Will The AntiChrist Control The Whole World?

[loveme1]

John declares that MANY antichrists have risen. There is no ONE specific person who is the antichrist.
1 John 2:18-22
18Dear children, this is the last hour; and as you have heard that the antichrist is coming, even now many antichrists have come. This is how we know it is the last hour. 19They went out from us, but they did not really belong to us. For if they had belonged to us, they would have remained with us; but their going showed that none of them belonged to us.
20But you have an anointing from the Holy One, and all of you know the truth.d 21I do not write to you because you do not know the truth, but because you do know it and because no lie comes from the truth. 22Who is the liar? It is the man who denies that Jesus is the Christ. Such a man is the antichrist—he denies the Father and the Son

John’s references to “antichrist” reveals that the term is a general designation employed to suggest a spirit of unbelief that can be manifested in a variety of ways, both in the past and present.

So, as far as the reference in Revelation, PLEASE keep in mind that the beast in this book was not of literal meaning. It was symbolic. Revelation is taken way too literal. That book was written for Christians of that time as a sign of hope and goodness prevailing. When John had his vision Christians were being persecuted. Reveltion showed early Christians that it would end.

And should we take everything else in the Bible as symbolic, or not to literal?

How will we discern what is to be taken literal, Daniel also had visions?

You have then just said that Yahshua the Messiah will not return?

Because this Revelation is the end.

And the Messiah said he would come at the end.

 

[Ugly]

Isn't inforwars that conspiracy theory site? Seriously? Thats where you point people to?

 

[doulos]

Sorry buddy but you have shown nothing from scripture that there is no king /Antichrist in the last days.
But you have managed to turn this verse around and say in the last times no antichrist shall come.

1 John 2:18Little children, it is the last time: and as ye have heard that ANTICHRIST shall come, even now are there many antichrists; whereby we know that it is the last time.

Yes there are many Antichrists in the world but you have shown nothing to say there is one Antichrist /king in the end, but you have shown Speculation which is not Bible scripture.

I don't need to show a verse that says there is no king/Antichrist in the last times. The burden of proof is on the one who says there is.
Show us the verse that says the antichrist is a king in the last time? Book chapter and verse please?

LOL earlier you quoted 1John4:3 which toild us exactly who the antichrist of1 John2:18 is. Did you forget what that verse says?
1Jn 4:3 And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world.
Looks like John made it perfectly clear that the antichrist they heard should come was a spirit that was already in the world.

You have shown nothing from scripture that Islam will be the domineering force in the last days, you could have said that about the Germans killing the Jews in WW2 it means nothing.

Islam can raise its ugly head as much it likes. Because when the devil comes he will come as an angel of light deceiving all the world including Islam.

Considering the amount of prophecy and history that goes into understanding it, one must recognize that it cannot be fully explained in a single post. Besides before one will look at another option they must first realize that the view they hold is in error. A good place to start is with antichrist. Now let me turn the table, you have not shown that there will be a King/theAntichrist from Scripture. Throwing out a few verses that you interpret that way doesn't prove it. Why not start by showing us which one of the only 4 verses that use the word antichrist or antichrists tell us he is a king? For your convenience I'll quote them and as we can all see none says he is a king but it does tell us there are many that have been here a long time. They also tell us who John was referring to when he said "ye have heard antichrist shall come"

1Jn 2:18 Little children, it is the last time: and as ye have heard that antichrist shall come, even now are there many antichrists; whereby we know that it is the last time.
1Jn 2:22 Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist, that denieth the Father and the Son.
1Jn 4:3 And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world.
2Jn 1:7 For many deceivers are entered into the world, who confess not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh. This is a deceiver and an antichrist.

As we can all see none of these verses say antichrist is a king, nor do any of them say it comes in the "last times".

 

[doulos]

Club of Rome.?

Do a google search club of rome behold the beast. An explanation is found there that shows how the club of Rome fits the bill. To much information for a single post.

Matthew Henry ?

I have an author for you Jesus Christ and his book the holy the Bible
I think I will stick to the Bible thanks, and his book the holy the Bible.I think that’s what you should have done too.

