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Thread: I am curious

  1. #1
    Senior Member oldhermit's Avatar
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    Default I am curious

    How many on here believe that Paul was not a legitimate apostle; and please give reasons for your answer.

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    Default Re: I am curious

    whaaaat

    ive seen a post like this recently

    it makes no sense


    paul was definitely a legitimate apostle


    652. apostolos ►
    Strong's Concordance
    apostolos: a messenger, one sent on a mission, an apostle
    Original Word: ἀπόστολος, ου, ὁ
    Part of Speech: Noun, Masculine
    Transliteration: apostolos
    Phonetic Spelling: (ap-os'-tol-os)
    Short Definition: an apostle, a messenger, an envoy, a delegate
    Definition: a messenger, envoy, delegate, one commissioned by another to represent him in some way, especially a man sent out by Jesus Christ Himself to preach the Gospel; an apostle.




    to not believe this means you think there is error in the bible

    you might as well pick and choose which verses to believe and reject



    (not implying you think that he isnt hermit)

  3. #3
    Senior Member oldhermit's Avatar
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    Default Re: I am curious

    Well, Luke certainly testified to the fact that he was, but some do not believe that. I think this is due largely to the fact that many people simply do not like much of what Paul had to say or how he said it.

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    Senior Member Gracie_14's Avatar
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    Default Re: I am curious

    Quote Originally Posted by NoNameMcgee View Post
    whaaaat

    ive seen a post like this recently

    it makes no sense


    paul was definitely a legitimate apostle


    652. apostolos ►
    Strong's Concordance
    apostolos: a messenger, one sent on a mission, an apostle
    Original Word: ἀπόστολος, ου, ὁ
    Part of Speech: Noun, Masculine
    Transliteration: apostolos
    Phonetic Spelling: (ap-os'-tol-os)
    Short Definition: an apostle, a messenger, an envoy, a delegate
    Definition: a messenger, envoy, delegate, one commissioned by another to represent him in some way, especially a man sent out by Jesus Christ Himself to preach the Gospel; an apostle.




    to not believe this means you think there is error in the bible

    you might as well pick and choose which verses to believe and reject



    (not implying you think that he isnt hermit)
    what a neat explanation there NNM
    NoNameMcgee and Deade like this.

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    Senior Member Gracie_14's Avatar
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    Default Re: I am curious

    Quote Originally Posted by oldhermit View Post
    How many on here believe that Paul was not a legitimate apostle; and please give reasons for your answer.
    hey dude, umm, no i dont think Paul was NOT a legitamate apostle. there you go! NNM explained it well
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    Senior Member trofimus's Avatar
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    Default Re: I am curious

    If somebody believes that Paul was not send by Christ to preach gospel to nations, he will have to also deal with three other things:

    1. Wrong Bible (full of Paul´s letters)
    2. Wrong witnessing of Peter about Paul (he said that Paul writes Scriptures)
    3. Very mislead Church (because Church recognized Paul as inspired and special apostle of Christ)
    Do not be worried about many things - only one thing is needed (Lk 10:41-42).

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    Default Re: I am curious

    I'm not going to get into a debate. All I'll say is this:

    You would think that if Paul wasn't a legitimate apostle, God would not have allowed the book of Acts and his letters to be part of the New Testament.
    Last edited by Stranger36147; 1 Week Ago at 10:16 AM.

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    Default Re: I am curious

    Quote Originally Posted by oldhermit View Post
    How many on here believe that Paul was not a legitimate apostle; and please give reasons for your answer.
    Only one qualification needed . Sent by God. God sends all his prophets with His prophecy .It would appear he has sent you as an legitimate apostle.
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    Senior Member oldhermit's Avatar
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    Default Re: I am curious

    I know full well there are people on this forum who do not believe Paul was a true apostle. I am still waiting to hear from them and find out why they believe this.

