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Thread: Subjective Religion vs Objective Christianity

  1. #1
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    Default Subjective Religion vs Objective Christianity

    Subjective religion objective Christianity

    #1
    Nothing works right for believers under the law or believers attempting to live the "kingdom message" without subjective religion, John 18:36,

    36 Jesus answered, My kingdom is not of this world: if my kingdom were of this world, then would my servants fight, that I should not be delivered to the Jews: but now is my kingdom not from hence.

    Christianity is objective, religion is subjective. The understanding of these two words gives the believer the victory in every day living that God intended.
    Objective Christianity means the believer can do nothing, within himself, to save himself or to stay saved, Eph. 2:8-9

    8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
    9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.

    Subjective religion puts the burden of being saved and staying saved on the believer. I call this subjective religion because it puts humans into self- works to become something they already are by being rebirthed in Christ, 1 John 3:8-9

    8 He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil.
    9 Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

    A believer adopting a course of self- effort or self-works will eventually put the emphasis of Christian living on himself rather than on the Christ in him. Everything at this point can become "me-isms" like, this is "my life," I can live it like I want to. These are "my things" I can do what I want with them.
    Life is mine, "my will and ways" are most important. I've got to look out for myself, "my feelings" are the way I have to live.

    While all these ideas are human, they ignore God's plan for living and most of all ignore the Christ who lives in the believer. Sadly, modern theology has written a new script for believers who live like this. This is subjective religion where multitudes of believers believe that since they are humans everything must revolve around them.

    Look in any Christian bookstore and you'll find the majority of subjects deal with what you can do to keep your salvation, or how to achieve as a good Christian, or how to have faith or power, or how to love yourself and others, or how to get the Holy Spirit, or how to get faith, or how to overcome frustration, cure mental health and be healed of all your diseases. I could go on and on, but these "how to" things lead believers to subjective religion where all the information puts the burden on them to be and to do. This happens even though Christ lives in them and Paul says Christ is our only life.

    The fact is, if we follow Paul as he follows Christ and I live in the Epistles, we will know how to live the Christ-life that is in us. The Christ-life is objective-- a finished work at the cross and a grace work in its totality. The problem in Christianity is the gospel coming from Christ to Paul has not been preached. If we knew the Christ in us, Ephesians 4:20

    20 But ye have not so learned Christ;

    we would never be in doubt as to who we are and what we are. Subjective religion has never had the answers and never will, but objective Christianity will produce a new creation in Christ.

    The fact remains, a believers growth comes from the gospel he hears, reads, and understands. Not having a definite direction when a believer reads and studies the Scriptures, he will never find the true message of God that is for him. Without this direction, when he studies someone's books or hear's someone's message, he can be confused. Where does this direction come from? Basically it comes from the Holy Spirit, who's ministry is to teach the believer about the Christ that is already in him, John 14:20

    20 At that day ye shall know that I am in my Father, and ye in me, and I in you.

    This is the clear direction every ongoing believer will have. Efforts relating to listening or studying anything else not akin to learning the Christ living in the believer will amount to nothing. If the believer never comes to the fullness of Christ in his knowing, then anything else he may have learned is futile. (Read 1 Corinthians chapters 1 and 2.)
    Zmouth and MatthewG like this.

  2. #2
    Senior Member dcontroversal's Avatar
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    Default Re: Subjective Religion vs Objective Christianity

    Quote Originally Posted by Noblemen View Post
    Subjective religion objective Christianity

    #1
    Nothing works right for believers under the law or believers attempting to live the "kingdom message" without subjective religion, John 18:36,

    36 Jesus answered, My kingdom is not of this world: if my kingdom were of this world, then would my servants fight, that I should not be delivered to the Jews: but now is my kingdom not from hence.

    Christianity is objective, religion is subjective. The understanding of these two words gives the believer the victory in every day living that God intended.
    Objective Christianity means the believer can do nothing, within himself, to save himself or to stay saved, Eph. 2:8-9

    8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
    9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.

