The real truth about the Son of God

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A

AtonedFor

Guest
#1

Muslims (and others) think Christians are crazy for believing Jesus is God's Son!


They know for sure God did not mate with some female entity to produce any offspring.

Christians know for sure that God did not create any Son of God.

“He was clothed with a robe dripped in blood, and His name is called The Word of God.” (Rev. 19:13).
“In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
He was in the beginning with God. All things were made through Him …” (John 1:1-3).


Because of their religious teaching, the Jews of the NT believed:
Messiah = Christ = Son of God.
“We have found the Messiah (which is translated the Christ)” (John 1:41).
“Tell us if You are the Christ, the Son of God” (Matthew 26:63).
“Are You the Christ, the Son of the Blessed?” (Mark 14:61).
“You are the Christ, the Son of the living God.” (Matthew 16:16).

Did the Jews actually believe that God somehow created His “equal”, a Son of God?
The answer is “No”, and is explained in (B) below.

First, let’s consider Gabriel
He appeared to Joseph in a dream …
"... you shall call His name Jesus, for He will save His people from their sins." (Matthew 1:21)
And he was also sent to Mary …
"And behold, you will conceive in your womb and bring forth a son,
and shall call his name Jesus. He will be great, and will be called the Son of the Highest
… that Holy One who is to be born will be called the Son of God." (Luke 1:31-35).

Please note that Gabriel did NOT say the baby to be born was the Son of God.
The baby was just to be called Jesus, the Son of the Highest, and the Son of God.
Robert is not really (a) Robert … he is a male human being called Robert.
God has given us actual names for the Word (the Logos) so we can relate to
the Second “Person” of the Triune Godhead.

(A) From the Catholic Encyclopedia … “The word ‘son’ was employed among the Semites
to signify not only filiation, but other close connection or intimate relationship ...”.

(B) From the Jewish Encyclopedia … “Yet the term (Son of God) by no means carries the idea
of physical descent from, and essential unity with, God the Father. The Hebrew idiom conveys
nothing further than a simple expression of godlikeness.”

Four usages in the OT for the term “Son of God”, and none of them mean co-equality with God:
(1) -- The angels are the sons of God. The old story in Gen 6:2, says that the sons of God saw
the daughters of men and were fatally attracted to them. Job 1:6, tells of the day when the
sons of God came to present themselves before the Lord. It was a regular title for the angels.
(2) -- The nation of Israel is the son of God. God called his son out of Egypt (Hosea 11:1).
In Exodus 4:22, God says of the nation, "Israel is my first-born son".
(3) -- The king of the nation is the son of God. In 2 Sam 7:14, God’s promise to the king is,
"I will be his father, and he shall be my son."
(4) -- In the later books, which were written between the Testaments, the good man is the son of God.
In Sirach 4:10, the promise to the man who is kind to the fatherless is:
"So shalt thou be a son of the Most High, and he shall love thee more than thy mother doth.”
In all these cases above the term "son" describes someone who is specially near and close to God.

Daily Study Bible (Mark 3:7-12)
“When we meet this title in the simplicity of the gospel story we are not to think in terms of
philosophy or theology or of the doctrine of the Trinity; we are to think of it as expressing
the fact that Jesus' relationship to God was so close that no other word could describe it ...”

“Thou art my beloved Son; with thee I am well pleased” (Mark 1:11).
This is an expression of exceptional love and immense compassion enjoyed by the most holy ones of God alone.
Since Jesus was "fully man", could Father God regard this "Son" as being an equal member of the Trinity?

“For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, these are the sons of God” (Romans 8:14).
.
 
T

Trax

Guest
#2

Daily Study Bible (Mark 3:7-12)
“When we meet this title in the simplicity of the gospel story we are not to think in terms of
philosophy or theology or of the doctrine of the Trinity; we are to think of it as expressing
the fact that Jesus' relationship to God was so close that no other word could describe it ...”

“Thou art my beloved Son; with thee I am well pleased” (Mark 1:11).
This is an expression of exceptional love and immense compassion enjoyed by the most holy ones of God alone.
Since Jesus was "fully man", could Father God regard this "Son" as being an equal member of the Trinity?

“For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, these are the sons of God” (Romans 8:14).
.
If Jesus isn't deity, we are all doomed to the lake of fire. How can a man pay for your sins
if all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God? You take scriptures speaking of the Humanity
of Jesus and toss out the deity of Jesus. Jesus claimed the title of Yahweh.
Ps 23 The Lord is my Shepherd, John 10:11 I am the Good Shepherd

Jer 17:13 ...because they have forsaken the LORD, the fountain of living waters.
Joh 4:10 Jesus answered and said unto her, If thou knewest the gift of God, and who it is that saith to thee, Give me to drink; thou wouldest have asked of him, and he would have given thee living water.
Joh 4:14 But whosoever drinketh of the water that I shall give him shall never thirst; but the water that I shall give him shall be in him a well of water springing up into everlasting life.

