Paul's Command To Be Silent For Tongues Without Interpretation

Enow · Jan 18, 2013

For those that hear and rely on Christ to help them to discern this issue of tongues that comes without interpretation:

#1) How can Paul command someone to be silent if the Holy Spirit is manifesting tongues that comes with no interpretation to be used for a prayer language?

1 Corinthians 14:27 If any man speak in an unknown tongue, let it be by two, or at the most by three, and that by course; and let one interpret. 28 But if there be no interpreter, let him keep silence in the church; and let him speak to himself, and to God.

And yet...

1 Thessalonians 5:18 In every thing give thanks: for this is the will of God in Christ Jesus concerning you. 19 Quench not the Spirit.

Thus opposing what Paul had said in this chapter:

1 Corinthians 14:16 Else when thou shalt bless with the spirit, how shall he that occupieth the room of the unlearned say Amen at thy giving of thanks, seeing he understandeth not what thou sayest? 17 For thou verily givest thanks well, but the other is not edified.

So then what did Paul meant in 1 Corinthians 14:28 because "if" tongues can be used for prayer language, then who is Paul to quench the Spirit for manifesting tongues to pray?

"If" that is what the Holy Spirit is leading the believer to do, and ....

1 Corinthians 14:32 And the spirits of the prophets are subject to the prophets. 33 For God is not the author of confusion, but of peace, as in all churches of the saints.

Then what is to keep a congregagtion for taking this route below as presumably led by the Spirit to do?

1 Corinthians 14:23 If therefore the whole church be come together into one place, and all speak with tongues, and there come in those that are unlearned, or unbelievers, will they not say that ye are mad?

If that be true for a congregation as presumably led by the Spirit to pray in tongues, then what does that say about the individual? Would they not be deem mad as well?

These are contentions raised, so may the Lord help us all to see the truth.

What Paul said in 1 Corinthians 14:28 was to be a guide for discerning tongues as to whethor it was being manifested by the Holy Spirit or if it was just a native tongue by a foreigner. It is the understanding of the tongue for which Paul was using "speaking unto" to mean and for believers to discern by.

Compare verses 2 with 28 below.

1 Corinthians 14: 2 For he that speaketh in an unknown tongue speaketh not unto men, but unto God: for no man understandeth him; howbeit in the spirit he speaketh mysteries.

Here, Paul was saying that God understands what the believers are saying in tongues whereas the tongue speakers does not understand what he is saying in tongues being manifested by the Spirit.

1 Corinthians 14:28 But if there be no interpreter, let him keep silence in the church; and let him speak to himself, and to God.

Here, Paul was saying that the tongue speaker understands what he is saying as God does which means that the tongue he is speaking in is native to the tongue speaker and thus knonw to him because he understands what he is saying as God does also.

So Paul was never saying that tongues was used for speaking unto God when you compare those two verses together in how Paul was using "speaking unto" to mean because it was about understanding the tongue that was being spoken.

Paul bottomlined tongues for what God said He was using tongues for.

1 Corinthians 12:4 Now there are diversities of gifts, but the same Spirit. 5 And there are differences of administrations, but the same Lord. 6 And there are diversities of operations, but it is the same God which worketh all in all. 7 But the manifestation of the Spirit is given to every man to profit withal.

1 Corinthians 14:20 Brethren, be not children in understanding: howbeit in malice be ye children, but in understanding be men. 21 In the law it is written, With men of other tongues and other lips will I speak unto this people; and yet for all that will they not hear me, saith the Lord.

Paul made no exception when bottomlining it, and so that is why we need discernment from the Lord to help us understand what Paul had meant, otherwise, Paul would be opposing himself by commanding believers to be silent when there is no interpretation, and yet Paul also said in another epistle that we are not to quench the Spirit.

We are to give thanks to God. The Holy Spirit is manifesting tongues to testify of our thanks to God unto the people of the testimony of what God has done for us. but the Spirit, Himself, has no need to give thanks to God. Tongues is not used as a prayer language of the Spirit giving thanks to God when it is being manifested to speak unto the people for the people to be edified by. It is even to be interpreted to edify the tongue speaker as well for him to understand and for that tongue manifested to be fruitful even to the tongue speaker.