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    Default Re: I am curious

    Quote Originally Posted by Stranger36147 View Post
    I'm not going to get into a debate. All I'll say is this:

    You would think that if Paul wasn't a legitimate apostle, God would not have allowed the book of Acts and his letters to be part of the New Testament.

    Yes one sent with prophecy.
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    Senior Member Gracie_14's Avatar
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    Default Re: I am curious

    Quote Originally Posted by oldhermit View Post
    I know full well there are people on this forum who do not believe Paul was a true apostle. I am still waiting to hear from them and find out why they believe this.
    hmm, i wonder if they'll reveal themselves anytime soon
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  12. #12


    gb9
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    Default Re: I am curious

    well, I was told a few months ago, by a longtime member on here, that " real , true, mature Christians do not need to read Paul's letters, they were for churches who have problems. if one does not have those problems, they do not need to read them".

    I will not name the person, I will say he has a menorah as his avatar.

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    Senior Member dcontroversal's Avatar
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    Default Re: I am curious

    Two things stand out at me concerning Paul's apostleship......

    a. Many reject what Paul has to say because it contradicts their religious persuasion......
    b. Many reject what Paul has to say because on a cursory glance it seems to contradict what Jesus taught......

    In my mind one of the biggest errors committed today by many is the simple fact that the words of JESUS are not interpreted in light of the fact that he was born, lived and died UNDER THE LAW which RATIFIED the NEW COVENANT.......The words of JESUS and of PAUL must be interpreted in light of this fact.

    The "many things" that JESUS still had to say, but the disciples were NOT YET READY are found in the inspired words of PAUL unto the churches......

    PAUL was definitely the apostle unto the Lord's churches and unto the Gentiles that were being folded in with the JEWS as the two became one......

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    Senior Member dcontroversal's Avatar
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    Default Re: I am curious

    Quote Originally Posted by gb9 View Post
    well, I was told a few months ago, by a longtime member on here, that " real , true, mature Christians do not need to read Paul's letters, they were for churches who have problems. if one does not have those problems, they do not need to read them".

    I will not name the person, I will say he has a menorah as his avatar.
    WOW..........one word comes to mind with the above view..........

    ig·no·rance
    ˈiɡnərəns/
    noun
    noun: ignorance

    • lack of knowledge or information





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    Default Re: I am curious

    I do not believe in Paul being a true apostle...yes his writings have good things in them but they are way too influenced by Judaism and pharisaical type laws/practices...plus I believe the RCC manipulated a lot of the texts to control people/future believers ....I totally disagree with the statement from Paul about "follow me as I follow Christ" like what the heck Paul? We should follow Christ not some middleman...paul is not my mediator he's a sinner just like me........only Jesus is a righteous mediator....

    Plus he has all these rules about marriage and women's role in church and appearance etc... and the man himself was never married......seems a bit hypocritical....

    A lot of the modern church structure of being under pastors bishops etc was from Paul due to his pharisee background....

    Jesus never said for any of this "church hierarchy stuff to occur" in fact many early Christians did not have "organized church" as we now know it....most were a group of believers who met for prayer and had someone like Apostle peter or John preach to them and then when that apostle left to another town they continued to meet together....there was no lording of authority over their fellow brethren and each person was one-on-one with Christ in a relationship.....

    now let the wolves come and try to rip me lol....i got thick skin :P
    I am the former ultimatum77.....dah dah dah......

  16. #16
    Senior Member oldhermit's Avatar
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    Default Re: I am curious

    Quote Originally Posted by razor17 View Post
    I do not believe in Paul being a true apostle...yes his writings have good things in them but they are way too influenced by Judaism and pharisaical type laws/practices...plus I believe the RCC manipulated a lot of the texts to control people/future believers ....I totally disagree with the statement from Paul about "follow me as I follow Christ" like what the heck Paul? We should follow Christ not some middleman...paul is not my mediator he's a sinner just like me........only Jesus is a righteous mediator....

    Plus he has all these rules about marriage and women's role in church and appearance etc... and the man himself was never married......seems a bit hypocritical....

