What Does It Mean To "Fall From Grace"?

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
Sep 3, 2016
6,337
527
113
#1
Answer: "Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the Law; you are fallen from Grace" (Gal. 5:4).

When one falls from Grace, this stops most of the action of the Holy Spirit on our behalf (Rom. 8:2).

One falls from Grace by placing one's faith in something other than the Cross of Christ. And no matter how beneficial the "something" might be in its own right, this is Faith that God will not recognize (Gal. 5:1-4).

When the Believer places his Faith in anything other than Christ and Him Crucified, such serves to frustrate the Grace of God. The word "frustrate" in the Greek is "atheteo," and means "to set aside, to neutralize or violate, to bring to naught, to reject."

The Holy Spirit works entirely within the framework of the Finished Work of Christ. What Jesus did there, gives Him the legal right to carry forth His Mission, without which He is greatly hindered (1 Cor. 1:18).

JSM


 
Sep 3, 2016
6,337
527
113
#2
Answer: "Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the Law; you are fallen from Grace" (Gal. 5:4).

When one falls from Grace, this stops most of the action of the Holy Spirit on our behalf (Rom. 8:2).

One falls from Grace by placing one's faith in something other than the Cross of Christ. And no matter how beneficial the "something" might be in its own right, this is Faith that God will not recognize (Gal. 5:1-4).

When the Believer places his Faith in anything other than Christ and Him Crucified, such serves to frustrate the Grace of God. The word "frustrate" in the Greek is "atheteo," and means "to set aside, to neutralize or violate, to bring to naught, to reject."

The Holy Spirit works entirely within the framework of the Finished Work of Christ. What Jesus did there, gives Him the legal right to carry forth His Mission, without which He is greatly hindered (1 Cor. 1:18).

JSM


In the last several decades, the modern church has all but abandoned the Cross. While the Cross is still the emblem of Christianity so to speak and rightly so, still, the Salvation experience respecting the Cross is about the limit of the understanding of most. As it regards Sanctification, in other words, how we live for God, most people don't have a clue as to how the Cross plays into this.

JSM
 

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
24,167
12,763
113
#3
When the Believer places his Faith in anything other than Christ and Him Crucified, such serves to frustrate the Grace of God.

Believers cannot stop there. We need to focus on Christ and Him crucified, resurrected, glorified, ascended, and exalted at the right hand of the Father. The focus must be on the totality of what Christ has accomplished and is accomplishing even now.

Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high; Being made so much better than the angels, as he hath by inheritance obtained a more excellent name than they. (Heb 1:3,4).
 
Sep 3, 2016
6,337
527
113
#4
As it regards the Cross of Christ versus the Resurrection, the great Apostle said:

“For Christ sent me not to baptize, but to preach the Gospel: not with wisdom of words, lest the Cross of Christ should be made of none effect” (1 Cor.1:17). If it is to be noticed, he did not say.“lest the Resurrection of Christ should be made of none effect.”


He also said, “For the preaching (Word) of the Cross is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are Saved it is the Power of God.” (1 Cor.1:18). He did not say, “For the preaching of the Resurrection is to them….”


The great Apostle also said, “But we preach Christ Crucified” (1 Cor. 1:23). He did not say, as it regards the Atonement,“We preach Christ Resurrected…”


Of course, Paul preached the Resurrection of Christ, even as Chapter 15 of 1 Corinthians bears out, but not as the Atonement.


He also stated to the Church at Corinth and to all others as well, “For I determined not to know any thing among you save Jesus Christ, and Him Crucified” (1 Cor. 2:2). He did not say, “For I determined not to know any thing among you save Jesus Christ, and Him Resurrected…”


He also stated, “But God forbid that I should glory, save in the Cross of our Lord Jesus Christ…” (Gal. 6:14). He did not say,“But God forbid that I should glory, save in the Resurrection of our Lord Jesus Christ…”


As I have stated before on other discussions, while the Resurrection, and the Ascension, and the Exaltation of Christ were of extreme significance, these three tremendous attributes were the result of the Atonement, i.e., “the Cross,” instead of the cause.

JSM

 

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
24,167
12,763
113
#5
As I have stated before on other discussions, while the Resurrection, and the Ascension, and the Exaltation of Christ were of extreme significance, these three tremendous attributes were the result of the Atonement, i.e., “the Cross,” instead of the cause.
When Paul uses the word "preaching" his focus is on the Gospel and the Cross. But when Paul is teaching, then he brings all the other aspects of Christ before Christians. So Christians must follow his lead in this matter.
 
Dec 9, 2011
13,703
1,715
113
#6
IMO,a fall from Grace for the Christian would be talking about conditional sanctification because when It comes to salvation,those who have been born of Incorruptible seed are spiritually made perfect.
 
