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Thread: sacrifice in the 1000-year of peace?

  1. #1
    Dutch41
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    Default sacrifice in the 1000-year of peace?

    Before you gave an answer maybe it is good to read Ezekiel 40-46. And when I read this part: there is something interesting because: we can read about the new temple made by God. In Chapter 43 we can read the Shekina is coming back into the temple (vs5).

    Now the interesting part: In Ezek 43:13-- it seems that the Priest offering ( and service) what was kept in the OT is coming back here. (See 44:1-27

    Why is this interesting: because we know that Jesus is the fulfil of the offering. We can see too, that some feasts are coming back too (see chapter 45)

    Well.. when you read this all.. and are thinking about it. What do you think about this?

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    Post Re: sacrifice in the 1000-year of peace?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dutch41 View Post
    Before you gave an answer maybe it is good to read Ezekiel 40-46. And when I read this part: there is something interesting because: we can read about the new temple made by God. In Chapter 43 we can read the Shekina is coming back into the temple (vs5).

    Now the interesting part: In Ezek 43:13-- it seems that the Priest offering ( and service) what was kept in the OT is coming back here. (See 44:1-27

    Why is this interesting: because we know that Jesus is the fulfil of the offering. We can see too, that some feasts are coming back too (see chapter 45)

    Well.. when you read this all.. and are thinking about it. What do you think about this?
    We are in the 1000 years of peace now. There is spiritual peace for Christians already because of the Cross of Christ. Not worldly peace, or deliverance from wars. Christ didn't promise world peace. .... The millennium is now. There will not be a future earthly 1000 year kingdom of Christ from a Jewish Zionist Jerusalem, with animal sacrifices in a restored Jewish temple. That is a myth. The First Council of Constantinople in 381 AD anathematized or rejected chiliasm. Premillennialism. The pretribulation rapture, also, is a new teaching since about 1830 AD, and was unknown to the early NT Church. It is not a teaching of the NT.
    Neither is chiliasm.


  3. #3
    Dutch41
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    Default Re: sacrifice in the 1000-year of peace?

    Quote Originally Posted by Scotth1960 View Post
    We are in the 1000 years of peace now. There is spiritual peace for Christians already because of the Cross of Christ. Not worldly peace, or deliverance from wars. Christ didn't promise world peace. .... The millennium is now. There will not be a future earthly 1000 year kingdom of Christ from a Jewish Zionist Jerusalem, with animal sacrifices in a restored Jewish temple. That is a myth. The First Council of Constantinople in 381 AD anathematized or rejected chiliasm. Premillennialism. The pretribulation rapture, also, is a new teaching since about 1830 AD, and was unknown to the early NT Church. It is not a teaching of the NT.
    Neither is chiliasm.

    Hoi Scotth.

    I understand your way of thinking. But I want to stay at the subject. And I don´t want to discus here about the 1000 year of peace, neither about the replacement theology or rapture or other views.. I know I wrote that, because of my theology view. I want to stay in the Ezekiel 40-46 chapter. So please be free, and gave your opinion about the Ezekiel 40-46.

  4. #4
    Dutch41
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    Default Re: sacrifice in the 1000-year of peace?

    Quote Originally Posted by scotth
    Zionist Jerusalem, with animal sacrifices in a restored Jewish temple. That is a myth
    Well that is the point written in Ezekiel 40-46. So please read the chapters. And gave than your opinion.

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    Senior Member zone's Avatar
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    Default Re: sacrifice in the 1000-year of peace?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dutch41 View Post
    Well that is the point written in Ezekiel 40-46. So please read the chapters. And gave than your opinion.
    hi Dutch.

    Ezekiel saw New Jerusalem (on The New Earth) FROM AFAR OFF.

    he saw the same CITY John saw in Revelation (the same city Jesus described):

    Ezekiel 40:2
    In visions of God he took me to the land of Israel and set me on a very high mountain, on whose south side were some buildings that looked like a city.

    Revelation 21:10
    And he carried me away in the Spirit to a great, high mountain, and showed me the holy city Jerusalem coming down out of heaven from God,

    Ezekiel 48:35
    And the name of the city from that time on shall be, The LORD Is There.”

    Rev 3:12
    Him who overcomes I will make a pillar in the temple of my God. Never again will he leave it. I will write on him the name of my God and the name of the city of my God, the new Jerusalem, which is coming down out of heaven from my God; and I will also write on him my new name.

