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Maybe some people could use this verse..then the things of the Spirit will be able to be seen by them.
John 3:6-7 (NASB)
[SUP]6 [/SUP] "That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.
[SUP]7 [/SUP] "Do not be amazed that I said to you, 'You must be born again.'
1 Corinthians 2:14 (NASB)
[SUP]14 [/SUP] But a natural man does not accept the things of the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him; and he cannot understand them, because they are spiritually appraised.
John 3:6-7 (NASB)
[SUP]6 [/SUP] "That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.
[SUP]7 [/SUP] "Do not be amazed that I said to you, 'You must be born again.'
1 Corinthians 2:14 (NASB)
[SUP]14 [/SUP] But a natural man does not accept the things of the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him; and he cannot understand them, because they are spiritually appraised.
G
And Grace777, the very next verse says that they were carnal and could not receive as spiritual people. They were babes in Christ and saved.
And there is not ONE verse in the bible that dogmatically says that all believers will advance in the Christian way of life.
Most don't in reality. They get stuck in religion and pay tithes,fight sin,get on a works program to work for or maintain salvation...........and never advance.
And there is not ONE verse in the bible that dogmatically says that all believers will advance in the Christian way of life.
Most don't in reality. They get stuck in religion and pay tithes,fight sin,get on a works program to work for or maintain salvation...........and never advance.
C
The first three verses talk about "us":
Hebrews 6:1 ¶ Therefore leaving the principles of the doctrine of Christ, let us go on unto perfection; not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works, and of faith toward God,
Hebrews 6:2 Of the doctrine of baptisms, and of laying on of hands, and of resurrection of the dead, and of eternal judgment.
Hebrews 6:3 And this will we do, if God permit.
The next couple of verses talk about "them". It is talking about the Jewish or Hebrew believers who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift. It is not talking about us because if you study the Bible there are words "turn" and "return" because there are exortations to come back to God like the parable of the prodigal son who returned. John tells us in 1 John 1:8-9 that if any man sins that and if we confess our sins He is faithful to forgive us and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. And Hebrews 4:15 says "For we have not an high priest which cannot be touched with the feeling of our infirmities; but was in all points tempted like as [we are, yet] without sin. " so the Bible has opportunities for forgiveness, healing, restoration and the opportunity to turn back to God. These verses can't be saying that if we fall away then it is over. 1 John 2:1 My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous:
Hebrews 6:4 For [it is] impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost,
Hebrews 6:5 And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come,
Hebrews 6:6 If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put [him] to an open shame.
We aren't part of this. There are five participles here:
for those who were once enlightened
have tasted of the heavenly gift
tasted the good word of God
and have fallen away (the word "if" here can mean "and" as in "and have fallen away")
If doesn't say,"if they shall fall away". The word "If" can mean "and" and I looked it up.
Hebrews 6:1 ¶ Therefore leaving the principles of the doctrine of Christ, let us go on unto perfection; not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works, and of faith toward God,
Hebrews 6:2 Of the doctrine of baptisms, and of laying on of hands, and of resurrection of the dead, and of eternal judgment.
Hebrews 6:3 And this will we do, if God permit.
The next couple of verses talk about "them". It is talking about the Jewish or Hebrew believers who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift. It is not talking about us because if you study the Bible there are words "turn" and "return" because there are exortations to come back to God like the parable of the prodigal son who returned. John tells us in 1 John 1:8-9 that if any man sins that and if we confess our sins He is faithful to forgive us and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. And Hebrews 4:15 says "For we have not an high priest which cannot be touched with the feeling of our infirmities; but was in all points tempted like as [we are, yet] without sin. " so the Bible has opportunities for forgiveness, healing, restoration and the opportunity to turn back to God. These verses can't be saying that if we fall away then it is over. 1 John 2:1 My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous:
Hebrews 6:4 For [it is] impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost,
Hebrews 6:5 And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come,
Hebrews 6:6 If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put [him] to an open shame.
We aren't part of this. There are five participles here:
for those who were once enlightened
have tasted of the heavenly gift
tasted the good word of God
and have fallen away (the word "if" here can mean "and" as in "and have fallen away")
If doesn't say,"if they shall fall away". The word "If" can mean "and" and I looked it up.
G
We as believers are part of it. All these verses are about believers and saved people. It is just not about salvation and going to heaven.
1.Falling away does not mean loss of salvation. Every time we grieve or quench the Spirit we fall away.
2.We can't be renewed again to repentance unto salvation........we are eternally secure in Christ the moment we believe.
3. every time we get on a works program for salvation or the loss of salvation is believed.....we crucify Christ afresh.
Believers do and will fall away from Christ. They don't fall away from salvation though. They are going to be servants in the eternal state, not lords and kings.
1.Falling away does not mean loss of salvation. Every time we grieve or quench the Spirit we fall away.
2.We can't be renewed again to repentance unto salvation........we are eternally secure in Christ the moment we believe.
3. every time we get on a works program for salvation or the loss of salvation is believed.....we crucify Christ afresh.
Believers do and will fall away from Christ. They don't fall away from salvation though. They are going to be servants in the eternal state, not lords and kings.
C
Sounds like it came from the Free Grace Evangelical Society from a book called "The Reign of the Servant Kings" by Joseph Dillow.
I have the Bible Knowledge Commentary by Dallas Theological Seminary and I don't take Zane Hodge's work seriously.
I believe in grace but I don't believe in swinging to the Free Grace Evangelical Society just to get away from Lordship Salvation.
Revelation 5:10 You have made them to be a kingdom and priests to serve our God, and they will reign on the earth."
I have the Bible Knowledge Commentary by Dallas Theological Seminary and I don't take Zane Hodge's work seriously.
