FAITH IS A WORK! The Deception of Eph 2:8-10

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Nov 26, 2011
3,818
62
0
#1
Jesus preached a works salvation plain and simple!

Work = To do something.

Jesus taught that YOU MUST be a doer of the word.




This passage is one of the most abused and least understood passages in the Bible.

Eph 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
Eph 2:9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.
Eph 2:10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.

Grace = Charis
From G5463; graciousness (as gratifying), of manner or act (abstract or concrete; literal, figurative or spiritual; especially the divine influence upon the heart, and its reflection in the life; including gratitude): - acceptable, benefit, favour, gift, grace (-ious), joy liberality, pleasure, thank (-s, -worthy).

Grace is indeed a free gift but what sort of gift is it?

Grace is the divine influence on the heart of man and grace teaches us.

Tit 2:11 For the grace of God that bringeth salvation hath appeared to all men,
Tit 2:12 Teaching us that, denying ungodliness and worldly lusts, we should live soberly, righteously, and godly, in this present world;

The grace of God BRINGS salvation when we put it to use through faith. Faith is the working principle that activates grace in our lives. Faith is the DOING part or the WORK that we must do.

This is why Paul wrote...

2Co 6:1 We then, as workers together with him, beseech you also that ye receive not the grace of God in vain.

You see we are to WORK TOGETHER with God otherwise we receive grace to NO EFFECT.

God is the AUTHOR of salvation not us, yet we MUST OBEY and yield to the working of the author in us. If you don't obey you will not be saved.

Heb 5:9 And being made perfect, he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him;

Look at what James wrote...

Jas 1:21 Wherefore lay apart all filthiness and superfluity of naughtiness, and receive with meekness the engrafted word, which is able to save your souls.
Jas 1:22 But be ye doers of the word, and not hearers only, deceiving your own selves.

You are a doer of the word when you are obeying God thus being a worker together with Him.

Look at Noah...

Heb 11:7 By faith Noah, being warned of God of things not seen as yet, moved with fear, prepared an ark to the saving of his house; by the which he condemned the world, and became heir of the righteousness which is by faith.

Noah was saved by grace through faith. God was the author of his salvation from the flood. The warning and instructions on building the ark was God's grace but Noah had to WORK TOGETHER with God, Noah had to be a DOER of the word. Otherwise he would have received the grace of God in vain.

It is very simple.

Let's look at the subject verse again...

Eph 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
Eph 2:9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.
Eph 2:10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.

We are saved by grace and not of ourselves. That means that we are not the authors of our own salvation, it is God leading the way. It is not something we do apart from God. It is by faith that we put to use the divine influence on our hearts to use.

What are the works Paul is talking about? He is talking about works done apart from God. Cleaning the outside of the cup apart from an internal cleansing.

Look at what the Jews did...

Rom 2:17 Behold, thou art called a Jew, and restest in the law, and makest thy boast of God,

The Jews were boasting in the cleansing of the outside of the cup. Look at what Jesus said to them...

Mat_23:26 Thou blind Pharisee, cleansefirst that which is within the cup and platter, that the outside of them may be clean also.

True righteousness is from the inside out not the outside in. That is why salvation is by grace through faith and not of works. You cannot purify the cup by works done apart from the grace of God.

Look at what Paul wrote right before Rom 2:17.

Rom 2:13 (For not the hearers of the law are just before God, but the doers of the law shall be justified.
Rom 2:14 For when the Gentiles, which have not the law, do by nature the things contained in the law, these, having not the law, are a law unto themselves:
Rom 2:15 Which shew the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and their thoughts the mean while accusing or else excusing one another;)

It is the law on the heart that counts because that will produce good fruit. The external appearance can be deceiving because the underlying motive can be corrupt just as it was with the Pharisees. They sought to appear righteous but were inwardly filthy.

Mat_23:27 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye are like unto whited sepulchres, which indeed appear beautiful outward, but are within full of dead men's bones, and of all uncleanness.

The Pharisees boasted in the works of the law done apart from a true faith.

Rom 2:23 Thou that makest thy boast of the law, through breaking the law dishonourest thou God?

That is why Paul wrote...
Eph 2:9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.

But instead would say...

