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Thread: COVENANT AND THE UNITY OF SCRIPTURE

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    Default COVENANT AND THE UNITY OF SCRIPTURE

    Quote Originally Posted by Devolution View Post
    ERROR...there is NO covenant theological model in the bible.
    AT LAST !!! ...THE MEN FOLLOWED AND PROMOTED BY A CERTAIN SOMEONE....found.

    These are not my words, i have minimal knowledge of this group/theory....so far.

    I have merely come across one argument against covenant theology. But within are points to help us understand the workings of this THEORY that has NO biblical authority whatsoever. Now i have found the MEN pushing this unbiblical THEORY....i suggest we all become acquainted with this dangerous doctrine of men that denies 3/4 of scripture....SIMPLE indeed....3/4 of scripture ignored...no wonder its simple !!!!

    THE SUPPOSED TWO COVENANTS OF COVENANT THEOLOGY
    "Little reference has been made so far to the essential error of Covenant Theology. It may be mentioned at this point only as it bears on human responsibility before God. The theological terms, Covenant of Works and Covenant of Grace, do not occur in Scripture. If they are to be sustained it must be wholly apart from Biblical authority.
    What is known as Covenant Theology builds its structure on these two covenants and is, at least, a recognition - though inadequate - of the truth that the creature has responsibility toward his Creator. Covenant Theology has Cocceius (1603-1669) as its chief exponent. "He taught that before the Fall, as much as after it, the relation between God and man was a covenant. The first was a ‘Covenant of Works.’ For this was substituted, after the Fall, the ‘Covenant of Grace’, to fulfil which the coming of Jesus Christ was necessary" (Encyclopedia Britannica, 14th ed., V, 938). (IV, 156)



    COVENANT THEOLOGY - A HUMAN INVENTION
    "Upon this human invention of two covenants Reformed Theology has largely been constructed. It sees the empirical truth that God can forgive sinners only by that freedom which is secured by the sacrifice of His Son - anticipated in the old order and realized in the new - but that theology utterly fails to discern the purposes for the ages; the varying relationships to God of the Jews, the Gentiles, and the Church, with the distinctive, consistent human obligations which arise directly and unavoidably from the nature of each specific relationship to God." (IV, 156)


    COVENANT THEOLOGY - A LIMITED UNDERSTANDING
    "A theology which penetrates no further into Scripture than to discover that in all ages God is immutable in His grace toward penitent sinners, and constructs the idea of a universal Church continuing through the ages, on the one truth of immutable grace, is not only disregarding vast spheres of revelation but is reaping the unavoidable confusion and misdirection which part-truth engenders. The outworking of divine grace is not standardized, though the Covenant idea of theology would make it so; and as certainly as God's dealings with man are not standardized, in the same manner the entire field of the corresponding human obligation in daily life is not run into a mold of human idealism." (IV, 156-157)



    COVENANT THEOLOGY IGNORES JUDAISTIC THEOLOGY
    "Judaism has its field of theology with its soteriology and its eschatology. That these factors of a system which occupies three-fourths of the Sacred Text are unrecognized and ignored by theologians does not demonstrate their nonexistence, nor does it prove their unimportance. A Covenant Theology engenders the notion that there is but one soteriology and one eschatology, and that ecclesiology, such as it is conceived to be, extends from the Garden of Eden to the Great White Throne. The insuperable problems in exegesis which such fanciful suppositions create are easily disposed of by ignoring them." (IV, 248)


    COVENANT THEOLOGY - BOUND BY TRADITIONS
    "On the other hand, Scripture is harmonized and its message clarified when two divinely appointed systems - Judaism and Christianity - are recognized, and their complete and distinctive characters are observed. No matter how orthodox they may be in matters of inspiration, the Deity of Christ, His virgin birth, and the efficacy of His death, Covenant theologians have not been forward in Bible exposition. This great field of service has been and is now occupied by those who distinguish things which differ, who, though giving close attention to all that has been written, are bound by no theological traditions whatever." (IV, 248)



    COVENANT THEOLOGY FAILS TO DISTINGUISH THE CHURCH AND ISRAEL
    "Israel has never been the Church, is not the Church, nor will she ever be the Church. A form of Covenant Theology which would thread all of Jehovah's purposes and undertakings upon His one attribute of grace could hardly avoid confusion of mind in matters related to His varied objectives. Covenant Theology, in consistency with its man-made premise, asserts its inventions respecting an Old Testament Church, which, it is claimed, is an integral part of the New Testament Church and on the ground that, since God's grace is one unchanging attribute, its accomplishments must be the realization of one standard ideal. The Covenant theory does retain Israel as such to the time of Christ's death. The Church is thought to be a spiritual remnant within Israel to whom all Old Testament blessings are granted, and the nation as such is allowed to inherit the cursings." (IV, 311)
    "The fact that the Bible recognizes an Israel within the nation itself - sometimes termed the remnant - has been seized upon by Covenant theologians as a ground for their contention that the Church is the true Israel of the Old Testament. The true text hardly sustains this idea." (IV, 312)
    "The introduction of an age as an intercalation into the midst of the predicted ongoing Jewish and Gentile programs, and the new heavenly purpose which characterizes this age, cannot be made to conform to a supposed single covenant. Thus it is seen how, to maintain the basic idea of a Covenant theology, much that is vital in the whole divine purpose must be renounced and excluded in the interest of that which at best is only a theory; and among the neglected truths is the resurrection of the Lord Jesus Christ." (V, 233-234)


    COVENANT THEOLOGY FAILS TO SEE THE SIGNIFICANCE OF THE RESURRECTION
    "As traced by the so-called Covenant theologians, the death of Christ is given a place of large significance but His resurrection is accounted as little more than something for His own personal convenience, His necessary return from the sphere of death back to the place which He occupied before. In other words, as viewed by Covenant theologians, there is practically no doctrinal significance to Christ's resurrection.
    That Christ by resurrection became what in Himself He had not been before - the federal Head of a wholly new order of beings and these the primary divine objective, as this is set forth in the New Testament - cannot be incorporated into a system of which the cherished and distinctive feature is one unchangeable divine purpose from Adam to the end of time." (V, 231)
    "If as has been said Covenant Theology ignores the doctrinal aspects of the resurrection of Christ, it is due to the fact that according to that idealism the Church is not a new creation with its headship in the ascended Christ, but has existed under a supposed uniform covenant from the beginning of human history. Thus for that system the great reality of a heavenly purpose peculiar to this dispensation is ruled out completely.
    The doctrinal aspects of Christ's ascension and present ministry in heaven mean but little to those who are committed to the theory of an unchanging covenant. According to this assumption, the Church obtained without a headship in heaven, even before Christ came; therefore, the inauguration of that headship as something sprung out of His resurrection could not be of any great moment.
    The Covenant theory cannot be broadened to allow for Christ's new priesthood in heaven, nor for His immeasurable ministry as Advocate, and for the same reason. Therefore, all this incalculable truth is not included in their system by Covenant theologians." (V, 232-233)
    "However, in spite of an almost universal influence of the Covenant theory upon theological thought, the resurrection of Christ is, when seen in its true Biblical setting, properly recognized as the very ground of all the purpose of this age and the basis upon which the new positions and possessions of those in Christ are made to rest. There is a wide doctrinal difference between those who see no special consequence in Christ's resurrection and those who see its momentous significance." (V, 234)



    COVENANT THEOLOGY FAILS TO RECOGNIZE THE MINISTRIES OF THE SPIRIT
    "The advent of the Spirit into the world and His residence in the world cannot be made to conform doctrinally to an unchangeable covenant-theory. Wherever this theory is stressed, there must go along with it a neglect of the most vital truths respecting the present age-characterizing ministries of the Spirit. The same reason may be assigned for this neglect, namely, that if the Church existed and progressed in Old Testament times apart from these ministries of the Spirit, they cannot be of vital import in the present dispensation.
    The disannulling of all Jewish purposes and distinctive features for an age renders a continuous-covenant conception objectionable. The Old Testament history leads on to its consummation in a glorious earthly kingdom in which the elect nation, Israel , will realize her covenants as promises fulfilled. It is, therefore, disruptive to a one-covenant theory to the last degree that a situation should be set up as it has been in this age in which it is said respecting Jew and Gentile that "there is no difference" (Rom. 3:9; 10:12)." (V, 233)



    COVENANT THEOLOGY - THE CRITICAL ERROR FOR THE CHRISTIAN’S RULE OF LIFE
    "Covenantism, which has molded the major theological concepts for many generations, recognizes no distinction as to ages, therefore can allow for no distinctions between law and grace. This dominating attitude of Covenantism must account for the utter neglect of life-truth in all their works of theology.
    No more representative theological dictum from the Covenant viewpoint has been formed than the Westminster Confession of Faith, which valuable and important document recognizes life truth only to the point of imposing the Ten Commandments on Christians as their sole obligation, and in spite of the teachings of the New Testament which assert that the law was never given to Gentiles or Christians, and that the latter has been saved and delivered from it (cf. John 1:16-17; Acts 15:23-29; Rom. 6:14; 7:1-6; 2 Cor. 3:11, 13; Gal. 3:23-25).
    Let it be restated that the Holy Spirit can be depended upon to enable the believer only as the believer’s life and effort are conformed to God’s will and plan for him in this age." (VI, 167)