    A lot of the modern church structure of being under pastors bishops etc was from Paul due to his pharisee background....

    Jesus never said for any of this "church hierarchy stuff to occur" in fact many early Christians did not have "organized church" as we now know it....most were a group of believers who met for prayer and had someone like Apostle peter or John preach to them and then when that apostle left to another town they continued to meet together....there was no lording of authority over their fellow brethren and each person was one-on-one with Christ in a relationship.....

    now let the wolves come and try to rip me lol....i got thick skin :P
    Do you believe that Luke was an inspired writer and that everything he wrote was given to him from the Lord?

    Do you believe the testimony of Peter concerning Paul is trustworthy?

  17. #17
    Senior Member dcontroversal's Avatar
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    Default Re: I am curious

    Quote Originally Posted by razor17 View Post
    I do not believe in Paul being a true apostle...yes his writings have good things in them but they are way too influenced by Judaism and pharisaical type laws/practices...plus I believe the RCC manipulated a lot of the texts to control people/future believers ....I totally disagree with the statement from Paul about "follow me as I follow Christ" like what the heck Paul? We should follow Christ not some middleman...paul is not my mediator he's a sinner just like me........only Jesus is a righteous mediator....

    Plus he has all these rules about marriage and women's role in church and appearance etc... and the man himself was never married......seems a bit hypocritical....

    A lot of the modern church structure of being under pastors bishops etc was from Paul due to his pharisee background....

    Jesus never said for any of this "church hierarchy stuff to occur" in fact many early Christians did not have "organized church" as we now know it....most were a group of believers who met for prayer and had someone like Apostle peter or John preach to them and then when that apostle left to another town they continued to meet together....there was no lording of authority over their fellow brethren and each person was one-on-one with Christ in a relationship.....

    now let the wolves come and try to rip me lol....i got thick skin :P
    Paul did not say or indicate that he was in any way shape or form a mediator between God and MEN....on the contrary HE CONSTANLTY pointed to CHRIST as the ONE and only MEDIATOR between GOD and MEN.....

    and to be honest....almost everything you stated in opposition above reeks of a lack of understanding.....and......by default rejects almost half of the New Testament written by PAUL.........

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    Default Re: I am curious

    Well Luke was a physician who historically bible scholars say used the previous 3 gospels (matt, mark, john) to gather information about Jesus. He was also alive during the latter years of apostles such as John so he could ask him along with other eyewitnesses of the time of Jesus about their experiences and write about them.

    As for being inspired....I will say that the material is inspired but as far as Luke being inspired himself I do not believe that...he was more of a historian/fact gatherer rather than the Holy Spirit speaking through him(Luke) he was just documenting the events that happened in Jesus life time by way of interviewing/gathering facts from people who lived when Jesus was physically on Earth.
    I am the former ultimatum77.....dah dah dah......

  19. #19
    Senior Member dcontroversal's Avatar
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    Default Re: I am curious

    Quote Originally Posted by oldhermit View Post
    Do you believe that Luke was an inspired writer and that everything he wrote was given to him from the Lord?

    Do you believe the testimony of Peter concerning Paul is trustworthy?
    Good point....he believes in Peter....does he believe Peter's word concerning PAUL........this will be good.

  20. #20
    Senior Member oldhermit's Avatar
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    Default Re: I am curious

    Quote Originally Posted by razor17 View Post
    Well Luke was a physician who historically bible scholars say used the previous 3 gospels (matt, mark, john) to gather information about Jesus. He was also alive during the latter years of apostles such as John so he could ask him along with other eyewitnesses of the time of Jesus about their experiences and write about them.

    As for being inspired....I will say that the material is inspired but as far as Luke being inspired himself I do not believe that...he was more of a historian/fact gatherer rather than the Holy Spirit speaking through him(Luke) he was just documenting the events that happened in Jesus life time by way of interviewing/gathering facts from people who lived when Jesus was physically on Earth.
    Do you believe Luke's writings (Gospel of Luke and Acts) to be scripture?

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