The Written Code Kills

[Stunnedbygrace]

You will nave need to excuse me because I am so confused, though I understand what you have posted.

Yes, Jesus does teach to the hypocrites if you have hatred in your heart for a brother you are already guilty of murder...I knew that, but being so confused it seems you have not read my op or other posts in this the thread I began this morning.

Now if you believe it out of love to label an elder as confused in the presence of others who beieve Jesus, then you seem to believe it to be good in the sight of the Fasther also.

It is too latwe for you to take me aside, that is send a pm, so i will leave you to contiue in your most holy endeavor. Meanwhiel I will share truth, even the truth you have indicated I am too confused to be aware of.

Since you are not confused, it probably will do not good to advise you to read my op and other posts today, thereofe ti will do you little if any good to post directly to me, a confused person who has been reading the Word for a half century. Oh, that is almost your age... Thank you for your critique. God bless you with true uinderstanding in Jesus christ, amen.

It was not my intent to...dress you down in any way Jaume!
I was trying to explain to you how the thinking of some people is (like myself). I was addressing the part of your post where you say the commands are not burdensome and how you didn't understand how one could think they were.

Some peoples minds grasp these things differently and I was trying to give you a peek inside my mind and how it processes it all.

That was my intent, and please accept my apology for not being clear or for making it look like I was talking down to you in some way!

 

[JaumeJ]

Perhaps I should if stressed that God's will for each of us is not a burden though it is true we will have trials in this age.....how they can possibly go together takes some prayer and meditation, then thre respons from our Father for each.

 

[Stunnedbygrace]

The trials of our trust are light and temporary and cannot be compared to the weight of glory we are being made to bear for eternity!

 

[Stunnedbygrace]

Perhaps I should if stressed that God's will for each of us is not a burden though it is true we will have trials in this age.....how they can possibly go together takes some prayer and meditation, then thre respons from our Father for each.

Getting to the place of radical trust, that radical obedience of trust that cares not what it sees with its eyes but cares what its Lord has promised, is a struggle and a trial, but it is gold being purified in fire and it comes out stronger and stronger with each trial.

 

[Grandpa]

2 Peter 3:17-18

[SUP]17 [/SUP]Ye therefore, beloved, seeing ye know these things before, beware lest ye also, being led away with the error of the wicked, fall from your own stedfastness.
[SUP]18 [/SUP]But grow in grace, and in the knowledge of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ. To him be glory both now and for ever. Amen.

Galatians 3:3 Are ye so foolish? having begun in the Spirit, are ye now made perfect by the flesh?

2 Corinthians 3:5-6
[SUP]5 [/SUP]Not that we are sufficient of ourselves to think any thing as of ourselves; but our sufficiency is of God;
[SUP]6 [/SUP]Who also hath made us able ministers of the new testament; not of the letter, but of the spirit: for the letter killeth, but the spirit giveth life.


Being led away with the error of the wicked. Probably just as bad as being led away with the error of the foolish, trying to be made perfect by an act of the will and flesh.

If we are not sufficient to look to the letter and be obedient by our own power and will then what is our alternative? To look to the Lord Jesus Christ who gives us rest from this labor, that is our ONLY alternative.

Matthew 11:28 Come unto me, all ye that labour and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest.

If you can't trust in your own power and understanding to be saved how can you trust in your own power and understanding to be "obedient"? It must be the error of the wicked to think this way. Someone who has put his whole trust in the Lord Jesus Christ for Salvation should know where ALL their blessings are located.
​

​

​

 

[oldethennew]

Honoring is Honoring, Loving is Loving, Forgiving is Forgiving, etc., all a continuing process
in a True Christian's Life...

 

[JaumeJ]

The written code or the Scripture kills without understanding of the Holy Spirit imparted.

The proof is historically demonstrated when men of "knowledge" have read and spread death and mayhem in place of love, salvation and the peace of Jesus Christ.

Yes, the written code kills when interpreted by the fleshy minds of men...........

 

[Ahwatukee]

The written code or the Scripture kills without understanding of the Holy Spirit imparted.

The proof is historically demonstrated when men of "knowledge" have read and spread death and mayhem in place of love, salvation and the peace of Jesus Christ.

Yes, the written code kills when interpreted by the fleshy minds of men...........

Forgive me JaumeJ, but you are not considering the immediate context of the scripture. The reference to "the written code" is not referring to interpreting the scriptures without the Holy Spirit, but is referring to the observance the law of Moses as what kills us, the written code. If you would have looked at the whole context of what Paul was saying you would have understood this:

"Such confidence we have through Christ before God. Not that we are competent in ourselves to claim anything for ourselves, but our competence comes from God. He has made us competent as ministers of a new covenant—not of the letter but of the Spirit; for the letter kills, but the Spirit gives life." - II Cor.2:3-11
Now if the ministry that brought death, which was engraved in letters on stone, came with glory, so that the Israelite's could not look steadily at the face of Moses because of its glory, transitory though it was, will not the ministry of the Spirit be even more glorious? If the ministry that brought condemnation was glorious, how much more glorious is the ministry that brings righteousness! For what was glorious has no glory now in comparison with the surpassing glory. And if what was transitory came with glory, how much greater is the glory of that which lasts!

not of the letter = The written code, the law of Moses

The ministry that brought death, which was engraved in letters on stone = Law of Moses

Paul is speaking about the difference between the written code (law of Moses) vs. the covenant of the Spirit which is salvation by grace through faith and being led by the Spirit, opposed to the letter of the law written on stone tablets, the law of Moses.