    Subjective religion puts the burden of being saved and staying saved on the believer. I call this subjective religion because it puts humans into self- works to become something they already are by being rebirthed in Christ, 1 John 3:8-9

    8 He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil.
    9 Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

    A believer adopting a course of self- effort or self-works will eventually put the emphasis of Christian living on himself rather than on the Christ in him. Everything at this point can become "me-isms" like, this is "my life," I can live it like I want to. These are "my things" I can do what I want with them.
    Life is mine, "my will and ways" are most important. I've got to look out for myself, "my feelings" are the way I have to live.

    While all these ideas are human, they ignore God's plan for living and most of all ignore the Christ who lives in the believer. Sadly, modern theology has written a new script for believers who live like this. This is subjective religion where multitudes of believers believe that since they are humans everything must revolve around them.

    Look in any Christian bookstore and you'll find the majority of subjects deal with what you can do to keep your salvation, or how to achieve as a good Christian, or how to have faith or power, or how to love yourself and others, or how to get the Holy Spirit, or how to get faith, or how to overcome frustration, cure mental health and be healed of all your diseases. I could go on and on, but these "how to" things lead believers to subjective religion where all the information puts the burden on them to be and to do. This happens even though Christ lives in them and Paul says Christ is our only life.

    The fact is, if we follow Paul as he follows Christ and I live in the Epistles, we will know how to live the Christ-life that is in us. The Christ-life is objective-- a finished work at the cross and a grace work in its totality. The problem in Christianity is the gospel coming from Christ to Paul has not been preached. If we knew the Christ in us, Ephesians 4:20

    20 But ye have not so learned Christ;

    we would never be in doubt as to who we are and what we are. Subjective religion has never had the answers and never will, but objective Christianity will produce a new creation in Christ.

    The fact remains, a believers growth comes from the gospel he hears, reads, and understands. Not having a definite direction when a believer reads and studies the Scriptures, he will never find the true message of God that is for him. Without this direction, when he studies someone's books or hear's someone's message, he can be confused. Where does this direction come from? Basically it comes from the Holy Spirit, who's ministry is to teach the believer about the Christ that is already in him, John 14:20

    20 At that day ye shall know that I am in my Father, and ye in me, and I in you.

    This is the clear direction every ongoing believer will have. Efforts relating to listening or studying anything else not akin to learning the Christ living in the believer will amount to nothing. If the believer never comes to the fullness of Christ in his knowing, then anything else he may have learned is futile. (Read 1 Corinthians chapters 1 and 2.)
    You should post this in my works thread.....it has about 4 to 6 that constantly interject self, works and say your not saved until the end when God sees your works which is as false as the serpent in the garden interjecting the word NOT......
    Noblemen likes this.

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    Default Re: Subjective Religion vs Objective Christianity

    Maybe you could invite them over.

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    Default Re: Subjective Religion vs Objective Christianity

    Religion can bring burdens on people, at churches even sometimes.

    You know some people talk about losing salvation, some don't, and it is taught in various places through out the whole world.

    Some people say sin has been paid for everyone, some people say sin has not been paid for everyone.

    Some people say people stay in hell forever, and ever. Some people stay in the Lake of Fire forever.

    Some people say Jesus Christ is returning, some people say Jesus Christ has already returned.

    Some people say Satan still owns this world, Some people believe God is in control of this world now compared to Satan.

    Some people say Demons are possessing people, some don't even talk about (I don't really care for demons/ I use to go play in graveyards, and abandoned places, with some friends, trying to find spirits.)

    Some people say there is everlasting punishment, some people don't believe in everlasting punishment.

    Some people say God is love, but...

    Some people say good works must come though you, but yes only (to be justified ) in the sight of men... (James 2:14-26)

    Some people you gotta pay your tithing, Some people don't. ( i heard once in a church that they were needing money to pay for the building they just added to the people in the crowd, saying help us pay for what you wanted ) Im paraphrasing it has been about 7 months ago maybe?

    Subjectivity...




    But Man is justified by faith alone in Jesus Christ by the grace of God, not by the works they preform when they happen to fall short, in any sense.
    Noblemen likes this.

  5. #5
    finaldesire
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    Default Re: Subjective Religion vs Objective Christianity

    Quote Originally Posted by Noblemen View Post
    Subjective religion objective Christianity

    #1
    Nothing works right for believers under the law or believers attempting to live the "kingdom message" without subjective religion, John 18:36,

    36 Jesus answered, My kingdom is not of this world: if my kingdom were of this world, then would my servants fight, that I should not be delivered to the Jews: but now is my kingdom not from hence.

