Healing through the Son

[Deade]

>>garee quoted<<No promises for physical healings. If they have sinned they will be forgiven.

Well garee, the scripture here says it is the same thing: Physical and spiritual healing.

Luke 5:20-24: "And when he saw their faith, he said, “Man, your sins are forgiven you.” And the scribes and the Pharisees began to question, saying, “Who is this who speaks blasphemies? Who can forgive sins but God alone?” When Jesus perceived their thoughts, he answered them, “Why do you question in your hearts? Which is easier, to say, ‘Your sins are forgiven you,’ or to say, ‘Rise and walk’? But that you may know that the Son of Man has authority on earth to forgive sins”—he said to the man who was paralyzed—“I say to you, rise, pick up your bed and go home.”"

The same is implied here.
Luke 8:48: "And he said to her, “Daughter, your faith has made you well; go in peace.”"

And this looks like it is for believers, today.
John 14:12: "Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me, the works that I do shall he do also; and greater works than these shall he do; because I go unto my Father."

 

[garee]

Well garee, the scripture here says it is the same thing: Physical and spiritual healing.

Luke 5:20-24: "And when he saw their faith, he said, “Man, your sins are forgiven you.” And the scribes and the Pharisees began to question, saying, “Who is this who speaks blasphemies? Who can forgive sins but God alone?” When Jesus perceived their thoughts, he answered them, “Why do you question in your hearts? Which is easier, to say, ‘Your sins are forgiven you,’ or to say, ‘Rise and walk’? But that you may know that the Son of Man has authority on earth to forgive sins”—he said to the man who was paralyzed—“I say to you, rise, pick up your bed and go home.”"

The same is implied here.
Luke 8:48: "And he said to her, “Daughter, your faith has made you well; go in peace.”"

And this looks like it is for believers, today.
John 14:12: "Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me, the works that I do shall he do also; and greater works than these shall he do; because I go unto my Father."

View attachment 180915

Hi ,I would offer the gospel was hid in those parables using healing.That kind of miraculous healing of the Bible is something that is not typicalfor today. They were used during the reformation to preach the gospel, inparables to help establish the new government.

The greater things are the preaching the gospel .Whenthe Son of man was here perhaps five hundred believed the gospel. When he leftwhen Peter preached the gospel 3000 entered the kingdom as the greater things.

There is no one walking around today performing those kind of miracles .In oneinstance a man was given the prescription to take a little wine for his ailments.

The greatest thing possible is a new creation. The bodiesof death we live in will die

It is not God's purpose to guarantee healing for us, or to necessarily provide healing for us. He does temporally heal all livingthings that are corrupted. All healing comes from God who heals indiscriminately.And ordinarily as a common grace

God does this because He is the Creator God,who cares for His universe. And if someone is ill, we have the privilege ofgoing to the Lord to beseech the Lord on behalf of this one that is ill. There isno guarantee that the request will not lead a person to his death bed.

 

[joaniemarie]

Not sure why the format on CC has changed. All the posts and letters are HUGE. Anyway., I'll try to post again. My spell check is not working either.



[TABLE="class: yiv5583564514templateContainer, width: 100%"]
[TR]
[TD][TABLE="class: yiv5583564514mcnTextBlock, width: 100%"]
[TR]
[TD="class: yiv5583564514mcnTextBlockInner"][TABLE="class: yiv5583564514mcnTextContentContainer, width: 100%, align: left"]
[TR]
[TD="class: yiv5583564514mcnTextContent, align: center"]…God has dealt to each one a measure of faith.
Romans 12:3[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]
[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]
[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD][TABLE="class: yiv5583564514mcnTextBlock, width: 100%"]
[TR]
[TD="class: yiv5583564514mcnTextBlockInner"][TABLE="class: yiv5583564514mcnTextContentContainer, width: 100%, align: left"]
[TR]
[TD="class: yiv5583564514mcnTextContent"][h=2]- APRIL 23 -
START USING YOUR MEASURE OF FAITH[/h][HR][/HR]
As children of God, we should never say, “I don’t have any faith.” To say this is to say that God is a liar because His Word already tells us that “God has dealt to each one a measure of faith”.

Why then does the faith of some seem to be stronger than others?

Well, faith is like muscles. We are all born with a measure of muscles. But some of us develop our muscles better than others. Bodybuilders, for example, exercise their muscles very regularly to make them grow bigger and stronger.

