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Thread: never thought

  1. #1


    CS1
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    Default never thought

    Before He died Kenneth Hagin warned against today’s materialistic gospel.



    By J. Lee Grady





    Charismatic Bible teacher Kenneth Hagin Sr. is considered the father of the so-called prosperity gospel. The folksy, self-trained “Dad Hagin” started a grass-roots movement in Oklahoma that produced a Bible college and a crop of famous preachers including Kenneth Copeland, Jerry Savelle, Charles Capps, Jesse DuPlantis, Creflo Dollar and dozens of others—all of whom teach that Christians who give generously should expect financial rewards on this side of heaven.
    Hagin taught that God was not glorified by poverty and that preachers do not have to be poor. But before he died in 2003 and left his Rhema Bible Training Center in the hands of his son, Kenneth Hagin Jr., he summoned many of his colleagues to Tulsa to rebuke them for distorting his message. He was not happy that some of his followers were manipulating the Bible to support what he viewed as greed and selfish indulgence.
    Those who were close to Hagin Sr. say he was passionate about correcting these abuses before he died. In fact, he wrote a brutally honest book to address his concerns. The Midas Touch was published in 2000, a year after the infamous Tulsa meeting.
    Many Word-Faith ministers ignored the book. But in light of the recent controversy over prosperity doctrines, it might be a good idea to dust it off and read it again.
    Here are a few of the points Hagin made in The Midas Touch
    1. Financial prosperity is not a sign of God’s blessing. Hagin wrote: “If wealth alone were a sign of spirituality, then drug traffickers and crime bosses would be spiritual giants. Material wealth can be connected to the blessings of God or it can be totally disconnected from the blessings of God.”

    2. People should never give in order to get. Hagin was critical of those who “try to make the offering plate some kind of heavenly vending machine.” He denounced those who link giving to getting, especially those who give cars to get new cars or who give suits to get new suits. He wrote: “There is no spiritual formula to sow a Ford and reap a Mercedes.”
    3. It is not biblical to “name your seed” in an offering. Hagin was horrified by this practice, which was popularized in faith conferences during the 1980s. Faith preachers sometimes tell donors that when they give in an offering they should claim a specific benefit to get a blessing in return. Hagin rejected this idea and said that focusing on what you are going to receive “corrupts the very attitude of our giving nature.”
    4. The “hundredfold return” is not a biblical concept. Hagin did the math and figured out that if this bizarre notion were true, “we would have Christians walking around with not billions or trillions of dollars, but quadrillions of dollars!” He rejected the popular teaching that a believer should claim a specific monetary payback rate.
    5. Preachers who claim to have a “debt-breaking” anointing should not be trusted.Hagin was perplexed by ministers who promise “supernatural debt cancellation” to those who give in certain offerings. He wrote in The Midas Touch: “There is not one bit of Scripture I know about that validates such a practice. I’m afraid it is simply a scheme to raise money for the preacher, and ultimately it can turn out to be dangerous and destructive for all involved.”
    (Many evangelists who appear on Christian television today use this bogus claim. Usually they insist that the miraculous debt cancellation will occur only if a person “gives right now,” as if the anointing for this miracle suddenly evaporates after the prime time viewing hour. This manipulative claim is more akin to witchcraft than Christian belief.)

    Hagin condemned other hair-brained gimmicks designed to trick audiences into emptying their wallets. He was especially incensed when a preacher told his radio listeners that he would take their prayer requests to Jesus’ empty tomb in Jerusalem and pray over them there—if donors included a special love gift. “What that radio preacher really wanted was more people to send in offerings,” Hagin wrote.
    Thanks to the recent resurgence in bizarre donation schemes promoted by American charismatics, the prosperity gospel is back under the nation’s microscope. It’s time to revisit Hagin’s concerns and find a biblical balance.
    Hagin told his followers: “Overemphasizing or adding to what the Bible actually teaches invariably does more harm than good.” If the man who pioneered the modern concept of biblical prosperity blew the whistle on his own movement, wouldn’t it make sense for us to listen to his admonition?
    The Midas Touch is available through Kenneth Hagin Ministries/ Rhema Bible Training Center

    it Don't mean a thing if you an't got the King

  2. #2
    Zi
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    Default Re: never thought

    I always tell people that Kenneth Hagin didn't teach the junk out today. anyone can watch his old videos on youtube. Most of the people who often get closely associated with him werent even his students. some never met him personally and the others only ever attended a few meetings. the people who actually went to his school and worked directly for him are never mentioned. It shows how ignorant complainers are.

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    Default Re: never thought

    WOF isn't the prosperity gospel, but it contains it. Name-it-and-claim-it was taught by Hagin, teaching his disciples they could claim healings & miracles without the leading of the Holy Spirit. He believed he could take authority over sickness, poverty, etc., any time he wanted.

    Hagin also believed in holy laughter, rolling around on the floor, kicking & screaming. There are videos on Youtube displaying this.

    BTW, Kenny Copeland was one of Hagin's closest disciples.
    Angela53510 and NotmebutHim like this.

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    Senior Member NotmebutHim's Avatar
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    Default Re: never thought

    That's what I couldn't figure out about Hagin. I know that he criticized the excesses of the WoF movement and the prosperity gospel, but what I'm not sure about is whether he modified his views or if his views stayed the same while other preachers/teachers became more extreme.
    So you're telling me this is a signature line??

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    Senior Member Angela53510's Avatar
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    Default Re: never thought

    I do hope he repented of the damage he did to the gospel around the world, before his heart gave out.

