Rick Warren - Heretic or Theologically Confused?

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Angela53510

Senior Member
Jan 24, 2011
11,780
2,937
113
#1
I know some are going to jump up and down at my “misuse” of the word heretic. I have heard it said in many places Rick Warren had deviated from sound doctrine, today, a friend posted one of his blogs on FB, and I was stunned at the entire piece!

The more faith you have in God, the more power and the more blessings you will have in your life.”

This is what Warren says in his article, entitled, “To Get God’s Power, Give Him Your Trust.” We give to get?? To get... we give!! Horrific doctrine. Really, in real life, that is a narcissist’s words. It is “all about me!” I will give you something if I get something back. That is not the gospel, where Jesus died for our sins, because of his love for us. Not so we could manipulate him to get what we want. If a man gives a woman a gift so he can get her into bed, he is a womanizer and a user. So why would we take that same approach with God?

Now, I did put a question mark in the title for a reason. Warren seems to be more mixed up than a heretic! Read this, next quote and you will see he is talking about trusting God, which I agree is important!

[FONT=&quot]That’s why it takes faith to what God wants you to do. You’ll never be able to do it on your own. You were never intended to be able to! Anything you can do in your own strength doesn’t require faith, and when faith is not required, we’re living faithlessly.”

Except, how does a born again believer live without faith? God gives us a measure of faith!


”[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot][/FONT]For by the grace given to me I say to everyone among you not to think of himself more highly than he ought to think, but to think with sober judgment, each according to the measure of faith that God has assigned.” Romans 12:3[FONT=&quot]

Then there is this:

”[/FONT]
Without God’s power in your life, you’re just running on your own energy. And that’s like having a laptop that’s unplugged; the battery will eventually drain and all the power will be gone. Why would you live like that?[FONT=&quot]Think of it like this: You’ve got a small battery in you. You can run through life on your own power, which means you’ll be tired all the time.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Or you have access to God’s power plant, provided you just plug in and admit you need God’s help. God has unlimited power to sustain your life and mission.”

Maybe I am foolish, but how can a born again believer not have God’s power? Well, for one thing, we need the guidiance and direction of the Holy Spirit, which he never zones in on. And yes, people do work in their own strength, I won’t deny that. But surely seeking God in prayer for his will, leading and guidance comes before needing power? And then there is submission to God’s will. That is about surrendering all, obeying God. Surely that is more important than power?

My final analysis is that Rick Warren does have some basic doctrine underneath this smozzle of twisted doctrines. But, he seems to be tickling ears, trying to attract the Health and Wealth people, using their doctrines without really understanding what he is saying. I really don’t think this is a good article, and now I will avoid him in future, because his message is mixed and confusing.

But I am interested in hearing what you have to say, particularly if you take the 2 minutes to click on the link and actually read the whole thing in context! Because context is important, and I would like to know if I am missing something or reading into this more than is there.


To Get God’s Power, Give Him Your Trust[/FONT]
 
P

pckts

Guest
#3
Warren is a member of the "Council on Foreign Relations". He is a heretic, a Zionist shill, and a puppet to liberal and one world government/antichrist agendas.

Rick Warren says the future is religious pluralism.

“Secularism is quite small outside Europe and Manhattan,” he joked. “The future of the world lies in religious pluralism.” --thehoya.com February 5, 2008



 

stonesoffire

Poetic Member
Nov 24, 2013
10,665
1,829
113
#4
I don't know anything about Rick Warren except what I hear or have read from critics. So, I do believe in going to the source because man is prone to gossip naturally.

I read the whole article. Being filled with Holy Spirit is like being connected to a power plant. Consider what it gives. Light.

And when one is prompted to move out, there can be a barrage of doubting words in the mind to get you to back down, so you put faith in the anointing and do or say what the prompting is. There's a better word than prompting but is escaping me at the moment.

I see nothing wrong with this particular article.
 