That means tongues would never be used as a prayer language when we are to give thanks to God in prayer and thus in our language so that we know what we had prayed for in giving thanks to God when He does answer our prayers.

In the same way in giving supplication & requests to God; it has to be done in the language you know and even silently in knowing what you had prayed for so that when God does answer your prayers that you had known what you had prayed for & talked to God about so that you will give thanks to Jesus Christ for answering your prayers.

John 14: 13 And whatsoever ye shall ask in my name, that will I do, that the Father may be glorified in the Son. 14 If ye shall ask any thing in my name, I will do it.

Now if God used tongues as a prayer language, then it undermines you ever knowing what was prayed for and thus prevent any opportunity for actually giving thanks to God for answering your prayers... so why would God do that? Answer: He would not.

1 Thessalonians 5:18 In every thing give thanks: for this is the will of God in Christ Jesus concerning you.

God wants YOU to give thanks: this is the will of God in Christ Jesus concerning YOU.

2 Timothy 2:16 But shun profane and vain babblings: for they will increase unto more ungodliness.

Matthew 6:7 But when ye pray, use not vain repetitions, as the heathen do: for they think that they shall be heard for their much speaking. 8 Be not ye therefore like unto them: for your Father knoweth what things ye have need of, before ye ask him.

Now if the Father knows before you ask Him, then what need does God have to manifest tongues as a prayer language? Answer: None.

So there is no need for tongues to be used as a prayer language, and thus the vanity of tongues without interpretation should be known and avoided.

This is why Paul can command that if someone that speaks in tongues but there is no intepretor to be silent in the church, because the person speaking is a foreignor. There is no danger of quenching the Spirit when He wants to pay because He does not need to pray.

This is why in the second letter to Timothy, tongues without interpretation should be shunned even in our personal walk with the Lord outside of the meeting place of the church, because it is vain. Our edification comes from the understood word.

2 Timothy 2:15 Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth. 16 But shun profane and vain babblings: for they will increase unto more ungodliness....24 And the servant of the Lord must not strive; but be gentle unto all men, apt to teach, patient, 25 In meekness instructing those that oppose themselves; if God peradventure will give them repentance to the acknowledging of the truth; 26 And that they may recover themselves out of the snare of the devil, who are taken captive by him at his will.

1 John 4:1Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world....

Believers were warned not to believe every spirit, and having tonguesw without interpretation is why when supernatural tongues had already existed in the world that was abbling nonsense.

Isaiah 8:19 And when they shall say unto you, Seek unto them that have familiar spirits, and unto wizards that peep, and that mutter: should not a people seek unto their God? for the living to the dead?

1 Thessalonians 5:21 Prove all things; hold fast that which is good. 22 Abstain from all appearance of evil. 23 And the very God of peace sanctify you wholly; and I pray God your whole spirit and soul and body be preserved blameless unto the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ. 24 Faithful is he that calleth you, who also will do it. 25Brethren, pray for us.

God will not copycat Satan's tongues of vain & profane babblings at all so that we can abstain from all appearances of evil.

God wants YOU to pray for others so that He will be given opportunities to answer prayers to receive thanksgiving for.

Tongues without interpretation as vain & profane babblings can be found in world's religions, occults, and cults in christianity.... so consider how that is a fruit of a false prophet in gathering grapes of thorns and figs of thistles.

Matthew 7:15 Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves. 16 Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles?

1 John 4:5 They are of the world: therefore speak they of the world, and the world heareth them. 6 We are of God: he that knoweth God heareth us; he that is not of God heareth not us. Hereby know we the spirit of truth, and the spirit of error.

Wayward believers can overcome this and be able to shun that evil tongue by going before that throne of grace for help in your time of need.

1 John 4:4 Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.

1 John 5:1Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: and every one that loveth him that begat loveth him also that is begotten of him.....4 For whatsoever is born of God overcometh the world: and this is the victory that overcometh the world, even our faith. 5 Who is he that overcometh the world, but he that believeth that Jesus is the Son of God?

