Free will and God's will

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jsr1221

Senior Member
Jul 7, 2013
4,265
77
48
#1
I know this forum gets heated at times. I can't control how any of you will react. You're going to do what you want regardless of asking to keep it civil. Having said that, this is something that has crossed my mind in the past, and has come up again.

How does God's will coincide with the free will He gave us? For example, I can choose whether or not I leave my house tomorrow. I can choose who I associate with. No amount of Scritpure can dictate the fact that God in fact gives us the freedom to choose our lives (both for the good and the bad). If I chose to not leave my house at all tomorrow, would that interfere at all with what God has in store for my life? I know we hand all of our desires and control over to the care of God, but as already stated, He doesn't do the work for us while we sleep the day away.

I know God's Will will be done. Scripture even states "It is finished." My question is, though, how do we have free will on every detail of our lives if God already knew us in our mother's womb? Wouldn't there be some inconsistencies in that regard?

Please don't just quote Scripture if you're going to respond. I would really like some explanations and opinions that go with them. Even though the Bible contains all truth, not all truth is contained in the Bible. A doctor wouldn't find out how to do major brain surgery just by reading the Bible. A mechanic wouldn't know how to fix a car just by reading the Bible. Thank you all, and I pray this can remain civil.
 

Blain

The Word Weaver
Aug 28, 2012
19,177
2,539
113
#2
That is actually a very good question. we have free will we can choose as we please that is no question the issue is knowing God's will. He always makes his will known to us in some form or manner but he never makes us do it, instead he will influence us and whether or not we decide to go with the flow he is trying to get us to go in is up to us but free will is not as free as it sounds because in some way or another we are actually following someones influence whether that is God's or the devils.

But it is a very interesting thing to think about isn't it? I mean if we have free will and we choose to just sit around and do nothing then is god's will truly done? perhaps he will simply use someone who is willing to be used for his will and in that manner his will is done?
 

Eromonnis

Senior Member
Dec 21, 2017
141
9
18
#3
God is also the Truth. Whenever we use our free will to align with God's will, we become aligned with the truth. However, the question is what truth is the real truth. In my personal experience, anything that is not true is a deception which raises fear within those that believe in it, for deep down they know it is not true. Anything that is true raises awakening, doubtlessness, and love. The very essence of God.

How do we know what is true. For the Christian, it is the Holy Spirit which quickens the heart whenever it hears the truth, for it loves the truth. After all, the truth is where it originated from. Other than the Christian, the person needs to be in-touch with their very Being, for it too (essence of life energy) comes from the Truth.

An example of what I mean by different levels of truth. A rock, from the ground was formed by natural geological occurrences. It's very nature is genuine, authentic and, for this example, true. Now a mason turns this rock into a brick. Now the rock, to all worldly intentions is no longer a rock, but a brick. But the brick is made from a rock. So, it can be argued that neither is genuine, authentic, or true, but just a bunch of philosophical facts. On a physics level, the rock is made from atomic matter, or deeper still, seen as nodes of bundled energy. Deeper still is that the energy arises out of a vacuum, which is termed as Uncreated Light (God).

Our free will allows us to either waste life on self-fabricated stories about life, or the Greater reality of Truth (God).
As mentioned earlier, it is the false life, the fear-based one of deceptions, which causes all the drama, tension, and ALL for nothing. God's will is truth, the truth will set us free from fear and deceptions. Truth, the reality of life, is genuine, authentic, and will be the only thing still standing at the End. It would be nice to be part of that, that my Being had experienced life on earth with some degree of truth and reality.
 
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OtherWay210

Guest
#4
John 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son,
that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.


God has His will, and expect people to fall in line of their own volition.

Asking for peoples opinion over scripture is something the Bible expressly states Not to do .

2 Timothy 4:3 For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears;
4 And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables.


Often people certainly of their own will ; choose NOT to listen to Gods word.
 
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Anothen

Junior Member
Jan 15, 2018
18
0
0
#5
Trying to figure out somethings is difficult. Do humans have free will is a question many have ask over along period of time. The answers will vary depending on one's theology,Calvinist, Arminian, or something else. I will offer my view as I do not fall into either of the categories I have mentioned. God is sovereign and knows all things. Man is created in his image and as such has free will. Man's free will is motivated by his sin nature and that nature seeks its own,selfishness. God sent His son to die for our sin, the sin of all mankind and then offers salvation to a humanity that apart for his sacrificial death no amount of free will would matter. But because he paid the sin debt salvation is possible to all that will trust in Him, have faith in him, believein Him. It is that simple. God's will is this, that you believe but he will not force you. Your free will, will either send you to hell or deliver you to heaven. God's foreknowledge is not a crystal ball, it is who God is All Knowing. Before a single cell in our body was created he know you and whatyou would do concerning eternal life. God can say that only the elect will be saved because he knows the end from the beginning. We don't know but because God's knows does not remove our responsibility to believe in Christ for eternal life. You and I are free to do whatever we have within our power to do it,because we are limited in our freedom within the realm we live. May God RichlyBless You.
 

