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Thread: “The Law is bad”

  1. #121
    finaldesire
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    Default Re: “The Law is bad”

    Quote Originally Posted by laymen View Post
    Law is bad after Jesus came??

    Why would anyone say that? Come now if you he think the law is a bad thing.

    the Bible is clear its a good thing not only Good but holy as welll!

    The only person that used it rightly was Jesus. And we do well to follow him.



    Everything above is true

    1)Rom 7:12Wherefore the law is holy, and the commandment holy, and just, and good.
    2)1Ti 1:8 But we know that the law is good, if a man use it lawfully;
    3)Gal 2:16 Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.

    only use 2 or 3 verse and 2 or 3 paragraphs like shown.
    laymen, the law does stir up sin in us.

    It also says that the law is good for reproof and correction, but in it it can not save us.
    stonesoffire and laymen like this.

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    Default Re: “The Law is bad”

    Quote Originally Posted by eternally-gratefull View Post
    Again, What doesn’t hits have to do with what I said.?
    Do you ever listen to what people say?

    The sabbath is not church day, IT IS REST DAY, Those who REST keep it holy, because he rested. THOSE WHO DO NOT REST do not keep it holy.

    The reason for the sabbath is because this body of ours was not made to work 7 days a week. It needs a day to rest. As do our minds.

    None of the passages you post refut that.
    You seem obsessed with resting and sleeping...obviously not left 'BABY-stage' since that is all they do !
    How about 'growing-up and progressing from milk to meat ?...going to school, assembling before God on HIS HOLY DAY ? Lev 23.
    Prov 6v9 How long wilt thou sleep o sluggard ? when wilt thou arise and wake out of thy sleep ?

    My people are destroyed for lack of knowledge...says the Lord !!!

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    Default Re: “The Law is bad”

    Quote Originally Posted by finaldesire View Post
    laymen, the law does stir up sin in us.

    It also says that the law is good for reproof and correction, but in it it can not save us.
    It stirs up sin in us ...to what purpose ? so we can deal with it !!!
    Or do you think we can be saved in sin ?
    The law of God the 10 Commandments are absolutely essential to show us what sin is 1Joh 3v4 so we can know it and see it....without the law it stays hidden in us andwe die in it !!!

    Transgressing GOD's law (10 Commandments) IS SIN !

  4. #124
    finaldesire
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    Default Re: “The Law is bad”

    Quote Originally Posted by beta View Post
    It stirs up sin in us ...to what purpose ? so we can deal with it !!!
    Or do you think we can be saved in sin ?
    The law of God the 10 Commandments are absolutely essential to show us what sin is 1Joh 3v4 so we can know it and see it....without the law it stays hidden in us andwe die in it !!!

    Transgressing GOD's law (10 Commandments) IS SIN !
    Does't our Lord write those laws on our hearts, and in our minds.

  5. #125
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    Default Re: “The Law is bad”

    Jas 1:25 But whoso looketh into the perfect law of liberty, and continueth therein, he being not a forgetful hearer, but a doer of the work, this man shall be blessed in his deed.
    1Ti 1:8 But we know that the law is good, if a man use it lawfully;
    Pro 18: 17 He who states his case first seems right, until his rival comes and cross-examines him.

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    Default Re: “The Law is bad”

    Quote Originally Posted by laymen View Post
    Looks like he went to church to me
    Lk 4v16
    Sabbath/saturday is the 'official worship DAY for God...a DAY chosen by HIM !!! but trad/nom christians think they can make their own bad choice and get away with it...oh foolish christians !

  7. #127
    Senior Member mailmandan's Avatar
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    Default Re: “The Law is bad”

    Quote Originally Posted by beta View Post
    Lk 4v16
    Sabbath/saturday is the 'official worship DAY for God...a DAY chosen by HIM !!! but trad/nom christians think they can make their own bad choice and get away with it...oh foolish christians !
    NOWHERE does the NT teach that keeping the Sabbath day holy is binding on Christians under the New Covenant.

    Sabbath keeping with all it's rules and regulations, was part of a covenant with Israel that is not binding on Christians under the New Covenant.