    Revelation 21:3
    And I heard a loud voice from the throne saying, "Now the dwelling of God is with men, and he will live with them. They will be his people, and God himself will be with them and be their God.

    ~

    Ezekiel in "visions of God" sees a temple reconstructed to receive the glory of the divine presence, a prophetic vision fulfilled in Emmanuel ("God with us"), who tabernacled among men John 1:14. Compare Romans 9:25; Revelation 21:2-3.

    zone.

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    Default Re: sacrifice in the 1000-year of peace?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dutch41 View Post
    Before you gave an answer maybe it is good to read Ezekiel 40-46. And when I read this part: there is something interesting because: we can read about the new temple made by God. In Chapter 43 we can read the Shekina is coming back into the temple (vs5).

    Now the interesting part: In Ezek 43:13-- it seems that the Priest offering ( and service) what was kept in the OT is coming back here. (See 44:1-27

    Why is this interesting: because we know that Jesus is the fulfil of the offering. We can see too, that some feasts are coming back too (see chapter 45)

    Well.. when you read this all.. and are thinking about it. What do you think about this?

    hi dutch41 hoe gaat het met jou?
    very interesting question ,regarding all these measurements, it realy bogles my
    mind, but what i understand that ezekiel was still in captivity in babylon.
    ch.40:1 he was in the 25th yr of captivity so he still has 50 yrs to go because the
    total captivity is 70yrs. so what god is showing ezekiel in vision,was the temple that is
    going to be rebuild. and its build by zerubabel( born in babel ).now all those
    sacrifices that is mentioned in the vision god gave ezekiel is when that temple was
    rebuild and destroyed by the romans in 70 ad. those sacrifices were not perfect
    to god ,and he is very angry, and thats why it was destroyed in70 ad. by the romans.
    so that was not at all a vision of the kingdom, for there will be no more animal
    sacrifices in the kingdom , only spiritual sacrifices. we true christians we do
    sacrifices everyday, by not doing the bad thing, we dont steal even if we have the
    chance to steal, we dont commit adultery even if we have the chance to.
    these are the sacrifices god loves, not animals for all animals belong to god.
    i hope this is of some help to you. tot kijk. trying very hard. long time no speak dutch.

    wakeup.

  7. #7
    Dutch41
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    Default Re: sacrifice in the 1000-year of peace?

    Quote Originally Posted by zone View Post
    hi Dutch.

    Ezekiel saw New Jerusalem (on The New Earth) FROM AFAR OFF.

    he saw the same CITY John saw in Revelation (the same city Jesus described):

    Ezekiel 40:2
    In visions of God he took me to the land of Israel and set me on a very high mountain, on whose south side were some buildings that looked like a city.

    Revelation 21:10
    And he carried me away in the Spirit to a great, high mountain, and showed me the holy city Jerusalem coming down out of heaven from God,

    Ezekiel 48:35
    And the name of the city from that time on shall be, The LORD Is There.”

    Rev 3:12
    Him who overcomes I will make a pillar in the temple of my God. Never again will he leave it. I will write on him the name of my God and the name of the city of my God, the new Jerusalem, which is coming down out of heaven from my God; and I will also write on him my new name.

    Revelation 21:3
    And I heard a loud voice from the throne saying, "Now the dwelling of God is with men, and he will live with them. They will be his people, and God himself will be with them and be their God.

    ~

    Ezekiel in "visions of God" sees a temple reconstructed to receive the glory of the divine presence, a prophetic vision fulfilled in Emmanuel ("God with us"), who tabernacled among men John 1:14. Compare Romans 9:25; Revelation 21:2-3.

    zone.
    Hoi Zone,.

    Well that isn't the question.. what the city is.. it is about the priest-sacrifice that comes back. You have to look at the chapter 40-46.. You can read that the sacrifice are coming back, the Jewish feast are coming back. And the priest from Zadok is coming back. And that made it so interesting.. because in the NT it gave the fulfilment in Jesus.

    So it isn't about the vision..who is Jerusalem or the time.. I hope you understand what I mean..

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    Post Re: sacrifice in the 1000-year of peace?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dutch41 View Post
    Hoi Scotth.