Hebrews 4:12 For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart. 13 Neither is there any creature that is not manifest in his sight: but all things are naked and opened unto the eyes of him with whom we have to do. 14 Seeing then that we have a great high priest, that is passed into the heavens, Jesus the Son of God, let us hold fast our profession. 15 For we have not an high priest which cannot be touched with the feeling of our infirmities; but was in all points tempted like as we are, yet without sin. 16 Let us therefore come boldly unto the throne of grace, that we may obtain mercy, and find grace to help in time of need.

Nautilus · Jan 18, 2013

I went to my friends church one tie and during the prayer the whole congregation started babbling nonsense, thats when I knew it was not a place to be

kenisyes · Jan 18, 2013

You are making an unproven assumption that tongues as a prayer language are "profane and vain babblings". The context suggests worthless debates in Greek (English for us). Your appeal to the Father knowing our needs is incorrectly applied, because prayer is meant for other purposes besides asking for things. For all you know, most tongues may be thanksgiving, or praise. Please account for how tongues are the languages of angels and men, and how tongues are the last of the eight steps in the foundation of new works in the church in I Cor. 12:28, and also why Paul himself draws the distinction between "I thank God I pray in tongues more than all of you.....but in the church, I would rather say ..." Why is not this distinction: "I thank God I pray in tongues more than all of you....but only when God is letting me interpret, or someone is there who can"?

Forty years of experience with tongues has proven that it does in fact increase people's prayer life. There is a significant difference between Godly tongues, demonic tongues, and human mimicry. Further, there are cases on record of tongues without interpretation being understood by certain people present at the meeting, in their own native dialect, and being praise of God.

Digital_Angel_316 · Jan 18, 2013

EDIFICATION OR EMOTIONAL ENCHANTMENT??

Connecticut - "Sandy Hook" School Children's Memorial Service:

[video]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bS--_V9Sq-Y[/video]

zone · Jan 18, 2013

ooooooooo DA.
too hot ta handle

Enow · Jan 26, 2013

kenisyes said:

That is the present educated scholarly assumption, but how is that a snare of the devil as mentioned in verse 26?

Well, that would be a conundrum, but hardly for the Lord when He shows you what Paul had meant.

1 Corinthians 14:[SUP]13[/SUP]Wherefore let him that speaketh in an unknown tongue pray that he may interpret. [SUP]14 [/SUP]For if I pray in an unknown tongue, my spirit prayeth, but my understanding is unfruitful.

That ties in with your verse as in "I thank God I pray in tongues more than you all...." meaning the Spirit was not praying, Paul was. If you read verse 13 with verse 14, you will see that Paul is praying here that someone may interpret the tongues that the Spirit was manifesting through him.

Yes... dubious records at that.

A church had invited linguists to attend their service in their practise when members were speaking in tongues while another interpret only to find that the interpretors were winging it, because the tongues were just babbling nonsense.

At one site, a female believer bragged about speaking in tongues and interpreting the tongue she had just spoken, and I did not believe her because the scripture testifies against her that the Spirit will manifest the gifts severally to profit the body withal. How easy would it be for someone knowing another language, speak it, and interpret it to look like he or she has the gift of tongues? Way too easy.

My problem with your defense of tongues is that they gained these tongues by seeking to receive the Holy Spirit again and after a sign of tongues that comes with no interpretation. That is the same rudiment of asking the Holy Spirit to come with those other signs that you had denounced in the first four of those movements as not being of God: slain in the spirit, holy laughter, Toronto Blessings, & Pensacola Outpouring.

Now how can that be? Are the promises of God yea & nay? But what have we here?

2 Corinthians 1:[SUP]18 [/SUP]But as God is true, our word toward you was not yea and nay. [SUP]19 [/SUP]For the Son of God, Jesus Christ, who was preached among you by us, even by me and Silvanus and Timotheus, was not yea and nay, but in him was yea. [SUP]20 [/SUP]For all the promises of God in him are yea, and in him Amen, unto the glory of God by us. [SUP]21 [/SUP]Now he which stablisheth us with you in Christ, and hath anointed us, is God; [SUP]22 [/SUP]Who hath also sealed us, and given the earnest of the Spirit in our hearts.