It is by attempting to be saved by the observance the written code, the law Moses, which kills. Anyone attempting to be saved by observing the Law Moses will not inherit the kingdom of God.

 

[p_rehbein]

Ephesians 1:3) Blessed [be] the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who hath blessed us with all spiritual blessings in heavenly [places] in Christ: 4) According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love: 5) Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will, 6) To the praise of the glory of his grace, wherein he hath made us accepted in the beloved. 7) In whom we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of his grace; 8) Wherein he hath abounded toward us in all wisdom and prudence; 9) Having made known unto us the mystery of his will, according to his good pleasure which he hath purposed in himself: 1)0 That in the dispensation of the fulness of times he might gather together in one all things in Christ, both which are in heaven, and which are on earth; [even] in him:

Hope this fits in...... it touches me

 

[JaumeJ]

I know by 28 years of not understanding, or, even being able to read the Bible that it cannot be understood fully or even in part for that matter without the infilling (of knowledge) by the Holy Spirit.

The same day the Holy Spirit entered into me, I was given to pick up an open book in a coffee house on campus and I could not put it down to see what it was. It was all true and understood in the spirit. Finally I looked and I was reading Isaiah in the Oxford Study Bible.........the following day I obtained my own from the Illini student store.

I do not understand out of context, I understand only by the Holy Spirit. I know the difference because like all who know nad love Jesuis Christ, Yeshua, the assurance comes with the understanding from God.

NO! I do not pretend to know the entire Word, but what I do know I have been assured of by God, Himself, and I believe all who know Jesus, Yeshua, are the same, though they may not yet be aware of this, but this is how all understand.

No mere flesh is going to rip the truth out of the Bible. Our Father has built in His own divine safegurdss......I believe.....amen

 

[JaumeJ]

This is beautiful for all to receive, sorry, the system does not allow you to have more at present......All blessings in Jesus Christ, amen

Ephesians 1:3) Blessed [be] the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who hath blessed us with all spiritual blessings in heavenly [places] in Christ: 4) According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love: 5) Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will, 6) To the praise of the glory of his grace, wherein he hath made us accepted in the beloved. 7) In whom we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of his grace; 8) Wherein he hath abounded toward us in all wisdom and prudence; 9) Having made known unto us the mystery of his will, according to his good pleasure which he hath purposed in himself: 1)0 That in the dispensation of the fulness of times he might gather together in one all things in Christ, both which are in heaven, and which are on earth; [even] in him:

Hope this fits in...... it touches me

 

[mailmandan]

Again, faith without works is not faith.

Works is a result of faith and the indwelling of the Spirit, not a requirement for salvation

Amen! James is discussing the proof/evidence of faith (says-claims to have faith but has no works/I will show you my faith by my works - James 2:14-18), not the initial act of being accounted as righteous with God (Romans 4:2-3).

James is simply saying faith that is not accompanied by evidential works is dead. If someone says-claims he has faith but lacks resulting evidential works, (James 2:14) then he has an empty profession of faith/dead faith and not authentic faith.

 

[pottersclay]

You can say this a thousand times in the largest font possible, and they will STILL not hear you....... If they see anything that even resembles works.......that will be all they see......brain freeze sets I suppose.

just saying

Is a labor of love considered work or a act of grace and obedience??? I think Jesus was challenged with this.

 

[JaumeJ]

Pe 2:12 having your behavior seemly among the Gentiles; that, wherein they speak against you as evil-doers, they may by your good works, which they behold, glorify God in the day of visitation.




Just some mentions of how we are to demonstrate our repentence in good works


Act 26:20 but declared both to them of Damascus first and at Jerusalem, and throughout all the country of Judaea, and also to the Gentiles, that they should repent and turn to God, doing works worthy of repentance




Joh 6:28 They said therefore unto him, What must we do, that we may work the works of God?
Joh 6:29 Jesus answered and said unto them, This is the work of God, that ye believe on him whom he hath sent.

 

[Stunnedbygrace]

I read this good thread again. I think I could have explained myself better. Its hard for me to type with one finger on my kindle when my computer battery has run down and so I don't explain myself as fully.

The part of Jaumes post I was really thinking on and trying to comment on was where he says he's afraid if you find our Lords commands burdensome then he wonders if you are really in Christ.

I think what I was trying to convey is that I had received the Holy Spirit but then began to try, out of love and gratitude, to be very good. It wasn't that I wasn't really in Christ- I was and I knew it - but His commands were very burdensome for me and I could not stop having anger and I could not truly and fully forgive.when I sort of gave up trying and saw that I wasn't good but He was, I then asked for what I lacked instead of trying to be good when I wasn't.