    Christianity is objective, religion is subjective. The understanding of these two words gives the believer the victory in every day living that God intended.
    Objective Christianity means the believer can do nothing, within himself, to save himself or to stay saved, Eph. 2:8-9

    8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
    9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.

    Subjective religion puts the burden of being saved and staying saved on the believer. I call this subjective religion because it puts humans into self- works to become something they already are by being rebirthed in Christ, 1 John 3:8-9

    8 He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil.
    9 Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

    A believer adopting a course of self- effort or self-works will eventually put the emphasis of Christian living on himself rather than on the Christ in him. Everything at this point can become "me-isms" like, this is "my life," I can live it like I want to. These are "my things" I can do what I want with them.
    Life is mine, "my will and ways" are most important. I've got to look out for myself, "my feelings" are the way I have to live.

    While all these ideas are human, they ignore God's plan for living and most of all ignore the Christ who lives in the believer. Sadly, modern theology has written a new script for believers who live like this. This is subjective religion where multitudes of believers believe that since they are humans everything must revolve around them.

    Look in any Christian bookstore and you'll find the majority of subjects deal with what you can do to keep your salvation, or how to achieve as a good Christian, or how to have faith or power, or how to love yourself and others, or how to get the Holy Spirit, or how to get faith, or how to overcome frustration, cure mental health and be healed of all your diseases. I could go on and on, but these "how to" things lead believers to subjective religion where all the information puts the burden on them to be and to do. This happens even though Christ lives in them and Paul says Christ is our only life.

    The fact is, if we follow Paul as he follows Christ and I live in the Epistles, we will know how to live the Christ-life that is in us. The Christ-life is objective-- a finished work at the cross and a grace work in its totality. The problem in Christianity is the gospel coming from Christ to Paul has not been preached. If we knew the Christ in us, Ephesians 4:20

    20 But ye have not so learned Christ;

    we would never be in doubt as to who we are and what we are. Subjective religion has never had the answers and never will, but objective Christianity will produce a new creation in Christ.

    The fact remains, a believers growth comes from the gospel he hears, reads, and understands. Not having a definite direction when a believer reads and studies the Scriptures, he will never find the true message of God that is for him. Without this direction, when he studies someone's books or hear's someone's message, he can be confused. Where does this direction come from? Basically it comes from the Holy Spirit, who's ministry is to teach the believer about the Christ that is already in him, John 14:20

    20 At that day ye shall know that I am in my Father, and ye in me, and I in you.

    This is the clear direction every ongoing believer will have. Efforts relating to listening or studying anything else not akin to learning the Christ living in the believer will amount to nothing. If the believer never comes to the fullness of Christ in his knowing, then anything else he may have learned is futile. (Read 1 Corinthians chapters 1 and 2.)
    I see what you are saying here, by objective you do mean becoming like Jesus. Yes, what you have written is very insightful, thank you.
    MatthewG and Noblemen like this.

  6. #6
    Senior Member Zmouth's Avatar
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    Default Re: Subjective Religion vs Objective Christianity

    Quote Originally Posted by Noblemen View Post
    Christianity is objective, religion is subjective. The understanding of these two words gives the believer the victory in every day living that God intended.
    Ok, so where did you get your understanding of the terms "objective" and "subjective", from religious theology or the disciple of science? The reason I ask is because the terms 'faith' and 'believe' are two separate and distinct words which are neither synonyms nor are they antonyms but are analogous.

    Quote Originally Posted by Noblemen View Post
    Objective Christianity means the believer can do nothing, within himself, to save himself or to stay saved, Eph. 2:8-9
    So if Christianity is objective then it can not be subjective since only religion is subjective, right? So if Christianity is objective then it must be pure anything which becomes impure is corrupted and being objective that would be a fact which is not subject to interpretation, right?

    Have you ever heard of the Unction Affliction, it is strong delusion that causes those without faith to believe a lie . (see James 1:27)

    Anyways, excellent post.

    Last edited by Zmouth; February 14th, 2018 at 07:59 AM.
    Noblemen likes this.


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