correct my summary

[livingbygrace]

Originally Posted by phil36

Ahh so now we get to the gist of it. you do believe in heresy and follow it.

Yes Jesus is God, but He is not the Father, the Holy Spirit is God, yet He is not the Father or the son. all three are distinct persons but one. this my friewnd is the triune God.

Of course you do not seem to believe this. so all that can be taken is that you willfully follow heresy... A heretic!

Blessings

Phil

So you doi not accept the plain scripture I quote? But of course if you quoted scripture to me I am sure you would expect me to accept it literally as it was written.

I am left wondering here why the Bible has made such plain and emphatic statements that cannot be relied on as to what is required to have eternal life

I see you didn't answer my question, never mind

[phil36]

Originally Posted by Consumed

amen Phil , in the meantime the mercy seat is open, judgement will come, His not ours bro. If it was up to man we would be writing people off in a flash at times, only He knows the heart of any man /woman

all good phil
God bless

Consumed, I agree, but I dont think you can see the difference, between loving truth and loving heresy? Are we just to say ok we should all agree heresy or not lets just love man? I don't think so.

Blessings consumed

[Consumed]

Originally Posted by phil36

Consumed, I agree, but I dont think you can see the difference, between loving truth and loving heresy? Are we just to say ok we should all agree heresy or not lets just love man? I don't think so.

Blessings consumed

bro all im saying is to love our neighbour, jew or gentile, He died for all. What ones beliefs are they are, saddens me to see division in the body of Christ over doctrianl differences between denominations. Do i believe in gay pastors and the like?? absoulutely not - do i believe if some feel the holy trinity means this and not that is not a point of contention to salvation. We are given this precious gift to love God and others as God has so loved us, all of us thru Jesus Christ.

like i said, it does get to be straining camels for gnats when i read things,my perspective, does that mean im a heretic or ignorant or deceived now? i just add to the threads as everyone else is led by what they believe, not to attack nor denounce anyone yet i seem to get alot of critism at times from some for doing so.
Love how Jesus said "woe when all men speak good of you, for so did they with the false prophets" gives me encouragement that not all do speak good of me, even at my own church i attend bro, some see things for gnats and i dont yet i show them respect love and honor that they are, like me, created by God.

i apologise to anyone who reads this and feel offended at times with my posts, to me - Its all about Jesus, the love poured out to all flesh thru Christ as His declaration in blood of that love being made manifested at calvary

blessings

[AgeofKnowledge]

I believe Consumed values and emphasizes love. I do as well and so because he accused me of being unloving have lightened up and will be striving for more gentleness and reverence as 1 Peter teaches. I suppose I have Consumed to thank for that so thank you Consumed for that.

I am troubled; however, that he does not think it's important if one holds to an accurate definition of who God is and I hope he answers my question of whether or not he believes all roads lead to God.

[Consumed]

Originally Posted by AgeofKnowledge

I believe Consumed values and emphasizes love. I do as well and so because he accused me of being unloving have lightened up and will be striving for more gentleness and reverence as 1 Peter teaches. I suppose I have Consumed to thank for that so thank you Consumed for that.

I am troubled; however, that he does not think it's important if one holds to an accurate definition of who God is and I hope he answers my question of whether or not he believes all roads lead to God.

what part did you miss, the question of your denominatinal doctrination or the overstated view i hold dear to me that all roads lead to calvary at the foot of the cross to where we have access assured to us to the Father??

[phil36]

Originally Posted by Consumed

bro all im saying is to love our neighbour, jew or gentile, He died for all. What ones beliefs are they are, saddens me to see division in the body of Christ over doctrianl differences between denominations. Do i believe in gay pastors and the like?? absoulutely not - do i believe if some feel the holy trinity means this and not that is not a point of contention to salvation. We are given this precious gift to love God and others as God has so loved us, all of us thru Jesus Christ.

like i said, it does get to be straining camels for gnats when i read things,my perspective, does that mean im a heretic or ignorant or deceived now? i just add to the threads as everyone else is led by what they believe, not to attack nor denounce anyone yet i seem to get alot of critism at times from some for doing so.
Love how Jesus said "woe when all men speak good of you, for so did they with the false prophets" gives me encouragement that not all do speak good of me, even at my own church i attend bro, some see things for gnats and i dont yet i show them respect love and honor that they are, like me, created by God.

i apologise to anyone who reads this and feel offended at times with my posts, to me - Its all about Jesus, the love poured out to all flesh thru Christ as His declaration in blood of that love being made manifested at calvary

blessings

Lol Sorry for getting you frustrtated, I apologise for that. What I am saying is yes we love everybody, even our worst enemy, infact do as much good you can for your enemy. However, as I say I don't think you realize the difference between loving your enemy and standing shoulder to shoulder with those who profess Christ yet Deny His Diety.