Dec 28, 2016
9,171
2,718
113
#5
I know some are going to jump up and down at my “misuse” of the word heretic. I have heard it said in many places Rick Warren had deviated from sound doctrine, today, a friend posted one of his blogs on FB, and I was stunned at the entire piece!

The more faith you have in God, the more power and the more blessings you will have in your life.”

This is what Warren says in his article, entitled, “To Get God’s Power, Give Him Your Trust.” We give to get?? To get... we give!! Horrific doctrine. Really, in real life, that is a narcissist’s words. It is “all about me!” I will give you something if I get something back. That is not the gospel, where Jesus died for our sins, because of his love for us. Not so we could manipulate him to get what we want. If a man gives a woman a gift so he can get her into bed, he is a womanizer and a user. So why would we take that same approach with God?

Now, I did put a question mark in the title for a reason. Warren seems to be more mixed up than a heretic! Read this, next quote and you will see he is talking about trusting God, which I agree is important!

That’s why it takes faith to what God wants you to do. You’ll never be able to do it on your own. You were never intended to be able to! Anything you can do in your own strength doesn’t require faith, and when faith is not required, we’re living faithlessly.”

Except, how does a born again believer live without faith? God gives us a measure of faith!


For by the grace given to me I say to everyone among you not to think of himself more highly than he ought to think, but to think with sober judgment, each according to the measure of faith that God has assigned.” Romans 12:3

Then there is this:

Without God’s power in your life, you’re just running on your own energy. And that’s like having a laptop that’s unplugged; the battery will eventually drain and all the power will be gone. Why would you live like that?Think of it like this: You’ve got a small battery in you. You can run through life on your own power, which means you’ll be tired all the time.
Or you have access to God’s power plant, provided you just plug in and admit you need God’s help. God has unlimited power to sustain your life and mission.”

Maybe I am foolish, but how can a born again believer not have God’s power? Well, for one thing, we need the guidiance and direction of the Holy Spirit, which he never zones in on. And yes, people do work in their own strength, I won’t deny that. But surely seeking God in prayer for his will, leading and guidance comes before needing power? And then there is submission to God’s will. That is about surrendering all, obeying God. Surely that is more important than power?

My final analysis is that Rick Warren does have some basic doctrine underneath this smozzle of twisted doctrines. But, he seems to be tickling ears, trying to attract the Health and Wealth people, using their doctrines without really understanding what he is saying. I really don’t think this is a good article, and now I will avoid him in future, because his message is mixed and confusing.

But I am interested in hearing what you have to say, particularly if you take the 2 minutes to click on the link and actually read the whole thing in context! Because context is important, and I would like to know if I am missing something or reading into this more than is there.


To Get God’s Power, Give Him Your Trust

It all seems to center around covetousness: What can we get from God, and, if we're not getting enough from God it's our fault.

"You can do it if you plug into God!"

"It" what exactly? Well, the text says "everything" so that must mean anything!

Context? Abandoned.

This is all begging the question: "What can I do to get more stuff from God, to make more money, to succeed?"

"More"
is. imho, the key phrase of the article, and the word is never defined in a godly fashion to show going after godly things in our "mission." What we "want" is subtly left up to our own imagination.

This is what people want to hear. I turn him off when he comes on the radio, the ministry seems more life coach and pragmatism than an authentic Christian message.
 

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
24,167
12,763
113
#6
I don't know anything about Rick Warren except what I hear or have read from critics. So, I do believe in going to the source because man is prone to gossip naturally.
You will find quotations from Warren's Purpose Driven Life and why they are not in conformity to Scripture when you check various websites. Warren is clearly a false teacher since he puts this book on the same level as Scripture, quotes extensively from people who are not genuine Christians, encourages New Age ideas, and then seeks to work hand-in-hand with Roman Catholics.
 

Angela53510

Senior Member
Jan 24, 2011
11,780
2,937
113
#7
It all seems to center around covetousness: What can we get from God, and, if we're not getting enough from God it's our fault.

"You can do it if you plug into God!"

