The 1st Century Chruch

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ForthAngel

Senior Member
Aug 31, 2012
2,171
91
48
#1
I deleted some of this because I did not agree with it all. He seemed to not believe in the Trinity, or didn't explain it in a way that made sense. Something about God being a person, Jesus being a person, and the Holy Spirit not being a person somehow? I dunno, it was confusing so I didn't include it. I see the Trinity as mind (God), Body (Jesus), and Spirit (Holy Spirit). Together, They make One. Just like we also consist of mind, body, and spirit. Without this setup, we wouldn't really exist would we? This is just my opinion, one I hope isn't dangerous.


If anyone would like to give me a biblical explanation, I would appreciate it.



My own view is that the church are individuals who make up the true spiritual body of Christ. Not an establishment or building or group of people who hold to, or emphasize one doctrine, which is really what this article looks at. I don't think it matters what church you go to. Well to an extent. Some churches have dangerous teachings, that should be avoided. But the point is, that the church of Christ has members that attend physical churches of most every denomination.



He also mentioned holidays and the seventh day sabbath, which, once again I hope isn't a dangerous stance, but I think are very trivial concerns. The rest of what he said, I think is pretty good, although I don't necessarily agree with it all. I haven't read back through what I pasted, but he did mention as well that the Gospel being spread is not about Jesus. But he explains that Jesus was also spreading the gospel (the news of the kingdom of heaven?) but also that Jesus is the only way to reach it. I dunno. Once again it was confusing.


I think what he meant was the gospel is about the Kingdom of Heaven being near (whether physically/spiritually near, or close to coming in the future, or both), but that through Jesus we are able to be a part of this Kingdom. ? Anyway, here is the article.



What Did the New Testament Church Look Like?
BY KEVIN D. DENEE


Professing Christianity is comprised of many groups and endless schools of thought. But does the picture today reflect the New Testament Church of 2,000 years ago? The comparisons will surprise you!


Two billion people on earth profess to be Christian. In other words, nearly every third person believes he is following Jesus Christ and the Bible.
Dominant in Western nations, Christianity is the world’s most popular religion, appearing in all sorts of shapes, sizes, varieties and flavors.
Huston Smith, author of The World’s Religions, described the world of Christianity this way: “From the majestic pontifical High Mass in St. Peter’s to the quiet simplicity of a Quaker meeting; from the intellectual sophistication of Saint Thomas Aquinas to the moving simplicity of spirituals such as ‘Lord, I want to be a Christian,’ from St. Paul’s in London, the parish Church of Great Britain, to Mother Teresa in the slums of Calcutta—all this is Christianity.”
Was he correct? Is this the picture of true Christianity?


The Traditional Churches
Have you ever wondered why there are so many different groups? Have you ever thought to yourself: “Is this what Christ meant when He said, ‘I will build my Church’?” Additionally, have you asked, “What is the difference between these groups?”—“Which one is the exact continuation of the first-century Church?”


If you are religious, then your beliefs are important to you—religion is a central part of your life.
However, have you ever examined the traditional view of Christianity? Have you compared it with your Bible? Or do you simply assume that the church you attend is correct?


If religion is an important part of your life, then you should not take the answers to these questions lightly. On the other hand, if you do not consider yourself religious, this article will change your perspective of those who call themselves Christian.


What Did the Church Look Like?
Suppose you are living during the first century, and you are asked what you think Christianity will look like in 2,000 years. The only item you have to determine your answer is the Bible. What picture would you paint? Would it look similar to what exists today? Since the Holy Bible is Christianity’s foundation, it must hold the answers to the religion that comes from it.


Why, therefore, are there so many groups today claiming to be Christian? The simplest answer is that they all teach different things. If they taught the same doctrines, they would be united under one Church government—in one group.


The book of Acts begins with the birth of the New Testament Church. Therefore, this would be the place to begin. Notice how the Church was described after 3,000 people were baptized in one day: “And they continued steadfastly in the apostles’ doctrine and fellowship” (Acts 2:42).
Why is this significant? The two most defining features of God’s Church are evident: steadfast continuation in (1) the apostles’ doctrine (teachings), and (2) fellowship. Then, after verse 43 explains that the fear of God was apparent in “every soul,” verse 44 adds, “…all that believed were together.” Verse 46 also states that they continued to be of “one accord [agreement],” meeting together “daily” in various houses in “singleness of heart.”
The Church of God was unified!—not divided in varying and disagreeing groups all calling themselves Christian.


One Church or Many?
Professing Christianity believes that God’s Church is split into different branches. Perhaps the Methodists best explain the common position of Christianity: “Nourished by common roots of this shared Christian heritage, the branches of Christ’s church have developed diverse traditions that enlarge our store of shared understandings. Our avowed ecumenical commitment as United Methodists is to gather our own doctrinal emphases into the larger Christian unity, there to be made more meaningful in a richer whole” (emphasis ours).