    COVENANT THEOLOGY SPIRITUALIZES CHRIST’S RETURN
    "A phenomenon exists, namely, that men who are conscientious and meticulous to observe the exact teaching of the Scripture in the fields of inspiration and the divine character of the Sacred Text, the ruin of the race through Adam's sin, the Deity and Saviourhood of Christ, are found introducing methods of spiritualizing and vamping the clear declarations of the Bible in the one field of Eschatology.
    So much has this tendency prevailed in the past two or three centuries that, as respecting theologians, they are almost wholly of this bold class. So great an effect calls for an adequate cause, and the cause is not difficult to identify. When one is bound to a man-made covenant theory there is no room within that assumption for a restoration of Israel, that nation with all her earthly covenants and glory having been merged into the Church. There is but one logical consummation - that advanced by Whitby with all its reckless disregard for the Biblical testimony, namely, that a hypothetical grace covenant will eventuate in a transformed social order, and not by the power of the returning Messiah but by the preaching of the gospel.
    In the present time there are those who, misapprehending the prediction that the gospel of the kingdom must be preached in all the world (Matt. 24:14), assert that Christ cannot return until the missionary enterprise has reached to all the inhabited earth, not recognizing that the passage in question is found in a context belonging to the future great tribulation, and that because of the unending cycle of birth and death there could not be a set time in this age when the missionary enterprise would be complete." (V, 282)



    COVENANT THEOLOGY FAILS TO RECOGNIZE THE CHARACTER OF THE MILLENNIAL KINGDOM
    "Though the kingdom occupies so large a place in the Sacred Text, the theme of the kingdom has been more misunderstood and its terminology more misapplied than any other one subject in the Bible. This is directly due to the failure, so inherent and far-reaching in Covenant Theology, to recognize the dispensational aspect of divine revelation. Truth respecting the Messianic expectation as that is set forth in the Old Testament does not imply that the kingdom is the Church, nor does the New Testament, with its objectives centered in heaven, teach that the Church is the kingdom.
    Similarly, the earthly kingdom that according to the Scriptures had its origin in the covenant made to David, which is mundane and literal in its original form, and equally as mundane and literal in uncounted references to it in all subsequent Scriptures which trace it on to its consummation, is by theological legerdemain metamorphosed into a spiritual monstrosity in which an absent King seated on His Father's throne in heaven is accepted in lieu of the theocratic monarch of David's line seated on David's throne in Jerusalem.
    Again, through careless inattention many modern writers refer to the kingdom of heaven as though it were heaven, and is spit of the absurdities and contradictions which arise when these terms are thus confused." (V, 315)



    A DISTINCTION BETWEEN THE KINGDOM GOSPEL AND THE GOSPEL OF GRACE
    "Strong objection is offered by Covenant theologians to a distinction between the gospel of the kingdom as preached by John the Baptist, Jesus, and the Disciples, and the Pauline gospel of the grace of God. One of them states that to make such a distinction is unfortunate, and dangerous.
    He with others contends that the kingdom gospel is identical with the gospel of divine Grace. Here nevertheless will arise an absurdity which does not deter this type of theologian, namely, that men could preach the grace gospel based as it is on the death and resurrection of the Lord Jesus Christ when they did not believe Christ would die or be raised again (Luke 18:31-34)." (VII, 176)



    Tsk,tsk,tsk. Now i can learn about a certain persons beliefs, which does not come from personal searching in spirit and truth, but from a made up theory devised by men.
    .....................

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    Default Re: COVENANT AND THE UNITY OF SCRIPTURE

    SOME DISPENSATIONAL PROPONENTS:

    Proponents:
    Craig Blaising
    Darrell Bock
    John Nelson Darby
    John Feinberg
    John Hagee
    Ed Hindson
    Carl Hock
    David Hocking
    Dave Hunt
    Thomas Ice
    Harry Ironside
    Tim LaHaye
    David Larsen
    Hal Lindsey
    John MacArthur
    Chuck Missler
    J. Dwight Pentecost
    Charles Ryrie
    Robert Saucy
    C. I. Scofield
    Henry Thiessen
    Robert Thomas
    Jeffrey Townsend
    Jack Van Impe
    Michael Vlach
    John Walvoord
    Kenneth Wuest

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    Default Re: COVENANT AND THE UNITY OF SCRIPTURE

    Covenant Theology vs. Dispensational Theology

    The following are the major differences between these two systems of theology. They represent the mainstreams of both systems, though there are variations in each.



    DISPENSATIONAL THEOLOGY


    (Lewis S. Chafer, John Walvoord, Tim LaHaye, John Nelson Darby, C.I. Scofield)



    COVENANT THEOLOGY

    (Charles Hodge, Loraine Boettner, Louis Berkhof, John Murray, B.B. Warfield)




    * inaccuracies on both sides (i.e.: Reformers are not all calvinists). i'm not 100% on the right side of all points on this chart, but assuredly not on the disensational side.
    i doubt, as well, most who hold to dispensationalism actually believe DAVID will rule on the earth (though that's what's in the original dogma)
    Last edited by zone; March 12th, 2011 at 02:26 PM.

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    Default Re: COVENANT AND THE UNITY OF SCRIPTURE

    The standard description of covenant theology views the history of God's dealings with mankind in all of history, from Creation to Fall to Redemption to Consummation, under the framework of three overarching theological covenants — the covenants of redemption, of works, and of grace.

    These three covenants are called theological because they are not explicitly presented as such in the Bible but are thought to be theologically implicit, describing and summarizing the wealth of Scriptural data. Within historical Reformed Christian systems of thought, covenant theology is not merely treated as a point of doctrine, neither is it treated as a central dogma. Rather, Covenant is viewed as the structure by which the biblical text organizes itself.

    As a framework for biblical interpretation, covenant theology stands in contrast to dispensationalism in regard to the relationship between the Old Covenant with national Israel and the New Covenant in Christ's blood. That such a framework exists appears to be, at least, feasible since, from the earliest time of the Church, the Jewish Bible has been known as the Old Testament (or Covenant) in contrast to the Christian addition which has been known as the New Testament (or Covenant). Regarding the theological status of modern day Jewish people, covenant theology is often referred to as "supersessionism," or "replacement theology" by its detractors, due to the perception that it teaches that God has abandoned the promises made to the Jews and Jewish proselytes and has replaced the Jews with Christians as his chosen people in the earth.

    Covenant theologians deny that God has abandoned his promises to Israel, but see the fulfillment of the promises to Israel in the person and the work of the Messiah, Jesus of Nazareth, who established the church in organic continuity with Israel, not a separate replacement entity.

    Covenant theology is a prominent feature in Protestant theology, especially in churches holding a Calvinist view of theology such as the Reformed churches and Presbyterian churches, Reformed Baptist churches, and, in different forms, some Methodist churches.

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    Default Re: COVENANT AND THE UNITY OF SCRIPTURE

    Quote Originally Posted by Devolution View Post
    COVENANT THEOLOGY FAILS TO DISTINGUISH THE CHURCH AND ISRAEL

    "Israel has never been the Church, is not the Church, nor will she ever be the Church.....

    . . . . "The introduction of an age as an intercalation into the midst of the predicted ongoing Jewish and Gentile programs, and the new heavenly purpose which characterizes this age, cannot be made to conform to a supposed single covenant.
    Acts 11
    Peter Reports to the Church
    1Now the apostles and the brothersa who were throughout Judea heard that the Gentiles also had received the word of God. 2So when Peter went up to Jerusalem, the circumcision party criticized him, saying, 3“You went to uncircumcised men and ate with them.” 4But Peter began and explained it to them in order: 5“I was in the city of Joppa praying, and in a trance I saw a vision, something like a great sheet descending, being let down from heaven by its four corners, and it came down to me. 6Looking at it closely, I observed animals and beasts of prey and reptiles and birds of the air. 7And I heard a voice saying to me, ‘Rise, Peter; kill and eat.’ 8But I said, ‘By no means, Lord; for nothing common or unclean has ever entered my mouth.’ 9But the voice answered a second time from heaven, ‘What God has made clean, do not call common.’ 10This happened three times, and all was drawn up again into heaven. 11And behold, at that very moment three men arrived at the house in which we were, sent to me from Caesarea. 12And the Spirit told me to go with them, making no distinction. These six brothers also accompanied me, and we entered the man’s house. 13And he told us how he had seen the angel stand in his house and say, ‘Send to Joppa and bring Simon who is called Peter; 14he will declare to you a message by which you will be saved, you and all your household.’ 15As I began to speak, the Holy Spirit fell on them just as on us at the beginning. 16And I remembered the word of the Lord, how he said, ‘John baptized with water, but you will be baptized with the Holy Spirit.’ 17If then God gave the same gift to them as he gave to us when we believed in the Lord Jesus Christ, who was I that I could stand in God’s way?” 18When they heard these things they fell silent. And they glorified God, saying, “Then to the Gentiles also God has granted repentance that leads to life.”

    The Church in Antioch
    19Now those who were scattered because of the persecution that arose over Stephen traveled as far as Phoenicia and Cyprus and Antioch, speaking the word to no one except Jews. 20But there were some of them, men of Cyprus and Cyrene, who on coming to Antioch spoke to the Hellenistsb also, preaching the Lord Jesus. 21And the hand of the Lord was with them, and a great number who believed turned to the Lord. 22The report of this came to the ears of the church in Jerusalem, and they sent Barnabas to Antioch. 23When he came and saw the grace of God, he was glad, and he exhorted them all to remain faithful to the Lord with steadfast purpose, 24for he was a good man, full of the Holy Spirit and of faith. And a great many people were added to the Lord. 25So Barnabas went to Tarsus to look for Saul, 26and when he had found him, he brought him to Antioch. For a whole year they met with the church and taught a great many people. And in Antioch the disciples were first called Christians.

    27Now in these days prophets came down from Jerusalem to Antioch. 28And one of them named Agabus stood up and foretold by the Spirit that there would be a great famine over all the world (this took place in the days of Claudius). 29So the disciples determined, everyone according to his ability, to send relief to the brothersc living in Judea. 30And they did so, sending it to the elders by the hand of Barnabas and Saul.

