Amillennialism

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Ariel82

Guest
Think not that I am come to send peace on earth:
I came not to send peace, but a sword.

The second coming is in actuality a continuation of the first.

Luk 4:17 And there was delivered unto him the book of the prophet Esaias.
And when he had opened the book, he found the place where it was written,

Luk 4:18 The Spirit of the Lord is upon me, because he hath anointed me
to preach the gospel to the poor; he hath sent me to heal the brokenhearted,
to preach deliverance to the captives, and recovering of sight to the blind,
to set at liberty them that are bruised,

Luk 4:19 To preach the acceptable year of the Lord.

Luk 4:20 And he closed the book, and he gave it again to the minister, and sat down.
And the eyes of all them that were in the synagogue were fastened on him.

He stop reading just there, closed the book, and sat down?

Isa 61:1 The Spirit of the Lord GOD is upon me; because the LORD hath anointed me
to preach good tidings unto the meek; he hath sent me to bind up the brokenhearted,
to proclaim liberty to the captives, and the opening of the prison to them that are bound;

Isa 61:2 To proclaim the acceptable year of the LORD,
And here is where He stopped reading in mid sentence.


Now the passage He quoted continues...

and [the day of vengeance] of our God; to comfort all that mourn;

Isa 61:3 To appoint unto them that mourn in Zion, to give unto them beauty
for ashes, the oil of joy for mourning, the garment of praise for the spirit of heaviness;
that they might be called trees of righteousness, the planting of the LORD,
that he might be glorified.

Isa 61:4 And they shall build the old wastes, they shall raise up the former desolations,
and they shall repair the waste cities, the desolations of many generations.

Isa 61:5 And strangers shall stand and feed your flocks, and the sons of the alien shall
be your plowmen and your vinedressers.

Isa 61:6 But ye shall be named the Priests of the LORD: men shall call you the Ministers
of our God: ye shall eat the riches of the Gentiles, and in their glory shall ye boast yourselves.

Isa 61:7 For your shame ye shall have double; and for confusion they shall rejoice in their
portion: therefore in their land they shall possess the double: everlasting joy shall be unto them.

He came the first time to complete Isa 61:1-2 but not all of verse 2. When He returns,
after the day of vengeance, He will complete verse 2 and forward through verse 7.
Yes compare those images with Revelation 22 of the New Heaven and New Earth...

Then the angel showed me the river of the water of life, as clear as crystal, flowing from the throne of God and of the Lamb 2 down the middle of the great street of the city. On each side of the river stood the tree of life, bearing twelve crops of fruit, yielding its fruit every month. And the leaves of the tree are for the healing of the nations. 3 No longer will there be any curse. The throne of God and of the Lamb will be in the city, and his servants will serve him. 4 They will see his face, and his name will be on their foreheads. 5 There will be no more night. They will not need the light of a lamp or the light of the sun, for the Lord God will give them light. And they will reign for ever and ever.
 
A

Ariel82

Guest
◄ lə·zar·‘ă·ḵā ►
Englishman's Concordance
lə·zar·‘ă·ḵā — 7 Occurrences
Genesis 12:7
HEB: אַבְרָ֔ם וַיֹּ֕אמֶר לְזַ֨רְעֲךָ֔ אֶתֵּ֖ן אֶת־
KJV: and said, Unto thy seed will I give

Genesis 15:18
HEB: בְּרִ֣ית לֵאמֹ֑ר לְזַרְעֲךָ֗ נָתַ֙תִּי֙ אֶת־
KJV: saying, Unto thy seed have I given

Genesis 24:7
HEB: לִי֙ לֵאמֹ֔ר לְזַ֨רְעֲךָ֔ אֶתֵּ֖ן אֶת־
KJV: unto me, saying, Unto thy seed will I give

Genesis 26:4
HEB: הַשָּׁמַ֔יִם וְנָתַתִּ֣י לְזַרְעֲךָ֔ אֵ֥ת כָּ
KJV: and will give unto thy seed all these

Genesis 48:4
HEB: הָאָ֧רֶץ הַזֹּ֛את לְזַרְעֲךָ֥ אַחֲרֶ֖יךָ אֲחֻזַּ֥ת
KJV: this land to thy seed after thee

Exodus 33:1
HEB: וּֽלְיַעֲקֹב֙ לֵאמֹ֔ר לְזַרְעֲךָ֖ אֶתְּנֶֽנָּה׃
KJV: saying, Unto thy seed will I give

