Hell

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Feb 16, 2011
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#1
I believe Hell has real fire! The Bible says fear God who can destroy both your body and soul!
 
Apr 24, 2011
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#3
So that's what you believe, alright. But I'm curious, who deserves to go there? I assume this fire is eternal yes? As in hundreds of years multiplied by millions of years to the trillionth power, except infinitely longer than that? I don't think anyone deserves that, I don't think anyone could possibly deserve that, not even the worst mass murderers of our history. What's your opinion on who deserves it? Just curious.
 
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Crazy4GODword

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#4
So that's what you believe, alright. But I'm curious, who deserves to go there? I assume this fire is eternal yes? As in hundreds of years multiplied by millions of years to the trillionth power, except infinitely longer than that? I don't think anyone deserves that, I don't think anyone could possibly deserve that, not even the worst mass murderers of our history. What's your opinion on who deserves it? Just curious.
Actually, God is trying to prevent people from entering hell. Pretend you warn someone that there is a rockslide up on the mountain and to turn around, but instead ignores you.....well you were trying to prevent them from going but they didn't want your time. God loves us so much, that's why Jesus died for us....so we can escape hell.
 
Mar 15, 2011
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#5
So that's what you believe, alright. But I'm curious, who deserves to go there? I assume this fire is eternal yes? As in hundreds of years multiplied by millions of years to the trillionth power, except infinitely longer than that? I don't think anyone deserves that, I don't think anyone could possibly deserve that, not even the worst mass murderers of our history. What's your opinion on who deserves it? Just curious.
Doesn't quite fit in with a loving God that forgives his children does it.
Is there anyone of you who could burn your child for ever & ever for anything? God is so much more loving & forgiving than we are sooooo,
who exactly is hell for? We know it's for Satan & the false prophet for sure, but who else ? Fallen Angels?
 
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Crazy4GODword

Guest
#6
Doesn't quite fit in with a loving God that forgives his children does it.
Is there anyone of you who could burn your child for ever & ever for anything? God is so much more loving & forgiving than we are sooooo,
who exactly is hell for? We know it's for Satan & the false prophet for sure, but who else ? Fallen Angels?
I agree, doesn't fit in GOD's nature. God actually became a man and suffered and was tempted as us and then die by suffering on a cross, all just so you can be free. Jesus washed all sins away from man, but the only way man can receive forgiveness and be washed is by going to Jesus Himself.
 
Apr 24, 2011
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Actually, God is trying to prevent people from entering hell. Pretend you warn someone that there is a rockslide up on the mountain and to turn around, but instead ignores you.....well you were trying to prevent them from going but they didn't want your time. God loves us so much, that's why Jesus died for us....so we can escape hell.
To my understanding... God created the rockslide, and then created a plan which put you in its path (no human can avoid sin, they're heading for it.) Then made the rockslide invisible, but provided a book teaching about it, but there are hundreds of other false books (other religions you know) saying other things, and then once the rockslide hits them, even if they were very nice caring people, they don't even get to die, they're tortured forever and ever in the eternal pit of hell... All the while god could have changed any aspect of this situation.

I don't think the analogy is fair unless it's given some edits that I just described. Hell is actually my biggest problem WITHIN Christian doctrine, I don't think it can be resolved but I'll keep an open mind. If someone could solve this problem of hell it would help a lot of other Christians struggling with the idea.
 
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djness

Guest
#8
As I live, saith the Lord GOD, I have no pleasure in the death of the wicked; but that the wicked turn from his way and live: turn ye, turn ye from your evil ways; for why will ye die... (Ezekiel 33:11)
The Lord is...not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance. (II Peter 3:9)
 
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Crazy4GODword

Guest
#9
To my understanding... God created the rockslide, and then created a plan which put you in its path (no human can avoid sin, they're heading for it.) Then made the rockslide invisible, but provided a book teaching about it, but there are hundreds of other false books (other religions you know) saying other things, and then once the rockslide hits them, even if they were very nice caring people, they don't even get to die, they're tortured forever and ever in the eternal pit of hell... All the while god could have changed any aspect of this situation.

