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Thread: Is the New Covenant for Israel only?

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    Default Re: Is the New Covenant for Israel only?

    Quote Originally Posted by distinctiveministry View Post
    Only by severing v4 from v3, where Paul clearly and EXPLICITLY states that he is talking about Israelites who are his kin ACCORDING TO THE FLESH, can we spiritualize "Israel" in the rest of this chapter. Paul says not all who are descended from Israel are Israelites, but he never says people who are NOT descended from Israel ARE Israelites. I know it is common practice in Christian circles to spiritualize Israel and the Law and the covenants, but it is exactly the fact that THE ONLY WAY WE CAN RELATED TO THESE THINGS IS BY SPIRITUALIZING that proves my point: The New Covenant is a real covenant that God has made with fleshly Israel through the blood of Jesus the Messiah.
    In Abraham's seed (Jesus) all the nations of the earth will be blessed. We have reconciliation with God on the basis of Christ's finished work, without reference to the New Covenant. The inheritance that belongs to Jew and Gentile alike by faith is God's Holy Spirit.
    Not sure he calls the church the Israel of God (Galatians 6:16). To whom exactly he is refering is vague, but it seems that it is NOT the Galatians.

    Being grafted into the olive tree does not make one and Israelite, it makes one a beneficiary of the root that supports the olive tree.

    Paul also does not say that Gentiles have become citizens of the commonwealth of Israel, only that they were formerly excluded from the commonwealth of Israel. Citizenship and inclusion are quite different.

    PS- I'm not a dispensationalist, so how do you discredit me?
    Weapons of mass confusion.

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    Default Re: Is the New Covenant for Israel only?

    Quote Originally Posted by Strangelove View Post
    Weapons of mass confusion.
    Easier to cast aspersions than to address issues, right?

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    Default Re: Is the New Covenant for Israel only?

    Originally Posted by 4runner
    The time of the Gentiles is from the time that the gentile were given the gospel (Cornelius) to the return of Christ. At which point every Jew that has not bowed to anti christ will receive Jesus as Messiah.
    Quote Originally Posted by Abiding View Post
    common answer, not the only answer, but the latest one historically.
    Oh ya, doesnt say times of the gentiles.
    well I am not so concerned with the common answer as I am with the biblical one. The reason i believe the time of the Gentile is the time from Cornelius to Christ return in because of a similar reference to the time of the Gentile in Luke 21

    Luke 21
    24 And they shall fall by the edge of the sword, and shall be led away captive into all nations: and Jerusalem shall be trodden down of the Gentiles, until the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled.
    25 And there shall be signs in the sun, and in the moon, and in the stars; and upon the earth distress of nations, with perplexity; the sea and the waves roaring;
    26 Men's hearts failing them for fear, and for looking after those things which are coming on the earth: for the powers of heaven shall be shaken.
    27 And then shall they see the Son of man coming in a cloud with power and great glory.


    The fulfilling of the time of the Gentile immediately precedes the return of Christ in Luke, and it is fair to believe that the same reference in Romans would also immediately precede the return of Christ.

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    Default Re: Is the New Covenant for Israel only?

    Quote Originally Posted by distinctiveministry View Post
    Easier to cast aspersions than to address issues, right?
    Right!....

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    Default Re: Is the New Covenant for Israel only?

    Quote Originally Posted by distinctiveministry View Post
    What I am advocating is not that there are two different gospels or two different ways to God or even two different outcomes, but rather that the New Covenant is the basis for God's ongoing relationship with Israel in place of the Mosaic covenant, while the Gentile's relationship with God is based on God's promises to Abraham in Genesis 12, namely, that God will bless all the nations of the earth through Abraham's seed. Unless you are Jewish the New Covenant doesn't have any direct impact on your relationship with God. Jesus and his work on the cross certainly do, but the covenants do not.
    same covenant dude.
    Abe: faith.
    Law kills/instructs...shows our dire condition (schoolmaster), faith saves. the Law came AFTER the PROMISE.

    see? PROMISE OF REDEMPTION FIRST, then comes LAW TO SHOW WHY NEEDED.

    no jew no gentile now: one new man, ONE FAITH, ONE BAPTISM, ONE FOLD, ONE COVENANT, ONE CHURCH, ONE PEOPLE - ONE LORD.