If you would stick to the Bible then you would know that we are to enquire of those from the former ages.
Job 8:8 For enquire, I pray thee, of the former age, and prepare thyself to the search of their fathers:
If you follow your own advice and stick to the Bible you will see that it is in our best interest to study what those of the former ages thought. They aren't always right which is why we should always examine what they say in light of Scripture. Matthew Henry is a theologian from the 17th/18 century (1662-1714) who wrote a very good (not perfect but very good) commentary on the whole Bible.

seven heads, even he is the eighth, and is of the seven.

Lets keep it Scriptural no need to twist the verse just to fit your doctrine. Instead twist your doctrine to fit the verse.
Rev 17:9-11 And here is the mind which hath wisdom. The seven heads are seven mountains, on which the woman sitteth. And there are seven kings: five are fallen, and one is, and the other is not yet come; and when he cometh, he must continue a short space. And the beast that was, and is not, even he is the eighth, and is of the seven, and goeth into perdition.

The verse doesn't say the seventh head is the eighth, why are you changing Scripture? It says the seventh beast is the eighth. Let's keep it Scriptural.

Rv17:12 And the ten horns which thou sawest are ten kings, which have received no kingdom as yet; but receive power as kings one hour with the beast.

10 kings and the little horn make 11 kings, takeaway 3 kings that are plucked up by the roots, that makes 8 kings the 8th but of the 7th

Daniel7:8 I considered the horns, and, behold, there came up among them another little horn, before whom there were three of the first horns plucked up by the roots: and, behold, in this horn [were] eyes like the eyes of man, and a mouth speaking great things.

20 And of the ten horns that [were] in his head, and [of] the other which came up, and before whom three fell; even [of] that horn that had eyes, and a mouth that spake very great things, whose look [was] more stout than his fellows.

24And the ten horns out of this kingdom [are] ten kings [that] shall arise: and another shall rise after them; and he shall be diverse from the first, and he shall subdue three kings.

Why not keep the verses in there proper context instead of mixing and matching just to support a doctrine? If one just pulls verses out of context one can make Scripture say anything. So why not use sound methods of interpretation which would require using sound hermeneutic principle that would lead to a proper interpretation.Using private interpretation and guess work theology hasn't worked in the past why should we expect it to work in the future? Horns are people beasts are kingdoms we can't just interchange them at will to support our doctrines.

 

[Elizabeth619]

And should we take everything else in the Bible as symbolic, or not to literal?

How will we discern what is to be taken literal, Daniel also had visions?

You have then just said that Yahshua the Messiah will not return?

Because this Revelation is the end.

And the Messiah said he would come at the end.

Please. Stop taking what I say out of context. I never said Jesus would not return. Jesus said himself he would return, and we do not know when that will happen and certain things must come to pass before he does return.

If you are unable to deipher between literall and figurative meaning and what is what in the bible, then maybe you should look into someone helping you with that instead of adding to what others say and taking everything out of context.

 

[doulos]

John declares that MANY antichrists have risen. There is no ONE specific person who is the antichrist.
1 John 2:18-22
18Dear children, this is the last hour; and as you have heard that the antichrist is coming, even now many antichrists have come. This is how we know it is the last hour. 19They went out from us, but they did not really belong to us. For if they had belonged to us, they would have remained with us; but their going showed that none of them belonged to us.
20But you have an anointing from the Holy One, and all of you know the truth.d21I do not write to you because you do not know the truth, but because you do know it and because no lie comes from the truth. 22Who is the liar? It is the man who denies that Jesus is the Christ. Such a man is the antichrist—he denies the Father and the Son

John’s references to “antichrist” reveals that the term is a general designation employed to suggest a spirit of unbelief that can be manifested in a variety of ways, both in the past and present.

You are correct and in this world one does not need to look far to see we are surrounded by antichrists. Mohammedans alone number approximately 1.5 billion and thats not counting atheists etc....

So, as far as the reference in Revelation, PLEASE keep in mind that the beast in this book was not of literal meaning. It was symbolic. Revelation is taken way too literal. That book was written for Christians of that time as a sign of hope and goodness prevailing. When John had his vision Christians were being persecuted. Reveltion showed early Christians that it would end.

The Word of God tell us beasts are kingdoms. History has proven God's Word true (Daniels beasts were kingdoms). What many forget is that while Revelation may have been in written in figurative or symbolic language it describes real events that take place in the real world. Understanding that requires using sound hermeneutic principles, if not then our exegesis will be in error. We cannot let our preconcieved notions get in the way or we may miss watching the fulfillment occur right under our noses.