I don't think the analogy is fair unless it's given some edits that I just described. Hell is actually my biggest problem WITHIN Christian doctrine, I don't think it can be resolved but I'll keep an open mind. If someone could solve this problem of hell it would help a lot of other Christians struggling with the idea.
Friend, it is not God's nature. These thing like other religions and other stuff are tests to see whether you would come or not. God is right now calling like a father calling for his lost children who ran away in the night, crying saying, "please come please I want you here with me and not out there where the wolves lye". It is called a discision or a free will, this is a great gift that He gave us. Without it as you think should happen, there is no love we would be like robots....must do must do.....and no free will, it is up to man to pick but God helps!!!!! Please don't be closed minded because of this!
 
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djness

Guest
#10
To my understanding... God created the rockslide, and then created a plan which put you in its path (no human can avoid sin, they're heading for it.) Then made the rockslide invisible, but provided a book teaching about it, but there are hundreds of other false books (other religions you know) saying other things, and then once the rockslide hits them, even if they were very nice caring people, they don't even get to die, they're tortured forever and ever in the eternal pit of hell... All the while god could have changed any aspect of this situation.

I don't think the analogy is fair unless it's given some edits that I just described. Hell is actually my biggest problem WITHIN Christian doctrine, I don't think it can be resolved but I'll keep an open mind. If someone could solve this problem of hell it would help a lot of other Christians struggling with the idea.
Somenone did solve the problem of hell, but not in the same way I think you are looking for it to be solved.
Why did Jesus have to die for our sins?


by Matt Slick

Basically, the reason Jesus had to die for our sins was so that we could be forgiven and go to be with the Lord. Jesus is God in flesh (John 1:1,14; Col. 2:9) and only God can satisfy the Law requirements of a perfect life and perfect sacrifice that cleanses us of our sins.
All people have sinned against God. But, God is infinitely holy and righteous. He must punish the sinner, the Law- breaker. If He didn't, then His law is not Law for there is no law that is a law without a punishment. The punishment for breaking the Law is death, separation from God. Therefore, we sinners need a way to escape the righteous judgment of God. Since we are stained by sin and cannot keep the Law of God, then the only one who could do what we cannot is God Himself. That is why Jesus is God in flesh. He is both divine and human. He was made under the Law (Gal. 4:4) and He fulfilled it perfectly. Therefore, His sacrifice to God the Father on our behalf is of infinite value and is sufficient to cleanse all people from their sins and undo the offense to God.
The following outline is an attempt to break this down, step by step, using scripture and logic. I hope that it helps you understand why God is our savior and not some created thing. Also, I hope that it helps you understand that you must trust in Christ alone for the forgiveness of your sins; that you can do nothing on your own to merit salvation from God.