Deuteronomy 34:4
HEB: וּֽלְיַעֲקֹב֙ לֵאמֹ֔ר לְזַרְעֲךָ֖ אֶתְּנֶ֑נָּה הֶרְאִיתִ֣יךָ
KJV: I will give it unto thy seed: I have caused thee to see
 

trofimus

Senior Member
Aug 17, 2015
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◄ lə·zar·‘ă·ḵā ►
Englishman's Concordance
lə·zar·‘ă·ḵā — 7 Occurrences
Genesis 12:7
HEB: אַבְרָ֔ם וַיֹּ֕אמֶר לְזַ֨רְעֲךָ֔ אֶתֵּ֖ן אֶת־
KJV: and said, Unto thy seed will I give

Genesis 15:18
HEB: בְּרִ֣ית לֵאמֹ֑ר לְזַרְעֲךָ֗ נָתַ֙תִּי֙ אֶת־
KJV: saying, Unto thy seed have I given

Genesis 24:7
HEB: לִי֙ לֵאמֹ֔ר לְזַ֨רְעֲךָ֔ אֶתֵּ֖ן אֶת־
KJV: unto me, saying, Unto thy seed will I give

Genesis 26:4
HEB: הַשָּׁמַ֔יִם וְנָתַתִּ֣י לְזַרְעֲךָ֔ אֵ֥ת כָּ
KJV: and will give unto thy seed all these

Genesis 48:4
HEB: הָאָ֧רֶץ הַזֹּ֛את לְזַרְעֲךָ֥ אַחֲרֶ֖יךָ אֲחֻזַּ֥ת
KJV: this land to thy seed after thee

Exodus 33:1
HEB: וּֽלְיַעֲקֹב֙ לֵאמֹ֔ר לְזַרְעֲךָ֖ אֶתְּנֶֽנָּה׃
KJV: saying, Unto thy seed will I give

Deuteronomy 34:4
HEB: וּֽלְיַעֲקֹב֙ לֵאמֹ֔ר לְזַרְעֲךָ֖ אֶתְּנֶ֑נָּה הֶרְאִיתִ֣יךָ
KJV: I will give it unto thy seed: I have caused thee to see
And in Hebrew, is there really the singular "seed"?

Because almost all translations have "descendants". I suppose the KJV changed that to conform it with Paul?
 

Enoch987

Senior Member
Jul 13, 2017
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In Luke 23, Jesus gives the green wood/dry wood prophecy ( the destruction of the Temple in 70 AD is the green wood). The argument of amil vs. premil hinges on when does the abomination that desolates happen. If it happens 1290 to 1335 days before the return of Jesus (Daniel 12, the entire chapter, the first verses speak of the resurrection of the just and the unjust, granted there is no 1000 years mentioned here) then premil is true. If amil is true the mark of the beast is not literal. If amil is false but amil preaches the mark of the beast is not literal, amil leads believers astray.
 

prove-all

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May 16, 2014
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That does not answer the question....is there symbolism used in the Book of Revelation?

Have you studied OT prophecies and visions and seen how God FULFILLED them?

Do you know the prophecies Jesus FULFILLED in His life?
Yes there is symbolism used in the Book of Revelation,
and we have to let the bible interpet itself, lean not on our own understanding.

Here are some bible verses that are [not fullfiled yet].


"Thy Kingdom come" The Good news of the comming Kingdom of God to earth.
After human misrule causes great tribulation that almost wipes out civilization,

The living Christ is coming as “King of kings and Lord of lords” (Revelation 19:11-21),
to put down the rebellion of warring nations (Revelation 17:14), and establish God’s
world-ruling government over all nations (Daniel 2:44; 7:9, 13-14, 18, 22, 27; Isaiah 9:7).

He went away (to heaven) to be coronated, and to return to Earth (Luke 19:12-27).
He will then be on the Earth—Zechariah 14:3-4, 1 Thessalonians 4:16 (Nahum 1:5)
“We give thee thanks, O Lord God Almighty, which art, and wast, and art to come;
because thou hast taken to thee thy great power, and hast reigned” (Revelation 11:17)
“The mountains quake at him, and the hills [will] melt…” (Nahum 1:5), (Rev. 16:18)

-The seventh angel sounds-Kingdoms of current world become Christs (Rev 11:15)
Will commit thy government into his hand, established with judgement and jutice.
(Isaiah 22:21) Of the increase of his government and peace there shall be no end,
upon the throne of David, and upon his kingdom,...(Isaiah 9:7)

Beginning of that rule and world government “And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them,
and judgment was given unto them…and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years”
(Revelation 20:4).(Isaiah 11:2-4) And before him shall be gathered all nations: and he shall
separate them one from another,...Matthew 25:32


Jesus said: “And he that overcometh, and keepeth my works unto the end, to him will
I give power over the nations: And he shall rule them with a rod of iron…” (Rev 2:26-27).
And again, “To him that overcometh will I grant to sit with me in my throne [on this Earth]”
(Revelation 3:21; Luke 1:32-33). And, “…we shall reign on the earth” (Revelation 5:10).