    ONE GOSPEL.
    (Cyrus Scofield has no part in it)

    NOT COMPLICATED. see this little word NOW? WHEN did Paul say they could receive mercy?

    1900+ years ago onwards....or sometime after 2011?

    ROMANS 11:31
    so they too have now become disobedient in order that they too may now receive mercy as a result of God's mercy to you. (NIV)

    so they too have now been disobedient in order that by the mercy shown to you they also may now receive mercy. (ESV)

    so these also now have been disobedient, that because of the mercy shown to you they also may now be shown mercy. (NASB)
    Last edited by zone; August 9th, 2011 at 12:07 PM.
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    Default Re: Is the New Covenant for Israel only?

    Quote Originally Posted by 4runner View Post
    well I am not so concerned with the common answer as I am with the biblical one. The reason i believe the time of the Gentile is the time from Cornelius to Christ return in because of a similar reference to the time of the Gentile in Luke 21

    Luke 21
    24 And they shall fall by the edge of the sword, and shall be led away captive into all nations: and Jerusalem shall be trodden down of the Gentiles, until the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled.
    25 And there shall be signs in the sun, and in the moon, and in the stars; and upon the earth distress of nations, with perplexity; the sea and the waves roaring;
    26 Men's hearts failing them for fear, and for looking after those things which are coming on the earth: for the powers of heaven shall be shaken.
    27 And then shall they see the Son of man coming in a cloud with power and great glory.


    The fulfilling of the time of the Gentile immediately precedes the return of Christ in Luke, and it is fair to believe that the same reference in Romans would also immediately precede the return of Christ.
    `````````````````````````````````````````````````` ````
    well when you came in we were in romans 11:25 different topic

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    Default Re: Is the New Covenant for Israel only?

    Quote Originally Posted by zone View Post
    same covenant dude.
    Abe: faith.
    Law kills/instructs...shows our dire condition (schoolmaster), faith saves. the Law came AFTER the PROMISE.

    see? PROMISE OF REDEMPTION FIRST, then comes LAW TO SHOW WHY NEEDED.

    no jew no gentile now: one new man, ONE FAITH, ONE BAPTISM, ONE FOLD, ONE COVENANT, ONE CHURCH, ONE PEOPLE - ONE LORD.

    ONE GOSPEL.
    (Cyrus Scofield has no part in it)

    NOT COMPLICATED. see this little word NOW? WHEN did Paul say they could receive mercy?

    1900+ years ago onwards....or sometime after 2011?

    ROMANS 11:31
    so they too have now become disobedient in order that they too may now receive mercy as a result of God's mercy to you. (NIV)

    so they too have now been disobedient in order that by the mercy shown to you they also may now receive mercy. (ESV)

    so these also now have been disobedient, that because of the mercy shown to you they also may now be shown mercy. (NASB)
    The New Covenant explicitly involves God writing His LAWS on the hearts and minds of His people. I would think you would be pulling in the other direction given your aversion to the Law.

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    Default Re: Is the New Covenant for Israel only?

    Quote Originally Posted by distinctiveministry View Post
    The New Covenant explicitly involves God writing His LAWS on the hearts and minds of His people. I would think you would be pulling in the other direction given your aversion to the Law.
    aversion to the Law?
    what a wretched thing to say!
    the Law is written on our hearts (minds).
    but do you think it looks like this?



    and that's my beloved dylan....who said he was a christian for a time.
    what's that thing on his forhead DM? THE LAW?

    IN....IN.....in the heart (mind).
    i know what adultery is now...do you DM?
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    Default Re: Is the New Covenant for Israel only?

    Quote Originally Posted by distinctiveministry View Post
    The New Covenant explicitly involves God writing His LAWS on the hearts and minds of His people. I would think you would be pulling in the other direction given your aversion to the Law.
    Hey guys are we allowed to cite the Apostle Paul to this guy or does he have a 'new perspective'?

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    Default Re: Is the New Covenant for Israel only?