"It" what exactly? Well, the text says "everything" so that must mean anything!

Context? Abandoned.

This is all begging the question: "What can I do to get more stuff from God, to make more money, to succeed?"

"More"
is. imho, the key phrase of the article, and the word is never defined in a godly fashion to show going after godly things in our "mission." What we "want" is subtly left up to our own imagination.

This is what people want to hear. I turn him off when he comes on the radio, the ministry seems more life coach and pragmatism than an authentic Christian message.
I agree with you! You are delightfully succinct in your analysis!

And when you fingered “covetousness” it helped me define the actual “sin” being not only committed in this article, but encouraged by Warren.

Put to death therefore what is earthly in you: sexual immorality, impurity, passion, evil desire, and covetousness, which is idolatry.” Col. 3:5

”For you may be sure of this, that everyone who is sexually immoral or impure, or who is covetous (that is, an idolater), has no inheritance in the kingdom of Christ and God.” Eph. 5:5


Wow! Too many scriptures to list here. And while a lot of them refer to riches and money, the lust for power, is here:

Now Simon, when he saw that the Spirit was given through the laying on of the apostles’ hands, offered them money, 19 saying, “Give me this power too, so that everyone I place my hands on may receive the Holy Spirit.” Acts 8:18-19[FONT=&quot]

I guess some would point to the fact that Simon the Magician’s motives were impure. Although it never says he wanted it for money, perhaps that is implied? All I know, is the next verses Peter shows a lot of anger at the request for “power!” And true, Simon offered money, but what is the difference between offering money, and giving to get?

”[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]But Peter said to him, “May your silver perish with you, because you thought you could acquire God’s gift with money! [/FONT][FONT=&quot][/FONT][FONT=&quot]21 You have no share or part in this matter because your heart is not right before God!” Acts 8:20-21[/FONT]
 

Ezekiel8

Senior Member
Oct 26, 2017
403
8
0
#8
Don't know who Rick Warren is, but makes me think of this verse.

Matthew 21:21-22

[SUP]21 [/SUP]Jesus answered and said unto them, Verily I say unto you, If ye have faith, and doubt not, ye shall not only do this which is done to the fig tree, but also if ye shall say unto this mountain, Be thou removed, and be thou cast into the sea; it shall be done.
[SUP]22 [/SUP]And all things, whatsoever ye shall ask in prayer, believing, ye shall receive.
 

Angela53510

Senior Member
Jan 24, 2011
11,780
2,937
113
#9
I don't know anything about Rick Warren except what I hear or have read from critics. So, I do believe in going to the source because man is prone to gossip naturally.

I read the whole article. Being filled with Holy Spirit is like being connected to a power plant. Consider what it gives. Light.

And when one is prompted to move out, there can be a barrage of doubting words in the mind to get you to back down, so you put faith in the anointing and do or say what the prompting is. There's a better word than prompting but is escaping me at the moment.

I see nothing wrong with this particular article.

I posted the whole article, because I wanted all of Warren’s words, and tried to avoid out of context quotes, or rambling about what I heard, because that is gossip. I tried to basically exegete the passage and how it is at odds with the gospel.

I have no quarrel with you, SoF on the fact that we need the Holy Spirit in our lives and his power. We really accomplish nothing without the leading of the Holy Spirit. And certainly he enables us to do these things, with his power! Absolutely!

But, my concern is the “give to get” aspect of his teaching. This is so ungodly. So anti-gospel! Jesus gave everything for us, and got nothing in return! He not only left heaven, he died on a sinner’s cross, paying for our sins which he did not deserve. That is the full defintion of “giving WITHOUT getting!” Jesus example always, is giving and giving, and the way he did it was to pray, and be filled with the power of God.

But godly power is not an electricity station, which has to be fixed, and repaired, and certainly we need to pay for that power. The analogy is faulty. In fact, Jesus paid for the power, and he paid it all!

But not so we could go off and do our own thing, then give God lip service, then get his power to accomplish what we want to do.