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    Default Re: COVENANT AND THE UNITY OF SCRIPTURE

    Originally Posted by Devolution
    COVENANT THEOLOGY FAILS TO DISTINGUISH THE CHURCH AND ISRAEL

    "Israel has never been the Church, is not the Church, nor will she ever be the Church.....

    . . . . "The introduction of an age as an intercalation into the midst of the predicted ongoing Jewish and Gentile programs, and the new heavenly purpose which characterizes this age, cannot be made to conform to a supposed single covenant.

    Galatians 3:28
    There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free, there is no male and female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus.

    Romans 3:22This righteousness from God comes through faith in Jesus Christ to all who believe. There is no difference,

    ISRAEL'S NOT EVER IN THE CHURCH?????????????????

    BLASPHEMY IN THE HIGHEST and ONLY Pharisees and their minions ( OR WICKED ANTISEMITES) could come up with such a WICKED TEACHING.

    1 Corinthians 12:13
    For we were all baptized by one Spirit into one body--whether Jews or Greeks, slave or free--and we were all given the one Spirit to drink.
    Last edited by zone; March 12th, 2011 at 02:48 PM.

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    Default Re: COVENANT AND THE UNITY OF SCRIPTURE

    "Israel has never been the Church, is not the Church, nor will she ever be the Church.....

    . . . . "The introduction of an age as an intercalation into the midst of the predicted ongoing Jewish and Gentile programs, and the new heavenly purpose which characterizes this age, cannot be made to conform to a supposed single covenant.

    ONLY ANTISEMITES, DEVILS OR INSANE PEOPLE DENY JESUS FULFILLED THE PROMISE MADE TO ABRAHAM.

    of course....that's why THEY DENY Jesus Fulfilled Daniel's 70th WEEK!

    Daniel 9:27
    And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make [it] desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.

    Galatians 3:14
    I would like to learn just one thing from you: Did you receive the Spirit by observing the law, or by believing what you heard?

    Galatians 3:14
    He redeemed us in order that the blessing given to Abraham might come to the Gentiles through Christ Jesus, so that by faith we might receive the promise of the Spirit.

    Romans 4:16
    Therefore, the promise comes by faith, so that it may be by grace and may be guaranteed to all Abraham's offspring--not only to those who are of the law but also to those who are of the faith of Abraham. He is the father of us all.

    Hebrews 9
    The Earthly Holy Place
    1Now even the first covenant had regulations for worship and an earthly place of holiness. 2For a tenta was prepared, the first section, in which were the lampstand and the table and the bread of the Presence.b It is called the Holy Place. 3Behind the second curtain was a second sectionc called the Most Holy Place, 4having the golden altar of incense and the ark of the covenant covered on all sides with gold, in which was a golden urn holding the manna, and Aaron’s staff that budded, and the tablets of the covenant. 5Above it were the cherubim of glory overshadowing the mercy seat. Of these things we cannot now speak in detail.

    6These preparations having thus been made, the priests go regularly into the first section, performing their ritual duties, 7but into the second only the high priest goes, and he but once a year, and not without taking blood, which he offers for himself and for the unintentional sins of the people. 8By this the Holy Spirit indicates that the way into the holy places is not yet opened as long as the first section is still standing 9(which is symbolic for the present age).d According to this arrangement, gifts and sacrifices are offered that cannot perfect the conscience of the worshiper, 10but deal only with food and drink and various washings, regulations for the body imposed until the time of reformation.

    Redemption Through the Blood of Christ
    11But when Christ appeared as a high priest of the good things that have come,e then through the greater and more perfect tent (not made with hands, that is, not of this creation) 12he entered once for all into the holy places, not by means of the blood of goats and calves but by means of his own blood, thus securing an eternal redemption. 13For if the blood of goats and bulls, and the sprinkling of defiled persons with the ashes of a heifer, sanctifyf for the purification of the flesh, 14how much more will the blood of Christ, who through the eternal Spirit offered himself without blemish to God, purify ourg conscience from dead works to serve the living God.

    15Therefore he is the mediator of a new covenant, so that those who are called may receive the promised eternal inheritance, since a death has occurred that redeems them from the transgressions committed under the first covenant.h 16For where a will is involved, the death of the one who made it must be established. 17For a will takes effect only at death, since it is not in force as long as the one who made it is alive. 18Therefore not even the first covenant was inaugurated without blood. 19For when every commandment of the law had been declared by Moses to all the people, he took the blood of calves and goats, with water and scarlet wool and hyssop, and sprinkled both the book itself and all the people, 20saying, “This is the blood of the covenant that God commanded for you.” 21And in the same way he sprinkled with the blood both the tent and all the vessels used in worship. 22Indeed, under the law almost everything is purified with blood, and without the shedding of blood there is no forgiveness of sins.

    23Thus it was necessary for the copies of the heavenly things to be purified with these rites, but the heavenly things themselves with better sacrifices than these. 24For Christ has entered, not into holy places made with hands, which are copies of the true things, but into heaven itself, now to appear in the presence of God on our behalf. 25Nor was it to offer himself repeatedly, as the high priest enters the holy places every year with blood not his own, 26for then he would have had to suffer repeatedly since the foundation of the world. But as it is, he has appeared once for all at the end of the ages to put away sin by the sacrifice of himself. 27And just as it is appointed for man to die once, and after that comes judgment, 28so Christ, having been offered once to bear the sins of many, will appear a second time, not to deal with sin but to save those who are eagerly waiting for him.

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    Default Re: COVENANT AND THE UNITY OF SCRIPTURE

    LET'S JUST IGNORE THESE SCRIPTURES AND TELL ISRAEL THEY CAN WAIT ANOTHER 1,000 YEARS, JUST LIKE THEIR RABBIS TELL THEM.

    oh ya....i forgot.

    devo doesn't believe Jesus brought jew and gentile together into ONE COVENANT.
    Israel isn't and NEVER WILL BE PART OF THE CHURCH..

    EXCELLENT TEACHING DEVO!!!!! GOOD ONE!!!!

    that's that YUMMY FRUIT FROM SCOFIELD'S TREE: keep feeding that GARABGE to the Lord's sheep.

    you'll answer for it.




    Matthew 22:3 He sent his servants to those who had been invited to the banquet to tell them to come, but they refused to come.

    Luke 22:20 In the same way, after the supper he took the cup, saying, "This cup is the new covenant in my blood, which is poured out for you.

    Acts 20:32 "Now I commit you to God and to the word of his grace, which can build you up and give you an inheritance among all those who are sanctified.

    Romans 3:24 and are justified freely by his grace through the redemption that came by Christ Jesus.

    Romans 8:28 And we know that in all things God works for the good of those who love him, who have been called according to his purpose.

    Romans 8:30 And those he predestined, he also called; those he called, he also justified; those he justified, he also glorified.

    Galatians 3:20 A mediator, however, does not represent just one party; but God is one.

    1 Timothy 2:5 For there is one God and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus,

    Hebrews 3:1 Therefore, holy brothers, who share in the heavenly calling, fix your thoughts on Jesus, the apostle and high priest whom we confess.

    Hebrews 6:15 And so after waiting patiently, Abraham received what was promised.

    Hebrews 8:6 But the ministry Jesus has received is as superior to theirs as the covenant of which he is mediator is superior to the old one, and it is founded on better promises.

    Hebrews 8:8 But God found fault with the people and said: "The time is coming, declares the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah.

    Hebrews 8:13 By calling this covenant "new," he has made the first one obsolete; and what is obsolete and aging will soon disappear.

    Hebrews 9:12 He did not enter by means of the blood of goats and calves; but he entered the Most Holy Place once for all by his own blood, having obtained eternal redemption.

    Hebrews 9:16 In the case of a will, it is necessary to prove the death of the one who made it,

    Hebrews 10:34 You sympathized with those in prison and joyfully accepted the confiscation of your property, because you knew that you yourselves had better and lasting possessions.

    Hebrews 10:36 You need to persevere so that when you have done the will of God, you will receive what he has promised.

    Hebrews 11:39 These were all commended for their faith, yet none of them received what had been promised.

    Hebrews 12:24 to Jesus the mediator of a new covenant, and to the sprinkled blood that speaks a better word than the blood of Abel.

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    Default Re: COVENANT AND THE UNITY OF SCRIPTURE

    Amillennialism
    by Prof. Robert B. Strimple



    I. Christ: The Theme of O.T. Prophecy
    A. Premillennial's Literal Hermeneutic: Dispensational premillennialists regard the as yet unfulfilled OT prophesies given to Israel under the old covenant as having a literal fulfillment in the millennium. This will entail a return to the Old Covenant, including:
    1. Jerusalem as capital city of the kingdom
    2. The temple rebuilt
    3. A reestablished priesthood
    4. Animal sacrifices again offered
    5. Christ entering the temple each Sabbath by the eastern gate while the priests offer sacrifices (Ez 46)
    6.Observation of dietary laws
    7. Circumcision (Ez 44:23, 9)


    B. Is Such A Literal Hermeneutic The Correct One?

    1. ALL EVANGELICALS AGREE that the Old Testament sacrifices, feasts, and ceremonies were "teaching tools pointing forward to the work of Christ" (86)
    2. WHY, THEN, MAY NOT the promised land, Jerusalem, the temple, and the nation of Israel have a like significance, pointing the way toward the new covenant? 3. TYPOLOGICAL INTERPRETATION DOES NOT DENY THE IMPORTANCE OF THE TYPES: The types do not, themselves, lack reality. Yet their relation to the NT is one of shadow/reality. Once the reality has come to pass in its fullness, the shadow passes away.