Likewise, your measure of faith grows when you feed and use it. Each time you hear or read God’s Word, you are feeding your faith. When you confess God’s Word and expect good things to happen to you, you are using it. And the more you use it, the
more your faith grows.

So use your faith. You could start with headaches, for example. When you have a headache, instead of always running straight for your painkillers, use your faith. Ask God for healing, and trust and thank Him for the healing.

Now, don’t get me wrong, there is nothing wrong with taking medicine. And if you have to go to the doctor, don’t feel condemned either. Just start using your faith at a level you are comfortable with. If you need to go to the doctor, then go in faith, praying, “Abba Father, I am going to the doctor. I am asking You in Jesus’ name to give the doctor wisdom to give me an accurate diagnosis. My trust is not in him but in You.”

And when you take your medicine, don’t just pop in the pills. In faith, say, “Lord, sanctify this medicine,” then take it. This is because some medicines have negative side effects. So when you ask God to sanctify it, He blesses that medicine. And what will be developing in you, growing bigger and possessing your body until it is too widespread, is divine health!

Beloved, you have been given a measure of faith. Start using it, believing that it is this measure of your faith that causes you to draw from the inexhaustible power of a faithful and loving God! Todays Devotional message from Destined to Reign.

I very much agree and say amen.

[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]
[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]
[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]

 

[joaniemarie]

Has anyone else experienced a change in the format here in the forums. It's almost impossible to get familiar again with this format.

 

[1ofthem]

No, but sometimes my computer will zoom up on its own for some reason making it hard for me to read it. I have to go to the top tool bar and zoom back down to 100%.

I don't know what type of format problems you are having though. Hopefully you can get them resolved.

 

[joaniemarie]

No, but sometimes my computer will zoom up on its own for some reason making it hard for me to read it. I have to go to the top tool bar and zoom back down to 100%.

I don't know what type of format problems you are having though. Hopefully you can get them resolved.

Thanks, it's really frustrating. No more spell check and this site has spanned across the screen into tiny little letters... HEEEELLLLLPPP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[1ofthem]

Thanks, it's really frustrating. No more spell check and this site has spanned across the screen into tiny little letters... HEEEELLLLLPPP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Sorry I don't know...I'm not high tech at all...lol

Hopefully someone here that is can help you resolve it, though.

 

[Angela53510]

Another question I had to consider is if a Christian has been taught to not expect Jesus to do as He says in the Bible., to not BE as He IS presented in the Bible.... how can we be confident and secure in Him?

Over and over, Joanie, you throw out this straw man. Maybe you were not taught about healing, in the beginning. But a lot of us were.

In fact, the first 15 years I was saved I ONLY went to Pentecostal/charismatic churches. Healing was 50% of what we were taught. The other 50% was speaking in tongues. Everyone wanted that “gift” because it was emphasized so much. But it was all babbling, except in one case where a man spoke 4 words in an unknown tongue (turned out it was Arminian) and he and his whole family (27 people) were saved. The words were “Jesus Christ is Lord.” That is really speaking in tongues!

I started reading Kenyon in 1984. Then Hagin and Copeland into the mid 1980s. But, I wasn’t sick, so it wasn’t an obsession. I was glad that everyone was healed, but it didn’t impact my life at that time. And I didn’t see the heresy of it all. That took a lot of years, studying Greek and finally death. Oh yes, and being told by people who left Pentecostalism and moved to full on Word Faith, by more than one person, that I wasn’t healed, because I didn’t have enough faith.

I fell off that bandwagon so quickly. But even then, I didn’t stop believing in healing, I just spent a long time in the desert, because of this heretical and evil doctrine.

So, stop with the straw man. First, I have not seen one person, (except maybe Zone, when she used to post) who does not believe in healing. Since everyone believes in healing, who has not heard about this? Who is being taught not to expect Jesus to do as he says, and since he is a lot more concerned about character than earthly healing, because character is what matters in eternity, when we will all be healed, you are in fact, limiting God.

In the end, this come back down to the faulty exegesis that healing is in the atonement. Healing is NOT guaranteed in the atonement.

Do you need me to flood this thread again with all I have researched and written, and why you are wrong about the what the atonement is all about? And at least is will be things I have written, and researched, instead of these half baked gurus that you constantly post, who are not theologians, don’t know the original languages, and certainly do not know the basics of hermeneutics or Bible interpretation.

