Satan, Hell and Judgement?

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Jun 20, 2010
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#1
Unbeliever here, ok so a few questions stemming here.
a) If judgement is not the 'heaven or hell' decision, what is it?
b) Is satan the manager of hell (biblically speaking, I seem to interpret other fallen angels ie demons, are in hell, but Satan is not)

2 Peter 2:4 KJV
"For if God spared not the angels that sinned, but cast them down to hell, and delivered them into chains of darkness, to be reserved unto judgment"
a)*this one doesn't explicity state demons are cast to hell, but does seem to say that those that are (if they are) are in chains and darkness. Does this mean fallen angels/demons are not the ones who torment [sinners] in hell, but would be alongside men in the 'lake of fire'?

Jude 1:6 KJV
"And the angels which kept not their first estate, but left their own habitation, he hath reserved in everlasting chains under darkness unto the judgment of the great day."
b)So the fallen angels are 'in chains and darkness', in hell (inferred by 2 Peter 2:4), and are awaiting judgement. What does judgement respresent?

From what I understand, there is no battle for souls (Job 1:6-11 and Luke 22:31-33- Satan needs permission to act, i.e. under sovereign control of God)...it seems he's not even a total outcast but still given some control over Earth which (dare I say it) is perhaps an instrument of God to test faith in a battle for glorification. I haven't found anything to suggest Satan is a torturer in hell of the damned (i'm not even sure he does that) or rejoices at the pain and suffering, God condemns the sinners to hell, where they go or what happens to sinners doesn't relate to the intention of Satan. Biblically speaking Satan's sole intention seems to be encouraging the rejection of god (stop the glorification of God i.e. worship), so the main question that I follow with... is; backing up with verses, c) to what extent has Satan encouraged crimes such as murder/rape/secular crimes in order to deglorify God, and in each case, do you believe these actions are under the permission of God?

I feel these questions could tie to how we percieve Satan, not as a practicioner of evil in general, but as one who 'legally?' works to deglorify god, allowed because it can swing both ways (to glorify also) as the result of trials and tribulations.

constructive criticisms and slander of these thoughts are appreciated :p
 
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Jan 18, 2011
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You're definitely on the right track. Even many Christians mistakenly think Satan is independent of God and the ruler of hell. This is way off from what the Bible actually teaches, which is that Satan works according to God's plan, and will end up a prisoner in hell along with everyone else there.

10 The devil, who deceived them, was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone where the beast and the false prophet are. And they will be tormented day and night forever and ever. (Revelation 20:10)

Satan may have turned against God, but that doesn't mean he has any power to thwart God's will. However powerful Satan may or may not be, God's power is infinite. So, let's arbitrarily say that the number 10 represents something with negligible power, such as an American voter, and the number 100 million represents Satan's relative power. Mathematically, both of them are equally insignificant relative to infinity.
 
Jun 20, 2010
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#3
Can I infer from Rev 20:7 "When the thousand years are over, Satan will be released from his prison", that he has been cast into hell before, but has since been released and won't be eternally cast there until judgement day?
 
Jan 18, 2011
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Can I infer from Rev 20:7 "When the thousand years are over, Satan will be released from his prison", that he has been cast into hell before, but has since been released and won't be eternally cast there until judgement day?
The release in 20:7 hasn't happened yet. Most of Revelation deals with the eschaton (end times), which has yet to occur but will happen at a time of God's choosing (not Harold Camping's).
 
Jun 20, 2010
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#5
So Satan has not yet been cast there either?; as Rev 20:10 is also in end-times. i.e. He's still out and about?
 
Jan 18, 2011
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So Satan has not yet been cast there either?; as Rev 20:10 is also in end-times. i.e. He's still out and about?
Looks that way. Then, during the eschaton, he gets imprisoned for 1000 years, after which he is released for a little while before being finally cast into hell for eternity.

9 So the great dragon was cast out, that serpent of old, called the Devil and Satan, who deceives the whole world; he was cast to the earth, and his angels were cast out with him. (Revelation 12:9)

8 Be sober, be vigilant; because your adversary the devil walks about like a roaring lion, seeking whom he may devour. (1 Peter 5:8)

1 And you He made alive, who were dead in trespasses and sins, 2 in which you once walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit who now works in the sons of disobedience, (Ephesians 2:1-2)