And I appoint unto you a kingdom, as my Father hath appointed unto me;(Luke 22:29)
Some resurrected saints will rule over 10 cities, some over five (Luke 19:12-19)
Saints shall take the kingdom, and possess the kingdom for ever, (Daniel 7:18)
We shall inherit the earth. (Psalms 25:13-22:26, 37:9, 22,29) not flesh and blood.

It was round about eighteen thousand measures: and the name
of the city from that day shall be, The Lord is there. (Ezekiel 48:35)


17At that time they shall call Jerusalem the throne of the Lord; and
all the nations shall be gathered unto it, to the name of the Lord, to Jerusalem:
neither shall they walk any more after the imagination of their evil heart.

Him that overcometh will I make a pillar in the temple of my God, and he shall go
no more out: and I will write upon him the name of my God, and the name of the city
of my God, which is new Jerusalem, which cometh down out of heaven from my God:
and I will write upon him my new name.

And the Gentiles shall see thy righteousness, and all kings thy glory: and thou shalt
be called by a new name, which the mouth of the Lord shall name. (Isaiah 62:2)

-Jerusalem, the future headquarters city of the Earth (Haggai 2:6-8)
-Land Beneath Sea Reclaimed, converted to Jerusalem(Isaiah 60:5, 11:15).
World’s gold and silver reserves under the seas for beautiful decorations there.
-Gods latter house shall be greater than of the former (Haggai 2:9)
-Jerusalem is uniquely describes as being “compact together,” tall 122:3

-Desolate land shall be tilled - will be like the garden of Eden (Ezekiel 36:34-35)
-Build the waste cities-fresh produce-drink there own wine-farming (Amos 9:14)
-Waste cities “filled with flocks of men” being very social(Ezekiel 36:36-37-38)
-Superhighways between major cities (Isaiah 19:23)

-Cities being crime-free , dwell safely-none be made afried (Ezekiel 34:28-Micah 4:4)
-No more Violence, nor wasting, nor destruction (Isaiah 60:18)
-Cities overflow with prosperity (Zechariah 1:17) -Equitable property distribution
- every man shall own his vine and fig tree (Micah 4:4-Lev25) and

-“Joy and gladness-thanksgiving-the voice of melody(Isaiah 51:3)(Jeremiah 33:10-11)
-Where old men and old women dwell -full of boys and girls playing (Zechariah 8:4-5)
-No lion shall be there, nor any ravenous beast shall go up (Isaiah 35:9 )
-There will be Shepherds and local animal husbandry (Jer. 33:12)

-Pure Water—Fertile Deserts where trees grow (Isaiah 35)
-No more hunger-He will raise up a plant of renown (Ezekiel 34:29)
-A new sharp threshing instrument -the mountains made small(Isaiah 41:14-16)
-If any thrist and seek water, the God of Israel will not forsake them. (ver 17-18)

Trees planted and growing-consider and understand that the [Eternal] hath
done this, and the Holy One of Israel hath created it” . (verse 19-20)

--All will speak the same language, a pure language from God (Zephaniah 3:9).
God will also destroy the idols, Ezekiel 30:13, Micah 5:10-15, Zechariah 13:2

Thy graven images also will I cut off, and thy standing images out of the midst
of thee; and thou shalt no more worship the work of thine hands.

The whole earth is at rest, and is quiet: they break forth into singing. (Isaiah 14:7)
All the earth shall worship thee, and shall sing unto thee; they shall sing to thy name.
Psalms 66:4 -God has spoken it, and He is not one to go back on His word (Isaiah 55:11)



Please show where and how these promises are fullfiled allready.
 

Deade

Called of God
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yeshuaofisrael.org
Ariel: Genesis 48:4
HEB: הָאָ֧רֶץ הַזֹּ֛את לְזַרְעֲךָ֥ אַחֲרֶ֖יךָ אֲחֻזַּ֥ת
KJV: this land to thy seed after thee

What seed do you think was being addressed here: This whole chapter was about Abraham assigning his name and blessing his two grandsons (the sons of Joseph). Gen. 48:16: "The Angel which redeemed me from all evil, bless the lads; and let my name be named on them, and the name of my fathers Abraham and Isaac; and let them grow into a multitude in the midst of the earth."