    You know, the heart that he claimed was healed numerous times, despite heart attacks and heart surgeries.

    By their fruit you will know them!
    "And He has said to me, “My grace is sufficient for you, for power is perfected in weakness.” Most gladly, therefore, I will rather boast about my weaknesses, so that the power of Christ may dwell in me." 2 Cor. 12:9 NASB

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    Senior Member preacher4truth's Avatar
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    Default Re: never thought

    It's like Charles Taze Russell not taking the blame for The Watchtower Society.
    People are offended that God is God.

    Oh, my brethren! bold-hearted men are always called mean-spirited by cowards. - Charles Spurgeon

    Open Theism and Molinism, two inept theological camps, do err in this sense; God doesn't have an R&D department, He does all things perfectly.

    A god who can be fashioned by our own thoughts is no more a god than an image produced by our own hands. - Charles Spurgeon


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    Senior Member NotmebutHim's Avatar
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    Default Re: never thought

    For those who may not know, Hagin was influenced heavily by Essek W. Kenyon, who in turn was influenced by Phineas P. Quimby. Quimby was the founder of New Thought and Metaphysics, and he was associated with Mary Baker Eddy, the founder of Christian Science.

    I found this out by listening to Justin Peters.
    So you're telling me this is a signature line??

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    Senior Member stonesoffire's Avatar
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    Default Re: never thought

    Quote Originally Posted by Speak2Me View Post
    WOF isn't the prosperity gospel, but it contains it. Name-it-and-claim-it was taught by Hagin, teaching his disciples they could claim healings & miracles without the leading of the Holy Spirit. He believed he could take authority over sickness, poverty, etc., any time he wanted.

    Hagin also believed in holy laughter, rolling around on the floor, kicking & screaming. There are videos on Youtube displaying this.

    BTW, Kenny Copeland was one of Hagin's closest disciples.
    I thought that Hagin preached confessing the Word over situations and needs. It was Charles Capps that started name it and claim it.
    Thats who I remember being so big on this. Robert Tilton was terrible. Not sure if he is still around.

    I agree with speaking the promises of God, standing firmly. But, I ask Him for the Word He wants for me. I don't choose.
    Angela53510 likes this.
    Php 3:7 But what things were gain to me, those I counted loss for Christ.


    Php 3:8 Yea doubtless, and I count all things but loss for the excellency of the knowledge of Christ Jesus my Lord: for whom I have suffered the loss of all things, and do count them but dung, that I may win Christ,

  9. #9


    CS1
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    Default Re: never thought

    My thread is not an endorsement for or against Kenneth Hagin. He is no longer with us so, I leave him in the hands of the Lord. What I am saying contextually to my post is I Agree with this position .
    stonesoffire likes this.
    it Don't mean a thing if you an't got the King

  10. #10
    ruach
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    Default Re: never thought

    Quote Originally Posted by Angela53510 View Post
    I do hope he repented of the damage he did to the gospel around the world, before his heart gave out.

    You know, the heart that he claimed was healed numerous times, despite heart attacks and heart surgeries.

    By their fruit you will know them!
    IIRC, He died of a Heart Attack.
    Angela53510 likes this.

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    Senior Member notuptome's Avatar
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    Default Re: never thought

    Quote Originally Posted by CS1 View Post
    My thread is not an endorsement for or against Kenneth Hagin. He is no longer with us so, I leave him in the hands of the Lord. What I am saying contextually to my post is I Agree with this position .
    Kind of makes you wonder how these men could sit under his teaching and come away corrupted. How can men hear the word of God taught and still not come into alignment with the word.

    For the cause of Christ
    Roger
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    The bible is a mirror not a magnifying glass
    use it to examine yourself not others.

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    Default Re: never thought

    Quote Originally Posted by notuptome View Post
    Kind of makes you wonder how these men could sit under his teaching and come away corrupted. How can men hear the word of God taught and still not come into alignment with the word.

    For the cause of Christ
    Roger
    It's no wonder. Hagin was a fraud, & his students are too. It's called generational decline. Israel went thru it also.

    It's also happening in the church too, but this slide is the last & the worst.

    "Like people, like priest"
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  13. #13


    CS1
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    Default Re: never thought

    Quote Originally Posted by notuptome View Post
    Kind of makes you wonder how these men could sit under his teaching and come away corrupted. How can men hear the word of God taught and still not come into alignment with the word.

    For the cause of Christ
    Roger
    how did Judas do it?
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    it Don't mean a thing if you an't got the King

  14. #14


    CS1
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    Default Re: never thought

    Quote Originally Posted by NotmebutHim View Post
    For those who may not know, Hagin was influenced heavily by Essek W. Kenyon, who in turn was influenced by Phineas P. Quimby. Quimby was the founder of New Thought and Metaphysics, and he was associated with Mary Baker Eddy, the founder of Christian Science.

    I found this out by listening to Justin Peters.
    hmm I would like to know your source to your claim please.
    it Don't mean a thing if you an't got the King

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    Senior Member Zmouth's Avatar
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    Default Re: never thought

    Why is the gospel freely given?

    Buy the truth, and sell it not; also wisdom, and instruction, and understanding.
    Prov 23:23

    So it can be received by faith...

    For this cause also we thank God without ceasing, because, when ye received the word of God which ye heard of us, ye received it not as the word of men, but as it is in truth, the word of God, which effectually worketh also in you that believe.
    1 Thess 2:13


    A man without faith can't receive the truth but a believer will always buy into a lie....


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