But yet you KNOW that the first four movements of the "Spirit" is not of God, but yet they used the same rudiment by asking the Holy Spirit to come and to receive after a sign in the same way those believers that are already saved that seek to receive the Holy Spirit after a sign of tongues. So what is wrong with this picture?

Luke 11:[SUP]9 [/SUP]And I say unto you, Ask, and it shall be given you; seek, and ye shall find; knock, and it shall be opened unto you. [SUP]10 [/SUP]For every one that asketh receiveth; and he that seeketh findeth; and to him that knocketh it shall be opened. [SUP]11 [/SUP]If a son shall ask bread of any of you that is a father, will he give him a stone? or if he ask a fish, will he for a fish give him a serpent? [SUP]12 [/SUP]Or if he shall ask an egg, will he offer him a scorpion? [SUP]13 [/SUP]If ye then, being evil, know how to give good gifts unto your children: how much more shall your heavenly Father give the Holy Spirit to them that ask him?

So for a believer to seek to receive the Holy Spirit again and after a sign is making the Father a liar because you are seeking to receive the Holy Spirit again as if you had not received Him the first time when you were saved, but got something else instead.. a stone instead of a bread...a passing good feeling instead of your seal of adoption. That is not so, and it cannot be of Him.

Plus... those movements of the "Spirit" that you denounce have been using the same rudiment by asking the Holy Spirit to come and to be received after a sign of tongues. Again, is the promises of God is yea & nay that what you defend how believers get tongues and yet can also be denounced in those other movements that you say is not of Him?

How can mediums and voodooists repent of their supernatural babbling tongues if believers are using it for a prayer language? How can any one that knew of their past believe that they had repented? How can any believer do this below?

1 Thessalonians 5:[SUP]21 [/SUP]Prove all things; hold fast that which is good. [SUP]22 [/SUP]Abstain from all appearance of evil. [SUP]23 [/SUP]And the very God of peace sanctify you wholly; and I pray God your whole spirit and soul and body be preserved blameless unto the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ. [SUP]24 [/SUP]Faithful is he that calleth you, who also will do it. [SUP]25 [/SUP]Brethren, pray for us.

You are called to pray: not the Spirit.

That is why in spite of your forty years of doing this, we are not to believe every spirit but test them, because Paul said plainly what tongues were for, but believers gloss over it as if he did not really mean that.

1 Corinthians 14:[SUP]20 [/SUP]Brethren, be not children in understanding: howbeit in malice be ye children, but in understanding be men. [SUP]21 [/SUP]In the law it is written, With men of other tongues and other lips will I speak unto this people; and yet for all that will they not hear me, saith the Lord.

Tongues are manifested by God to speak unto the people: not back to Himself in a form of a prayer language.[SUP]

22 [/SUP]Wherefore tongues are for a sign, not to them that believe, but to them that believe not: but prophesying serveth not for them that believe not, but for them which believe.

Believers are not to seek after tongues as a sign. Tongues only serve as a sign towards unbelievers.

Signs follow believers: believers do not follow signs. That also include believers seeking signs to follow them to validate them also.

nathan3 · Jan 26, 2013

So i guess from what I read this post is against speaking in tongues as its done today. Then I like the post. But. Your wording is too jumbled. You can clean up a lot of the words , and simplify it, using clearer words. You could have given the definitions for many words in Greek at least. But good effort. But it can be improved a lot. It could be made concise.

homwardbound · Jan 26, 2013

From what I see when tongues started was at Pentecost. When Peter spoke out receiving the Holy Ghost he spoke to the audience in their language about the resurrected Christ and there what 3,000 saved that day, for they heard truth and were convinced for Peter did not knkow their language and there were other languages spoken that others had a differant dialect. There were a lot of differant languages just like here in the states today.
So unknown tongues is if you speak them you not knowing the tongue, who you are speaking to does and has their chance to believe as the in the day of Pentecost. All for edification to salvation, this is what Paul meant
Homwardbound

Enow · Jan 26, 2013

nathan3 said:

I trust Jesus Christ as my Good Shepherd to help me to be a better witness of our faith in Him.

