Why should we seek the gifts earnestly, but especially prophecy?

[VW]

Paul wrote this, but why would he write such a foolish thing,'seeing all the confussion and discord the "gifts" have caused? One group teaches this, and another that, and still another says that there are no gifts any more, and others won't even consider something so subjective, so uncontrollable. But he did write this, that we all should seek the gifts of the Spirit, but especially that we should prophecy. It's scripture, unless Paul was not inspired by the Holy Spirit when he wrote about the "gifts."

There are many reasons to seek the gifts of the Spirit, but there is one that has not been guessed by many, and it involves that embarrassing gift, the one most of us wish has never been mentioned; prophecy. All kinds of reasons are given why we should not prophecy, and every one of them is a rationalization. The reason why we should seek to prophecy is immense in it's ramifications. Simply, that we learn to speak the words we hear from Jesus.

When confronted about the words He spoke, Jesus had a very simple yet powerful explanation; He said that the words He spoke were the things He heard His Father speaking. Just consider this for a moment. He spoke what He heard His Father saying. This is the essence of prophecy.

In almost all of the teachings Jesus gave to His disciples in private, one theme was most often repeated. That as He did, we are to do likewise. This means not only that we are to do the same things He did, but that we are to do them in the very same way that He did them. And in His prayer to His Father, He shows the desire of having us become just as He was, while we remain in this world. "That the world may know that Thou didst love them, even as Thou hast loved Me." one of the things that can be easily said about Jesus during His walk in this world is that the Gather loved Him, because He did whatever Jesus asked Him to do, but one.

So we seek to prophecy in order to walk in the very same way that Jesus did, having His words to speak, because we hear them, and having His love, because we are truly wanting to be His disciples, filled with His Spirit by which we hear His voice.

Do not despise prophecy. Please. And earnestly desire the gifts of the Spirit.

In Christ,

 

[Mark777]

"But the manifestation of the Spirit is given to each one for the profit of all." (1 Cor 12:7) We could go into detail about the benefit of each of the nine gifts, but this one verse sums it up beautifully. Spiritual gifts were given for the benefit of the church and those God is drawing to himself from the world. They provide a means of mutual edification and, properly used (that's what 1 Cor 13 and 14 are all about), strengthen the unity of the body. It is a tragedy that so much of the modern church has rejected what God teaches about the gifts in His word and this includes many Pentecostal fellowships which now forbid their use in Sunday services. The gifts never caused discord; human teaching reguarding them has.
As for the emphasis on prophecy, I do not always need a healing, I do not always need to discern a spirit, I do not always need a miracle or a word of knowledge; but I always need to know the mind and heart of God.
Jesus said "As the Father has sent Me, I also send you." (Jn 20:21) The Father did not send the Son into the world powerless and devoid of supernatural manifestation, but in the power of the Spirit, demonstrating what an awesome and mighty God we serve. In the same way, Jesus has commissioned us to go in the might of His Spirit.

 

[AnandaHya]

Prophecy is not "telling the future" or about winning the lottery or predicting the next natural disasters (as the pagans, witches and false prophets would lead you to believe). It is about give God's message to His people be it warnings or blessings and the prophet's intercessory prayer for God's lost people that He be merciful and not destroy the world as it deserves to be dealt with.

To speak as a prophet or prophetess of God is to watch every word the proceeds out of your mouth for every idle word will be taken into account and can be used by the forces of darkness to destroy things of the light.

Jesus cursed a fig tree for bearing no fruit and it withered up and died.

If you think you have been given the gift of prophecy from the HOLY SPIRIT then watch ever word and ever curse you utter because who you curse and bind will be bound in Heaven and if you judge unjustly then God will bind YOU.

That is why the teaching and the scriptures say "Bless and do not curse those who revile you"

May the mercy and the grace of the Lord rain down on all who seek God with a pure heart of Repentance. May His name be glorified throughout the WHOLE EARTH. And all God's people say, AMEN. Hallejuh. Praise God on High.