While this sounds honorable, is it what Christ intended? Were there to be many groups of “diverse traditions” all with their own “doctrinal emphasis”?
Even the Roman Catholics, who, for the most part, believe that God’s Church cannot be divided, say this: “Those [outside the Roman Catholic Church] who believe in Christ and have been properly baptized are put in a certain, although imperfect, communion with the Catholic Church” (Catech 838).
Again, are all these differing groups what Jesus Christ intended?


The Bible is clear that the Church—Christ’s Body (Eph. 1:22-23; Col. 1:18)—is unified. Notice:
I Corinthians 1:10: “Now I beseech you, brethren, by the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that you all speak the same thing, and that there be no divisions among you; but that you be perfectly joined together in the same mind and in the same judgment.”
I Corinthians 12:25: “…there should be no schism in the body.”
Ephesians 4:16: “From whom the whole body fitly joined together [Moffat translation: “welded together”] and compacted by that which every joint supplies.”


Do these scriptures describe modern Christianity? The answer is clear!
The world is filled with all sorts of different groups professing to be Christian, and most profess that the other competing groups are also Christian. Yet, notice Christ’s words: “And if a house be divided against itself, that house cannot stand” (Mark 3:25). The Greek word for “stand” can also mean “abide, continue, be established, hold up.” A house or any organization cannot stand—abide, continue, hold up—if divided. Yet, the world of Christianity is divided!
Would Christ have built His Church to contradict His statement in Mark 3:25? Of course not.


Simply put, Christ said, “I will build My Church” (Matt. 16:18)—not churches! This is the first of many differences that you will discover as this article continues. (Please read the article “The Ecumenical Movement – A Family Reunion?”, in this issue.)


A Little Flock
Could so many of these large, well-established churches—with hundreds of millions of people—be wrong?
Society, especially in Western cultures, stresses, “Bigger is better.” More money, more friends, larger cars, bigger houses and so on are all seen as a better way of life. The more people one can find to support this or that group, idea, or cause, the better. This way of thinking is prevalent in professing Christianity. People feel safe in numbers; therefore, large congregations are more popular, and thus grow faster than small ones.
But just because the majority follows a certain way, does that make it right?


Christ calls His Church a little flock (Luke 12:32). Only when Christ returns will God’s way of life prevail throughout the world. Until that point, Christ is only working with a few—called “firstfruits”—to rule with Him after His Second Coming.


“The god of this world”
Although we have looked at a few of the major differences between today’s Christianity and the Church that Christ established, let’s also look at how Jesus described counterfeit Christianity: “Howbeit in vain do [they] worship Me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men. For laying aside the commandment of God, [they] hold the tradition of men. Full well [they] reject the commandment of God, that [they] may keep [their] own tradition” (Mark 7:7-9).


This article has briefly touched upon several common beliefs to which the majority of so-called Christians adhere.
So what happened within the last 2,000 years? How could so many today be so deceived?—and so wrong?
The Bible reveals that the whole world is deceived (Rev. 12:9) by the “god of this world” (II Cor. 4:4)—Satan the devil. The world is cut off from God, and Satan has deceived a large part of it into thinking they are following Christ. But, they are following “another Jesus” (11:4)—and, in fact, are not part of true Christianity.


Will you put forth the effort to find the true Church?
 
K

kenisyes

Guest
#2
I'm not sure what you want a Biblical explanation of. Assuming it is why the Body of Christ is in the disjointed state we find it, try this: On the first day, God said "let there be light". Then, "evening came and morning followed". Not "morning came and evening followed". God makes light, earth's response is to turn away from it and to get dark. The earth needs to take God's light in pieces, and rest between. Otherwise, the full revelation of God would overcome it. Jesus is the Light of the world. We are taking Him in pieces, because that's all we can do.
 

ForthAngel

Senior Member
Aug 31, 2012
2,171
91
48
#3
I'm not sure what you want a Biblical explanation of. Assuming it is why the Body of Christ is in the disjointed state we find it, try this: On the first day, God said "let there be light". Then, "evening came and morning followed". Not "morning came and evening followed". God makes light, earth's response is to turn away from it and to get dark. The earth needs to take God's light in pieces, and rest between. Otherwise, the full revelation of God would overcome it. Jesus is the Light of the world. We are taking Him in pieces, because that's all we can do.
This was more to show how the church is not a physical entity or group of entities, but rather a spiritual group of people, who may happen to belong to these physical entities, aka denominations. I also was looking for an explanation of what is the Trinity, because I can't find it in the bible where it is explained.

I dunno. It was really just a random post I figured people would form some opinions about some stuff in it that I might learn something from. I guess I should have included the section about the Holy Spirit, since that is really what my question was about lol. But it seemed as though he didn't acknowledge the Trinity at all so I didn't want to include it.

