"The remnant of her seed", Literal or Spiritual Israel.

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TMS

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Mar 21, 2015
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#1
Today i hear and read many theories about Israel being seperate or set aside for a special reason.
But we know that the book of Revelation has many Spiritual meanings implied, so how do we know if it is Spiritual Israel or literal Israel?

The seed = the offspring
The woman = the church
the remnant = a part that is left after the greater part has been used, removed, or destroyed. (Remaining part)

Gen 3:15 And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise his heel.

Adams seed (single) = Jesus, The seed that came and bruised the serpents (Satans, Dragons) head.

Gal 3:16 Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ.

Rev 12:17 And the dragon (satan) was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed (single = Jesus), which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.

If the woman is Gods church that produced the seed (Jesus), it is the remnant of that seed, who Satan will attack.

The remnant = the true Christian's that follow Jesus.

Jesus didn't have any literal children.

Joh 12:23 And Jesus answered them, saying, The hour is come, that the Son of man should be glorified.
Joh 12:24 Verily, verily, I say unto you, Except a corn of wheat fall into the ground and die, it abideth alone: but if it die, it bringeth forth much fruit.

Gal 3:29 And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.

Seed = Jesus
Remnant = Jesus's Seed's

In the next post i will give 10 reasons why Gods Israel is not literal today.
 

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
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#2
Today i hear and read many theories about Israel being seperate or set aside for a special reason.
But we know that the book of Revelation has many Spiritual meanings implied, so how do we know if it is Spiritual Israel or literal Israel?
Unless you study the entire Bible and what is revealed about Israel, you will go into error. Revelation is the culmination of all prophecies but you will have to start at Genesis to understand that God had a plan for "literal" Israel (the 12 tribes) which has not been fulfilled and which remains to be fulfilled. This verse is only a partial promise to future redeemed and restored Israel.

In the same day the LORD made a covenant with Abram, saying, Unto thy seed have I given this land, from the river of Egypt unto the great river, the river Euphrates (Gen 15:18).

The land occupied currently by the SECULAR nation-state of Israel is about 1/10 of what God has promised, but that promise can only be fulfilled after the second coming of Christ.

As to "spiritual Israel" the correct term is "the Church" (redeemed Jews and Gentles in one Body, with believing Israel as the "good olive tree" and believing Gentiles as branches from the "wild olive tree" grafted into believing Israel. The Church will be a separate entity from redeemed and restored Israel.
 
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Jun 5, 2017
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#3
Unless you study the entire Bible and what is revealed about Israel, you will go into error.
This is a good point here you make here.

WHO ARE GOD'S ISRAEL IN THE NEW COVENANT?

Let's look at the scriptures.......

Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He says not, and to seeds, as of many; but as of one, AND TO YOUR SEED, WHICH IS CHRIST (Galatians 3:16)

Abraham’s seed is Israel.........

THERE IS NEITHER JEW NOR GREEK, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: FOR YOU ALL ONE IN CHRIST JESUS AND IF YOU BE CHRISTS, THEN YOU ARE ABRAHAM'S SEED FOR YOU ARE ALL ONE IN CHRIST JESUS and IF YOU BE CHRISTS, THEN ARE YOU ABRAHAM'S SEED, AND HEIRS ACCORDING TO THE PROMISE (Galatians 3:28).

No explanation needed, believe God's Word, and again..........

FOR THEY ARE NOT ALL ISRAEL WHICH ARE OF ISRAEL,: NEITHER, BECAUSE THEY ARE THE SEED OF ABRAHAM, ARE THEY ALL CHILDREN: but in Isaac shall thy seed be called <Christ> That is, THEY WHICH ARE THE CHILDREN OF THE FLESH, THESE ARE NOT THE CHILDREN OF GOD: BUT THE CHILDREN OF THE PROMISE <those who believe> ARE COUNTED FOR THE SEED (Romans 9:6).

FOR HE IS NOT A JEW WHICH IS ONE OUTWARDLY; NEITHER IS THAT CIRCUMCISION, WHICH IS OUTWARDS IN THE FLESH: BUT HE IS A JEW WHICH IS ONE INWARDLY; and CIRCUMCISION IS OF THE HEART, IN THE SPIRIT, AND NOT IN THE LETTER; whose praise is not of men, but of God. (Romans 2:28-29)

God's Israel...............