Isaiah 29:5-7 (New King James Version)

5 “ Moreover the multitude of your foes
Shall be like fine dust,
And the multitude of the terrible ones
Like chaff that passes away;
Yes, it shall be in an instant, suddenly.
6 You will be punished by the LORD of hosts
With thunder and earthquake and great noise,
With storm and tempest
And the flame of devouring fire.
7 The multitude of all the nations who fight against Ariel,
Even all who fight against her and her fortress,
And distress her,
Shall be as a dream of a night vision.

 

[VW]

In this case, I am not talking about one becoming a prophet, but receiving the gift of prophecy from the Holy Spirit. This is simply speaking as one hears from God.

 

[Red33]

1Cor 14:1-3 AV
1 EAGERLY PURSUE and seek to acquire [this] love [make it your aim, your great quest]; and earnestly desire and cultivate the spiritual endowments (gifts), especially that you may prophesy (interpret the divine will and purpose in inspired preaching and teaching).
2 For one who speaks in an [unknown] tongue speaks not to men but to God, for no one understands or catches his meaning, because in the [Holy] Spirit he utters secret truths and hidden things [not obvious to the understanding].
3 But [on the other hand], the one who prophesies [who interprets the divine will and purpose in inspired preaching and teaching] speaks to men for their upbuilding and constructive spiritual progress and encouragement and consolation.

Rev 19:10
10 Then I fell prostrate at his feet to worship (to pay divine honors) to him, but he [restrained me] and said, Refrain! [You must not do that!] I am [only] another servant with you and your brethren who have [accepted and hold] the testimony borne by Jesus. Worship God! For the substance (essence) of the truth revealed by Jesus is the spirit of all prophecy [the vital breath, the inspiration of all inspired preaching and interpretation of the divine will and purpose, including both mine and yours].

1Thes 5:20,21
20 Do not spurn the gifts and *utterances of the prophets [do not depreciate prophetic revelations nor despise inspired instruction or exhortation or warning].
21 But test and prove all things [until you can recognize] what is good; [to that] hold fast.


*utterances of the prophets

Prophecy, Prophesy, Prophesying:
signifies "the speaking forth of the mind and counsel of God" (pro, "forth," phemi, "to speak:" see PROPHET); in the NT it is used
(a) of the gift, e.g., Rom 12:6; 1Cr 12:10; 13:2;
(b) either of the exercise of the gift or of that which is "prophesied," e.g., Mat 13:14; 1Cr 13:8; 14:6, 22; 1Th 5:20, "prophesying (s);" 1Ti 1:18; 4:14; 2Pe 1:20, 21; Rev 1:3; 11:6; 19:10; 22:7, 10, 18, 19.

"Though much of OT prophecy was purely predictive, see Mic 5:2, e.g., and cp. Jhn 11:51, prophecy is not necessarily, nor even primarily, fore-telling. It is the declaration of that which cannot be known by natural means, Mat 26:68, it is the forth-telling of the will of God, whether with reference to the past, the present, or the future, see Gen 20:7; Deu 18:18; Rev 10:11; 11:3. . . .

"In such passages as 1Cr 12:28; Eph 2:20, the 'prophets' are placed after the 'Apostles,' since not the prophets of Israel are intended, but the 'gifts' of the ascended Lord, Eph 4:8, 11; cp. Act 13:1; . . . ; the purpose of their ministry was to edify, to comfort, and to encourage the believers, 1Cr 14:3, while its effect upon unbelievers was to show that the secrets of a man's heart are known to God, to convict of sin, and to constrain to worship, 1Cr 14:24, 25.

*Remember this VW

1Cor 14:3 But he that prophesieth speaketh unto men to edification, and exhortation, and comfort.

 

[VW]

1Cor 14:1-3 AV


*Remember this VW

1Cor 14:3 But he that prophesieth speaketh unto men to edification, and exhortation, and comfort.

And prophets are placed before evangelists and pastors and teachers. And there is an office of prophet in the church, although today most churches will not recognize them, to their own detriment, even great harm.

You remember that, Red.

 

[VW]

It is a shame, and it is shameful behavior, that you present here.

