a coat when it's -30 wind chill out!" (or?) "You'll surely freeze to death!" Now, does that mean, you'll freeze instantly? No! It does mean, you SHALL! Eventually, inevitably, certainly, definitely! In the "garden of eden" incident, "surely", means, as opposed to living eternally. Hence NOT dieing!
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    Default Re: Did God tell a lie? (Genesis 2-3)

    Reading those verses carefully, we learn that there is a lot more being said here, than, "Dis me by eating there, an' you gonna be struck dead!"
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    Default Re: Did God tell a lie? (Genesis 2-3)

    He did die immediately the moment he sinned, he was seperate from God, spiritually dead, and had to be born again to have his relationship restored.

    just look how Adam acted following his sin, He made som really foolish mistakes he would have never have made before he sinned, The things of God became foolish to him immediately (he thought he could hide, he thought he could blame Eve because God did not know the truth, and his nakedness)

    He died physically 900 and some years later as a result of the fall.
    Eternally Grateful for the grace God has shown a wretched soul such as myself.

    Rom 8:1 There is therefore now no condemnation to those who are in Christ Jesus,

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    Default Re: Did God tell a lie? (Genesis 2-3)

    Quote Originally Posted by Devin02 View Post
    In Genesis 2 when God is instructing Adam that he can't eat from the tree of knowledge of good and evil he says if you eat from the tree "you shall surely die" (Verse 17). So how come they didn't die when they ate from the tree of knowledge of good and evil as God said they would?
    Scripture is primarily about Spiritual matters. The day they became knowledgeable of good and evil and chose to do evil (by disobeying God) they cut off their special relationship with Him. Those who can only think literal and physical will tell you it is about dying physically.
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    Default Re: Did God tell a lie? (Genesis 2-3)

    One way of simplifying the narrative in your mind and better understand the bigger picture, as it were, in relation to how the actions of Adam and Eve impacted the rest of humanity, is that we are all born of the flesh ("in Adam"), and all will die a mortal death. Only those who are born again of the Holy Spirit of God, by partaking of The Tree of Life which is Jesus Christ, escape the second death, for the flesh, which we are born into "of Adam," counts for nothing.
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    Default Re: Did God tell a lie? (Genesis 2-3)

    Quote Originally Posted by Willie-T View Post
    Are you assuming the word, "surely", means 'immediately' or 'instantly'?[

    5 Then the Lord God took the man and put him in the Garden of Eden to farm the land and to take care of it. 16 The Lord God commanded the man. He said, “You are free to eat from any tree in the garden. 17 But you must never eat from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil because when you eat from it, you will certainly die.”

    Tell me how you put those two thoughts together.

    But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it:
    for
    in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die.

    Gen 2:1

    However, I see your point since it is written in the translation I use that

    But the book of knowledge of good and evil thou shalt not read of it,
    for in the day thou readest you shall surely die before the 4th verse in Chapter 6.



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    Default Re: Did God tell a lie? (Genesis 2-3)

    On a spiritual level they did die immediately. They became afraid of God and tried to hide from him.

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    Default Re: Did God tell a lie? (Genesis 2-3)

    They Died because they disobeyed and sinned, which opened a whole can of worms.

    They died to their original nature and design that was originally intended for them by YHWH.

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    Default Re: Did God tell a lie? (Genesis 2-3)

    God knew beforehand that Adam and Eve would sin, for we are told that Jesus was purposed from before the foundation of the world as the Lamb of God. Jesus' incarnation was for the express purpose of giving His life as a ransom for many, for whosoever believes shall not perish, but have eternal life. In Him is the light and life of men.



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    Default Re: Did God tell a lie? (Genesis 2-3)

    This is a Spiritual death and a Bodily (fleshly) death. But to be accurate it was a spiritual dormancy as we see the future yet to unfold in the miracle of Christ's death on a Cross for us. Have we forgotten that we are in that same position outside of accepting God's provisions of grace in Christ thru belief and receiving Him as our New Creation; our new life?, yet we walk and talk and live still despite accepting Him - at least temporarily as hope has been granted us on earth by God for a time.