  1. God exists.
    1. Gen. 1:1, "In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth."
  2. God is infinite
    1. Psalm 90:2, "Before the mountains were born, Or Thou didst give birth to the earth and the world, Even from everlasting to everlasting, Thou art God."
    2. Psalm 147:5, "Great is our Lord, and abundant in strength; His understanding is infinite."
    3. Jer. 23:24, "Can a man hide himself in hiding places, So I do not see him?” declares the Lord. “Do I not fill the heavens and the earth?” declares the Lord."
  3. God is holy
    1. Isaiah 6:3, "And one called out to another and said, “Holy, Holy, Holy, is the Lord of hosts, The whole earth is full of His glory.”
    2. Rev. 4:8 "And the four living creatures, each one of them having six wings, are full of eyes around and within; and day and night they do not cease to say, "Holy, holy, holy, is the Lord God, the Almighty, who was and who is and who is to come."
  4. God is righteous
    1. Neh. 9:32-33, "Now therefore, our God, the great, the mighty, and the awesome God, who dost keep covenant and lovingkindness, Do not let all the hardship seem insignificant before Thee, Which has come upon us, our kings, our princes, our priests, our prophets, our fathers, and on all Thy people, From the days of the kings of Assyria to this day. 33“However, Thou art just in all that has come upon us."
    2. 2 Thess. 1:6, "For after all it is only just for God to repay with affliction those who afflict you."
  5. Therefore, God is infinitely holy and just.
  6. Furthermore, God speaks out of the character of what He is.
    1. Matt. 12:34, "...For the mouth speaks out of that which fills the heart."
  7. God spoke the Law
    1. Exodus 20:1-17, "Then God spoke all these words, saying, 2 “I am the Lord your God, who brought you out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of slavery. 3 “You shall have no other gods before Me...."
  8. Therefore, the Law is in the heart of God and is a reflection of God's character since it is Holy and good.
    1. Rom. 7:12, "So then, the Law is holy, and the commandment is holy and righteous and good."
  9. Furthermore, to break the Law of God is to offend Him since it is His Law that we break. This sin results in an infinite offense because God is infinite.
  10. Furthermore, it is also right that God punish the Law breaker. To not punish the Law breaker (sinner) is to allow an offense against His holiness to be ignored.
    1. Amos 2:4, "Thus says the Lord, “For three transgressions of Judah and for four I will not revoke its punishment, because they rejected the law of the Lord And have not kept His statutes."
    2. Rom. 4:15, "...for the Law brings about wrath."
  11. God says that the person who sins must die (be punished). The wages of sin is death.
    1. Ezekiel 18:4, "Behold, all souls are Mine; the soul of the father as well as the soul of the son is Mine. The soul who sins will die."
    2. Rom. 6:23, "For the wages of sin is death, but the free gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord."
  12. The sinner needs to escape the righteous judgment of God or he will face damnation.
    1. Rom. 1:18, "For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who suppress the truth in unrighteousness."
    2. Matt. 25:46, "And these will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life."
  13. But, no sinner can undo an infinite offense since to please God and make things right, he must obey the Law, which is the standard of God's righteous character.
    1. Gal. 2:16, "...by the works of the Law shall no flesh be justified."
    2. Gal. 2:21, "I do not nullify the grace of God; for if righteousness comes through the Law, then Christ died needlessly."
  14. But the sinner cannot fulfill the law because he is sinful (in the flesh).
    1. Rom. 8:3, "For what the Law could not do, weak as it was through the flesh, God did: sending His own Son..."
  15. Since the sinner cannot fulfill the law and satisfy God, it follows that only God can do this.
    1. This is simple logic. If we are unable to fulfill the Law, then we will be punished by it. But, since God desires us to be saved, the Law must be satisfied. Since we cannot keep the Law and it must be satisfied, then the only one capable of keeping the Law must keep the Law: God.
  16. Jesus is God in flesh.
    1. John 1:1,14, "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.... 14 And the Word became flesh, and dwelt among us, and we beheld His glory, glory as of the only begotten from the Father, full of grace and truth."
    2. Col. 2:9, "For in Him all the fullness of Deity dwells in bodily form."
  17. Jesus was also a man under the Law.
    1. 1 Tim. 2:5, "For there is one God, and one mediator also between God and men, the man Christ Jesus."
    2. Gal. 4:4-5, "But when the fullness of the time came, God sent forth His Son, born of a woman, born under the Law, 5in order that He might redeem those who were under the Law, that we might receive the adoption as sons."
  18. Jesus became sin for us and bore our sins in His body on the cross, thus fulfilling the Law.
    1. 2 Cor. 5:21, "He made Him who knew no sin to be sin on our behalf, that we might become the righteousness of God in Him."
    2. 1 Peter 2:24, "and He Himself bore our sins in His body on the cross, that we might die to sin and live to righteousness; for by His wounds you were healed."
    3. Rom. 8:3-4, "For what the Law could not do, weak as it was through the flesh, God did: sending His own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh and as an offering for sin, He condemned sin in the flesh, 4so that the requirement of the Law might be fulfilled in us, who do not walk according to the flesh, but according to the Spirit."
  19. Therefore, salvation is by grace through faith since it was not by our keeping the Law, but by Jesus, God in flesh, who fulfilled the Law and died in our place.
    1. Eph. 2:8-9, "For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God; 9 not as a result of works, that no one should boast."
    2. Gal. 3:13, "Christ redeemed us from the curse of the Law, having become a curse for us — for it is written, "Cursed is everyone who hangs on a tree."
    3. Eph. 5:2, "and walk in love, just as Christ also loved you, and gave Himself up for us, an offering and a sacrifice to God as a fragrant aroma."
 