As the blessing continued: Gen 48:19: "And his father refused, and said, I know it, my son, I know it: he also shall become a people, and he also shall be great: but truly his younger brother shall be greater than he, and his seed shall become a multitude of nations." So, Manasseh becomes one great nation and Ephraim will be a multitude of nations.
:cool:
 
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Ariel82

Guest
And in Hebrew, is there really the singular "seed"?

Because almost all translations have "descendants". I suppose the KJV changed that to conform it with Paul?
It is singular in Hebrew but people say it can be translated with a plural sense to it.

However I believe God made it singular for a reason because not all of Abraham's offspring were included in the promise.


Gen 21:12, "for in Isaac shall thy seed be called."


It also says in Galatians about the New Covenant versus the Old....that earthly Jerusalem is compared to beingHagar and not entitled to the promises made to Abraham...just like Esau and Ishmael.
 
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Ariel82

Guest

What seed do you think was being addressed here: This whole chapter was about Abraham assigning his name and blessing his two grandsons (the sons of Joseph). Gen. 48:16: "The Angel which redeemed me from all evil, bless the lads; and let my name be named on them, and the name of my fathers Abraham and Isaac; and let them grow into a multitude in the midst of the earth."

As the blessing continued: Gen 48:19: "And his father refused, and said, I know it, my son, I know it: he also shall become a people, and he also shall be great: but truly his younger brother shall be greater than he, and his seed shall become a multitude of nations." So, Manasseh becomes one great nation and Ephraim will be a multitude of nations.
:cool:
You mean Israel or Jacob...not Abraham
 
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Ariel82

Guest
In Luke 23, Jesus gives the green wood/dry wood prophecy ( the destruction of the Temple in 70 AD is the green wood). The argument of amil vs. premil hinges on when does the abomination that desolates happen. If it happens 1290 to 1335 days before the return of Jesus (Daniel 12, the entire chapter, the first verses speak of the resurrection of the just and the unjust, granted there is no 1000 years mentioned here) then premil is true. If amil is true the mark of the beast is not literal. If amil is false but amil preaches the mark of the beast is not literal, amil leads believers astray.
You are mistaken. Amil actually says the mark of the beast was given to 1st century people by Nero when they worshipped at the Roman temples that allowed them to trade at the market places. They received a mark on their hand or forehead to show they had bowed down to the emporer's idols as if he were a god.
 
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valiant

Senior Member
Mar 22, 2015
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In Luke 23, Jesus gives the green wood/dry wood prophecy ( the destruction of the Temple in 70 AD is the green wood). The argument of amil vs. premil hinges on when does the abomination that desolates happen. If it happens 1290 to 1335 days before the return of Jesus (Daniel 12, the entire chapter, the first verses speak of the resurrection of the just and the unjust, granted there is no 1000 years mentioned here) then premil is true. If amil is true the mark of the beast is not literal. If amil is false but amil preaches the mark of the beast is not literal, amil leads believers astray.
amillenialism, which I discovered to be the truth having been caught up in the mires of premillenialism, does teach that the mark of the beast is literal. It was the mark put on people having sacrificed to the emperor. Without that mark they could not join the trade guilds.


the abomination of desolation occurred when the Roman troops took their standards into the Temple.
 
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Ariel82

Guest
Galatians 4
22 For it is written that Abraham had two sons: the one by a bondwoman, the other by a freewoman. 23 But he who was of the bondwoman was born according to the flesh, and he of the freewoman through promise, 24 which things are symbolic. For these are the[d] two covenants: the one from Mount Sinai which gives birth to bondage, which is Hagar— 25 for this Hagar is Mount Sinai in Arabia, and corresponds to Jerusalem which now is, and is in bondage with her children— 26 but the Jerusalem above is free, which is the mother of us all. 27 For it is written:

“Rejoice, O barren,
You who do not bear!
Break forth and shout,
You who are not in labor!
For the desolate has many more children
Than she who has a husband.”[e]

28 Now we, brethren, as Isaac was, are children of promise. 29 But, as he who was born according to the flesh then persecuted him who was born according to the Spirit, even so it is now. 30 Nevertheless what does the Scripture say? “Cast out the bondwoman and her son, for the son of the bondwoman shall not be heir with the son of the freewoman.”[f] 31 So then, brethren, we are not children of the bondwoman but of the free.
 

trofimus

Senior Member
Aug 17, 2015
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It is singular in Hebrew but people say it can be translated with a plural sense to it.

However I believe God made it singular for a reason because not all of Abraham's offspring were included in the promise.


Gen 21:12, "for in Isaac shall thy seed be called."


It also says in Galatians about the New Covenant versus the Old....that earthly Jerusalem is compared to beingHagar and not entitled to the promises made to Abraham...just like Esau and Ishmael.
So, why all translations have plural?