    *Colossians 2:16 - Therefore no one is to act as your judge in regard to food or drink or in respect to a festival or a new moon or a Sabbath day 17 things which are a mere shadow of what is to come; but the substance belongs to Christ. So stop acting as judge!

    Even when Sabbatarians set out to worship on the Sabbath, are they truly "keeping the Sabbath?" To "keep the Sabbath" as it was required in the Old Testament under the Old Covenant would involve compliance with specific regulations (Exodus 16:23; 35:3; Leviticus 23:32; Jeremiah 17:21) that were strictly enforced.

    If Sabbath day observances are still required, so would the burnt offerings which went along with them (Leviticus 19:30; 23:2-3; Numbers 28:1-10; 29:39-40; I Chronicles. 23:30-31; II Chronicles 31:2-4; Isaiah 1:13). So no kindling a fire in any of your dwellings on the sabbath (Exodus 35:3). Every man must remain in his place (no traveling) on the sabbath (Exodus 16:29). No trading (Amos 8:5). No marketing (Nehemiah 10:31; 13:15,19).

    These were commanded by God to Israel (Exodus 35:1).

    If the seventh day Sabbath is still in affect, then why do not the Sabbatarians seek to obey ALL that the LORD commanded? How can a person keep a certain law when he keeps only part of it?

    If the Sabbath day laws were still in effect today, then according to Exodus 31:12-18; 35:1-3; and Numbers 15:32-36, anyone who profaned the Sabbath was put to death and any person who does any work on it, that person shall be cut off from his people.

    Who is going to enforce that? The Jewish synagogue? The SDA church? The Government? Since we do not live under a theocratic state as ancient Israel did under the Old Covenant, no Sabbatarian can live consistently under these Mosaic regulations.
    I'm not a bad guy. I'm just misunderstood.

    Galatians 6:14 - But God forbid that I should boast except in the cross of our Lord Jesus Christ, by whom the world has been crucified to me, and I to the world.

  8. #128
    Senior Member eternally-gratefull's Avatar
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    Default Re: “The Law is bad”

    Quote Originally Posted by laymen View Post
    Looks like he went to church to me

    Thats interesting, since there was no church in his day. He also healed on the sabbath, He did go to where the word was read., it was the only way they had access. Yet as far as I can see, they did this pretty much every day. In fact, the early church? They continued daily in the apostles doctrine in breaking and bread fellowship and prayer.

    Do you only go on saterday? If so. Do you think that is all you need and resembles the NT church?
    Eternally Grateful for the grace God has shown a wretched soul such as myself.

    Rom 8:1 There is therefore now no condemnation to those who are in Christ Jesus,

  9. #129
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    Default Re: “The Law is bad”

    Quote Originally Posted by finaldesire View Post
    Does't our Lord write those laws on our hearts, and in our minds.
    The law on our heart and mind is the love of the Spirit, not the law of the letter. This is why Paul tells us that the new covenant is a covenant of the Spirit, and not of the letter.

    "He has made us competent as ministers of a new covenant — not of the letter but of the Spirit; for the letter kills...the ministry that brought death, which was engraved in letters on stone...the ministry that condemns" (2 Corinthians 3:6-9).

    ALL have sinned and come short of the glory of God (Romans 3:23). The wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord (Romans 6:23) and is not through the 10 Commandments.

    References for 9 of the 10 commandments under the Old Covenant are reiterated under the New Covenant, yet the command to keep the Sabbath day is not binding on Christians under the New Covenant.

    1. You shall have no other gods before Me. - Acts 14:15
    2. You shall make no idols. - 1 John 5:21
    3. You shall not take the name of the Lord your God in vain. - James 5:12
    4. Keep the Sabbath day holy. - Not binding on the Church - Colossians 2:16-17
    5. Honor your father and your mother. - Ephesians 6:1-2
    6. You shall not murder. - Romans 13:9-10; 1 John 3:15
    7. You shall not commit adultery. - Romans 13:9-10; 1 Corinthians 6:9-10
    8. You shall not steal. - Romans 13:9-10; Ephesians 4:28
    9. You shall not bear false witness against your neighbor. - Romans 13:9-10; Colossians 3:9-10
    10. You shall not covet. - Romans 13:9-10; Ephesians 5:3

    Justification is not by works of the law, but by faith in Jesus Christ (Romans 3:22-28; Galatians 2:16; Philippians 3:9 etc..).
    I'm not a bad guy. I'm just misunderstood.

