Demise of Repentance

[Skinski7]

[video]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lWpVsHO9qu0[/video]


The understanding of the Clearing of Wrong Doing in the Process of Repentance is completely absent from the pulpits today. Instead that call everyone to Salvation 'in sin' .....not OUT of sin! As a result the converts remain in bondage to their sins. Dig into the Bible and find out what Real Repentance is before it's too late!


2Co 7:10 For godly sorrow worketh repentance to salvation not to be repented of: but the sorrow of the world worketh death.
2Co 7:11 For behold this selfsame thing, that ye sorrowed after a godly sort, what carefulness it wrought in you, yea, what clearing of yourselves, yea, what indignation, yea, what fear, yea, what vehement desire, yea, what zeal, yea, what revenge! In all things ye have approved yourselves to be clear in this matter.

Luk 13:2 And Jesus answering said unto them, Suppose ye that these Galilaeans were sinners above all the Galilaeans, because they suffered such things?
Luk 13:3 I tell you, Nay: but, except ye repent, ye shall all likewise perish.
Luk 13:4 Or those eighteen, upon whom the tower in Siloam fell, and slew them, think ye that they were sinners above all men that dwelt in Jerusalem?
Luk 13:5 I tell you, Nay: but, except ye repent, ye shall all likewise perish.

The prodigal son had to forsake the pig pen BEFORE he was restored by the father. Forsaking the pig pen did not save him, it was simply meeting a mandatory condition that was required by the father before restoration would be granted.

Luk 15:11 And he said, A certain man had two sons:
Luk 15:12 And the younger of them said to his father, Father, give me the portion of goods that falleth to me. And he divided unto them his living.
Luk 15:13 And not many days after the younger son gathered all together, and took his journey into a far country, and there wasted his substance with riotous living.
Luk 15:14 And when he had spent all, there arose a mighty famine in that land; and he began to be in want.
Luk 15:15 And he went and joined himself to a citizen of that country; and he sent him into his fields to feed swine.
Luk 15:16 And he would fain have filled his belly with the husks that the swine did eat: and no man gave unto him.
Luk 15:17 And when he came to himself, he said, How many hired servants of my father's have bread enough and to spare, and I perish with hunger!
Luk 15:18 I will arise and go to my father, and will say unto him, Father, I have sinned against heaven, and before thee,
Luk 15:19 And am no more worthy to be called thy son: make me as one of thy hired servants.
Luk 15:20 And he arose, and came to his father. But when he was yet a great way off, his father saw him, and had compassion, and ran, and fell on his neck, and kissed him.
Luk 15:21 And the son said unto him, Father, I have sinned against heaven, and in thy sight, and am no more worthy to be called thy son.
Luk 15:22 But the father said to his servants, Bring forth the best robe, and put it on him; and put a ring on his hand, and shoes on his feet:
Luk 15:23 And bring hither the fatted calf, and kill it; and let us eat, and be merry:
Luk 15:24 For this my son was dead, and is alive again; he was lost, and is found. And they began to be merry.

 

[Skinski7]

Pro 28:13 He that covereth his sins shall not prosper: but whoso confesseth and forsaketh them shall have mercy.

Isa 1:16 Wash you, make you clean; put away the evil of your doings from before mine eyes; cease to do evil;
Isa 1:17 Learn to do well; seek judgment, relieve the oppressed, judge the fatherless, plead for the widow.
Isa 1:18 Come now, and let us reason together, saith the LORD: though your sins be as scarlet, they shall be as white as snow; though they be red like crimson, they shall be as wool.
Isa 1:19 If ye be willing and obedient, ye shall eat the good of the land:
Isa 1:20 But if ye refuse and rebel, ye shall be devoured with the sword: for the mouth of the LORD hath spoken it.

Isa 55:6 Seek ye the LORD while he may be found, call ye upon him while he is near:
Isa 55:7 Let the wicked forsake his way, and the unrighteous man his thoughts: and let him return unto the LORD, and he will have mercy upon him; and to our God, for he will abundantly pardon.

Jer 26:13 Therefore now amend your ways and your doings, and obey the voice of the LORD your God; and the LORD will repent him of the evil that he hath pronounced against you.

Jon 3:5 So the people of Nineveh believed God, and proclaimed a fast, and put on sackcloth, from the greatest of them even to the least of them.
Jon 3:6 For word came unto the king of Nineveh, and he arose from his throne, and he laid his robe from him, and covered him with sackcloth, and sat in ashes.
Jon 3:7 And he caused it to be proclaimed and published through Nineveh by the decree of the king and his nobles, saying, Let neither man nor beast, herd nor flock, taste any thing: let them not feed, nor drink water:
Jon 3:8 But let man and beast be covered with sackcloth, and cry mightily unto God: yea, let them turn every one from his evil way, and from the violence that is in their hands.
Jon 3:9 Who can tell if God will turn and repent, and turn away from his fierce anger, that we perish not?
Jon 3:10 And God saw their works, that they turned from their evil way; and God repented of the evil, that he had said that he would do unto them; and he did it not.

Jas 4:7 Submit yourselves therefore to God. Resist the devil, and he will flee from you.
Jas 4:8 Draw nigh to God, and he will draw nigh to you. Cleanse your hands, ye sinners; and purify your hearts, ye double minded.
Jas 4:9 Be afflicted, and mourn, and weep: let your laughter be turned to mourning, and your joy to heaviness.
Jas 4:10 Humble yourselves in the sight of the Lord, and he shall lift you up.