    Quote Originally Posted by 4runner View Post
    Paul says that the Church is the Israel of God. He also says that the Gentile have been grafted into the good olive tree which is Israel, and furthermore he says that Gentile believers have become citizens of the commonwealth of Israel.... But you cant believe this biblical truth you are a dispensationalist. your doctrine trumps scripture.
    Wow, You are messed up.

    1. The tree is not Israel. Israel is the "natural branch" on the tree. The tree is God (namely Christ). Paul calls the tree the Olive tree. Isreal are the natural branches. Gentiles are the unnatural branches.


    19 You will say then, “Branches were broken off that I might be grafted in.” 20 Well said.Because of unbelief they were broken off, and you stand by faith. Do not be haughty, but fear.21 For if God did not spare the natural branches, He may not spare you either. 22 Therefore consider the goodness and severity of God: on those who fell, severity; but toward you, goodness,[f] if you continue in His goodness. Otherwise you also will be cut off. 23 And they also, if they do not continue in unbelief, will be grafted in, for God is able to graft them in again. 24 For if you were cut out of the olive tree which is wild by nature, and were grafted contrary to nature into a cultivated olive tree, how much more will these, who are natural branches, be grafted into their own olive tree?

    second. Did you read Romans 11? You could not have read it and said what you just said.

    25 For I do not desire, brethren, that you should be ignorant of this mystery, lest you should be wise in your own opinion, that blindness in part has happened to Israel until the fullness of the Gentiles has come in. 26 And so all Israel will be saved,[g] as it is written:


    The Deliverer will come out of Zion,
    And He will turn away ungodliness from Jacob;
    27 For this is My covenant with them,
    When I take away their sins.[h]


    28 Concerning the gospel they are enemies for your sake, but concerning the election they are beloved for the sake of the fathers.

    Do you want to be ignorant of the mystery? What is the mystery spoken of in the NT? THE CHURCH! Israel is Blind in part (there are still jews who will be saved) Until the fullness (greek word means complete) of the gentiles. In other word, until the TIME OF THE GENTILES is completed. When will this happen?

    If the jews had it. And because of their rejection God took it away from them and through Paul gave it over the the gentiles. It would be the church. When this time is complete. what will happen?

    1. All Israel will be saved. (No Gentile is mentioned here. This is not the church this is a people. Natural jews)
    2. Jeremiah will be fulfilled. It is Gods covenant with them (Israel not the church)

    God finishes with a stern warning.

    1. Isreal is an enemy for the sake of the gospel.

    2. They are BELOVED for the sake of election. Gods covenants with them STILL STAND.

    as for the rest of your post. It is not even worth responding to. Try giving some meat instead of ad hominem attacks.
    Eternally Grateful for the grace God has shown a wretched soul such as myself.

    Rom 8:1 There is therefore now no condemnation to those who are in Christ Jesus,

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    Default Re: Is the New Covenant for Israel only?

    Quote Originally Posted by Strangelove View Post
    Hey guys are we allowed to cite the Apostle Paul to this guy or does he have a 'new perspective'?
    You can cite away, but make sure you actually understand him, first. You keep quoting verses where you use "spiritual" interpretations rather than taking things to mean what they actually say. Nothing in what Paul argues from Romans 9-11 justifies your allegorical interpretation, since Paul is clear about when he understands things allegorically (he SAYS when he understands things to be allegory or metaphor) versus when he is being literal (any time he does not specify allegory/metaphor).

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    Default Re: Is the New Covenant for Israel only?

    Quote Originally Posted by zone View Post
    aversion to the Law?
    what a wretched thing to say!
    the Law is written on our hearts (minds).
    but do you think it looks like this?



    and that's my beloved dylan....who said he was a christian for a time.
    what's that thing on his forhead DM? THE LAW?

    IN....IN.....in the heart (mind).
    i know what adultery is now...do you DM?
    The Law isn't written on your heart and mind- you aren't a Jew. Unless you are trying to say now that you ARE under the law?

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    Default Re: Is the New Covenant for Israel only?

    Quote Originally Posted by eternally-gratefull View Post
    Wow, You are messed up.