It is not that we still don't love them, that is not the issue in the debate, I still love them, but I will not stand idly by and let themespouse heresy especially the very foundation of Christianity.

So the argument is not love each other as that is a given, the argument goes deeper, it goes to the very core of who God is. They deny the very subtances of God, The Godhead, triunity. This is the Christian God.

It is through the utmost love that Christians speak out against these heresies consumed. It is because we care enough to speak against falicies. and not just on this board, it has been since the NT times.. Just reading the Epistles we can see this. It is through love!

Blessings consumed

Phil

[VW]

When you have a chance of changing another person's mind or heart, which by the way is only accomplished by speaking the words of the Spirit in the power of the Spirit, when the Spirit is at work in the one hearing, should you take on the daunting task of trying to change how another thinks? And when it involves religious beliefs, strongly held beliefs, which do not actually have a bearing on salvation; to throw around words like heresy and heretic is beyond irresponsible. It is uncalled for.

It should be agreed that if one believes that Jesus is Lord, crucified for our sins, risen from the dead, the one mediator between God and man, the only way into eternal life and salvation, that they are of the body of Christ. If this be the case, to call such a one a heretic is wrong. This is not loving, not as God is love.

Not one of us has all of the truth, not about anything. We are parts of a body, a heavenly body, a spiritual body, and each part is a part of us. What is being practiced here is as bad as eating meat before a brother who is condemned by our eating. Maybe worse. Error is not heresy. Heresy is belief which does not lead to salvation, does not lead to loving our brothers even as Jesus loves us. This is what I find wrong with most if not all religious creeds. While they have a portion of the truth, they are not truth, because it is not truth until the Holy Spirit opens one's heart to see God with the understanding of the Spirit. Something called the mind of Christ.

Paul preached against those who wished to put brothers and sisters under the condemnation of the Law. Against those who taught that Jesus had already returned. Against those who taught that we could live in sin. And Peter and James and John taught these things also. The foundation of Christianity is not doctrine, it is not having a correct view of God, it is not being correct in doctrine. No, the foundation is having the life of God in us by the Spirit, His life as our life. And loving one another.

[AgeofKnowledge]

Originally Posted by Consumed

what part did you miss, the question of your denominatinal doctrination or the overstated view i hold dear to me that all roads lead to calvary at the foot of the cross to where we have access assured to us to the Father??

So you actually do believe that all roads lead to the God of the Bible. It looks like you are what is known as a religious pluralist and happen to be a Christian instead of a Hindu or Muslim or Mormon or whatever.

"In theology, pluralism suggests that there are many paths to and expressions of truth about God and several equally valid means to salvation" -Dictionary of Theological Terms.

Pluralism: The belief that every religion is true, that each provides a genuine encounter with the Ultimate. One may be better than the others, but all are adequate.

So you believe then that every religion is true and provides a genuine encounter with the God of the Bible? Is this your view Consumed?

Piss,

anyone seen any wolves looking to blast hersy at Christain's for loven the Lord, Ya'll be careful, there's a pack in here looking to set thing right, Hummm

" I Be '

[AgeofKnowledge]

Calm down ibe. I'm honestly wanting to understand brother Consumed's belief as per his statement. We're in a discussion and you're showing up and saying some pretty unsavory things. I forgive you but would it be possible for you to take that somewhere else? Thanking you for your love and understanding in advance.

[phil36]

Originally Posted by ibewhoibe

Piss,

anyone seen any wolves looking to blast hersy at Christain's for loven the Lord, Ya'll be careful, there's a pack in here looking to set thing right, Hummm

" I Be '

Hi IBE,

I am sure you are having a litlle giggle, The maturity level reminds me of my son..he's 12.

I think you are also mistaken about the wolves blasting those who love the Lord.. infact your telling Lies. Of course I am not really sure if you are talking about the real one triune God?

Blessings

Phil

[AgeofKnowledge]

Well I'm waiting for Consumed's reply I'll add that I accepted the rebuke to be more loving (even if I disagree with his position that all roads lead to the God of the Bible if he's actually teaching that they do) and thank him for that. Hey, I'm willing to admit I'm not perfect and God isn't finished with me yet . You'll hear less of the "H" word from me in the future though I still reserve the right to employ it in the historical sense of ancient and modern Judaism and Christianity (but without calling people names).

Honestly, I just want to know now if his statement:

"what part did you miss, the question of your denominatinal doctrination or the overstated view i hold dear to me that all roads lead to calvary at the foot of the cross to where we have access assured to us to the Father??"

means all religions lead to calvary at the foot of the cross to where we have access assured to us to the Father.