One can post long or short posts, but the results all rests on the Lord as He is the One that provides seed to the sower & water to the waterer as it is on God to cause the increase. What may be obscure or confusing to one believer, to another, God makes it clear because they are in the thick of it to know what is being posted about. So His yoke is easy & His burden is light.

I keep hoping that He will help me to post short posts, but in these latter days in keeping the faith which is the good fight, it just seems like making full proof of the ministry is needed, but I shall trust Him to provide what is needed and to keep from going overboard in making it clear because that is where I need His help in as it would wind up being a long post.

RedTent · Jan 26, 2013

Co_14:39 So, myfriends, be eager to prophesy, and do not forbid speaking in tongues;

God also says that speaking in tongues is a gift of the spirit, so I listen to what God says.

I went to one church to hear tongues spoken. The interpreter said it meant "the death of the children". That didn't sound to me like something from God so I left. That does not mean that I condemn all speaking in tongues. It means that I listen to men through the lens of scripture, even tongues.

My spiritually grown girlfriend tells me that she sometimes speaks in tongues as she is praying and it deepens her understanding of God. She says that it is as if her spirit is expressing to God what she cannot in English. I wish I had that gift, but I don't.

rauleetoe · Jan 26, 2013

Nautilus said:

Paul said he prayed in tongues more than the rest of them, but he would rather speak a few words that are understandable than a thousand 'tongues'..
I do think that many forsake what is written by Paul regarding that if one is going to pray in tongues, then have the faith to interpret, otherwise, zipit,shut aka keep it in your prayer Closet, you benefit nobody in church. What will the non believers say if they were to walk into your service and you are just shondala hondaing,every one of you..will they not think that you are out of your minds?
(Paul's words,not mine)

Sadly it seems to be a 'trend' to be what many call continuationists, While i am not saying that the gifts are not for today..sadly many who embrace the 'gifts' only talk about the gifts,only focus on the gifts, compare their church with others regarding gifts, compare themselves with others regarding gifts, and this is the emphasis they have..none other. Common sense and reason are thrown out of the window and one is expected to accept every single wind of doctrine and new teaching and new movement..case in point, Todd Bentley..John Crowder, and many other false prophets of today who cater to those who are perverse and wicked.
Jesus said, a wicked and perverse generation seeks after signs..And I truly believe God has allowed them to have their
signs because thats all they want, they want this more than Jesus..so he has let them have it..

rauleetoe · Jan 26, 2013

RedTent said:

I believe more than wanting the gift of tongues..you have been blessed with something better..the giver of the gifts themselves, the Holy Spirit! That to me I believe is far better than any 'gift' that could be given..

rauleetoe · Jan 26, 2013

kenisyes said:

I do not think anyone was saying or implying that tongues are non existant..not yet at least. I for one did not. What I will say however and appeal to you and all those who may emphasize the gifts is more important than this emphasis is to live right, and live Holy before God and truly live in the fruit of Repentance,having a sincere conversion and Christian walk. I would rather be a right representation of what it is to be a Christian before man and before God than putting another knotch in my spiritual gifts toolbox(not saying you do, but i have met some who seem to care only about this)
When a person is more concerned about hoping to get a prophetic 'word' or hoping people will pray in tongues in church or that someone will get healed..etc etc etc and will not care enough about the Word being taught and being challenged to live for God, that is where I will say keep your 'Holy Ghost' prayer time in your prayer closet for you are a mere distraction, you only edify yourself, you seek to get attention from all others and you will answer to God for your disobedience of the command to do things in order if you cause a brother or sister to stumble or keep non christians from hearing the gospel because you were too wrapped up in 'getting drunk in the spirit' or whatever other activity you thought was more important..
and i came out of this 'revival' movement, so i know a thing or two about how things are done in such churches/circles.

tribesman · Jan 26, 2013

Tongues=languages. If a language is spoken in the congregation that all does not understand then, needless to say, someone has to interpret that language so that all present may understand what is being communicated and even say their Amen to same. In the private prayer closet no such interpretation is needed. In summary Paul said: speak in languages, but do so orderly and forbid not to speak in languages.