    1. The tree is not Israel. Israel is the "natural branch" on the tree. The tree is God (namely Christ). Paul calls the tree the Olive tree. Isreal are the natural branches. Gentiles are the unnatural branches.

    Do you want to be ignorant of the mystery? What is the mystery spoken of in the NT? THE CHURCH! Israel is Blind in part (there are still jews who will be saved) Until the fullness (greek word means complete) of the gentiles. In other word, until the TIME OF THE GENTILES is completed. When will this happen?

    If the jews had it. And because of their rejection God took it away from them and through Paul gave it over the the gentiles. It would be the church. When this time is complete. what will happen?

    1. All Israel will be saved. (No Gentile is mentioned here. This is not the church this is a people. Natural jews)
    2. Jeremiah will be fulfilled. It is Gods covenant with them (Israel not the church)

    God finishes with a stern warning.

    1. Isreal is an enemy for the sake of the gospel.

    2. They are BELOVED for the sake of election. Gods covenants with them STILL STAND.

    as for the rest of your post. It is not even worth responding to. Try giving some meat instead of ad hominem attacks.
    If someone converts to Judaism tomorrow do they automatically become party to certain prophecy?

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    Default Re: Is the New Covenant for Israel only?

    Quote Originally Posted by eternally-gratefull View Post
    Wow, You are messed up.

    1. The tree is not Israel. Israel is the "natural branch" on the tree. The tree is God (namely Christ). Paul calls the tree the Olive tree. Isreal are the natural branches. Gentiles are the unnatural branches.


    19 You will say then, “Branches were broken off that I might be grafted in.” 20 Well said.Because of unbelief they were broken off, and you stand by faith. Do not be haughty, but fear.21 For if God did not spare the natural branches, He may not spare you either. 22 Therefore consider the goodness and severity of God: on those who fell, severity; but toward you, goodness,[f] if you continue in His goodness. Otherwise you also will be cut off. 23 And they also, if they do not continue in unbelief, will be grafted in, for God is able to graft them in again. 24 For if you were cut out of the olive tree which is wild by nature, and were grafted contrary to nature into a cultivated olive tree, how much more will these, who are natural branches, be grafted into their own olive tree?

    second. Did you read Romans 11? You could not have read it and said what you just said.

    25 For I do not desire, brethren, that you should be ignorant of this mystery, lest you should be wise in your own opinion, that blindness in part has happened to Israel until the fullness of the Gentiles has come in. 26 And so all Israel will be saved,[g] as it is written:


    The Deliverer will come out of Zion,
    And He will turn away ungodliness from Jacob;
    27 For this is My covenant with them,
    When I take away their sins.[h]


    28 Concerning the gospel they are enemies for your sake, but concerning the election they are beloved for the sake of the fathers.

    Do you want to be ignorant of the mystery? What is the mystery spoken of in the NT? THE CHURCH! Israel is Blind in part (there are still jews who will be saved) Until the fullness (greek word means complete) of the gentiles. In other word, until the TIME OF THE GENTILES is completed. When will this happen?

    If the jews had it. And because of their rejection God took it away from them and through Paul gave it over the the gentiles. It would be the church. When this time is complete. what will happen?

    1. All Israel will be saved. (No Gentile is mentioned here. This is not the church this is a people. Natural jews)
    2. Jeremiah will be fulfilled. It is Gods covenant with them (Israel not the church)

    God finishes with a stern warning.

    1. Isreal is an enemy for the sake of the gospel.

    2. They are BELOVED for the sake of election. Gods covenants with them STILL STAND.

    as for the rest of your post. It is not even worth responding to. Try giving some meat instead of ad hominem attacks.
    Dispensationalist falsely teach that God dealt with Israel before the cross, but since the cross He has been dealing with the Church, but after the rapture He will once again turn His attention toward Israel. This is also a false teaching. Their problem is not only do they have no scripture to corroborate this belief, but it directly opposes what the Bible does teach on the matter. Here are a few passages on what God does have to say about the union between Israel and the Church.
    Romans 2:28-29
    28 For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; neither is circumcision, which is outward in the flesh:
    29 But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God.