That's when His commands began to become a delight to me and not a burden. My point, which I failed to properly convey well, was that I was in Christ at that time, even though I was finding His commands burdensome when I was relying on my own self to obey them rather than admitting my poverty and asking for what I lacked.

Maybe I have not done any better of a job...

 

[JaumeJ]

This is directed only to those people who every time good works from faith are mentioned run to the law and counter, which is not a counter, that works of the law will not save you. You are correct, but you really must learn the difference between good works and works of the law.

After you have learned this, learn that the law is not dead or abolished, it is completed or fulfilled.

When a story is completed or fulfilled, it has not been abolished, it is simply over. If the story is true, it will always be true. So it is with the law, yes, the law.

Jesus Christ has fulfilled the law, and He has completed it, but those that remain, and He teaches by word and deed which they are, are still to be obeyed........since you all wish to continually make references to this type of what you call work.-

It is not work to obey God but may here in these forums have come in and prverted obedience into works of the law.......I suppose obeying God would be work for this type of understanding, bit it is a joy for His chidren.

It was brought up earlier and this was given me to explain since although it is not this subject of this thread, my own thread.

Pe 2:12 having your behavior seemly among the Gentiles; that, wherein they speak against you as evil-doers, they may by your good works, which they behold, glorify God in the day of visitation.




Just some mentions of how we are to demonstrate our repentence in good works


Act 26:20 but declared both to them of Damascus first and at Jerusalem, and throughout all the country of Judaea, and also to the Gentiles, that they should repent and turn to God, doing works worthy of repentance




Joh 6:28 They said therefore unto him, What must we do, that we may work the works of God?
Joh 6:29 Jesus answered and said unto them, This is the work of God, that ye believe on him whom he hath sent.

 

[Stunnedbygrace]

Yes, Jaume, I think I understand what you are saying.
I used to be one of those who always countered, as you say, in that exact way, but I have recently begun to stop this and move on from...elementary things, and want to talk about other things.

Obedience of trust is not works of the law. Obedience of trust is the good works He has prepared for us that we might do them.

When rebhein and I had a conversation elsewhere, we discussed our own failures (not other men's failures but our own failures) in obedience to the law not to murder.

Men have to face these struggles/trials where they try to obey the law in spirit and truth, in their inside, their heart, before they come to the obedience of trust. They have to come to the end of trying to obey the law to not murder by anger in their heart, by finding they fail in it, and begin learning the obedience of trust (faith) through these trials and testings of their trust. They cease from their hard labors and begin the rest of the obedience of trust.

None of it is wasted time. Just as our Lord learned this obedience of trust by the things He suffered, so do we. He always spoke of how He could do nothing on His own. We have to learn that too. But it opens up to a broad and restful place of: but with God, all things are possible.

 

[tourist]

Good thoughts in the OP........

I agree, very good thoughts.

 

[Lewiz]

The written code kills that is to say, scripture without the Holy Spirit to teach is
quite lethal. The Bible without the guidance of the Holy Spirit is death.

It is seen posted in the forums every day.




I ask those who post murdrous Scripture that is, Scripture without understanding of the Holy Spirit to cease this pratice
and pray before posting. Yes, Scripture is good and life-giving in Christ when shared in Spirit and truth,however without
understanding it can only amount to a lie and self promotion.

Pleas do not use misunderstood scriptures to fight two sides of battles........this is not of
the HOY SPIRIT.

May God bless all who are in Jesus Christ and all who will be, amen.

I think I see what you're trying to say, although calling scripture 'code' seems to be meaningless.

Like a gun, the scriptures are only dangerous in the hands of those abusing it.

The Word is pure & unadulterated. Those that use it illegally are the killers. False teachers use scriptures to their advantage to deceive the flock. A false teacher will receive his reward no matter how christianeze he sounds.

Dare I say that using the scripture without the Spirit's leading is criminal? Without the Spirit, the Word cannot be spiritually discerned.

I would advise, dear brother, to be more accurate in your statements or else members will post from all directions but the one you intended.

 

[JaumeJ]

2Co 3:6 who also made us sufficient as ministers of a new covenant; not of the letter, but of the spirit: for the letter killeth, but the spirit giveth life.

The refernce is to Scripture, but I quoted a different version of the Word. It means a lot more to some and less to others, and this is how we get down to our favorite version. Again though, it is the Holy Spirit that brings it to life. You knew that though. Blessings in Jesus Christ always..

I think I see what you're trying to say, although calling scripture 'code' seems to be meaningless.

Like a gun, the scriptures are only dangerous in the hands of those abusing it.

The Word is pure & unadulterated. Those that use it illegally are the killers. False teachers use scriptures to their advantage to deceive the flock. A false teacher will receive his reward no matter how christianeze he sounds.

Dare I say that using the scripture without the Spirit's leading is criminal? Without the Spirit, the Word cannot be spiritually discerned.

I would advise, dear brother, to be more accurate in your statements or else members will post from all directions but the one you intended.