In the name of Jesus I rebuke you.

 

[VW]

Because you seem to track my posts down to attack them and me, and this has stained all of this site for most of those here, I will not be posting here after today. All I can say is that Jesus is not well represented by your words.

In the love of Christ,
vic

 

[superdave5221]

1 Corinthians 13: 8 Love never fails ; but if there are gifts of prophecy, they will be done away ; if there are tongues, they will cease ; if there is knowledge, it will be done away. 9 For we know in part and we prophesy in part ; 10 but when the perfect comes, the partial will be done away. 11 When I was a child, I used to speak like a child, think like a child, reason like a child ; when I became a man, I did away with childish things. 12 For now we see in a mirror dimly, but then face to face ; now I know in part, but then I will know fully just as I also have been fully known. 13 But now faith, hope, love, abide these three ; but the greatest of these is love.

What is Paul talking about here? He is saying that the gifts of prophecy, etc. will be done away with, and only faith, hope, and love will abide. Certainly all of these things existed when he made this statement, so what future event is he talking about in which those "gifts" will be done away?

It cannot be the end of times, when Jesus returns. He says that faith and hope will abide. What need would there be for faith and hope, if Christ has returned? Why would we hope and have need of faith for that which we have?

In verse 10, the word "perfect" in it's Greek context means "complete". In the context of verses 11 and 12, Paul is talking about perfect knowledge, (as opposed to the incomplete or errant knowledge which will be replaced by the perfect knowledge) in our salvation, and in our certainty of Christ's return. That knowledge is contained in the completed New Testament bible. It is not surprising that those who would claim to be prophets would have a disdain for the bible, for it makes them obsolete.

It is certain that no "new" revelations (not contained in the bible) have come from those claiming to be prophets. And that is what prophets do. They reveal God's will to us. Reveal means that which was previously unknown. Since we have a complete knowledge of God's will contained in the bible, along with Holy Spirit to interpret it for us, there is no need today for prophets.

Is it not telling that the bible speaks not of true prophets of God in the last days? The bible mentions only false prophets in the last days.

Hebrews 1: 1 God, after He spoke long ago to the fathers in the prophets in many portions and in many ways, 2 in these last days has spoken to us in His Son, whom He appointed heir of all things, through whom also He made the world.

We are fortunate to have a collection of the sayings and doings of the Son. It is called the Gospels.

 

[Red33]

Because you seem to track my posts down to attack them and me, and this has stained all of this site for most of those here, I will not be posting here after today. All I can say is that Jesus is not well represented by your words.

In the love of Christ,
vic

No one tracked you down. You posted a thread and invited others to comment with your question and title of the thread. Am I being rebuked for responding to your thread or for the content of my post? If for the content of my post, it is basically quoting scripture from the Amplified Version (AV) and some comments from Vine's Dictionary and you are rebuking not just me but others that have the same convictions concerning this subject. Not posting on this site is your perrogative but that does not do away with this subject of prophecy that you feel so strong about.

 

[livingbygrace]

Because you seem to track my posts down to attack them and me, and this has stained all of this site for most of those here, I will not be posting here after today. All I can say is that Jesus is not well represented by your words.

In the love of Christ,
vic

VW

Red does track down your posts and seek to attack them, but I sincerely hope this will not stop you posting on this site after today, and that you will not give in to or be intimidated or crushed by such tactics.

Many say they are standing up for Biblical truth and will not compromise the message when making such attacks, but in reality are all too often being led by anger that comes from pride pride from the heart

And looking at it from a Biblical point of view, Christ said when carrying his cross(Living Bibkle translation)

If such things as this are done to me the living tree, what will they do to you?

Who was Jesus refering to here? The religious or non religious? Who was responsible for Christ's death on the cross? The religious, or the non religious?

I have been told I am condemned, have the spirit of antichrist in me and am a heretic-by religious people.

But I look at it this way. If I wasn't attacked by religious people I would be worried that I did not know truth, for human nature will NEVER change, it is the same now as it was two thousand years ago

Who stoned Steven to death?
Who persecuted Paul?
And who hounded Christ as a law breaker and found fault with him at every oppurtunity?

