On Converting To Roman Catholicism

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WebersHome

Senior Member
Dec 9, 2014
1,940
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0
#1
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I was baptized an infant into the Roman Catholic system and continued on
to complete First Holy Communion and Confirmation.

Roman Catholicism is a difficult religion. In order for its followers to obtain a
passing grade they have to consistently comply with everything in the
Catechism, plus all of Rome's traditions, and every Bull, every Holy Day of
Obligation, every Encyclical plus all of the Sermon On The Mount and
everything taught in the epistles of Paul, Peter, James, Jude, and John;
along with every ruling of Rome's Church Councils including Nicaea 1 & 2,
Constantinople 1 & 2 & 3, Ephesus, Chalcedon, Lateran 1 & 2 & 3 & 4 & 5,
Lyons 1 & 2, Vienne, Constance, Florence, Trent, and Vaticans 1 & 2.

On top of all that; should a Catholic leave this life in a state of mortal sin,
they go straight to Hell with no stopover in a purgatory. All their years as a
Catholic, no matter how many nor how faithful, will count for naught.

/
 
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
20,395
113
#2
-
I was baptized an infant into the Roman Catholic system and continued on
to complete First Holy Communion and Confirmation.

Roman Catholicism is a difficult religion. In order for its followers to obtain a
passing grade they have to consistently comply with everything in the
Catechism, plus all of Rome's traditions, and every Bull, every Holy Day of
Obligation, every Encyclical plus all of the Sermon On The Mount and
everything taught in the epistles of Paul, Peter, James, Jude, and John;
along with every ruling of Rome's Church Councils including Nicaea 1 & 2,
Constantinople 1 & 2 & 3, Ephesus, Chalcedon, Lateran 1 & 2 & 3 & 4 & 5,
Lyons 1 & 2, Vienne, Constance, Florence, Trent, and Vaticans 1 & 2.

On top of all that; should a Catholic leave this life in a state of mortal sin,
they go straight to Hell with no stopover in a purgatory. All their years as a
Catholic, no matter how many nor how faithful, will count for naught.

/
There is a reason that Jesus condemned organized religion...........the reason is obvious!
 
S

SpoonJuly

Guest
#3
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I was baptized an infant into the Roman Catholic system and continued on
to complete First Holy Communion and Confirmation.

Roman Catholicism is a difficult religion. In order for its followers to obtain a
passing grade they have to consistently comply with everything in the
Catechism, plus all of Rome's traditions, and every Bull, every Holy Day of
Obligation, every Encyclical plus all of the Sermon On The Mount and
everything taught in the epistles of Paul, Peter, James, Jude, and John;
along with every ruling of Rome's Church Councils including Nicaea 1 & 2,
Constantinople 1 & 2 & 3, Ephesus, Chalcedon, Lateran 1 & 2 & 3 & 4 & 5,
Lyons 1 & 2, Vienne, Constance, Florence, Trent, and Vaticans 1 & 2.

On top of all that; should a Catholic leave this life in a state of mortal sin,
they go straight to Hell with no stopover in a purgatory. All their years as a
Catholic, no matter how many nor how faithful, will count for naught.

/
I will prey that you find Jesus as your personal Savior.
 

Magenta

Senior Member
Jul 3, 2015
55,885
26,047
113
#4
Roman Catholicism is a difficult religion.

In order for its followers to obtain a passing grade they have to consistently
comply with everything in theC atechism, plus all of Rome's traditions,
and every Bull,
every Holy Day of Obligation, every Encyclical plus
all of the Sermon On The Mount and everything taught in the epistles of
Paul, Peter, James, Jude, and John;along with every ruling of Rome's
Church Councils including Nicaea 1 & 2, Constantinople 1 & 2 & 3,
Ephesus, Chalcedon, Lateran 1 & 2 & 3 & 4 & 5,Lyons 1 & 2, Vienne,
Constance, Florence, Trent, and Vaticans 1 & 2.
That's a lot of Bull :eek:
 

Dino246

Senior Member
Jun 30, 2015
24,688
13,377
113
#5
(Not directed at the OP, or any other contributor so far...)