Adstar

Senior Member
Jul 24, 2016
7,417
3,468
113
#6
If I chose to not leave my house at all tomorrow, would that interfere at all with what God has in store for my life?
God from His foreknowledge of all your life before you lived it already knows if you are going to leave your house tomorrow ot not.. He has already factored that future decision of yours into his eternal plan regarding you and the effects you have on History..

I know God's Will will be done. Scripture even states "It is finished." My question is, though, how do we have free will on every detail of our lives if God already knew us in our mother's womb? Wouldn't there be some inconsistencies in that regard?
God exists in eternity and has seen all history.. He is not locked into our time limitation.. So He has already factored into His eternal plan all the things that all human beings will ever do by their free will.. His eternal plan cannot be changed by the efforts of men.. Even men who hate God and attack His children on earth are actually playing their part in Gods eternal plan..


Please don't just quote Scripture if you're going to respond. I would really like some explanations and opinions that go with them. Even though the Bible contains all truth, not all truth is contained in the Bible. A doctor wouldn't find out how to do major brain surgery just by reading the Bible. A mechanic wouldn't know how to fix a car just by reading the Bible. Thank you all, and I pray this can remain civil.
So you do not like scripture... That is very sad.. Very sad indeed.. You are seeking answers outside of scripture because you do not like what the Bible says.. What does that make you in relation to God ????? No need to answer this question..
 

OneFaith

Senior Member
Sep 5, 2016
2,270
369
83
#7
Well I know I have freewill because I can tell my hand to touch my head, and it does it. I tell my legs to walk, and where to walk, and they do my will. Unlike a robot, I am capable of choosing for myself whether I will do and say what my will is, or to do and say what God’s Will is.

Unlike most, I choose to use my freewill to do and say God’s Will. But what if the Bible isn’t specific enough? For example, Jonah was told to go to Nineveh, but what if there are two roads that lead there, and God didn’t say which road to take there? That is when you pray and follow your conscience. God is like GPS, if you go off route He will simply redirect you from there.

The main point and purpose in this life is to be tested and to please God. Did we practice love, joy, peace, etc. Did we have compassion on those less fortunate? Did we forgive and obey of our own freewill? These are the things to be judged- not whether we put our right sock on before our left sock.

But some question that if God has foreknowledge of what we will choose before we choose it, did we really have a choice? Yes, even I, a mere human, can have some foreknowledge- which has no effect on other’s choices. For example, if I see a train coming quickly down the tracks, I know that it will pass me before it actually does. Does that mean my foreknowledge overrides the freewill of him who chose to drive the train pass me? Of course not.

Will do truly have freewill.
 

FlSnookman7

Senior Member
Jun 27, 2015
1,125
135
63
#8
You're probably not going to like this answer....I believe some things like freewill, the Trinity, the fact that God is "outside" of time etc. are just too much for my brain to comprehend. I enjoy discussing these topics but I have never found an explanation I agree with completely and that's ok. It is not for me to know everything just yet, rather I am to accept that God is indeed working on the big picture and have faith in that.
 

nddreamer

Senior Member
Aug 31, 2017
142
4
18
#9
We have free will. The closer we follow the will of God, we will be guided and blessed. The farther away we depart from the will of God, the more we are on our own. Instead of being blessed, we will be allowed to fall. These are the choices we have. The details of our lives don't matter as long as we behave in a manner that is pleasing to God. We have free choice in our lives but we may be led in a direction that will bless us or we may be led in a direction that will bless others or we may be led to a train wreck. What matters is what's is our hearts. That determines the outcome.
 
Jun 6, 2015
171
0
0
#10
I know this forum gets heated at times. I can't control how any of you will react. You're going to do what you want regardless of asking to keep it civil. Having said that, this is something that has crossed my mind in the past, and has come up again.

How does God's will coincide with the free will He gave us? For example, I can choose whether or not I leave my house tomorrow. I can choose who I associate with. No amount of Scritpure can dictate the fact that God in fact gives us the freedom to choose our lives (both for the good and the bad). If I chose to not leave my house at all tomorrow, would that interfere at all with what God has in store for my life? I know we hand all of our desires and control over to the care of God, but as already stated, He doesn't do the work for us while we sleep the day away.

