Bill Johnson's Presuppositional Based Hermeneutic Is A Psychosis
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If this doesn't work, I suggest a nonconfrontational approach and ask them to pray with you or perhaps have some good gospel songs or concerts to enjoy together?
I have found that many good doctrines have been set to music.
Their objection is that you aren't "spiritual"...while I would not go into the whole seeking signs and omens from dead roadrunner...
I would show them my spirituality through prayer, music and other spiritual activities.
My guess is your goal is not to "win" an argument but to gain their trust to allow you to spend time with your grandkids?
Will keep you in prayer.
Dear God give our brother the wisdom and strength to know when to keep silent and when to speak in love, amen.
I have found that many good doctrines have been set to music.
Their objection is that you aren't "spiritual"...while I would not go into the whole seeking signs and omens from dead roadrunner...
I would show them my spirituality through prayer, music and other spiritual activities.
My guess is your goal is not to "win" an argument but to gain their trust to allow you to spend time with your grandkids?
Will keep you in prayer.
Dear God give our brother the wisdom and strength to know when to keep silent and when to speak in love, amen.
In November 2005, the membership of Bethel Church voted unanimously to withdraw the church's affiliation with the Assemblies of God and become a non-denominational church. However, the Assemblies of God's bylaws required Bethel to invite the leadership of the Northern California-Nevada District to speak to the congregation. On January 15, 2006, Bethel's membership voted to rescind the withdrawal and invited the district leadership to Redding. The district leadership met with the congregation in January 17, but the result was a near-unanimous vote to withdraw. In a letter, Johnson points out that this action was "...not a reaction to conflict but a response to a call... we feel called to create a network that helps other networks thrive — to be one of many ongoing catalysts in this continuing revival. Our call feels unique enough theologically and practically from the call on the Assemblies of God that this change is appropriate."[SUP][6][/SUP] Since that time, the church has grown to nearly 9,000 attendees a week.[SUP][1]
Bethel is no longer AOG, & it's worship style is charismatic.[/SUP]
Bethel is no longer AOG, & it's worship style is charismatic.[/SUP]
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This may sound strange but I suggest that you don't argue with your words but with your actions. Show them what true Christianity is through prayer,worship and love that is biblically sound.
You probably already pray over your daughter and her family every day, but maybe if you don't already you and your wife could pray together?
You can argue and debate but that will just push your family farther away.
You have to show them God's agape love, be the type of Father that a prodigal daughter will return to and trust God to keep them safe until they do.
You never know what God will do.maybe when they return they can help others hurt by the lies false doctrine inflicts upon people's souls?
May God's peace and love enfold and comfort you.
You probably already pray over your daughter and her family every day, but maybe if you don't already you and your wife could pray together?
You can argue and debate but that will just push your family farther away.
You have to show them God's agape love, be the type of Father that a prodigal daughter will return to and trust God to keep them safe until they do.
You never know what God will do.maybe when they return they can help others hurt by the lies false doctrine inflicts upon people's souls?
May God's peace and love enfold and comfort you.
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I am living proof of this type of move before it became as popular as it is
people will believe what they want to believe and turning your entire life around is not an easy task
I don't have to give anyone proof. I can just easily say to you give me proof it is all God...but the verdict on this latest farce is not in yet except in private to people's messed up lives
you have an entire Bible full of proof but some people just prefer the pied piper.
I am starting to believe that the ones Jesus will say to get away from because He never knew them, the ones who will respond 'oh but we did miracles in your name etc', are going to be the ones who follow a false Jesus
makes no sense to me otherwise
and kindly don't come back with some nonsense about I don't have proof so I didn't answer because if you have pc or laptop, you have 24/7 to research what I am talking about
I have done extensive research because when I started hearing about NAR and the very wide network...going back over 10 years now, alarms went off and with good reason.
people need to humble themselves before God instead of glorifying themselves and making themselves out to be a god that has all the answers
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I never said Bethel was Pentecostal. because you do not actually know the differences between Pentecostal, Charismatic and NAR you copy/paste an article.
how does what you say change the fact Johnson was Pentecostal but is now NAR?
sure there are shared characteristics between Charismatic and NAR...but they are not the same
you are not giving any new info here and it does not alter what I said
it's like this...you can compare a monkey who walks on 2 legs and a human who does the same. only one is human
people are not getting the fact and do not seem to understand that NAR is making deep inroads in churches who do not even know the spirit they are letting in
I mean seriously....there are years of catching up someone would need to do if they really were interested in the movement
Charismatics can be found in Catholic churches and mainstream churches and it has been that way over 40 years...prob closer to 50.
nothing new there
NAR has a definite timeline and a specific event which defines it
it's all out there. I'm not being paid to publish articles LOL!
