Does God exist outside of time?
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This is not a critique on Ben's post, this is just a furtherance of the discussion.
Eternality
Difference between Infinite and Eternal
We need to distinguish between the words "infinite" and "eternal."
They don't mean the same thing.
To be infinite means to be made of separate and distinct parts, the number of which have no end.... like infinite days.
To be eternal simple means to have "always been".
These are entirely different things.
In common usage, we throw these terms around pretty loosely, and that's perfectly ok.
But for use in theology and philosophy, we need to use more precise definitions of terms.
God's relationship to time could logically take two different possible forms:
There seem to be 2 different ways that a being could be "eternal."
1. God could exist infinitely in time... meaning actual moments in time which stretch into the infinite past.
2. God could exist "timelessly"... meaning he exists without time
When the Bible says God is eternal, it doesn't explicitly tell us which of these possibilities it might be referring to.
God did however give us minds, and our minds our endowed by God with the ability to sort though logical problems, and sometimes we can find a solution to how the more vague Biblical propositions must work themselves out.
One way these 2 relationships to time might interact:
Some Christian philosophers believe that God existed "without time" in eternity past, and when he created the universe he then "entered into time" with the creation he made.
We can parse this out if needed, but I personally think this is the most logical explanation.
I also think we have Biblical evidence for this.
This is what makes the most sense to me, but it's also fine if we disagree.
No one is losing their salvation over this incredibly vast and endless topic.
: )
Christians don't have to agree on this issue of "how" exactly God goes about being eternal:
As Christians, we DO need to believe in God's eternality; this is one of God's essential attributes.
But we DO NOT have to agree on "how" exactly an eternal being relates to time.
This topic does have some consequences in a few areas of apologetics.
It also may affect a few doctrinal areas here and there, but not a lot.
For the most part, in most areas of doctrine, the matter of "how" exactly our eternal God relates to time... well, it's fascinating but it isn't a critical issue.
M
This is just me speculating, I might be wrong. 
Ive read a few things which suggests anything which has energy or mass as we
know it, can only exist inside of time.
However concepts/thoughts, maths for example could exist outside of time
because they have no energy or mass.
In the beginning was the word / by Him was everything made.
God spoke everything as we know it into existence, words have no energy/mass etc
Jesus in His resurrected body could be in two places at once, He could enter a
locked room, He could eat, He could ascend into heaven. He was not bound by space,
time, mass as we know it. He was outside of time, but subjected Himself to our
time laws.
There is something else that transcends the laws of time, mass, energy. We just
don’t know what it is, we can’t comprehend it.
We can’t even comprehend why jelly fish don’t get crushed at pressures that would
kill us.
Or how someone can get a bang on the head and start talking in a foreign language.
Or how worms can live in volcanic steam vents under the sea and not get burnt.
There is loads we dont know, we like to think we do, but we don’t.
We are like goldfish in a bowl contemplating if there is life beyond the glass.
Im glad God does know it all.
Ive read a few things which suggests anything which has energy or mass as we
know it, can only exist inside of time.
However concepts/thoughts, maths for example could exist outside of time
because they have no energy or mass.
In the beginning was the word / by Him was everything made.
God spoke everything as we know it into existence, words have no energy/mass etc
Jesus in His resurrected body could be in two places at once, He could enter a
locked room, He could eat, He could ascend into heaven. He was not bound by space,
time, mass as we know it. He was outside of time, but subjected Himself to our
time laws.
There is something else that transcends the laws of time, mass, energy. We just
don’t know what it is, we can’t comprehend it.
We can’t even comprehend why jelly fish don’t get crushed at pressures that would
kill us.
Or how someone can get a bang on the head and start talking in a foreign language.
Or how worms can live in volcanic steam vents under the sea and not get burnt.
There is loads we dont know, we like to think we do, but we don’t.
We are like goldfish in a bowl contemplating if there is life beyond the glass.
Im glad God does know it all.
God + Time=Infinite
We humans operate in time different to God we live in a way by constantly checking the time,days and seasons...While God time clock is different, spiritually it is still synced with Us. As we draw closer to God we must learn to have patience. You ever always hear people say that they are sick and tired of waiting ...while God has already set everything in place for them ...time in itself can be fleshly if you just see it as a basis for just navigating through life... but their is a spiritual compass and a spiritual time clock which operates differently from the time as we see it. God time is never ending but constantly evolving ...like expanding just like the galaxy and as the many stars of the universe...even the universe itself is infinite.