I know God's Will will be done. Scripture even states "It is finished." My question is, though, how do we have free will on every detail of our lives if God already knew us in our mother's womb? Wouldn't there be some inconsistencies in that regard?

Please don't just quote Scripture if you're going to respond. I would really like some explanations and opinions that go with them. Even though the Bible contains all truth, not all truth is contained in the Bible. A doctor wouldn't find out how to do major brain surgery just by reading the Bible. A mechanic wouldn't know how to fix a car just by reading the Bible. Thank you all, and I pray this can remain civil.
To make a long story short, we all lived in the first world age, and satan rebelled and got a third of us to follow him, a third of us fought on the side of God and a third watched, the third that fought on the side of God were judged and found to be righteous, these are the elect, they will not be judged again and God uses them to bring about his plan of salvation.
Instead of destroying two third of his children God created this word age and made us flesh in the image we were in the first world age, this two third has free will to follow God or satan, God will not interfere in there lives, so choose life. God bless
 

Shamah

Senior Member
Jan 6, 2018
2,735
692
113
#11
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Psalm 11:4, "[/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]יהוה [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]is in His holy temple; [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]יהוה [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]throne is in heaven; His eyes behold, His eyelids test the sons of men."

Joshua 24:15, “And if it seems evil in your eyes to serve
[/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]יהוה[/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif], choose for yourselves this day whom you are going to serve, whether the mighty ones which your fathers served that were beyond the River, or the mighty ones of the Amorites, in whose land you dwell. But I and my house, we serve [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]יהוה[/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif].”

John 7:17, “If anyone chooses to do His desire, he shall know concerning the teaching, whether it is from YHWH, or whether I speak from Myself.”

chooses” is word #G2309 θέλω thelo (the'-lō) v., ἐθέλω ethelo (e-the'-lō) , 1. to determine, i.e. choose or prefer., 2. (by implication) to wish, i.e. be inclined to., 3. (sometimes adverbially) gladly., 4. (impersonally for the future tense) to be about to., 5. (by Hebraism) to delight in., {literally or figuratively; as an active option from subjective impulse; whereas G1014 properly denotes rather a passive acquiescence in objective considerations}, [apparently strengthened from the alternate form of G138], KJV: desire, be disposed (forward), intend, list, love, mean, please, have rather, (be) will (have, -ling, - ling(-ly)) , Root(s): G138, Compare: G140, G1014

[/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Hebrews 11:24-27, “By belief, Mosheh, having become great, refused to be called the son of the daughter of Pharaoh, choosing rather to be afflicted with the people of Yah than to enjoy the pleasures of sin for a time, deeming the reproach of Messiah greater riches than the treasures in Mitsrayim, for he was looking to the reward. By belief, he left Mitsrayim, not fearing the wrath of the sovereign, for he was steadfast, as seeing Him who is invisible.”[/FONT]
 

jsr1221

Senior Member
Jul 7, 2013
4,265
77
48
#12
God from His foreknowledge of all your life before you lived it already knows if you are going to leave your house tomorrow ot not.. He has already factored that future decision of yours into his eternal plan regarding you and the effects you have on History..



God exists in eternity and has seen all history.. He is not locked into our time limitation.. So He has already factored into His eternal plan all the things that all human beings will ever do by their free will.. His eternal plan cannot be changed by the efforts of men.. Even men who hate God and attack His children on earth are actually playing their part in Gods eternal plan..




So you do not like scripture... That is very sad.. Very sad indeed.. You are seeking answers outside of scripture because you do not like what the Bible says.. What does that make you in relation to God ????? No need to answer this question..
I never said I didn't like Scripture. I said to not just quote Scripture into a response. That's a big difference. If I want to learn how to make a new dish, would I read a cookbook or the book of Proverbs for that? If I I'm studying for a test, would I read through my notes and the assigned textbook, or I would I read through 1 Peter? Don't twist my words. Don't assume. The latter speaks for itself in what it does.
 

Johnny_B

Senior Member
Mar 18, 2017
1,954
64
48
#13

Yes we can make daily decisions for our lives everyday, but those decisions have no spiritual impact on your lives. Where salvation is another story, those or that decision we cannot make because we are blind to the kingdom of God.

John 3:3 “Jesus answered and said to him, “Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.”

II Corinthians 2:14 “But the natural man does not receive the things of the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him; nor can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.”