The religious or non religious?

Part of a Christians lot is to be attacked by 'religioius people' you know that, don't walk away and let them gloat in their pride, stand firm and stay

God bless

 

[superdave5221]

VW

Red does track down your posts and seek to attack them, but I sincerely hope this will not stop you posting on this site after today, and that you will not give in to or be intimidated or crushed by such tactics.

Many say they are standing up for Biblical truth and will not compromise the message when making such attacks, but in reality are all too often being led by anger that comes from pride pride from the heart

And looking at it from a Biblical point of view, Christ said when carrying his cross(Living Bibkle translation)

If such things as this are done to me the living tree, what will they do to you?

Who was Jesus refering to here? The religious or non religious? Who was responsible for Christ's death on the cross? The religious, or the non religious?

I have been told I am condemned, have the spirit of antichrist in me and am a heretic by religious people.

But I look at it this way. If I wasn't attacked by religious people I would be worried that I did not know truth, for human nature will NEVER change, it is the same now as it was two thousand years ago

Who stoned Steven to death?
Who persecuted Paul?
And who hounded Christ as a law breaker and found fault with him at every oppurtunity?

The religious or non religious?

Part of a Christians lot is to be attacked by 'religioius people' you know that, don't walk away and let them gloat in their pride, stand firm and stay

God bless

Which begs the question. Would a true prophet bow to pressures of (what you call non religious people, as if you are their judge)? Jonah ran from God's will for a time, but eventually did His bidding. He feared for his life. It seems that VW can't even take a little criticism. They certainly don't make prophets like they used to!

Perhaps it is more difficult to oppose those wielding the word of God, than it was to preach in Nineveh.

 

[Red33]

VW

Red does track down your posts and seek to attack them, but I sincerely hope this will not stop you posting on this site after today, and that you will not give in to or be intimidated or crushed by such tactics.

Many say they are standing up for Biblical truth and will not compromise the message when making such attacks, but in reality are all too often being led by anger that comes from pride pride from the heart

And looking at it from a Biblical point of view, Christ said when carrying his cross(Living Bibkle translation)

If such things as this are done to me the living tree, what will they do to you?

Who was Jesus refering to here? The religious or non religious? Who was responsible for Christ's death on the cross? The religious, or the non religious?

I have been told I am condemned, have the spirit of antichrist in me and am a heretic-by religious people.

But I look at it this way. If I wasn't attacked by religious people I would be worried that I did not know truth, for human nature will NEVER change, it is the same now as it was two thousand years ago

Who stoned Steven to death?
Who persecuted Paul?
And who hounded Christ as a law breaker and found fault with him at every oppurtunity?

The religious or non religious?

Part of a Christians lot is to be attacked by 'religioius people' you know that, don't walk away and let them gloat in their pride, stand firm and stay

God bless

To post what you have here is deluded and misleading and what you infer is not even in the same ball park (it's baseball season). Your comments have no authority or ability to take the joy away from me or others that we have in our heart. I see you and VW as two individuals that have been wounded and have attached yourself to each other through that common bond. Both of you are very sensitive in certain areas of doctrine and spiritual gifts when others do not bow to your understanding. If someone appears to get a little rough with you about what you believe, you inwardly react because you are unsettled in your heart. Those that love the word have great peace and nothing shall offend them (Ps 119:165). The word gives the believer peace and rest and the work and effect of righteousness will be peace and quiet resting places (Is 32:17). Just the fact that you both can be so unsettled points to unrest and negativity in the mind and heart. That comes from within and not from without.

 

[livingbygrace]

Which begs the question. Would a true prophet bow to pressures of (what you call non religious people, as if you are their judge)? Jonah ran from God's will for a time, but eventually did His bidding. He feared for his life. It seems that VW can't even take a little criticism. They certainly don't make prophets like they used to!

Perhaps it is more difficult to oppose those wielding the word of God, than it was to preach in Nineveh.

As I have much respect for most of what you write I am suprised by the tone of your words here.