In fact, the first step, the middle step, the final step and every step of our journey with God is submission and obedience. And being overwhelmingly grateful for God’s mercy and grace. And then, walking with Christ, not going off on our own, doing something, burning out and then asking God to bless us, and fill us.

We need to be asking God to lead us and guide us, first! When we are in his will, we don’t NEED to ask for power, it will already be ours. He will have given us the power to do the “mission” he has sent us to do.

I am not trying to create doubt about God, his power, his will for our life at all! I think I am trying to warn people to beware of wolves in sheep’s clothing. I was really surprised at this article. I have never read anything by him. (Maybe Purpose Driven Life a long time ago?? Which made no impression of me, obviously!)

The only reason I opened and read this article is because a close friend of mine, from Peru, who loves God, but always gets pulled into private magical, thinking posted it. I have been through this with her in the past, and several other discerning Christians. And then, the title alone, Giving to Get, more or less, was extremely worrisome to me, knowing her past!

I do thank you for reading it, and we will have to agree to disagree on our conclusions!
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
#10
I will just say this.

Can anyone show me a person who really had more faith than paul?

Yet here are paul's blessings.

in labors more abundant, in stripes above measure, in prisons more frequently, in deaths often. [SUP]24 [/SUP]From the Jews five times I received forty stripes minus one. [SUP]25 [/SUP]Three times I was beaten with rods; once I was stoned; three times I was shipwrecked; a night and a day I have been in the deep; [SUP]26 [/SUP]in journeys often, in perils of waters, in perils of robbers, in perils of my own countrymen, in perils of the Gentiles, in perils in the city, in perils in the wilderness, in perils in the sea, in perils among false brethren; [SUP]27 [/SUP]in weariness and toil, in sleeplessness often, in hunger and thirst, in fastings often, in cold and nakedness— [SUP]28 [/SUP]besides the other things, what comes upon me daily: my deep concern for all the churches

I have heard people who say if a person suffers this much, they are either in sin, or do not have enough faith. Really??
 
Dec 28, 2016
9,171
2,718
113
#11
I agree with you! You are delightfully succinct in your analysis!

And when you fingered “covetousness” it helped me define the actual “sin” being not only committed in this article, but encouraged by Warren.

Put to death therefore what is earthly in you: sexual immorality, impurity, passion, evil desire, and covetousness, which is idolatry.” Col. 3:5

”For you may be sure of this, that everyone who is sexually immoral or impure, or who is covetous (that is, an idolater), has no inheritance in the kingdom of Christ and God.” Eph. 5:5


Wow! Too many scriptures to list here. And while a lot of them refer to riches and money, the lust for power, is here:

Now Simon, when he saw that the Spirit was given through the laying on of the apostles’ hands, offered them money, 19 saying, “Give me this power too, so that everyone I place my hands on may receive the Holy Spirit.” Acts 8:18-19

I guess some would point to the fact that Simon the Magician’s motives were impure. Although it never says he wanted it for money, perhaps that is implied? All I know, is the next verses Peter shows a lot of anger at the request for “power!” And true, Simon offered money, but what is the difference between offering money, and giving to get?

But Peter said to him, “May your silver perish with you, because you thought you could acquire God’s gift with money! 21 You have no share or part in this matter because your heart is not right before God!” Acts 8:20-21
People tend to throw around being "anointed" of God. But that is generally where it ends.

Anointed to do what exactly?

It appears to me, biblically, that for a person to be anointed of God, it was always initiated by a particular and known task to which the person was being sent and empowered. It was always for God's glory, never mans.

Nowadays it's just something vague and nonspecific, and unfortunately too often it is for personal lusts and gain. People want to be able to say "I'm anointed" yet it appears to be all for self, for a spiritual buzz, a "look at me" but not for a specific task centering on the Gospel of Christ, God's glory or sound doctrine; Acts 1 & 2, and 1 John 2:27; 1 Thessalonians 4:9; 1 Corinthians 2:12; 2 Timothy 3:14-4:5.