    I understand your way of thinking. But I want to stay at the subject. And I don´t want to discus here about the 1000 year of peace, neither about the replacement theology or rapture or other views.. I know I wrote that, because of my theology view. I want to stay in the Ezekiel 40-46 chapter. So please be free, and gave your opinion about the Ezekiel 40-46.
    I haven't studied Ezekiel 40 through 46 much, so I decline from giving a complete, thoughtful, orthodox answer. I'm sure there is an Orthodox view of these things, but they only thing I have been taught is that Ezekiel 44:1-3 teaches the gate of Mary's womb was forever shut, and that she, the holy Blessed Mother of God, the Theotokos (God-bearer), was and is ever-virgin. She never had a union with St. Joseph, either before the birth of Christ, or after the birth of Christ. She is ever virgin. Matthew 1:25 is better translated and was not knowing her until .... St. Joseph was always not knowing Mary in the flesh. She is the Ark of the New Covenant, a temple virgin totally dedicated and sanctified unto Christ the Word of God; she is the temple that bore the LOGOS of God, the Messiah and Saviour/LORD God Immanuel of all. I have no opinion about Ezekiel or anything else. I don't want to believe in mere opinion. I want to believe the Creed of 381 AD, which is the Creed of the true Gospel of God in Christ, the living tradition of the Church of the living God, the pillar and ground of the truth (1 Tim. 3:15). For more information on Ezekiel 44:1-3, see "Facing Up to Mary", in Gillquist, Peter E. (1992). Becoming Orthodox: A Journey to the Ancient Christian Faith. Revised and expanded edition. Ben Lomond, CA: Conciliar Press. Available for a minimal amount of money on Google at Amazon.com or directly from Conciliar Press in California. God bless you and have mercy on you always because of the love of Christ Jesus Christ; God love you. Lord have mercy on all of us; Amen. In Erie PA Scott Harrington


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    Default Re: sacrifice in the 1000-year of peace?

    Hebrews 10: 10 And by that will, we have been made holy through the sacrifice of the body of Jesus Christ once for all. 11 Day after day every priest stands and performs his religious duties; again and again he offers the same sacrifices, which can never take away sins. 12 But when this priest had offered for all time one sacrifice for sins, he sat down at the right hand of God. 13 Since that time he waits for his enemies to be made his footstool, 14 because by one sacrifice he has made perfect forever those who are being made holy. 15 The Holy Spirit also testifies to us about this. First he says: 16 "This is the covenant I will make with them after that time, says the Lord. I will put my laws in their hearts, and I will write them on their minds." 17 Then he adds: "Their sins and lawless acts I will remember no more." 18 And where these have been forgiven, there is no longer any sacrifice for sin.

    Why do people continue to try and revive the Mosaic covenant which is no more? The old covenant was fulfilled on the cross. It is no longer binding on ANYONE. It has been made abundantly clear that animal sacrifices have no power to save, and are thus useless. Why would anyone want to revive them?

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    Default Re: sacrifice in the 1000-year of peace?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dutch41 View Post
    Before you gave an answer maybe it is good to read Ezekiel 40-46. And when I read this part: there is something interesting because: we can read about the new temple made by God. In Chapter 43 we can read the Shekina is coming back into the temple (vs5).

    Now the interesting part: In Ezek 43:13-- it seems that the Priest offering ( and service) what was kept in the OT is coming back here. (See 44:1-27

    Why is this interesting: because we know that Jesus is the fulfil of the offering. We can see too, that some feasts are coming back too (see chapter 45)

    Well.. when you read this all.. and are thinking about it. What do you think about this?
    Hi Dutch,

    Any description of the animals used for sacrifice when regarding the millennium, is purely symbolic. Animal sacrifice will never be reinstated, Christ ended that practice. For instance, when God mentions bulls being sacrificed, this symbolism reflects the level of sacrifice His people will make, for bulls are counted as a very important sacrifice...it is just symbolism. Seething in pots is symbolic for the people conquering their personal sins within them..we are vessels remember. So always remember...God is concealing His meanings, that is why He speaks this way, and in doing this, it causes seekers to seek and delve deeper and deeper....a sign of love in wanting to know all our Father has written. It is good you are seeking this out...keep up the good fight..

    Regards
    Devolution.





  11. #11
    Dutch41
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    Default Re: sacrifice in the 1000-year of peace?