have you ever attended a Pentecostal church? doesn't sound like it
how does what you say change the fact Johnson was Pentecostal but is now NAR?
sure there are shared characteristics between Charismatic and NAR...but they are not the same
you are not giving any new info here and it does not alter what I said
it's like this...you can compare a monkey who walks on 2 legs and a human who does the same. only one is human
people are not getting the fact and do not seem to understand that NAR is making deep inroads in churches who do not even know the spirit they are letting in
I mean seriously....there are years of catching up someone would need to do if they really were interested in the movement
Charismatics can be found in Catholic churches and mainstream churches and it has been that way over 40 years...prob closer to 50.
nothing new there
NAR has a definite timeline and a specific event which defines it
it's all out there. I'm not being paid to publish articles LOL!
have you ever attended a Pentecostal church? doesn't sound like it
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Regardless of how they label themselves it is the legitimacy of the claims they are making that is in question. Unfounded claims of physical tangible supernatural acts are a damning sign of apostasy. They will be judged by their claims and found lacking. Truly, this movement is the "Lord, Lord did we not" that Jesus spoke about.
No Didy, I don't support anybody and I certainly know nothing about Johnson. I was just pointing out the much of the so-called sound doctrine people swear by needs to be inspected. We will never be open to any last-days prophecy if all we accept is what has been handed to us by tradition. I had to set aside a lot of my traditional understanding of scripture before the Holy Spirit could make me open for something new. By last days prophecy, I will reference the following:
Dan. 12:4 "But you, Daniel, roll up and seal the words of the scroll until the time of the end. Many will go here and there to increase knowledge.”
I believe this is talking about us the time right before the end. With our computers and ready reference material so handily available we might be able to unlock more prophecy. By going here and there, I feel is the way people fly all over the world today.
Dan. 12:4 "But you, Daniel, roll up and seal the words of the scroll until the time of the end. Many will go here and there to increase knowledge.”
I believe this is talking about us the time right before the end. With our computers and ready reference material so handily available we might be able to unlock more prophecy. By going here and there, I feel is the way people fly all over the world today.
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No Didy, I don't support anybody and I certainly know nothing about Johnson. I was just pointing out the much of the so-called sound doctrine people swear by needs to be inspected. We will never be open to any last-days prophecy if all we accept is what has been handed to us by tradition. I had to set aside a lot of my traditional understanding of scripture before the Holy Spirit could make me open for something new. By last days prophecy, I will reference the following:
Dan. 12:4 "But you, Daniel, roll up and seal the words of the scroll until the time of the end. Many will go here and there to increase knowledge.”
I believe this is talking about us the time right before the end. With our computers and ready reference material so handily available we might be able to unlock more prophecy. By going here and there, I feel is the way people fly all over the world today.
Dan. 12:4 "But you, Daniel, roll up and seal the words of the scroll until the time of the end. Many will go here and there to increase knowledge.”
I believe this is talking about us the time right before the end. With our computers and ready reference material so handily available we might be able to unlock more prophecy. By going here and there, I feel is the way people fly all over the world today.
No Didy, I don't support anybody and I certainly know nothing about Johnson. I was just pointing out the much of the so-called sound doctrine people swear by needs to be inspected. We will never be open to any last-days prophecy if all we accept is what has been handed to us by tradition. I had to set aside a lot of my traditional understanding of scripture before the Holy Spirit could make me open for something new. By last days prophecy, I will reference the following:
Dan. 12:4 "But you, Daniel, roll up and seal the words of the scroll until the time of the end. Many will go here and there to increase knowledge.”
I believe this is talking about us the time right before the end. With our computers and ready reference material so handily available we might be able to unlock more prophecy. By going here and there, I feel is the way people fly all over the world today.
Dan. 12:4 "But you, Daniel, roll up and seal the words of the scroll until the time of the end. Many will go here and there to increase knowledge.”
I believe this is talking about us the time right before the end. With our computers and ready reference material so handily available we might be able to unlock more prophecy. By going here and there, I feel is the way people fly all over the world today.
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I honestly cannot figure why folks would want to insist they are right when they are wrong
Johnson is NAR.
Largely behind the scenes, a group of mostly self-proclaimed “apostles,” leading ministries from North Carolina to Southern California, has attracted millions of followers with promises of direct access to God through signs and wonders
NAR stands for New Apostolic Reformation and Johnson is one of the leading so called Apostles of the movement
these folks passed 'Charismatics' eons ago in there practices
sorry to bore y'all, but Pentecostal, Charismatic and NAR breath different air
What you need to know about the New Apostolic Reformation (NAR)
by NTAdmin on April 1, 2017 in Naomi’s Table
The New Apostolic Reformation (NAR) is a dominionist movement that also goes by names like Third Wave, Seven Mountains, Latter Rain, Kingdom Now, Joel’s Army, Manifest Sons of God, Charismatic Renewal, and more. This week we feature our White Paper on this dangerous counterfeit “Christianity” which asserts that God is restoring the lost offices of church governance, namely the offices of Prophet and Apostle.