And do remember, I learned about these things AFTER I came out of Pentecostalism and was healed from the damage your Word Faith/hypergrace teachings did to me, and everyone else I know. Word Faith and everyone being healed, from an evidence based viewpoint, is an utter failure, a total bust!

Don’t bother answering me with a repost for clarification. Clarification means, “to restate, to put it in a different way, to make it simpler or clearer.” I dare you to google it. If you want to repost, just say, “A repost.” Besides, no one reads your pamphlets anymore, I gave up on that a long, time ago, unless I feel in the mood to tear them apart because they are so wrong!

And no more with the “you are all mired in tradition.” Nope, not at all! I’ve changed radically in my traditions, from the shallow Pentecostal Days, the Bible has shown me such a deeper, more meaningful walk with Christ, through the Holy Spirit.

 

[7seasrekeyed]

if a Christian has been taught to not expect Jesus to do as He says in the Bible., to not BE as He IS presented in the Bible.... how can we be confident and secure in Him?

I really do not believe I just let this one go

what Christian in what church would be taught that Jesus, that is Jesus in what we refer to as 'the Bible' is not to be trusted?

perhaps if someone is taught to look to man as their 'god' as many Catholics are; we see the priest taking the place of our High Priest, Jesus Christ, and then hops, skips and jumps to the conclusion everyone had the same misfortune as far as indoctrination go, then, perhaps they may lean to that understanding

BUT what is actually objected to, is not Jesus as we learn of Him and from Him in scripture, but the ADDED teaching of men who have gone the other way and rather than minimizing Jesus, they have ADDED to scripture and are trying to make Him say what He never said and promise what He never promised

enter

'if a Christian has been taught to not expect Jesus to do as He says in the Bible'

as the continuing objection to any and all scripture that exposes the false teaching

again, not needing to refute the op as many have done so mulitple times in this and similar threads, but for anyone considering the false teaching, I point out that one person having a negative experience in church, does NOT create a doctrine of 'Christians suffering from not believing in Jesus'

actually if you believe in a 'different' Jesus, you may not be believing in Jesus as we see Him revealed in our Bibles

 

[7seasrekeyed]

And no more with the “you are all mired in tradition.

this is the mantra of those who choose to follow the 'itching ears' fellowship

 

[tourist]

Thanks, it's really frustrating. No more spell check and this site has spanned across the screen into tiny little letters... HEEEELLLLLPPP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Try turning the computer off and then reboot.

 

[joaniemarie]

Try turning the computer off and then reboot.

That might have done it tourist I don't know for sure but something got the format back. Thanks for the advice. I wish the spell check would come back as I am a terrible speller!!

 

[joaniemarie]

Angela and 7seas., since we don't agree about the subject of healing in the atonement and you both are obviously antagonistic to even discuss it with me I see no point in going back and forth about it. I believe in healing in the atonement and you don't that is just the way it is.

I think in cases like this we must agree to disagree and go on our separate ways on the subject here on cc. I see no good in this constant bickering. I'm not trying to convince either one of you and your experiences and posts will not convince me either.

I respect you both as Christian woman and although my beliefs about healing in the atonement are not the same as yours my respect for you and other believers here on cc does not change. I can only be myself here and that includes my sharing what I know and believe is from the Bible. Just as each of us does and should do. Therefore agreeing to disagree is most needed between us and should be practiced.

 

[BenFTW]

The site was having issues yesterday to where the site even went down (at least on my end). I also had a bunch of letters and links spread out on my screen. A site popped up and informed me that this URL was down and to check back later. Well, I came online today and no more issues.

 

[joaniemarie]

Sorry I don't know...I'm not high tech at all...lol

Hopefully someone here that is can help you resolve it, though.

I'm not a high tech person either. I just push keys and go to settings and try this and try that and turn on....turn off... and pray. The format is back so I'm a happy camper.

 

[joaniemarie]

The site was having issues yesterday to where the site even went down (at least on my end). I also had a bunch of letters and links spread out on my screen. A site popped up and informed me that this URL was down and to check back later. Well, I came online today and no more issues.

Thanks for telling me that. I surely thought it was my fooling around with the settings the other day. The format was just as you said and soo hard to read as it spanned across the whole screen some small some HUGE. I didn't see any message that said the URL was down. Thanks Ben!!