    Quote Originally Posted by Scotth1960 View Post
    I haven't studied Ezekiel 40 through 46 much, so I decline from giving a complete, thoughtful, orthodox answer. I'm sure there is an Orthodox view of these things, but they only thing I have been taught is that Ezekiel 44:1-3 teaches the gate of Mary's womb was forever shut, and that she, the holy Blessed Mother of God, the Theotokos (God-bearer), was and is ever-virgin. She never had a union with St. Joseph, either before the birth of Christ, or after the birth of Christ. She is ever virgin. Matthew 1:25 is better translated and was not knowing her until .... St. Joseph was always not knowing Mary in the flesh. She is the Ark of the New Covenant, a temple virgin totally dedicated and sanctified unto Christ the Word of God; she is the temple that bore the LOGOS of God, the Messiah and Saviour/LORD God Immanuel of all. I have no opinion about Ezekiel or anything else. I don't want to believe in mere opinion. I want to believe the Creed of 381 AD, which is the Creed of the true Gospel of God in Christ, the living tradition of the Church of the living God, the pillar and ground of the truth (1 Tim. 3:15). For more information on Ezekiel 44:1-3, see "Facing Up to Mary", in Gillquist, Peter E. (1992). Becoming Orthodox: A Journey to the Ancient Christian Faith. Revised and expanded edition. Ben Lomond, CA: Conciliar Press. Available for a minimal amount of money on Google at Amazon.com or directly from Conciliar Press in California. God bless you and have mercy on you always because of the love of Christ Jesus Christ; God love you. Lord have mercy on all of us; Amen. In Erie PA Scott Harrington

    Scotth.. maybe you can open a new posting with the tittle Ezek 44:1-3 Marias womb..
    But I want to stay at the subject. I hope you don't mind.

  12. #12
    Dutch41
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    Default Re: sacrifice in the 1000-year of peace?

    Quote Originally Posted by wakeup View Post
    hi dutch41 hoe gaat het met jou?
    very interesting question ,regarding all these measurements, it realy bogles my
    mind, but what i understand that ezekiel was still in captivity in babylon.
    ch.40:1 he was in the 25th yr of captivity so he still has 50 yrs to go because the
    total captivity is 70yrs. so what god is showing ezekiel in vision,was the temple that is
    going to be rebuild. and its build by zerubabel( born in babel ).now all those
    sacrifices that is mentioned in the vision god gave ezekiel is when that temple was
    rebuild and destroyed by the romans in 70 ad. those sacrifices were not perfect
    to god ,and he is very angry, and thats why it was destroyed in70 ad. by the romans.
    so that was not at all a vision of the kingdom, for there will be no more animal
    sacrifices in the kingdom , only spiritual sacrifices. we true christians we do
    sacrifices everyday, by not doing the bad thing, we dont steal even if we have the
    chance to steal, we dont commit adultery even if we have the chance to.
    these are the sacrifices god loves, not animals for all animals belong to god.
    i hope this is of some help to you. tot kijk. trying very hard. long time no speak dutch.

    wakeup.
    Het gaat goed, dank je (Everything is OK, thanks) Yes it is an interesting question...And I am thinking and reading now about it. I will share some reading later..

  13. #13
    Dutch41
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    Default Re: sacrifice in the 1000-year of peace?

    Quote Originally Posted by superdave5221 View Post
    Hebrews 10: 10 And by that will, we have been made holy through the sacrifice of the body of Jesus Christ once for all. 11 Day after day every priest stands and performs his religious duties; again and again he offers the same sacrifices, which can never take away sins. 12 But when this priest had offered for all time one sacrifice for sins, he sat down at the right hand of God. 13 Since that time he waits for his enemies to be made his footstool, 14 because by one sacrifice he has made perfect forever those who are being made holy. 15 The Holy Spirit also testifies to us about this. First he says: 16 "This is the covenant I will make with them after that time, says the Lord. I will put my laws in their hearts, and I will write them on their minds." 17 Then he adds: "Their sins and lawless acts I will remember no more." 18 And where these have been forgiven, there is no longer any sacrifice for sin.

    Why do people continue to try and revive the Mosaic covenant which is no more? The old covenant was fulfilled on the cross. It is no longer binding on ANYONE. It has been made abundantly clear that animal sacrifices have no power to save, and are thus useless. Why would anyone want to revive them?
    Well that is the question.... And I know there are some views about it. But it still is a difficult question..

