Truth you never heard...

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Oct 14, 2017
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#1
1. God does not punish anyone for the sins of another.

This means any church that preaches all are born with "the sin of Adam" upon them, is preaching a falsehood... because sin seperate us from God... and that "inherited" separation is a type of punishment.

2. God doesn't punish the innocent.

The things you do without knowledge of right and wrong are done in innocence. So, when Adam and Eve bit the apple from "the tree of knowledge of good and evil"... they didn't yet know what good or evil was. Thos means they bit the apple in innocense. Something God does not punish.

3. Being forced to leave the garden was not a punishment... it was a blessing.

God created us that we might find joy... and all things must come in opposition or joy cannot be found: if you've never known hunger you can't be grateful or appreciate food; if you've never known cold you won't find joy in warmth; if every sunset is the same... "ho hum... the sun is going down."

Being forced out of the garden was actually God saying, "I want you to find joy. I want you to appreciate the fruits of your own labor, and the blessing if filling a grumbling stomach. I want you to know the joys of both of you leaving one to another on cold nights to find warmth. I want you to feel the sun of your face after a hard rain so you can appreciate the better times. I want you to know a a beautiful sunset from any other... SO.. you can't stay here in the garden... because no joy can be known without also knowing suffering."

4. God does not set people up for failure.

This means, when God told Adam and Eve to multiply and replenish the earth... He also wanted them to teach their children up in the ways of righteousness... and warn them of evil. This means Adam and Eve need to have the knowledge of good and evil in order to be successful parents... and it was actually in Eve's wisdom that she realized this.

And because God doesn't set us up for failure... He didn't allow us to follow Adam and Eve into this world until they gained the knowledge they needed. ... if they didn't eat that apple.. we'd still be waiting for them to bite it.

5. Jesus is the way, the truth, and the life.

He is the way back to Heavenly Father (no one may come before the Father except through Jesus Christ)... and Jesus is 100% of the truth... and He is life eternal.

We also no that if any should deny Jesus... He will deny them before the Father.

So... if you deny these truths... even if they only make up 1% of the entire truth of Jesus... then He will deny you to that same extent... because denying truth means denying Jesus.

This also means that if tou attend a church that refutes these simple truths... that church is not of God. -- there may be much good in that church... but it is teaching up to one day be denied 1% of the way back to Heavenly Father... and that means that Satan loves the church you go to.

There's only one church that teaches these truths... look for it... and rely only on the Holy Ghost for your guidance to it.

That church will always be demonized by others... but do you have faith to enter it... accept it... and desire enough to be part of it?

There are so many more truths to uncover... but for now these should suffice. And if it be wisdom in God that you should read these things... having a pure and sincere intent to know the truth...and asking God... having faith in Jesus Christ... the truth of these things will be made manifest unto you.

I say these things in the name of Jesus Christ.. amen.
 
D

Depleted

Guest
#2
Jason? Are you old Jason who used to be on here or a new Jason?

Either way, what you wrote has no authority and is NOT "through the name of Jesus."
 
Oct 14, 2017
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#3
Just ponder and pray about it. That's my best advice.
 

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
24,167
12,763
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#4
5. Jesus is the way, the truth, and the life.

He is the way back to Heavenly Father (no one may come before the Father except through Jesus Christ)... and Jesus is 100% of the truth... and He is life eternal.
This is the only truth which you have presented, and it is not a new truth. The rest of your post is spiritual nonsense. So this church which you are promoting is teaching heresy in spite of recognizing that Jesus is the Way, the Truth, and the Life. Sad.
 

NotmebutHim

Senior Member
May 17, 2015
2,916
1,588
113
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#5
Don't know if this passage is totally appropriate for this thread, but I was prompted to post it:

3 What advantage then has the Jew, or what is the profit of circumcision? [SUP]2 [/SUP]Much in every way! Chiefly because to them were committed the oracles of God. [SUP]3 [/SUP]For what if some did not believe? Will their unbelief make the faithfulness of God without effect? [SUP]4 [/SUP]Certainly not! Indeed, let God be true but every man a liar. As it is written:
“That You may be justified in Your words,
And may overcome when You are judged.”[SUP][a][/SUP]

[SUP]5 [/SUP]But if our unrighteousness demonstrates the righteousness of God, what shall we say? Is God unjust who inflicts wrath? (I speak as a man.) [SUP]6 [/SUP]Certainly not! For then how will God judge the world?
[SUP]7 [/SUP]For if the truth of God has increased through my lie to His glory, why am I also still judged as a sinner? [SUP]8 [/SUP]And why not say, “Let us do evil that good may come”?—as we are slanderously reported and as some affirm that we say. Their condemnation is just.
[h=3]All Have Sinned[/h][SUP]9 [/SUP]What then? Are we better than they? Not at all. For we have previously charged both Jews and Greeks that they are all under sin.
[SUP]10 [/SUP]As it is written:
“There is none righteous, no, not one;
[SUP]11 [/SUP]There is none who understands;
There is none who seeks after God.
[SUP]12 [/SUP]They have all turned aside;
They have together become unprofitable;
There is none who does good, no, not one.”[SUP][b][/SUP]
[SUP]13 [/SUP]“Their throat is an open tomb;
With their tongues they have practiced deceit”; [SUP][c][/SUP]
“The poison of asps is under their lips”; [SUP][d][/SUP]
[SUP]14 [/SUP]“Whose mouth is full of cursing and bitterness.”[SUP][e][/SUP]
[SUP]15 [/SUP]“Their feet are swift to shed blood;
[SUP]16 [/SUP]Destruction and misery are in their ways;
[SUP]17 [/SUP]And the way of peace they have not known.”[SUP][f][/SUP]
[SUP]18 [/SUP]“There is no fear of God before their eyes.”[SUP][g][/SUP]