I want to know what the word "ROADS" means here from Consumed himself (not someone else trying to speak for him) so I can be sure I understand his position. Thank you and God bless. Consumed, please be good enough to clarify. Thank you brother.

[phil36]

Originally Posted by VW

When you have a chance of changing another person's mind or heart, which by the way is only accomplished by speaking the words of the Spirit in the power of the Spirit, when the Spirit is at work in the one hearing, should you take on the daunting task of trying to change how another thinks? And when it involves religious beliefs, strongly held beliefs, which do not actually have a bearing on salvation; to throw around words like heresy and heretic is beyond irresponsible. It is uncalled for.

It should be agreed that if one believes that Jesus is Lord, crucified for our sins, risen from the dead, the one mediator between God and man, the only way into eternal life and salvation, that they are of the body of Christ. If this be the case, to call such a one a heretic is wrong. This is not loving, not as God is love.

Not one of us has all of the truth, not about anything. We are parts of a body, a heavenly body, a spiritual body, and each part is a part of us. What is being practiced here is as bad as eating meat before a brother who is condemned by our eating. Maybe worse. Error is not heresy. Heresy is belief which does not lead to salvation, does not lead to loving our brothers even as Jesus loves us. This is what I find wrong with most if not all religious creeds. While they have a portion of the truth, they are not truth, because it is not truth until the Holy Spirit opens one's heart to see God with the understanding of the Spirit. Something called the mind of Christ.

Paul preached against those who wished to put brothers and sisters under the condemnation of the Law. Against those who taught that Jesus had already returned. Against those who taught that we could live in sin. And Peter and James and John taught these things also. The foundation of Christianity is not doctrine, it is not having a correct view of God, it is not being correct in doctrine. No, the foundation is having the life of God in us by the Spirit, His life as our life. And loving one another.

VW, you are so of the mark I do not even know where to begin. Lets get straight to a major issue I have with your statement.. you say error is not heresy, I agree, However you know fine well that those debating here are not in error, they willfully deny the Trinity. that is heresy My friend.

And I will ask you again. what god are they talking about? for it certainly is not the Triune God of the Bible.

My other big problem with your Statement is your 'all paths' attitude towards God.. even the demons know exactly who Jesus is and that you have to confess THAT JESUS IS LORD. so be very careful VW.

You are using Paul preaching about the Law, that is an altogether differing issue and fine well you know it VW! of course do you Know what Paul means by 'works of the Law'? never mind it is of topic.

The Apostle Paul was the first to condemn any form of heresy!

again I will say to you VW, what god do they confess? for by their own confession it is not the triune God, therefore NOT the God of Scripture.

I am very sorry to have short and blunt with this post and i really don't mean to offend. but all this pandering to heresy really is sickening especially from those who confess to be Christians.

The Trinity is the Foundation of Christianity, Why? because it is God Himself, that is why. to deny this you deny the one true God. Some people are mislead, and as far as they are concerned they are not following heresy, it is my deepest heartfelt plea to those who don't know about the Trinity to find out. It is Christian basics and the foundation of Christianity.

Blessings

Phil

[VW]

Originally Posted by phil36

VW, you are so of the mark I do not even know where to begin. Lets get straight to a major issue I have with your statement.. you say error is not heresy, I agree, However you know fine well that those debating here are not in error, they willfully deny the Trinity. that is heresy My friend.

And I will ask you again. what god are they talking about? for it certainly is not the Triune God of the Bible.

My other big problem with your Statement is your 'all paths' attitude towards God.. even the demons know exactly who Jesus is and that you have to confess THAT JESUS IS LORD. so be very careful VW.

You are using Paul preaching about the Law, that is an altogether differing issue and fine well you know it VW! of course do you Know what Paul means by 'works of the Law'? never mind it is of topic.

The Apostle Paul was the first to condemn any form of heresy!

again I will say to you VW, what god do they confess? for by their own confession it is not the triune God, therefore NOT the God of Scripture.

I am very sorry to have short and blunt with this post and i really don't mean to offend. but all this pandering to heresy really is sickening especially from those who confess to be Christians.

The Trinity is the Foundation of Christianity, Why? because it is God Himself, that is why. to deny this you deny the one true God. Some people are mislead, and as far as they are concerned they are not following heresy, it is my deepest heartfelt plea to those who don't know about the Trinity to find out. It is Christian basics and the foundation of Christianity.

Blessings

Phil

I wonder about your christianity Phil. The trinity is not the basis of christianity. Do you know why you are wrong? God is not of the scripture, the scripture is of God.