 

[Angela53510]

@Ben

I think there is good evidence to eat healthy. I was raised to eat from a garden, my mom cooked from scratch.I become an organic vegetarian at age 17. I have always grown my own veggies and locally I buy organic fruit. I have my own grain grinder, I buy organic wheat from Saskatchewan and grind it.

But, I still got RA. Because it is about genetics and who knows what else?

Then there was my grandfather. He smoked, drank hard liquor and a lot of fatty pork. It was cultural. Although there were always fresh fruit and veggies around. He died at 71 of congestive heart failure. So, was it partly what he ate. Or not?

Then my father, the son of the above mentioned grandfather. He was a professional athlete, got a PhD in Physical Education, in athletic injures. He was a university professor for 33 years, and that meant teaching and coaching everything from football and basketball to swimming and wrestling. Then he became a fanatical golfer. So, walking 5 or 6 miles daily. He was always in shape. He had always eaten well, never smoked, and only drank wine occasionally, socially. In his 70s, his heart started to have problems. He was hospitalized for the last time when he turned 82, and God also saved him then. He died 5 months later. I walked with him through that, and was there when he died.

So, his lifestyle was excellent. Because of that, many doctors hypothesized it was amyloidois, a genetic illness. So, my sister and I had his heart biopsied and it was 99% amyloid protein. He lasted a few years longer than my grandfather, but in the end, it still got him.

My mom is still alive at 88, with basically nothing wrong. She ate the same things, golfed beside him, never smoke, barely drank. She never claimed healing, but, having no genetic illnesses, she is still alive and healthy. She was also underweight the whole Great Depression, because they didn’t have enough money to buy food, although they lived on a “rock” farm.

Same circumstances, basically, yet my father has been gone for over 6 years, my mom is fine.

I will never say it is not good to eat healthy. I have a rule of thumb, that if it is advertised on TV, comes out of a box or package, or is processed, then I don’t eat it. I freeze lots of veggies, and pay extra for imported fruits and veggies in winter.

And yet, I am still sick. I have a gene that got turned on, was not dealt with properly because of stupid doctors, who didn’t diagnose me properly, or medicate me properly when diagnosed. So, I am ultra severe. Not a thing to do with what I eat, or the 90-100 km I put on my bike in a week, indoors and out for 13 years. And before RA, speed walking, dancing, swimming, mountain hiking and always working out.

I agree with 7seas! Ben - you need to stop dispensing medical advise, until you have finished your residency and maybe a fellowship, in nutrition and exercise physiology, ok?

 

[joaniemarie]

Amen to that. Each day we are faced with the "reality" of the world.... the flesh....the devil. The only way to survive the constant turmoil those 3 things will bring is by the new reality we are called to live by; our faith in Jesus love and His many provisions. And yes., it means those things will have no power over us when we walk by faith and not by sight. Rom.8:2

[SUP]2 [/SUP]For the law of the Spirit of life [which is] in Christ Jesus [the law of our new being] has freed me from the law of sin and of death.


Even if I don't see the end of a problem today., Even if I'm feeling frustrated or even defeated., I must keep believing in the promise that Jesus loves me and will lead me as I follow. How to follow? The Holy Spirit is there to show us how to do this each day. We walk through the valley here and make it to the other side here. Faith is the victory.

Problems come but there is relief and victory to be found IN Jesus. If I become weary in well doing that is ok to a point because we humans will get weary but we can't stay there. And He gives strength in our weakness. He gives rest to the weary. He gives the gift of no condemnation as we are walking the ups and downs of life. He is with us. We must remember to NOT forget no matter what our flesh says or feels. And He brings us out to the other side.

And it's of major importance for us believers to keep pointing one another to Jesus as we go through the process of maturing.


A Psalm of David.

[SUP]1 [/SUP]The Lord is my Shepherd [to feed, guide, and shield me], I shall not lack.
[SUP]
2 [/SUP]He makes me lie down in [fresh, tender] green pastures; He leads me beside the still and restful waters.
[SUP]
3 [/SUP]He refreshes and restores my life (my self); He leads me in the paths of righteousness [uprightness and right standing with Him—not for my earning it, but] for His name’s sake.
[SUP]
4 [/SUP]Yes, though I walk through the [deep, sunless] valley of the shadow of death, I will fear or dread no evil, for You are with me; Your rod [to protect] and Your staff [to guide], they comfort me.
[SUP]
5 [/SUP]You prepare a table before me in the presence of my enemies. You anoint my head with [SUP][a][/SUP]oil; my [brimming] cup runs over.
[SUP]
6 [/SUP]Surely or only goodness, mercy, and unfailing love shall follow me all the days of my life, and through the length of my days
the house of the Lord [and His presence] shall be my dwelling place.
Footnotes:

1. Psalm 23:5 It is difficult for those living in a temperate climate to appreciate, but it was customary in hot climates to anoint the body with oil to protect it from excessive perspiration. When mixed with perfume, the oil imparted a delightfully refreshing and invigorating sensation. Athletes anointed their bodies as a matter of course before running a race. As the body, therefore, anointed with oil was refreshed, invigorated, and better fitted for action, so the Lord would anoint His “sheep” with the Holy Spirit, Whom oil symbolizes, to fit them to engage more freely in His service and run in the way He directs—in heavenly fellowship with Him.

This is an encouragement for me to read and post again.

 

[BenFTW]

@Ben

I think there is good evidence to eat healthy. I was raised to eat from a garden, my mom cooked from scratch.I become an organic vegetarian at age 17. I have always grown my own veggies and locally I buy organic fruit. I have my own grain grinder, I buy organic wheat from Saskatchewan and grind it.

But, I still got RA. Because it is about genetics and who knows what else?

Then there was my grandfather. He smoked, drank hard liquor and a lot of fatty pork. It was cultural. Although there were always fresh fruit and veggies around. He died at 71 of congestive heart failure. So, was it partly what he ate. Or not?

Then my father, the son of the above mentioned grandfather. He was a professional athlete, got a PhD in Physical Education, in athletic injures. He was a university professor for 33 years, and that meant teaching and coaching everything from football and basketball to swimming and wrestling. Then he became a fanatical golfer. So, walking 5 or 6 miles daily. He was always in shape. He had always eaten well, never smoked, and only drank wine occasionally, socially. In his 70s, his heart started to have problems. He was hospitalized for the last time when he turned 82, and God also saved him then. He died 5 months later. I walked with him through that, and was there when he died.

So, his lifestyle was excellent. Because of that, many doctors hypothesized it was amyloidois, a genetic illness. So, my sister and I had his heart biopsied and it was 99% amyloid protein. He lasted a few years longer than my grandfather, but in the end, it still got him.

My mom is still alive at 88, with basically nothing wrong. She ate the same things, golfed beside him, never smoke, barely drank. She never claimed healing, but, having no genetic illnesses, she is still alive and healthy. She was also underweight the whole Great Depression, because they didn’t have enough money to buy food, although they lived on a “rock” farm.

Same circumstances, basically, yet my father has been gone for over 6 years, my mom is fine.

I will never say it is not good to eat healthy. I have a rule of thumb, that if it is advertised on TV, comes out of a box or package, or is processed, then I don’t eat it. I freeze lots of veggies, and pay extra for imported fruits and veggies in winter.

And yet, I am still sick. I have a gene that got turned on, was not dealt with properly because of stupid doctors, who didn’t diagnose me properly, or medicate me properly when diagnosed. So, I am ultra severe. Not a thing to do with what I eat, or the 90-100 km I put on my bike in a week, indoors and out for 13 years. And before RA, speed walking, dancing, swimming, mountain hiking and always working out.

I agree with 7seas! Ben - you need to stop dispensing medical advise, until you have finished your residency and maybe a fellowship, in nutrition and exercise physiology, ok?

No surprise there. As for dispensing medical advice, a suggestion of eating healthier and making a correlation between diet and health is sound. Its common sense. For the record, people have reversed the symptoms of auto-immune diseases, and have shown no sign of the issue afterwards, having made a change in dietary consumption (such as eliminating lectins).

Look up Dr. Gundry MD.

I swear you people attack everything I say.

 

[joaniemarie]

Ben has every right to give his opinion about healthy eating. He has made no claim to being a doctor nor does he have to be a doctor to give his opinion here on healthy eating habits. We all have equal footing here on these forums and we each can give our opinions freely as long as they are not anti Christ and certainly I have not seen that here at all.

Ben., by all means give your opinions and share your views on healthy eating as well as Bible understanding. Your opinions and views are just as valuable as anyones. If it is not welcome on someone else's thread, it is most welcome on mine. I will take your advice or leave it as I hope you will do the same with mine. Keep up the good words and good posts.