We humans operate in time different to God we live in a way by constantly checking the time,days and seasons...While God time clock is different, spiritually it is still synced with Us. As we draw closer to God we must learn to have patience. You ever always hear people say that they are sick and tired of waiting ...while God has already set everything in place for them ...time in itself can be fleshly if you just see it as a basis for just navigating through life... but their is a spiritual compass and a spiritual time clock which operates differently from the time as we see it. God time is never ending but constantly evolving ...like expanding just like the galaxy and as the many stars of the universe...even the universe itself is infinite
.I would think eternal God is not subject to temporal time, as to the things of a corrupted creation. I believed He created time and will put an end to it. This is when it would seem on day four he switched the source of light from his own glory to a temporal fading glory, dying called under the Sun. The Sun and moon will be under our feet represent the new heavens and earth. The new heavens and earth will be lit by the glory of God as it was in the beginning three days
And I saw no temple therein: for the Lord God Almighty and the Lamb are the temple of it.And the city had no need of the sun, neither of the moon, to shine in it: for the glory of God did lighten it, and the Lamb is the light thereof Revelation 21
The phrase under the Sun used many times represents the temporal time period that we who walk by faith not subject to time it is used to describe the chaste virgin bride, the church clothed in the righteousness of Christ in Revelation 12.
Revelation 12:1And there appeared a great wonder in heaven; a woman clothed with thesun, and the moon under her feet, and upon her head a crown of twelve stars:
2Corinthians 4 in that way help us to interpret parables in which the gospel is hid from natural man who walks by sight after the temporal things of this world
But if our gospel be hid, it is hid to them that are lost:In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them.2 Corinthians 4:3-4.
We mix faith the unseen in what we hear and see hid in those parables to give us the unseen eternal understanding.
While we look not at the things which are seen, but at the things which are not seen: for the things which are seen are temporal; but the things which are not seen are eternal.2 Corinthians 4:18
No. The universe is separate from God because it is Gods creation.. The universe is not perfect, this universe is not eternal.. This universe is not a part of God.. But it is owned by God as a tool to bring about His eternal plan..
We will not be God.. Only God can be God.. The trouble,, the great controversy started when Lucifer made a claim to Godhood and thus we have been working out that great debate since the time of the garden of Eden.. We shall be made perfect and we shall be eternal but we shall never be God..
Jesus is God manifested in the flesh.. Jesus has always existed.. Jesus was not made..
Only the flesh body He entered into His Creation was created..
We will not be God.. Only God can be God.. The trouble,, the great controversy started when Lucifer made a claim to Godhood and thus we have been working out that great debate since the time of the garden of Eden.. We shall be made perfect and we shall be eternal but we shall never be God..
Jesus is God manifested in the flesh.. Jesus has always existed.. Jesus was not made..
Only the flesh body He entered into His Creation was created..
You clearly don't understand what creation means; creation means part of God (Knowledge) takes a physical form. You should be knowing this otherwise answer this question,
Q. Were created by God or by your parents? why? how?
It is sin that separates what came from within God (Creation) from God, Jesus is sinless, that's why He is God. If Adam would have reached for the tree of life in the garden of Eden, they would have become God- Read Genesis or something.
Q. Were created by God or by your parents? why? how?
It is sin that separates what came from within God (Creation) from God, Jesus is sinless, that's why He is God. If Adam would have reached for the tree of life in the garden of Eden, they would have become God- Read Genesis or something.
We have things that mark time (sun, moon, clocks, hours, days, months, etc). However, time did not start with the things that identify how much time has gone by. There was a time Satan was an angel in heaven, but at this time he is not. So it took time for there to be a war in heaven, and this is before the creation of the world- before clocks and a sun and moon to mark seasons, days, and years.
God existed for years, decades, centuries, and far beyond our comprehension of any kind of time marker. But time did take place. I think what is hard for us to fathom is that God has no beginning. Even though we cannot count that high, we can still understand how you can always make a number bigger, but it is hard to understand no beginning.
Still, time (maybe not time markers, but time itself) does exist in the spiritual realm. When those who were beheaded for God asked God when He would revenge their blood, God said "Wait until..." If time did not exist in the spiritual realm, they would be put on pause like statues who cannot do anything, including asking God a question.
