How I became Post-Trib Rapture from a Pre-Trib denomination

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Feb 16, 2011
2,957
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#1
I was previously someone who believed Pre-trib rapture and have heard alot about Pre-trib from my denomination and from Bible College. I find one problem with Pre-trib rapture teaching I do not believe was ever addressed and that is Matthew 24:29-31.

Matthew 24:29-31 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken: 30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. 31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

This verse guarantees a Post-Tribulation Rapture. The only theory I can offer Pre-Tribulation teachers is that they must now believe in two rapture events! The problem with that is, that there is not a verse that proclaims that there will be two rapture events. Matthew 24:29-31 is Jesus coming to gather His saints. I believe that this passage of Scripture should be placed alongside other verses that are concerning the Rapture. This is most definitely the Rapture.

This verse adds angels to the Rapture teaching. To be honest I was never taught that the angels had anything to do with it. It could be due to a complete avoidance of this passage by Pre-Trib preachers and teachers. This is the verse that changed my view of the Rapture to Post-Trib and I suspect that that is the reason that this verse was never addressed. I believe Pre-Trib believers avoid these verses. They are not usually quoted or taught with other Rapture verses in Pre-Trib denominations.
 
L

Laodicea

Guest
#2
I was previously someone who believed Pre-trib rapture and have heard alot about Pre-trib from my denomination and from Bible College. I find one problem with Pre-trib rapture teaching I do not believe was ever addressed and that is Matthew 24:29-31.

Matthew 24:29-31 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken: 30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. 31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

This verse guarantees a Post-Tribulation Rapture. The only theory I can offer Pre-Tribulation teachers is that they must now believe in two rapture events! The problem with that is, that there is not a verse that proclaims that there will be two rapture events. Matthew 24:29-31 is Jesus coming to gather His saints. I believe that this passage of Scripture should be placed alongside other verses that are concerning the Rapture. This is most definitely the Rapture.

This verse adds angels to the Rapture teaching. To be honest I was never taught that the angels had anything to do with it. It could be due to a complete avoidance of this passage by Pre-Trib preachers and teachers. This is the verse that changed my view of the Rapture to Post-Trib and I suspect that that is the reason that this verse was never addressed. I believe Pre-Trib believers avoid these verses. They are not usually quoted or taught with other Rapture verses in Pre-Trib denominations.
God Bless you
Acts 17:11
(11) These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so.


 

zone

Senior Member
Jun 13, 2010
27,214
164
63
#3
I was previously someone who believed Pre-trib rapture and have heard alot about Pre-trib from my denomination and from Bible College.
kudos jonathan.
it takes courage and conviction to say this:
Re: How I became Post-Trib Rapture from a Pre-Trib denomination

how is your church taking your shift in position? do you discuss it?
zone.
 
Feb 16, 2011
2,957
24
0
#4
kudos jonathan.
it takes courage and conviction to say this:
Re: How I became Post-Trib Rapture from a Pre-Trib denomination

how is your church taking your shift in position? do you discuss it?
zone.
I have talked with a friend or two from Bible College about it. One was considering changing his view but said he didn't think he could see the whole picture yet. I haven't been able to change anyone's mind. I believe they need to read Matthew 24:29-31 for themselves. I have not told my church as a whole because I have not been asked to speak.
 
1

1still_waters

Guest
#5
Putting down the Hal Lindsey sauce and picking up the Bible can do wonders.
 