Well, whatever "works" for you...

:rolleyes:
 

Blain

The Word Weaver
Aug 28, 2012
19,213
2,549
113
#6
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I was baptized an infant into the Roman Catholic system and continued on
to complete First Holy Communion and Confirmation.

Roman Catholicism is a difficult religion. In order for its followers to obtain a
passing grade they have to consistently comply with everything in the
Catechism, plus all of Rome's traditions, and every Bull, every Holy Day of
Obligation, every Encyclical plus all of the Sermon On The Mount and
everything taught in the epistles of Paul, Peter, James, Jude, and John;
along with every ruling of Rome's Church Councils including Nicaea 1 & 2,
Constantinople 1 & 2 & 3, Ephesus, Chalcedon, Lateran 1 & 2 & 3 & 4 & 5,
Lyons 1 & 2, Vienne, Constance, Florence, Trent, and Vaticans 1 & 2.

On top of all that; should a Catholic leave this life in a state of mortal sin,
they go straight to Hell with no stopover in a purgatory. All their years as a
Catholic, no matter how many nor how faithful, will count for naught.

/
Are you considering converting to it or are you describing how you used to be Roman Catholic and these are some of the things they enforce?
 

Blain

The Word Weaver
Aug 28, 2012
19,213
2,549
113
#7
(Not directed at the OP, or any other contributor so far...)

Well, whatever "works" for you...

:rolleyes:
Well it's in the earned rights for any who would diligently and obediently obtain salvation through the rcc to have their works to be counted towards their justly earned treasures in heaven through the salvation of their immortal souls. Need i continue?:cool:
 

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
24,446
12,925
113
#8
On top of all that; should a Catholic leave this life in a state of mortal sin, they go straight to Hell with no stopover in a purgatory. All their years as a Catholic, no matter how many nor how faithful, will count for naught.
I trust this is a warning sign to anyone who might be considering conversion to the RCC. It is hard to imagine someone wanting to go into bondage, but stranger things have happened. In the 19th century there was a huge movement in England to revert back to Roman Catholicism after John Henry Newman converted from Anglican priest to Roman Catholic Cardinal. This was called the Oxford or Tractarian Movement.
 

WebersHome

Senior Member
Dec 9, 2014
1,940
32
0
#9
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Are you considering converting to it
I underwent conversion when I was baptized an infant into the Roman
Catholic system and continued on to complete First Holy Communion and
Confirmation.



you used to be Roman Catholic?
I lost hope in Roman Catholicism back in 1968. I really can't imagine how
anyone could ever be a good enough Catholic to make it into heaven; it's
just too hard.

/
 

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
24,446
12,925
113
#10
I lost hope in Roman Catholicism back in 1968. I really can't imagine how anyone could ever be a good enough Catholic to make it into heaven; it's just too hard.
That's why those poor Catholics need to pay "the Church" some serious cash to get to Heaven.
 

WebersHome

Senior Member
Dec 9, 2014
1,940
32
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#11
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According to the information below, taken from the Catechism of the
Catholic Church (a.k.a. the CCC) it's readily seen that it isn't necessary to
completely turn against either God or the Church in order to leave this life in
a state of mortal sin.

CCC 1856 When the will sets itself upon something that is of its nature
incompatible with the charity that orients man toward his ultimate end, then
the sin is mortal by its very object . . . whether it contradicts the love of
God, such as blasphemy or perjury, or the love of neighbor, such as
homicide or adultery.

CCC 1857 For a sin to be mortal, three conditions must together be met:
"Mortal sin is sin whose object is grave matter and which is also committed
with full knowledge and deliberate consent."

CCC 1858 Grave matter is specified by the Ten Commandments,
corresponding to the answer of Jesus to the rich young man: "Do not kill, Do
not commit adultery, Do not steal, Do not bear false witness, Do not
defraud, Honor your father and your mother."