Jas 1:21 Wherefore lay apart all filthiness and superfluity of naughtiness, and receive with meekness the engrafted word, which is able to save your souls.

2Ti 2:19 Nevertheless the foundation of God standeth sure, having this seal, The Lord knoweth them that are his. And, Let every one that nameth the name of Christ depart from iniquity.
2Ti 2:20 But in a great house there are not only vessels of gold and of silver, but also of wood and of earth; and some to honour, and some to dishonour.
2Ti 2:21 If a man therefore purge himself from these, he shall be a vessel unto honour, sanctified, and meet for the master's use, and prepared unto every good work.
2Ti 2:22 Flee also youthful lusts: but follow righteousness, faith, charity, peace, with them that call on the Lord out of a pure heart.

 

[loveme1]

Skinski, are you saying people should be obedient to Yahvah God's Law?

Is that what you think True Repentance is?

Do you think too many have been taught that they are free to trespass Almighty Yahvah God's Law because they misunderstand grace?

Do you think people have been taught, that they can enter through the wide gate, not the narrow?


I am trying to understand what you are saying people are not doing properly?

 

[Skinski7]

Skinski, are you saying people should be obedient to Yahvah God's Law?

Is that what you think True Repentance is?

Do you think too many have been taught that they are free to trespass Almighty Yahvah God's Law because they misunderstand grace?

Do you think people have been taught, that they can enter through the wide gate, not the narrow?


I am trying to understand what you are saying people are not doing properly?

Repentance is where the rebellion to God is forsaken and thus it leaves an individual in a state where they are willing to yield to the working of the grace of God.

This is why one cannot be saved "in their rebellion" because being in a state of rebellion is the opposite of being saved.

People need to be obedient to the commands of Jesus, under the New Covenant we are not under the letter of the law of Moses. Yet the law has not been thrown out the window, the righteousness or morality of the law still stands and that is fulfilled through a genuine faith which works on the principle of love within.

When we are walking after the leading of the Spirit and not yielding to the corruptions of lust we will emanate right behaviour from the heart. That is the law we keep. It is the law of love and that is what Jesus taught. Love God and love your neighbour because that fulfills the law.

It is for this reason that someone who is truly born again cannot sin. If one truly has the seed of God within then they cannot go out and steal, lust in the heart, or be angry without cause. When the root is pure the fruit produced will also be pure.

God is looking at the heart.

The modern church system does not teach a gospel message that produces true heart purity. Because the crucifixion of the old man in repentance is not taught they bring people into the faith with the old man intact and then try and reform the old man through a gradual process they call sanctification. In this state the "believer" is pronounced "saved" while they are still double minded, serving two masters, and still walking after their lusts. This is not Christianity but a hoax.

You ask if I think too many have been taught that they are free to trespass Almighty God's Law because they misunderstand grace?

Grace has been completely redefined to simply mean mercy. It is viewed as tolerance by God where He considers one saved whilst they still continue in rebellion.

Grace in the Bible is the power of God, it is His influence on the soul which is freely provided. This grace has to be put to use through an obedient faith by submitting to the right living it teaches. If that does not occur then the grace is received in vain.

One cannot yield to the grace of God without first turning from rebellion. One cannot rebel and submit at the same time and this is why repentance is key. Repentance is not simply a confession of sinfulness, repentance is a complete change of mind that results in a complete change of action.

Yes the narrow gate is not taught today. It has been replaced by a wide gate which is built upon a foundation of error. Very few know what the Gospel actually is because they don't believe their Bibles. Instead they put their faith in teachers who selectively quote mine the Bible to support systematic theology.

It is a real tragedy and more people need to expose the error.

 

[loveme1]

Do you keep the 10 commandments?

Before you are born of a new seed do you have the desire or the love to keep the Law?

After you are "born again" do you feel new inside and strive to keep the Law?

the whole law is based on what Yahshua the Messiah said:

34But when the Pharisees had heard that he had put the Sadducees to silence, they were gathered together. 35Then one of them, which was a lawyer, asked him a question, tempting him, and saying, 36Master, which is the great commandment in the law? 37Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind. 38This is the first and great commandment. 39And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. 40On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.

I think this verse is taught to say that the 10 commandments are not to be kept, but it does not say that at all.

It summarizes the 10 commandments with those two...

The Bible itself tells us that the Saints are those that:

17Then the dragon was enraged at the woman and went off to make war against the rest of her offspring—those who obey God’s commandments and hold to the testimony of Jesus.


12Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.


Revelation still teaches about keeping the commandments, so any teaching before this should never be understood to have been about not keeping the 10 commandments.

Any teaching before this was obviously directed at those that believed in keeping the commandments of Yahvah God, but did not believe in Yahshua the Messiah.

No we seem to see another set of people who, Have faith in Yahshua the Messiah, but do not keep the Commandments of Yahvah God.

The Bible is clear that the devil makes war against those that obey Yahvah God's Commandments and the Testimony of Yahshua.

The Bible says the Saints do both, not one or the other.

 

[Skinski7]

Paul wrote this to those under the law.