godsron · Jan 26, 2013

Paul explains that if we speak in tongues or do anything no matter how great, without charity it is useless. It takes charity coupled with tongues for it to be real. Speaking in tongues to yourself and to God is not wrong and Paul says that when he says exactly this "...forbid not to speak with tongues" If you read through all of 1 Corinth chap 14 I believe you see that Paul says not to speak in tongues without an interpreter. Now because he actually said "forbid not to speak with tongues" it almost seems contradictory. In that specific instance he is referring to speaking in front of a crowd or to attempt to teach in tongues. It's useless unless you can interpret. Therefore praying in tongues is right to do no matter where you are if you are praying toGod and not to be heard. But speaking(to others) without an interpreter is not right. If you notice in that instances he says a woman shouldn't speak in the church. Again he's referring to preaching or teaching in that use of the word "speak."

Enow · Jan 26, 2013

RedTent said:

1 Corinthians 14:[SUP]20 [/SUP]Brethren, be not children in understanding: howbeit in malice be ye children, but in understanding be men. [SUP]21 [/SUP]In the law it is written, With men of other tongues and other lips will I speak unto this people; and yet for all that will they not hear me, saith the Lord.

Tongues are manifested by God to speak unto the people: not back to Himself in a form of a prayer language. That is what Paul said what tongues are. That is what God says He was using tongues for. [SUP]
[/SUP]

When everybody in the congregation is speaking the same language, there is no necessity to manifest tongues and interpret them when the gift of prophesy will do.

And when there is scripture available by way of the KJV, and yet nothing new has manifested by way of tongues that cannot be read in scripture, one wonders why the indirect route. God is not vain. Tongues are used as a purpose: not for vanity.

Doesn't matter how long a person has been a believer or how long they have been praying in tongues, believers were warned not to believe every spirit, but test them. Alot of believers have a rationalization or a "reason" for what they are doing, but they are false, because it does not go to God's glory at all for a believer to pray in an unknown tongue and not know what he has prayed for so that when God answers that "prayer", how would he give thanks if he knew not what was prayed for?

John 14:13-14 has Jesus saying what the purpose of prayer was for: so that when He answers the prayers, God will be glorified in the Son.

Matthew 6:7-8 has the Father knowing before we ask Him anything in prayer so again, I ask every believer to discern what need does the Holy Spirit have to manifest tongues to pray for anything if the Father knows before we ask anything in prayer?

The role of the Holy Spirit has Him speaking not of Himself, but whatever He hears, that He speaks: John 16:13 so that when we stand before governors for a testimony, it is not we who speak, but the Spirit of our Father: Matthew 10:19-20

Now that means for the Spirit to pray what He hears, you have God the Father praying back to Himself. That is redundant and vain.

There is a supernatural tongue in the world that is just babbling nonsense. It is not a foreign language and can be found in world's religions, occults, as well as cults in christianity, thus indicative of the fruit of a false prophet as gathering grapes of thorns & figs of thistles in being ecumenical in nature.

For God to call these sinners away from their familiar spirits and the babbling tongues that comes with them, all invitation points to the Son in coming to and relating to God the Father by.

Isaiah 8:[SUP]19 [/SUP]And when they shall say unto you, Seek unto them that have familiar spirits, and unto wizards that peep, and that mutter: should not a people seek unto their God? for the living to the dead?

From 1 Thessalonians 5:21-24, how can believers prove the tongues they have is of God and yet abstain from all appearances of evil if God manifest tongues to be babbling nonsense to be used as a prayer language? How can those wizards and voodooists show that they have repented of their occultic practises if the tongues that other sinners know them to have in their sinful past is the same as what believers err in thinking it is God's gift of tongues to be used as a prayer language only because there is no interpretation? How can believers know that these former occultists have repented? It is a bad witness.

Tongues was never meant to be used as a prayer language which is why believers are warned not to believe evbery spirit but test them, including the tongues that comes with them because if they speak as the world speak, and hear as the world hears which is tongues without interpretation and thus a stranger's voice, then that is the spirit of error and not the Spirit of Truth.