CCC 1859 Mortal sin requires full knowledge and complete consent. It
presupposes knowledge of the sinful character of the act, of its opposition to
God's law. It also implies a consent sufficiently deliberate to be a personal
choice.

CCC 1861 Mortal sin . . . results in the loss of charity and the privation of
sanctifying grace, that is, of the state of grace. If it is not redeemed by
repentance and God's forgiveness, it causes exclusion from Christ's kingdom
and the eternal death of hell.

In other words: mortal sins fall in the category of willful behavior; i.e. acts
committed wherein the offender knows in advance that certain things are
wrong.

A really good example of willful sin is Adam's. He tasted the forbidden fruit
in the knowledge of both the ban the consequences; which correlates to a
catechized Catholic knowing both the ban and the consequences for breaking
any one of the Ten Commandments.

/
 

WebersHome

Senior Member
Dec 9, 2014
1,940
32
0
#12
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Mortal sins hang over Catholicism's head like a sword of Damocles;
suspended by a slender thread easily severed by a moment of defiance;
hence:


Council of Trent Session 6, Chapter 16, Canon 16 . . If anyone
says that he will for certain, with an absolute and infallible certainty, have
that great gift of perseverance even to the end, unless he shall have learned
this by a special revelation, let him be anathema.

/
 
R

Ralph-

Guest
#13

On top of all that; should a Catholic leave this life in a state of mortal sin,
they go straight to Hell with no stopover in a purgatory. All their years as a
Catholic, no matter how many nor how faithful, will count for naught.

/
Yes, they believe that every time you sin you lose justification and have to be re-justified.

But Jesus said all you need is your feet washed, not your whole body washed again.
 

Adstar

Senior Member
Jul 24, 2016
7,426
3,478
113
#14
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I was baptized an infant into the Roman Catholic system and continued on
to complete First Holy Communion and Confirmation.

Roman Catholicism is a difficult religion. In order for its followers to obtain a
passing grade they have to consistently comply with everything in the
Catechism, plus all of Rome's traditions, and every Bull, every Holy Day of
Obligation, every Encyclical plus all of the Sermon On The Mount and
everything taught in the epistles of Paul, Peter, James, Jude, and John;
along with every ruling of Rome's Church Councils including Nicaea 1 & 2,
Constantinople 1 & 2 & 3, Ephesus, Chalcedon, Lateran 1 & 2 & 3 & 4 & 5,
Lyons 1 & 2, Vienne, Constance, Florence, Trent, and Vaticans 1 & 2.

On top of all that; should a Catholic leave this life in a state of mortal sin,
they go straight to Hell with no stopover in a purgatory. All their years as a
Catholic, no matter how many nor how faithful, will count for naught.


/
If the don't accept the Atonement of Jesus for the forgivness of sin and their eternal salvation all the above i have bolded is irrelevant.. Even if they could avoid ""mortal sin "" they would still be doomed because of their other sins..

And of course there is no such place as purgatory... No place to get ones sins purged after death.. The Atonement of Jesus purges us of our sins here and now for forever..
 

WebersHome

Senior Member
Dec 9, 2014
1,940
32
0
#15
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Q: At Matt 16:18, Jesus said: "You are Peter, and upon this rock I will build
my church; and the gates of the netherworld shall not prevail against it."
What is the meaning of that verse?

A: Basically it's saying that should one of Christ's true believing followers slip
through a crack and end up in the wrong place, they will be able to stroll
right on out of there like a tourist in Paris; possibly guided on their journey by
a celestial being, maybe similar to Peter's experience when he escaped jail in
Acts 12:3-11.

I should point out that if the Roman Catholic Church were the "my church"
that Christ spoke of in Matt 16:18, then no true Catholic-- not one --would
end up in hell; but I'm pretty sure that Rome expects to lose a number of its
followers to an uncertain fate; which reminds me of a line from the movie
AVATAR spoken by Colonel Miles Quaritch, played by Stephen Lang, that
goes like this:

It is my job to keep you alive.
I will not succeed . . not with all of you.