Rom 7:1 Know ye not, brethren, (for I speak to them that know the law,) how that the law hath dominion over a man as long as he liveth?
Rom 7:2 For the woman which hath an husband is bound by the law to her husband so long as he liveth; but if the husband be dead, she is loosed from the law of her husband.
Rom 7:3 So then if, while her husband liveth, she be married to another man, she shall be called an adulteress: but if her husband be dead, she is free from that law; so that she is no adulteress, though she be married to another man.
Rom 7:4 Wherefore, my brethren, ye also are become dead to the law by the body of Christ; that ye should be married to another, even to him who is raised from the dead, that we should bring forth fruit unto God.
Rom 7:5 For when we were in the flesh, the motions of sins, which were by the law, did work in our members to bring forth fruit unto death.
Rom 7:6 But now we are delivered from the law, that being dead wherein we were held; that we should serve in newness of spirit, and not in the oldness of the letter.
Rom 7:7 What shall we say then? Is the law sin? God forbid. Nay, I had not known sin, but by the law: for I had not known lust, except the law had said, Thou shalt not covet.
Rom 7:8 But sin, taking occasion by the commandment, wrought in me all manner of concupiscence. For without the law sin was dead.

Here Paul is teaching that through Jesus Christ one is no longer under the law. Notice that he refers to "Thou shalt not covet" which is one of the 10 commandments.

The law was added because of sin until Jesus Christ would come.

Gal 3:19 Wherefore then serveth the law? It was added because of transgressions, till the seed should come to whom the promise was made; and it was ordained by angels in the hand of a mediator.

Love fulfills the law and if one is walking after the Spirit they are not under the law.

Gal 5:18 But if ye be led of the Spirit, ye are not under the law.
Gal 5:14 For all the law is fulfilled in one word, even in this; Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.

The law is not tossed out the window, it is fulfilled by faith, by faith which works by love.

Gal 5:5 For we through the Spirit wait for the hope of righteousness by faith.
Gal 5:6 For in Jesus Christ neither circumcision availeth any thing, nor uncircumcision; but faith which worketh by love.

Now read the following written by Paul very carefully...

2Co 3:3 Forasmuch as ye are manifestly declared to be the epistle of Christ ministered by us, written not with ink, but with the Spirit of the living God; not in tables of stone, but in fleshy tables of the heart.
2Co 3:4 And such trust have we through Christ to God-ward:
2Co 3:5 Not that we are sufficient of ourselves to think any thing as of ourselves; but our sufficiency is of God;
2Co 3:6 Who also hath made us able ministers of the new testament; not of the letter, but of the spirit: for the letter killeth, but the spirit giveth life.
2Co 3:7 But if the ministration of death, written and engraven in stones, was glorious, so that the children of Israel could not stedfastly behold the face of Moses for the glory of his countenance; which glory was to be done away:
2Co 3:8 How shall not the ministration of the spirit be rather glorious?
2Co 3:9 For if the ministration of condemnation be glory, much more doth the ministration of righteousness exceed in glory.
2Co 3:10 For even that which was made glorious had no glory in this respect, by reason of the glory that excelleth.
2Co 3:11 For if that which is done away was glorious, much more that which remaineth is glorious.
2Co 3:12 Seeing then that we have such hope, we use great plainness of speech:
2Co 3:13 And not as Moses, which put a vail over his face, that the children of Israel could not stedfastly look to the end of that which is abolished:
2Co 3:14 But their minds were blinded: for until this day remaineth the same vail untaken away in the reading of the old testament; which vail is done away in Christ.
2Co 3:15 But even unto this day, when Moses is read, the vail is upon their heart.
2Co 3:16 Nevertheless when it shall turn to the Lord, the vail shall be taken away.
2Co 3:17 Now the Lord is that Spirit: and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is liberty.
2Co 3:18 But we all, with open face beholding as in a glass the glory of the Lord, are changed into the same image from glory to glory, even as by the Spirit of the Lord.

The glory of the ten commandments is done away by the glory of the ministration of righteousness which is by faith. This is a stumbling block to many who still put their confidence in outward things not understanding what the Spirit of life in Jesus Christ actually is.

The law is only done away with Jesus Christ which is a new and better way because it is a life lived from having a pure heart within which is through Jesus Christ.

Justification is by the faith of Jesus Christ as we walk after the Spirit with the old man crucified thus allowing to the new man to be made manifest.

Gal 2:16 Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.
Gal 2:17 But if, while we seek to be justified by Christ, we ourselves also are found sinners, is therefore Christ the minister of sin? God forbid.
Gal 2:18 For if I build again the things which I destroyed, I make myself a transgressor.
Gal 2:19 For I through the law am dead to the law, that I might live unto God.
Gal 2:20 I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me.
Gal 2:21 I do not frustrate the grace of God: for if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain.

We have liberty in Christ and are not subject to the letter but this does not mean we can walk after the flesh. No, the standard is much higher now. The righteousness through the Spirit of life in Jesus Christ exceeds that of the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees which was outward adornment only.

Gal 5:13 For, brethren, ye have been called unto liberty; only use not liberty for an occasion to the flesh, but by love serve one another.

Mat_5:20 For I say unto you, That except your righteousness shall exceed the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, ye shall in no case enter into the kingdom of heaven.



The major error within the apostate church system is people do not understand any of this and truly believe they can continue in sin and that grace is a cover for that sin. Nothing could be further from the truth. The sins of the flesh must stop as a result of a genuine repentance or that repentance was not real.

1Pe 4:1 Forasmuch then as Christ hath suffered for us in the flesh, arm yourselves likewise with the same mind: for he that hath suffered in the flesh hath ceased from sin;
1Pe 4:2 That he no longer should live the rest of his time in the flesh to the lusts of men, but to the will of God.

Repentance results in the ceasing of a life lived according to the lusts of the flesh.

Gal 5:24 And they that are Christ's have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts.

That is not happening in the church system at all.