    Galatians 6:14 - But God forbid that I should boast except in the cross of our Lord Jesus Christ, by whom the world has been crucified to me, and I to the world.

  10. #130
    Senior Member eternally-gratefull's Avatar
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    Default Re: “The Law is bad”

    Quote Originally Posted by finaldesire View Post
    laymen, the law does stir up sin in us.

    It also says that the law is good for reproof and correction, but in it it can not save us.
    It says scripture is good for that, Not the law
    Eternally Grateful for the grace God has shown a wretched soul such as myself.

    Rom 8:1 There is therefore now no condemnation to those who are in Christ Jesus,

  11. #131
    Senior Member eternally-gratefull's Avatar
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    Default Re: “The Law is bad”

    Quote Originally Posted by beta View Post
    You seem obsessed with resting and sleeping...obviously not left 'BABY-stage' since that is all they do !
    How about 'growing-up and progressing from milk to meat ?...going to school, assembling before God on HIS HOLY DAY ? Lev 23.
    Prov 6v9 How long wilt thou sleep o sluggard ? when wilt thou arise and wake out of thy sleep ?

    My people are destroyed for lack of knowledge...says the Lord !!!
    You seem stuck on tradition and works not on finding out what God really wanted.

    Jesus rested on the 7th day, He did not create church, or go to church. He rested from his work.

    That is the meaning and purpose behind the 7th day rest.

    Me leave baby status? I left that along time ago. I started having a relation ship with God and stopped playing church. Will you join me? Or continue to play church?
    Eternally Grateful for the grace God has shown a wretched soul such as myself.

    Rom 8:1 There is therefore now no condemnation to those who are in Christ Jesus,

  12. #132
    Senior Member eternally-gratefull's Avatar
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    Default Re: “The Law is bad”

    Quote Originally Posted by beta View Post
    Lk 4v16
    Sabbath/saturday is the 'official worship DAY for God...a DAY chosen by HIM !!! but trad/nom christians think they can make their own bad choice and get away with it...oh foolish christians !
    God was offended by the jews who held that day in the way they did.. He called them a few choice names. Paul called them fools, He is no more happy with religious people today who hold a day taken out of context (or any works people focus on) as a means to puff themselves up while attacking or judging others. Even John (baptist) called them foolish.

    Eternally Grateful for the grace God has shown a wretched soul such as myself.

    Rom 8:1 There is therefore now no condemnation to those who are in Christ Jesus,

  13. #133
    Senior Member eternally-gratefull's Avatar
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    Default Re: “The Law is bad”

    Quote Originally Posted by mailmandan View Post
    The law on our heart and mind is the love of the Spirit, not the law of the letter. This is why Paul tells us that the new covenant is a covenant of the Spirit, and not of the letter.

    "He has made us competent as ministers of a new covenant — not of the letter but of the Spirit; for the letter kills...the ministry that brought death, which was engraved in letters on stone...the ministry that condemns" (2 Corinthians 3:6-9).

    ALL have sinned and come short of the glory of God (Romans 3:23). The wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord (Romans 6:23) and is not through the 10 Commandments.

    References for 9 of the 10 commandments under the Old Covenant are reiterated under the New Covenant, yet the command to keep the Sabbath day is not binding on Christians under the New Covenant.

    1. You shall have no other gods before Me. - Acts 14:15
    2. You shall make no idols. - 1 John 5:21
    3. You shall not take the name of the Lord your God in vain. - James 5:12
    4. Keep the Sabbath day holy. - Not binding on the Church - Colossians 2:16-17
    5. Honor your father and your mother. - Ephesians 6:1-2
    6. You shall not murder. - Romans 13:9-10; 1 John 3:15
    7. You shall not commit adultery. - Romans 13:9-10; 1 Corinthians 6:9-10
    8. You shall not steal. - Romans 13:9-10; Ephesians 4:28
    9. You shall not bear false witness against your neighbor. - Romans 13:9-10; Colossians 3:9-10
    10. You shall not covet. - Romans 13:9-10; Ephesians 5:3

    Justification is not by works of the law, but by faith in Jesus Christ (Romans 3:22-28; Galatians 2:16; Philippians 3:9 etc..).