1 Then Jesus was led up by the Spirit into the wilderness to be tempted by the devil. 2 And when He had fasted forty days and forty nights, afterward He was hungry. 3 Now when the tempter came to Him, he said, "If You are the Son of God, command that these stones become bread." 4 But He answered and said, "It is written, 'Man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word that proceeds from the mouth of God.' " 5 Then the devil took Him up into the holy city, set Him on the pinnacle of the temple, 6 and said to Him, "If You are the Son of God, throw Yourself down. For it is written: 'He shall give His angels charge over you,' and, 'In their hands they shall bear you up, Lest you dash your foot against a stone.' " 7 Jesus said to him, "It is written again, 'You shall not tempt the Lord your God.' " 8 Again, the devil took Him up on an exceedingly high mountain, and showed Him all the kingdoms of the world and their glory. 9 And he said to Him, "All these things I will give You if You will fall down and worship me." 10 Then Jesus said to him, "Away with you, Satan! For it is written, 'You shall worship the Lord your God, and Him only you shall serve.' " 11 Then the devil left Him, and behold, angels came and ministered to Him. (Matthew 4:1-11)

12 Immediately the Spirit drove Him into the wilderness. 13 And He was there in the wilderness forty days, tempted by Satan, and was with the wild beasts; and the angels ministered to Him. (Mark 1:12-13)

15 And these are the ones by the wayside where the word is sown. When they hear, Satan comes immediately and takes away the word that was sown in their hearts. (Mark 4:15)

17 Then the seventy returned with joy, saying, "Lord, even the demons are subject to us in Your name." 18 And He said to them, "I saw Satan fall like lightning from heaven. 19 Behold, I give you the authority to trample on serpents and scorpions, and over all the power of the enemy, and nothing shall by any means hurt you. 20 Nevertheless do not rejoice in this, that the spirits are subject to you, but rather rejoice because your names are written in heaven." (Luke 10:17-20)

3 Then Satan entered Judas, surnamed Iscariot, who was numbered among the twelve. (Luke 22:3)

14 And no wonder! For Satan himself transforms himself into an angel of light. (2 Corinthians 11:14)

18 Therefore we wanted to come to you--even I, Paul, time and again--but Satan hindered us. (1 Thessalonians 2:18)
 
Dec 19, 2009
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#7
Hell is the natural consequence of sin, I believe. We experience it every time we sin. When we stop sinning, hell goes away. Read this:

[17] "Yet your people say, `The way of the Lord is not just'; when it is their own way that is not just.
[18] When the righteous turns from his righteousness, and commits iniquity, he shall die for it.
[19] And when the wicked turns from his wickedness, and does what is lawful and right, he shall live by it.
[20] Yet you say, `The way of the Lord is not just.' O house of Israel, I will judge each of you according to his ways." Ezekiel 33:17-20 RSV
 
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Brandon777

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#8
a) If judgement is not the 'heaven or hell' decision, what is it?
Judgement may refer to the idea of judging or Judgement Day. If you mean to know about Judgement Day look no further than Revelation Chapter 20. Verse 11 "Then I saw a great white throne and Him who sat on it, form whose face the earth and the heaven fled away. And there was found no place for them. And I saw the dead, small and great, standing before God, and books were opened. And another book was opened, which is the Book of Life. And the dead were judged according to their works, by the things which were written in the books."
b)So the fallen angels are 'in chains and darkness', in hell (inferred by 2 Peter 2:4), and are awaiting judgement. What does judgement respresent?
Judgement here is referring to the throwing of these demons into the lake of fire (Rev. 20 again). This time verse 14 "Then Death and Hades were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death and anyone not found written in the Book of Life was cast into the lake of fire."
So Satan has not yet been cast there either?; as Rev 20:10 is also in end-times. i.e. He's still out and about?
Yes, that's right. Satan leads a rebellion against God and He won't be cast into the lake until after the millennium with Christ followers lead by Jesus.
 
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Brandon777

Guest
#9
Hell is the natural consequence of sin, I believe. We experience it every time we sin. When we stop sinning, hell goes away. Read this:
I love you, you know this. Please, please stick with what the Bible say directly instead of reading too far into it. Where does the Bible say that hell will ever go away? Rather it says just the opposite. "And the Devil, who deceived them, was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone where the beast and false prophet are. And they will be tormented day and night for ever and ever" (Revelation 20: 10,15) Matthew 25:41 "Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels."

Happiness and blessings :)
 
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MaggieMye

Guest
#10
Unbeliever here, ok so a few questions stemming here.
a) If judgement is not the 'heaven or hell' decision, what is it? “Judgment” is neither heaven nor hell. It is the act of summation; of the condition of one's heart; of the frequency or lack thereof of obedience. It is the CONSEQUENCES that render heaven or hell. One could liken it to a job: You go to work and DO the work and you get a postive reward; you REFUSE to go to work OR you go but you do not DO the work and you DON'T get paid and without money you cannot eat so you die.
b) Is satan the manager of hell (biblically speaking, I seem to interpret other fallen angels ie demons, are in hell, but Satan is not) Satan is the creatED angel, Lucifer, turned prideful and rebellious. Lucifier means, son of the morning or “shining one”, but he lost that meaning when he chose spiritual darkness.
The fallen angels are locked in chains. They are STILL angels, even in their fallen state. Demons are a separate spiritual entity in their own right.