[phil36]

Originally Posted by VW

I wonder about your christianity Phil. The trinity is not the basis of christianity. Do you know why you are wrong? God is not of the scripture, the scripture is of God.

VW,

Please don't wonder about my Christianity it is just fine, I have my ups and down like everyone, but the journey on the road is awesome

Now back to your statement.. Now this is where we can tell you dont like scripture and only use it to suuit your own purposes..

OF course scripture is not God.. what silly observation to make VW! However i think you ought to be careful, for it is certainly Gods word, unless you deny that?

God has chosen scripture as his vehicle to tell us what we need to know, and what we need to know about him... MMmm remind me what did Paul say?????

Now, here is the the crux, you believe the Spirit guides you , you don't need scripture.... well my friend don't forget your are a fallen man, yes you are saved and praise God Almighty for that.. but rest assured your fleshly nature will be eating at you daily as it does daily with us all... are you really sure you are perfectly hearing the Spirit.

I will say that again, as a fallen creature, are you PERFECTLY HEARING the Spirit, are you sure.. As History has testified. many who say these things usually go so far left it is unBelievable.

SCRIPTURE IS OUR MEASURING ROD FOR ALL TRUTH.

My prayer is that you come to realize this VW.

My Christian walk is based on the fact that the great TRIUNE God saved me, a wreck of man , evil and wicked, and brought me into His family, forgiven and free from guilt.

For the gospel is the power of salvation, the word of God, And God was so gracious that he gave us His writtin living word to be our measuring stick.

What is your meausring stick..Are you like the bereans VW.. do you search scripture to amke sure the small vooice in your head is truth?

The triune God is the foundation of Christianity.

WHY VW

Because HE is GOD, all thing BEGIN with GOD and not maybe a voice inour heads.. that you don't measure upto scripture LIKE the BOREANS.


Blessings

Phil

[phil36]

Originally Posted by VW

I wonder about your christianity Phil. The trinity is not the basis of christianity. Do you know why you are wrong? God is not of the scripture, the scripture is of God.

I still cannot believe what you have just said... GOD IS NOT THE BASIS OF CHRISTiANITY!

[VW]

Originally Posted by phil36

I still cannot believe what you have just said... GOD IS NOT THE BASIS OF CHRISTiANITY!

Twist, twist, twist.

I said that the doctrine of the trinity is not the basis of our faith, is not the basis of our christianity.

I DID NOT SAY THAT GOD IS NOT THE BASIS OF OUR FAITH!!!!!!!

You show your true colors.

[VW]

If one believes that God was in Christ, that Christ Jesus is God manifested in the flesh, you say that they are heretics, that they are not saved, that they do not believe in the true God, and thus are wrong and unsaved and need to be called heretics because you love them.

Get real.

[phil36]

VW,

You should know better, and to be honest I personally thought you did! there is no twist, twist twist, you are following a dangerous path if you believe that the trinity is just a man made notion. The doctrine of the Trinity, for your information is the foundational for christians. IT IS THE GOD YOU PROFESS TO SERVE VW.

The doctrine of the Trinity.. is GOD. It is who God is. ALL things begin with God therefore the basis of Christianity is GOD!

Yes I have shown my true colours VW, and insults dont help your cause VW.

You have also shown that you show no regard for scripture, or else you certainly would be saying the things you are.

GOD is the basis of our faiith, our whole existence.. God is Triune, therefore to deny the trinity is to deny who GOD is, the Almighty of Almightys the sustainer and creator of all things.

you can't even answer about.. how you just follow the spirit, you are a fallen man,, are you sure the voice in your is telling you the truth.. surely you must meausre it against Gods word.. like the bereans.. for if you did you would know exactly what I am saying VW. That God is the BASIS of Christianity, the Triune God as in SCRIPTURE.

I have certainly shown my colours VW, you are right there. I have shown that I do believe in the true God of scripture, and that I will not bed fellow heresy.

Now what is your colours?


Anyhow, we are now going down turning circles, you seem happy to bedfellow heretical notions, and you have backed this up with the post you have just made.


So I will leave it there VW.

Blessings

Phil

[phil36]

Originally Posted by VW

If one believes that God was in Christ, that Christ Jesus is God manifested in the flesh, you say that they are heretics, that they are not saved, that they do not believe in the true God, and thus are wrong and unsaved and need to be called heretics because you love them.

Get real.

VW, I honestly dont think you have a clue what the trinity is? They follow heresy.. that is REAL! do you also not believe in the trinity VW?

Do you believe that The Father is God, the Son is God and the Holy Spirit is God, three persons yet one/substance in other words God is one, yet three?

IDo you believe that is true?


Phil