Gal 5:6 For in Jesus Christ neither circumcision availeth any thing, nor uncircumcision; but faith which worketh by love.

Righteousness is from the inside out not the outside in. It is a very simple teaching.

Here is another very important scripture...

Rom 3:31 Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid: yea, we establish the law.

The law is established in the heart through faith. It is through this faith that we walk after the Spirit fulfilling the righteous requirements of the law.

Rom 8:4 That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.

This is because a faith that works by love fulfills the law.

Gal 5:14 For all the law is fulfilled in one word, even in this; Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.

Which is why Jesus taught this...

Mat 22:37 Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
Mat 22:38 This is the first and great commandment.
Mat 22:39 And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
Mat 22:40 On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.

Love fulfills the law. True righteousness come by a faith that works by love. The root is pure.

Jesus said this...Mat 5:17 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.

Mat 5:20 For I say unto you, That except your righteousness shall exceed the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, ye shall in no case enter into the kingdom of heaven.

Out righteousness exceeds that of the scribes and pharisees when we walk by a faith that works by love having the law established in our hearts and we thus fulfill the righteous requirements of the law by the Spirit.

The letter kills but the Spirit brings life.

2Co 3:6 Who also hath made us able ministers of the new testament; not of the letter, but of the spirit: for the letter killeth, but the spirit giveth life.

Again let's look at our subject passage...

Eph 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
Eph 2:9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.
Eph 2:10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.

When we are workers together with God by faith our hearts are purified. This is why it says this in Acts.

Act 15:9 And put no difference between us and them, purifying their hearts by faith.

It is also why Peter wrote this...

1Pe 1:22 Seeing ye have purified your souls in obeying the truth through the Spirit unto unfeigned love of the brethren, see that ye love one another with a pure heart fervently:

It is the pure in heart that will see God.
Mat 5:8 Blessed are the pure in heart: for they shall see God.

The vast majority of professing Christianity has no idea about what I have written and they see grace as some provision or package which they simply trust in to be saved. They throw works out the window.

Jesus preached WORKS.

Mat 7:24 Therefore whosoever heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them, I will liken him unto a wise man, which built his house upon a rock:

Luk 13:24 Strive to enter in at the strait gate: for many, I say unto you, will seek to enter in, and shall not be able.

Mar 8:34 And when he had called the people unto him with his disciples also, he said unto them, Whosoever will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow me.
Mar 8:35 For whosoever will save his life shall lose it; but whosoever shall lose his life for my sake and the gospel's, the same shall save it.

It is about works done in faith. Those are the works Abraham did. That was the faith that God counted Abraham righteous by.

Rom 4:20 He staggered not at the promise of God through unbelief; but was strong in faith, giving glory to God;
Rom 4:21 And being fully persuaded that, what he had promised, he was able also to perform.
Rom 4:22 And therefore it was imputed to him for righteousness.

It is the same with us.

Rom 4:23 Now it was not written for his sake alone, that it was imputed to him;
Rom 4:24 But for us also, to whom it shall be imputed, if we believe on him that raised up Jesus our Lord from the dead;

True believers are doers of the word. They walk after the Spirit with their old man crucified with Christ, they are born again and they are not sinning.

1Jn 5:18 We know that whosoever is born of God sinneth not; but he that is begotten of God keepeth himself, and that wicked one toucheth him not.

You do not fulfill the righteous requirements of the law by sinning every day in thought word and deed every day. Salvation is not some package, provision, or covering which you trust in to make up for your continued sin. That is a lie of Satan.

Jesus gave Himself for us that we be made pure.

Tit 2:14 Who gave himself for us, that he might redeem us from all iniquity, and purify unto himself a peculiar people, zealous of good works.

He did not give Himself that we remain sinners. The false teachers today twist scriptures like Rom 7:15, 1Tim 1:15, and 1Joh 1:8 and Eph 2:8-10 right out of their context to keep the people deceived and in bondage to their sin. Don't be deceived!

Gal 6:7 Be not deceived; God is not mocked: for whatsoever a man soweth, that shall he also reap.
Gal 6:8 For he that soweth to his flesh shall of the flesh reap corruption; but he that soweth to the Spirit shall of the Spirit reap life everlasting.