Joh 8:58 Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I am.

God is who He is and doesn't change. The Lord is the fountain of living waters, because that is
who He is. Jesus, being God in the flesh, gives the living waters, because God is who He is
and doesn't change. The Lord in the OT is the Good Shepherd, because that is who He is
and can't change. Jesus said He is the Good Sheperd, because He was God in the flesh
and God is who He is and can't change. Jesus didn't come out and claim to "be God", but
He his claim to deity as God was that He was/is/and forever shall be how He is. He couldn't
be something He never was. He couldn't be the Good Shepherd if He had never been the
Good Shepherd. Jesus couldn't give the living waters if He wasn't the fountain to give
living waters. He couldn't claim to exist before Abraham if He had not already existed before
Abraham. He was God in the flesh, and done what God does, because God does what He does
and doesn't change.
 
A

AtonedFor

Guest
#3
If Jesus isn't deity, we are all doomed to the lake of fire.
MEOW!

Admin is complaining also ... the above message too short!

Okay, let's try again ...
MEOW!

.
 
May 18, 2011
1,815
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0
#4
If Jesus isn't deity, we are all doomed to the lake of fire. How can a man pay for your sins
if all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God? You take scriptures speaking of the Humanity
of Jesus and toss out the deity of Jesus. Jesus claimed the title of Yahweh.
Ps 23 The Lord is my Shepherd, John 10:11 I am the Good Shepherd

Jer 17:13 ...because they have forsaken the LORD, the fountain of living waters.
Joh 4:10 Jesus answered and said unto her, If thou knewest the gift of God, and who it is that saith to thee, Give me to drink; thou wouldest have asked of him, and he would have given thee living water.
Joh 4:14 But whosoever drinketh of the water that I shall give him shall never thirst; but the water that I shall give him shall be in him a well of water springing up into everlasting life.

Joh 8:58 Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I am.

God is who He is and doesn't change. The Lord is the fountain of living waters, because that is
who He is. Jesus, being God in the flesh, gives the living waters, because God is who He is
and doesn't change. The Lord in the OT is the Good Shepherd, because that is who He is
and can't change. Jesus said He is the Good Sheperd, because He was God in the flesh
and God is who He is and can't change. Jesus didn't come out and claim to "be God", but
He his claim to deity as God was that He was/is/and forever shall be how He is. He couldn't
be something He never was. He couldn't be the Good Shepherd if He had never been the
Good Shepherd. Jesus couldn't give the living waters if He wasn't the fountain to give
living waters. He couldn't claim to exist before Abraham if He had not already existed before
Abraham. He was God in the flesh, and done what God does, because God does what He does
and doesn't change.
Very nicely done Trax, very nice indeed. Shalom
 
Oct 31, 2011
8,200
182
0
#5
John 10:30
IandtheFather are one.”
John 14:6
Jesus answered, “I am the way andthe truth andthe life. No one comes to theFather except through me.
1 Corinthians 8:6
yet for us there is but one God, theFather, from whom all things came and for whom we live; andthere is but one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom all things came and through whom we live.

Scripture, from Genesis to Revelation is about God reconciling us, His creation, to His holiness. Sin stands in the way. Christ was from the beginning a way to reconcile this, with the sacrificial system using the blood of animals as a symbol of the Christ to come.

John 1 The Word Became Flesh
1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2 He was with God in the beginning. 3 Through him all things were made; without him nothing was made that has been made. 4 In him was life, and that life was the light of all people. 5 The light shines in the darkness, and the darkness has not overcome it.
 
A

AtonedFor

Guest
#6

Gabriel told Mary that she would have "a son" ... not "a son who is the Son of God".
He could have used the “son of God” terminology … the Jews were familiar with it.
He just said to “call” Him “the Son of God” … he did not say that He actually was God's Son.

Some help …
Jesus was God's Son … as far as … the Holy Spirit being Jesus' Father.
So, for those of us who regard Jesus as being "fully man" and "fully God",
at least "part" of Jesus was the Son of God ... logically, I mean.
 
Oct 20, 2011
490
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#7
"no one cometh to the father but by me." .... You can't know, talk to, or worship God unless you know Jesus.
 

pickles

Senior Member
Apr 20, 2009
14,479
182
63
#8
For the message of the cross is foolishness to those who perish.

Please consider the word and scripture given.
Seems the warning about denying Jesus Christ is becoming so promoted today, and Jesus warned of this.
Dont you who deny Jesus see , the scriptures being fullfilled.
I plead in Jesus Christ is Lord come in the flesh, to all who are being led astray, do not let satan steal the glorious, victoious and loving gift given by God Our Father through faith.
I pray that all eyes and ears will be opened , to the gift and message of the cross given in Jesus Christ is Lord come in the flesh.