    C. How Does The NT Interpret These OT Figures? Answer: Typologically

    1. CHRIST IS THE TRUE ISRAEL, AS ARE THOSE WHO ARE IN HIM
    a. ISAIAH’S SERVANT SONGS HAVE A DOUBLE REFERENT that has long baffled Jewish commentators. On the one hand, they refer to Israel, God’s chosen one and servant (41:8-9; 44:1-2, 21; 45:4; 49:3). On the other, they seem also to refer to some individual (42:1-4). These prophesies are interpreted by the NT as referring to Christ (Mt 8:17 and Acts 8:30-35)
    b. MATTHEW (2:15) SEES A DOUBLE REFERENT IN HOSEA 11:1 ("Out of Egypt I called my son") c. PAUL IDENTIFIES CHRIST , NOT PHYSICAL ISRAEL, AS ABRAHAM’S SEED (Gal 3:16). Gal 3:7 and Rom 4:11, 16, moreover, identify the church as Abraham’s offspring.
    d. HENCEFORTH, WE WHO ARE IN CHRIST ARE THE TRUE ISRAEL: Gal 3:26-29, Rom 2:28-29, and Phil 3:3
    e. THE OLD COVENANT IS OBSOLETE, HAVING BEEN SUPERSEDED BY THE NEW: Heb 8:8-12 identifies the new covenant with Israel (Jer 31:33-34) with the covenant instituted by Christ with the church. Most importantly, Heb 8:13 declares the old covenant obsolete and passing away. This makes impossible the dispensational view of Ez 40-48 as a reinstitution of temple sacrifice. f. UPSHOT: The OT did not see how its own prophesies were to be fulfilled - indeed, it could not prior to Christ. The NT authors were able to interpret the OT in the light of His coming of the new covenant that He instituted. So should we.

    2. THE LAND OF PROMISE A TYPE OF A NEW HEAVEN AND EARTH
    a. LITERALISM WOULD DICTATE THAT THE JEWS WERE PROMISED CANAAN ONLY: Gen 17:8
    b. THE NT VIEW THIS PROMISE AS INVOLVING THE WORLD, EVEN THE UNIVERSE: Rom 4:13, Heb 11:9-10, 13-16, and 2 Pet 3:3 c. UPSHOT: Amillennialism does ignore prophesies regarding the restoration and renewal of Israel. But it places them in the context of the new heaven and earth (Is 65:17; 66:22; 2 Pet 3:13; Rev 21:1) and a final redemption that is cosmic in scope.

    3. THE HOLY CITY A TYPE OF THE PRESENCE OF GOD HIMSELF
    a. Heb 12:18-24, Gal 4:25-26, and Rev 14:1 (cf. Rev 4:1-6)
    b. THE DISTINCTION, "EARTHLY vs. HEAVENLY," IS THAT OF "COPY vs. REAL" (cf. Heb 9:23-24)
    c. SPIRITUAL REALITIES ARE AS REAL AS THE TYPES TO WHICH THEY ARE COMPARED: To refer the OT types to their ultimate counterparts is not to engage in "spiritualizing" or "allegorical" exegesis that somehow minimizes their significance.
    d. WHAT IS THE REFORMATION PRINCIPLE OF THE LITERAL INTERPRETATION OF SCRIPTURE? It is interpreting Scripture in the light of Scripture.
    e. THIS IS PRECISELY THE SORT OF EXEGESIS IN WHICH THE NT WRITERS ENGAGE. They interpret the elements of the old covenant in the light of the new (progressive revelation). So should we. f. The prophesies of Is 2:2-4 and Micah 4:1-3 about "many peoples" from "all nations" streaming to Jerusalem are being fulfilled now as men and women of every tribe on the face of the earth call upon the name of Zion’s King and become citizens of ‘the Jerusalem that is above." (93)

    4. THE KINGDOM OF DAVID IS SEEN BY THE NT AS A TYPE OF A PRESENT AND ETERNAL (NOT FUTURE AND PROVISIONAL) KINGDOM
    a. PETER SEES GOD’S PROMISE TO DAVID AS ALREADY HAVING BEEN FULFILLED: 2 Sam 7:16 and Acts 2:30-31
    b. JAMES SEES THE RESTORATION OF DAVID’S THRONE, AND ITS BROAD SCOPE, AS HAVING ALREADY BEEN FULFILLED: Amos 9:11-12 and Acts 15:13-21 c. IF IT WERE NOT JAMES WHO HAD SAID THIS, DISPENSATIONALISTS WOULD MAKE THE CHARGE THAT THIS IS A DANGEROUS "SPIRITUALIZING" OF OT PROPHESY

    5. THE TEMPLE OF GOD A TYPE OF CHRIST
    a. THE PROPHETS SPEAK OF FUTURE WORSHIP OF GOD IN TERMS OF THE TEMPLE
    b. YET CHRIST IDENTIFIES HIMSELF AS THE TEMPLE: Mt 12:6, Jn 2:19-22, Jn 4:10, 14 (cf. Ez 47:1), and Rev 21:22 c. UPSHOT: PROPHESY REQUIRES NO FUTURE, LITERAL REBUILT TEMPLE


    II. The Second Coming of Christ: The Grand Finale of Redemptive History

    A. THE OT DOES NOT TEACH A FUTURE MILLENNIAL KINGDOM
    B. THE NT GOES EVEN FARTHER, RULING OUT A MILLENNIAL KINGDOM. WHY? THE END TIME EVENTS WILL HAPPEN ALL AT ONCE.
    1. THE CONCURRENCE OF THESE EVENTS 2. DISPENSATIONALISM ARTIFICIALLY SEPARATES THESE EVENTS IN ORDER TO FIT IN A MILLENNIUM

    C. WHAT THE SCRIPTURES TEACH
    1. A SINGLE RESURRECTION OF THE JUST AND UNJUST: Jn 5:28-29, Acts 24:15. References to the resurrection of the just (Lk 14:14, 20:14, Phil 3:11 and 1 Thess 4:16) have been taken to imply two resurrections. But nowhere in Scripture, except Rev 20:4-6, are two resurrections mentioned. Amillennialists argue that the "first resurrection" is a metaphor for something other than physical resurrection, and that we must abide by the clear teaching of the other passages that there is one resurrection.
    2. ONE RETURN OF CHRIST, ONE JUDGMENT
    2 Thess 1:5-10 speaks of final, eternal punishment of the wicked and simultaneous relief given the saints, both occurring at Christ’s return. Hence, Christ’s coming for his saints (the rapture), and his coming in judgment upon the rest of the world, are one and the same event.

    3. THE RESURRECTION/GLORIFICATION OF THE BODY, JUDGMENT, AND RENEWAL OF ALL CREATION AS SIMULTANEOUS EVENTS (NO INTERVENING MILLENNIUM)
    a. Rom 8:17-23 gives no hint of a 1000+ year gap between the saints’ resurrection and the final restoration of all things.
    b. 2 Pet 3:3-14 identifies Christ’s coming (4, 10), the judgment ("day of the Lord" in vv. 7 and 10-12), and the renewal of creation (13) as contemporaneous events. c. 1 Cor 15:22-26 indicates the same.


    III. Two Passages Considered Crucial by Millennialists

    A. ROMANS 11 (esp. v. 26: "And so all Israel will be saved")
    1. EVEN IF A FUTURE CONVERSION OF ISRAEL PREDICTED, THIS IS NOT PROOF OF PREMILLENNIALISM
    2. NOWHERE IN ROM 9-11 DOES PAUL SPEAK OF A RETURN OF THE JEWS TO THEIR LAND OR AN EARTHLY REIGN OF CHRIST FROM JERUSALEM
    3. BUT DOES PAUL EVEN PREDICT A FUTURE CONVERSION OF NATIONAL ISRAEL?
    a. THE CONTEXT OF ROM 9-11: Paul is wrestling with the issue of how the Messiah, foreseen in the OT as a great blessing to the Jews, could have been rejected by them.
    b. ROM 9:1-5 ACKNOWLEDGES THAT ISRAEL WAS CHOSEN BY GOD AND POSSESSED THE HIGHEST SPIRITUAL BLESSINGS
    c. ROM 9:6-7 REJECTS THE FALSE IMPLICATION THAT GOD HAS BEEN UNTRUE TO HIS PURPOSE FOR ISRAEL. His explanation: not all who are descended from Israel are Israel.
    d. ROM 9:8 - 10:21: THERE FOLLOWS A SERIES OF ILLUSTRATIONS that "mere physical descent from Abraham did not guarantee the possession of the blessings promised to Abraham."
    (1) Ishmael (9:8-9)
    (2) Esau (9:10-18)
    (3) In 9:24-26, Paul recalls that God told Hosea that He would choose others who were not his people to be "my people." They would be called "sons of the living God." (Hosea 2:23, 1:10)
    (4) In 29:27-29 he cites Isaiah 29:16 and 45:9 as evidence that not all of Israel would be saved, but only a remnant.
    (5) In 10:19 he cites Deut 32:21 as evidence that God would make Israel envious "by those who are not a nation." (6) In 10:20-21 he cites Is 65:1-2 in defense of God’s present choice of the Gentiles.