Galatians 3:28-29,
THERE IS NEITHER JEW NOR GREEK, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus. And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.
Colossians 3:11,
WHERE THERE IS NEITHER JEW NOR GREEK circumcision nor uncircumcision, Barbarian, Scythian, bond nor free: but Christ is all, and in all.

Romans 10:11-13,
For the scripture saith, Whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed. FOR THERE IS NO DIFFERENCE BETWEEN JEW OR GREEK: for the same Lord over all is rich unto all that call upon him. FOR WHOSOEVER SHALL CALL UPON THE NAME OF THE LORD SHALL BE SAVED.

Romans 2:28-29,
FOR HE IS NOT A JEW WHICH IS ONE OUTWARDLY; neither is that circumcision, which is outward in the flesh: BUT HE IS A JEW WHICH IS ONE INWARDLY ; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God.

The New Covenant is for God's Israel..........

Jeremiah 31:33-4,
BUT THIS IS THE COVENANT THAT I WILL MAKE WITH THE HOUSE OF ISRAEL; After those days, says the LORD, I WILL PUT MY LAW IN THEIR INWARD PARTS,AND WRITE IT IN THEIR HEARTS; and will be their God, and they shall be my people. And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the LORD: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, says the LORD: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more.

Hebrews 8:10-12,
BUT THIS IS THE COVENANT THAT I WILL MAKE WITH THE HOUSE OF ISRAEL; After those days, says the LORD, I WILL PUT MY LAW IN THEIR INWARD PARTS, AND WRITE IT IN THEIR HEARTS; and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people: And they shall not teach every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the Lord: for all shall know me, from the least to the greatest. For I will be merciful to their unrighteousness, and their sins and their iniquities will I remember no more.

Hebrews 10:14-17,
For by one offering he hath perfected for ever them that are sanctified. Whereof the Holy Ghost also is a witness to us: for after that he had said before, this is the covenant that I will make with them after those days, says the Lord, I WILL PUT MY LAWS INTO THEIR HEARTS, AND INTO THEOR MINDS WILL I WRITE THEM; and their sins and iniquities will I remember no more.

Galatians 3:29,
AND IF YOU BE CHRISTS THEN YOU ARE ABRAHAMS SEED AND HEIRS ACCORDING TO THE PROMISE.

The New Covenant is for God's Israel which represent those who BELIEVE and FOLLOW God’s WORD. If you are not part of God's Israel you are not part of the New Covenant (Hebrews 8:10-12).

God's Israel are those that believe the Word of God and follow it and is why Jesus says If you love me keep my commandments (John 14:15)

Practicing KNOWN SIN will keep all who reject God’s GIFT out of God’s KINGDOM and the proclamation will be announced DEPART from me you who work SIN I never KNEW you (Matthew 7:23; 1 John 3:3-10; 1 John 2:3-4; Hebrews 10:26-27)

If you are not a part of God's Israel you are not a part of the NEW COVENANT

……………….

In times of ignorance God winks at but now calls all men everywhere to repent (Acts 17:30-31). God's Word says if we break one of the ten we stand guilty before God of breaking all the commandments of God (James 2:8-12). God's 4th commandment is one of the ten (Exodus 20:8-11) and if we break it like any of the other commandments we stand guilty before God of SIN (Exodus 20:1-17).

If we break any of God’s Laws we stand guilty before God in SIN (James 2:11; Romans 7:7; 1 John 3:4; Romans 3:20). This includes the 4th commandment which is one of the ten (Exodus 20:8-11)

Sunday worship is a tradition and teaching of man that has lead many to break the commandments of God. Jesus says that if we follow the traditions of man that break the commandments of God we are not following God (Matthew 15:3-9)

Who should we follow the teachings and traditions of men or the Word of God? Who should we believe the Words of men or the Word of God?
 
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TMS

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#4
Revelation has many spirital meanings like dragon and scarlet woman and all the beasts, which all apply to our literal world (past, present and future). So to understand it we need to study the whole Bible and find the keys to the meaning of each.