1 John 4:1,5-6

Most tongue speaker will testify of the "spirit" coming over them "again" as if to impart this tongue, but that should tell them it is not of Him because the Holy Spirit was already in them when they first came to & believed in Jesus Christ: 1 John 4:4 is also the line of discernment given in testing the spirits by.

Like it or not, your friend needs to shun vain & profane babblings as it will increase more unto ungodliness. 2 Timothy 2:16,24-26 Better to know what your friend had prayed for so that when God answers those prayers, she will give Him thanks.

Enow · Jan 26, 2013

tribesman said:

Who will interpret the prayer so that you will know what you had prayed for to giev God thanks? No one.

See post #16 in this thread for scriptural reproofs that God will not use tongues for a prayer language.

tribesman · Jan 26, 2013

Enow said:

...I never argued for a so called "prayer language", whereas I don't believe in any such idea. I do see a difference however between public and private speaking of languages.

Enow · Jan 26, 2013

rauleetoe said:

When they preach receiving the Holy Spirit again in order to get those tongues, then for believing that lie, God will permit them to suffer a strong delusion for believing that lie.

This is the falling away from the faith spoken of in 1 Timothy 4:1-2 & 2 Thessalonians 2nd chapter.

Believers need to repent.

1 Timothy 4:1Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils; [SUP]2 [/SUP]Speaking lies in hypocrisy; having their conscience seared with a hot iron;

2 Thessalonians 2:[SUP]9 [/SUP]Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders, [SUP]10 [/SUP]And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved. [SUP]11 [/SUP]And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie: [SUP]12 [/SUP]That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness.

Then Paul reminded believers when they had received the Holy Spirit in the first place: when they were saved.
[SUP]13 [/SUP]But we are bound to give thanks alway to God for you, brethren beloved of the Lord, because God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth: [SUP]14 [/SUP]Whereunto he called you by our gospel, to the obtaining of the glory of our Lord Jesus Christ. [SUP]15 [/SUP]Therefore, brethren, stand fast, and hold the traditions which ye have been taught, whether by word, or our epistle.

Believers really need to not believe every spriit but test them. If one testifies of the "Spirit" coming over them & filling them again and they spoke in tongues that came with no interpretation, then that was not the Holy Spirit because He was already in them. That was the spirit of error: not the Spirit of Truth.

How can one say of that experience that it was when they were saved even though they had been a believer long before that time and another says of having the same experience that it was God calling her into the ministry? That means they do not know what that moment was about. They just want to believe it was of God, and by that spirit of error by chnaging the testimony when they were saved, that mislead other believers into thinking they need that experience to know that they are saved just as those in the ministry or thinking about serving Him will consider that they need that experience to know that they were called by God to go into the ministry... both are falsehoods.

Paul said what tongues were for... to speak unto the people... as it is of other men's lips.

1 Corinthians 14:[SUP]20 [/SUP]Brethren, be not children in understanding: howbeit in malice be ye children, but in understanding be men. [SUP]21 [/SUP]In the law it is written, With men of other tongues and other lips will I speak unto this people; and yet for all that will they not hear me, saith the Lord.

There is no exception here given by Paul.

When Paul said that he prayed in tongue, that was his spirit praying, not the Holy Spirit as he was praying that somebody would interpret the tongues.

1 Corinthians 14:[SUP]13 [/SUP]Wherefore let him that speaketh in an unknown tongue pray that he may interpret. [SUP]14 [/SUP]For if I pray in an unknown tongue, my spirit prayeth, but my understanding is unfruitful. [SUP]15 [/SUP]What is it then? I will pray with the spirit, and I will pray with the understanding also: I will sing with the spirit, and I will sing with the understanding also.

Thus Paul was not talking about tongues to be used as a prayer language when he has been praying that it be interpreted.

Again... plainly speaking that Paul was not praying in tongues, but praying while speaking in tongues that someone would interpret it.

Paul said "my spirit prayeth" and he does does hoping for someone to interpret it si he would understand what was spoken.

May God cause the increase and be peradventuring to recover some from this snare of the devil because tongues without interpretation rationalized to be used as a prayer language is not of God. Period.

Enow · Jan 26, 2013

tribesman said:

This private speaking of languages is unfruitful even to the tongue speaker. Paul said so.