God existed for years, decades, centuries, and far beyond our comprehension of any kind of time marker. But time did take place. I think what is hard for us to fathom is that God has no beginning. Even though we cannot count that high, we can still understand how you can always make a number bigger, but it is hard to understand no beginning.
Still, time (maybe not time markers, but time itself) does exist in the spiritual realm. When those who were beheaded for God asked God when He would revenge their blood, God said "Wait until..." If time did not exist in the spiritual realm, they would be put on pause like statues who cannot do anything, including asking God a question.
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I clearly know what creation is.. I do not know where you have obtained your idea of what creation is but it is not from the scriptures..
God created me.. God creates everything apart from Himself.. God has always been. We the created have not always been.. This is so basic to understand if you are willing to..
Again the lie that the created can be God is the evil enticement/ lie of satan to Adam and Eve in the scriptures.. Any doctrine that promotes the created being Gods is false no matter what way it is stated..
God created me.. God creates everything apart from Himself.. God has always been. We the created have not always been.. This is so basic to understand if you are willing to..
Again the lie that the created can be God is the evil enticement/ lie of satan to Adam and Eve in the scriptures.. Any doctrine that promotes the created being Gods is false no matter what way it is stated..
1 What is time?
Time is the opposite of paused or stopped. It is impossible to have a thought, conclusion, or an action without time.
2 What is the Bible's view on time?
Well we know God created things to mark time in Genesis. (Sun, moon). But it also says Jesus existed before the creation of the world. Did He exist in a frozen state, unable to think, move, or talk? No, He was not put on pause. Even though it is a short time, it takes time to say "Let there be..." or "Let Us make..." or to hover over waters.
3 What does the bible say about God's relationship to time?
"A day is as a thousand years, and a thousand years is as a day." How is this so? A day is as a thousand years because He knows every detail of every day. It is like if we knew every cell in our body, every hair, every tiny thing, then we would say our body, even though it is one thing, to you it is a billion trillion things. And those billion trillion things are all one thing- your body. And a thousand years is like a day to Him because He existed for so long. When I was five, thirty seemed old. My memory of time span increased as I got older. What used to seem like an eternity- like a school year, or winter, now seems to go by so fast, because I'm older. Imagine that effect on God's age.
Ohh really? God created you? How?
Gen 3:[FONT="] [/FONT][FONT="]22 And the Lord God said, “The man has now become like one of us, knowing good and evil. He must not be allowed to reach out his hand and take also from the tree of life and eat, and live forever.”
If Adam had reached out for the tree of life, He would be God and live forever - reason God said "he has become like one of us..". The only thing that was missing was life eternal.
[/FONT]And from the same tree of life is what believers are going to eat at the end of age so we will become like God and live forever:
Rev 22:1Then the angel showed me the river of the water of life, as clear as crystal, flowing from the throne of God and of the Lamb 2down the middle of the great street of the city. On each side of the river stood the tree of life, bearing twelve crops of fruit, yielding its fruit every month. And the leaves of the tree are for the healing of the nations. 3No longer will there be any curse. The throne of God and of the Lamb will be in the city, and his servants will serve him. 4They will see his face, and his name will be on their foreheads.
The authority of the son is given believers; the Father and the son are one.
Take note.
Gen 3:[FONT="] [/FONT][FONT="]22 And the Lord God said, “The man has now become like one of us, knowing good and evil. He must not be allowed to reach out his hand and take also from the tree of life and eat, and live forever.”
If Adam had reached out for the tree of life, He would be God and live forever - reason God said "he has become like one of us..". The only thing that was missing was life eternal.
[/FONT]And from the same tree of life is what believers are going to eat at the end of age so we will become like God and live forever:
Rev 22:1Then the angel showed me the river of the water of life, as clear as crystal, flowing from the throne of God and of the Lamb 2down the middle of the great street of the city. On each side of the river stood the tree of life, bearing twelve crops of fruit, yielding its fruit every month. And the leaves of the tree are for the healing of the nations. 3No longer will there be any curse. The throne of God and of the Lamb will be in the city, and his servants will serve him. 4They will see his face, and his name will be on their foreheads.
The authority of the son is given believers; the Father and the son are one.
Take note.