    Romans 10:12 For there is no difference between Jew and the Greek: for the same Lord is rich unto all that call upon his name.

    Romans 11:16-24
    16 For if the firstfruit be holy, the lump is also holy: and if the root be holy, so are the branches.
    17 And if some of the branches be broken off, and thou being a wild olive tree, wert grafted in among them, and with them partake of the root and fatness of the olive tree:
    18 Boast not against the branches. But if thou boast thou bearest not the root, but the root thee.
    19 Thou wilt say then, the branches were broken off that I might be grafted in.
    20 Well: because of unbelief they were broken off, and thou standeth by faith. Be not high minded but fear.
    21 For if God spared not the natural branches, take heed lest he also spare not thee.
    22 Behold therefore the goodness and severity of God: on them which fell, severity; but toward thee goodness, if thou continue in his goodness: otherwise thou shall also be cut off.
    23 And they also if they abide not still in unbelief, shall be grafted in: for God is able to graft them in again.
    24 For if thou wert cut out of the olive tree that is wild by nature, and were grafted in contrary to nature into the good olive tree: how much more shall these, which be the natural branched be grated into there own olive tree?

    Romans 12:5 So we being many, are one body in Christ, and every one member one of another.

    Galatians 3:28-29
    28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus.
    29 And if you be Christ's, then you are Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.

    Galatians 6:15-16
    15 For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision availeth anything, nor uncircumcision, but a new creature.
    16 And as many as walk according to this rule, peace upon them, and mercy, and upon the Israel of God.

    Ephesians 2:11-19
    11 Wherefore remember, that ye being in times past Gentiles in the flesh, who are called Uncircumcision by that which is called the Circumcision in the flesh made by hands.
    12 That at times past you were without Christ, being aliens from the commonweath of Israel, and strangers from the covenants of promise, having no hope, and without God in the world:
    13 But now in Christ Jesus ye who sometimes were far off are made nigh by the blood of Christ.
    14 For He is our peace, who hath made both one, and hath broken down the middle wall of partition between us;
    15 Having abolished in His flesh the enmity, even the law of commandment in ordinances; for to make in Himself of twain one new man, so making peace;
    16 And that He might reconcile both unto God in one body by the cross, having slain the enmity thereby:
    17 And came and preached peace to you that were afar off, and to them that were nigh.
    18 For through Him we both have access by one Spirit unto the Father.
    19 Now therefore ye are no more strangers and foreigners, but fellow citizens with the saints, and of the household of God.

    Ephesians 4:4-6
    4 There is one body, and one Spirit, even as you are called in one hope of your calling;
    5 One Lord, one faith, one baptism,
    6 One God and Father of us all, who is above all, and through us all, and in you all.



    We can clearly see that scripture teaches, the Jew and Gentile/Israel and the Church have become one new man. That there is only one Faith, and that we are all apart of the same body in Christ. That a Jew is not one that is a Jew outwardly, but a Jew is one that is one inwardly circumcised in the heart by the Spirit, regardless of blood line. Scripture tells us that believing Gentiles have been grafted into the good Olive Tree which is Israel, who's root is Christ, and whoever has been baptized into Christ, have become citizens of the true Israel of God with the saints, being seeds of Abraham, heirs according to the promise. We have not replaced Israel at all, but we are included with them in all the promises of God, being one with and equal to them, not separate from them in any way.

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    Default Re: Is the New Covenant for Israel only?

    Quote Originally Posted by 4runner View Post
    Dispensationalist falsely teach that God dealt with Israel before the cross, but since the cross He has been dealing with the Church, but after the rapture He will once again turn His attention toward Israel. This is also a false teaching. Their problem is not only do they have no scripture to corroborate this belief, but it directly opposes what the Bible does teach on the matter. Here are a few passages on what God does have to say about the union between Israel and the Church.
    Romans 2:28-29
    28 For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; neither is circumcision, which is outward in the flesh:
    29 But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God.

    Romans 10:12 For there is no difference between Jew and the Greek: for the same Lord is rich unto all that call upon his name.

