Question on 2 Thessalonians 1:8-9

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MatthewG

MatthewG

Banned
#1
Nov 19, 2016
258
7
0
#1
8In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ:
Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power; 2 Thessalonians 2 1:8-9

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in flaming fire, giving vengeance to those not knowing God, and to those not obeying the good news of our Lord Jesus Christ;

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who shall suffer justice -- destruction age-during -- from the face of the Lord, and from the glory of his strength, 2 Thessalonians 1:8-9

Do people who do not follow the gospel, suffer punishment, and an age during destruction, that is from being in the presence of the Lord, and from his Glory of His power?



Destruction in this manner doesn't mean to be completely wiped away, but a suffering of loss and undoing.
3639 ólethros (from ollymi/"destroy") – properly, ruination with its full, destructive results (LS). 3639 /ólethros ("ruination") however does not imply "extinction" (annihilation). Rather it emphasizes the consequent loss that goes with the complete "undoing."
 
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Locutus

Locutus

Senior Member
#2
Feb 10, 2017
5,928
685
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#2
"age during" is a literal rendition of the Greek, but it can have the meaning of "forever" - it needs to be understood in the context.

It looks like you are using Young's Literal

Strongs

G166 aionios ahee-o'-nee-os

from G165;

perpetual (also used of past time, or past and future as well).


KJV: eternal, for ever, everlasting, world (began)

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We see from aionios "aiwnion" is used in other passages where it is rendered "eternal":

(John 5:24 KJV) Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.


(John 5:24 Young's Literal) “Truly, truly, I say to you, he who hears My word, and believes Him who sent Me, has eternal life, and does not come into judgment, but has passed out of death into life.

Young's has "aiwnion" in John as eternal whereas in Thessalonians he has "age during".
 
E

Ellsworth1943

Guest
#3
#3
MatthewG said:
8In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ:
Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power; 2 Thessalonians 2 1:8-9

​
in flaming fire, giving vengeance to those not knowing God, and to those not obeying the good news of our Lord Jesus Christ;

​
who shall suffer justice -- destruction age-during -- from the face of the Lord, and from the glory of his strength, 2 Thessalonians 1:8-9

Do people who do not follow the gospel, suffer punishment, and an age during destruction, that is from being in the presence of the Lord, and from his Glory of His power?



Destruction in this manner doesn't mean to be completely wiped away, but a suffering of loss and undoing.
3639 ólethros (from ollymi/"destroy") – properly, ruination with its full, destructive results (LS). 3639 /ólethros ("ruination") however does not imply "extinction" (annihilation). Rather it emphasizes the consequent loss that goes with the complete "undoing."
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Why did you not include verse 7?
It clearly describes the coming of Jesus when He pours out His wrath on unbelievers.
 
Nehemiah6

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
#4
Jul 18, 2017
24,344
12,870
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#4
MatthewG said:
...and an age during destruction...
Click to expand...

Not sure what you mean by this. This passage reveals how the Lord pours our His wrath on the unbelieving and the ungodly. This passage is about the second coming of Christ with His saints and angels to bring judgment upon the enemies of Israel, Christians, and Christ.

 
O

OtherWay210

Guest
#5
#5
Anytime there is talk like that verse, its talking about the end times, the signs and the actual return and Judgment Day.
When the passages says destruction, how about just allow it to speak and accept it ? Both 1 and 2 Thess is about the return .

Matthew 10:28 And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.

That happens at the Lake of Fire. . Christ is not using symbolic language here, nor figures of speech. Hes speaking plain.
His plan language here, is what the figures of speech in revelation are talking about . People allow themselves to weave new doctrines, from figurative language they dont understand .

God is not literally burning people forever.
But the symbolic languages about Lake of Fire, is saying just as it says in Revelation, it is literally a second death. The death of the Soul, at the end of the Lords Day. Jesus is not talking in parable in Matthew 10:28. He speaking as plain as in John 3:16. The opposite of Everlasting life, is Perish.
 
OneFaith

OneFaith

Senior Member
#6
Sep 5, 2016
2,270
369
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#6
The Bible says that for those who know not God’s Word, that their conscience is a law onto themselves, and they will be judged according to that. But for those who have access to a Bible, are capable of reading it, and are capable of asking, seeking, and knocking for understanding through prayer- those are the ones who will be held accountable if they choose not to do so.

The gospel is the death, burial, and resurrection of Jesus Christ. We must obey this gospel by dying to ourself, burying our sinful self in the watery grave of baptism, and be raised a new creature in Christ. “Do you not know that all of us who were baptized into Christ Jesus were baptized into His death? If we join Him like this in His death, we will also join Him in His resurrection.” (Romans 6).




 
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mailmandan

mailmandan

Senior Member
#7
Apr 7, 2014
25,034
13,041
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#7
OneFaith said:
The gospel is the death, burial, and resurrection of Jesus Christ.
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Amen! The gospel is the "good news" of the death, burial and resurrection of Jesus Christ (1 Corinthians 15:1-4) and is the power of God unto salvation to everyone that BELIEVES.. (Romans 1:16). *Salvation by water baptism is NOT the gospel. To "believe" the gospel is to trust in the death, burial and resurrection of Christ as the ALL-sufficient means of our salvation.

The gospel is a message of grace to be received through faith. The gospel is not a set of rituals to perform, a code of laws or statutes to be obeyed or a check list of good works to accomplish (including water baptism) as a prerequisite for salvation.

We must obey this gospel by dying to ourself, burying our sinful self in the watery grave of baptism, and be raised a new creature in Christ. “Do you not know that all of us who were baptized into Christ Jesus were baptized into His death? If we join Him like this in His death, we will also join Him in His resurrection.” (Romans 6).
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You are confusing the picture (water baptism) with the reality (Spirit baptism). We obey the gospel by choosing to believe the gospel.

Romans 10:16 - But they have not all obeyed the gospel. For Isaiah says, "Lord, who has believed our report."




 
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