Leading figures in this seemingly loosely organized movement claim that these prophets and apostles alone have the power and authority to execute God’s plans and purposes on earth. They believe they are laying the foundation for a global church, governed by them.
Johnson is a 'leading figure' ^^^^^
there is no way someone doing honest research can sit on their hanches and conclude he is simply Charasmatic
I could sit here all day (thankfully have lots of other things to do) and post links to this group and the history etc.
Johnson is NAR.
Largely behind the scenes, a group of mostly self-proclaimed “apostles,” leading ministries from North Carolina to Southern California, has attracted millions of followers with promises of direct access to God through signs and wonders
NAR stands for New Apostolic Reformation and Johnson is one of the leading so called Apostles of the movement
these folks passed 'Charismatics' eons ago in there practices
sorry to bore y'all, but Pentecostal, Charismatic and NAR breath different air
What you need to know about the New Apostolic Reformation (NAR)
by NTAdmin on April 1, 2017 in Naomi’s Table
Leading figures in this seemingly loosely organized movement claim that these prophets and apostles alone have the power and authority to execute God’s plans and purposes on earth. They believe they are laying the foundation for a global church, governed by them.
Johnson is a 'leading figure' ^^^^^
there is no way someone doing honest research can sit on their hanches and conclude he is simply Charasmatic
I could sit here all day (thankfully have lots of other things to do
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The Charismatic movement derives it's roots from Pentecostalism. This is no secret to anybody that has taken five minutes to investigate. The NAR (New Apostolic Reformation) is Pentecostalism on steroids, the steroids being but not isolated to modern day apostles and prophets, all of whom are (self-)appointed within their own circle. The biggest discrepancy between the three IMO is the level or degree to which the "spirit" is moving amongst them. All three seek sign gifts, the most obvious being the gift of tongues. Similar origins ... varied styles and degrees. I don't subscribe to any of the three. My faith stands firm without such "evidence".
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From Wikipedia:
While Pentecostals and charismatics share these beliefs, there are differences. Many in the charismatic movement deliberately distanced themselves from Pentecostalism for cultural and theological reasons. Foremost among theological reasons is the tendency of many Pentecostals to insist that speaking in tongues is always the initial physical sign of receiving Spirit baptism. Although specific teachings will vary from group to group, charismatics generally believe that the baptism with the Holy Spirit occurs at the new birth and prefer to call subsequent encounters with the Holy Spirit by other names, such as "being filled".[9] In contrast to Pentecostals, charismatics tend to accept a range of supernatural experiences (such as prophecy, miracles, healing, or "physical manifestations of an altered state of consciousness") as evidence of having been baptized or filled with the Holy Spirit.[10]
Pentecostals are also distinguished from the charismatic movement on the basis of style.[11] Also, Pentecostals have traditionally placed a high value on evangelization and missionary work. Charismatics, on the other hand, have tended to see their movement as a force for revitalization and renewal within their own church traditions.[12]
Being a Pentecostal myself, I don't believe that tongues are the only initial physical evidence of the Baptism in the Holy Spirit.
Peter & Joel lays it out plainly that the gift of Prophecy should be the main actual proof of the baptism.
The NAR claims it's in both the Pentecostal churches & the charismatic movement, with charismatics being the majority.
While Pentecostals and charismatics share these beliefs, there are differences. Many in the charismatic movement deliberately distanced themselves from Pentecostalism for cultural and theological reasons. Foremost among theological reasons is the tendency of many Pentecostals to insist that speaking in tongues is always the initial physical sign of receiving Spirit baptism. Although specific teachings will vary from group to group, charismatics generally believe that the baptism with the Holy Spirit occurs at the new birth and prefer to call subsequent encounters with the Holy Spirit by other names, such as "being filled".[9] In contrast to Pentecostals, charismatics tend to accept a range of supernatural experiences (such as prophecy, miracles, healing, or "physical manifestations of an altered state of consciousness") as evidence of having been baptized or filled with the Holy Spirit.[10]
Pentecostals are also distinguished from the charismatic movement on the basis of style.[11] Also, Pentecostals have traditionally placed a high value on evangelization and missionary work. Charismatics, on the other hand, have tended to see their movement as a force for revitalization and renewal within their own church traditions.[12]
Being a Pentecostal myself, I don't believe that tongues are the only initial physical evidence of the Baptism in the Holy Spirit.
Peter & Joel lays it out plainly that the gift of Prophecy should be the main actual proof of the baptism.
The NAR claims it's in both the Pentecostal churches & the charismatic movement, with charismatics being the majority.