"Anointed" to do what exactly?
 
Dec 28, 2016
9,171
2,718
113
#12
I will just say this.

Can anyone show me a person who really had more faith than paul?

Yet here are paul's blessings.

in labors more abundant, in stripes above measure, in prisons more frequently, in deaths often. [SUP]24 [/SUP]From the Jews five times I received forty stripes minus one. [SUP]25 [/SUP]Three times I was beaten with rods; once I was stoned; three times I was shipwrecked; a night and a day I have been in the deep; [SUP]26 [/SUP]in journeys often, in perils of waters, in perils of robbers, in perils of my own countrymen, in perils of the Gentiles, in perils in the city, in perils in the wilderness, in perils in the sea, in perils among false brethren; [SUP]27 [/SUP]in weariness and toil, in sleeplessness often, in hunger and thirst, in fastings often, in cold and nakedness— [SUP]28 [/SUP]besides the other things, what comes upon me daily: my deep concern for all the churches

I have heard people who say if a person suffers this much, they are either in sin, or do not have enough faith. Really??
Yep, and the above is the context of Philippians 4:13. It was about suffering for God.
 

Angela53510

Senior Member
Jan 24, 2011
11,780
2,937
113
#13
Don't know who Rick Warren is, but makes me think of this verse.

Matthew 21:21-22

[SUP]21 [/SUP]Jesus answered and said unto them, Verily I say unto you, If ye have faith, and doubt not, ye shall not only do this which is done to the fig tree, but also if ye shall say unto this mountain, Be thou removed, and be thou cast into the sea; it shall be done.
[SUP]22 [/SUP]And all things, whatsoever ye shall ask in prayer, believing, ye shall receive.

Again, this is not what I was addressing in my OP, and is not the content of the article. Did you read the OP or the article? If yes, then ok, but if no, please go back and revisit it and then see if this applies.

And, if we want to really look at the verses you posted, perhaps a look at the context, what is going on in the chapter, and what this leads to, is important.

First, these verses occur directly after Jesus triumphal entry into Jerusalem. This was the last week on earth for Jesus before he went to the cross. So, what was he addressing here? Was it a blanket endorsement of demanding God give you anything you demand/pray for? Or was he perhaps talking about himself? He killed the tree, and knew he was going to be killed. He was telling them to have faith in him for what was to come! And that was his death and resurrection, and then the commission of preaching the gospel. Nothing about power, and how we must be in God’s will. In fact, verses following your verses this confirm that WE MUST BE IN GOD’S WILL for anything to occur.

What do you think? A man had two sons. He went to the first and said, ‘Son, go and work in the vineyard today.’ 29 The boy answered, ‘I will not.’ But later he had a change of heart and went. 30 The father went to the other son and said the same thing. This boy answered, ‘I will, sir,’ but did not go. 31 Which of the two did his father’s will?” They said, “The first.” Jesus said to them, “I tell you the truth, tax collectors and prostitutes will go ahead of you into the kingdom of God! 32 For John came to you in the way of righteousness, and you did not believe him. But the tax collectors and prostitutes did believe. Although you saw this, you did not later change your minds and believe him.” Matt. 21:28-32[FONT=&quot]

So, Matt 21:21-22 which you posted, Ezekiel8, is not tied to giving to get, and not giving for power. It is tied to doing the will of God! That is righteousness, which is what the Kingdom of God demands.

And, you have confirmed my hypothesis of this post really being Word Faith, a most heinous and destructive, self serving and evil doctrine! And sadly, so many people deceived by it!
[/FONT]
 

Ezekiel8

Senior Member
Oct 26, 2017
403
8
0
#14
Again, this is not what I was addressing in my OP, and is not the content of the article. Did you read the OP or the article? If yes, then ok, but if no, please go back and revisit it and then see if this applies.

And, if we want to really look at the verses you posted, perhaps a look at the context, what is going on in the chapter, and what this leads to, is important.