[SUP]19 [/SUP]Now we know that whatever the law says, it says to those who are under the law, that every mouth may be stopped, and all the world may become guilty before God. [SUP]20 [/SUP]Therefore by the deeds of the law no flesh will be justified in His sight, for by the law is the knowledge of sin.
[h=3]God’s Righteousness Through Faith[/h][SUP]21 [/SUP]But now the righteousness of God apart from the law is revealed, being witnessed by the Law and the Prophets, [SUP]22 [/SUP]even the righteousness of God, through faith in Jesus Christ, to all and on all[SUP][h][/SUP] who believe. For there is no difference; [SUP]23 [/SUP]for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, [SUP]24 [/SUP]being justified freely by His grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus, [SUP]25 [/SUP]whom God set forth as a propitiation by His blood, through faith, to demonstrate His righteousness, because in His forbearance God had passed over the sins that were previously committed, [SUP]26 [/SUP]to demonstrate at the present time His righteousness, that He might be just and the justifier of the one who has faith in Jesus.
[h=3]Boasting Excluded[/h][SUP]27 [/SUP]Where is boasting then? It is excluded. By what law? Of works? No, but by the law of faith. [SUP]28 [/SUP]Therefore we conclude that a man is justified by faith apart from the deeds of the law. [SUP]29 [/SUP]Or is He the God of the Jews only? Is He not also the God of the Gentiles? Yes, of the Gentiles also, [SUP]30 [/SUP]since there is one God who will justify the circumcised by faith and the uncircumcised through faith. [SUP]31 [/SUP]Do we then make void the law through faith? Certainly not! On the contrary, we establish the law.

Romans 3 NKJV
 
Oct 14, 2017
67
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#6
...and His truth entered the world... but most of them knew it not... for they did not know the character of their Heavenly Father... and leaned upon the understanding they were taught...

Does God really punish us today for what Adam and Eve did?

Is He that vindictive?

I only shared these truths because to share truth is to love... and I'm trying to get better at it.

I hope we aren't arguing... just discussing.
 

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
24,167
12,763
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#7
Does God really punish us today for what Adam and Eve did?
Where did you get this absurd notion? Adam's disobedience affected the whole human race, but no one is punished for the sins of Adam and Eve.

Because of Adam, all human beings are born tainted with the sin nature of Adam -- separated from God and subject to death (the first and second deaths). But they also sin by choice.

Study Romans chapter 5 very carefully, and also 1 Corinthians 15.
 
D

Depleted

Guest
#8
Just ponder and pray about it. That's my best advice.
Not much to ponder, once I see the first lie. Your second point. And then I saw your second lie. Third point.

I don't spend a lot of time pondering lie.
 
Oct 14, 2017
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#9
Those who read with a heart aimed at finding truth are who this post was for... but all of your replies are appreciated.
 

Dino246

Senior Member
Jun 30, 2015
24,555
13,320
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#10
Jason, I see grains of truth in what you shared... but I would suggest that you have a lot more study to do and it would be good not to jump to conclusions as you seem to have done.

For example... the removal of Adam and Eve from the Garden was not a "blessing"; it was to prevent them taking hold of the fruit of the tree of life in their fallen state. That's it, that's all. Read the latter part of Genesis 3.
 
D

Depleted

Guest
#11
Those who read with a heart aimed at finding truth are who this post was for... but all of your replies are appreciated.
You are old Jason! I thought so.

And my heart is doing all right at the moment. When someone tells me Adam and Eve were innocent, and that God did not give that curse, but a blessing, my heart's doing all right. So is my brain. Because both of those statements are the opposite from what the Bible truly says, so not really a heart issue. More of a common sense issue.

If I told you the sun is made of snow, would you believe me? And, if you did would it be because "your heart is aimed at finding truth?" Or if you didn't is it because your heart is aimed at finding truth? Neither? Well, all right then, because it's just common sense I lied.
 

CS1

Well-known member
May 23, 2012
12,170
4,000
113
#12
...and His truth entered the world... but most of them knew it not... for they did not know the character of their Heavenly Father... and leaned upon the understanding they were taught...

Does God really punish us today for what Adam and Eve did?

Is He that vindictive?

I only shared these truths because to share truth is to love... and I'm trying to get better at it.