  14. #14
    Dutch41
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    Default Re: sacrifice in the 1000-year of peace?

    Quote Originally Posted by Devolution View Post
    Hi Dutch,

    Any description of the animals used for sacrifice when regarding the millennium, is purely symbolic. Animal sacrifice will never be reinstated, Christ ended that practice. For instance, when God mentions bulls being sacrificed, this symbolism reflects the level of sacrifice His people will make, for bulls are counted as a very important sacrifice...it is just symbolism. Seething in pots is symbolic for the people conquering their personal sins within them..we are vessels remember. So always remember...God is concealing His meanings, that is why He speaks this way, and in doing this, it causes seekers to seek and delve deeper and deeper....a sign of love in wanting to know all our Father has written. It is good you are seeking this out...keep up the good fight..

    Regards
    Devolution.
    Well, what you said is an option. I thought about that too. But, when we read it as an symbolic.. than we can say Ezekiel saw everything symbolic. Normal when there is some symbole and only used as a symbole.. it will be explained.

    Interesting is the part from Ezekiel 43:

    In Ezekiel 11:22-25, we can read that the Shekinah moved from the temple. The glory of the Lord departs left the temple. (the temple was in the midst of the city) and it moved to the mountain at the east of the city. That is Mt Olive.

    Ezekiel 43 starts with that the Sekinah came from the east. Than this is written:
    Quote Originally Posted by Ezekiel 43:4-7
    4 And the glory of the LORD came into the house by the way of the gate whose prospect is toward the east.
    5 So the Spirit took me up and brought me into the inner court; and behold, the glory of the LORD filled the house.
    6 And I heard Him speaking unto me out of the house; and the man stood by me.
    7 ¶ And He said unto me, "Son of man, the place of My throne and the place of the soles of My feet, where I will dwell in the midst of the children of Israel for ever, and My holy name, shall the house of Israel no more defile, neither they nor their kings, by their whoredom nor by the carcasses of their kings in their high places.
    Here the Lord isn't talking about symbolic. But He is talking about the place where He lives. Where His throne is. It is the describtion of the House of the Lord.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ezek 43:12-13
    12 This is the law of the house: Upon the top of the mountain the whole limit thereof round about shall be most holy. Behold, this is the law of the house.
    13 ¶ "And these are the measurements of the altar in cubits (the cubit is a cubit and a handbreadth): even the bottom shall be a cubit and the breadth a cubit, and the border thereof by the edge thereof round about shall be a span; and this shall be the higher place of the altar.
    Ezekiel have to write to the Israelites 10-11 about the laws of the house and he have to bring the message of, the form, the design of the house and the law of the house..

    So the message is clear:

    Some thoughts about this part Ezekiel 43:6-46:18:
    Quote Originally Posted by "ESV-studybible"[I
    regullations for Renewed Israel:[/I]]
    The Messianic Jewish teacher David Stern said that it could be a remembering to the offering at the Cross.(Stern 19:99:704)

    The Dutch Theologian prof. dr. W.J. Ouweneel noted:
    Peter and John went to the temple at the 9th hour of pray. That means the during the evening praying (Act 3:1) And long as the tempel there was, the Messianic Jews in the OT where a part of the offering. Paul participate wiht the ritual cleaning and the offering that had to be done when he did the nazirite oath. After the fall of Jerusalem the sacrifise stopped. And when the 3th temple will rebuild the offering will start again. And this prophet (Ezekiel) tells us that in Jerusalem will be offering again in the Temple of the Lord(How love I thy Law: 143)
    The reform Dutch Studybible said[ quote] It is difficult to read the vision only symbolic, like the old churchfathers read it. This as an image to the new convenant. Because there are some elements that doesn't fit in that theory: Like the circumcision from the flesh next to the circumcision from the hart. We can see that in the future the government of God and the templeservice will be more united (Reformstudybible:1076)[/quote]

    So this are some views: But I am really curious about more..

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    Default Re: sacrifice in the 1000-year of peace?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dutch41 View Post
    Hoi Zone,.

    Well that isn't the question.. what the city is.. it is about the priest-sacrifice that comes back. You have to look at the chapter 40-46.. You can read that the sacrifice are coming back, the Jewish feast are coming back. And the priest from Zadok is coming back. And that made it so interesting.. because in the NT it gave the fulfilment in Jesus.