 

[Tombo]

It's a shame how this false teacher whose videos you keep posting has lead you astray into working for your salvation and losing your salvation based on what you do.
I'll pray for you, brother. And I don't mean that flippantly. I know I have made comments to you in the past that mocked this false doctrine of working for your salvation, but I am genuinely concerned for your soul.
I pray that God will make you see that salvation is all His work from first to last. A person doesn't make themselves well first and then call a physician. Call on the Lord Jesus Christ to save you. Be like the tax collector, humble yourself and ask for His free forgiveness. Don't bring any works before the Lord, they are nothing but filthy rags in His sight.
God bless, my friend.

Tom

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Paul wrote this to those under the law.

Rom 7:1 Know ye not, brethren, (for I speak to them that know the law,) how that the law hath dominion over a man as long as he liveth?
Rom 7:2 For the woman which hath an husband is bound by the law to her husband so long as he liveth; but if the husband be dead, she is loosed from the law of her husband.
Rom 7:3 So then if, while her husband liveth, she be married to another man, she shall be called an adulteress: but if her husband be dead, she is free from that law; so that she is no adulteress, though she be married to another man.
Rom 7:4 Wherefore, my brethren, ye also are become dead to the law by the body of Christ; that ye should be married to another, even to him who is raised from the dead, that we should bring forth fruit unto God.
Rom 7:5 For when we were in the flesh, the motions of sins, which were by the law, did work in our members to bring forth fruit unto death.
Rom 7:6 But now we are delivered from the law, that being dead wherein we were held; that we should serve in newness of spirit, and not in the oldness of the letter.
Rom 7:7 What shall we say then? Is the law sin? God forbid. Nay, I had not known sin, but by the law: for I had not known lust, except the law had said, Thou shalt not covet.
Rom 7:8 But sin, taking occasion by the commandment, wrought in me all manner of concupiscence. For without the law sin was dead.

Here Paul is teaching that through Jesus Christ one is no longer under the law. Notice that he refers to "Thou shalt not covet" which is one of the 10 commandments.

The law was added because of sin until Jesus Christ would come.

Gal 3:19 Wherefore then serveth the law? It was added because of transgressions, till the seed should come to whom the promise was made; and it was ordained by angels in the hand of a mediator.

Love fulfills the law and if one is walking after the Spirit they are not under the law.

Gal 5:18 But if ye be led of the Spirit, ye are not under the law.
Gal 5:14 For all the law is fulfilled in one word, even in this; Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.

The law is not tossed out the window, it is fulfilled by faith, by faith which works by love.

Gal 5:5 For we through the Spirit wait for the hope of righteousness by faith.
Gal 5:6 For in Jesus Christ neither circumcision availeth any thing, nor uncircumcision; but faith which worketh by love.

Now read the following written by Paul very carefully...

2Co 3:3 Forasmuch as ye are manifestly declared to be the epistle of Christ ministered by us, written not with ink, but with the Spirit of the living God; not in tables of stone, but in fleshy tables of the heart.
2Co 3:4 And such trust have we through Christ to God-ward:
2Co 3:5 Not that we are sufficient of ourselves to think any thing as of ourselves; but our sufficiency is of God;
2Co 3:6 Who also hath made us able ministers of the new testament; not of the letter, but of the spirit: for the letter killeth, but the spirit giveth life.
2Co 3:7 But if the ministration of death, written and engraven in stones, was glorious, so that the children of Israel could not stedfastly behold the face of Moses for the glory of his countenance; which glory was to be done away:
2Co 3:8 How shall not the ministration of the spirit be rather glorious?
2Co 3:9 For if the ministration of condemnation be glory, much more doth the ministration of righteousness exceed in glory.
2Co 3:10 For even that which was made glorious had no glory in this respect, by reason of the glory that excelleth.
2Co 3:11 For if that which is done away was glorious, much more that which remaineth is glorious.
2Co 3:12 Seeing then that we have such hope, we use great plainness of speech:
2Co 3:13 And not as Moses, which put a vail over his face, that the children of Israel could not stedfastly look to the end of that which is abolished:
2Co 3:14 But their minds were blinded: for until this day remaineth the same vail untaken away in the reading of the old testament; which vail is done away in Christ.
2Co 3:15 But even unto this day, when Moses is read, the vail is upon their heart.
2Co 3:16 Nevertheless when it shall turn to the Lord, the vail shall be taken away.
2Co 3:17 Now the Lord is that Spirit: and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is liberty.
2Co 3:18 But we all, with open face beholding as in a glass the glory of the Lord, are changed into the same image from glory to glory, even as by the Spirit of the Lord.

The glory of the ten commandments is done away by the glory of the ministration of righteousness which is by faith. This is a stumbling block to many who still put their confidence in outward things not understanding what the Spirit of life in Jesus Christ actually is.

The law is only done away with Jesus Christ which is a new and better way because it is a life lived from having a pure heart within which is through Jesus Christ.

Justification is by the faith of Jesus Christ as we walk after the Spirit with the old man crucified thus allowing to the new man to be made manifest.

Gal 2:16 Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.
Gal 2:17 But if, while we seek to be justified by Christ, we ourselves also are found sinners, is therefore Christ the minister of sin? God forbid.
Gal 2:18 For if I build again the things which I destroyed, I make myself a transgressor.
Gal 2:19 For I through the law am dead to the law, that I might live unto God.
Gal 2:20 I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me.
Gal 2:21 I do not frustrate the grace of God: for if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain.