    This passage hints at the characteristics of both God and Sin, in that for us, God or Sin must die in us. In the Adam and Eve premise we need to understand they were unlike us in the relationship to God as a precursor to what we now face as our relationship to God. They were alive unto God as a pre-set condition. It wasn't until Self-awareness by Satan's temptations that Sin was introduced. Satan influenced Eve to become introspective based on his arguments, and she doubted God and was deceived. Adam knew of it to be sinful, and he chose it over God = sinfulness in man. Choosing to disobey God.

    The one elementary Bible truth we are in danger of forgetting after Adam is that the Gospel of God is addressed to men as sinners, and nothing else.

    Thus, this Genesis passage shows us of both God's character and the Character of Sin. Sin in its character is always immediately rebellion against God; as sinner or Christian. It always originates from the devil/Satan. Sin always opposes Christ taking away sins. Sin is immediately opposed to Christ's appearing to destroy the works of the devil/Satan. Thus, even today a true Christian does not live in sin. A true Christian cannot live in sin. A true Christian practices Righteousness and Love. (1 John 3:4-10):

    Everyone who sins breaks the law; in fact sin is lawlessness. But you know that He appeared so that He might take away our sins. And in Him is no sin. No one who lives in Him keeps on sinning. No one who continues to sin has either seen Him or known Him.

    Dear Children, do not let anyone lead you astray. He who does what is right is righteous, just as He is righteous. He who does what is sinful is of the devil, because the devil has been sinning from the beginning. The reason the Son of God appeared was to destroy the devils work. No one who is born of God will continue to sin, because God's seed remains in him; he cannot go on sinning, because he has been born of God. This is how we know who the Children of God are and who the Children of the devil are: Anyone who does not do what is right is not a child of God; nor is anyone who does not love his brother.
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    Default Re: Did God tell a lie? (Genesis 2-3)

    Ok this makes sense now. Thanks for all of the answers!
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    Default Re: Did God tell a lie? (Genesis 2-3)

    Quote Originally Posted by jimd View Post
    Scripture is primarily about Spiritual matters. The day they became knowledgeable of good and evil and chose to do evil (by disobeying God) they cut off their special relationship with Him. Those who can only think literal and physical will tell you it is about dying physically.
    Adam did IN FACT die """in the day""" he ate the friut

    Genesis 2:
    16 And the LORD God commanded the man, saying, Of every tree of the garden thou mayest freely eat:

    17 But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die.
    (NOTE: """IN THE DAY""" you eat from the tree of knowledge of good & evil, you will die)

    Scripture teaches:
    Psalm 90:4 For a thousand years in thy sight are but as yesterday when it is past, and as a watch in the night.
    (NOTE: In Gods sight a day 1000 years is like yesterday = 1 day)

    2 Peter 3:8 But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.
    (NOTE: With the Lord, 1 day is like 1000 years)

    Genesis 5:5 And all the days that Adam lived were nine hundred and thirty years: and he died. (Adam died 930 yrs old)

    According to scripture: Even though Adam lived to be 930 years old. He did in fact, die """IN THE DAY""" he ate the fruit.

    Methuselah, the oldest recorded human lived to be 969.

    Genesis 5:27 And all the days of Methuselah were nine hundred sixty and nine years: and he died.

    Final thought:
    The Day of the Lord in Joel 2:31 & Acts 2:20 isn't 24 hrs. It will cover 1000 years.
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    Default Re: Did God tell a lie? (Genesis 2-3)





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    Default Re: Did God tell a lie? (Genesis 2-3)

    God did not lie . This was a serious sin that was committed . God did not say He changed His mind either.

    Genesis 5:5 And all the days that Adam lived were nine hundred and thirty years: and he died.

    930 years .

    So you are thinking because God said in the "day" you would die .

    You have to take into account all the Bible teaches and then once you learn more, don't forget to apply what it taught .

    2nd Peter 3:8 But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.

    Psalms 90:4 For a thousand years in thy sight are but as yesterday when it is past, and as a watch in the night.

    Revelation 20. etc .

    Given the fact Adam walked with the LORD (
    Gen 3:9 -10 ) And the double witness to it, that Adam lived short of a thousand years, its established that he did die in that day, God told him he would. But this day is counted as a Day with God. That being a thousand years in this case which Adam died within ...

    Last edited by OtherWay210; 2 Weeks Ago at 03:55 PM.

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