    I think the 4th is still a command, just not the way they make it out to be, And as with all of the commands, they were not given to show us HOW to be righteous, but to expose our sin. Thats why the churhc is not under law. But under grace, apart from grace, all people would be condemned.
    Eternally Grateful for the grace God has shown a wretched soul such as myself.

    Rom 8:1 There is therefore now no condemnation to those who are in Christ Jesus,

  14. #134
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    Lightbulb Re: “The Law is bad”

    Quote Originally Posted by laymen View Post
    Law is bad after Jesus came??
    I consider the law as the "necessary bad":

    • It is BAD, but is necessary;
    • It is NECESSARY, but is bad.

    Unfortunately, the sin does wherewith the law is necessary:


    • “But we know that the law is good, if a man use it lawfully; knowing this, that the law is not made for a righteous man, but for the lawless and disobedient, for the ungodly and for sinners, for unholy and profane, for murderers of fathers and murderers of mothers, for manslayers, for whoremongers, for them that defile themselves with mankind, for menstealers, for liars, for perjured persons, and if there be any other thing that is contrary to sound doctrine;” (1Tim 1.8-10).


    The law serves only to lead us to Christ. After this, the love is that ought to be our bond:


    • “But before faith came, we were kept under the law, shut up unto the faith which should afterwards be revealed. Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith. But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster.” (Gal 3.23-25).
    "Then shall we know, if we follow on to know the LORD: his going forth is prepared as the morning; and he shall come unto us as the rain, as the latter and former rain unto the earth." (Hosea 6.3).

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    Default Re: “The Law is bad”

    Quote Originally Posted by mailmandan View Post
    NOWHERE does the NT teach that keeping the Sabbath day holy is binding on Christians under the New Covenant.

    Sabbath keeping with all it's rules and regulations, was part of a covenant with Israel that is not binding on Christians under the New Covenant.

    *Colossians 2:16 - Therefore no one is to act as your judge in regard to food or drink or in respect to a festival or a new moon or a Sabbath day 17 things which are a mere shadow of what is to come; but the substance belongs to Christ. So stop acting as judge!

    Even when Sabbatarians set out to worship on the Sabbath, are they truly "keeping the Sabbath?" To "keep the Sabbath" as it was required in the Old Testament under the Old Covenant would involve compliance with specific regulations (Exodus 16:23; 35:3; Leviticus 23:32; Jeremiah 17:21) that were strictly enforced.

    If Sabbath day observances are still required, so would the burnt offerings which went along with them (Leviticus 19:30; 23:2-3; Numbers 28:1-10; 29:39-40; I Chronicles. 23:30-31; II Chronicles 31:2-4; Isaiah 1:13). So no kindling a fire in any of your dwellings on the sabbath (Exodus 35:3). Every man must remain in his place (no traveling) on the sabbath (Exodus 16:29). No trading (Amos 8:5). No marketing (Nehemiah 10:31; 13:15,19).

    These were commanded by God to Israel (Exodus 35:1).

    If the seventh day Sabbath is still in affect, then why do not the Sabbatarians seek to obey ALL that the LORD commanded? How can a person keep a certain law when he keeps only part of it?

    If the Sabbath day laws were still in effect today, then according to Exodus 31:12-18; 35:1-3; and Numbers 15:32-36, anyone who profaned the Sabbath was put to death and any person who does any work on it, that person shall be cut off from his people.

    Who is going to enforce that? The Jewish synagogue? The SDA church? The Government? Since we do not live under a theocratic state as ancient Israel did under the Old Covenant, no Sabbatarian can live consistently under these Mosaic regulations.
    All you are doing is showing your ignorance when you speak of OT requirements/regulations...have you not read JESUS' teaching in the NT ?

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    Default Re: “The Law is bad”

    Quote Originally Posted by eternally-gratefull View Post
    God was offended by the jews who held that day in the way they did.. He called them a few choice names. Paul called them fools, He is no more happy with religious people today who hold a day taken out of context (or any works people focus on) as a means to puff themselves up while attacking or judging others. Even John (baptist) called them foolish.