Which are you sowing to?


There think very carefully about what Paul is teaching here and do not buy into what all the false teachers are telling you.

Eph 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
Eph 2:9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.
Eph 2:10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.


Grace is the divine influence on the heart which God freely gives us. We cannot earn it, God is the author of our salvation, it is God that quickens us.

Eph 2:5 Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved;)

We don't quicken ourselves. We put this grace to use through an active obedient faith. We walk in the light as He is in the light which means we stop sinning. We walk in purity and the blood of Jesus Christ cleanses us from all sin.

1Jn 1:7 But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin.

If you are not walking in the light then you are not cleansed. A true repentance allows a true conversion to take place where the sin stops. Then the Lord will come and regenerate you and your sins will be forgiven. Not before.

Act 3:19 Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, when the times of refreshing shall come from the presence of the Lord;

It is a very simple message.
 
C

Crossfire

Guest
#2
I would agree that those who are truly saved will manifest good works as a result / side effect of our salvation. True christians pray, fast, both read and obey the bible, obstain from sin and repent if necessary, partake of communion, etc. HOWEVER, all of these things - in and of themselves can not save you - only faith in the ressurected Jesus Christ can. Don't get me wrong, that does not mean that we should not pray, study, fast, obey and obstain - for all of those things are good and necessary if we truly desire to live a life please to God in His divine presence (Holy Spirit) however, if it were not for Jesus' life, death, burial, resurrection and ascension, everything else is pointless because it is faith in our resurrected Lord that is the entry point, it is He who made salvation possible. It is He who repaired rift between man and God thus restoring us to right relationship with the Father in Heaven. It He who has given us His own righteousness in the form of the Holy Spirit.

In fact, God considers good works done with the wrong motive to be sin just as He considers disobedience to be sin. Do all things for the glory of God and under the inspiration (unction) of the Holy Spirit and He (God) will prosper you to no end. :)
 
Last edited:
Feb 11, 2012
1,358
8
0
#3
Crossfire said:

HOWEVER, all of these things - in and of themselves can not save you - only faith in the ressurected Jesus Christ can.

Do you believe in faith alone for salvation? And do you believe Jesus was your substitute, took the penalty for your sins, and God poured out His wrath on Jesus?

This will help in understanding your view of biblical faith and works.

Thank you

Tommy
 
Last edited:
Oct 20, 2011
490
1
0
#4
Jesus preached a works salvation plain and simple!

Work = To do something.

Jesus taught that YOU MUST be a doer of the word.




This passage is one of the most abused and least understood passages in the Bible.

Eph 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
Eph 2:9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.
Eph 2:10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.

Grace = Charis
From G5463; graciousness (as gratifying), of manner or act (abstract or concrete; literal, figurative or spiritual; especially the divine influence upon the heart, and its reflection in the life; including gratitude): - acceptable, benefit, favour, gift, grace (-ious), joy liberality, pleasure, thank (-s, -worthy).

Grace is indeed a free gift but what sort of gift is it?

Grace is the divine influence on the heart of man and grace teaches us.

Tit 2:11 For the grace of God that bringeth salvation hath appeared to all men,
Tit 2:12 Teaching us that, denying ungodliness and worldly lusts, we should live soberly, righteously, and godly, in this present world;

The grace of God BRINGS salvation when we put it to use through faith. Faith is the working principle that activates grace in our lives. Faith is the DOING part or the WORK that we must do.

This is why Paul wrote...

2Co 6:1 We then, as workers together with him, beseech you also that ye receive not the grace of God in vain.

You see we are to WORK TOGETHER with God otherwise we receive grace to NO EFFECT.

God is the AUTHOR of salvation not us, yet we MUST OBEY and yield to the working of the author in us. If you don't obey you will not be saved.

Heb 5:9 And being made perfect, he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him;

Look at what James wrote...

Jas 1:21 Wherefore lay apart all filthiness and superfluity of naughtiness, and receive with meekness the engrafted word, which is able to save your souls.
Jas 1:22 But be ye doers of the word, and not hearers only, deceiving your own selves.

You are a doer of the word when you are obeying God thus being a worker together with Him.

Look at Noah...

