The timing of the rapture?

Just a poll to see what most believe.

[daddycat]

is this just a poll, or is it also a discussion thread?

Originally Posted by daddycat

is this just a poll, or is it also a discussion thread?

Discuss away, I would be curious to what people have to say on the subject.

Matter of fact I would like to know why you believe what you believe.

I see we have 3 votes for pretrib so far, it is leading the opinions. Can anyone explain to me (biblically) why they believe in the pretrib rapture?

[daddycat]

Of course, Christ can do things any way He pleases, and if He chooses to remove His church from the world in a separate event prior to His return, He will. I do not, however, subscribe to the 'rapture' doctrine. There are three reasons for my position on this subject.

1) Although there is ample mention of Christ's return in glory in the Scriptures, the passages on which to build a 'rapture' doctrine are few, and open to debate.

2) The doctrine of the 'rapture' has arisen only in the last 150 years. No one in the New Testament church, none of the early church fathers, in fact no one in the church until the mid-nineteenth century had this belief, nor found it necessitated by the words of the text.

3) The idea of a 'rapture' (especially the pre-trib version of it) is, on a psychological level, pleasant and convenient. To be whisked away from the world just prior to the horrible hardships and devastation mentioned in Revelation and elsewhere would be a blessing, without doubt. But when in the past has God spared His church from hardship and persecution on a large scale? Rather, it seems to be an aspect of His economy to allow us to experience these things in order to refine us and to bring glory to His name. In short, I suspect that belief in the 'rapture' is often a result of wishful thinking and not of careful Bible study or a knowledge of church history.

*Daddycat braces himself for an inundation of disagreement *

Originally Posted by daddycat

Of course, Christ can do things any way He pleases, and if He chooses to remove His church from the world in a separate event prior to His return, He will. I do not, however, subscribe to the 'rapture' doctrine. There are three reasons for my position on this subject.

1) Although there is ample mention of Christ's return in glory in the Scriptures, the passages on which to build a 'rapture' doctrine are few, and open to debate.

2) The doctrine of the 'rapture' has arisen only in the last 150 years. No one in the New Testament church, none of the early church fathers, in fact no one in the church until the mid-nineteenth century had this belief, nor found it necessitated by the words of the text.

3) The idea of a 'rapture' (especially the pre-trib version of it) is, on a psychological level, pleasant and convenient. To be whisked away from the world just prior to the horrible hardships and devastation mentioned in Revelation and elsewhere would be a blessing, without doubt. But when in the past has God spared His church from hardship and persecution on a large scale? Rather, it seems to be an aspect of His economy to allow us to experience these things in order to refine us and to bring glory to His name. In short, I suspect that belief in the 'rapture' is often a result of wishful thinking and not of careful Bible study or a knowledge of church history.

*Daddycat braces himself for an inundation of disagreement *

But you do believe in the catching away of the living saints at the posttrib 2nd coming immediately after the resurrection of the just to receive our heavenly bodies? Correct? This is what most refer to as the ''posttrib rapture''. Or do you not believe in the catching away or gathering together at all?

i didn't vote cuz i didn't get it, but i believe He's coming to take his church very soon. sooner than most expect.

Originally Posted by Lil_warrior

i didn't vote cuz i didn't get it, but i believe He's coming to take his church very soon. sooner than most expect.

Well I also think Jesus is coming to receive us unto Himself very soon, but I believe it will be about 7 yrs later than most people think.

I see that mosr believe pretrib about 3 to 1, but I have yet to see one pretribber explain why. To be honest i do not think that pretribbers can explain their position.

so when DO people think the rapture will happen?

Originally Posted by Lil_warrior

so when DO people think the rapture will happen?

Well so far we have 6 pre or before the tribulation, 1 mid or in the middle of the tribulation, 2 post or after the tribulation, and 2 other. The Bible teaches that Jesus returns to gather us together to Himself after the Tribulation,so the posttrib view comes from scripture. Where the pretrib or midtrib views come from I do not know, some person must have made it up.

um ok, i have no idea what u just said. but all i know is He's coming. and the time of His coming, no one knows.

Originally Posted by Lil_warrior

um ok, i have no idea what u just said. but all i know is He's coming. and the time of His coming, no one knows.

No one know the day or hour, however the Bible clearly states that His return is after the tribulation, and at this point He will rapture His church, yet most people teach that it happens before the trib. They oppose the word of God by the teachings.

But it is before the trib!

Originally Posted by Lil_warrior

But it is before the trib!

Why do you think that? What scripture or scriptures in the Bible would cause you to believe that?

and wat makes you believe it'll be after the tribulation?

Originally Posted by Lil_warrior

and wat makes you believe it'll be after the tribulation?

The Bible.
Matthew 24:29-31
29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of heaven shall be shaken:
30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.
31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds from one end of heaven to the other.

Mark 13:24-27
24 But in those days, after this tribulation, the sun will be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light.
25 And the stars of heaven shall fall, and the powers that are in heaven shall be shaken.
26 And they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds with great power and glory.
27 And then he shall send his angels, and shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from the uttermost part of the earth to the uttermost part of heaven.

Your turn Lil-warrior, or any other pretribber that wants to explain why they believe the rapture is before the tribulation. I really would like to hear your view on the subject, especially since it seems to be the dominant view, yet oddly has no biblical basis at all.

[daddycat]

Originally Posted by onwingsaseagles

But you do believe in the catching away of the living saints at the posttrib 2nd coming immediately after the resurrection of the just to receive our heavenly bodies? Correct? This is what most refer to as the ''posttrib rapture''. Or do you not believe in the catching away or gathering together at all?

I guess I'm an agnostic when it comes to that distinction. I don't know what I think. I do think far too much mental energy is burned up over this when it's much more important to be 'ready' and do the things He left for us to do. I'd like to see the Biblical support for a 'posttrib rapture' which incontrovertibly posits it as a separate and distinct event from Christ's return. I'm willing to be shown.