And why Paul argued that its singular, when it can be translated plural?
 
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Ariel82

Guest
So, why all translations have plural?

And why Paul argued that its singular, when it can be translated plural?
Because it's written in singular even if it could have been written in plural and man tries to make things confirm to their logic.

Plus the KJV doesn't have it plural

Ephesians 4:4 ►
New International Version
There is one body and one Spirit, just as you were called to one hope when you were called;
 
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Bladerunner

Senior Member
Aug 22, 2016
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Answer honestly....does Revelation contain symbolic language? Yes or no?

Have you examined the FULFILLED prophecies and visions in the Old testament?

Have you seen how God used Jesus to fulfill many of the prophecies?


"Answer honestly....does Revelation contain symbolic language? Yes or no?""

Yes and a 100 other grammatical parts of speech (i.e. similes, metaphors, idioms, allusions etc...etc....etc....). What about Puns...God uses several in the His Book!.......

As far as the Prophecies are concerned Yes, I have and did you know that from the time that Jesus rode on that donkey into Jerusalem and the time that Pentecost happened, over 108 prophecies were fulfilled..

You speak of revelation yet you discount most of it by way of symbolism. Revelation has what---404 verses and has well 800 allusions to OT text which are Prophecies?

REm, you are the one who is throwing away God's Word and/or Changing it to fit world view.

That is what Amellinnialism does. Allows everyone who believes in it to change it to fit their lifestyles and/or worldviews..... I am not talking about you but over all the population, it is a fact...... They do not want to live by God's standards.

I would bet that Since Paul is our apostle and He gave us far more than 10 commandments from Jesus; How many people want to follow them and give up/change their lifestyle or worldview....NOT VERY MANY.....






 
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Ariel82

Guest
I feel as if you don't understand the purpose of symbolism....


For example the imagery of water...do you understand what it means?

If you add salt to your water?

Or that God places in our hearts life giving water?

Understanding symbolism doesn't discount Revelation..,it makes it a message relevant to TODAY and the world we face.

.it tells of God's war plan on physical Earth and the spirit realm.
 
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iamsoandso

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Oct 6, 2011
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amillenialism, which I discovered to be the truth having been caught up in the mires of premillenialism, does teach that the mark of the beast is literal. It was the mark put on people having sacrificed to the emperor. Without that mark they could not join the trade guilds.


the abomination of desolation occurred when the Roman troops took their standards into the Temple.

Where on earth is this about Nero and the mark and them sacrificing to the emperor coming from? I keep seeing this over and over repeated as if it is true but always without any proof. Is this just another Internet hoax or is there any actual proof that shows this to be true?
 

Bladerunner

Senior Member
Aug 22, 2016
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amillenialism, which I discovered to be the truth having been caught up in the mires of premillenialism, does teach that the mark of the beast is literal. It was the mark put on people having sacrificed to the emperor. Without that mark they could not join the trade guilds.


the abomination of desolation occurred when the Roman troops took their standards into the Temple.

Yes, and under some of the Emperors each person had to throw a pinch of material into the fire and repeat words that ineffect made the Emperor the #1 God.....once per year. Was this a pattern that would again appear in the far future. I think so....

By the way, the emperors were not the antichrist! Megalomaniacs , maybe but not Gods nor antichrist (pseudo Christ)

By the way, they were given a piece of paper attesting to what they had done and if they did not do this, they died...Many Christians, died and many did not.......Just like our future for as then there are those who now will place God second place to MAN..
 
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Ariel82

Guest
Nero as the Antichrist

During his reign many abuses were severely punished and put down, and no fewer new laws were made....Punishment was inflicted on the Christians, a class of men given to a new and mischievous superstition."

Suetonius, Nero (XVI.2)
 

iamsoandso

Senior Member
Oct 6, 2011
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Nero as the Antichrist

During his reign many abuses were severely punished and put down, and no fewer new laws were made....Punishment was inflicted on the Christians, a class of men given to a new and mischievous superstition."

Suetonius, Nero (XVI.2)

Lets examine this very close and see if it is true. Josephus: Of the War, Book II Scroll down to chapter 10,11 and look what is said about the Jews refusing to "sacrifice"
 

iamsoandso

Senior Member
Oct 6, 2011
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Lets examine this very close and see if it is true. Josephus: Of the War, Book II Scroll down to chapter 10,11 and look what is said about the Jews refusing to "sacrifice"

Then notice the link you gave and mine are both Chicago.edu ...

The fragment at the bottom of your link is Papyrus 115 ( can you read it?) I can and would love Angela to help!