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Crazy4GODword

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#11
Jesus is awesome :)
 
Apr 24, 2011
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#12
Friend, it is not God's nature. These thing like other religions and other stuff are tests to see whether you would come or not. God is right now calling like a father calling for his lost children who ran away in the night, crying saying, "please come please I want you here with me and not out there where the wolves lye". It is called a discision or a free will, this is a great gift that He gave us. Without it as you think should happen, there is no love we would be like robots....must do must do.....and no free will, it is up to man to pick but God helps!!!!! Please don't be closed minded because of this!
I'm not being close minded when I take offense to the worst sort of cruelty imaginable. God created hell, god put us all in a situation in which we were condemned to it, god made the criteria upon which souls would be judged, I cannot see how he is not responsible for every soul in hell.

Also, if he wanted to give us free will, then why is everyone who chooses the option that is not him going to suffer eternal torture? That is not free will, that is a conform or die ultimatum! And beyond that, why did the punishment for not choosing him have to be so cruel? Couldn't there be a choice to have god or not, but the consequences for not choosing god wouldn't have to be torture? That wouldn't make us robots, that would give us more free will than if we did have eternal torture.

@ Djness...
You're basically explaining that god's standard is perfection, and is far greater than we could ever hope to achieve. But we didn't ask to be born, we couldn't help that we were born inferior to god's standard. He's holding what are essentially children (us) up to the standard of an adult (him) I believe it's immoral for him to sentence a punishment of such incredible cruelty for us not being perfect, for us not meeting a literally perfect standard.

EDIT: also, way past my bedtime, can't respond again till tomorrow. Have at it though.
 
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Crazy4GODword

Guest
#13
Hope this convicted you, you need it friend. I should pray for you. I love you friend out of my heart, you would be amazed at GOD's plan and be happy, but it seems you put a stumbling block in front.

God Save
 
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djness

Guest
#14
I'm not being close minded when I take offense to the worst sort of cruelty imaginable. God created hell, god put us all in a situation in which we were condemned to it, god made the criteria upon which souls would be judged, I cannot see how he is not responsible for every soul in hell.

Also, if he wanted to give us free will, then why is everyone who chooses the option that is not him going to suffer eternal torture? That is not free will, that is a conform or die ultimatum! And beyond that, why did the punishment for not choosing him have to be so cruel? Couldn't there be a choice to have god or not, but the consequences for not choosing god wouldn't have to be torture? That wouldn't make us robots, that would give us more free will than if we did have eternal torture.

@ Djness...
You're basically explaining that god's standard is perfection, and is far greater than we could ever hope to achieve. But we didn't ask to be born, we couldn't help that we were born inferior to god's standard. He's holding what are essentially children (us) up to the standard of an adult (him) I believe it's immoral for him to sentence a punishment of such incredible cruelty for us not being perfect, for us not meeting a literally perfect standard.

EDIT: also, way past my bedtime, can't respond again till tomorrow. Have at it though.
It's the entire point of Jesus dying, Laylie, so that God can look at us being covered by what Jesus did. So we do look like Him. We are up tot he standard.