God bless
pickles
 
T

Trax

Guest
#9
Gabriel told Mary that she would have "a son" ... not "a son who is the Son of God".
He could have used the “son of God” terminology … the Jews were familiar with it.
He just said to “call” Him “the Son of God” … he did not say that He actually was God's Son.

Some help …
Jesus was God's Son … as far as … the Holy Spirit being Jesus' Father.
So, for those of us who regard Jesus as being "fully man" and "fully God",
at least "part" of Jesus was the Son of God ... logically, I mean.
Heb 1:8-9 But unto the Son he saith, Thy throne, O God, is for ever and ever: a sceptre of righteousness is the sceptre of thy kingdom. (9) Thou hast loved righteousness, and hated iniquity; therefore God, even thy God, hath anointed thee with the oil of gladness above thy fellows.

But unto the Son he saith......therefore God. (I shortened it up, so you could see were Jesus,
the Son, is called God.)
 
A

AtonedFor

Guest
#10

The KEY for me is this ...

Luke 1:35
And the angel (Gabriel) answered and said to her (Mary),
“The Holy Spirit will come upon you, and the power of the Highest will overshadow you;
therefore (i.e. for that reason), also, that Holy One who is to be born will be called the Son of God."


... which I had forgotten. My apologies.

However, Gabriel still did not say ...
“... that Holy One who is to be born will be the Son of God."

IMO, as with many other spiritual truths …
the Lord wanted this truth (and the truth of the Trinity) to be revealed via the Holy Spirit.
Others may believe in these truths because of being born into them via family, society, etc.
but without a real spiritual revelation have they been born again?
.
 
T

Tombo

Guest
#11
Even the Jews knew who Jesus claimed to be. John 5:18 "This is why the Jews were seeking all the more to kill Him, because not only was He breaking the Sabbath, but He was even caling God His own Father, making Himself equal with God."
Did John, in his gospel account, correct this? No, because he knew it was true. Read John chapter one VERY CAREFULLY.
It's so distressing to see all of this evil being disseminated. But we were warned that as the world got closer to judgment wickedness would increase.
God bless, my friends.

Tom
 
Dec 28, 2011
1
0
0
#12
Yes, I believe that Jesus is the son of God
Where would we be today if He did not
die on the cross for us? I am glad he
gave his life to save us from our sins.
 
A

AtonedFor

Guest
#13

I am sorry for not making it clear in the OP that ...
I have always had the revelation that Jesus, the Second Person of the Trinity, was/is God.

My intent in the OP was to question why He was called the Son of God ...
because it makes no sense at all that somehow God could be a "Son" of anyone, anywhere, any time.

However, I have been reminded that Jesus can very reasonably be called God's Son ...
because the Holy Spirit (God) was His "Father" (my terminology, which many don't care for),
which is made clear in Luke 1:35.
.
 
Last edited by a moderator:

pickles

Senior Member
Apr 20, 2009
14,479
182
63
#14
It might help to look more to the scriptures on this
For Jesus was called both son of God and son of man.
Spending time on this will help bring better understanding.
Im sorry I cannot quote the spacific scriptures for you, hopefully another her can. :)

God bless
pickles
 
L

Laodicea

Guest
#15

I am sorry for not making it clear in the OP that ...
I have always had the revelation that Jesus, the Second Person of the Trinity, was/is God.

My intent in the OP was to question why He was called the Son of God ...
because it makes no sense at all that somehow God could be a "Son" of anyone, anywhere, any time.

However, I have been reminded that Jesus can very reasonably be called God's Son ...
because the Holy Spirit (God) was His "Father" (my terminology, which many don't care for),
which is made clear in Luke 1:35.
.
Jesus is not a literal son but in the plan of God He became as a son, He humbled Himself.
 

tribesman

Senior Member
Oct 13, 2011
4,612
274
83
#16
It is written:

Ps.2

[12] Kiss the Son, lest he be angry, and ye perish from the way, when his wrath is kindled but a little. Blessed are all they that put their trust in him.
Matt.16

[13] When Jesus came into the coasts of Caesarea Philippi, he asked his disciples, saying, Whom do men say that I the Son of man am?
[14] And they said, Some say that thou art John the Baptist: some, Elias; and others, Jeremias, or one of the prophets.
[15] He saith unto them, But whom say ye that I am?
[16] And Simon Peter answered and said, Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God.
[17] And Jesus answered and said unto him, Blessed art thou, Simon Barjona: for flesh and blood hath not revealed it unto thee, but my Father which is in heaven.