We have liberty in Christ and are not subject to the letter but this does not mean we can walk after the flesh. No, the standard is much higher now. The righteousness through the Spirit of life in Jesus Christ exceeds that of the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees which was outward adornment only.

Gal 5:13 For, brethren, ye have been called unto liberty; only use not liberty for an occasion to the flesh, but by love serve one another.

Mat_5:20 For I say unto you, That except your righteousness shall exceed the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, ye shall in no case enter into the kingdom of heaven.



The major error within the apostate church system is people do not understand any of this and truly believe they can continue in sin and that grace is a cover for that sin. Nothing could be further from the truth. The sins of the flesh must stop as a result of a genuine repentance or that repentance was not real.

1Pe 4:1 Forasmuch then as Christ hath suffered for us in the flesh, arm yourselves likewise with the same mind: for he that hath suffered in the flesh hath ceased from sin;
1Pe 4:2 That he no longer should live the rest of his time in the flesh to the lusts of men, but to the will of God.

Repentance results in the ceasing of a life lived according to the lusts of the flesh.

Gal 5:24 And they that are Christ's have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts.

That is not happening in the church system at all.

Now if you believed and taught this, all would be well. But you don't

paul tells us we who are SAVED, (not we who are trying to be saved) are no longer under law. Thus we will live by the spirit, and in doing so as we learn to trust God, crucify the flesh and start to be conformed to the image of God.

Who he is not talking to is people trying to be saved this way, or people trying not to LOSE their salvation by not doing it this way (of course both mean the same, just worded different) which is why many are fooled into believing this way. I am not doing it to be saved, But if I don't do it, God will take back his gift. In other words. I am doing it to earn his gift, but am afraid to say it, the second way sound better and not so legalistic!

As for us children of God. The things you showed comes natural to us as we grow in Christ.

 

[Tombo]

Now if you believed and taught this, all would be well. But you don't

paul tells us we who are SAVED, (not we who are trying to be saved) are no longer under law. Thus we will live by the spirit, and in doing so as we learn to trust God, crucify the flesh and start to be conformed to the image of God.

Who he is not talking to is people trying to be saved this way, or people trying not to LOSE their salvation by not doing it this way (of course both mean the same, just worded different) which is why many are fooled into believing this way. I am not doing it to be saved, But if I don't do it, God will take back his gift. In other words. I am doing it to earn his gift, but am afraid to say it, the second way sound better and not so legalistic!

As for us children of God. The things you showed comes natural to us as we grow in Christ.

I agree that if he would only call believers to repentance and holiness of life, he would have it right. But he insist that repentance is what saves us, and that we can lose the salvation that Jesus has won for us. This is where he greatly errs.
I have hope that God will reveal this to him. He is zealous, but not according to the truth.
God bless.

Tom

 

[loveme1]

Here Paul is teaching that through Jesus Christ one is no longer under the law. Notice that he refers to "Thou shalt not covet" which is one of the 10 commandments.




Why then does it mention the Commandments of Yahvah God and Faith of Yahshua the Messiah in Revelation?

If the Messiah Yahshua said this:

17Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil. 18For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled. 19Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.

The Messiah said himself that he did not come to destroy the Law, he fulfills it.

We do not offer burnt sacrifices to cover our sins, it is only by Yahshua the Messiah that we are forgiven for our trespass of the Law.

Old times the Hebrews had a different offering for their trespasses, you will find in Moses ceremonial Law was to be kept until Yahshua the Messiah became the sin offering for all of us that accept Salvation and be covered by his blood.

You can quote what Paul said all day long, but it does not answer why Revelation makes clear that the Saints are those that keep the Commandments of Yahvah God and Faith of Yahshua the Messiah.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

I agree that if he would only call believers to repentance and holiness of life, he would have it right. But he insist that repentance is what saves us, and that we can lose the salvation that Jesus has won for us. This is where he greatly errs.
I have hope that God will reveal this to him. He is zealous, but not according to the truth.
God bless.

Tom

well repentance is what saves us, Just not the type he is talking about.

We repent about what we think, who we are, Who God is, and agree we are lost without hope minus his son's grace gift. Without this. we will never get to the repentance he wants (sin) because we will never agree sin is sin and separates us from God. thus will keep living as we did, even if we state we "believe" in Christ. or will continue to try to earn our way to heaven by good works and living what we consider to be a holy life.

Opposite ends of the spectrum yes. But both highly dangerous, because both leads straight to hell.

 

[Skinski7]

Jesus is God.

Rev_12:17 And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.

Rev_14:12 Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.



Mat 5:17 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.
Mat 5:18 For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.
Mat 5:19 Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.
Mat 5:20 For I say unto you, That except your righteousness shall exceed the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, ye shall in no case enter into the kingdom of heaven.

We keep the law through walking after the Spirit. That is why in all the writings of the New Testament there is no emphasis on the letter of the law. That is why they do not go on about the Sabbath etc. They understand that the letter deals with external things but true righteousness is from within.

We are to fulfill the righteousness of the law through the Spirit.

Rom 8:4 That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.

We are not to judge others on external things except if they be walking in immorality.

Act 15:28 For it seemed good to the Holy Ghost, and to us, to lay upon you no greater burden than these necessary things;
Act 15:29 That ye abstain from meats offered to idols, and from blood, and from things strangled, and from fornication: from which if ye keep yourselves, ye shall do well. Fare ye well.


Col 2:16 Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days:

note: "days" is not in the Greek but was added by the translators probably because of the context of ordinances a few verses before. Yet holyday is used in the same sentence. Nevertheless 2Cor3 is very clear on this issue in regards to the ministration of death.