    So it isn't about the vision..who is Jerusalem or the time.. I hope you understand what I mean..
    hi dutch.
    ezekiel saw the New Things from far off.

    it really does come down to THE CITY, and as you said, that in The New Testament the fulfillment is in JESUS.

    Hebrews 10
    Christ’s Sacrifice Once for All
    1For since the law has but a shadow of the good things to come instead of the true form of these realities, it can never, by the same sacrifices that are continually offered every year, make perfect those who draw near. 2Otherwise, would they not have ceased to be offered, since the worshipers, having once been cleansed, would no longer have any consciousness of sins? 3But in these sacrifices there is a reminder of sins every year. 4For it is impossible for the blood of bulls and goats to take away sins.

    5Consequently, when Christa came into the world, he said,
    “Sacrifices and offerings you have not desired,
    but a body have you prepared for me;
    6 in burnt offerings and sin offerings
    you have taken no pleasure.
    7 Then I said, ‘Behold, I have come to do your will, O God,
    as it is written of me in the scroll of the book.’”

    8 When he said above, “You have neither desired nor taken pleasure in sacrifices and offerings and burnt offerings and sin offerings” (these are offered according to the law), 9 then he added, “Behold, I have come to do your will.” He does away with the first in order to establish the second. 10And by that will we have been sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all.

    11 And every priest stands daily at his service, offering repeatedly the same sacrifices, which can never take away sins. 12 But when Christb had offered for all time a single sacrifice for sins, he sat down at the right hand of God, 13 waiting from that time until his enemies should be made a footstool for his feet. 14 For by a single offering he has perfected for all time those who are being sanctified.

    15 And the Holy Spirit also bears witness to us; for after saying,
    16 “This is the covenant that I will make with them
    after those days, declares the Lord:
    I will put my laws on their hearts,
    and write them on their minds,”
    17 then he adds,
    “I will remember their sins and their lawless deeds no more.”
    18 Where there is forgiveness of these, there is no longer any offering for sin.

    ~ see if the writer to The Hebrews (who should have told them there would be renewed animals sacrifces if that's what God's Plan was) has to say about THE NEW Covenant...which is NOT Moses:

    The Full Assurance of Faith
    19 Therefore, brothers,c since we have confidence to enter the holy places by the blood of Jesus, 20 by the new and living way that he opened for us through the curtain, that is, through his flesh, 21 and since we have a great priest over the house of God, 22 let us draw near with a true heart in full assurance of faith, with our hearts sprinkled clean from an evil conscience and our bodies washed with pure water. 23 Let us hold fast the confession of our hope without wavering, for he who promised is faithful. 24 And let us consider how to stir up one another to love and good works, 25 not neglecting to meet together, as is the habit of some, but encouraging one another, and all the more as you see the Day drawing near.
    26 For if we go on sinning deliberately after receiving the knowledge of the truth, there no longer remains a sacrifice for sins, 27 but a fearful expectation of judgment, and a fury of fire that will consume the adversaries. 28 Anyone who has set aside the law of Moses dies without mercy on the evidence of two or three witnesses. 29 How much worse punishment, do you think, will be deserved by the one who has spurned the Son of God, and has profaned the blood of the covenant by which he was sanctified, and has outraged the Spirit of grace? 30 For we know him who said, “Vengeance is mine; I will repay.” And again, “The Lord will judge his people.” 31 It is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God.

    32 But recall the former days when, after you were enlightened, you endured a hard struggle with sufferings, 33 sometimes being publicly exposed to reproach and affliction, and sometimes being partners with those so treated. 34 For you had compassion on those in prison, and you joyfully accepted the plundering of your property, since you knew that you yourselves had a better possession and an abiding one. 35 Therefore do not throw away your confidence, which has a great reward. 36 For you have need of endurance, so that when you have done the will of God you may receive what is promised. 37For,

    “Yet a little while,
    and the coming one will come and will not delay;
    38 but my righteous one shall live by faith,
    and if he shrinks back,
    my soul has no pleasure in him.”
    39 But we are not of those who shrink back and are destroyed, but of those who have faith and preserve their souls.

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    Default Re: sacrifice in the 1000-year of peace?