John 3:16-18King James Version (KJV)


16For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
17For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.
18He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God
 
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AnandaHya

Guest
#15
Hell is eternal seperation from God. It is like locking yourself in a closet and when someone comes along to set you free of sin you attack them and accuse them of putting you there in the first place. God did not create the world to be sinful and suffer. People chose to do so and when Jesus comes and tries to set them free, they attack. I've seen it acted out in the very young. My nephew somehow as hiding in the closet and the door shut and he couldn't get out but no one found him. Eventually my son walked by and heard him and open the door. the first thing the little boy did was try and punch him and beat him up. we talked to him and eventually he admitted that my son didn't really put him in the closet and he was just the first person he saw when let out. He didn't want to admit that he did it to himself. It is understandable in a 3 year old, but I hope that more years and walking and talking with God would have people understand better His loving nature and how He wants to set us free of the chains of sin that we have wrapped so tightly around us. He wants to remove the burdens He never intended for us to have in the first place. He wants to wash us clean of all the wrong things done to us and by us. He wants us to forgive others because He has forgiven us our trespass if we but believe in the saving grace of Christ Jesus.

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Apr 24, 2011
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@ Djness
I don't believe that putting Jesus into the mix absolves god of any cruelty here. Jesus is one potential escape from what we were originally condemned to. That and Jesus isn't actually a choice do you want to go to hell or not, people don't believe in hell or the validity of the religion that says it exists. If god wanted to offer us a fair choice he wouldn't have been so subjective.

@Crazy4Godword
Many Christians have this same problem, but in the end they say "I can't understand it but I'm just going to trust god" I simply can't do that, I need to understand why something that seems unbelievably cruel is actually just. I didn't put a stumbling block in front, god did when he set up this situation in which I can't believe in a loving god who also created and judged that all sinners must go to hell.

Hell is eternal seperation from God. It is like locking yourself in a closet and when someone comes along to set you free of sin you attack them and accuse them of putting you there in the first place. God did not create the world to be sinful and suffer. People chose to do so and when Jesus comes and tries to set them free, they attack.
This comparison doesn't fit. We couldn't possibly put ourselves in hell unless god first created it and then made the criteria for which souls are judged that condemns every single one of us there. That and you don't deny that we were born into this 'closet' as we were born into our condemnation to hell, what choice did we have other than to already be stuck there? From the earliest moment we can remember we've been condemned to hell/stuck in the closet. Then there's the matter that if god simply truly showed himself or proved his existence, no one would attack him, but the way he's "trying to let us out of the closet" is in a way where no one can be sure if he actually exists.

Then there's also the fact that if we stay in the closet because we don't think there's a way out, he'll instead of pulling us out of the closet, show himself to us, and then lock us in the closet forever and ever so we can't possibly ever get out, and he'll also make the closet a place of torture where there is unbearable agony. He won't let you out even after billions of years after he's locked you there forever. And beyond that, if I saw a child in a dangerous and harmful situation, I'm going to pull them out of it and make sure they're alright, even if they fight me over it. They're a child, as adults it's our responsibility to protect them, shouldn't god be doing the same?

All these comparisons about us choosing to go to hell don't work... No one chooses hell, they just don't believe it exists, and god isn't proving that it exists either, nor when we die is he offering us a choice personally, we're just condemned no matter what... I've explained my problems with the concept of hell as described, and why I cannot believe in it, that's my stance.

That's why I see annihilation as more consistent with the idea of a loving god, don't you think annihilation makes more sense?
 
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Feb 16, 2011
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The Bible really teaches that people either know "about the rockslid" or don't! One scripture about hell says people recieve less punishment if they never knew! The servant who knew his masters will and did evil recieves more stripes than the servant who never knew! I think eternal punishment is in different levels of punishment because of this verse. It also warns in the Bible that those who put Christ to open shame will receive punishment. God spared not His own Son, how much sore a punishment those who put Him to open shame and tred on His bood?
 
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I assume your talking of Luke 12:48, being beated with a few stripes (lashes) as opposed to the usual 'up to 40'. This relates to punishments on earth, i.e. jewish law.

Leviticus 5:17 "If a person sins and does what is forbidden in any of the LORD's commands, even though he does not know it, he is guilty and will be held responsible.