I believe in grace but I don't believe in swinging to the Free Grace Evangelical Society just to get away from Lordship Salvation.
Revelation 5:10 You have made them to be a kingdom and priests to serve our God, and they will reign on the earth."
Hebrews 6:6 is in hypothetical case. It should be understood that verse 4 that believers is impossible to experienced falling away or apostatize. Christian maybe back slid but never in a state of falling away as in this case "for it is impossible." These apostates to begin with may have heard the Gospel, the Word of God, participated in the ministry, enjoy the ministry yet in reality never have been abode by the Holy Spirit thereby crucifying Christ afresh and putting Him to an open shame.
Imagine what you are really saying here. Are you saying most people who walk with Jesus are walking in darkness and are deceived? Yes there will always be margins in this regard, but these are the Lords people. I am not going to say what they are or are not doing.
If one ends up saying most of this is failure, you are dishonouring the Lord. The more I meet people the more amazed I am at what the Lord is doing and how quietly and truthfully He works His truth into peoples lives.
Advancing is about learning how to love despite pain and loss, to count ourselves unworthy of the blessing we have received and to walk on in purity, love and righteousness.
What people often mean by advance is spiritual gifts, missing out the most important one, healing of the heart and soul.
If one ends up saying most of this is failure, you are dishonouring the Lord. The more I meet people the more amazed I am at what the Lord is doing and how quietly and truthfully He works His truth into peoples lives.
Advancing is about learning how to love despite pain and loss, to count ourselves unworthy of the blessing we have received and to walk on in purity, love and righteousness.
What people often mean by advance is spiritual gifts, missing out the most important one, healing of the heart and soul.
One's theology determines how he or she sees that verse. Iwill state my belief and do so with clarity. It is not intent to offend you or anyone but only to clearlystate its context. Matthew 24:13 is not to Christians in this dispensation.That verse is to the Jews near the end of Daniel's 70 week or the close of the GreatTribulation prior to Jesus coming back to Earth with his Bride the body ofChrist. Saved in this verse does not have anything to do with saving the soulfrom hell, but from physical death. If the Jews this is directed at die priorto the second coming then they are absent from the body and present with thelord which is true of any believer at their death. The Jews that survive whoare saved in the tribulation will be those with saved gentiles too during thefinal week of Daniel’s prophecy to populated the earth in the Millennial kingdomwhich will last for 1000 years.
Once you choose to follow Jesus, and believe that He died for your sins are you forever saved and never able to choose to walk away from Christ after that point?
I think No is the answer to this question because It is a daily walk and the relationship is based on a daily commitment.
1Co 15:31 I protest by your rejoicing which I have in Christ Jesus our Lord, I die daily.
Luk 8:11 Now the parable is this: The seed is the word of God.
Luk 8:12 Those by the way side are they that hear; then cometh the devil, and taketh away the word out of their hearts, lest they should believe and be saved.
Luk 8:13 They on the rock are they, which, when they hear, receive the word with joy; and these have no root, which for a while believe, and in time of temptation fall away.
Luk 8:14 And that which fell among thorns are they, which, when they have heard, go forth, and are choked with cares and riches and pleasures of this life, and bring no fruit to perfection.
Luk 8:15 But that on the good ground are they, which in an honest and good heart, having heard the word, keep it, and bring forth fruit with patience.
Notice that all hear or receive the word, the saving word, the truth of the gospel. But 3 lose it because the devil takes it, or they fall away, or are choked by temptation.
We can go backwards and lose our salvation.
I think No is the answer to this question because It is a daily walk and the relationship is based on a daily commitment.
1Co 15:31 I protest by your rejoicing which I have in Christ Jesus our Lord, I die daily.
Luk 8:11 Now the parable is this: The seed is the word of God.
Luk 8:12 Those by the way side are they that hear; then cometh the devil, and taketh away the word out of their hearts, lest they should believe and be saved.
Luk 8:13 They on the rock are they, which, when they hear, receive the word with joy; and these have no root, which for a while believe, and in time of temptation fall away.
Luk 8:14 And that which fell among thorns are they, which, when they have heard, go forth, and are choked with cares and riches and pleasures of this life, and bring no fruit to perfection.
Luk 8:15 But that on the good ground are they, which in an honest and good heart, having heard the word, keep it, and bring forth fruit with patience.
Notice that all hear or receive the word, the saving word, the truth of the gospel. But 3 lose it because the devil takes it, or they fall away, or are choked by temptation.
We can go backwards and lose our salvation.
haven't read the comments, but the Thread Title didn't sit well with me.
I am not an OSASer, and folks are pretty well aware of that here on CC, but I do not believe it is a Theology of the devil......in my opinion only I suspect, that is just wrong to even post here.....but, now, that may just be me, sooooooo
I am not an OSASer, and folks are pretty well aware of that here on CC, but I do not believe it is a Theology of the devil......in my opinion only I suspect, that is just wrong to even post here.....but, now, that may just be me, sooooooo
Luk 8:15 But that on the good ground are they, which in an honest and good heart, having heard the word,
keep it, and bring forth fruit with patience.
This is the answer. The only one that was actually saved were those of an honest and good heart. It is clear that all the others were never saved. Notice that verse 15 distinguishes between the heart of the one that is saved and the others. Only one of the categories actually had saving faith. It is that simple.
Yes, you are to believe and continue to believe that Christ did enough work, so that you are saved.
If you decide not to trust the efforts of Jesus, then you have created a wall around yourself and
cannot receive forgiveness becasue you have lost the required faith. But forgiveness is always waiting.
If you decide not to trust the efforts of Jesus, then you have created a wall around yourself and
cannot receive forgiveness becasue you have lost the required faith. But forgiveness is always waiting.