/
 
Mar 28, 2016
15,954
1,528
113
#16
Q: At Matt 16:18, Jesus said: "You are Peter, and upon this rock I will build
my church; and the gates of the netherworld shall not prevail against it."
What is the meaning of that verse?
I would suggest first and foremost scripture is of no a authority to a Catholic. The loving commandment to study in order to seek the approval of God not seen is made to no effect seeing they must seek the approval of man .It shows its face in every tradition of their fathers whom Christ called a brood of vipers (false prophets) .

The little word it which represent the unseen faith of God as it is written makes the devil flee .

Having it in respect to Peter seen and not Christ not seen is to blaspheme the Holy name by which we are called .The it in verse 17 represents the same it in verse 18 .

If the first it represents our father in heaven and not flesh and blood peter the second follows . It the gospel is the key that unlocks the gates of hell .


And Jesus answered and said unto him, Blessed art thou, Simon Barjona: for flesh and blood hath not revealed
it unto thee, but my Father which is in heaven.And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.Mat 16:17

If we have it in respect to Peter then the gates of hell have overcome the power of Christ.

Peter the “greatest denier” is show blaspheming the holy name by which all men are called heavenward. Christ forgave blasphemy in respect to that seen.

Then Peter took
him, and began to rebuke him, saying, Be it far from thee, Lord: this shall not be unto thee.But he turned, and said unto Peter, Get thee behind me, Satan: thou art an offence unto me: for thou savourest not the things that be of God, but those that be of men. Mat 16:22
 

WebersHome

Senior Member
Dec 9, 2014
1,940
32
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#17
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I would suggest first and foremost scripture is of no a authority to a
Catholic.
According to the Vatican Council (Sess. III, c. ii) the Scriptures are sacred
and canonical because "having been written by inspiration of the Holy Ghost,
they have God for their author"

Faithful Roman Catholics should not be reluctant to agree with the Council's
ruling that the Bible is:

1• Sacred

2• Canonical

3• Inspired by the Holy Ghost, and

4• Authored by God

There's also this:

"In its pages we recognize His voice, we hear a message of deep significance
for every one of us. Through the spiritual dynamism and prophetic force of
the Bible, the Holy Spirit spreads His light and His warmth over all men, in
whatever historical or sociological situation they find themselves." (Paulus PP
VI, from the Vatican, September 18, 1970)

So then; according to that Vatican Council and to Paulus PP VI; when people
listen to the Bible; they're hearing the voice of God, and also listening to
that which the Holy Spirit utilizes to spread His light and His warmth over all
men.

One of Christ's parables spoke of a farmer sowing seed. The Lord interpreted
the seed to be the word of God (Luke 8:11) which in his day did not include
the Catechism. In other words: the seed in the parable refers to the Holy
Bible.

When John Q and Jane Doe pew warmer relegate the Holy Bible to the status
of a non essential, they identify themselves as the soil on the path; a
location in which the word of God does not take root; instead the path's soil
is a killing field for evil.

"Those on the path are the ones who have heard, but the Devil comes and
takes away the word from their hearts that they may not believe and be
saved." (Luke 8:12)

/
 

mailmandan

Senior Member
Apr 7, 2014
25,043
13,050
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#18
The Catholic Church Teaches Salvation by Works

Question: You mentioned something about how the Catholic Church teaches that salvation is through works. This is contrary to everything that I’ve discovered about the Catholic Church.