Of course if we expect 'perfection' from Christians it is easy to find fault or question those who show human emotion when they basically are hounded

But let me ask you something

If and I will say if, someone was on this website and the main reason they were on it was not to seek glory for God but to be looked up to by others as a spiritual authority and revered by them as such, would this be someone you would look to and listen to when the placed scripture before you?

And if such a person demanded much of how others should act towards their fellow Christians, but did not themselves live by what they demanded of others would you consider such a person someone to defend, or feel they have the right to quote scripture to others to berate them?

 

[livingbygrace]

To post what you have here is deluded and misleading and what you infer is not even in the same ball park (it's baseball season). Your comments have no authority or ability to take the joy away from me or others that we have in our heart. I see you and VW as two individuals that have been wounded and have attached yourself to each other through that common bond. Both of you are very sensitive in certain areas of doctrine and spiritual gifts when others do not bow to your understanding. If someone appears to get a little rough with you about what you believe, you inwardly react because you are unsettled in your heart. Those that love the word have great peace and nothing shall offend them (Ps 119:165). The word gives the believer peace and rest and the work and effect of righteousness will be peace and quiet resting places (Is 32:17). Just the fact that you both can be so unsettled points to unrest and negativity in the mind and heart. That comes from within and not from without.

One of the first posts I read of yours on thjis site stated the following

We must always speak to our brother and sister in Christ only to edify them

The amount of people who have been on this site that know you have not practiced what you preach here is considerable.

You use scripture to conmdemn your fellow Christians and in my opinion firstly seek to be recognised by others as a spiritual authority and be looked up to as such

 

[superdave5221]

As I have much respect for most of what you write I am suprised by the tone of your words here.

Of course if we expect 'perfection' from Christians it is easy to find fault or question those who show human emotion when they basically are hounded

But let me ask you something

If and I will say if, someone was on this website and the main reason they were on it was not to seek glory for God but to be looked up to by others as a spiritual authority and revered by them as such, would this be someone you would look to and listen to when the placed scripture before you?

And if such a person demanded much of how others should act towards their fellow Christians, but did not themselves live by what they demanded of others would you consider such a person someone to defend, or feel they have the right to quote scripture to others to berate them?

I agree completely. But how can you judge someone's heart, and know the reasons that they are posting?

Why do you demand a different standard for those who "get caught up in the moment" and say things that may be considered as not edifying, and then allow a "lack of perfection" to VW? He is not immune to saying nonedifying things. I know, for I have been the object on a few occasions.

This is a debate forum, not a preschool nursery. Everyone has their own debate styles, which may include things like sarcasm. John the Baptist, Paul, and even Jesus used sarcasm in their debates with religious leaders in their times. Jesus often healed on the Sabbath with the express purpose of engaging the Pharisees in contentious debate. Would you judge their character by the fact that they may have offended their audiences?

As for the pride of being looked up to, all of us have strived with that sin before. I have prayed to God to help me to be humble, and I would imagine that even you have struggled with it. There is no need to single out Red, or anyone else for a sin that is all to common in our society.

 

[Red33]

One of the first posts I read of yours on thjis site stated the following

We must always speak to our brother and sister in Christ only to edify them

The amount of people who have been on this site that know you have not practiced what you preach here is considerable.

You use scripture to conmdemn your fellow Christians and in my opinion firstly seek to be recognised by others as a spiritual authority and be looked up to as such

If this is what you are convinced of, who is going to persuade you otherwise? To edify never means to compromise or to be sentimental in any way but to build up in the truth, whether it is received, pondered or rejected. Was it edifying to the disciples when Jesus said,...unless you eat my flesh and drink my blood you have no life in you and you can not be my disciple. Many of the disciples were offended at that saying and followed Him no more and Jesus turned to the twelve and said, 'Will you go away also' (Jn 6:53-67)? There will always be things that the Christ will have us say through the Holy Spirit that will offend and reveal the heart of the one being offended. This is not the same kind of offense referred to in (Mt 18:1-7).