 

[jandian]

Though Revelations is a book of allegories; it actually explains most of what was said. It would be nice if we studied it together verse by verse; we might be able to discover what God is really saying .......together.

Well, one could only dream...

 

[Elizabeth619]

Though Revelations is a book of allegories; it actually explains most of what was said. It would be nice if we studied it together verse by verse; we might be able to discover what God is really saying .......together.

Well, one could only dream...

That has been attempted before, and was no successful.

 

[Elizabeth619]

You are correct and in this world one does not need to look far to see we are surrounded by antichrists. Mohammedans alone number approximately 1.5 billion and thats not counting atheists etc....



The Word of God tell us beasts are kingdoms. History has proven God's Word true (Daniels beasts were kingdoms). What many forget is that while Revelation may have been in written in figurative or symbolic language it describes real events that take place in the real world. Understanding that requires using sound hermeneutic principles, if not then our exegesis will be in error. We cannot let our preconcieved notions get in the way or we may miss watching the fulfillment occur right under our noses.

Keep in mind that the OT prophets were known to speak to their people of that time of his own generation. These types of prophecies would occur during the time of social and/or political changes.

John wrote Revelation in his own name so it is realted to the characteristics of OT prophecy which would make this book about the people of John's generation. If you look back to the biblical timeline when John was still living you will notice that the First century Christians were being persecutied by Romans and Jews.

I am very well aware that apocolyptic writing is in Revelation. The symbols, visions and so on show this, but this type of writing is not known for even being in a chronological map of the future. Like I said earlier, the fact that Revelation is written in John's own name then it is natural to read it like one would an OT prophecy(which have all been fulfulled).

The book does mention the end of times and states that thing are already taking place. If you look at all the symbols you can apply them all throughout history. The "beast" is described as a political figure..Well, how many evil politcal figures have come and gone that would fit this description? Several. In other words, this book is literally NOT a prophecy of the end of times ,this wouild include one specific antichrist.

To me, the book of Revelation is strictly for Christiians of the first century who were ndergoing persecution. This book gives them hope for oppressed people and direction on how to deal with hard times.

Think about it. The first century church fits the opression of Christians in Revelation perfectly. Therefore the prophecy has been fulfilled.

If one wants to apply this book to modern times and say it is a book about the end of the word then I can't stop them, but I do encourage people to read this book with an open mind.

I also know that many on here wil disagree with me. This is my view of the book. I am not telling anyone they are wrong, but I wanted to express my viewpoint. I believe the end of times are near, but I do not look in to the book of Revelation for clues. All I can do is live a Christian life, and be ready when the time comes.

 

[peterT]

Minich Actually it isn't the antichrist that controls the world in the end. There are only 4 verses in Scripture that tell us about antichrists and all of them tell us there are many. None of those say antichrist will control the world. Unfortunately most endtime doctrines mistakenly call the beast the antichrist but as Scripture and history prove beasts are kingdoms. Our battle is a spiritual battle so this leopard, bear lion beast is a spiritual kingdom. A kingdom started by a false prophet that teaches the exact opposite of the Gospel and requires all of it's folowers to be antichrist as it requires all of it's followers to deny God has a Son. As of right now that spiritual kingdom controls the geographic area that were once occupird by Danirl's leopard, bear and lion kingdoms. Ethnographically speaking what was John's whole world is now controlled by the beast.

You’re looking at part of the pitcher and thinking it’s the whole pitcher.

Islam needs to raise its ugly head and play its wicked hand, so modern technology and the western world can play its wicked hand.

Islam needs to raise its ugly and play its wicked hand, because every superhero needs a super villain.

A holey man of God would have me stand of scripture, but you have shown speculation and want me to stand on that.

You have shown not one verse in the Bible showing that Islam is the beast.

You say beasts are kingdoms, but they are also known as kings.

Rv17:3 So he carried me away in the spirit into the wilderness: and I saw a woman sit upon a scarlet coloured beast, full of names of blasphemy, having seven heads and ten horns.
Revelation 17:10 And there are seven kings: five are fallen, and one is, [and] the other is not yet come; and when he cometh, he must continue a short space.

You are looking in the wrong direction for the mark of the beast

 

[peterT]

Lets keep it Scriptural no need to twist the verse just to fit your doctrine. Instead twist your doctrine to fit the verse.