Is Babylon literal today? No, This city and nation represents the enemy of God, and in contrast Jerusalem and Israel represents the people and city of God. But is it literal Israel or a spiritual representative of...?

Gentiles and Jews are no longer a separate people
There is one Israel which include all the saved.

1. One fold - Joh 10:16 And other sheep I have, which are not of this fold: them also I must bring, and they shall hear my voice; and there shall be one fold, and one shepherd.
- Joh 11:51 And this spake he not of himself: but being high priest that year, he prophesied that Jesus should die for that nation; 52 And not for that nation only, but that also he should gather together in one the children of God that were scattered abroad.

2. One Israel - Not by blood but by relationship with Jesus.
- Gal 3:26 For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus. 27 For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ. 28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.
- Rom 2:28 For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; neither is that circumcision, which is outward in the flesh:
Rom 2:29 But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God.
- Rom 9:6 Not as though the word of God hath taken none effect. For they are not all Israel, which are of Israel: 7 Neither, because they are the seed of Abraham, are they all children: but, In Isaac shall thy seed be called. 8 That is, They which are the children of the flesh, these are not the children of God: but the children of the promise are counted for the seed.
3. One Body - Eph 2:13 But now in Christ Jesus ye who sometimes were far off are made nigh by the blood of Christ. Eph 2:14 For he is our peace, who hath made both one, and hath broken down the middle wall of partition between us; 15 Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace; 16 And that he might reconcile both unto God in one body by the cross, having slain the enmity thereby: 7 And came and preached peace to you which were afar off, and to them that were nigh. 18 For through him we both have access by one Spirit unto the Father.
- 1Co 12:13 For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.
- Eph 3:6 That the Gentiles should be fellowheirs, and of the same body, and partakers of his promise in Christ by the gospel:
-
Col 1:18 And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence. - Col 1:24 Who now rejoice in my sufferings for you, and fill up that which is behind of the afflictions of Christ in my flesh for his body's sake, which is the church:



notice the oneness .

4. One City - Rev 21:2 And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.
- Rev 21:12 And had a wall great and high, and had twelve gates, and at the gates twelve angels, and names written thereon, which are the names of the twelve tribes of the children of Israel: - 14 And the wall of the city had twelve foundations, and in them the names of the twelve apostles of the Lamb. Notice the old and new Testament parts.
- Heb 11:9 By faith he sojourned in the land of promise, as in a strange country, dwelling in tabernacles with Isaac and Jacob, the heirs with him of the same promise:
Heb 11:10 For he looked for a city which hath foundations, whose builder and maker is God.
Heb 11:13 These all died in faith, not having received the promises, but having seen them afar off, and were persuaded of them, and embraced them, and confessed that they were strangers and pilgrims on the earth. 14 For they that say such things declare plainly that they seek a country. 15 And truly, if they had been mindful of that country from whence they came out, they might have had opportunity to have returned. 16 But now they desire a better country, that is, an heavenly: wherefore God is not ashamed to be called their God: for he hath prepared for them a city.
Heb 11:17 By faith Abraham, when he was tried, offered up Isaac: and he that had received the promises offered up his only begotten son,


5. One Woman - One Church. - Rev 12:1 And there appeared a great wonder in heaven; a woman clothed with the sun, and the moon under her feet, and upon her head a crown of twelve stars: 2 And she being with child cried, travailing in birth, and pained to be delivered.
This must be literal Israel, who gave birth to Jesus.
-Rev 12:5 And she brought forth a man child, who was to rule all nations with a rod of iron: and her child was caught up unto God, and to his throne. 6 And the woman fled into the wilderness, where she hath a place prepared of God, that they should feed her there a thousand two hundred and threescore days.
Notice the same woman that gave birth to Jesus fled into the wilderness for 1260 days\years. There isn't 2 women, one that is Jewish and one that is gentile.