    Romans 11:16-24
    16 For if the firstfruit be holy, the lump is also holy: and if the root be holy, so are the branches.
    17 And if some of the branches be broken off, and thou being a wild olive tree, wert grafted in among them, and with them partake of the root and fatness of the olive tree:
    18 Boast not against the branches. But if thou boast thou bearest not the root, but the root thee.
    19 Thou wilt say then, the branches were broken off that I might be grafted in.
    20 Well: because of unbelief they were broken off, and thou standeth by faith. Be not high minded but fear.
    21 For if God spared not the natural branches, take heed lest he also spare not thee.
    22 Behold therefore the goodness and severity of God: on them which fell, severity; but toward thee goodness, if thou continue in his goodness: otherwise thou shall also be cut off.
    23 And they also if they abide not still in unbelief, shall be grafted in: for God is able to graft them in again.
    24 For if thou wert cut out of the olive tree that is wild by nature, and were grafted in contrary to nature into the good olive tree: how much more shall these, which be the natural branched be grated into there own olive tree?

    Romans 12:5 So we being many, are one body in Christ, and every one member one of another.

    Galatians 3:28-29
    28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus.
    29 And if you be Christ's, then you are Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.

    Galatians 6:15-16
    15 For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision availeth anything, nor uncircumcision, but a new creature.
    16 And as many as walk according to this rule, peace upon them, and mercy, and upon the Israel of God.

    Ephesians 2:11-19
    11 Wherefore remember, that ye being in times past Gentiles in the flesh, who are called Uncircumcision by that which is called the Circumcision in the flesh made by hands.
    12 That at times past you were without Christ, being aliens from the commonweath of Israel, and strangers from the covenants of promise, having no hope, and without God in the world:
    13 But now in Christ Jesus ye who sometimes were far off are made nigh by the blood of Christ.
    14 For He is our peace, who hath made both one, and hath broken down the middle wall of partition between us;
    15 Having abolished in His flesh the enmity, even the law of commandment in ordinances; for to make in Himself of twain one new man, so making peace;
    16 And that He might reconcile both unto God in one body by the cross, having slain the enmity thereby:
    17 And came and preached peace to you that were afar off, and to them that were nigh.
    18 For through Him we both have access by one Spirit unto the Father.
    19 Now therefore ye are no more strangers and foreigners, but fellow citizens with the saints, and of the household of God.

    Ephesians 4:4-6
    4 There is one body, and one Spirit, even as you are called in one hope of your calling;
    5 One Lord, one faith, one baptism,
    6 One God and Father of us all, who is above all, and through us all, and in you all.


    We can clearly see that scripture teaches, the Jew and Gentile/Israel and the Church have become one new man. That there is only one Faith, and that we are all apart of the same body in Christ. That a Jew is not one that is a Jew outwardly, but a Jew is one that is one inwardly circumcised in the heart by the Spirit, regardless of blood line. Scripture tells us that believing Gentiles have been grafted into the good Olive Tree which is Israel, who's root is Christ, and whoever has been baptized into Christ, have become citizens of the true Israel of God with the saints, being seeds of Abraham, heirs according to the promise. We have not replaced Israel at all, but we are included with them in all the promises of God, being one with and equal to them, not separate from them in any way.
    I'm not arguing that Jew and Gentile form two separate peoples of God, but rather that HOW these two groups become part of the people of God is distinct. Gentiles are reconciled to God through Christ on account of the promises that God made to Abraham. Jews are reconciled to God through Christ on account of the covenant that God promised in Jeremiah 31. Both groups are reconciled through Christ, but on the basis of different promises.

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    Default Re: Is the New Covenant for Israel only?

    Quote Originally Posted by distinctiveministry View Post
    The Law isn't written on your heart and mind- you aren't a Jew. Unless you are trying to say now that you ARE under the law?
    SERIOUS? lol DM

    exactly WHO is doing the work, causing these Promises to come to pass concerning this Covenant that GOD ALONE cut with Abraham, DM?
    WHO is circumcising hearts DM?
    WHO is raising the dead to life?

    HOW is he able to justify the ungodly?

    Ezekiel 36:27
    And I will put my Spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes and be careful to obey my rules.