First, these verses occur directly after Jesus triumphal entry into Jerusalem. This was the last week on earth for Jesus before he went to the cross. So, what was he addressing here? Was it a blanket endorsement of demanding God give you anything you demand/pray for? Or was he perhaps talking about himself? He killed the tree, and knew he was going to be killed. He was telling them to have faith in him for what was to come! And that was his death and resurrection, and then the commission of preaching the gospel. Nothing about power, and how we must be in God’s will. In fact, verses following your verses this confirm that WE MUST BE IN GOD’S WILL for anything to occur.

What do you think? A man had two sons. He went to the first and said, ‘Son, go and work in the vineyard today.’ 29 The boy answered, ‘I will not.’ But later he had a change of heart and went. 30 The father went to the other son and said the same thing. This boy answered, ‘I will, sir,’ but did not go. 31 Which of the two did his father’s will?” They said, “The first.” Jesus said to them, “I tell you the truth, tax collectors and prostitutes will go ahead of you into the kingdom of God! 32 For John came to you in the way of righteousness, and you did not believe him. But the tax collectors and prostitutes did believe. Although you saw this, you did not later change your minds and believe him.” Matt. 21:28-32

So, Matt 21:21-22 which you posted, Ezekiel8, is not tied to giving to get, and not giving for power. It is tied to doing the will of God! That is righteousness, which is what the Kingdom of God demands.

And, you have confirmed my hypothesis of this post really being Word Faith, a most heinous and destructive, self serving and evil doctrine! And sadly, so many people deceived by it!
Well I have just read the OP, I have no real interest in Rick Warren nor do I really care to find out about him. I am more interested in what the Bible says, for if the Bible says such things and if the Bible is the orthodox doctrine of Christianity, how can it then be a heresy?

I think that verse which I posted which is merely the first one that came to my mind after reading the OP, and also the ones you posted are about the nature of faith. For even there in verse 32 they are condemned why? Because they did not actually believe enough to do their father's commandments though they claim to believe while the son that at first rejects the father's command in the parable then goes and does it because he does believe.

I do not think it is a heresy to say that if you have faith, and do not doubt (very important part of that verse), and ask that you shall receive.

Though perhaps for the sake of all due diligence and Bible discussion and study we should investigate this to make sure it is not like a one-off example in the Bible. Let us see if there are other examples in the Bible, for we do not have to rely on this Rick Warren or for that matter, on any man. I think this episode comes to my mind next.

Luke 11:5-12
[SUP]5 [/SUP]And he said unto them, Which of you shall have a friend, and shall go unto him at midnight, and say unto him, Friend, lend me three loaves;
[SUP]6 [/SUP]For a friend of mine in his journey is come to me, and I have nothing to set before him?
[SUP]7 [/SUP]And he from within shall answer and say, Trouble me not: the door is now shut, and my children are with me in bed; I cannot rise and give thee.
[SUP]8 [/SUP]I say unto you, Though he will not rise and give him, because he is his friend, yet because of his importunity he will rise and give him as many as he needeth.
[SUP]9 [/SUP]And I say unto you, Ask, and it shall be given you; seek, and ye shall find; knock, and it shall be opened unto you.
[SUP]10 [/SUP]For every one that asketh receiveth; and he that seeketh findeth; and to him that knocketh it shall be opened.
[SUP]11 [/SUP]If a son shall ask bread of any of you that is a father, will he give him a stone? or if he ask a fish, will he for a fish give him a serpent?
[SUP]12 [/SUP]Or if he shall ask an egg, will he offer him a scorpion?
 

MarcR

Senior Member
Feb 12, 2015
5,486
183
63
#15
IMO Rick Warren began reasonably sound and has been drifting in a liberal direction since a few years before he published "Purpose Driven Life". This suggests that some people aren't able to handle wealth well; but I am not sure it is a sound principle.
 

stonesoffire

Poetic Member
Nov 24, 2013
10,665
1,829
113
#16
I posted the whole article, because I wanted all of Warren’s words, and tried to avoid out of context quotes, or rambling about what I heard, because that is gossip. I tried to basically exegete the passage and how it is at odds with the gospel.