When Jesus rebuked Peter He did not separate Himself from him, but tuned his back and rebuked Satan for using Peter's vocal cords to express words that were sentimentally attached to the Lord and designed to keep Him from going to the cross for the purpose of which He came (Mk 8:31-34).

 

[livingbygrace]

If this is what you are convinced of, who is going to persuade you otherwise? To edify never means to compromise or to be sentimental in any way but to build up in the truth, whether it is received, pondered or rejected. Was it edifying to the disciples when Jesus said,...unless you eat my flesh and drink my blood you have no life in you and you can not be my disciple. Many of the disciples were offended at that saying and followed Him no more and Jesus turned to the twelve and said, 'Will you go away also' (Jn 6:53-67)? There will always be things that the Christ will have us say through the Holy Spirit that will offend and reveal the heart of the one being offended. This is not the same kind of offense referred to in (Mt 18:1-7).

When Jesus rebuked Peter He did not separate Himself from him, but tuned his back and rebuked Satan for using Peter's vocal cords to express words that were sentimentally attached to the Lord and designed to keep Him from going to the cross for the purpose of which He came (Mk 8:31-34).

Is honesty vital to the Christian?

Can you honestly say that you do not seek out VWs posts and hope in your heart you may be able to find fault with them? Be honest.

Of course we can all use scripture to defend what we say and do, but it is what is driving our motives, that is all important.

A lot of people have said that you speak unkindly or nastily to people on this website, are they all wrong?

If not, are you speaking this way simply to defend the Gospel? Or is there another reason?

And does the word of God come first with you? The plain words of what are written?

Christ when he walked this earth claimed to be the Son of God, he clearly and continuously plainly stated that anyone who saw him as the son of God would have eternal life seeing him as such

But you have told me I have the Spirit of antichrist in me for simply believing Christ's words concerning how we must see him to have eternal life. So how much does the plain words of the Bible mean to you Red?

Of course you can quote scripture to justify yourself, we all can.

But nevertheless I believe Christ was who he cosisitently claimed to be. He never once demanded we see him as God Himself to have eternal life, but you do.

So personally it does not mean much to me when you quote scriptiure to me, for in effect you say those who stand on certain scripture have the spirit of antichrist in them

Please note, I have never said this to you or anyone else on this site

 

[VW]

Just to set the record straight, there is debate, and then there is tearing down.

I have been accused of tearing down, of judging the church, of being super spiritual, of many other things besides.

But this I know, from my spirit: that the tone of the replies to my posts is adversarial and this tone is growing.

I cannot and will not be party to causing another to stumble. Some of you think you are serving righteousness, but the righteousness you are serving is not God's.

I find it not only amazing, but the fulfillment of prophecy that for some the bible has replaced the Holy Spirit.

Surely, the end is near, for she has gone her own way, after her lovers, and left her betrothed.

Goodby.

 

[VW]

Is honesty vital to the Christian?

Can you honestly say that you do not seek out VWs posts and hope in your heart you may be able to find fault with them? Be honest.

Of course we can all use scripture to defend what we say and do, but it is what is driving our motives, that is all important.

A lot of people have said that you speak unkindly or nastily to people on this website, are they all wrong?

If not, are you speaking this way simply to defend the Gospel? Or is there another reason?

And does the word of God come first with you? The plain words of what are written?

Christ when he walked this earth claimed to be the Son of God, he clearly and continuously plainly stated that anyone who saw him as the son of God would have eternal life seeing him as such

But you have told me I have the Spirit of antichrist in me for simply believing Christ's words concerning how we must see him to have eternal life. So how much does the plain words of the Bible mean to you Red?

Of course you can quote scripture to justify yourself, we all can.

But nevertheless I believe Christ was who he cosisitently claimed to be. He never once demanded we see him as God Himself to have eternal life, but you do.

So personally it does not mean much to me when you quote scriptiure to me, for in effect you say those who stand on certain scripture have the spirit of antichrist in them

Please note, I have never said this to you or anyone else on this site

I am sorry brother, but this is not serving Jesus any longer.

With the hopes and prayers of His love,
vic