I hope we aren't arguing... just discussing.
we die because of the sin of adam ,

but we also have trangressed Gods law. all have sinned and failed. all have .
 
Mar 8, 2018
100
6
18
#13
1. God does not punish anyone for the sins of another.

This means any church that preaches all are born with "the sin of Adam" upon them, is preaching a falsehood... because sin seperate us from God... and that "inherited" separation is a type of punishment.

2. God doesn't punish the innocent.

The things you do without knowledge of right and wrong are done in innocence. So, when Adam and Eve bit the apple from "the tree of knowledge of good and evil"... they didn't yet know what good or evil was. Thos means they bit the apple in innocense. Something God does not punish.

3. Being forced to leave the garden was not a punishment... it was a blessing.

God created us that we might find joy... and all things must come in opposition or joy cannot be found: if you've never known hunger you can't be grateful or appreciate food; if you've never known cold you won't find joy in warmth; if every sunset is the same... "ho hum... the sun is going down."

Being forced out of the garden was actually God saying, "I want you to find joy. I want you to appreciate the fruits of your own labor, and the blessing if filling a grumbling stomach. I want you to know the joys of both of you leaving one to another on cold nights to find warmth. I want you to feel the sun of your face after a hard rain so you can appreciate the better times. I want you to know a a beautiful sunset from any other... SO.. you can't stay here in the garden... because no joy can be known without also knowing suffering."

4. God does not set people up for failure.

This means, when God told Adam and Eve to multiply and replenish the earth... He also wanted them to teach their children up in the ways of righteousness... and warn them of evil. This means Adam and Eve need to have the knowledge of good and evil in order to be successful parents... and it was actually in Eve's wisdom that she realized this.

And because God doesn't set us up for failure... He didn't allow us to follow Adam and Eve into this world until they gained the knowledge they needed. ... if they didn't eat that apple.. we'd still be waiting for them to bite it.

5. Jesus is the way, the truth, and the life.

He is the way back to Heavenly Father (no one may come before the Father except through Jesus Christ)... and Jesus is 100% of the truth... and He is life eternal.

We also no that if any should deny Jesus... He will deny them before the Father.

So... if you deny these truths... even if they only make up 1% of the entire truth of Jesus... then He will deny you to that same extent... because denying truth means denying Jesus.

This also means that if tou attend a church that refutes these simple truths... that church is not of God. -- there may be much good in that church... but it is teaching up to one day be denied 1% of the way back to Heavenly Father... and that means that Satan loves the church you go to.

There's only one church that teaches these truths... look for it... and rely only on the Holy Ghost for your guidance to it.

That church will always be demonized by others... but do you have faith to enter it... accept it... and desire enough to be part of it?

There are so many more truths to uncover... but for now these should suffice. And if it be wisdom in God that you should read these things... having a pure and sincere intent to know the truth...and asking God... having faith in Jesus Christ... the truth of these things will be made manifest unto you.

I say these things in the name of Jesus Christ.. amen.
Do you consider consequences to be the same as punishment??
 

jb

Senior Member
Feb 27, 2010
4,940
586
113
#14
we die because of the sin of adam ,
If you are referring to spiritual death, Ezekiel chapter 18 (with Isaiah 53v6) would not agree with you on that point! It categorically states that every person dies spiritually for their OWN sin. Every human has "gone astray" and are not "born astray," which agrees with Rom 3v23.

And physical death entered upon mankind because of the withdrawl of the tree of life. Gen 3v22-24, Rev 22v2.
 
Oct 14, 2017
67
2
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#15
I consider being seperate from God a bad thing... something I would not choose... and for the actions of someone else? ... anyone that ponders the character of God can know that He would not punish us for the actions of others.

Sin is a choice... not an inherited trait.

When we know good from evil and then choose evil... that is a sin.

This means that children that don't yet know good and evil are innocent (without sin) and only become sinful after being corrupted by the world.
 

Dino246

Senior Member
Jun 30, 2015
24,555
13,320
113
#17
This means that children that don't yet know good and evil are innocent (without sin) and only become sinful after being corrupted by the world.
If this is true, why did Jesus have to be born of a virgin?

Don't confuse the sin nature (which we all have, having inherited it from Adam) with culpability for sin (which we don't all have).
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
36,530
13,094
113
#18
nut's i've heard all of 1-5 before.

thread title threw me
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
36,530
13,094
113
#19
Does God really punish us today for what Adam and Eve did?

if you truly believe removing them from the garden was a blessing, what are you calling "
punishment" ?

:rolleyes:
 
Oct 14, 2017
67
2
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#20
Jesus wasn't born of a virgin to avoid inheriting sin. If inheriting sin from your parents were possible.. do you think Mary (Jesus' blood mother) was without sin? .. no.. she wasn't. And.. wasn't it Eve that people believed sinned first? Jesus was born of a virgin to fulfil prophecy... just like much of what He did was to fulfil prophecy. The better question to find the answer to is "how" was Jesus born of a virgin.