I have no quarrel with you, SoF on the fact that we need the Holy Spirit in our lives and his power. We really accomplish nothing without the leading of the Holy Spirit. And certainly he enables us to do these things, with his power! Absolutely!

But, my concern is the “give to get” aspect of his teaching. This is so ungodly. So anti-gospel! Jesus gave everything for us, and got nothing in return! He not only left heaven, he died on a sinner’s cross, paying for our sins which he did not deserve. That is the full defintion of “giving WITHOUT getting!” Jesus example always, is giving and giving, and the way he did it was to pray, and be filled with the power of God.

But godly power is not an electricity station, which has to be fixed, and repaired, and certainly we need to pay for that power. The analogy is faulty. In fact, Jesus paid for the power, and he paid it all!

But not so we could go off and do our own thing, then give God lip service, then get his power to accomplish what we want to do.

In fact, the first step, the middle step, the final step and every step of our journey with God is submission and obedience. And being overwhelmingly grateful for God’s mercy and grace. And then, walking with Christ, not going off on our own, doing something, burning out and then asking God to bless us, and fill us.

We need to be asking God to lead us and guide us, first! When we are in his will, we don’t NEED to ask for power, it will already be ours. He will have given us the power to do the “mission” he has sent us to do.

I am not trying to create doubt about God, his power, his will for our life at all! I think I am trying to warn people to beware of wolves in sheep’s clothing. I was really surprised at this article. I have never read anything by him. (Maybe Purpose Driven Life a long time ago?? Which made no impression of me, obviously!)

The only reason I opened and read this article is because a close friend of mine, from Peru, who loves God, but always gets pulled into private magical, thinking posted it. I have been through this with her in the past, and several other discerning Christians. And then, the title alone, Giving to Get, more or less, was extremely worrisome to me, knowing her past!

I do thank you for reading it, and we will have to agree to disagree on our conclusions!
His power can be like electricity. I've been touched that way several times Angela. And you are right, we never move in our own or on our own. The word I couldn't think of was unction. We always have the unction or power coming upon one to perform His will, through His power. The unction is what separates those whomare in union with Him, and those who read, then presuppose they can do. Nothing about Holy Spirit.

So I didn't see what you saw about coveting. Just a teaching on the Holy Spirit and faith to do His unction of "work".

If you disagree with this, no problem. I can't make anyone agree.
 

stonesoffire

Poetic Member
Nov 24, 2013
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#17
IMO Rick Warren began reasonably sound and has been drifting in a liberal direction since a few years before he published "Purpose Driven Life". This suggests that some people aren't able to handle wealth well; but I am not sure it is a sound principle.
I remember now...something about including muslims? Was it chrislam? Will have to look if that is the word.
 

stonesoffire

Poetic Member
Nov 24, 2013
10,665
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#18
People tend to throw around being "anointed" of God. But that is generally where it ends.

Anointed to do what exactly?

It appears to me, biblically, that for a person to be anointed of God, it was always initiated by a particular and known task to which the person was being sent and empowered. It was always for God's glory, never mans.

Nowadays it's just something vague and nonspecific, and unfortunately too often it is for personal lusts and gain. People want to be able to say "I'm anointed" yet it appears to be all for self, for a spiritual buzz, a "look at me" but not for a specific task centering on the Gospel of Christ, God's glory or sound doctrine; Acts 1 & 2, and 1 John 2:27; 1 Thessalonians 4:9; 1 Corinthians 2:12; 2 Timothy 3:14-4:5.

"Anointed" to do what exactly?
The works of Jesus, heal the sick, cleanse lepers, raise dead, cast out Devils. We just medicate them in the USA..