6. One Olive Tree = Christs kingdom - Rom 11:16 For if the firstfruit be holy, the lump is also holy: and if the root be holy, so are the branches. (Jesus is the root, we are the branches. One tree)
Rom 11:17 And if some of the branches be broken off, and thou, being a wild olive tree, wert graffed in among them, and with them partakest of the root and fatness of the olive tree; 18 Boast not against the branches. But if thou boast, thou bearest not the root, but the root thee. 19 Thou wilt say then, The branches were broken off, that I might be graffed in. 20 Well; because of unbelief they were broken off, and thou standest by faith. Be not highminded, but fear: 21 For if God spared not the natural branches, take heed lest he also spare not thee. 22 Behold therefore the goodness and severity of God: on them which fell, severity; but toward thee, goodness, if thou continue in his goodness: otherwise thou also shalt be cut off. 23 And they also, if they abide not still in unbelief, shall be graffed in: for God is able to graff them in again. 24 For if thou wert cut out of the olive tree which is wild by nature, and wert graffed contrary to nature into a good olive tree: how much more shall these, which be the natural branches, be graffed into their own olive tree?
Rom 11:25 For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.
Rom 11:26 And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob: 27 For this is my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins.

Israel is those that are part of the Olive tree, including the wild (gentile) olive branches. Notice that it isn't 2 trees but one tree and life comes from the roots of that one tree.

8. One Banquet Table in Heaven - Mat 8:11 And I say unto you, That many shall come from the east and west, and shall sit down with Abraham, and Isaac, and Jacob, in the kingdom of heaven. Mat 8:12 But the children of the kingdom shall be cast out into outer darkness: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.


Gentile from the East and west shall sit down with Abraham in the Kingdom of Heaven, there will not be two tables.

9. Only one song. - Rev 15:3 And they sing the song of Moses the servant of God, and the song of the Lamb, saying, Great and marvellous are thy works, Lord God Almighty; just and true are thy ways, thou King of saints.
Rev 15:4 Who shall not fear thee, O Lord, and glorify thy name? for thou only art holy: for all nations shall come and worship before thee; for thy judgments are made manifest.

The song will be song by all saints.

10. Only one Father - How do we become children of God the Father?
Gal 3:26 For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus. 27 For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ. 28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus. 29 And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.
We become seeds of Abraham through Jesus.
Joh 1:12 But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name: 13 Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.

It comes down to our relationship and character.
Joh 8:44 Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.

We are part of the church of Christ through Christ, the One people and one church is not defined by blood line but by faith in Jesus. Being Israel today means to be in Christ.
 

prove-all

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May 16, 2014
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#5
Gen 3:15 And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between
thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise his heel.

Satan would be against or strife with the woman's [Eve] seed, or [man],
and would cause Christ to have to suffer and die for us.

But later Christ would bruise his head, by removing satan as god
of this current age [Thy Kingdom come]


The first good news of the coming kingdom on earth, and to replace satan
 

Metternich

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Jan 13, 2018
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#6
Women do not have seed. The woman spoken of in Gn 3:15 is Mary and her seed is Jesus. For a woman to have seed would imply a virgin birth.
 

Metternich

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Jan 13, 2018
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#7
In Rev 12 we see a woman clothed with the sun. At the end of chapter 11 we are about to see the Ark of the Covenant. And we do in the woman. She if Mary. Remember the 3 things the original ark carried. The Ten Commandments, a container of manna, and Aarons staff. All three referred to Jesus, the word of God, the bread of life, and the high priest. While Mary carried Jesus she was the new Ark of the Covenant.
 

TMS

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#8
So will Jesus rule in literal Jerusalem over literal Jews or will He rule in the kingdom that God makes (heavenly, Jerusalem in Heaven), over spiritual Israel (all that believe).
 
Mar 28, 2016
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#9
This is a good point here you make here.

WHO ARE GOD'S ISRAEL IN THE NEW COVENANT?

Let's look at the scriptures.......

Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He says not, and to seeds, as of many; but as of one, AND TO YOUR SEED, WHICH IS CHRIST (Galatians 3:16)

Abraham’s seed is Israel.........
Abraham’s seeds(many) fleshly as that seen is Israel.........an outward unconverted Jew as that seen .

Abraham’s seed (singular Christ) is the spiritual seed not seen, the faith principle.
 