D

Depleted

Guest
#7
IMO,a fall from Grace for the Christian would be talking about conditional sanctification because when It comes to salvation,those who have been born of Incorruptible seed are spiritually made perfect.
Pssst, you opinion doesn't count for Message. His opinion is the only opinion to have. :)
 
Sep 3, 2016
6,337
527
113
#8
Pssst, you opinion doesn't count for Message. His opinion is the only opinion to have. :)
We all must understand that the intrusion of human wisdom will immediately cancel Grace. The Believer whom is going to Heaven is either operating in Grace or Law.

Under the Power of the Holy Spirit the Apostle Paul said:
For it is written, I (God) will destroy the wisdom of the wise, and will bring to nothing the understanding of the prudent (1 Cor. 1:19).

This why Paul said:
For I determined not to know any thing among you, save Jesus Christ, and Him Crucified. 1 Corinthians 2:2


 
Last edited:
Dec 9, 2011
13,703
1,715
113
#9
We all must understand that the intrusion of human wisdom will immediately cancel Grace. The Believer whom is going to Heaven is either operating in Grace or Law.

Under the Power of the Holy Spirit the Apostle Paul said:
For it is written, I (God) will destroy the wisdom of the wise, and will bring to nothing the understanding of the prudent (1 Cor. 1:19).

This why Paul said:
For I determined not to know any thing among you, save Jesus Christ, and Him Crucified. 1 Corinthians 2:2


Can the believer not operate In Grace when It comes to conditional sanctification and still make It to heaven?
 
Sep 3, 2016
6,337
527
113
#10
Can the believer not operate In Grace when It comes to conditional sanctification and still make It to heaven?
The majority of Christians know nothing about the Cross of Christ for sanctification. All they have in their mind is, "I have to do something." Satan has been the master of deception by deceiving the Christian population into moving them away from the Cross to something else.

Those who have departed from the faith

To depart from the faith means that a person had once been in the faith. Brother Swaggart says when we speak of faith at the ministry, we're speaking of faith in the Cross of the Lord Jesus Christ. When people leave the Cross and turn to other things, which millions are now doing, the Scripture says of them:" Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils" (
1 Timothy 4:1).

Needless to say, such individuals, as with the lukewarm and as with those who have a form of godliness, are labeled by the Lord as unsaved, despite their claims, and will not go in the rapture nor enter the strait gate and narrow way that leads unto life.

 
Mar 23, 2016
6,732
1,630
113
#11
The great Apostle also said, “But we preach Christ Crucified” (1 Cor. 1:23). He did not say, as it regards the Atonement,“We preach Christ Resurrected…”
And if you continue reading, in 1 Cor 1:24 he says unto them which are called … Christ the power of God, and the wisdom of God


The cross is the beginning, the foundation.


The resurrection declares our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ to be the Son of God with power, according to the spirit of holiness (Rom 1:4).


The ascension reveals the exceeding greatness of God’s power which He wrought in Christ, when He raised Him from the dead, and set Him at His own right hand in the heavenly places far above all principality, and power, and might, and dominion, and every name that is named, not only in this world, but also in that which is to come (Eph 1:29-21).



The cross is where we are humbled to death.
The resurrection is where we are brought from death to life.
The ascension is where we are blessed with all spiritual blessings.

To walk in newness of life after we are born again, we must understand that it encompasses the whole of the cross, the resurrection, and the ascension.
 
Dec 9, 2011
13,703
1,715
113
#12
The majority of Christians know nothing about the Cross of Christ for sanctification. All they have in their mind is, "I have to do something." Satan has been the master of deception by deceiving the Christian population into moving them away from the Cross to something else.

Those who have departed from the faith

To depart from the faith means that a person had once been in the faith. Brother Swaggart says when we speak of faith at the ministry, we're speaking of faith in the Cross of the Lord Jesus Christ. When people leave the Cross and turn to other things, which millions are now doing, the Scripture says of them:" Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils" (
1 Timothy 4:1).

Needless to say, such individuals, as with the lukewarm and as with those who have a form of godliness, are labeled by the Lord as unsaved, despite their claims, and will not go in the rapture nor enter the strait gate and narrow way that leads unto life.

Doesn't the bible say that GOD so loved the world that HE gave HIS only begotten son that whosoever BELIEVED In HIM would not perish but HAVE everlasting life?

And once we are born AGAIN of Incorruptible seed,how can that that Is Incorruptible become corrupted?

Maybe the verse about departing from the faith was misinterpreted.
 