    Quote Originally Posted by superdave5221 View Post
    Why do people continue to try and revive the Mosaic covenant which is no more? The old covenant was fulfilled on the cross. It is no longer binding on ANYONE. It has been made abundantly clear that animal sacrifices have no power to save, and are thus useless. Why would anyone want to revive them?

    hi Superdave!



    there's a glaring answer to that question...happening as we speak.

    we are to believe Jesus has NOT fulfilled all Righteousness, that there IS to be a revival in Law Keeping (Moses), and since we've not looked for the Leaven of The Pharisees, its not even Moses we're being presented with.

    of course, if you believe in a pretrib rapture, you also believe there are Two Covenants in effect, which means.....well......

    Galatians 5:4
    You are severed from Christ, you who would be justified by the law; you have fallen away from grace.

  17. #17
    Dutch41
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    Default Re: sacrifice in the 1000-year of peace?

    Quote Originally Posted by zone View Post
    hi dutch.
    ezekiel saw the New Things from far off.

    it really does come down to THE CITY, and as you said, that in The New Testament the fulfillment is in JESUS.

    Hebrews 10
    Christ’s Sacrifice Once for All
    1For since the law has but a shadow of the good things to come instead of the true form of these realities, it can never, by the same sacrifices that are continually offered every year, make perfect those who draw near. 2Otherwise, would they not have ceased to be offered, since the worshipers, having once been cleansed, would no longer have any consciousness of sins? 3But in these sacrifices there is a reminder of sins every year. 4For it is impossible for the blood of bulls and goats to take away sins.

    5Consequently, when Christa came into the world, he said,
    “Sacrifices and offerings you have not desired,
    but a body have you prepared for me;
    6 in burnt offerings and sin offerings
    you have taken no pleasure.
    7 Then I said, ‘Behold, I have come to do your will, O God,
    as it is written of me in the scroll of the book.’”

    8 When he said above, “You have neither desired nor taken pleasure in sacrifices and offerings and burnt offerings and sin offerings” (these are offered according to the law), 9 then he added, “Behold, I have come to do your will.” He does away with the first in order to establish the second. 10And by that will we have been sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all.

    11 And every priest stands daily at his service, offering repeatedly the same sacrifices, which can never take away sins. 12 But when Christb had offered for all time a single sacrifice for sins, he sat down at the right hand of God, 13 waiting from that time until his enemies should be made a footstool for his feet. 14 For by a single offering he has perfected for all time those who are being sanctified.

    15 And the Holy Spirit also bears witness to us; for after saying,
    16 “This is the covenant that I will make with them
    after those days, declares the Lord:
    I will put my laws on their hearts,
    and write them on their minds,”
    17 then he adds,
    “I will remember their sins and their lawless deeds no more.”
    18 Where there is forgiveness of these, there is no longer any offering for sin.

    ~ see if the writer to The Hebrews (who should have told them there would be renewed animals sacrifces if that's what God's Plan was) has to say about THE NEW Covenant...which is NOT Moses:

    The Full Assurance of Faith
    19 Therefore, brothers,c since we have confidence to enter the holy places by the blood of Jesus, 20 by the new and living way that he opened for us through the curtain, that is, through his flesh, 21 and since we have a great priest over the house of God, 22 let us draw near with a true heart in full assurance of faith, with our hearts sprinkled clean from an evil conscience and our bodies washed with pure water. 23 Let us hold fast the confession of our hope without wavering, for he who promised is faithful. 24 And let us consider how to stir up one another to love and good works, 25 not neglecting to meet together, as is the habit of some, but encouraging one another, and all the more as you see the Day drawing near.
    26 For if we go on sinning deliberately after receiving the knowledge of the truth, there no longer remains a sacrifice for sins, 27 but a fearful expectation of judgment, and a fury of fire that will consume the adversaries. 28 Anyone who has set aside the law of Moses dies without mercy on the evidence of two or three witnesses. 29 How much worse punishment, do you think, will be deserved by the one who has spurned the Son of God, and has profaned the blood of the covenant by which he was sanctified, and has outraged the Spirit of grace? 30 For we know him who said, “Vengeance is mine; I will repay.” And again, “The Lord will judge his people.” 31 It is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God.