Mar 28, 2016
15,954
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#10
In Rev 12 we see a woman clothed with the sun. At the end of chapter 11 we are about to see the Ark of the Covenant. And we do in the woman. She if Mary. Remember the 3 things the original ark carried. The Ten Commandments, a container of manna, and Aarons staff. All three referred to Jesus, the word of God, the bread of life, and the high priest. While Mary carried Jesus she was the new Ark of the Covenant.
A person must look to the spiritual understanding hid in that parable (Revelation 12) it represent the whole body of Christ the church. She as a chaste virgin bride of Christ our husband shown as not fornificating with the gods of this world. She is considered the mother of us all as new creatures no longer after the flesh...no longer considered Jew or Gentile, male or female but again a new creation. Again she is considered the mother of us all.

Paul is shown being used as a surrogate mother in that way in hope as he held out the gospel in a hope Christ would be formed in those he brings the gospel to

Galatians 4:19 My little children, of whom I travail in birth again until Christ be formed in you,

Would to God ye could bear with me a little in my folly: and indeed bear with me.For I am jealous over you with godly jealousy: for I have espoused you to one husband, that I may present you as a chaste virgin to Christ. 2Co 11:1

She as a chaste virgin bride is the one signified by the word hundred and forty and four thousand . They are not as those defiled with the strange woman or queen of heaven but again are those who do not violate the first commandment not to fornicate with the gods of this world.


And they sung as it were a new song before the throne, and before the four beasts, and the elders: and no man could learn that song but the hundred and forty and four thousand, which were redeemed from the earth.( Not just men) These are they which were not defiled with women; for they are virgins. These are they which follow the Lamb whithersoever he goeth. These were redeemed from among men, (not all are men but mankind.. both male and female ...) being the firstfruits unto God and to the Lamb.Rev 14:3
 

Johnny_B

Senior Member
Mar 18, 2017
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#11
Today i hear and read many theories about Israel being seperate or set aside for a special reason.
But we know that the book of Revelation has many Spiritual meanings implied, so how do we know if it is Spiritual Israel or literal Israel?

The seed = the offspring
The woman = the church
the remnant = a part that is left after the greater part has been used, removed, or destroyed. (Remaining part)

Gen 3:15 And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise his heel.

Adams seed (single) = Jesus, The seed that came and bruised the serpents (Satans, Dragons) head.

Gal 3:16 Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ.

Rev 12:17 And the dragon (satan) was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed (single = Jesus), which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.

If the woman is Gods church that produced the seed (Jesus), it is the remnant of that seed, who Satan will attack.

The remnant = the true Christian's that follow Jesus.

Jesus didn't have any literal children.

Joh 12:23 And Jesus answered them, saying, The hour is come, that the Son of man should be glorified.
Joh 12:24 Verily, verily, I say unto you, Except a corn of wheat fall into the ground and die, it abideth alone: but if it die, it bringeth forth much fruit.

Gal 3:29 And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.

Seed = Jesus
Remnant = Jesus's Seed's

In the next post i will give 10 reasons why Gods Israel is not literal today.


He has not given up on physical Israel, Romans 11:1-2 “I ask, then, has God rejected his people? By no means! For I myself am an Israelite, a descendant of Abraham, a member of the tribe of Benjamin.2 God has not rejected his people whom he foreknew. Do you not know what the Scripture says of Elijah, how he appeals to God against Israel?”
 

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
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#12
So will Jesus rule in literal Jerusalem over literal Jews or will He rule in the kingdom that God makes (heavenly, Jerusalem in Heaven), over spiritual Israel (all that believe).
What you insist on calling "spiritual Israel" is the Church (the saints of God), who will be kings and priests in the eternal Kingdom of God. They will live and reign with Christ over the nations (and possibly other worlds in the universe) whereas Christ will rule over literal Israel, with literal Jerusalem, and a literal temple, through literal David, and the twelve apostles (all of which were Jews).
 

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
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#13
Abraham’s seeds(many) fleshly as that seen is Israel.........an outward unconverted Jew as that seen .
Not unconverted Jews (whose father -- Christ said -- was the Devil) but believing Jews and believing Israel.
 