The verse doesn't say the seventh head is the eighth, why are you changing Scripture? It says the seventh beast is the eighth. Let's keep it Scriptural.



Why not keep the verses in there proper context instead of mixing and matching just to support a doctrine? If one just pulls verses out of context one can make Scripture say anything. So why not use sound methods of interpretation which would require using sound hermeneutic principle that would lead to a proper interpretation.Using private interpretation and guess work theology hasn't worked in the past why should we expect it to work in the future? Horns are people beasts are kingdoms we can't just interchange them at will to support our doctrines.

Where do you think john got the inspiration for prophesy from the Old Testament that’s were.

He was prophesying according to scripture, as we should too.

But you are prophesying not according to scripture because there’s not one verse saying that the beast is Islam. You are just making it up.

The verse doesn't say the seventh head is the eighth, why are you changing Scripture? It says the seventh beast is the eighth. Let's keep it Scriptural.



.

Yes it dose
Rv17:11 And the beast that was, and is not, even he is the eighth, and is of the seven, and goeth into perdition.

 

[jandian]

The Antichrist is a system; but he will also manifest as a person

 

[Elizabeth619]

The Antichrist is a system; but he will also manifest as a person

and how did you come up with that conclusion?

 

[Elizabeth619]

Hmmmmmm, I wonder if it is possible to identify the "beasts" as pagan Rome and the evil things they did to early Christians. Not to mention formations of apostate churches.

What about the Middle Ages? Anyone ever study them? The religous opression where people were slaughtered throughout France? Read about the Maxxacre of St. Bartholomew's Day and the thousands that were killed and the Pope ordered a hymn of praise..... Could THIS be a description of a beast?

Wait, no. It couldn't be. Any religous opression that happened in the past could not have applied to Revelation back then could it? YES. It could!

 

[2knowhim]

PeterT,

I know your serious when you say this "You are just making it up."

But I gotta tell ya, it cracks me up every time I come across it, I don't know why.

ROTF



Blessings

 

[jandian]

Hmmmmmm, I wonder if it is possible to identify the "beasts" as pagan Rome and the evil things they did to early Christians. Not to mention formations of apostate churches.

What about the Middle Ages? Anyone ever study them? The religous opression where people were slaughtered throughout France? Read about the Maxxacre of St. Bartholomew's Day and the thousands that were killed and the Pope ordered a hymn of praise..... Could THIS be a description of a beast?

Wait, no. It couldn't be. Any religous opression that happened in the past could not have applied to Revelation back then could it? YES. It could!

Sorry; I stepped out a bit....
This is a long discussion
But Rev 17: 10 States that the seven heads are also kings, five have fallen, one is , and the other is YET to come. And when he comes, he must continue a short time

 

[jandian]

when Jesus was on earth he spoke to the Pharisees in John 5:43 and he said to them,
You wont receive me, but if another comes in his own name Him you will receive

 

[peterT]

when Jesus was on earth he spoke to the Pharisees in John 5:43 and he said to them,
You wont receive me, but if another comes in his own name Him you will receive

Wow, forgot about that verse.

God bless

 

[loveme1]

Please. Stop taking what I say out of context. I never said Jesus would not return. Jesus said himself he would return, and we do not know when that will happen and certain things must come to pass before he does return.

If you are unable to deipher between literall and figurative meaning and what is what in the bible, then maybe you should look into someone helping you with that instead of adding to what others say and taking everything out of context.

Actually you told people not to take it literally.............. You told people to take the Bible out of context.


I have never done such a thing, and I admit you never said he would not return, I put the question mark, and wondered if you may elaborate on what you said....

Of course you find it easier to tell me, I should get help with the Bible, i say my friend you are in need of that help not I.

I wanted to make sure any person reading this thread, did not take what you said literally.

 

[loveme1]

Hmmmmmm, I wonder if it is possible to identify the "beasts" as pagan Rome and the evil things they did to early Christians. Not to mention formations of apostate churches.

What about the Middle Ages? Anyone ever study them? The religous opression where people were slaughtered throughout France? Read about the Maxxacre of St. Bartholomew's Day and the thousands that were killed and the Pope ordered a hymn of praise..... Could THIS be a description of a beast?

Wait, no. It couldn't be. Any religous opression that happened in the past could not have applied to Revelation back then could it? YES. It could!

Do you ever wonder where all those wicked people went to?