The Sabbath was a type and shadow of the rest that is in Christ and it is fulfilled in Christ. I speak of the Sabbath because I am sure that is the commandment that you'll probably mention because all the others are obvious immorality and idolatry.

One can keep the letter of the Sabbath if they wish but we are not to judge anyone on such things because the just walk by faith which has purified their heart and thus they live according to a good conscience towards God. Read Romans 11.

There are many today who wish to put a yolk of bondage upon the simplicity that is in Christ. I have dealt with many of these people and it is interesting that when one gets down to it they are preaching the saved in sin message as everyone else.

Just like those who will fight vehemently against the remarriage issue and force bondage on those who come to Christ in a second marriage, these legalists use the Sabbath in the same manner, yet they will never say that the sin has to stop in repentance.

 

[Red33]

Repentance is alive and well but not according to the leagalistic dictates of your understanding.

 

[Skinski7]

Tombo and Eternally Grateful.


You both argue in favour of the continuation of sin. That is your problem with what I say. You cannot stand the preaching of real repentance.

That is why you refuse to directly address this verse...

1Pe 4:1 Forasmuch then as Christ hath suffered for us in the flesh, arm yourselves likewise with the same mind: for he that hath suffered in the flesh hath ceased from sin;
1Pe 4:2 That he no longer should live the rest of his time in the flesh to the lusts of men, but to the will of God.

This verse...

1Jn 5:18 We know that whosoever is born of God sinneth not; but he that is begotten of God keepeth himself, and that wicked one toucheth him not.

Gal 5:24 And they that are Christ's have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts.

You have to explain them away and say they do not mean what they say.

Tombo has plainly stated many times that repentance comes after salvation and it irked when I post this verse...

2Co 7:10 For godly sorrow worketh repentance to salvation not to be repented of: but the sorrow of the world worketh death.

It totally contradicts what he believes.

Eternally Grateful I have seen you deny Pro 28:13 and imply that it was a reference to someone who was saved already.

Pro 28:13 He that covereth his sins shall not prosper: but whoso confesseth and forsaketh them shall have mercy.



You both believe in a package salvation which is totally abstract and disconnected from the deeds of the body. Thus this package cannot be lost in your view. Your religion is gnostic dualism dressed up in Christian terminology. So of course I am a heretic to your belief system. I expose your theology with clear scripture.

You both respond with rhetoric and scripture out of context and you invent strawmen to attack and malign my character while refusing to directly address what I am actually saying.

The blood of Jesus Christ only cleanses someone if they are walking in the light as God is in the light and that means with no darkness at all.
1Jn 1:7 But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin.

One can only walk in the light if they forsake the darkness in repentance. It is only then that God will raise someone up to newness of life and empower them to walk after the Spirit. It is by the grace of God that this is possible.

You gnostic theology has converts living in a supposed saved state still double minded and still in bondage to their sin. Salvation to you both is simply wrath protection because the bondage of sin is not broken. Therefore nothing you do or don't do has any bearing on salvation. It is totally disconnected and that is gnostic dualism.

I don't even know why you would teach that one must "receive Jesus" because that would still be a work on the part of man. Your theology is full of contradictions and collapses like a house of cards when compared to what the Bible actually teaches.l

 

[loveme1]

If you love Almighty Yahvah God with all your heart and soul you would take delight in the Sabbath and not consider it a yoke around your neck so to speak..................


If you love Almighty Yahvah God with all your heart and soul you would listen to him when he says swine is not to be eaten.



Sin is a trespass of the 10 commandments.

They are still to be kept, otherwise there is no sin.

Yahshua the Messiah never said we are not under the 10 commandments.


<< 1 John 5 >>
King James Version
1Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: and every one that loveth him that begat loveth him also that is begotten of him. 2By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God, and keep his commandments. 3For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous. 4For whatsoever is born of God overcometh the world: and this is the victory that overcometh the world, even our faith.

 

[loveme1]

<< 1 John 5 >>
King James Version
1Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: and every one that loveth him that begat loveth him also that is begotten of him. 2By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God, and keep his commandments. 3For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous. 4For whatsoever is born of God overcometh the world: and this is the victory that overcometh the world, even our faith.
5Who is he that overcometh the world, but he that believeth that Jesus is the Son of God? 6This is he that came by water and blood, even Jesus Christ; not by water only, but by water and blood. And it is the Spirit that beareth witness, because the Spirit is truth. 7For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one. 8And there are three that bear witness in earth, the spirit, and the water, and the blood: and these three agree in one. 9If we receive the witness of men, the witness of God is greater: for this is the witness of God which he hath testified of his Son. 10He that believeth on the Son of God hath the witness in himself: he that believeth not God hath made him a liar; because he believeth not the record that God gave of his Son. 11And this is the record, that God hath given to us eternal life, and this life is in his Son. 12He that hath the Son hath life; and he that hath not the Son of God hath not life.

13These things have I written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God; that ye may know that ye have eternal life, and that ye may believe on the name of the Son of God. 14And this is the confidence that we have in him, that, if we ask any thing according to his will, he heareth us: 15And if we know that he hear us, whatsoever we ask, we know that we have the petitions that we desired of him.

16If any man see his brother sin a sin which is not unto death, he shall ask, and he shall give him life for them that sin not unto death. There is a sin unto death: I do not say that he shall pray for it. 17All unrighteousness is sin: and there is a sin not unto death.