I like what you said though, thanks for your comment.
 

ForthAngel

Senior Member
Aug 31, 2012
2,171
91
48
#4
Also, I am bad for just writing statements Kenis. Not really expecting responses in a lot of cases lol.
 
Jul 12, 2012
933
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#5
I also was looking for an explanation of what is the Trinity, because I can't find it in the bible where it is explained.
You're likely to get a dozen answers, both leaning towards one of two mainstream ideas.
I subscribe to neither.
I think Y'Shua held His words on some topics for the following reason...

Impossible to explain, must be experienced. Did Y'Shua in this way refrain from casting a stumbling block? Or did the Father through Him in fact cast one of the stumbling blocks promised?

I believe these topics include mainly "how does this oneness work", "what is the Set Apart Spirit", "what is the kingdom of Elohim", and "what is heaven proper"

Unexplainable to a point of satisfaction.
Set Apart Spirit for example: Exodus 32:32 is the best I can do, and that's only by quoting God's word.
 
Last edited:
Sep 7, 2012
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#6
The literally thousands of doctrinal positions held by people of all denominations are not the "church." So it is useless to try and fit them all together somehow by those doctrines. I believe that there are people of any and all faiths that God knows about and who He clings to as "His church" and to the naked human eye they might just make no sense at all as being "one" of anything. We so easily forget that it is His church not our church and therefore He has the keys and knows all the answers and we just are left to guess. Of course we can take some educated guesses, but they remain only that guesses. Frankly I would not want to even hazard a guess because we can hardly even guess just how big a group it might be, God does tend to operate in remnants rather than majorities. So those groups most often claiming to be the single group have basically eliminated themselves.

So comparing what we have today and the 1st century church is also a big waste of time because frankly it would not even give us a clue. Sorry.
 

ForthAngel

Senior Member
Aug 31, 2012
2,171
91
48
#7
I wasn't comparing churches today to the 1st church. I was showing how far it has fallen and fragmented.
 
A

Abiding

Guest
#8
I wasn't comparing churches today to the 1st church. I was showing how far it has fallen and fragmented.
Hi ForthAngel! really factions and divisions came in the first century church. Tons.
And through church history each generation had to fight off error. How?
By creeds and meetings and breakoffs.

Alot of denominations were started by missionary programs. Others to split
divided churches over doctrinal issues. We are doing the same today. And we must,
as long as false teachers and false prophets exist.

I know its sad, id love it if we were all one big happy family...but that isnt gona happen. :)
 
K

kenisyes

Guest
#9
This was more to show how the church is not a physical entity or group of entities, but rather a spiritual group of people, who may happen to belong to these physical entities, aka denominations. I also was looking for an explanation of what is the Trinity, because I can't find it in the bible where it is explained.
Let me see what I can do. We have a denomination locally (Pentecostals of Dover) that does not believe in the trinity, so I have had some discussions with them, and verified what they say. The "trinity" is a didactic concept. That is, the early church introduced it so we can remember that God showed up in three ways in the Bible - Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. The Pentecostals of Dover believe in all three of these, but prefer not to call it that, since we might one day discover a fourth way that God shows up shown in the Bible. Since it was invented by teachers to summarize something in the Bible, the concept itself is not in the Bible. I have many reasons for thinking the Pent. of Dover are wrong, and I think we will never find a fourth way. God just does too many things in threes, and reality is defined in threes in ways I won't try to go into here. The Bible certainly proves that all three of these are God, and Scripture proves there are three: "I only do what I see my Father do" proves Jesus and the Father are different. "The HS descended on Jesus like a dove", proves those two are different. "God sent His Spirit" proves those two are different. All three are God is proven the Bible as well, of course.

I dunno. It was really just a random post I figured people would form some opinions about some stuff in it that I might learn something from. I guess I should have included the section about the Holy Spirit, since that is really what my question was about lol. But it seemed as though he didn't acknowledge the Trinity at all so I didn't want to include it.

I like what you said though, thanks for your comment.
Most denominations have different ideas of who or what the HS is, depending on what they are willing to admit He does. Some avoid thinking about it, and their children grow up thinking He's an invisible bird. Some say He leads you to God, but aren't quite sure how. Some say He gives you power, and try to prove it by tongues and prophecy. Some say every worthwhile thing in the Body of Christ comes from His inspiration.

Here is my experience: First, think of the Christmas spirit, or the spirit of joy. The HS is the Spirit of holiness. He is also the Spirit of potential, since He brooded over the waters. He is also an energizing and empowering Spirit because of the gifts He gives. Like you feel like doing Christmas when you have the Christmas spirit, you feel like you want to be perfectly whatever God wants when you have the Holy Spirit, and that lets Him move in you. God wants you to want Him, God wants to create in you, God can and wants to empower you, and God wants you to move to perfection. The Holy Spirit is God's presence to make you want that too.