Heb 11:7 By faith Noah, being warned of God of things not seen as yet, moved with fear, prepared an ark to the saving of his house; by the which he condemned the world, and became heir of the righteousness which is by faith.

Noah was saved by grace through faith. God was the author of his salvation from the flood. The warning and instructions on building the ark was God's grace but Noah had to WORK TOGETHER with God, Noah had to be a DOER of the word. Otherwise he would have received the grace of God in vain.

It is very simple.

Let's look at the subject verse again...

Eph 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
Eph 2:9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.
Eph 2:10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.

We are saved by grace and not of ourselves. That means that we are not the authors of our own salvation, it is God leading the way. It is not something we do apart from God. It is by faith that we put to use the divine influence on our hearts to use.

What are the works Paul is talking about? He is talking about works done apart from God. Cleaning the outside of the cup apart from an internal cleansing.

Look at what the Jews did...

Rom 2:17 Behold, thou art called a Jew, and restest in the law, and makest thy boast of God,

The Jews were boasting in the cleansing of the outside of the cup. Look at what Jesus said to them...

Mat_23:26 Thou blind Pharisee, cleansefirst that which is within the cup and platter, that the outside of them may be clean also.

True righteousness is from the inside out not the outside in. That is why salvation is by grace through faith and not of works. You cannot purify the cup by works done apart from the grace of God.

Look at what Paul wrote right before Rom 2:17.

Rom 2:13 (For not the hearers of the law are just before God, but the doers of the law shall be justified.
Rom 2:14 For when the Gentiles, which have not the law, do by nature the things contained in the law, these, having not the law, are a law unto themselves:
Rom 2:15 Which shew the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and their thoughts the mean while accusing or else excusing one another;)

It is the law on the heart that counts because that will produce good fruit. The external appearance can be deceiving because the underlying motive can be corrupt just as it was with the Pharisees. They sought to appear righteous but were inwardly filthy.

Mat_23:27 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye are like unto whited sepulchres, which indeed appear beautiful outward, but are within full of dead men's bones, and of all uncleanness.

The Pharisees boasted in the works of the law done apart from a true faith.

Rom 2:23 Thou that makest thy boast of the law, through breaking the law dishonourest thou God?

That is why Paul wrote...
Eph 2:9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.

But instead would say...

Gal 5:6 For in Jesus Christ neither circumcision availeth any thing, nor uncircumcision; but faith which worketh by love.

Righteousness is from the inside out not the outside in. It is a very simple teaching.

Here is another very important scripture...

Rom 3:31 Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid: yea, we establish the law.

The law is established in the heart through faith. It is through this faith that we walk after the Spirit fulfilling the righteous requirements of the law.

Rom 8:4 That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.

This is because a faith that works by love fulfills the law.

Gal 5:14 For all the law is fulfilled in one word, even in this; Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.

Which is why Jesus taught this...

Mat 22:37 Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
Mat 22:38 This is the first and great commandment.
Mat 22:39 And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
Mat 22:40 On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.

Love fulfills the law. True righteousness come by a faith that works by love. The root is pure.

Jesus said this...Mat 5:17 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.

Mat 5:20 For I say unto you, That except your righteousness shall exceed the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, ye shall in no case enter into the kingdom of heaven.

Out righteousness exceeds that of the scribes and pharisees when we walk by a faith that works by love having the law established in our hearts and we thus fulfill the righteous requirements of the law by the Spirit.

The letter kills but the Spirit brings life.

2Co 3:6 Who also hath made us able ministers of the new testament; not of the letter, but of the spirit: for the letter killeth, but the spirit giveth life.

Again let's look at our subject passage...

Eph 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
Eph 2:9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.
Eph 2:10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.

When we are workers together with God by faith our hearts are purified. This is why it says this in Acts.

Act 15:9 And put no difference between us and them, purifying their hearts by faith.

It is also why Peter wrote this...

1Pe 1:22 Seeing ye have purified your souls in obeying the truth through the Spirit unto unfeigned love of the brethren, see that ye love one another with a pure heart fervently:

It is the pure in heart that will see God.
Mat 5:8 Blessed are the pure in heart: for they shall see God.