    e. ROM 11:1-10 REAFFIRMS THAT GOD HAS NOT REJECTED HIS PEOPLE: A BELIEVING REMNANT REMAINS
    (1) Paul cites himself as an example of a believing Jew (11:1)
    (2) Israel’s situation is no different than in Elijah’s day when a remnant was chosen. (3) UPSHOT: GOD HAS BEEN TRUE TO HIS PURPOSE IN ELECTION, FOR ELECTION IS NOT COEXTENSIVE WITH THE WHOLE NATION. (Rom 11:7)

    f. ROM 11:11, TRADITIONALLY VIEWED AS A TURNING POINT IN PAUL’S ARGUMENT, IS NOT.
    (1) Prior to 11:11, Paul stated that God’s rejection of the Jews is not total. After 11:11 he seems to say that neither is it final. Rom 11:12, 15, 25-26 foresee widespread conversion of Jews.
    (2) YET THIS CONVERSION OF JEWS IS NOT FUTURE - IT IS CONTEMPORANEOUS WITH THAT OF THE GENTILES, AND WILL BE TO THE END
    (a) "Just as you who were at one time disobedient to God have now received mercy as a result of their disobedience, so they too have now become disobedient in order that they too may now receive mercy as a result of God’s mercy to you." (11:31)
    (b) I.e., Paul conceives of the Jews’ conversion occurring in the present as a result of the Gentiles’ conversion, which incites them to envy. Cf. 10:19. (c) While this did not happen in Paul’s day, the process of Gentile conversion and Jewish response will continue until "the full number of the Gentiles has come in. And so all Israel will be saved" (11:25-26)

    (3) CONCLUSION: WHEN PAUL TALKS ABOUT THE CONVERSION OF ISRAEL, HE IS NOT SPEAKING OF A FUTURE CONVERSION AFTER THAT OF THE GENTILES, BUT A PRESENT ONE IN RESPONSE TO THE GENTILES.B. REV 20:1-10
    1. PRELIMINARY CAVEATS
    a. AMILLENNIALISTS HAVE A HIGH VIEW OF SCRIPTURE: They "agree that if a truth is taught with unmistakable clarity in Scripture, it is to be believed - even if it is taught in just one verse." (119)
    b. THE QUESTION IS: Is the millennium clearly taught in this passage? c. AMILLENNIALISM CLAIMS A LITERAL INTERPRETATION: "Amillennialists want to interpret Revelation 20 in a way that is consistent with the rest of the Scriptures," and in so doing follow the principle that "the less clear, more difficult portions of the Bible are to be interpreted in the light of the more clear portions, the poetry in the light of the prose, the figurative in the light of the literal." (119)

    2. THE EXEGESIS OF THE PASSAGE
    a. NOTHING IN IT GIVES "ANY HINT THAT IT IS TO BE CONNECTED WITH THOSE OT PROPHECIES THAT SPEAK OF A COMING ERA OF NATIONAL GLORY FOR ISRAEL"
    b. THE CHRONOLOGY OF REV 19 AND 20 IS UNCLEAR.
    (1) REV 19 SEEMS TO BRING US DOWN TO THE END OF THE AGE, the second coming of Christ, the final battle, and judgment on the forces of evil.
    (2) IS IT POSSIBLE THAT REV 20 TAKES US BACK TO THE FIRST COMING OF CHRIST AND THE BEGINNING OF THE CHURCH AGE? (3) SUCH DISCONTINUOUS CHRONOLOGY OCCURS ELSEWHERE. Rev 11:18 brings us to the end of the age ("the time has come for judging the dead"), and 12:1 takes us back to its beginning with its figurative account of the birth of Christ and his ascension.

    c. REV 20:1-10 HAS TWO VISIONS LINKED BY THE PHRASE "A THOUSAND YEARS"
    (1) THE SCENE OF THE ONE (20:1-3, 7-10) IS EARTH: The vision begins: "And I saw an angel coming down out of heaven." It relates Satan’s binding and casting into the Abyss for 1,000 years "to keep him from deceiving the nations." After the 1,000 years he is released, gathers his forces for a final showdown, and is defeated by fire falling from heaven.
    (2) THE SCENE OF THE OTHER (20:4-6) IS HEAVEN: It, too, begins, "And I saw" - martyred souls reigning on thrones with Christ. This recalls John’s earlier vision of Christ on his heavenly throne (Rev 4-5) and his promise, "To him who overcomes, I will give the right to sit with me on my throne, just as I overcame and sat down with my Father on his throne" (Rev 3:21) (3) UPSHOT: CHRIST’S MILLENNIAL REIGN WITH THE SAINTS IS A HEAVENLY REIGN

    d. SATAN’S BINDING IN REV 20 IS AN ALLUSION TO THE EVENTS OF REV 12
    (1) REV 12 DESCRIBES A RESTRAINT PLACED ON SATAN AT CHRIST’S FIRST COMING. Satan wanted to destroy the woman and her child, but could not. Accompanying these events was a heavenly battle in which Satan was cast down from heaven. Might Rev 20 be a recaptitulation of his? In both places Satan is "cast down" by an angel or angels.
    (2) THE FIRST COMING OF CHRIST ELSEWHERE DESCRIBED AS A DECISIVE VICTORY THAT CURTAILS SATAN’S ACTIVITY
    (a) MT 12:28-29: Jesus described his own mission by a parable. He had come to bind (deo - same word as Rev 20:2) the strong man and carry off of what had been in his possession.
    (b) JN 12:31: "Now is the time for judgment on this world; now the prince of this world will be driven out (the same word, ballo, is used in Rev 20:3) (c) CF. COL 2:15, HEB 2:14-15 and 1 JN 3:8

    (3) EVIDENCE THAT REV 20:1 IS A FIGURATIVE REPRESENTATION OF CHRIST’S VICTORY OVER SATAN AT THE CROSS
    (a) AT THE CROSS SATAN WAS BOUND - BUT NOT ABSOLUTELY. Similarly, Rev. 20 says that Satan is bound, but adds: that he might deceive the nations no longer. The word, ethn ("nations") was used by the Jews to designate the Gentiles. Hence, Rev 20 links Satan’s binding with the arrival of salvation for the Gentiles in the present age.
    i) JESUS DID COMMISSION THE MISSION TO THE GENTILES (Acts 26:17-18) ii) OUR STRUGGLE WITH EVIL POWERS (Eph 6:11-12) IS NOT INCONSISTENT WITH THEIR BEING BOUND: Jude 6, 2 Pet 2:4, Rev 9:14 all speak of the fallen angels being bound, awaiting punishment. But this does not mean that they are not active.

    e. REVELATION ALWAYS REFERS TO THE BATTLE (ho polemos): Rev 20:8, 16:14, 16, 19:19
    (1) THE BATTLE OF ARMAGEDDON (Rev 16 and 19) IS THE BATTLE OF GOG AND MAGOG (Rev 20) (2) IF REV 19 AND 20 DESCRIBE THE SAME BATTLE, THEN THE EVENTS OF REV 20:1-10 RECAPITULATE THE TIME BETWEEN CHRIST’S ADVENTS.

    f. WHO ARE THE "SOULS" REIGNING WITH CHRIST IN REV 20:4?
    (1) THESE "SOULS" ARE NOT YET RESURRECTED
    (a) "SOUL" CAN MEAN "PERSON." IF SO, THEN JOHN’S VISION WOULD BE OF SAINTS IN THEIR RESURRECTED STATE ON THE EARTH. E.g., Acts 2:41
    (b) THE CONTEXT DOES NOT INDICATE THIS, HOWEVER.
    i) THE INTERMEDIATE STATE IS INDICATED BY THE CONTRAST OF SOUL WITH BODY
    ii) THE SCENE SEEMS TO BE HEAVEN, NOT EARTH: the setting of Rev 20:4 appears to be that of Rev 4-5, and 20:4 appears to the fulfillment of Christ’s promise in 3:21. iii) THROUGHOUT REVELATION THE THRONE OF CHRIST AND HIS PEOPLE IS ALWAYS IN HEAVEN: 1:4, 3:21, 4:5, 6:16, 7:9ff, 8:3, 12:5, 14:3, 16:17, 19:4-5, 20:11, 21:5, 22:1,3

    (c) WHAT, THEN, IS MEANT BY "FIRST RESURRECTION"?
    i) STRIMPLE IDENTIFIES IT WITH THE BELIEVER’S RECEPTION INTO HEAVEN: "The first resurrection occurs when he or she departs this life and is immediately ushered into the presence of Christ to reign with him. The second resurrection will be bodily at Christ’s second coming" (127)
    ii) OTHER AMILLENNIALISTS IDENTIFY IT WITH REGENERATION
    a) 1 Jn 3:14, Eph 2:4-6, and Col 2:13 speak of Christians as already having "come to life" in Christ. b) Eph 2:6, 1 Cor 3:21-22, and Col 3:1-2 speak of them as already spiritually enthroned with him in heaven.

    g. WHAT IS THE MEANING OF "1,000"?
    (1) MOST AMILLENNIALISTS THINK THAT IT SYMBOLIZES THE COMPLETION OF THE AGE ("10" and "3" are numbers of perfection, 103 the ultimate such symbol). (2) STRIMPLE THINKS THAT IT IS USED TO ENCOURAGE BELEAGUERED CHRISTIANS, stressing the brevity of their present suffering in relation to their glorious reign to come.
    [End]
    Dr. Robert Strimple is Professor of Systematic Theology at Westminster Theological Seminary in Escondido, California. He was the founding dean, and the first president of Westminster in California.

    Amillennialism
    Last edited by zone; March 12th, 2011 at 03:33 PM.

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    Default Re: COVENANT AND THE UNITY OF SCRIPTURE

    Quote Originally Posted by Devolution View Post
    ERROR...there is NO covenant theological model in the bible.

    AT LAST !!! ...THE MEN FOLLOWED AND PROMOTED BY A CERTAIN SOMEONE....found.