2 Peter 2:4 KJV
"For if God spared not the angels that sinned, but cast them down to hell, and delivered them into chains of darkness, to be reserved unto judgment"
a)*this one doesn't explicity state demons are cast to hell, but does seem to say that those that are (if they are) are in chains and darkness. Does this mean fallen angels/demons are not the ones who torment [sinners] in hell, but would be alongside men in the 'lake of fire'? See above. Again, the fallen angels are LOCKED UP and the demons that God created are under the authority of Satan, yet can do nothing with out God allowing as HE is the ONLY GOD and Satan is an angel of darkness and must submit to God at all times. God ALLOWS Satan to have his way in our lives because of unrepented sin or generational curses that are in place in our lives.


Jude 1:6 KJV
"And the angels which kept not their first estate, but left their own habitation, he hath reserved in everlasting chains under darkness unto the judgment of the great day."
b)So the fallen angels are 'in chains and darkness', in hell (inferred by 2 Peter 2:4), and are awaiting judgement. What does judgement respresent? “Judgment” is the ACT or Process of EVATLUATION.

From what I understand, there is no battle for souls (Job 1:6-11 and Luke 22:31-33- Satan needs permission to act, i.e. under sovereign control of God)...it seems he's not even a total outcast but still given some control over Earth which (dare I say it) is perhaps an instrument of God to test faith in a battle for glorification. I haven't found anything to suggest Satan is a torturer in hell of the damned (i'm not even sure he does that) neither have I, at least the word 'torture' does not show up in the KJV or NASB in that context. or rejoices at the pain and suffering, God condemns the sinners to hell, where they go or what happens to sinners doesn't relate to the intention of Satan. Biblically speaking Satan's sole intention seems to be encouraging the rejection of god (stop the glorification of God i.e. worship), right; his main objective is to STEAL from God that which He created and loves SO MUCH! so the main question that I follow with... is; backing up with verses, c) to what extent has Satan encouraged crimes such as murder/rape/secular crimes in order to deglorify God, and in each case, do you believe these actions are under the permission of God?
Yes, they are permitted by God.
For God to NOT allow it is to violate a person's free will; it would be to FORCE obedience and then it is no longer true obedience. Satan takes glee when people commit murder because it CUTS OFF the destiny of the person killed...that being to KNOW and LOVE God. Satan takes pleasure when rape and other crimes occur because very few people know how to respond to such great offenses in a GODLY manner and so open the door of their soul and then the devil and his demons can step in an greatly influence the person's emotions and thinking in a way that draws them AWAY from God.

I feel these questions could tie to how we percieve Satan, not as a practicioner of evil in general, but

as one who 'legally?' works to deglorify god, allowed because it can swing both ways (to glorify also) as the result of trials and tribulations. It is Allowed because God is a righteous God; He has given free will to humans who can chose to obey Him or not. When they chose not, He has no choice but to ALLOW our adversary to have at us, but stealing the destiny that God created for us, each, individually; by destroying us physically, emotionally and mentally; and by even killing us so those of the human race that do not know God never have a chance to know Him.
Maggie

 
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AnandaHya

Guest
#11
this world has a set of rules that have to obeyed. the ones you as a nonbeliever of God will be most comfortable with are the laws of Nature as outlined by science.

for example the law of gravity: what comes up must come down (at least while on Earth until you reach the outer atmosphere orbiting altitude)

In the same way the world is ruled by SPIRITUAL laws that all beings including demons, angels, humans, animals, etc must obey. if you know anything about Eastern religion it is called the law of Karma or in wicca it is called the threefold rule. Or in the Bible it is known as the second commandment that Jesus gave: love one another. What the world and other religions do not tell you is the FIRST commandment.

the First commandment tells you how to defy the law of spiritual gravity or karma. it tell you how to reach and go beyond orbiting altitude. It tells you about Heaven if you have faith to believe.

The first commandment is to love God with all your heart soul and mind. The Truth will set you free and the truth is that Jesus Christ came and died for your sins and if He did not, all would be judged and damned to Hell. If you learn of the moral laws of any religion you will learn they set a standard that only GOD can live up to. We are not saved through works but through grace and faith. though we do works out of love for God and to share HIS love for us with others.

I pray He touches your heart and teaches you the freedom of flight after being freed from your sins and the bonds of karma. In Jesus name we pray.