A

Abiding

Guest
#6
Paul said the man of sin must come first.......way past the socalled middle of a 7 year period
Peter said we are Looking and waiting for the eternal state and Christs return.
Jude looks for judgement day
guess there just isnt any talk of premil in the places there should have been a mention. hmmm
 
Feb 16, 2011
2,957
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#7
I definitlly believe in Pre-Millenialism. It has to be the future because those who reign with Christ are those who did not take the mark of the beast which has not happened yet, Revelation 20:4. I do not see how anyone believes that the Millenial Reign started 2,000 years ago when Christ said the Kingdom is come unto you. It's been 2,000 years that means if it started in Christ time that it is already over. Revelation places the thousand year Reign with Christ after the Tribulation because all of those who did not take the mark of the Beast will be reigning with Christ. I do not believe it is figurative because they are real people from a real event (the Tribulation) and God does not lie and has no shadow of turning. No doubt there is a kingdom of God now and those who reign with Christ are part of that Kingdom but to say that the thousand year reign is not real is blasphemous.
 

zone

Senior Member
Jun 13, 2010
27,214
164
63
#8
I definitlly believe in Pre-Millenialism. It has to be the future because those who reign with Christ are those who did not take the mark of the beast which has not happened yet, Revelation 20:4. I do not see how anyone believes that the Millenial Reign started 2,000 years ago when Christ said the Kingdom is come unto you. It's been 2,000 years that means if it started in Christ time that it is already over. Revelation places the thousand year Reign with Christ after the Tribulation because all of those who did not take the mark of the Beast will be reigning with Christ. I do not believe it is figurative because they are real people from a real event (the Tribulation) and God does not lie and has no shadow of turning. No doubt there is a kingdom of God now and those who reign with Christ are part of that Kingdom but to say that the thousand year reign is not real is blasphemous.
oh puleeze.

you believed in pretrib once and now don't!

why so adament you're certain about the period termed a thousand years?

~

Revelation 20:1-6, the only passage in the Bible which speaks explicitly of a thousand-year reign.

Note first that the passage obviously divides itself into two parts: verses 1-3, which describe the binding of Satan; and verses 4-6, which describe the thousand-year reign of souls with Christ.

The premillennial interpretation of these verses sees them as describing a millennial reign of Christ on earth which will occur after his Second Coming. And it is true that the Second Coming of Christ has been referred to in the previous chapter (see 19:11-16). If, then, one thinks of Revelation 20 as describing what follows chronologically after what is described in chapter 19, one would indeed conclude that the millennium of Revelation 20:1-6 will come after the return of Christ.

As has been indicated above, however, chapters 20-22 comprise the last of the seven sections of the book of Revelation and therefore do not describe what follows the return of Christ.

Rather, Revelation 20:1 takes us back once again to the beginning of the New Testament era.

That this is the proper interpretation of these verses is clear not only from what has been developed above, but also from the fact that this chapter describes the defeat and final doom of Satan. Surely the defeat of Satan began with the first coming of Christ, as has already been clearly spelled out in chapter 12:7-9. That the millennial reign described in verses 4-6 occurs before the Second Coming of Christ is evident from the fact that the final judgment, described in verses 11-15 of this chapter, is pictured as coming after the thousand-year reign. Not only in the book of Revelation but elsewhere in the New Testament the final judgment is associated with the Second Coming of Christ. (See Revelation 22:12 and the following passages: Mt. 16:27; 25:31-32; Jude 14-15; and especially 2 Thess. 1:7-10.)

This being the case, it is obvious that the thousand-year reign of Revelation 20:4-6 must occur before and not after the Second Coming of Christ.

http://www.the-highway.com/amila_Hoekema.html

its really not hard jonathan.
just lay aside the same approach to scripture that had you duped by pretrib.
you can always go back if you want (you won't).
 

zone

Senior Member
Jun 13, 2010
27,214
164
63
#9
just lay aside the same approach to scripture that had you duped by pretrib.
you can always go back if you want (you won't).
jonathan:

you valiantly repaired one GAP inserted into scripture that wasn't there: pretrib.

a couple more to go.

there's the one that claims Joel didn't really prophesy of Pentecost (which Peter confirmed - "this is that"), but inserted a 1900+ year GAP and said it would come as "Latter Rain".

another GAP is the theory that The Kingdom was Postponed for 2000+ years when some jews rejected Jesus - ditch it! Daniel 9 is fulfilled.



once you close those GAPS you'll see there's no NEED for a 1,000 GAP between the 2nd Advent and Judgment.
it ain't in there.
 