18We know that whosoever is born of God sinneth not; but he that is begotten of God keepeth himself, and that wicked one toucheth him not. 19And we know that we are of God, and the whole world lieth in wickedness. 20And we know that the Son of God is come, and hath given us an understanding, that we may know him that is true, and we are in him that is true, even in his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life.

21Little children, keep yourselves from idols. Amen.

 

[Tombo]

Tombo and Eternally Grateful.


You both argue in favour of the continuation of sin. That is your problem with what I say. You cannot stand the preaching of real repentance.

That is why you refuse to directly address this verse...

1Pe 4:1 Forasmuch then as Christ hath suffered for us in the flesh, arm yourselves likewise with the same mind: for he that hath suffered in the flesh hath ceased from sin;
1Pe 4:2 That he no longer should live the rest of his time in the flesh to the lusts of men, but to the will of God.

This verse...

1Jn 5:18 We know that whosoever is born of God sinneth not; but he that is begotten of God keepeth himself, and that wicked one toucheth him not.

Gal 5:24 And they that are Christ's have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts.

You have to explain them away and say they do not mean what they say.

Tombo has plainly stated many times that repentance comes after salvation and it irked when I post this verse...

2Co 7:10 For godly sorrow worketh repentance to salvation not to be repented of: but the sorrow of the world worketh death.

It totally contradicts what he believes.

Eternally Grateful I have seen you deny Pro 28:13 and imply that it was a reference to someone who was saved already.

Pro 28:13 He that covereth his sins shall not prosper: but whoso confesseth and forsaketh them shall have mercy.



You both believe in a package salvation which is totally abstract and disconnected from the deeds of the body. Thus this package cannot be lost in your view. Your religion is gnostic dualism dressed up in Christian terminology. So of course I am a heretic to your belief system. I expose your theology with clear scripture.

You both respond with rhetoric and scripture out of context and you invent strawmen to attack and malign my character while refusing to directly address what I am actually saying.

The blood of Jesus Christ only cleanses someone if they are walking in the light as God is in the light and that means with no darkness at all.
1Jn 1:7 But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin.

One can only walk in the light if they forsake the darkness in repentance. It is only then that God will raise someone up to newness of life and empower them to walk after the Spirit. It is by the grace of God that this is possible.

You gnostic theology has converts living in a supposed saved state still double minded and still in bondage to their sin. Salvation to you both is simply wrath protection because the bondage of sin is not broken. Therefore nothing you do or don't do has any bearing on salvation. It is totally disconnected and that is gnostic dualism.

I don't even know why you would teach that one must "receive Jesus" because that would still be a work on the part of man. Your theology is full of contradictions and collapses like a house of cards when compared to what the Bible actually teaches.l

Skinski, you know that isn't true. You show me ONE PLACE where I have ever said continuation in sin is ever acceptable to someone who claims to be a Christian. I have continually said that when a person is saved, repentance and good works will follow because we are now indwelt by the Holy Spirit. Your problem is that you teach repentance saves a person, and that continuing in repentance, you keep yourself saved. You have been led down the garden path on this.
You always say that I SAY that we are saved while we're still sinners, but it isn't I who says it but the Bible. Remember the verse, "while we were yet sinners Christ died for us"? You need to get away from that guy you follow, he is leading himself and you to destruction.
God bless

Tom

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Tombo and Eternally Grateful.


You both argue in favour of the continuation of sin. That is your problem with what I say. You cannot stand the preaching of real repentance.

No we don't, we fight against it. And we understand those who are born of God can not continue in sin (1 john)

We not only fight against that, but we fight against people who teach self righteous deeds trying to earn salvation.

That is why you refuse to directly address this verse...

1Pe 4:1 Forasmuch then as Christ hath suffered for us in the flesh, arm yourselves likewise with the same mind: for he that hath suffered in the flesh hath ceased from sin;
1Pe 4:2 That he no longer should live the rest of his time in the flesh to the lusts of men, but to the will of God.

What is there to adress? What paul said was true. if we are born of God we will live the rest of our lives enjoying doing the will of God, and learn to destroy the lust of the flesh. Being conformed to the image of God, that just as he crucified the flesh, we will also.

1Jn 5:18 We know that whosoever is born of God sinneth not; but he that is begotten of God keepeth himself, and that wicked one toucheth him not.

Ah thanks. You showed the verse for me. Whoever is BORN OF GOD. can not CONTINUE in sin. But this is not what you preach. You preach we must stop sin to be born of God, you have it backwards.

Gal 5:24 And they that are Christ's have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts.

Ah yes, We who are Christ's children WILL do this. Not might do it. So why do you preach we must do it to be Christ's and not as a result of being Christ's?

You have to explain them away and say they do not mean what they say.

No, you do, because you do not believe them. They say exactly what we have been saying all along, your the one fighting them.

2Co 7:10 For godly sorrow worketh repentance to salvation not to be repented of: but the sorrow of the world worketh death.

Yes, just what I said. and this leads us to become Children of God. and the verses you posted above from 1 John and galations WILL HAPPEN.

But you don't believe this!

Eternally Grateful I have seen you deny Pro 28:13 and imply that it was a reference to someone who was saved already.

Pro 28:13 He that covereth his sins shall not prosper: but whoso confesseth and forsaketh them shall have mercy.

Deny it? No. If we confess we will find healing, if we do not confess, but hide, we will suffer greatly.

When are you going to stop lying, I heve never denied that verse. It works perfectly with what I bel;ieve. you just can't see it because you have utterly no clue what I believe.