    Tsk,tsk,tsk. Now i can learn about a certain persons beliefs, which does not come from personal searching in spirit and truth, but from a made up theory devised by men.
    Covenants in the Bible

    1. God's covenant with the children of Israel concerning the Sabbath. (Exodus 31:14-18)
    2. God's covenant concerning the Ten Commandments and Holy Days designated by God. (Exodus 34:10 - 35)
    3. God's covenant concerning the bread in the Tabernacle, and later the Temple, to be eaten only by the priests, descendants of Aaron. (Leviticus 24:8,9)
    4. God promised a new covenant. (Jeremiah 31:31-34)
    5. God spoke of His unconditional covenant with King David of Israel and of His continuing, unconditional covenant with Jacob's descendants. (Jeremiah 33:19-36)
    6. God spoke of "divorcing" Israel and Judah, thus ending the earlier covenant, and of establishing a new covenant with them. (Ezekiel 16:59-63)
    7. The most important covenant - the new covenant - established by Jesus upon His death. (Matthew 26:28; Mark 14:24; Luke 22:20; 2 Corinthians 3:6; Hebrews chapters 7 - 10). Paul described the only new ritual of the new covenant. (1 Corinthians 11:23-30)
    I have attempted to give you some scriptural references to the more important covenants of the Bible. There are many other scriptural references to these covenants and the Bible is usually divided into two sections, the "Old Testament" and the "New Testament".

    The word "testament" is interchangeable with "covenant". The King James Version sometimes translates the Greek word diatheke as "testament" and sometimes as "covenant". Many other translations use "covenant" exclusively. We could just as easily refer to the two common divisions of scripture as the "Old Covenant" (since it contains descriptions, prophecies and books of wisdom from people living under that "Old Covenant") and the "New Covenant" (containing the story of Jesus and people who lived during the transition from old to new covenants.

    What are the different COVENANTS in the Bible?

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    Default Re: COVENANT AND THE UNITY OF SCRIPTURE

    Quote Originally Posted by Devolution View Post
    ERROR...there is NO covenant theological model in the bible.
    AT LAST !!! ...THE MEN FOLLOWED AND PROMOTED BY A CERTAIN SOMEONE....found.
    really?


    Quote Originally Posted by Devolution View Post
    within are points to help us understand the workings of this THEORY that has NO biblical authority whatsoever.

    Now i have found the MEN pushing this unbiblical THEORY....

    i suggest we all become acquainted with this dangerous doctrine of men that denies 3/4 of scripture....
    3/4 of Scripture denied by the Reformers?

    Quote Originally Posted by Devolution View Post
    THE SUPPOSED TWO COVENANTS OF COVENANT THEOLOGY

    The theological terms, Covenant of Works and Covenant of Grace, do not occur in Scripture.
    really? do i have to post on Moses and Sinai? or can you read it yourself?



    Ephesians 2
    By Grace Through Faith
    1And you were dead in the trespasses and sins 2in which you once walked, following the course of this world, following the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that is now at work in the sons of disobedience— 3among whom we all once lived in the passions of our flesh, carrying out the desires of the bodya and the mind, and were by nature children of wrath, like the rest of mankind. 4Butb God, being rich in mercy, because of the great love with which he loved us, 5even when we were dead in our trespasses, made us alive together with Christ—by grace you have been saved6and raised us up with him and seated us with him in the heavenly places in Christ Jesus, 7so that in the coming ages he might show the immeasurable riches of his grace in kindness toward us in Christ Jesus. 8For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God, 9not a result of works, so that no one may boast. 10For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand, that we should walk in them.

    One in Christ
    11Therefore remember that at one time you Gentiles in the flesh, called “the uncircumcision” by what is called the circumcision, which is made in the flesh by hands— 12remember that you were at that time separated from Christ, alienated from the commonwealth of Israel and strangers to the covenants of promise, having no hope and without God in the world. 13But now in Christ Jesus you who once were far off have been brought near by the blood of Christ. 14For he himself is our peace, who has made us both one and has broken down in his flesh the dividing wall of hostility 15by abolishing the law of commandments expressed in ordinances, that he might create in himself one new man in place of the two, so making peace, 16and might reconcile us both to God in one body through the cross, thereby killing the hostility. 17And he came and preached peace to you who were far off and peace to those who were near. 18For through him we both have access in one Spirit to the Father. 19So then you are no longer strangers and aliens,c but you are fellow citizens with the saints and members of the household of God, 20built on the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Christ Jesus himself being the cornerstone, 21in whom the whole structure, being joined together, grows into a holy temple in the Lord. 22In him you also are being built together into a dwelling place for God byd the Spirit.


    Quote Originally Posted by Devolution;399351
    [/FONT
    If they are to be sustained it must be wholly apart from Biblical authority.

    Tsk,tsk,tsk. Now i can learn about a certain persons beliefs, which does not come from personal searching in spirit and truth, but from a made up theory devised by men.
    look this one over very very slowly and carefully: see if God has TWO SEPARATE PLANS....SEE IF HE PURPOSED FROM THE BEGINNING TO HAVE HIS CHURCH BE JEW AND GENTILE:

    Ephesians 3
    The Mystery of the Gospel Revealed
    1For this reason I, Paul, a prisoner for Christ Jesus on behalf of you Gentiles— 2assuming that you have heard of the stewardship of God’s grace that was given to me for you, 3how the mystery was made known to me by revelation, as I have written briefly. 4When you read this, you can perceive my insight into the mystery of Christ, 5which was not made known to the sons of men in other generations as it has now been revealed to his holy apostles and prophets by the Spirit. 6This mystery isa that the Gentiles are fellow heirs, members of the same body, and partakers of the promise in Christ Jesus through the gospel.

    7Of this gospel I was made a minister according to the gift of God’s grace, which was given me by the working of his power. 8To me, though I am the very least of all the saints, this grace was given, to preach to the Gentiles the unsearchable riches of Christ, 9and to bring to light for everyone what is the plan of the mystery hidden for ages inb God who created all things, 10so that through the church the manifold wisdom of God might now be made known to the rulers and authorities in the heavenly places. 11This was according to the eternal purpose that he has realized in Christ Jesus our Lord, 12in whom we have boldness and access with confidence through our faith in him. 13So I ask you not to lose heart over what I am suffering for you, which is your glory.
    Last edited by zone; March 12th, 2011 at 04:03 PM.

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    Default Re: COVENANT AND THE UNITY OF SCRIPTURE

    back shortly.

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    Default Re: COVENANT AND THE UNITY OF SCRIPTURE

    Quote Originally Posted by Devolution View Post

    COVENANT THEOLOGY - A HUMAN INVENTION
    "Upon this human invention of two covenants Reformed Theology has largely been constructed.

    It sees the empirical truth that God can forgive sinners only by that freedom which is secured by the sacrifice of His Son - anticipated in the old order and realized in the new
    PLEASE TELL US HOW GOD REDEEMS SINFUL MEN IF NOT THROUGH THE SACRIFICE OF HIS SON.

    TELL US IF THE OLD TESTAMENT ANTICIPATED JESUS, AND IF HE CAME IN THE NEW TESTAMENT.

    IS THE NEW COVENANT BY WHICH MEN MAY BE SAVED A HUMAN INVENTION?

    do you deny the Atonement, devo?

    Quote Originally Posted by Devolution View Post
    - but that theology utterly fails to discern the purposes for the ages; the varying relationships to God of the Jews, the Gentiles, and the Church, with the distinctive, consistent human obligations which arise directly and unavoidably from the nature of each specific relationship to God." (IV, 156)
    IN OTHER WORDS, REFORMED THEOLOGY REJECTS DISPENSATIONALISM....YA? SO?
    THAT'S WHAT I TOLD YOU.

    here's what your author laments that reformed theology rejects:

    The Seven Dispensations
    Rightly Dividing the Word of Truth

    by Dr. C. I. Scofield
    The Scriptures divide time (by which is meant the entire period from the creation of Adam to the "new heaven and a new earth" of Rev. 21: 1) into seven unequal periods, usually called dispensations (Eph. 3:2), although these periods are also called ages (Eph. 2:7) and days, as in "day of the Lord."

    These periods are marked off in Scripture by some change in God's method of dealing with mankind, or a portion of mankind, in respect of the two questions: of sin, and of man's responsibility. Each of the dispensations may be regarded as a new test of the natural man, and each ends in judgment, marking his utter failure in every dispensation. Five of these dispensations, or periods of time, have been fulfilled; we are living in the sixth, probably toward its close, and have before us the seventh, and last: the millennium.







    1. Man innocent.
    "This dispensation extends from the creation of Adam in Genesis 2:7 to the expulsion from Eden. Adam, created innocent and ignorant of good and evil, was placed in the garden of Eden with his wife, Eve, and put under responsibility to abstain from the fruit of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil. The dispensation of innocence resulted in the first failure of man, and in its far-reaching effects, the most disastrous. It closed in judgment: "So he drove out the man." See Gen. 1:26; Gen. 2:16,17; Gen. 3:6; Gen. 3:22-24.)"

    Salvation Gospel in this dispensation:


    Do not eat of the tree of knowledge of good and evil.

    Genesis 2:16 And the Lord God commanded the man, saying, "Of every tree of the garden you may freely eat; 17 "but of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil you shall not eat, for in the day that you eat of it you shall surely die."




    2. Man under conscience.


    "By the fall, Adam and Eve acquired and transmitted to the race the knowledge of good and evil. This gave conscience a basis for right moral judgment, and hence the race came under this measure of responsibility -- to do good and eschew evil. The result of the dispensation of conscience, from Eden to the flood (while there was no institution of government and of law), was that "all flesh had corrupted his way on the earth," that "the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every imagination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually," and God closed the second testing of the natural man with judgment: the flood. See Gen. 3:7, 22; Gen. 6:5,11-12; Gen. 7:11-12, 23.)"


    Salvation Gospel in this dispensation:


    Do good and do not do evil, or love what is good and hate what is evil.


    Genesis 3:22 Then the Lord God said, "Behold, the man has become like one of Us, to know good and evil. And now, lest he put out his hand and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live forever"-- 23 therefore the Lord God sent him out of the garden of Eden to till the ground from which he was taken.







