Prophets Amongst Us
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Taken in context Paul in those verses is speaking about how love will endure and how we only see part of the picture while we are here on earth. Paul goes on to say all the gifts, sacrifices and talk are meaningless without love. I do not think Paul is speaking about whether or not the spiritual gifts have ceased.
1 Corinthians 13King James Version (KJV)
13 Though I speak with the tongues of men and of angels, and have not charity, I am become as sounding brass, or a tinkling cymbal.
2 And though I have the gift of prophecy, and understand all mysteries, and all knowledge; and though I have all faith, so that I could remove mountains, and have not charity, I am nothing.
3 And though I bestow all my goods to feed the poor, and though I give my body to be burned, and have not charity, it profiteth me nothing.
4 Charity suffereth long, and is kind; charity envieth not; charity vaunteth not itself, is not puffed up,
5 Doth not behave itself unseemly, seeketh not her own, is not easily provoked, thinketh no evil;
6 Rejoiceth not in iniquity, but rejoiceth in the truth;
7 Beareth all things, believeth all things, hopeth all things, endureth all things.
8 Charity never faileth: but whether there be prophecies, they shall fail; whether there be tongues, they shall cease; whether there be knowledge, it shall vanish away.
9 For we know in part, and we prophesy in part.
10 But when that which is perfect is come, then that which is in part shall be done away.
11 When I was a child, I spake as a child, I understood as a child, I thought as a child: but when I became a man, I put away childish things.
12 For now we see through a glass, darkly; but then face to face: now I know in part; but then shall I know even as also I am known.
13 And now abideth faith, hope, charity, these three; but the greatest of these is charity.
1 Corinthians 13King James Version (KJV)
13 Though I speak with the tongues of men and of angels, and have not charity, I am become as sounding brass, or a tinkling cymbal.
2 And though I have the gift of prophecy, and understand all mysteries, and all knowledge; and though I have all faith, so that I could remove mountains, and have not charity, I am nothing.
3 And though I bestow all my goods to feed the poor, and though I give my body to be burned, and have not charity, it profiteth me nothing.
4 Charity suffereth long, and is kind; charity envieth not; charity vaunteth not itself, is not puffed up,
5 Doth not behave itself unseemly, seeketh not her own, is not easily provoked, thinketh no evil;
6 Rejoiceth not in iniquity, but rejoiceth in the truth;
7 Beareth all things, believeth all things, hopeth all things, endureth all things.
8 Charity never faileth: but whether there be prophecies, they shall fail; whether there be tongues, they shall cease; whether there be knowledge, it shall vanish away.
9 For we know in part, and we prophesy in part.
10 But when that which is perfect is come, then that which is in part shall be done away.
11 When I was a child, I spake as a child, I understood as a child, I thought as a child: but when I became a man, I put away childish things.
12 For now we see through a glass, darkly; but then face to face: now I know in part; but then shall I know even as also I am known.
13 And now abideth faith, hope, charity, these three; but the greatest of these is charity.
And yet, not once has anybody witnessed the preachers who go there to proclaim God's message of salvation speak supernaturally in the tongue(s) of the audience present ... not in any of these countries. I can't help but wonder why that is, given that most or all who declare such things have this gift of tongues themselves ? I've yet to see a clip of any of them preaching anywhere where there isn't a native who already speaks their language on the stage interpreting the English/German/ .. whatever .. into their own tongue. Am I the only one here who finds this peculiar ?
Let me shine some light into this for you. The latter rain will include the signs in the heavens that were not part of the sign given at Pentecost. You have read Joel so you know that its there in the prophecy. The promise of the Holy Spirit was to all flesh again clearly shown in the text. The other signs were for Israel not for the Gentiles.
When another believer disparages Christ we all should be offended. You can disparage me but do not cast scorn and dishonor on Christ. Believers defend the faith which is the faith of Christ.
Men by the power of their own spirit do deceptive acts. When believers make unbiblical claims that are surely beyond outrageous then we all are made to appear foolish and unlearned.
Why do you wish to say that I am against the Holy Spirit? I have never said or insinuated that the Holy Spirit was not given by Jesus to believers in John 20. I fully support that the Holy Spirit filled the believers at Pentecost in Acts 2 as promised by Christ in Acts 1:8.
If you are going to claim that the Holy Spirit is moving in any given situation then you must find support for that in the bible. The Holy Spirit does not freelance but only moves within the word of God. Christ Himself did not freelance but worked within the will of the Father. It is unwise to cast off biblical reason to attain which is not.
For the cause of Christ
Roger
When another believer disparages Christ we all should be offended. You can disparage me but do not cast scorn and dishonor on Christ. Believers defend the faith which is the faith of Christ.
Men by the power of their own spirit do deceptive acts. When believers make unbiblical claims that are surely beyond outrageous then we all are made to appear foolish and unlearned.
Why do you wish to say that I am against the Holy Spirit? I have never said or insinuated that the Holy Spirit was not given by Jesus to believers in John 20. I fully support that the Holy Spirit filled the believers at Pentecost in Acts 2 as promised by Christ in Acts 1:8.