The vast majority of professing Christianity has no idea about what I have written and they see grace as some provision or package which they simply trust in to be saved. They throw works out the window.

Jesus preached WORKS.

Mat 7:24 Therefore whosoever heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them, I will liken him unto a wise man, which built his house upon a rock:

Luk 13:24 Strive to enter in at the strait gate: for many, I say unto you, will seek to enter in, and shall not be able.

Mar 8:34 And when he had called the people unto him with his disciples also, he said unto them, Whosoever will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow me.
Mar 8:35 For whosoever will save his life shall lose it; but whosoever shall lose his life for my sake and the gospel's, the same shall save it.

It is about works done in faith. Those are the works Abraham did. That was the faith that God counted Abraham righteous by.

Rom 4:20 He staggered not at the promise of God through unbelief; but was strong in faith, giving glory to God;
Rom 4:21 And being fully persuaded that, what he had promised, he was able also to perform.
Rom 4:22 And therefore it was imputed to him for righteousness.

It is the same with us.

Rom 4:23 Now it was not written for his sake alone, that it was imputed to him;
Rom 4:24 But for us also, to whom it shall be imputed, if we believe on him that raised up Jesus our Lord from the dead;

True believers are doers of the word. They walk after the Spirit with their old man crucified with Christ, they are born again and they are not sinning.

1Jn 5:18 We know that whosoever is born of God sinneth not; but he that is begotten of God keepeth himself, and that wicked one toucheth him not.

You do not fulfill the righteous requirements of the law by sinning every day in thought word and deed every day. Salvation is not some package, provision, or covering which you trust in to make up for your continued sin. That is a lie of Satan.

Jesus gave Himself for us that we be made pure.

Tit 2:14 Who gave himself for us, that he might redeem us from all iniquity, and purify unto himself a peculiar people, zealous of good works.

He did not give Himself that we remain sinners. The false teachers today twist scriptures like Rom 7:15, 1Tim 1:15, and 1Joh 1:8 and Eph 2:8-10 right out of their context to keep the people deceived and in bondage to their sin. Don't be deceived!

Gal 6:7 Be not deceived; God is not mocked: for whatsoever a man soweth, that shall he also reap.
Gal 6:8 For he that soweth to his flesh shall of the flesh reap corruption; but he that soweth to the Spirit shall of the Spirit reap life everlasting.

Which are you sowing to?


There think very carefully about what Paul is teaching here and do not buy into what all the false teachers are telling you.

Eph 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
Eph 2:9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.
Eph 2:10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.


Grace is the divine influence on the heart which God freely gives us. We cannot earn it, God is the author of our salvation, it is God that quickens us.

Eph 2:5 Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved;)

We don't quicken ourselves. We put this grace to use through an active obedient faith. We walk in the light as He is in the light which means we stop sinning. We walk in purity and the blood of Jesus Christ cleanses us from all sin.

1Jn 1:7 But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin.

If you are not walking in the light then you are not cleansed. A true repentance allows a true conversion to take place where the sin stops. Then the Lord will come and regenerate you and your sins will be forgiven. Not before.

Act 3:19 Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, when the times of refreshing shall come from the presence of the Lord;

It is a very simple message.
Are you catholic? They believe you have to work your way to heaven
 
Nov 26, 2011
3,818
62
0
#5
Are you catholic? They believe you have to work your way to heaven


Isn't it interesting how I quote very clear Bible passages that speak of being a DOER of the word and you would make a statement like that.

Please quote something I wrote which is unbiblical. You won't be able to because what I wrote is the truth. You might attempt to cancel it out by misusing Romans 4:1-4 but that passage is only teaching that you cannot do works and claim that God "owes" you. Salvation is via the grace and mercy of God, not of anything we put in motion. God is the author, God is the source, but we must WORK TOGETHER with God lest we receive grace in vain.

It was the heretic Martin Luther who came up with the "faith alone" deception.

I am not of any denominational persuasion. None of them teach what I wrote.
 
K

krisbrian

Guest
#6
Faith alone saves, but the faith that saves is not alone.

Jas 2:17 Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone.
 
Nov 26, 2011
3,818
62
0
#7
Faith alone saves, but the faith that saves is not alone.

Jas 2:17 Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone.