Oct 2, 2011
416
3
0
#10
I was previously someone who believed Pre-trib rapture and have heard alot about Pre-trib from my denomination and from Bible College. I find one problem with Pre-trib rapture teaching I do not believe was ever addressed and that is Matthew 24:29-31.

Matthew 24:29-31 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken: 30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. 31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

This verse guarantees a Post-Tribulation Rapture. The only theory I can offer Pre-Tribulation teachers is that they must now believe in two rapture events! The problem with that is, that there is not a verse that proclaims that there will be two rapture events. Matthew 24:29-31 is Jesus coming to gather His saints. I believe that this passage of Scripture should be placed alongside other verses that are concerning the Rapture. This is most definitely the Rapture.

This verse adds angels to the Rapture teaching. To be honest I was never taught that the angels had anything to do with it. It could be due to a complete avoidance of this passage by Pre-Trib preachers and teachers. This is the verse that changed my view of the Rapture to Post-Trib and I suspect that that is the reason that this verse was never addressed. I believe Pre-Trib believers avoid these verses. They are not usually quoted or taught with other Rapture verses in Pre-Trib denominations.
Matthew 24 was my first clue in changing from pretrib to post trib as well ;)

I also am a pre mill believer. So where the Apostles and their original disciples
 
P

peterT

Guest
#11
I have talked with a friend or two from Bible College about it. One was considering changing his view but said he didn't think he could see the whole picture yet. I haven't been able to change anyone's mind. I believe they need to read Matthew 24:29-31 for themselves. I have not told my church as a whole because I have not been asked to speak.
I spoke in my church, a Pentecostal church and they tried to cast out the devil in me just for speaking Matt24.
29 And now, Lord, behold their threatenings: and grant unto thy servants, that with all boldness they may speak thy word,

Acts 5:42 And daily in the temple, and in every house, they ceased not to teach and preach Jesus Christ.

31 Preaching the kingdom of God, and teaching those things which concern the Lord Jesus Christ, with all confidence, no man forbidding him.
 
J

jimmydiggs

Guest
#13
I'm not sure having a post-trib rapture even makes sense. Who is there left to rapture?
 

tribesman

Senior Member
Oct 13, 2011
4,612
274
83
#14
I'm not sure having a post-trib rapture even makes sense. Who is there left to rapture?
You hit that one good. LOL.

Seriously, the flaws of rapturism and a trib-period of a certain numbers of years is not that hard to spot. The issue of millenialism is a little more tricky. Postmillenialism and especially amillenialism would have the strongest warrant in Scripture, as I see it. Futurism is a risky road. Waiting for prophecies to be fulfilled that has already been fulfilled thousands of years ago seems is a step closer to judaism.
 
Last edited:
Oct 2, 2011
416
3
0
#16
I'm not sure having a post-trib rapture even makes sense. Who is there left to rapture?
The rapture is to give those that survive the Tribulation immortal bodies, just like the ones that the dead will be resurrected in.
 
Oct 2, 2011
416
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#17
You are sorry that a brother in Christ has left deception and entered into truth. That strikes me as odd.
If only all pretrib believers would open their spiritual eyes and stop believing in what they WANT to believe. Sigh...
 
J

jimmydiggs

Guest
#19
1 Thessalonians 4 17 Then we which are alive [and] remain
I thought after the tribulation, everyone will be dead.

This is why I don't get into eschatology yet. Just don't understand it.
 
K

kayem77

Guest
#20
I thought after the tribulation, everyone will be dead.

This is why I don't get into eschatology yet. Just don't understand it.

I think you're talking about the wrath of God, it's different. After the tribulation(persecution of believers), comes the wrath of God(punishment for unbelievers). At least that's how i understand it.

I used to be a pre-trib rapture believer too, now....I really don't find many scripture substantiating that position.