    I agree...but WHO is following the JEWS as an EXample ??? Don't we have JESUS ???

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    Default Re: “The Law is bad”

    Quote Originally Posted by beta View Post
    I agree...but WHO is following the JEWS as an EXample ??? Don't we have JESUS ???
    yeah we do. What was jesus focus on? Loving others? Serving others no matter what? Doing his fathers will?

    or playing church?
    Eternally Grateful for the grace God has shown a wretched soul such as myself.

    Rom 8:1 There is therefore now no condemnation to those who are in Christ Jesus,

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    Default Re: “The Law is bad”

    Quote Originally Posted by eternally-gratefull View Post
    You seem stuck on tradition and works not on finding out what God really wanted.

    Jesus rested on the 7th day, He did not create church, or go to church. He rested from his work.

    That is the meaning and purpose behind the 7th day rest.

    Me leave baby status? I left that along time ago. I started having a relation ship with God and stopped playing church. Will you join me? Or continue to play church?
    Not still in your baby-stage ? then learn to read, write and do sums ! If you think what GOD gives us is mere tradition you don't know Him yet.
    I am not saying we must go to church but we need to spend time with Father and Son on THEIR HOLY DAY...that is REAL church and getting to know them !
    Resting and sleeping all sabbath is not teaching you ANYTHING !!! why don't YOU join me ?

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    Default Re: “The Law is bad”

    Quote Originally Posted by beta View Post
    All you are doing is showing your ignorance when you speak of OT requirements/regulations...have you not read JESUS' teaching in the NT?
    I specifically quoted OT scripture and I sure have read Jesus' teaching in the NT. Jesus sent the twelve to preach only to Israel. Matthew 10:5 - These twelve Jesus sent out and commanded them, saying: “Do not go into the way of the Gentiles, and do not enter a city of the Samaritans. 6 But go rather to the lost sheep of the house of Israel. 7 And as you go, preach, saying, ‘The kingdom of heaven is at hand.’ Yet Israel as a whole did not receive their Messiah. The disciples were specifically told to go only to the people of Israel. There was a transition from the Old to the New Covenant and you seem to be stuck in transition.

    Have you read Paul's epistles (which are inspired by God) under the New Covenant? Do you realize that the gospel which Paul preached is not according to man but it came through a revelation of Jesus Christ? (Galatians 1:11-12).

    Ephesians 3:1 - For this reason I, Paul, the prisoner of Christ Jesus for you Gentiles— 2 if indeed you have heard of the dispensation of the grace of God which was given to me for you, 3 how that by revelation He made known to me the mystery (as I have briefly written already, 4 by which, when you read, you may understand my knowledge in the mystery of Christ), 5 which in other ages was not made known to the sons of men, as it has now been revealed by the Spirit to His holy apostles and prophets: 6 that the Gentiles should be fellow heirs, of the same body, and partakers of His promise in Christ through the gospel, 7 of which I became a minister according to the gift of the grace of God given to me by the effective working of His power. 8 To me, who am less than the least of all the saints, this grace was given, that I should preach among the Gentiles the unsearchable riches of Christ, 9 and to make all see what is the fellowship of the mystery, which from the beginning of the ages has been hidden in God who created all things through Jesus Christ; 10 to the intent that now the manifold wisdom of God might be made known by the church to the principalities and powers in the heavenly places, 11 according to the eternal purpose which He accomplished in Christ Jesus our Lord, 12 in whom we have boldness and access with confidence through faith in Him.
    I'm not a bad guy. I'm just misunderstood.

    Galatians 6:14 - But God forbid that I should boast except in the cross of our Lord Jesus Christ, by whom the world has been crucified to me, and I to the world.

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    Default Re: “The Law is bad”

    Quote Originally Posted by eternally-gratefull View Post
    yeah we do. What was jesus focus on? Loving others? Serving others no matter what? Doing his fathers will?

    or playing church?
    Do you think doing His Fathers Will was NOT His priority ?
    You don't seem to know scripture that tells us He went to church/synagogue on the SABBATH day ?

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