    32 But recall the former days when, after you were enlightened, you endured a hard struggle with sufferings, 33 sometimes being publicly exposed to reproach and affliction, and sometimes being partners with those so treated. 34 For you had compassion on those in prison, and you joyfully accepted the plundering of your property, since you knew that you yourselves had a better possession and an abiding one. 35 Therefore do not throw away your confidence, which has a great reward. 36 For you have need of endurance, so that when you have done the will of God you may receive what is promised. 37For,

    “Yet a little while,
    and the coming one will come and will not delay;
    38 but my righteous one shall live by faith,
    and if he shrinks back,
    my soul has no pleasure in him.”
    39 But we are not of those who shrink back and are destroyed, but of those who have faith and preserve their souls.
    Hoi Zone,

    No, I don't agree with you, that Ezekiel saw it far of.. Like it was with John, the spirit took him to the place and He saw it very detailed. He was walking trough the city of Jerusalem. He knows the size of the altar. (Ezekiel 43:13) It isn't like a normal prophesy.. .. Ezekiel was there.. Ezekiel 43:5 said
    5 So the Spirit took me up and brought me into the inner court; and behold, the glory of the LORD filled the house.

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    Default Re: sacrifice in the 1000-year of peace?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dutch41 View Post
    Hoi Zone,

    No, I don't agree with you, that Ezekiel saw it far of.. Like it was with John, the spirit took him to the place and He saw it very detailed. He was walking trough the city of Jerusalem. He knows the size of the altar. (Ezekiel 43:13) It isn't like a normal prophesy.. .. Ezekiel was there.. Ezekiel 43:5 said
    5 So the Spirit took me up and brought me into the inner court; and behold, the glory of the LORD filled the house.
    hi dutch.
    okay...so which temple could it be that ezekiel saw?
    zone

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    Default Re: sacrifice in the 1000-year of peace?

    Land, Seed, and Blessing in the Abrahamic Covenant

    Conclusion
    The interpretation of the Abrahamic covenant which sees the promises necessitating the possession of physical Palestine by ethnic Jews fails to do justice to the spiritual understanding of the promises that Abraham himself had. As Christ told the Jews of his day, “Your father Abraham rejoiced to see My day, and He saw and was glad” (John 8:56).

    Abraham looked beyond the merely physical and placed his hope in the coming Messiah, and in God who would raise him from the dead. This assessment is borne out by a careful study of Abraham’s life. And that this understanding that Abraham had of the promise is essentially correct is made clear by New Testament teaching on the topic.

    Any interpretation of the Abrahamic covenant that misunderstands the scriptural teaching of what the promises signified, to whom they were made, and who could claim them as Abraham’s true children and heirs is not only wrong, but positively harmful.

    An interpretation that insists on claiming physical benefits for Israel on the basis of their ethnicity obscures the vast spiritual riches of the Abrahamic promises as fulfilled to Christ and to us who are in Christ; it minimizes the place of Christ as the one true Seed of Abraham and the one in whom are all promised blessings; and it conditions us to be looking for a crassly physical, not to mention false, eschatological hope in the coming of an ethnically Jewish millennial kingdom, instead of understanding and awaiting that blessed hope of all redemptive history, the great proclamation, “Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and He will dwell with them, and they will be His people, and God Himself will be with them and be their God” (Rev. 21:3).

    This is the hope of Abraham and all his true children, and the goal of all redemptive history.

    Psalm 45 Publications Land, Seed, and Blessing in the Abrahamic Covenant

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    Post Re: sacrifice in the 1000-year of peace?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dutch41 View Post
    Scotth.. maybe you can open a new posting with the tittle Ezek 44:1-3 Marias womb..
    But I want to stay at the subject. I hope you don't mind.
    I would think all of the OT prophecies of an earthly Jerusalem from Zion are viewed as SYMBOLIC by the Orthodox Church. The real Zion is the Heavenly Zion, NEW JERUSALEM. These prophecies won't be fulfilled in the present earthly Zion from sinful, earthly Jerusalem. After all, earthly Zion crucified and rejected Jesus Christ. The new Zion is the Orthodox Church, and the real Zion is NOT OF THIS WORLD. CHRIST'S KINGDOM IS NOT OF THIS WORLD. Is not of earthly JERUSALEM. But is OF THE NEW JERUSALEM. That is the real meaning of Ezekiel 40 through 48. Take it allegorically and figuratively and symbolically, not literal referring to present day Jerusalem. Take care.

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