Question about Salvation

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
S

Shyness

Banned
#1
Aug 17, 2007
496
4
18
#1
I have read the verses and for some reason, I do believe in good works as a requirement of faith per James 2:26 which states faith without works is dead. I dd read where it says that We are saved by faith and not by our works but somehow I understand that as good works alone does not save but without good works, there is no faith for faith without works is dead and without faith, it's impossible to please God which I understand that if good works are mandatory for true faith, then good works are also mandatory for salvation. I was just wondering if it is true but I do believe to be saved that I must do God's will.[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica]
[/FONT]
 
A

Adrianv125

Senior Member
#2
Jan 17, 2011
567
12
18
#2
Romans 12

Living Sacrifices to God

I beseech you therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God, that you present your bodies a living sacrifice, holy, acceptable to God, which is your reasonable service. 2 And do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewing of your mind, that you may prove what is that good and acceptable and perfect will of God.

The pattern of this world is sin.

1 John 2:3-6

3 Now by this we know that we know Him, if we keep His commandments. 4 He who says, “I know Him,” and does not keep His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him. 5 But whoever keeps His word, truly the love of God is perfected in him. By this we know that we are in Him. 6 He who says he abides in Him ought himself also to walk just as He walked.

His commandments are His word.

1 John 1:5-6

5 This is the message which we have heard from Him and declare to you, that God is light and in Him is no darkness at all. 6 If we say that we have fellowship with Him, and walk in darkness, we lie and do not practice the truth.

Again, darkness is sin.


So from these passages we can see that:

1. We are called become a sacrifice that is holy (set apart) before God.
2. In order to do this we must keep His commands (His word)
3. But doing step one and two are useless if we are walking in darkness

So in reality we must first confess our sins, repent from them sincerely, keep His commands, and then we will become a living holy sacrifice unto God that is acceptable to Him and capable of being used by Him. When you do these steps that's when you will prove what is that good and perfect will of God.

Faith without fruits of the Holy Spirit in you is dead. The fruit of the spirit is love. And if what you love and worship isn't God then your faith is vain.
 
W

WordGaurdian

Senior Member
#3
May 1, 2011
473
8
0
#3
Shyness said:
I have read the verses and for some reason, I do believe in good works as a requirement of faith per James 2:26 which states faith without works is dead. I dd read where it says that We are saved by faith and not by our works but somehow I understand that as good works alone does not save but without good works, there is no faith for faith without works is dead and without faith, it's impossible to please God which I understand that if good works are mandatory for true faith, then good works are also mandatory for salvation. I was just wondering if it is true but I do believe to be saved that I must do God's will.
Click to expand...
Good Morning

To your question: For salvation good works are not necessary. For spiritual growth they are. You will not please God without faith. To grow in faith you must grow in obedience. You cannot grow in obedience if you do not do good works. So simplified to grow spiritually you need to do good works. For salvation 1 John 5.

Peace be with you.
 
Z

zackabba

Guest
#5
#5
Well I believe Adrian, Guardian and Paul87 have provided better answers than the one I'm about to give, but...

...realize this.

Paul was writing (in books like Romans) to the Jewish people who still wanted to remain under their law.

"For we hold that one is justified by faith apart from works of the law." (Romans 3:28)

works of the law = the Torah law of the OT, the law that could not save nor redeem.



Now James does say that faith without works is dead. He was talking mainly to people who were already believers.



Likewise, Paul himself says:

"He will render to each one according to his works:" (Romans 2:6)

Here, works is referring to the works of the law written on our hearts, and the fruits of the Spirit, which are eternal.




So, they both agree if you look in their proper contexts. It seems like Paul is contradicting James (or the other way around); even the same example of Abraham is used, and the same terminology and phrasing.


However, when read in context we can see that both actually complimented each other, and didn't contradict each other.






We must never focus on doing good works.

Instead, we should always focus on loving, knowing, and abiding in God, that is, Our Father, the Holy Spirit within us, and our Savior Jesus Christ.




Grace and Love
 
A

Alabasterboxky

Guest
#6
#6
Well actually in order to be saved you must believe that Jesus is what the bible says he is. In order to believe you must have some faith. Once you are saved and you begin this journey of faith, your actions begin to change and as you read the word of God, your faith begins to take shape in your actions. Does that mean you will never displease God...I doubt it. But that is why grace is so wonderful, because when we realize and YOU WILL, that you have messed up, God is willing and able to forgive you, set you back on the right path and FORGET IT!!!!

God does expect our behavior to line up with his word. Our actions are a direct result of our faith. They prove what kind of person we are and who we serve. If I say I am a christian and my fruit say otherwise, then the devil has me fooled. My fruit should reflect the tree, apples can't bear oranges, plums can't bear bananas. Our fruit may be a little odd shaped and be hard to tell what it is but as time goes by and we read, listen, learn Gods will for our lives, our fruit will become very evident no one will question from what tree shook it off.
 
VW

VW

Banned
#7
Dec 22, 2009
4,579
9
0
#7
The only "good works" are those done in and by the power of God throughout the agency of the Holy Spirit.
 
Red33

Red33

Banned
#8
Jun 24, 2010
3,822
19
0
#8
Alabasterboxky said:
Well actually in order to be saved you must believe that Jesus is what the bible says he is. In order to believe you must have some faith. Once you are saved and you begin this journey of faith, your actions begin to change and as you read the word of God, your faith begins to take shape in your actions. Does that mean you will never displease God...I doubt it. But that is why grace is so wonderful, because when we realize and YOU WILL, that you have messed up, God is willing and able to forgive you, set you back on the right path and FORGET IT!!!!

God does expect our behavior to line up with his word. Our actions are a direct result of our faith. They prove what kind of person we are and who we serve. If I say I am a christian and my fruit say otherwise, then the devil has me fooled. My fruit should reflect the tree, apples can't bear oranges, plums can't bear bananas. Our fruit may be a little odd shaped and be hard to tell what it is but as time goes by and we read, listen, learn Gods will for our lives, our fruit will become very evident no one will question from what tree shook it off.
Click to expand...
This comes from a very mature believer who has walked with God and gotten to know Him by faith through the grace of God.
 
phil36

phil36

Senior Member
#9
Feb 12, 2009
8,260
2,111
113
51
#9
Hi Shyness,

As stated above. James is talking about works for those who have Faith already. He is not talking to those who are not christian. Whereas Paul is talking about works to those who are not saved..

Paul says.. Good works will not get you saved or save you!

James says... If you are saved and have Faith it will manifest itself in good works..ie the fruit of the spirit.

So good works will never save any man, but to those who are saved (have Faith) good works will show that faith through the bearing fruits of the Spirit.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.