You both believe in a package salvation which is totally abstract and disconnected from the deeds of the body. Thus this package cannot be lost in your view. Your religion is gnostic dualism dressed up in Christian terminology. So of course I am a heretic to your belief system. I expose your theology with clear scripture.

if I can't earn it by my deeds, i can't keep it by my deeds. Paul makes it clear a person who thinks he can "perfect his salvation" by works (deeds0 are foolish. I do not want to be a fool. I want to be thankfull to God for the precious gift he gave me. when I know I deserve nothing.

You both respond with rhetoric and scripture out of context and you invent strawmen to attack and malign my character while refusing to directly address what I am actually saying.

Thats funny. I addressed everything you said. You did not respond to it. All you have done is make a felonious attack on what you do not understand (my belief) lie about what I have said or did nto say, and say I believe things I don't.

The blood of Jesus Christ only cleanses someone if they are walking in the light as God is in the light and that means with no darkness at all.
1Jn 1:7 But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin.

We will walk in the light/ we will stumble from time to time. But we will not live as we did before. This is the part you don't get. As john said, a child born of God can not keep sinning, he is born of God.

One can only walk in the light if they forsake the darkness in repentance. It is only then that God will raise someone up to newness of life and empower them to walk after the Spirit. It is by the grace of God that this is possible.

lol. try that see how good it works. If your spiritually dead, you can't walk in the spirit, you have no spirit to walk in. You are DEAD TO GOD.

You gnostic theology has converts living in a supposed saved state still double minded and still in bondage to their sin. Salvation to you both is simply wrath protection because the bondage of sin is not broken. Therefore nothing you do or don't do has any bearing on salvation. It is totally disconnected and that is gnostic dualism.

Again, your preaching to a licentious person. I am not one. When are you going to stop saying this. Do you not understand that when you falsly accuse someone you are in sin. REPENT MY CHILD before you lose your salvation, for you have broken one of Gods commands!

I don't even know why you would teach that one must "receive Jesus" because that would still be a work on the part of man. Your theology is full of contradictions and collapses like a house of cards when compared to what the Bible actually teaches.l

Nope. I don't teach recieve Jesus, I teach we are condemned and spiritually dead to god, But god loves you so much he sen his son to die in your place. He has a gift he want to give you, it is called a life with him, free of the bondage of sin, and a new life in him. Take it, or reject it, the choice is yours. Christ wants to recieve YOU.

That is not a work. that is Gods work, and us taking it in faith.

again, try to learn what we believe, stop listening to men teach you wahat we believe, and what you should believe,

 

[cfultz3]

I would like to make these my words also.

No we don't, we fight against it. And we understand those who are born of God can not continue in sin (1 john)

We not only fight against that, but we fight against people who teach self righteous deeds trying to earn salvation.



What is there to adress? What paul said was true. if we are born of God we will live the rest of our lives enjoying doing the will of God, and learn to destroy the lust of the flesh. Being conformed to the image of God, that just as he crucified the flesh, we will also.



Ah thanks. You showed the verse for me. Whoever is BORN OF GOD. can not CONTINUE in sin. But this is not what you preach. You preach we must stop sin to be born of God, you have it backwards.



Ah yes, We who are Christ's children WILL do this. Not might do it. So why do you preach we must do it to be Christ's and not as a result of being Christ's?



No, you do, because you do not believe them. They say exactly what we have been saying all along, your the one fighting them.



Yes, just what I said. and this leads us to become Children of God. and the verses you posted above from 1 John and galations WILL HAPPEN.

But you don't believe this!



Deny it? No. If we confess we will find healing, if we do not confess, but hide, we will suffer greatly.

When are you going to stop lying, I heve never denied that verse. It works perfectly with what I bel;ieve. you just can't see it because you have utterly no clue what I believe.



if I can't earn it by my deeds, i can't keep it by my deeds. Paul makes it clear a person who thinks he can "perfect his salvation" by works (deeds0 are foolish. I do not want to be a fool. I want to be thankfull to God for the precious gift he gave me. when I know I deserve nothing.



Thats funny. I addressed everything you said. You did not respond to it. All you have done is make a felonious attack on what you do not understand (my belief) lie about what I have said or did nto say, and say I believe things I don't.




We will walk in the light/ we will stumble from time to time. But we will not live as we did before. This is the part you don't get. As john said, a child born of God can not keep sinning, he is born of God.



lol. try that see how good it works. If your spiritually dead, you can't walk in the spirit, you have no spirit to walk in. You are DEAD TO GOD.



Again, your preaching to a licentious person. I am not one. When are you going to stop saying this. Do you not understand that when you falsly accuse someone you are in sin. REPENT MY CHILD before you lose your salvation, for you have broken one of Gods commands!



Nope. I don't teach recieve Jesus, I teach we are condemned and spiritually dead to god, But god loves you so much he sen his son to die in your place. He has a gift he want to give you, it is called a life with him, free of the bondage of sin, and a new life in him. Take it, or reject it, the choice is yours. Christ wants to recieve YOU.

That is not a work. that is Gods work, and us taking it in faith.

again, try to learn what we believe, stop listening to men teach you wahat we believe, and what you should believe,

 

[loveme1]

Nope. I don't teach recieve Jesus, I teach we are condemned and spiritually dead to god, But god loves you so much he sen his son to die in your place. He has a gift he want to give you, it is called a life with him, free of the bondage of sin, and a new life in him. Take it, or reject it, the choice is yours. Christ wants to recieve YOU.

What does free from the bondage of sin mean?