Answer: Many Catholics will not agree with you. They frankly admit that they hope to be saved by living a good life. They seek to obey the commandments, participate in the sacraments, go to church, do penance and give alms, recite prayers and so on, in order to merit salvation. In its official writings, the Catholic Church teaches that faith is important; but it also insists on the necessity of good works to merit eternal life. Please read carefully the following quotations from the Council of Trent on Justification:

Canon 11. If anyone says that men are justified either by the sole imputation of the justice of Christ or by the sole remission of sins, excluding grace and charity which is poured into their hearts by the Holy Spirit and inheres in them, or also that the grace which justifies us is only the favour of God, let him be anathema. (see note 1)

Canon 12. If anyone says that justifying faith is nothing else than confidence in divine mercy, which remits sins for Christ's sake, or that it is this confidence alone that justifies us, let him be anathema.

Canon 24. If anyone says that the justice (righteousness) received is not preserved and also not increased before God through good works but that those works are merely the fruits and signs of justification obtained, but not the cause of the increase, let him be anathema.

Canon 30. If anyone says that after the reception of the grace of justification the guilt is so remitted and the debt of eternal punishment so blotted out to every repentant sinner, that no debt of temporal punishment remains to be discharged either in this world or in purgatory before the gates of heaven can be opened, let him be anathema.

Canon 32. If anyone says that the good works of the one justified are in such manner the gifts of God that they are not also the good merits of him justified; or that the one justified by the good works that he performs by the grace of God and the merit of Jesus Christ (of whom one is a living member), the justified does not truly merit an increase of grace, and eternal life, provided that one dies in the state of grace, the attainment of this eternal life, as well as an increase in glory, let him be anathema.

Official Catholic teaching would not allow the sinner to rely by faith on the mercy of God or to believe that his sins are forgiven for Christ’s sake only. Something more is required. You must keep yourself justified by your own good works. You must merit grace and eternal life by your works. You must pay the debt of sins by your penance and your purgatorial sufferings. That is Rome's salvation by works!

What about Canon 1?

Question But you forgot to mention canon 1, which clearly asserts that we are not justified by our works. "If anyone says that man can be justified before God by his own works, whether done by his own natural powers or through the teaching of the law, without divine grace through Jesus Christ, let him be anathema."

Answer This canon gives an initial impression that Rome denies justification by works just as the Bible (and evangelicals) also do. In fact it does not! The canon simply says that a man cannot be justified by performing the works of the Law by his own natural powers. However, the same canon indicates that a man can 'receive divine grace through Jesus Christ' to perform the works necessary for justification. In other words, Rome teaches that God helps man to do good works and hence to fully satisfy the Law. Only then is a person qualified to enter heaven. The Council of Trent elaborates this idea in chapter 16:

"For, whereas Jesus Christ Himself continually infuses his virtue into the said justified, - as the head into the members, and the vine into the branches, - and this virtue always precedes and accompanies and follows their good works, which without it could not in any wise be pleasing and meritorious before God, - we must believe that nothing further is wanting to the justified, to prevent their being accounted to have, by those very works which have been done in God, fully satisfied the divine law according to the state of this life, and to have truly merited eternal life, to be obtained also in its (due) time, if so be, however, that they depart in grace..."

To be fair, we should acknowledge that a great emphasis is placed on Jesus Christ and the grace of God. Good works do not originate in man's natural ability but can only be performed through Jesus Christ. Yet, it is also true that these works do not cease to be the good works of the Christian; personal works give him the right to heaven.

So then, what is required for a person to be justified at the end, that is, to be accounted to have fully satisfied divine law, and therefore to merit eternal life? Trent answers: THEIR GOOD WORKS! Their good works fully satisfy the divine law. Their works merit eternal life.

Catholic theology insists that the Christian's good works are truly his good merits, and by these works, he preserves and increases the initial righteousness received in baptism to finally attain eternal life (canons 24 and 32). Without doubt, the official documents of the Roman Catholic Church teach justification by works.

In contrast to this, the Bible declares:

“Now to him who works, the wages are not counted as grace but as debt. But to him who does not work but believes on Him who justifies the ungodly, his faith is accounted for righteousness, just as David also describes the blessedness of the man to whom God imputes (reckons, credits to one’s account) righteousness apart from works” (Romans 4:4-6).