TMS

Senior Member
Mar 21, 2015
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#14
What you insist on calling "spiritual Israel" is the Church (the saints of God), who will be kings and priests in the eternal Kingdom of God. They will live and reign with Christ over the nations (and possibly other worlds in the universe) whereas Christ will rule over literal Israel, with literal Jerusalem, and a literal temple, through literal David, and the twelve apostles (all of which were Jews).
If you read post 4 there isn't a separation between the two groups, all that believe are part of the same group through Christ.
The literal was Christ in Heaven when it comes to the sacrifices and temple.
Heb 8:5 Who serve unto the example and shadow of heavenly things, as Moses was admonished of God when he was about to make the tabernacle: for, See, saith he, that thou make all things according to the pattern shewed to thee in the mount.
Heb 8:6 But now hath he obtained a more excellent ministry, by how much also he is the mediator of a better covenant, which was established upon better promises.
 

louis

Senior Member
Nov 1, 2017
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#15
Remnant indicates a few who come out of the 1,260 days of travailing/tribulation with their skins.
 
Dec 12, 2013
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#16
Jesus will sit on the throne of his father DAVID <----either this is a lie or He will rule over an earthly Kingdom during his reign...there are numerous scriptures that point to a literal rule on this planet before the heavenly age and that rule being from Jerusalem, over the nation Israel and ALL Gentile world powers flowing into it to glorify the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob.
 

louis

Senior Member
Nov 1, 2017
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#17
Jesus will sit on the throne of his father DAVID <----either this is a lie or He will rule over an earthly Kingdom during his reign...there are numerous scriptures that point to a literal rule on this planet before the heavenly age and that rule being from Jerusalem, over the nation Israel and ALL Gentile world powers flowing into it to glorify the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob.
Correct, there are numerous scriptures indicating the Lord will rule over the whole world from Jerusalem.
I imagine this is where the gathered of the Lord will be.
 

TMS

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Mar 21, 2015
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#18
REMEMBER THE MISTAKE THE JEWS MADE WHEN JESUS CAME THE FIRST TIME.
they were looking for an Earthly kingdom.
Joh 18:36 Jesus answered, My kingdom is not of this world: if my kingdom were of this world, then would my servants fight, that I should not be delivered to the Jews: but now is my kingdom not from hence.
Joh 18:37 Pilate therefore said unto him, Art thou a king then? Jesus answered, Thou sayest that I am a king. To this end was I born, and for this cause came I into the world, that I should bear witness unto the truth. Every one that is of the truth heareth my voice.

They read the promises made to the Jews and thought that Jesus would rule and deliver them from the Romans, but He didn't. Is it possible for you to make the same mistake?

Yes, Jesus will ultimately rule the world but is it before or after the thousand years. If the New Jerusalem comes down to Earth from Heaven and Jesus has a throne in this City then a man made one would be poor and insufficient.
 

TMS

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Mar 21, 2015
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#19
Rev 21:1 And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea.
Rev 21:2 And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.
 

Johnny_B

Senior Member
Mar 18, 2017
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#20
Jesus will sit on the throne of his father DAVID <----either this is a lie or He will rule over an earthly Kingdom during his reign...there are numerous scriptures that point to a literal rule on this planet before the heavenly age and that rule being from Jerusalem, over the nation Israel and ALL Gentile world powers flowing into it to glorify the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob.

We seem to be on the same Scriptural track, I know there are many that do not see that. This is why I cannot call myself a Reformer or Calvinist and because I believe that He is not done with Israel yet. I believe in the Doctrines of Grace, but I also believe in the Millennial reign of Christ as well or the kingdom of David His earthly father. But I am not a dispensationalist (if that's the way it is spelled) either.

Here is what I am looking into, they are covenant they claim not to be replacement, this is what caught my interest, because they believe in the dealing with Israel by the Lord and not passing over them.

https://heidelblog.net/2013/08/covenant-theology-is-not-replacement-theology/

I mean come on who can read Romans 9-11 and go away thinking that the Lord is done with Israel? Not anyone that understands the Word of God, if you can read Romamns 9-11 and walk away thinking that the Lord is done with Israel you have preconcieved ideas about the Bible, Israel, and His promise to Abraham, I want no part of that because the Lord is faithful to His Word and His promises to His people.