Anointing upon, unction within. Holy Spirits giftings. By the authority of His name!
 

vic1980

Senior Member
Apr 25, 2013
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#19
I know some are going to jump up and down at my “misuse” of the word heretic. I have heard it said in many places Rick Warren had deviated from sound doctrine, today, a friend posted one of his blogs on FB, and I was stunned at the entire piece!

The more faith you have in God, the more power and the more blessings you will have in your life.”

This is what Warren says in his article, entitled, “To Get God’s Power, Give Him Your Trust.” We give to get?? To get... we give!! Horrific doctrine. Really, in real life, that is a narcissist’s words. It is “all about me!” I will give you something if I get something back. That is not the gospel, where Jesus died for our sins, because of his love for us. Not so we could manipulate him to get what we want. If a man gives a woman a gift so he can get her into bed, he is a womanizer and a user. So why would we take that same approach with God?

Now, I did put a question mark in the title for a reason. Warren seems to be more mixed up than a heretic! Read this, next quote and you will see he is talking about trusting God, which I agree is important!

That’s why it takes faith to what God wants you to do. You’ll never be able to do it on your own. You were never intended to be able to! Anything you can do in your own strength doesn’t require faith, and when faith is not required, we’re living faithlessly.”

Except, how does a born again believer live without faith? God gives us a measure of faith!


For by the grace given to me I say to everyone among you not to think of himself more highly than he ought to think, but to think with sober judgment, each according to the measure of faith that God has assigned.” Romans 12:3

Then there is this:

Without God’s power in your life, you’re just running on your own energy. And that’s like having a laptop that’s unplugged; the battery will eventually drain and all the power will be gone. Why would you live like that?Think of it like this: You’ve got a small battery in you. You can run through life on your own power, which means you’ll be tired all the time.
Or you have access to God’s power plant, provided you just plug in and admit you need God’s help. God has unlimited power to sustain your life and mission.”

Maybe I am foolish, but how can a born again believer not have God’s power? Well, for one thing, we need the guidiance and direction of the Holy Spirit, which he never zones in on. And yes, people do work in their own strength, I won’t deny that. But surely seeking God in prayer for his will, leading and guidance comes before needing power? And then there is submission to God’s will. That is about surrendering all, obeying God. Surely that is more important than power?

My final analysis is that Rick Warren does have some basic doctrine underneath this smozzle of twisted doctrines. But, he seems to be tickling ears, trying to attract the Health and Wealth people, using their doctrines without really understanding what he is saying. I really don’t think this is a good article, and now I will avoid him in future, because his message is mixed and confusing.

But I am interested in hearing what you have to say, particularly if you take the 2 minutes to click on the link and actually read the whole thing in context! Because context is important, and I would like to know if I am missing something or reading into this more than is there.


To Get God’s Power, Give Him Your Trust
Angela53510 Warren is aware of what he is doing , he himself has read it in the scriptures , clouds without water. One does not come into the truth in Jesus Christ , then connect with all sorts of other gospels , teachings , & other gods . While bringing in thousands of dollars with beyond heresy books & setting trap for thousands of souls into the mouth of the lion that has been waiting to devour them.

A blend of truth and lies has always been consider deception , and this worker ( Rick Warren ) is not of Jesus Christ.


But to those that are new to the Faith , beware of such teachers that preach a diffrent Christ. Always seek the truth in God Word.

Galatians 1:8 But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed.

Shalom
 
R

ruach

Guest
#20
IMO Rick Warren began reasonably sound and has been drifting in a liberal direction since a few years before he published "Purpose Driven Life". This suggests that some people aren't able to handle wealth well; but I am not sure it is a sound principle.
If you read the book, and know anything about Secular Marketing, you will find that Purpose driven life and Purpose driven church take the church through the playbook of secular marketing. Many compare his writings to that of Lee Iacocca who used similar strategies at Ford and Dodge Chrysler.

Some suggest and rumor monger that Rick Warren and his book Purpose Driven Church was the marketing plan for the seeker friendly movement and seeker friendly church. I believe some might be Right in those assessments.

I do not read or watch him.