Sep 3, 2016
6,337
527
113
#13
Doesn't the bible say that GOD so loved the world that HE gave HIS only begotten son that whosoever BELIEVED In HIM would not perish but HAVE everlasting life?

And once we are born AGAIN of Incorruptible seed,how can that that Is Incorruptible become corrupted?

Maybe the verse about departing from the faith was misinterpreted.
Not every one that saith unto Me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the Kingdom of Heaven; but he that doeth the Will of My Father which is in Heaven.

Jesus tells us that there will be many who have been involved in ministry in His name, to whom He will say, "Depart from Me; I never knew you" (Matt. 7:21). What is the Will of the Father? Verse 23 tells us.

v. 23 - And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from Me, you who work iniquity.

The criteria alone is Christ and Him Crucified (1 Cor. 1:23). We have access to God only through Christ, and access to Christ only through the Cross, and access to the Cross only through a denial of self (Lk.9:23); any other Message is judged by God as "iniquity," and cannot be a part of Christ (1 Cor. 1:17).



 
Last edited:
Sep 3, 2016
6,337
527
113
#14
If a Christian Faith is not placed and maintained exclusively in Christ and His Finished Work, i.e., The Cross, i.e., The Blood of Jesus (Rom. 8:2), there's no way he can escape demons. The only way to have victory over sin, the world, the flesh, and the devil, is Faith in Christ and His Finished Work (2 Tim. 2:24-26).

Paul also makes it very clear in Romans 8:10 that the physical body, mind / intellect, and the heart (which is evil - Jeremiah 17:9) has been rendered helpless because of the original sin; consequently, the Believer trying to overcome by willpower presents a fruitless task. Only the Holy Spirit can mortify the deeds of the flesh and make us what we ought to be (Romans 8:13). This means we cannot do it ourselves. Once again, He performs all that He does within the confines of the Finished Work of Christ (Romans 8:2).

If a Christian will and their efforts to live for God is in anything except Christ and the Cross, i.e., Finished Work, The Blood of Jesus (Romans 8:2), Satan can override your will and force you to do things you don't want to do and trying not to do (Ephesians 6:12). Jesus said deny yourself and pick up your cross and follow me (Luke 9:23).

Remember our bodies are dead and useless to God. The heart is prone to wander away from God's love and eat from "The Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil." The reason why the body is dead is because of the effects of the fall has made us totally incapable of yielding spiritual obedience on a regular basis (Jeremiah 13:23). So there must be a source outside of myself that helps me to enter into sanctification which is the Holy Spirit (Romans 8:13).



 
Last edited:

Zmouth

Senior Member
Nov 21, 2012
3,391
134
63
#15
Doesn't the bible say that GOD so loved the world that HE gave HIS only begotten son that whosoever BELIEVED In HIM would not perish but HAVE everlasting life?
So if the Son said that all things are delivered to him of his Father, stating that no man knoweth who the Son is, but the Father; and who the Father is, but the Son, and he to whom the Son will reveal him.

Since the devils believe in one God also, maybe the reason they tremble is due to the fact that if the Son has revealed the Father then wouldn't they have known who the Father was before they knew who the Son is since no man can come to the Son unless the Father that sent him draw them. It is written in the scriptures that "If ye had known me, ye should have known my Father also:" John 14:7


In previous dialogue they had said they unto him, Where is thy Father? Jesus answered, Ye neither know me, nor my Father: if ye had known me, ye should have known my Father also. John 8:19


And once we are born AGAIN of Incorruptible seed,how can that that Is Incorruptible become corrupted?

Isn't it written whosoever commits sin is of their father the devil who was a liar from the beginning who abode not in the truth?

He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. 1 John 3:8

Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it. John 8:44

God forbid: yea, let God be true, but every man a liar; as it is written, That thou mightest be justified in thy sayings, and mightest overcome when thou art judged. Rom 3:4

[FONT=&quot]Since devils are born without ears they cannot hear [/FONT][FONT=&quot]whosoever is born of God does to sin, neither can they because there is no sin in them. [/FONT]
 
Sep 3, 2016
6,337
527
113
#16
[FONT="&amp]Brethren, be followers together of me, and mark them which walk so as ye have us for an ensample.[/FONT]
[SUP][FONT="&amp]18 [/FONT][/SUP][FONT="&amp](For many walk, of whom I have told you often, and now tell you even weeping, that they are the enemies of the Cross of Christ:[/FONT]
[SUP][FONT="&amp]19 [/FONT][/SUP][FONT="&amp]Whose end is destruction, whose God is their belly, and whose glory is in their shame, who mind earthly things.) Philippians 3:17-19[/FONT]
 
Last edited:
Mar 23, 2016
6,732
1,630
113
#17
The criteria alone is Christ and Him Crucified (1 Cor. 1:23). We have access to God only through Christ, and access to Christ only through the Cross, and access to the Cross only through a denial of self (Lk.9:23); any other Message is judged by God as "iniquity," and cannot be a part of Christ (1 Cor. 1:17).
So these guys didn’t get the memo?