1 Corinthians 14:[SUP]13 [/SUP]Wherefore let him that speaketh in an unknown tongue pray that he may interpret. [SUP]14 [/SUP]For if I pray in an unknown tongue, my spirit prayeth, but my understanding is unfruitful. [SUP]15 [/SUP]What is it then? I will pray with the spirit, and I will pray with the understanding also: I will sing with the spirit, and I will sing with the understanding also.

God can speak clearly to us through His words and not a stranger's voice that comes with no interpretation.

If a believer is to test the spirits and the tongues that comes with them to prove all things and to abstain from all appearances of evil, then God would not manifest tongues for private interpretation.

I know that you can use 1 Corinthians 2-4 as seemingly validating that as a practise when all others use it as a prayer language, but Paul was comparing the gift of tongues against the gift of prophesy, and that same tongue was meant to be interpreted even to the tongue speaker, otherwise it would be unfruitful and vain for God to be doing that when prophesying straightway to us would be achieve the result He wants.

So you have to take the message in context when Paul started out in verse 1 about seeking spiritual gifts and to seek the gift of prophesy over all spiritual gifts and in verse 2, shows why by comparing the singular gift of tongue against the singualr gift of prophesy in regards to edifying, but in no way was Paul advocating that tongues was for private interpretation because Paul had laid the groundwork for why these manifestations of the Spirit are done... to profit the body withal: not individual member in this previous chapter below.

1 Corinthians 12:[SUP]4 [/SUP]Now there are diversities of gifts, but the same Spirit. [SUP]5 [/SUP]And there are differences of administrations, but the same Lord. [SUP]6 [/SUP]And there are diversities of operations, but it is the same God which worketh all in all. [SUP]7[/SUP]But the manifestation of the Spirit is given to every man to profit withal.[SUP]8 [/SUP]For to one is given by the Spirit the word of wisdom; to another the word of knowledge by the same Spirit; [SUP]9 [/SUP]To another faith by the same Spirit; to another the gifts of healing by the same Spirit; [SUP]10 [/SUP]To another the working of miracles; to another prophecy; to another discerning of spirits; to another divers kinds of tongues; to another the interpretation of tongues: [SUP]11 [/SUP]But all these worketh that one and the selfsame Spirit, dividing to every man severally as he will. [SUP]12 [/SUP]For as the body is one, and hath many members, and all the members of that one body, being many, are one body: so also is Christ.

Verses 11 & 12 ties in to the bottomline of the purpose of these manifestations in verse 7.

Paul also bottomlined what tongues are for in regards to outside the body of Christ in serving as a sign to unbelievers in speaking unto them.

1 Corinthians 14:[SUP]20 [/SUP]Brethren, be not children in understanding: howbeit in malice be ye children, but in understanding be men. [SUP]21 [/SUP]In the law it is written, With men of other tongues and other lips will I speak unto this people; and yet for all that will they not hear me, saith the Lord. [SUP]22 [/SUP]Wherefore tongues are for a sign, not to them that believe, but to them that believe not: but prophesying serveth not for them that believe not, but for them which believe.

So as much as believers want to believe that tongues are for private interpretation, it is not when it is written that these gifts are manifested severally as He wills: that means no one will be speaking in tongues & interpreting their own tongues. You have to consider that if one can truly be edified by tongue alone, then Paul would not need interpretation, and so he wasn't advocating that tongues can edify the tongue speaker, but pointing out between the two gifts which one truly edifies the church when tongues is not a stand alone gift that it needs interpretation for it to edify even the tongue speaker.

And tongues for private interpretation is still not abstaining from all appearances of evil when it is not a foreign language, but just babbling nonsense. God would not manifest tongues without interpretation unless otherwise understood by a foreignor.

It's time to discern the spirits, and shun vain & profane babblings. If someone thought the church speaking in tongues would be seen as mad, what does that say of someone coming in on the individual believer? Do not the voodooists & wizards do the same? It is still a bad witness and not of Him.

We are edified by the understood word for Him to be fruitful to us by His grace & by His help.

Paul's Command To Be Silent For Tongues Without Interpretation

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