    3. Man in authority over the earth.


    "Out of the fearful judgment of the flood God saved eight persons, to whom, after the waters were assuaged, He gave the purified earth with ample power to govern it. This, Noah and his descendants were responsible to do. The dispensation of human government resulted, upon the plain of Shinar, in the impious attempt to become independent of God and closed in judgment: the confusion of tongues. (See Gen. 9: 1, 2; Gen. 11: 1-4; Gen. 11:5-8.)"


    Salvation Gospel in this dispensation:


    Believe God and build an ark.


    Genesis 6:16 "You shall make a window for the ark, and you shall finish it to a cubit from above; and set the door of the ark in its side. You shall make it [with] lower, second, and third [decks]. 17 "And behold, I Myself am bringing floodwaters on the earth, to destroy from under heaven all flesh in which [is] the breath of life; everything that [is] on the earth shall die. 18 "But I will establish My covenant with you; and you shall go into the ark--you, your sons, your wife, and your sons' wives with you.







    4. Man under promise.

    "Out of the dispersed descendants of the builders of Babel, God called one man, Abram, with whom He enters into covenant. Some of the promises to Abram and his descendants were purely gracious and unconditional. These either have been or will yet be literally fulfilled. Other promises were conditional upon the faithfulness and obedience of the Israelites. Every one of these conditions was violated, and the dispensation of promise resulted in the failure of Israel and closed in the judgment of bondage in Egypt."

    "The book of Genesis, which opens with the sublime words, "In the beginning God created," closes with, "In a coffin in Egypt." (See Gen. 12:1-3; Gen. 13:14-17; Gen. 15:5; Gen. 26:3; Gen. 28:12-13; Exod. 1: 13-14.)"


    Salvation Gospel in this dispensation:


    Believe God's promise.

    Genesis 12:1 Now the Lord had said to Abram: "Get out of your country, From your family And from your father's house, To a land that I will show you. 2 I will make you a great nation; I will bless you.




    5. Man under law.


    "Again the grace of God came to the help of helpless man and redeemed the chosen people out of the hand of the oppressor. In the wilderness of Sinai He proposed to them the covenant of law. Instead of humbly pleading for a continued relation of grace, they presumptuously answered: "All that the Lord hath spoken we will do." The history of Israel in the wilderness and in the land is one long record of flagrant, persistent violation of the law, and at last, after multiplied warnings, God closed the testing of man by law in judgment: first Israel, and then Judah, were driven out of the land into a dispersion which still continues. A feeble remnant returned under Ezra and Nehemiah, of which, in due time, Christ came: "Born of a woman-made under the law." Both Jews and Gentiles conspired to crucify Him. (See Exod. 19:1-8; 2 Kings 17:1-18; 2 Kings 25: 1 -11; Acts 2:22-23; Acts 7:5152; Rom. 3:19-20; Rom. 10:5; Gal. 3: 10.)"


    Salvation Gospel in this dispensation:


    Obey God and keep His commandments.


    Exodus 19:5 Now therefore, if you will indeed obey My voice and keep My covenant, then you shall be a special treasure to Me above all people; for all the earth [is] Mine.







    6. Man under grace.

    "The sacrificial death of the Lord Jesus Christ introduced the dispensation of pure grace, which means undeserved favor, or God giving righteousness, instead of God requiring righteousness, as under law. Salvation, perfect and eternal, is now freely offered to Jew and Gentile upon the acknowledgment of sin, or repentance, with faith in Christ."



    "Jesus answered and said unto them, This is the work of God, that ye believe on him whom he hath sent" (John 6:29). "Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me hath everlasting life" (John 6:47). "Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life." (John 5:24). "My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me: and I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish" (John 10:27-28). "For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast" (Eph. 2:8-9).



    The predicted result of this testing of man under grace is judgment upon an unbelieving world and an apostate church. (See Luke 17:26-30; Luke 18:8; 2 Thess. 2:7-12; Rev. 3:15-16.)



    The first event in the closing of this dispensation will be the descent of the Lord from heaven, when sleeping saints will be raised and, together with believers then living, caught up "to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord" (I Thess. 4:16-17). Then follows the brief period called "the great tribulation." (See Jer. 30:5-7; Dan. 12:1; Zeph. 1:15-18; Matt. 24:21-22.)



    After this the personal return of the Lord to the earth in power and great glory occurs, and the judgments which introduce the seventh, and last dispensation. (See Matt. 25:31-46 and Matt. 24:29- 30.)"


    Comment:


    Some teachers number the Tribulation as one of the dispensations, while combining the dispensations of Promise & Law. However, we see the Tribulation as a special period during which human civilization crumbles under the weight of the combined features of its ages long rejection of God.


    Salvation Gospel in this dispensation:

    Confess Jesus as Lord and believe in His resurrection.

    Romans 10:9 that if you confess with your mouth the Lord Jesus and believe in your heart that God has raised Him from the dead, you will be saved.











    7. Man under the personal reign of Christ.

    "After the purifying judgments which attend the personal return of Christ to the earth, He will reign over restored Israel and over the earth for one thousand years. This is the period commonly called the millennium. The seat of His power will be Jerusalem, and the saints, including the saved of the dispensation of grace, namely the church, will be associated with Him in His glory. (See Isa. 2:1-4; Isa. 11; Acts 15:14-17; Rev. 19:11-21; Rev. 20:1-6.



    But when Satan is "loosed a little season," he finds the natural heart as prone to evil as ever, and easily gathers the nations to battle against the Lord and His saints, and this last dispensation closes, like all the others, in judgment. The great white throne is set, the wicked dead are raised and finally judged, and then come the "new heaven and a new earth." Eternity is begun. (See Rev. 20:3,7-15; Rev. 21 and 22.)"

    Bible Life Ministries - The Seven Dispensations.


    Quote Originally Posted by Devolution View Post
    Tsk,tsk,tsk. Now i can learn about a certain persons beliefs, which does not come from personal searching in spirit and truth, but from a made up theory devised by men.


    WELL SAID DEVO ^^ ABOUT YOURSELF...and your Scofield antisemitic DISPENSATIONALIST insanity.
    Last edited by zone; March 12th, 2011 at 11:03 PM.

  17. #17
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    Default Re: COVENANT AND THE UNITY OF SCRIPTURE

    Quote Originally Posted by zone View Post
    The Seven Dispensations
    Rightly Dividing the Word of Truth



    by Dr. C. I. Scofield
    The Scriptures divide time (by which is meant the entire period from the creation of Adam to the "new heaven and a new earth" of Rev. 21: 1) into seven unequal periods, usually called dispensations (Eph. 3:2), although these periods are also called ages (Eph. 2:7) and days, as in "day of the Lord."

    These periods are marked off in Scripture by some change in God's method of dealing with mankind, or a portion of mankind, in respect of the two questions: of sin, and of man's responsibility. Each of the dispensations may be regarded as a new test of the natural man, and each ends in judgment, marking his utter failure in every dispensation. Five of these dispensations, or periods of time, have been fulfilled; we are living in the sixth, probably toward its close, and have before us the seventh, and last: the millennium.




    1. Man innocent.
    "This dispensation extends from the creation of Adam in Genesis 2:7 to the expulsion from Eden. Adam, created innocent and ignorant of good and evil, was placed in the garden of Eden with his wife, Eve, and put under responsibility to abstain from the fruit of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil. The dispensation of innocence resulted in the first failure of man, and in its far-reaching effects, the most disastrous. It closed in judgment: "So he drove out the man." See Gen. 1:26; Gen. 2:16,17; Gen. 3:6; Gen. 3:22-24.)"

    Salvation Gospel in this dispensation:

    Do not eat of the tree of knowledge of good and evil.




    Genesis 2:16 And the Lord God commanded the man, saying, "Of every tree of the garden you may freely eat; 17 "but of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil you shall not eat, for in the day that you eat of it you shall surely die."

    2. Man under conscience.

    "By the fall, Adam and Eve acquired and transmitted to the race the knowledge of good and evil. This gave conscience a basis for right moral judgment, and hence the race came under this measure of responsibility -- to do good and eschew evil. The result of the dispensation of conscience, from Eden to the flood (while there was no institution of government and of law), was that "all flesh had corrupted his way on the earth," that "the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every imagination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually," and God closed the second testing of the natural man with judgment: the flood. See Gen. 3:7, 22; Gen. 6:5,11-12; Gen. 7:11-12, 23.)"

    Salvation Gospel in this dispensation:


    Do good and do not do evil, or love what is good and hate what is evil.


    Genesis 3:22 Then the Lord God said, "Behold, the man has become like one of Us, to know good and evil. And now, lest he put out his hand and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live forever"-- 23 therefore the Lord God sent him out of the garden of Eden to till the ground from which he was taken.

    3. Man in authority over the earth.

    "Out of the fearful judgment of the flood God saved eight persons, to whom, after the waters were assuaged, He gave the purified earth with ample power to govern it. This, Noah and his descendants were responsible to do. The dispensation of human government resulted, upon the plain of Shinar, in the impious attempt to become independent of God and closed in judgment: the confusion of tongues. (See Gen. 9: 1, 2; Gen. 11: 1-4; Gen. 11:5-8.)"

    Salvation Gospel in this dispensation:


    Believe God and build an ark.



    Genesis 6:16 "You shall make a window for the ark, and you shall finish it to a cubit from above; and set the door of the ark in its side. You shall make it [with] lower, second, and third [decks]. 17 "And behold, I Myself am bringing floodwaters on the earth, to destroy from under heaven all flesh in which [is] the breath of life; everything that [is] on the earth shall die. 18 "But I will establish My covenant with you; and you shall go into the ark--you, your sons, your wife, and your sons' wives with you.