James is saying it is not by faith alone. Clever semantics do not negate the clear teaching of the Bible.

Faith is a work.
 
K

krisbrian

Guest
#8
James is saying it is not by faith alone. Clever semantics do not negate the clear teaching of the Bible.

Faith is a work.
What is a work? I would say doing the will of the father is a good work?

Joh 6:40 And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.
 
Nov 26, 2011
3,818
62
0
#9
What exactly are you trying to say? Are you trying to say that believing is separate from obedience?

Believers are purified by faith.

Act 15:9 And put no difference between us and them, purifying their hearts by faith.

Believers are purified through obedience.

1Pe 1:22 Seeing ye have purified your souls in obeying the truth through the Spirit unto unfeigned love of the brethren, see that ye love one another with a pure heart fervently:

Faith = Obedience.



It is the will of God that those who believe may have eternal life.

Joh 6:40 And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.

Believeth - pisteuō - G4100
From G4102; to have faith (in, upon, or with respect to, a person or thing), that is, credit; by implication to entrust (especially one’s spiritual well being to Christ): - believe (-r), commit (to trust), put in trust with.

Many false teachers will take verses like the one above and isolate them from the rest of Scripture in order to disconnect obedience from believing. They will reject the simply teachings of Jesus about the strait gate and narrow way and being a doer of the word in favour of an ear tickling teaching of "a mental acknowledgment of some facts."

Thus they replace the true Gospel with a package system which totally negates heart purity because they have thrown the working dynamic of faith right out the window.


You will never see false teachers examine verses like the following.

Joh 3:36 He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him.

Believeth Not - apeitheō - G544
From G545; to disbelieve (wilfully and perversely): - not believe, disobedient, obey not, unbelieving.

The above verse makes a clear distinction between "believing" and "not believing." Those who believe obey and those who do not believe disobey.

Those who disobey or "believe not" have the wrath of God abiding on them.



What happened with Israel in the wilderness is a good example for us today. They believed in the sense of a "mental acknowledgment of some facts." After all they were witnesses to the deliverance from Egypt. Yet they were disobedient in the wilderness and were thus rejected by God.

God cuts people off for unbelief/disobedience.

Rom 11:22 Behold therefore the goodness and severity of God: on them which fell, severity; but toward thee, goodness, if thou continue in his goodness: otherwise thou also shalt be cut off.
Rom 11:23 And they also, if they abide not still in unbelief, shall be graffed in: for God is able to graff them in again.


This is why we must "labour" to enter into the rest of God. Faith is a work and it is simply meekly yielding to the work of God in us.

Heb 4:11 Let us labour therefore to enter into that rest, lest any man fall after the same example of unbelief.
 
Feb 11, 2012
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Remember its what the sheep did, and the goats diddnt do that will determine your final salvation!

Nothing in scripture is a done deal, as Skinski says, our salvation is on probation, a dead faith is just that, leads to death, and an alive vibrant working faith in love and obedience is alive, and leads to eternal life!
 
Apr 13, 2011
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#11
Remember its what the sheep did, and the goats diddnt do that will determine your final salvation!

Nothing in scripture is a done deal,
Salvation for Christians is a done deal. Rom 10:9, 1 Pet 1:23, Eph 1:13

as Skinski says, our salvation is on probation
If a person has acted on Rom 10:9, he is saved. He is NOT "on probation".

a dead faith is just that, leads to death, and an alive vibrant working faith in love and obedience is alive, and leads to eternal life!
Christians HAVE eternal life. Living a life of love and obedience will earn rewards.

1 Cor 3:15) If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire.

You are preaching a works salvation. Salvation is by faith. It is the gift of God. Rewards are earned or lost by works.

God bless.
 

jandian

Senior Member
Feb 12, 2011
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#12
You cannot work your way into heaven, we are saved by grace...But when Jesus comes into your life, the challenges of sin does not disappear...It takes effort to resist, which is advice that God gives to us.....Resist the devil and he will flee from you (Jam4:7)...resisting takes effort; therefore your with God requires some work, submission requires work, renewing the mind requires work (Rom12:1-2). In addition it is a demonstration of your love for God who said if you love Him you will keep His commandments (john 14:15)...