The Bible asserts that he who "does not work" but "believes" is justified before God. Justification is not the reward for our works. Justification is the free gift of grace which we do not merit. The works that a Christian performs - and every true believer performs good works - are not the basis of their acceptance before God. The blood and righteousness of Jesus is the only basis for the believer's justification. "Much more then, being now justified by his blood, we shall be saved from wrath through him... by one Man’s obedience many will be made righteous" (Romans 5:9, 19).

That is the true Gospel; Rome’s message is counterfeit.

Note: When reading Trent's canons on Justification, keep in mind that the Protestant teaching is constantly caricatured as if we hold that there is nothing more to salvation than the remission of sins. Nothing could be further from the truth. We believe that regeneration and sanctification are integral aspects of salvation. So, for example, concerning canon 11, we do not exclude the grace and love poured in our hearts by the Holy Spirit. On the other hand, we do not believe that our standing before God is based on our inherent righteousness, but only on account of the righteousness of Christ imputed (credited) to us by faith and His substitutionary sacrifice for our sins.

The Catholic Church Teaches Salvation by Works
 

Johnny_B

Senior Member
Mar 18, 2017
1,954
64
48
#19
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I underwent conversion when I was baptized an infant into the Roman
Catholic system and continued on to complete First Holy Communion and
Confirmation.




I lost hope in Roman Catholicism back in 1968. I really can't imagine how
anyone could ever be a good enough Catholic to make it into heaven; it's
just too hard.

/
Not if you give your money to the right people and the right places. If you've been a Catholic for any amount of time you know how the mass for a died person goes. If you have money you get a high mass, little money low mass, no money no mass, which means no chance of purgatory. Maybe I misunderstood the system but from all I remember the only way to go hell is to violate Church doctrine, but there is still a mass to get around it if you have the money, you basically have to die a murderer to go to hell from what I remember.

Have you ever read the book "Christ Amoug Us" it is the brake down of Vatican II, I read a lot of it before I first became a born again believer. I cannot remember all the stages of being a believer, but if you are a priest your sins do not count against you in no way, why do you think they can do all those terrible things to young children and be okay with it, it is because their sins are not counted against them. We as born again believers, our sins are not count against us Psalm 32:1-2 “Blessed is the one whose transgression is forgiven, whose sin is covered.2 Blessed is the man against whom the Lord counts no iniquity, and in whose spirit there is no deceit.”

Romans 4:5-8
And to the one who does not work but believes in him who justifies the ungodly, his faith is counted as righteousness,6 just as David also speaks of the blessing of the one to whom God counts righteousness apart from works:7 “Blessed are those whose lawless deeds are forgiven,and whose sins are covered;8 blessed is the man against whom the Lord will not count his sin.

Look at the difference of a born again believer over an unregenate religous person and how they view those Scriptures. One thanks the Lord and feels bad when they sin and they confess it to receive forgiveness and the other view it as a free ticket to do as they please and still make heaven their home. A regenerate person see those Scriptures and when they sin they feel bad towards their creator and the other sins and says I can do it again because the creator doesn't hold it against me.

 

WebersHome

Senior Member
Dec 9, 2014
1,940
32
0
#20
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1Pet 3:15 . . Always be ready to give an explanation to anyone who ask
you for a reason for your hope.

The Greek word for "hope" in Peter's command is elpis (el pece') which
means to anticipate (usually with pleasure) and to expect with confidence.
Note the elements of anticipation, and expectation, and confidence.

In other words: Peter's hope is a know-so hope rather than a cross your
fingers hope.

So, unless someone is 110% confident-- beyond even the slightest glimmer
of sensible doubt --that they are going to heaven, then of course it is
impossible for them to comply with Peter's instructions seeing as they would
not yet have the kind of hope about which he wrote.

Rom 12:12 . . Rejoicing in hope.

When people are praying for the best, while in the back of their mind
dreading the worst, they have absolutely no cause for rejoicing; no; but they
do have plenty of cause to fear the unknown.

/