If you are going to claim that the Holy Spirit is moving in any given situation then you must find support for that in the bible. The Holy Spirit does not freelance but only moves within the word of God. Christ Himself did not freelance but worked within the will of the Father. It is unwise to cast off biblical reason to attain which is not.
For the cause of Christ
Roger
7
how would you know what the Holy Spirit is on about when you reject what the Bible says regarding Him?
you sound desperate when you start with your first fruits, latter fruits, Pentecost shenanigans and cherry picked verses and silly theories that cannot be found anywhere in scritpure
you cannot shed light on what you have no knowledge of
take care of your own logjam first
then you can talk
over and out
7
I believe this to be true
and I also believe that so much of the resistance to the gifts comes because the gifts are exalted and the person through whom they may flow
this ties in with people claiming gifts like prophecy or healing or teaching and they are none of those things
you cannot teach a person how to create or receive a gift when God declares HE DECIDES to give whichever gift He wants to WHOMEVER He wishes to
so many many movements now have this backwards and actually open schools and pray over people until some bogus anointing is manifested complete with twitching uncontrollably, bobbing like a cork or screaming loudly and rolling around
I have seen those 3 (and others) and all they do is put ALL eyes on the one doing it. this is not the Holy Spirit and again, one of the major reasons people walk away. I have walked away...I want less than nothing to do with that spiritual hocus pocus
this does not mean the gifts are all bogus but it does mean it is a 'bogus' anointing...demonic if you really want to know what I think
the Holy Spirit will keep your eyes on Jesus...not people acting in a bizarre manner
the Holy Spirit will glorify Jesus ... not a person on stage or the congregation and certainly not so called worship bands
and I also believe that so much of the resistance to the gifts comes because the gifts are exalted and the person through whom they may flow
this ties in with people claiming gifts like prophecy or healing or teaching and they are none of those things
you cannot teach a person how to create or receive a gift when God declares HE DECIDES to give whichever gift He wants to WHOMEVER He wishes to
so many many movements now have this backwards and actually open schools and pray over people until some bogus anointing is manifested complete with twitching uncontrollably, bobbing like a cork or screaming loudly and rolling around
I have seen those 3 (and others) and all they do is put ALL eyes on the one doing it. this is not the Holy Spirit and again, one of the major reasons people walk away. I have walked away...I want less than nothing to do with that spiritual hocus pocus
this does not mean the gifts are all bogus but it does mean it is a 'bogus' anointing...demonic if you really want to know what I think
the Holy Spirit will keep your eyes on Jesus...not people acting in a bizarre manner
the Holy Spirit will glorify Jesus ... not a person on stage or the congregation and certainly not so called worship bands
Baseless personal accusation. The Holy Spirit abides in my heart and moves to enable me to serve the Lord as a witness and testimony to the saving grace of God.
Perhaps a little honest research on your part is in order.
Again you attack me personally to what end? You have no counter argument of merit?
Again real nice. Sorry the bible causes you discomfort.
The Holy Spirit only operates within the word of God which is the bible.
John 16:12 I have yet many things to say unto you, but ye cannot bear them now.
13 Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come.
14 He shall glorify me: for he shall receive of mine, and shall shew it unto you.
15 All things that the Father hath are mine: therefore said I, that he shall take of mine, and shall shew it unto you.
Right from Jesus.
For the cause of Christ
Roger
Perhaps a little honest research on your part is in order.
Again you attack me personally to what end? You have no counter argument of merit?
Again real nice. Sorry the bible causes you discomfort.
The Holy Spirit only operates within the word of God which is the bible.
John 16:12 I have yet many things to say unto you, but ye cannot bear them now.
13 Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come.
14 He shall glorify me: for he shall receive of mine, and shall shew it unto you.
15 All things that the Father hath are mine: therefore said I, that he shall take of mine, and shall shew it unto you.
Right from Jesus.
For the cause of Christ
Roger
And yet Jesus said Lu 22:42 Saying, Father, if thou be willing, remove this cup from me: nevertheless not my will, but thine, be done.
The interaction within the Godhead is visible.
Heb 2:9 But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels for the suffering of death, crowned with glory and honour; that he by the grace of God should taste death for every man.
For the cause of Christ
Roger
The interaction within the Godhead is visible.
Heb 2:9 But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels for the suffering of death, crowned with glory and honour; that he by the grace of God should taste death for every man.
For the cause of Christ
Roger
Phil 2:5 Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus:
6 Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God:
7 But made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men:
8 And being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross.
9 Wherefore God also hath highly exalted him, and given him a name which is above every name:
10 That at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of things in heaven, and things in earth, and things under the earth;
11 And that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.
Especially to the glory of God the Father.
For the cause of Christ
Roger
6 Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God:
7 But made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men:
8 And being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross.
9 Wherefore God also hath highly exalted him, and given him a name which is above every name:
10 That at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of things in heaven, and things in earth, and things under the earth;
11 And that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.
Especially to the glory of God the Father.
For the cause of Christ
Roger