Paul was a powerful man of God but said you know what; I have to do everything I tell you, because if I don't; I myself might be disqualified (I Cor 9:27)

The power that raised God from the dead resides in us, why are we fighting for our right to sin....

Last but certainly not least... God looks at the heart...the heart that saids, grace saved me so i dont have to resist sin is completely different from someone who knows that they are saved by grace and shows their appreciation by giving their all to obey God an falters along the way, repents and continues the race.
 
C

Crossfire

Guest
#13
Faith alone saves, but the faith that saves is not alone.

Jas 2:17 Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone.
EXACTLY! If the Holy Spirit - who is the divine nature of Christ (2 Peter 1) - truly lives inside of you and is at work in you and through you, you and those who know you will be able to see it. Sure, you may still struggle with certain areas sin but that just means that the Holy Spirit will work in the different than one who is disciplined such as conviction and repentance, neither of which is not a work of man but rather the work of the Holy Spirit in the heart of man.
 
C

Crossfire

Guest
#14
EXACTLY! If the Holy Spirit - who is the divine nature of Christ (2 Peter 1) - truly lives inside of you and is at work in you and through you, you and those who know you will be able to see it. Sure, you may still struggle with certain areas sin but that just means that the Holy Spirit will work in the different than one who is disciplined such as conviction and repentance, neither of which is a work of man but rather the work of the Holy Spirit in the heart of man.
Had to modify my last post. I realized that I had made a critical typo but my internet connection timed out and I was unable to fix it in time. I've got a great landlord who offers free internet but the connection is horrible. *lol*
 
J

jimmydiggs

Guest
#15
"Faith is a work", well, if you are synergistic and believe you produced your own faith, then yes that would be a work. Seeing as your faith in God, your belief in God, has become a result of your doing.
 
Nov 26, 2011
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Salvation for Christians is a done deal. Rom 10:9, 1 Pet 1:23, Eph 1:13
The first verse you reference is this one.

Rom 10:9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.

This verse is a favourite of the false teachers and they include it in their Romans Road deception.

They will never tell you that Paul had Deuteronomy 30:14 on his mind from which he was making a reference.

Deu 30:14 But the word is very nigh unto thee, in thy mouth, and in thy heart, that thou mayest do it.

No, they will use it to imply that "lip service" gets you into the kingdom which is in complete contradiction to everythign Paul stood for.

In the exact same letter Paul wrote this...

Rom 2:6 Who will render to every man according to his deeds:
Rom 2:7 To them who by patient continuance in well doing seek for glory and honour and immortality, eternal life:
Rom 2:8 But unto them that are contentious, and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness, indignation and wrath,

If you do not obey the truth but instead obey unrighteousness you will receive the wrath of God. Yet you completely deny scriptures like Rom 2:6-8 and try to imply that "ye shall not surely die" by isolating select verses and using them as proof texts


The second verse you referenced was this one...

1Pe 1:23 Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever.

Yet Paul right before that verse wrote this...

1Pe 1:22 Seeing ye have purified your souls in obeying the truth through the Spirit unto unfeigned love of the brethren, see that ye love one another with a pure heart fervently:

The people he is talking about here are people who have obeyed the truth. Those are the ones who are born again of an incorruptible seed by the word of God.

John makes a reference to those who are born of God.

1Jn 5:18 We know that whosoever is born of God sinneth not; but he that is begotten of God keepeth himself, and that wicked one toucheth him not.

Those who are born of God keep themselves and don't sin. They mortify the deeds of the body, and it is those people who are the true sons of God.

Rom 8:13 For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live.
Rom 8:14 For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.

If you are not mortifying the deeds of the body by the Spirit then you are not a son of God. If have not purified your heart through obedience to the truth then you are not born again. It is that simple.

This is what the Bible clearly teaches. I am not twisting the scriptures by isolating verses out of context to proof text a sin gospel.

Look how the children of God are made manifest to the world.

1Jn 3:9 Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.
1Jn 3:10 In this the children of God are manifest, and the children of the devil: whosoever doeth not righteousness is not of God, neither he that loveth not his brother.