We are unable to see the kingdom of God and in our natural state we cannot understand the things of God because they are spiritually discerned and in that natural state they are foolishness to us, why? Because we are slaves of sin, we have been blinded by the god of this world and we love our sins rather than the light who is Jesus because our works are evil or because what we do is sin.

John 8:34
“Jesus answered them, “Most assuredly, I say to you, whoever commits sin is a slave of sin.”

II Corinthians 4:4 “In their case the god of this world has blinded the minds of the unbelievers, to keep them from seeing the light of the gospel of the glory of Christ, who is the image of God.”


John 3:19
“And this is the judgment: the light has come into the world, and people loved the darkness rather than the light because their works were evil.”

As we can see, yes we can make daily decisions for our physical lives, but when it comes to our spiritual lives we are blind to the kingdom and it is foolishness to us, because we are slaves to our sins and we love our wickedness. Because we are in this state, we need to be born again so we can see the kingdom so that we can know that we need to repent. Unless the Lord intervenes in our lives we will go on loving our sin as we are slaves to it.

Being blind sin loving slaves with no spiritual understanding of the kingdom of God we can never make a free will decision to repent/believe/have faith because it is foolishnees to us. Because it is spiritually discerned and we are blinded by the god of this world.

But God makes us alive to see the need to repent and His mercy for us because of His great love for us that allows us to repent.

Ephesians 2:4-7
“But God, being rich in mercy, because of the great love with which he loved us,5 even when we were dead in our trespasses, made us alive together with Christ—by grace you have been saved—6 and raised us up with him and seated us with him in the heavenly places in Christ Jesus,7 so that in the coming ages he might show the immeasurable riches of his grace in kindness toward us in Christ Jesus.”

It always amazes me when someone gets upset when you say that God had to make you alive so you could repent, because you are giving the glory to God inthier salvation and that is where it belongs, we as natural man cannot save ourself.

Making daily decision for our lives is a far cry from us making a decision for salvation, because if it were left to our will we would never be saved because as the Scripture show us our will is not free to choose salvation.

 

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
24,167
12,764
113
#14
My question is, though, how do we have free will on every detail of our lives if God already knew us in our mother's womb?
The fact that God knows all things from the beginning does not interfere with your personal choices (which are not pre-determined by God). However there is a Law of Consequences which affects your choices. Good choices generally lead to good consequences and vice versa.

At the same time God has His own eternal plans and purposes and He is able to make all things work together so that His plans are accomplished. The best example is the unjust condemnation of Christ and His crucifixion. God had already planned that the Lamb of God would die for the sins of the whole world. But He also knew that Christ would make bitter enemies of the Jews who would insist that the Romans crucify Him. So, without compelling His enemies to make false accusations and then clamor for His crucifixion, God's purposes were accomplished and Christ became the Passover Lamb as planned by God. But God held the Jews fully accountable for the murder of Christ.
 

Adstar

Senior Member
Jul 24, 2016
7,417
3,468
113
#15
I never said I didn't like Scripture. I said to not just quote Scripture into a response. That's a big difference. If I want to learn how to make a new dish, would I read a cookbook or the book of Proverbs for that? If I I'm studying for a test, would I read through my notes and the assigned textbook, or I would I read through 1 Peter? Don't twist my words. Don't assume. The latter speaks for itself in what it does.
You did not comment on my explaination????
 
Nov 12, 2015
9,112
822
113
#16
I know this forum gets heated at times. I can't control how any of you will react. You're going to do what you want regardless of asking to keep it civil. Having said that, this is something that has crossed my mind in the past, and has come up again.

How does God's will coincide with the free will He gave us? For example, I can choose whether or not I leave my house tomorrow. I can choose who I associate with. No amount of Scritpure can dictate the fact that God in fact gives us the freedom to choose our lives (both for the good and the bad). If I chose to not leave my house at all tomorrow, would that interfere at all with what God has in store for my life? I know we hand all of our desires and control over to the care of God, but as already stated, He doesn't do the work for us while we sleep the day away.

I know God's Will will be done. Scripture even states "It is finished." My question is, though, how do we have free will on every detail of our lives if God already knew us in our mother's womb? Wouldn't there be some inconsistencies in that regard?

Please don't just quote Scripture if you're going to respond. I would really like some explanations and opinions that go with them. Even though the Bible contains all truth, not all truth is contained in the Bible. A doctor wouldn't find out how to do major brain surgery just by reading the Bible. A mechanic wouldn't know how to fix a car just by reading the Bible. Thank you all, and I pray this can remain civil.
Man plans his way but it is God who directs his steps.
The man and the donkey show this well. He kept trying to get the donkey to move (his plan on what to do and where to go) and Gods will trumped his own because he was not going where God was directing.