Peter:

Acts 10:

34 Then Peter opened his mouth, and said, Of a truth I perceive that God is no respecter of persons:

35 But in every nation he that feareth him, and worketh righteousness, is accepted with him.

36 The word which God sent unto the children of Israel, preaching peace by Jesus Christ: (he is Lord of all; )

37 That word, I say, ye know, which was published throughout all Judaea, and began from Galilee, after the baptism which John preached;

38 How God anointed Jesus of Nazareth with the Holy Ghost and with power: who went about doing good, and healing all that were oppressed of the devil; for God was with him.

39 And we are witnesses of all things which he did both in the land of the Jews, and in Jerusalem; whom they slew and hanged on a tree:

40 Him God raised up the third day, and shewed him openly;



Paul:

Acts 13:

26 Men and brethren, children of the stock of Abraham, and whosoever among you feareth God, to you is the word of this salvation sent.

27 For they that dwell at Jerusalem, and their rulers, because they knew him not, nor yet the voices of the prophets which are read every sabbath day, they have fulfilled them in condemning him.

28 And though they found no cause of death in him, yet desired they Pilate that he should be slain.

29 And when they had fulfilled all that was written of him, they took him down from the tree, and laid him in a sepulchre.

30 But God raised him from the dead:




Peter before the counsel at Jerusalem:

Acts 15:

6 And the apostles and elders came together for to consider of this matter.

7 And when there had been much disputing, Peter rose up, and said unto them, Men and brethren, ye know how that a good while ago God made choice among us, that the Gentiles by my mouth should hear the word of the gospel, and believe.



Apparently Peter considered the resurrection to be an integral part of the gospel.
 
Dec 9, 2011
13,703
1,715
113
#18
Not every one that saith unto Me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the Kingdom of Heaven; but he that doeth the Will of My Father which is in Heaven.

Jesus tells us that there will be many who have been involved in ministry in His name, to whom He will say, "Depart from Me; I never knew you" (Matt. 7:21). What is the Will of the Father? Verse 23 tells us.

v. 23 - And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from Me, you who work iniquity.

The criteria alone is Christ and Him Crucified (1 Cor. 1:23). We have access to God only through Christ, and access to Christ only through the Cross, and access to the Cross only through a denial of self (Lk.9:23); any other Message is judged by God as "iniquity," and cannot be a part of Christ (1 Cor. 1:17).



So then how do we harmonize a person that Is born again of Incorruptible seed with In latter times some will depart from the faith so that they make sense together and not seem to contradict each other I mean both of those are the word of GOD?
 
Dec 9, 2011
13,703
1,715
113
#19
So if the Son said that all things are delivered to him of his Father, stating that no man knoweth who the Son is, but the Father; and who the Father is, but the Son, and he to whom the Son will reveal him.

Since the devils believe in one God also, maybe the reason they tremble is due to the fact that if the Son has revealed the Father then wouldn't they have known who the Father was before they knew who the Son is since no man can come to the Son unless the Father that sent him draw them. It is written in the scriptures that "If ye had known me, ye should have known my Father also:" John 14:7


In previous dialogue they had said they unto him, Where is thy Father? Jesus answered, Ye neither know me, nor my Father: if ye had known me, ye should have known my Father also. John 8:19





Isn't it written whosoever commits sin is of their father the devil who was a liar from the beginning who abode not in the truth?

He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. 1 John 3:8

Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it. John 8:44

God forbid: yea, let God be true, but every man a liar; as it is written, That thou mightest be justified in thy sayings, and mightest overcome when thou art judged. Rom 3:4

[FONT="]Since devils are born without ears they cannot hear [/FONT][FONT="]whosoever is born of God does to sin, neither can they because there is no sin in them. [/FONT]
Are you saying that you don’t sin?
 
B

BJH

Guest
#20
Hi, I believe 1 Jn 3 says "whosoever is born of God….." the only part of Us that is born of God is our Spirit. Christ in you. The body and the soul (mind, will and emotions that require renewing) still in a corruptible state. Many times in the scriptures the word "sin" is hamartia, hamartian (noun) not talking about the action of sin (verb) but the nature of sin (a persons fallen state before Christ). The spirit in a believer cannot sin because it is incorruptible. Our old nature (the flesh) has been cut off and we have been freed from sin, no longer a prisoner to it. We are not to even have a sin consciousness.(thinking about sin) but a Christ consciousness.