If you are producing sin in your life you are a child of the devil. If you are producing righteousness then you are a child of God. You cannot produce both. A good tree does not bear good and bad fruit and a double minded man ought not think he will receive anything from God.



The third verse you referenced was this one...

Eph 1:13 In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,

Believe means to obey. If you truly believe that what God says is the absolute truth then you abide in it simply because there is no other option. It is a very simple premise.

John 3:36 makes a comparison between believing and not believing.
Joh 3:36 He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him.

Believeth - pisteuō - G4100
From G4102; to have faith (in, upon, or with respect to, a person or thing), that is, credit; by implication to entrust (especially one’s spiritual well being to Christ): - believe (-r), commit (to trust), put in trust with.

Believeth Not - apeitheō - G544
From G545; to disbelieve (wilfully and perversely): - not believe, disobedient, obey not, unbelieving.

The difference is clear and such language is used throughout the Bible.

2Th_1:8 In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ:

What you do is separate justification from sanctification and you make sanctification optional. That is a very foolish position to hold because Jesus is the author of salvation of those who obey Him. You can only be sanctified through obedience to the truth because that produced true heart purity.

Heb_5:9 And being made perfect, he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him;

You may think "sanctification" is only about rewards and has nothing to do with salvation but that is because you do not understand what salvation actually is. Salvation is being sanctified because you have been set free from the bondage of sin.

Jesus came to save us from our sins.

Mat 1:21 And she shall bring forth a son, and thou shalt call his name JESUS: for he shall save his people from their sins.

Jesus came to set us free.

Joh 8:36 If the Son therefore shall make you free, ye shall be free indeed.

If you still sin you are a slave of sin and still in bondage.

Joh 8:34 Jesus answered them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Whosoever committeth sin is the servant of sin.

Rom 6:16 Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?
 

jandian

Senior Member
Feb 12, 2011
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#17
so are we saying that God is ok with sin once He truly lives inside of us whether we are convicted or not?
 
Apr 13, 2011
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1 Cor 6:11) And such were some of you: but ye are washed, but ye are sanctified, but ye are justified in the name of the Lord Jesus, and by the Spirit of our God.
 
Apr 13, 2011
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so are we saying that God is ok with sin once He truly lives inside of us whether we are convicted or not?
No, God is not "OK" with sin. We are to stop sinning.

But salvation is not contingent on stopping sinning, salvation is contingent on believing on the savior from sin, Jesus Christ.
 
Nov 26, 2011
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1 Cor 3:15) If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire.

You are preaching a works salvation. Salvation is by faith. It is the gift of God. Rewards are earned or lost by works.

I was showing what the Bible clearly teaches. Can you quote a single thing I said and call it a lie?

Which part is wrong? The part about you having to strive to enter the strait gate? How about the picking up your cross and denying yourself? What about faith being a working dynamic like in the case of Noah? Is that wrong? Please elaborate instead of isolating scriptures and ignoring everything I wrote.

You won't be able to because your position is in gross error.

You use 1Cor 3:15 to imply that you can be disobedient and enter the kingdom. You use 1Cor 3:15 to imply that God will be mocked and that you won't reap what you sow except in regards to "rewards."

Show me the scriptures with these "rewards teachings" please. I don't see anywhere in the Bible where sinners are granted entrance into the kingdom while they remain vile and all they lose is some sort of rewards. That is pure nonsense.

Here is the full context of 1 Cor 3:15.

1Co 3:13 Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is.
1Co 3:14 If any man's work abide which he hath built thereupon, he shall receive a reward.
1Co 3:15 If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire.
1Co 3:16 Know ye not that ye are the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you?
1Co 3:17 If any man defile the temple of God, him shall God destroy; for the temple of God is holy, which temple ye are.

This is a good verse to discuss as I am still not sure of its complete meaning. Yet there is no way it can be implied to mean what you are saying it means because that would make Paul, Peter, Jesus, and John clear liars.

God won't be mocked. You don't reap eternal life by sowing to the flesh.

Gal 6:7 Be not deceived; God is not mocked: for whatsoever a man soweth, that shall he also reap.
Gal 6:8 For he that soweth to his flesh shall of the flesh reap corruption; but he that soweth to the Spirit shall of the Spirit reap life everlasting.