    Joel 2:29
    Even on the male and female servants in those days I will pour out my Spirit.

    1 Corinthians 12:13
    For in one Spirit we were all baptized into one body—Jews or Greeks, slaves or free—and all were made to drink of one Spirit.

    The Lutheran Church—Missouri Synod

    http://www.lcms.org/

    ~

    Sooner or later, somebody is going to insist that the Bible be studied, and then there will be disunity.
    Gary Summers

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    Default Re: Is the New Covenant for Israel only?

    Quote Originally Posted by zone View Post
    SERIOUS? lol DM

    exactly WHO is doing the work, cuasing these Promises to come to pass concerning this Covenant that GOD ALONE cut with Abraham, DM?

    Ezekiel 36:27
    And I will put my Spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes and be careful to obey my rules.

    Joel 2:29
    Even on the male and female servants in those days I will pour out my Spirit.

    1 Corinthians 12:13
    For in one Spirit we were all baptized into one body—Jews or Greeks, slaves or free—and all were made to drink of one Spirit.
    Paul is clear that our inheritance as Gentiles- God's holy Spirit, is one and the same as that which the Jews have on account of the New Covenant. We just receive the Spirit because God promised to Abraham to bless all the peoples of the world.

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    Default Re: Is the New Covenant for Israel only?

    Quote Originally Posted by distinctiveministry View Post
    You can cite away, but make sure you actually understand him, first. You keep quoting verses where you use "spiritual" interpretations rather than taking things to mean what they actually say. Nothing in what Paul argues from Romans 9-11 justifies your allegorical interpretation, since Paul is clear about when he understands things allegorically (he SAYS when he understands things to be allegory or metaphor) versus when he is being literal (any time he does not specify allegory/metaphor).
    SERIOUS? lol DM

    exactly WHO is doing the work, cuasing these Promises to come to pass concerning this Covenant that GOD ALONE cut with Abraham, DM?

    Ezekiel 36:27
    And I will put my Spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes and be careful to obey my rules.

    Joel 2:29
    Even on the male and female servants in those days I will pour out my Spirit.

    1 Corinthians 12:13
    For in one Spirit we were all baptized into one body—Jews or Greeks, slaves or free—and all were made to drink of one Spirit.
    Are you sure Paul didnt mean LITERALLY DRINK THE SPIRIT...like...we have a cup full of spirit and we are made to actually drink it. Coz Paul didnt specify allegory or metaphor there dollface!

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    Default Re: Is the New Covenant for Israel only?

    Quote Originally Posted by Strangelove View Post
    If someone converts to Judaism tomorrow do they automatically become party to certain prophecy?
    exactly.
    will we get an answer to that?
    are the Khazars Hebrews?
    what about Indonesian jews?
    american jews?
    chinese jews?

    are they Hebrews?
    and if they were, SHOULDN'T THEY BE THINKING ABOUT PRESSING INTO THAT NEW COVENANT RIGHT ABOUT NOW?

    The Lutheran Church—Missouri Synod

    http://www.lcms.org/

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    Sooner or later, somebody is going to insist that the Bible be studied, and then there will be disunity.
    Gary Summers

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    Default Re: Is the New Covenant for Israel only?

    24: ... not from the Jews only but also from the Gentiles?
    25: As indeed he says in Hosea,
    "Those who were not my people
    I will call `my people,'
    and her who was not beloved
    I will call `my beloved.'"
    26: "And in the very place where it was said to them, `You are not my
    people,' they will be called `sons of the living God.'"
    27: And Isaiah cries out concerning Israel: "Though the number of the sons of Israel be as the sand of the sea, only a remnant of them will be saved;
    30: What shall we say, then? That Gentiles who did not pursue righteousness have attained it, that is, righteousness through faith;
    31: but that Israel who pursued the righteousness which is based on law did not succeed in fulfilling that law.
    32: Why? Because they did not pursue it through faith, but as if it were based on works. They have stumbled over the stumbling stone,
    33: as it is written,
    "Behold, I am laying in Zion a stone that will make men stumble,
    a rock that will make them fall;
    and he who believes in him will not be put to shame."

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