    4. Man under promise.


    "Out of the dispersed descendants of the builders of Babel, God called one man, Abram, with whom He enters into covenant. Some of the promises to Abram and his descendants were purely gracious and unconditional. These either have been or will yet be literally fulfilled. Other promises were conditional upon the faithfulness and obedience of the Israelites. Every one of these conditions was violated, and the dispensation of promise resulted in the failure of Israel and closed in the judgment of bondage in Egypt."


    "The book of Genesis, which opens with the sublime words, "In the beginning God created," closes with, "In a coffin in Egypt." (See Gen. 12:1-3; Gen. 13:14-17; Gen. 15:5; Gen. 26:3; Gen. 28:12-13; Exod. 1: 13-14.)"

    Salvation Gospel in this dispensation:

    Believe God's promise.

    Genesis 12:1 Now the Lord had said to Abram: "Get out of your country, From your family And from your father's house, To a land that I will show you. 2 I will make you a great nation; I will bless you.

    5. Man under law.

    "Again the grace of God came to the help of helpless man and redeemed the chosen people out of the hand of the oppressor. In the wilderness of Sinai He proposed to them the covenant of law. Instead of humbly pleading for a continued relation of grace, they presumptuously answered: "All that the Lord hath spoken we will do." The history of Israel in the wilderness and in the land is one long record of flagrant, persistent violation of the law, and at last, after multiplied warnings, God closed the testing of man by law in judgment: first Israel, and then Judah, were driven out of the land into a dispersion which still continues. A feeble remnant returned under Ezra and Nehemiah, of which, in due time, Christ came: "Born of a woman-made under the law." Both Jews and Gentiles conspired to crucify Him. (See Exod. 19:1-8; 2 Kings 17:1-18; 2 Kings 25: 1 -11; Acts 2:22-23; Acts 7:5152; Rom. 3:19-20; Rom. 10:5; Gal. 3: 10.)"

    Salvation Gospel in this dispensation:


    Obey God and keep His commandments.


    Exodus 19:5 Now therefore, if you will indeed obey My voice and keep My covenant, then you shall be a special treasure to Me above all people; for all the earth [is] Mine.

    6. Man under grace.
    "The sacrificial death of the Lord Jesus Christ introduced the dispensation of pure grace, which means undeserved favor, or God giving righteousness, instead of God requiring righteousness, as under law. Salvation, perfect and eternal, is now freely offered to Jew and Gentile upon the acknowledgment of sin, or repentance, with faith in Christ."


    "Jesus answered and said unto them, This is the work of God, that ye believe on him whom he hath sent" (John 6:29). "Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me hath everlasting life" (John 6:47). "Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life." (John 5:24). "My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me: and I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish" (John 10:27-28). "For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast" (Eph. 2:8-9).



    The predicted result of this testing of man under grace is judgment upon an unbelieving world and an apostate church. (See Luke 17:26-30; Luke 18:8; 2 Thess. 2:7-12; Rev. 3:15-16.)



    The first event in the closing of this dispensation will be the descent of the Lord from heaven, when sleeping saints will be raised and, together with believers then living, caught up "to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord" (I Thess. 4:16-17). Then follows the brief period called "the great tribulation." (See Jer. 30:5-7; Dan. 12:1; Zeph. 1:15-18; Matt. 24:21-22.)


    After this the personal return of the Lord to the earth in power and great glory occurs, and the judgments which introduce the seventh, and last dispensation. (See Matt. 25:31-46 and Matt. 24:29- 30.)"

    Comment:



    Some teachers number the Tribulation as one of the dispensations, while combining the dispensations of Promise & Law. However, we see the Tribulation as a special period during which human civilization crumbles under the weight of the combined features of its ages long rejection of God.


    Salvation Gospel in this dispensation:



    Confess Jesus as Lord and believe in His resurrection.


    Romans 10:9 that if you confess with your mouth the Lord Jesus and believe in your heart that God has raised Him from the dead, you will be saved.

    7. Man under the personal reign of Christ.


    "After the purifying judgments which attend the personal return of Christ to the earth, He will reign over restored Israel and over the earth for one thousand years. This is the period commonly called the millennium. The seat of His power will be Jerusalem, and the saints, including the saved of the dispensation of grace, namely the church, will be associated with Him in His glory. (See Isa. 2:1-4; Isa. 11; Acts 15:14-17; Rev. 19:11-21; Rev. 20:1-6.



    But when Satan is "loosed a little season," he finds the natural heart as prone to evil as ever, and easily gathers the nations to battle against the Lord and His saints, and this last dispensation closes, like all the others, in judgment. The great white throne is set, the wicked dead are raised and finally judged, and then come the "new heaven and a new earth." Eternity is begun. (See Rev. 20:3,7-15; Rev. 21 and 22.)"

    Bible Life Ministries - The Seven Dispensations.
    and if you prefer this doctrine of devils, (DISPENSATIONAL THEOLOGY) to Reformed Theology (Covenant/Two Ages), you can always take the author of the above article up on his offer to purchase the BEST BOOKS AVAILABLE ON DISPENSATIONAL DELUSIONAL THOLOGY:

    The best book for the study of dispensations is:
    Dispensational Truth - Gods' Plan and Purpose in the Ages
    by Clarence Larkin, 1918 ISBN: 0-89540-388-9
    The best study Bible for learning the dispensations is:
    The New Scofield Study Bible - Genuine King James Version
    Genuine Leather, Burgundy, ISBN: 019527749X
    Highly recommended book for studying many different theologies is:
    The Moody Handbook of Theology
    by Paul Enns, ISBN: 0-8024-3428-2
    Last edited by zone; March 12th, 2011 at 11:27 PM.

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    Default Re: COVENANT AND THE UNITY OF SCRIPTURE

    Quote Originally Posted by Devolution View Post

    COVENANT THEOLOGY - A LIMITED UNDERSTANDING

    "A theology which penetrates no further into Scripture than to discover that in all ages God is immutable in His grace toward penitent sinners, and constructs the idea of a universal Church continuing through the ages,on the one truth of immutable grace, is not only disregarding vast spheres of revelation but is reaping the unavoidable confusion and misdirection which part-truth engenders.


    this doesn't even dignify the effort to refute.

    only men energized by satan could deny that God is ALWAYS, consistent to His Character, Gracious TO CONTRITE MEN.

    only devils could suggest God is not Sovereign.

    i am soooooooooooooo grateful He did not leave me in this mess of DISPENSATIONAL GARBAGE.

    Quote Originally Posted by Devolution View Post
    The outworking of divine grace is not standardized, though the Covenant idea of theology would make it so;

    and as certainly as God's dealings with man are not standardized, in the same manner the entire field of the corresponding human obligation in daily life is not run into a mold of human idealism." (IV, 156-157)
    Quote Originally Posted by Devolution View Post

    Tsk,tsk,tsk. Now i can learn about a certain persons beliefs, which does not come from personal searching in spirit and truth, but from a made up theory devised by men.
    indeed, devo. GOOD WORK! keep poisoning the sheep's food! promise them a rapture...or a future earthly kingdom! excellent devo.

    so you and your group just went away and studied in isolation and OUT POPPED SCOFIElD'S DISPENSATIONS! imagine that.

    The Seven Dispensations
    Rightly Dividing the Word of Truth
    by Dr. C. I. Scofield


    Bible Life Ministries - The Seven Dispensations.

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    Senior Member zone's Avatar
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    Default Re: COVENANT AND THE UNITY OF SCRIPTURE

    CONTINUED TOMORROW.

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    Default Re: COVENANT AND THE UNITY OF SCRIPTURE

    indeed, devo. GOOD WORK! keep poisoning the sheep's food! promise them a rapture...or a future earthly kingdom! excellent devo.

    so you and your group just went away and studied in isolation and OUT POPPED SCOFIElD'S DISPENSATIONS! imagine that.

    The Seven Dispensations
    Rightly Dividing the Word of Truth
    by Dr. C. I. Scofield


    Bible Life Ministries - The Seven Dispensations.[/quote]


    It is so sad. I answered your posting concerning this Seven Dispensations confusion. And if you read my response you will see i disagree with 98% of that doctrine. So to accuse us of holding that said doctrine is just silly. Do you understand what this means: No Zone, we do not agree with the Seven Dispensations? Not at all.

    Don't we all speak English? Again: No Zone, we do not agree with the Seven Dispensations. Not at all.

    So now, even now...AGAIN, you see that as we TOLD you before, many times, we do NOT agree with what you say we preach. We never even heard of it till you accused us of it. So NOW you have the opportunity once again to stop falsely accusing us of this thing you keep saying. It is not true. It is slander. Christians should not practice such things.

    I hold my relationship with Jesus very deeply, it is my life. To keep saying what you say even after we tell you we do not follow this, is very insulting. And as i said in my reply to your other post. There will be in this world similarities amongst all beliefs. One need not be aware of the other for this to occur. For we all read the same bible. And as my reply to your other post clearly reveals, i only agree with 2% of what that man spoke anyway.

    And as i also said, i have seen you agreeing with Catholics on certain points. Does this make you Catholic? Of course not. Have i accused you of being Catholic for agreeing with them on certain points? No i have not. So why mete out unjust measure which you yourself do not suffer?

    So if you will not stop this untruth you keep saying we preach, then hopefully, many will see this declaration and know that what you say about us is just that...untruth. And in that knowledge, those who know scripture, know that His children do not practice this type of behavior...this in itself speaks volumes. It is very serious in Gods eyes to falsely accuse, especially the more so when it is Spiritual.. Yet you keep doing it to us. Have you no fear of Him?

    I think i see what you are trying to do though. To keep slandering us, hoping to make us angry so we say things that will get us banned. This also is wrong. I do not understand how you keep getting away with demeaning us & so many others? You have called us false prophets, heretics, blind, deceivers, wolves, crazy, a cult etc etc etc....and that's just us? Odd.


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