I don't see how 'Hell' can be cooled down to be less of a punishment. You either get cast there, or you don't.
 
Dec 19, 2009
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I believe Hell has real fire! The Bible says fear God who can destroy both your body and soul!
Hell is what happens to you when you sin, I believe. Heaven is what happens when you don’t sin:

[17] "Yet your people say, `The way of the Lord is not just'; when it is their own way that is not just.
[18] When the righteous turns from his righteousness, and commits iniquity, he shall die for it.
[19] And when the wicked turns from his wickedness, and does what is lawful and right, he shall live by it.
[20] Yet you say, `The way of the Lord is not just.' O house of Israel, I will judge each of you according to his ways." Ezekiel 33:17-20 RSV

 
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ezekialswheel

Guest
#20
To understand this subject we need to understand the CHARACTER iof God. In the old testament they had an Ark that God told them to make. On top of the Ark was 2 cheribum with wings covering the "mercy seat", I think its significant that this place where God would manifest his presence is called the "MERCY seat".It could have been called the LOVE seat or the GRACE seat or the JUDGES seat or anything God would want, Correct?


But God calls it the MERCY seat. This is significant in that this must be Gods attribute He wants us to understand about Him. God is merciful! Amen?


If that is true then what does a merciful God have a use for a place where ignorant morons go to burn forever and ever and ever? Its against His character!


In the new testament Jesus says, If you, then, though you are evil, know how to give good gifts to your children, how much more will your Father in heaven give good gifts to those who ask him! Mathew7:11

I just think this verse shows how infinately more kind and loving and merciful than I am.

If thats so, then how is it that evil me, would have no use for a place of ETERNAL TORMENT but a loving creator God would? Makes no sence.

If this is the case I would be abliged to do a bible study on the subject, because we have been taught eternal hell from the time we were children. But theoretically we are grown up now and it should be time we check it out for ourselves. Amen? This is the command of scripture is it not?


Thats why I have done exactly that and I discovered they have been lying to us about hell. Ahaa! I can prove it biblically, but it would take to long and most people believe what they WANT to believe and not what the bible says anyway so it would be fruitless to document everything I found.

Suffice it to say Ill hit a couple of the high points.

The first one is a quote of somebody else though I wish I had said it myself. "The word hell is an unfortunate mistranslation of an old english word."

I would like to pause here for an hour while that tidbit sinks in or Ide like to say it twice and then again. "The word HELL is an UNFORTUNATE MISTRANSLATION of an old english word"


Hell is an old english word that means "to cover over." Its understandable now isnt it? To cover over! As in BURIED. A use in a sentence would be."I have to hell my roof today", or, "Are you going to hell the potatoes today?"


A little church history here would be invaluble. Can anybody say "supersticious?" The people werent even allowed to OWN a bible in the days before the reformation! No wonder they call it the dark ages eh? The church were the only ones allowed to own a bible or teach it. They used misinformation and lies to ring money from there converts and hell was a convenient way to do exactly that. It was also about this time that the book "Dantes inferno" came out. I believe the King liked the book and it became popular. Dantes Inferno was a place where all the people were put to be tortured and burned and ripped limb from limb for eternity for not obeying the edicts of the church.


This is the the place that we get our word hell from so is it any surprise that some of that superstition clings to the word? Weve had the King James Bible for over 400 years correct? FORTUNATELY we now have other translations we can check. If youll notice the word hell hardly even exists in most modern translations but the superstision persists. Very unfortunate.


And we havnt even opened our bibles yet! I wont go there because that is YOUR responsibility! Do what Paul said when he was at Berea. See Acts 17:11. However I will recamend a Strongs concordance and look up the meanings of the following words. Hades. Sheol. Gehenna. These are the three words translated hell in the KJV of the bible. Once you know the meanings of the words go back and read the passages again that have the word hell in them and your eyes will be opened.

So in conclusion we thank God for Grace and our Lord Jesus Christ. Amen.