You can plan your way with the calm peace of knowing that God is directing your steps. And if you keep trying to do something and it keeps not working out, stop pushing and go a different route. Sometimes, the different route is just waiting in your house. Fair warning though - people will call you foolish for waiting peacefully until God arranges your steps. In fact, your own mind will start agreeing with them and you will say: they are right, I can't just do nothing and keep sitting here waiting for God to do something! But that would be wrong.

I tried to find a job for many years. I got to the point where I was applying at fast food places and restaurants. No one would hire me. One day, it occurred to me that this was impossible. No one who will take ANY job someone will give her would apply for years and still not find a job. It's impossible, which by definition would make it a work of God. That's when I knew that I needed to step back and wait for God. I said: if a man won't work you shouldn't feed him. Where is the work You will give me to do with my hands Lord? And then I waited. And it only took two days. He immediately answered me once I put it on Him to guide me to a job. Now I am self-employed and am making it. I don't have loads of money piling in but I have just enough.

All those years, I just kept kicking that donkey. It took a long time for me to stop my course. I guess I AM the donkey, actually.

But all of those turn downs for jobs WAS God guiding my steps. Look what I learned about just asking for what I needed instead of going another few years in a desperate and sweaty fear of how I would eat and clothe myself and have a roof!

A man plans his way but it is God who guides his steps.
 
D

Depleted

Guest
#17
I know this forum gets heated at times. I can't control how any of you will react. You're going to do what you want regardless of asking to keep it civil. Having said that, this is something that has crossed my mind in the past, and has come up again.

How does God's will coincide with the free will He gave us? For example, I can choose whether or not I leave my house tomorrow. I can choose who I associate with. No amount of Scritpure can dictate the fact that God in fact gives us the freedom to choose our lives (both for the good and the bad). If I chose to not leave my house at all tomorrow, would that interfere at all with what God has in store for my life? I know we hand all of our desires and control over to the care of God, but as already stated, He doesn't do the work for us while we sleep the day away.

I know God's Will will be done. Scripture even states "It is finished." My question is, though, how do we have free will on every detail of our lives if God already knew us in our mother's womb? Wouldn't there be some inconsistencies in that regard?

Please don't just quote Scripture if you're going to respond. I would really like some explanations and opinions that go with them. Even though the Bible contains all truth, not all truth is contained in the Bible. A doctor wouldn't find out how to do major brain surgery just by reading the Bible. A mechanic wouldn't know how to fix a car just by reading the Bible. Thank you all, and I pray this can remain civil.
The ultimate example of "free will" over God's will is Jonah. Jonah maintained "free will" throughout his story. He freely chose to hop onto the next ship going in the opposite direction from where God told him to go. He freely chose to have the men toss him overboard. He didn't even opt to jump over himself. He freely consent to be used by the Lord in Nineveh after three days of being soggy and cramped in the belly of a fish. He freely proclaimed the Lord's saving message to Nineveh. He freely pouted in the wilderness afterward, as the Lord covered him with the shade of a rapidly-growing weed. And he was free to chose to do whatever he wanted after the Lord let the weed die.

The ultimate example. Why not read it?
 
D

Depleted

Guest
#18
I never said I didn't like Scripture. I said to not just quote Scripture into a response. That's a big difference. If I want to learn how to make a new dish, would I read a cookbook or the book of Proverbs for that? If I I'm studying for a test, would I read through my notes and the assigned textbook, or I would I read through 1 Peter? Don't twist my words. Don't assume. The latter speaks for itself in what it does.
It's 2018. If you're going to make a new dish, google it. Much easier than finding it in a cookbook.


(Sorry. Could not resist.)
 
Dec 28, 2016
9,171
2,718
113
#19
Jesus taught no man is free, yet man continues to teach against this as if choosing a Quarter Pounder or a Filet-O-Fish proves our wills to be free. Then this teaching is brought over into matters of spirituality and salvation and it is preached man is free and just needs to vote for God or against God, and voila heaven is his home.

Easy as pie. :rolleyes:
 

John146

Senior Member
Jan 13, 2016
16,540
3,503
113
#20
He freely proclaimed the Lord's saving message to Nineveh.
Actually, Jonah preached a message of destruction, "Yet, forty days and Nineveh shall be overthrown." Was Nineveh overthrown in forty days? Nope. Why? Because the people of Nineveh believed this message and cried out to God to spare them(free will). Did God spare them? Yes. God changed His mind toward Nineveh because thy believed His word and cried out to Him.

Nineveh's free will decision thwarted God's decision to destroy them.